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/lit/ - Literature

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File: 12 KB, 334x330, mishima-acting-out-his-suicide.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
882670 No.882670 [Reply] [Original]

Did it really have to end this way?

>> No.882672

I would say, most definitely. I've read quite a lot of this man's work and his aura to me always seemed suicidal and hopeless, even before I knew how he died.

>> No.882678

Everything that lives dies.

>> No.882681

>>882678
Well not everything eviscerates its self and is (incompetently) decapitated by a gay lover...

>> No.882685

getting someone to cut off his head after was pretty much his magnum opus mind

>> No.882690

didn't know it was his man friend that did it

>> No.882701

Who is this? I know, I know, I'm a faggot.

>> No.882703

>>882701
it's okay so is he. yukio mishima

>> No.882706
File: 41 KB, 557x795, mishima_head.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
882706

Here's another pick to help you guess

>> No.882709

A heroic gesture, but very laughable in retrospect.

He committed suicide after a single failed speech, something totally insignificant for a revolutionary- his suicide was hilariously inept, he had to be hit something around three times with the sword to be beheaded.

It always strikes me as such amateur work, the whole thing undermines itself. He took the cowards way out, nothing admirable at all like he had intended.

>> No.882718
File: 33 KB, 377x457, Ishihara_Mishima.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
882718

was this the man with handy hacking skills??

>> No.882721

in death in midsummer and other stories there is a story called, "patriotism." it's about suicide and is one of the most brutal things i've ever read. btw i'm reading temple of the golden pavilion soon. got to finish suttree and some lovecraft stuff first. i'm excited.

>> No.882719
File: 81 KB, 446x400, 1275416264959.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
882719

>>882709
>He thinks Mishima's suicide was because his coup failed and wasn't planned that way from the start.

>> No.882725

>>882709
I do not think that a real person should be looked as if he were just a character. You have to consider his life's very complexity. He was dualistic in so many respects (intellect vs. physical; masucline vs. homosexuality). I think this last act was one of grand theater (something he also venerated, consider his love for Noh theater), the political and martial aspects serving as an elegant backdrop to a suicide, which I believe he always anticipated. He was a very morose character.

>> No.882726

>>882709
i think mishima had planned his ritual suicide for a year before the coup attempt.

>> No.882727

>The customary kaishakunin duty at the end of this ritual had been assigned to Tatenokai member Masakatsu Morita, but Morita was unable to properly perform the task: after several attempts, he allowed another Tatenokai member, Hiroyasu Koga, to behead Mishima.

What? That guy Morita tried to chop Mishima's head off but ended up slicing his neck only a tiny bit while he was suffering? Perfect time to choke, Morita, you're a prick.

>> No.882739

How do you fail to cut someone's head off? It's like splitting firewood, only made of a softer material.

>> No.882741

>>882727
ha.

>> No.882744

>>882719
Nah, it obviously was- but that even goes so much further to illustrate what an idealistic waste the whole affair really was. Idolation of the suicide cult, but a total lack of will to do anything else. It is hilariously artistic- all words and self-absorbed display, no real result in the things that matter. I have little respect for such cheap tricks to aquire fame

>> No.882751

>>882744
Suicide to acquire fame? I think this is a pretty thin interpretation. The arts are not for petty, materialistic people such as yourself. Kindly gtfo

>> No.882754

>>882744
read "teach us to outgrow our madness" by kenzaburo oe. it's a short and interesting look into a character that seems very mishima-like.

>> No.882765

>>882751
Can you provide a different interpretation? He might have had skill as a writer, but a pre-mediated suicide in such a public fashion is fairly obviously an attempt to aquire glory.

>> No.882770

not glory but maybe in his eyes moral duty??

>> No.882773

>>882765
i partly agree and i'm a really big fan of mishima. but it's not that simple either. you really need to read a few of his stories to see what kind of morality he had for himself. he really thought he was a samurai. and a true samurai view death and ritualistic suicide very different from westerners.

>> No.882775

>>882765
Just as you say, it is part of the ''cult of suicide'' and there is something to this. The idolization of death isn't just an empty gesture in my opinion, I understand that it may not be materially productive, but I am not a strict materialist, either. I don't think an artist (well one of the non-plastic arts such as literature) could be a strict materialist.

>> No.882790

>>882775
>>882773
>>882770

Eh, that is an argument basically impossible to answer. Might be interesting what Japanese reports on the event evaluated it as

>> No.882794

>>882770
Not his moral duty. Some people just like the drama (not in the OH YOU SO DRAMA QUEEN sense) and Mishima probably thought that his death had to be 'beautiful'. Which is why he planned everything so carefully (except choosing the right guy to finish him lol).
Not to acquire fame, just to have a beautiful death. The whole Sea of Fertility deals with this matter, specially Runaway Horses.

>> No.882796

>>882790
are you saying nothing can be inferred from his own writing?

>> No.882805

tbh i was thinking moral duty in more of the samurai way of things, then again if he planned it to fail then its not really his moral duty, but what if he thought it might fail but did it anyway.............................im confused!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

wouldn't catch any of my Russian boys doing this silliness

>> No.882808

>>882790
how about consider what mishima was motivated by when considering what mishima did? the japanese haven't considered samurai seriously for some time. from that perspective his acts do seem foolish. but that perspective isn't why the act happened.

>> No.882818

>>882808
Not who you were talking to but is anachronism inherently foolish to you? Idealists, I suppose are seen as fools always, and when there are discrepencies of character the idea that they are fools seems to many to be confirmed. Honestly, I don't see it this way. There is something to Idealism, and the dismissal of it is something I see as a culture disease.

>> No.882844

>>882796
You can inferr much, but you may never see his thoughts at the actual moment nor himself in absolute totality.

>>882808
If you take his motivation as an attempt to reinstate the old japanese state, it would seem he was a complete failure. If you take his motivation as a premediated suicide, it would seem he chose the event to die serving what he believed in, possibly commemorated in the eyes of others as a result

Neither really paint him as a particularly heroic individual. I do not believe japanese tradition stated one should seek death in order to commit suicide

>> No.882857

>>882844
I see suicide as an heroic act.

>> No.882899

>>882818
i totally agree with you. without idealism we wouldn't have the inventions we've got. we wouldn't have skyscrapers or cell phones. we wouldn't have airplanes or automobiles.

>> No.882908

>>882899
I like your spirit, but I'm thinking youre being sarcastic? These things are cynical, products of an overly materialistic lack of sensuality. Shadows of the endless epoch of impotence which we are currently suffering through.

>> No.882913

If you're going to kill yourself, it might as well be via seppuku.

>> No.882920

>>882899
Idealism in moderation is purpose, yet too much takes a person away from reality, makes them weak and easy to decieve.

A person may dream of flight all they like, but unless they are willing to learn the hard concepts require to create flight, it is unlikely that anything but misfortune will result.

>> No.882927

>>882908
i wasn't being sarcastic. idealism doesn't end there. those were material things. but i could go on about art in it's various forms, forms of government and more. don quixote is a character to consider in regards to idealism. people can get lost in fantasy and reality which was probably mishima's case although i love the guy. but it shouldn't be discounted as you said earlier. maybe i read you wrong.

>> No.882930

You're not supposed to cut the head off all the way anyway, just enough to kill the person.

Full decapitation is disrespectful.

>> No.882931

>>882920
i agree. i posted right after you here: >>882927

said the same thing i think.