If you've never done psychedelics, you cannot possibly consider yourself a good fiction writer.

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Anonymous Fri Sep 25 14:32:58 2015 No.7158500 [Reply] [Original]

If you've never done psychedelics, you cannot possibly consider yourself a good fiction writer.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 14:35:36 2015 No.7158510
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>>7158500
I sorta support this with the exception of anyone with schizophrenia or derealization/depersonalization issues. If you've got one of those disorders don't go anywhere near psychs, but if you're healthy occasional trips are like steroids for your creative faculties.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 14:36:16 2015 No.7158513 >>7158500 I don't know where to get any

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 14:36:58 2015 No.7158517 >milton was not a good fiction writer >joyce was not a good fiction writer >tolstoy was not a good fiction writer ok fam

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 14:37:05 2015 No.7158518 >>7158513 Online. It's never been so easy to acquire drugs.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 14:37:46 2015 No.7158521 >>7158518 I don't believe you.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 14:38:25 2015 No.7158523 >>7158518 go on

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 14:40:22 2015 No.7158529 File: 56 KB, 223x226, rd3aDw5r4LJU53dw.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>7158517 The times have changed. Psychedelics are part of the academic and intellectual scene the same way caps and gowns are.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 14:43:38 2015 No.7158542 Psychedelics have nothing to do with good fiction writing. Neither do caps and gowns.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 14:44:34 2015 No.7158545 but I don't want HHPD get fucking acid flashbacks every time you spark a joint

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 14:46:28 2015 No.7158549

>>7158510
that's why even thought lsd is one of the greatest experiences a human can have i don't think i will do it again since finally my life is starting to go in a halfway decent direction and my autism is chilling out, the last thing i need to do is go off on some crazy introspective trip were i can't connect with other humans for another 10 years...before i did acid i had tons of friends, then after acid i became self concious of the social bonds between people and couldn't make any new friends and lost contact with the old over time...took like 5-10 years to be able to connect with people...if you're already on 4chan i don't know if lsd is going to be healthy for you

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 14:47:29 2015 No.7158553 >>7158545 as long as you don't drop acid in public the Hasbrouck Heights Police Department isn't going to affect your life

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 14:48:40 2015 No.7158562 >>7158549 basically lsd took me from normalfag to reeelord in one summer and i'm still trying to get back to normal 15 years later

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 14:51:46 2015 No.7158574 >>7158553 >living in fear of the weekly acid flashbacks that hit you while driving on the freeway or at a family funeral i just dont have the constitution id probably killmyslef

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 14:51:52 2015 No.7158576
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>>7158542
I just meant that they're both ubiquitous and most people with credibility have both (even a famous fiction author who didn't go to college will eventually receive an honorary degree from somewhere).

>>7158545
To my knowledge you don't get this from shrooms unless you're a dumbass and smoke weed or drink at the same time.

>>7158549
I'd be curious to hear more about this. Most of my friends who've done both say shrooms were much gentler and less disturbing than acid.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 14:55:08 2015 No.7158594 >>7158576 >unless you're a dumbass and smoke weed or drink at the same time Yikes

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 14:56:32 2015 No.7158598

>>7158576
>I'd be curious to hear more about this. Most of my friends who've done both say shrooms were much gentler and less disturbing than acid.

from my experience it seems true, you're more likely to have a giggling fit on shrooms and an anxiety attack on lsd, but being the asshole i am i took shrooms and lsd at the same time, and that may have been the start of my trouble, then a little later someone brought a vial of liquid lsd back from the west coast, oh boy...

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 14:58:13 2015 No.7158604

To anyone out there thinking about trying psychs, don´t be a dick about it.

I´ve done some on and off over the last 5 years, which isn´t terribly long in it self. I started small like everyone recommended. Took care of set and setting and pretty much tried anything between raw amanita muscaria straight of the forest ground and dissolving my ego totally in home brewed ayahuasca, to blowing out my brains with a fat line of ketamine after a good night on the town with some coke, alcohol and weed, and whoopty fucking loo everything was great.
Most of my experience is with shrooms though. about 15-20 of those trips, and a handful of LSD trips.

A couple of months ago when I went home to old and jolly bitchville where I was born, an old friend of mine called me up, and asked me if I wanted to take an impro acid trip, just a small dose, and of course, me thinking that I´m pretty stable at this shit, jump right in.
Unbeknownst to me, two other dudes I don´t know join us, uncomfortable big pusherish psychoviolent types. At this point we´ve already retrieved the acid, and me being an idiot and not wanting to seem like a pussy took it. I ended up crying in the corner screaming I´m sorry to no one in particular, for no particular reason for a couple of hours. Set and setting dudes, make bloody fucking sure you´re comfortable and if you want to push your comfort zone, have a way out before you start. Unless you are, really, experienced, like I wasn´t.

Took me a couple of months to rebuild my ego, and I still feel like shit at days. But getting better, and even though the trip was awful awful awful, the following months have been interesting to say the least. Different. Lots of jungian synchronicity going on. Lots of self exploration and discovery, depression, suicidal thoughts, rumination, anxiety, childhood flashbacks. Working out a lot of quirks. Overall I´ve gotten more out of this one extremely bad experience, than a ton of good experiences. Was it worth it? I don´t know. On reflection I´m inclined to believe so. No regrets and all that shit. But had it been my first experience, I don´t know how I would have handled it.

Which brings me to another point. It´s liberty cap season, and high season in a couple of weeks. All good luck and happy hunting to pickers old as new, but especially to the new: It´s a good place to start, but take care on you´re dosing, take care of your mindset and take care of your setting.

All the very best, and take care of yourselves. Don´t be idiots in the sense I was.

P.s.
You don´t need to do drugs to be a good writer. Drug fiction is primarily interesting to people who do drugs. If you´re not interested in doing drugs, write about something else. Fetishism needs more literary output. Write about that, I know you´re all fetishists.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 14:58:22 2015 No.7158605

>>7158574
the flashbacks are usually just when you are tired and under stress, like you have to wake up at 6am for some exam, maybe the tiles in the room are moving a bit before the professor gets there, or when you smoke weed you get a lot more paranoid than usually, it's not like you're walking down the street and suddenly you start getting some insane visuals ...

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 14:59:57 2015 No.7158613 >>7158574 Flashbacks are a myth son. You may remember the trip vividly, and it will certainly influence the way you see/understand the world -- most likely permanently -- but you won't be tripping after a day or so.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 15:00:12 2015 No.7158616 >>7158604 Sorry for spelling mistakes and shit. English is not first language. "You´re dosing" hurts me as much as anyone else... Typed in a hurry.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 15:03:20 2015 No.7158630
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>>7158604
Good post fam. I'm personally interested in tripping them much less frequently than that and probably only with mushrooms. I agree that drug fiction is kinda lame on the whole, but then again Gravity's Rainbow is pretty heavily influenced by the author's thoughts on drugs, so I think there's a place for that kind of ecstatic thinking in art that isn't about drugs.

>>7158598
>>7158594
Not sure why people mix drugs. It's not like hallucinogens are weak shit on their own.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 15:04:03 2015 No.7158634 >>7158605 Either you're full of shit, or you didn't take really acid. Or, you just found some really god sativa and aren't used to the particular high it produces, i.e. more paranoia than indi

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 15:05:00 2015 No.7158638 >>7158630 >taking a hallucinogen for the first time >not thinking "maybe I'll calm my nerves with a drink and a joint"

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 15:07:27 2015 No.7158644

>>7158638
Except now we have the internet and you can look this shit up before you try a hallucinogen for the first time and learn that everyone who knows anything about them says alcohol pretty much always causes bad trips and weed can have a similar effect.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 15:08:46 2015 No.7158649 Fucking druggies need to leave.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 15:09:10 2015 No.7158650

>>7158630
Mixing hard drugs is a horrible idea and will fuck up your brain. However, smokin a lil weed is a good idea while tripping. It's the "great equalizer" and will keep the mood light. Cigs are also crucial. They calm you down.

As mentioned above though, set and setting are the most important thing.

Source: seasoned vet

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 15:11:14 2015 No.7158656 >>7158644 A single drink and a joint could be beneficial. Just don't drink more than 1 or 2 and don't smoke so much you get paranoid.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 15:12:00 2015 No.7158660 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BHbZD68SGoE too scared of this tbh

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 15:15:55 2015 No.7158669 I've done psychedelics a few times. So long as you're strong mentally and take them in a safe, familiar environment there shouldn't be any problems.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 15:17:09 2015 No.7158674 >>7158630 >Not sure why people mix drugs. It's not like hallucinogens are weak shit on their own. >not mixing your drugs pleb

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 15:17:45 2015 No.7158676 >>7158669 I have a huge window that opens up all the way which would mean falling 30 metres. Can I trust myself not to do this on psychadeleiacs?

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 15:18:06 2015 No.7158677 >>7158674 This. There are some combos that are fucking amazing. Just research heavily beforehand.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 15:19:30 2015 No.7158682 >>7158677 This guy gets it. Shrooms, ket & speed for example is a GOAT combo

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 15:20:31 2015 No.7158686 >>7158676 Uhh...just close the window? Unless you're doing PCP or something I highly doubt you're gonna jump out a window while tripping.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 15:22:18 2015 No.7158691 >>7158676 Of course you can. People have this idea that doing psychs makes you lose control. They don't. I've done acid on top floors of high buildings, in the middle of the busiest city in my country, at all sorts of parties and I'm just fine.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 15:27:11 2015 No.7158709

>>7158669
Nothing to do with mental strength. Something to do with mental stability. I´ve seen the most simple-minded wantons have the best time of their lives on psychedelics, and the brightest most intellectually capable, and stable people degrade into crying puddles of pathetic ooze.
Pretentiousness is seldomly accompanied by straight out simple-mindedness, which is why I hold most of the people on this board will tend towards the latter category. Many of them very young. Don´t be overly confident in mere mental capability. It´s not necessarily an advantage.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 15:29:21 2015 No.7158717 >>7158709 >Nothing to do with mental strength. Something to do with mental stability. Wtf? That's exactly what mental strength means you idiot.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 15:34:06 2015 No.7158737 >>7158517 Joyce was likely schizophrenic and writing was possibly the only thing keeping him from insanity.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 15:35:10 2015 No.7158741

>>7158717
No it doesn´t you fucking pleb. It´s a complex statement.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/strength
Force and vigor.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/stability
Firmness in position and permanence.

It´s the principle of compositionality within semantic theory. They are not synonyms, they are not equivalent, and they are not reducible to one another by conceptual analysis. Educate yourself faggot.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 15:39:25 2015 No.7158756 >>7158741 not him but in common usage, mental strength and mental stability means the same thing more or less. No one uses mentally strong if they mean smart.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 15:39:33 2015 No.7158757 >>7158737 Having a schizophrenic daughter doesn't make you a schizophrenic.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 15:40:49 2015 No.7158760

Would you c/lit/s say Lsd has changed you in any permanent way? And how?

The last time I tried it (must have been my 8th or 9th intake) was 3 years ago and I remember rationalizing a lot of its effects on my personna, but the memories have faded in time. I only remember the fun and the bad trips, the fear and the unstoppable torrent of thoughts.
If anything, it's made me more aware than ever that I have a bitch of a 'super ego' (haven't read much psych, so bare with my ignorance), one that could see reality under the harshest of lights, capable of the most extreme forms of hate. And, at the same, there was this very sentitive side of me, constantly terrorized and running away from all that negativity. I don't like being that guy, so I smoke weed most of the time and -while sober- I just ignore the kind of thoughts 'this will be good for my future' and act on whims whenever possible.
Another possible effect is that I can think 'faster', I mean, I'm quicker in layering the basics of a concept, or maybe that's just the crystalization from a life long of reading lit, playing games on a semi comp level and growing older.

If anything, acid has made more cautious, of everything. Or maybe that's just my depression...

I know this is ridiculous, because my former self should be inseparable from my current self, and therefore no way to tell the differences... But ever since those days, people have randomly noticed I'm even quieter and more guarded than I used to be, but again, that might be my depression and loneliness.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 15:43:12 2015 No.7158765 >>7158760 Not at all what a superego is, just for the record

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 15:43:23 2015 No.7158766 >>7158760 Lmao I know some people claim LSD made them racist.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 15:47:37 2015 No.7158781 >>7158741 Why did you quote only one of the twelve definitions of "strength" to make your point? From your own link: >moral power, firmness, or courage. >power of resisting force, strain, wear, etc. You're a fucking idiot.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 16:06:03 2015 No.7158837

Psychedelics are beneficial in that they are an experience and all experiences culture your world view. I have tripped 30~ times on basically everything under the sun in some hefty doses and I haven't found them to be any more pivotal than a bad break up, moving cities, etc.

My drug of choice was acid and I took it mainly for creative purposes, but I would come back to the ideas I cultivated during the trip and most of them could be easily discarded. The ones that were salvageable weren't anything I couldn't think of sober, either. This same thing occurs every time I take adderall, get super shitfaced, whatever. Creatively, the only meritorious aspect of psychedelics is increased ambition, but it's not like it's something you can't find somewhere else.

Psychedelics basically have two main purposes, imo: rainbow sex and introspection. Rainbow sex goes without saying, but the introspective element of psychedelics is a good tool to learn how to question yourself. A lot of literary types that are attracted to psychedelics already know how to do this, though.

People who romanticize psychedelics are wasting their time. I've seen so many new age wannabe hippies that worship the sun and dropped out of high school taking acid and thinking they're somehow superior than other people for it and that's bullshit. Taking them won't make you a good writer, and taking them won't make you a good person. It's what you do with the experience that matters.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 16:06:34 2015 No.7158838

>>7158760

increased knowledge of abstracting substances that enter/affect my body. Not robotically or to the point where i'm seeing food as just nutrients, but i won't eat most meats now, because it's difficult to think of cooked parts of a pig or cow as 'beef' or 'pork.' I haven't eaten many unhealthy foods since LSD, it just seems foolish not to eat healthy when it is so easy. General drug effects gain new perspective during my LSD trips. Insight to the effects marijuana and alcohol was helpful in improving control and enjoyment.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 16:17:50 2015 No.7158880

>>7158837

sounds like you were taking it expecting to turn into a genius. Psychedelics (mushrooms in particular) are the ego-breaking salvation that monks experience through asceticism and meditation. Forgetting the self. You aren't wrong, the experience is the most important aspect. Proust said 'The real voyage of discovery is not seeing new landscapes but in having new eyes.' That's a very psychedelic statement. It is through the loss of self, through seeing the same world with new eyes, that Schopenhauer's virtues of tolerance, patience, self-control, and charity can be examined and instilled.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 16:28:22 2015 No.7158921

>>7158500
I agree with T.M. when he criticized "piss-ant doses" that he said were utterly uninteresting. He said he was only interested in the extremely rare experiences had on very high doses in contemplative environments (opposed of dropping a tab and going to concert or a few tabs and just chilling with friends, he criticized this as a waste of time).

I agree yet think most people shouldn't do high doses, so I guess it is a good thing that the vast majority of the recreational community only do piss-ant doses. There is a reason why repressive mechanisms exist in the human psyche, and I don't believe most can live up to what happens without negative consequences.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 16:30:46 2015 No.7158936

>>7158576
>To my knowledge you don't get this from shrooms unless you're a dumbass and smoke weed or drink at the same time.

Actually it can happen on large doses or even repeated frequent use of smaller doses while actively engaging with the visual distortion through the pattern recognition process of the mind. Same goes with LSD and mescaline.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 16:30:49 2015 No.7158937 >>7158921 rambling: the post

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 16:32:53 2015 No.7158946

>>7158709
>Don´t be overly confident in mere mental capability. It´s not necessarily an advantage.

As far as hallucinogens go, I completely agree. You are better off learning to meditate for a few months and then jumping into it if you are more intellectually capable than the average person.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 16:37:07 2015 No.7158964

>>7158781
that point wasn't expressed well, but it's a legit point. people who are highly intellectual are actually more likely to be fucked over by lsd in my opinion. people who are wrapped up in their own head, people who have hobbies they are highly tied up with, proud and elitist people—these are the people who are going to get fucked by lsd because it strips all that away, showing you how pointless it all is and what a joke identities are

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 16:39:12 2015 No.7158975 >>7158709 while simple-minded people often cope really well with lsd, they rarely get any worthwhile insight from it

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 16:41:19 2015 No.7158985 >>7158946 I got into meditating afterwards but I wish I had done this

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 16:42:46 2015 No.7158993

Drank 4-grams-of-mushroom tea and starting having visual hallucinations in an unprecedented 10 minutes or less. First trip i've ever had where visuals overcame the interior experience. Of course my friends pressured me into joining them taking 'dabs' which just made it uncomfortably intense.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 16:43:13 2015 No.7158994

>>7158880
>sychedelics (mushrooms in particular) are the ego-breaking salvation that monks experience through asceticism and meditation.

This is a common misconception held by people who haven't seriously studied these contemplative traditions. I would check out some of the works by Elias Capriles, who completed 6 years retreat and formal training by one of the 'great living masters' of Buddhism Namkhai Norbu. His theory on CREVs is doctrinally consistent with these traditions, and it rejects the idea that you are experiencing what the monks are considering to be salvation.

In Dzogchen Buddhism for example, there is a category of states called the base-of-all, and psychedelic experiences apparent salvation actually fall into this category. In Dzogchen this is the greatest obstacle because it is a profound bewildering stupification that mimics the actual state of salvation in a great many respects. It can last for decades and even provides the total relaxation often attributed to salvation, but it still isn't the real thing. The most advanced practices developed, like thodgal, are specifically designed to break this state so that one can experience the actual salvation.

So when you hear people say things like "all is one" and other similar things that come from this category of states, this is actually rejected by monks as being delusion. Nearly all the modern literature on psychedelics have made this mistake, including the greats like Watts and Leary.

This might be a place to start:

http://webdelprofesor.ula.ve/humanidades/elicap/en/Main/Bb-bm-bh

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 16:44:08 2015 No.7159001
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>>7158921
The Johns Hopkins psilocybin study would disagree with him. None of the doese tey used were heroic, and even the smallest ones brought about experiences that people considered profound.

>>7158936
What do you mean about engaging with the visual distortion? Is it safer to keep your eyes closed?

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 16:45:18 2015 No.7159006

>>7158964
The sad thing is, for being more intellectual you would hope they would of done their research. As this fact was explicitly documented by Leary after dosing and observing thousands of people.
He further provides mechanisms for people to help overcome these obstacles, and I can personally attest to their veracity.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 16:45:52 2015 No.7159007 >>7158994 I didn't mean any specific practice and i suppose i should have said 'similar to.' Thank you for the links. informative.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 16:45:53 2015 No.7159008 >>7158549 >impling LSD caused that There's a very good chance the problems that caused you to take LSD were the same that caused you to become a faggot.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 16:46:27 2015 No.7159014 >>7158993 Your friends sounds like a collective douche or people really inexperienced.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 16:47:47 2015 No.7159017 >>7158994 >people who strive for years to do something difficult don't want to believe that you can achieve the same thing without all the struggle Wow no way.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 16:49:40 2015 No.7159025

>>7159001
>experiences that people considered profound.

Of course they did, nearly everyone who does it thinks that their experience is profound. If you lack any reference point then you can't tell how relatively trivial the experience was compared to what is possible.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 16:52:55 2015 No.7159037 >>7159025 Should have added that the lowest doses also brought about lasting personality changes that are measured just slightly lower than the changes wrought by the highest doses.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:01:08 2015 No.7159078

>>7159001
>What do you mean about engaging with the visual distortion? Is it safer to keep your eyes closed?

Not necessarily safer to keep your eyes closed. Many don't consider HPPD to be an issue and some even prefer it, others have a real problem with it.

Some people are naturally inclined towards things which resemble advanced Buddhist techniques that increase the visual distortion significantly.

A brief example, as I am about to go out to dinner:

You look at everything at once but nothing in particular, basically viewing all of visual experience at once. You may stress the peripheral areas initially to really get the panoramic attention distribution I am referring to.

When you do this and sort of just rest their without moving your eyes at all, patters start to emerge. They sort of build and build and eventually sort of resync. If you blink or move your eyes they sort of get set back a few steps but, after each resync the distortion grows- because the patters are based on the prior patterns rather than the "base" visual data that was basically non-distorted.

The more you do this the more the distortions consume all of objective reality, and eventually they become non-jungian archetypes and then further become fully immersive and animated hallucinations with absolutely no referent to any objective world.

After that shit gets completely insane. The Buddhists do this without drugs and they take it to really incredible levels, but with psychedelics it happens very rapid but lacks the precision and control that formal practice provides.

After doing LSD for the 5th or 6th time I did about 800-1000 ug and naturally did this technique. It reoriented a lot of my intellectual interests and in turn really influenced the course of my life.

Anyway, have plans gotta run.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:02:58 2015 No.7159092

>>7159017
>people assume that two things that sound similar are identical, those same people having no extensive formal training whatsoever and have no valid reference point to make such outlandish claims.

Wow no way, people talking about what they know very little about.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:06:18 2015 No.7159103

>>7159092
It's sort of a he-said-she-said thing though. Leary and others thought the two experiences were practically identical, and took steps towards validating this through their research. On the other hand, you're telling me that the members of the priestly class in some third world mountain enclave hold it as dogma that their practices are the only valid ones.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:08:33 2015 No.7159110 >>7158500 because all of the great authors you can think of were all into them? nah

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:15:02 2015 No.7159137
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>purchase an ounce of shrooms with the intent of doing them all
>maybe four bags of golden truffles
>wait inside until darkness falls
>manage to eat 2 and a half bags without vomiting
>first hour of the come up is fine
>anxious feeling begins creeping up on me
>it grows stronger
>attempt to travel to the comfort of my PC in the other room but collapse onto the couch
>traumatizing memories are filtering through my brain and ringing in my ears
>lose entire gaps of time without passing out only to snap back into conscious awareness sometime later
>time is no longer continuous
>vomit
>lie prone on my floor as I'm thrown into an endless thought loop that descends into a jumble of memories repeating themselves over and over
>my mind is being meticulously deconstructed
>confront infinity and the bounds of being
>wake up hours later in a pool of piss and vomit

pic related. don't do drugs kids

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:22:40 2015 No.7159177 File: 109 KB, 573x410, Terrence-McKenna-DMT-Revelations-Hypothesis-Experiences1.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>7159137 Sounds like a good time tbh wu fam.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:39:40 2015 No.7159242

>>7159103

I used to think the exact same way, but after years of research and direct experience I have been forced to reconsider, I can't take such perennial notions seriously anymore.

>It's sort of a he-said-she-said thing though.

It may seem like that to people who are unfamiliar with the details or are not used to thinking critically about this topic.

> Leary and others thought the two experiences were practically identical

Yeah, but based on what? They had no basis for this, buddhalogical scholarship was only in its infancy at the time and these people, Leary and others, were not scholars on the topic at all. Leary and Watts are not taken seriously in buddhalogical scholarship then, let alone now where they are not even on the radar.

They based these beliefs on their own presuppositions, without taking the time to really learn whether there was a similarity at all. It wasn't objective study, it was seeking confirmation and a willingness to gloss over the details. What is known about their biographies really make this clear. Leary for example would just read religious texts on their face assuming from the get go that all of their experiences not only were identical to his experience, but that the soteriological goal and experiences discussed between traditions was identical. He had no basis for these assumptions at all.

>validating this through their research

What research exactly, because they did no such thing. Even the very best research merely tried to establish extremely general categories of similarity at best, which is fine but it doesn't address the issue at all.

>that their practices are the only valid ones

Often that isn't what they say at all, very often they have clearly defined soteriological goals, and those goals are evidently different. Dzogchen Buddhism for example encourages people to practice whatever works, including non-Buddhist techniques, if they are serving a specific end you find desirable. In fact, it isn't unusual for these traditions that their particular tradition isn't ideal for various people, and that those people would progress a lot faster using other methods.

>members of the priestly class in some third world mountain enclave

Actually no, there are a range of views coming from the "priestly" class, some of which recognize the benefits of these drugs, others saying no outright, and others believe that eventually science may be able to provide what are equivalent to "samsara" vaccines, nullifying the need for practice at all.

However, my research, which over the years has focused on the soteriological goals of various approaches, the methodological behind it, and their similarities and differences has lead me to a completely different view than what I assumed from the get go.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:42:44 2015 No.7159253 >>7159242 Sorry for my English by the way.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:46:21 2015 No.7159266

>>7159242
>soteriology
The study of religious salvation. So for a non-religious person this whole discussion seems beside the point and it's more likely that the complaints of the monks mentioned earlier are just based on the likelihood that someone's experience with hallucinogens doesn't synch up with their dogma.

Your English is fine.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:51:10 2015 No.7159284

>>7158644

Alcohol is a GABA-ergic depressant. I've never heard of or experienced it to cause bad trips. Neuropharmacologically, it is similar to benzodiazepines, which are first-choice meds for trips gone awry.

I call bullshit.

Weed on the other hand.. every bad trip I've had was precipitated by weed. It intensifies the trip while also making me dumb as fuck. That can easily get overwhelming.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:52:10 2015 No.7159291 >>7158649 >tfw you realize that almost every author of note was a druggy of one sort or another (alcohol, nicotine and caffeine are all drugs)

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:54:51 2015 No.7159301 >>7158500 I love psychedelics. I loathe people who get a superiority complex from them, which is unfortunately all too common. tfw I just received 2 grams of mescaline HCl, the greatest psychedelic of all time.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:58:44 2015 No.7159315

>>7158760
I hated my parents and i hated dogs before i took lsd
Then when i was tripping i felt sympathy for my parents for maybe the first time instead of just being afraid of them punishing me
My dog came up to me and he was being nice to me for no reason and I realized that it was good and I petted him. Still love the little fucker to this day he's like my best friend, never done me wrong.
I also wasn't depressed for months after I took it, it was like a miracle really.
Good times, would recommend
Cannabis and LSD won't give anyone schizophrenia, literally all it does is make the symptoms worse for people who already have it.
Make sure your first dose is always a small one lads

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:59:47 2015 No.7159317
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>>7158500
If you were a real psychonaut you'd understand that the perceptions you gain from dropping acid were within you all along.

You're just a square trying to be a circle, making up flaccid rules because you fail to understand that the multifaceted nature of human cognition holds no room for absolutes.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 18:01:50 2015 No.7159326 File: 59 KB, 300x393, alien-gains.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] a /lit/ thread where nobody fights and we get some talking done h-hold me guise

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 18:03:08 2015 No.7159330 >>7159317 Not sure I get what you're going for. Experiencing those perceptions in certain stronger ways is an interesting experience, whether they're internal or not.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 18:04:44 2015 No.7159340 >>7159317 >real psychonaut You forgot the ™ You insufferable tool.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 18:06:40 2015 No.7159348 >>7159315 >Cannabis and LSD won't give anyone schizophrenia, literally all it does is make the symptoms worse for people who already have it. It wont cause schizophrenia, no, but psychotic episodes can occur even in otherwise healthy people.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 18:08:05 2015 No.7159353

>>7159330
Basically, just because "you" (this is assuming you're OP, if you're not consider this a corollary to the prior statement).

Just because you think you need acid to be a good fiction writer, doesn't mean everybody does.

Psychs are fine and dandy, I've taken tons myself, but not everyone needs or wants them, and they aren't conducive to all forms of fiction writing.

>>7159340
Let me rephrase: Hallucinogens are perception changers.

If you're experienced with hallucinogens, but are advocating some sort of rigid perscriptivist approach, like "You can't be a good fiction writer unless you've done hallucinogens" then you haven't fully absorbed the lesson of seeing the world from an altered perspective: even the idea of what is good fiction is state dependant.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 18:15:27 2015 No.7159384 >>7159353 Well, I think we agree, and I'll retract my previous statement. Still, putting real as a qualifier on pretty much anything rustles my jimmies, and seems to me to be exactly the kind of rigid prescriptivism we both seem to find annoying.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 18:15:30 2015 No.7159385

>>7159353
No OP.

I think it's more like one of those silly absolutes people throw out on 4chan, given some validity by the prevalence of psychedelic experience in intellectual circles over the last half decade. Even people who don't write about it have done psychs.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 18:16:49 2015 No.7159391 >>7158500 Sometimes, when I'm feeling real rowdy, I do speedballs. Double the scoops of instant coffee and throw in 2-3 bags of chamomile tea in there. Will fuck you right up

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 18:45:20 2015 No.7159488 >>7159391 >mixing uppers and downers Enjoy being dead fam

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 19:04:47 2015 No.7159559 So weed freaks me out sometimes. Is acid a bad call?

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 19:19:29 2015 No.7159609
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i did acid for the first time last weekend

>115ug
>slightly nervous going into it, but i was with my two close friends
>30 mins in, i start noticing that the walls are moving towards me slowly
>we go outside to smoke weed
>lay down on the ground
>can notice the street rippling like ocean waves
>my heart is racing at this point but im not nervous or anything
>my muscles are extremely relaxed too
>a couple pass by
>anything i stare at turns into some sort of pattern (a bit like fractals)
>i literally see The Matrix green, garbled text/code/numbers pass through the ground like rain
>can't tell my friends this because they thought i was bullshitting the entire time
>we're listening to some aphex twin
>my friend asks me what we're listening to
>other friend replies with "he thinks its trippy"
>they can't believe that i just like AFX for himself
>anyways, i notice that red dots were forming on the ground
>they look like a million little laser points
>they start moving with the beat of the music
>completely amazed
>we go back into the house and i start skimming through a yearbook
>their faces start changing shape, eyebrows are moving when i look somewhere else, mouths start to move up and down
>the ceiling starts to look like hundreds of arms slowly moving towards the light
>the vent changes to a rainbow of colors
>experience up to this point was generally amazing

It turned to shit once I tried to go to fall asleep. My heart couldn't stop pounding and I felt like things were trying to attack me from under my bed. So I kept the light on for a couple hours and listened to some more Aphex Twin. I also watched an interview of his on Youtube. It gave me comfort for some reason, like everything was OK in the world. All I needed to do was pursue what I enjoyed, nothing else mattered. I didn't fall asleep until about 6 AM when pretty much all the effects went away. I woke up feeling extremely happy that I wasn't high anymore.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 19:22:28 2015 No.7159620 >>7158521 >>7158523 Silk road.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 19:22:42 2015 No.7159622

>>7158510
>anyone with... derealization/depersonalization issues

Can you expand a little more on this? I'm in the process of getting shrooms or pure LSD and have those issues. I was hoping that shrooms could help with anxiety/derealization/depersonalization.

On a different note, if you're going to do LSD, GET A TEST KIT. LSD is rare as hell and most people will try to sell you RCs as LSD. Yes, you're doing drugs, but that doesn't mean you shouldn't minimize the risk associated with drug use. Better yet, go with shrooms. They aren't nearly as sketchy as LSD.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 19:22:56 2015 No.7159623 >>7159559 yes it will. depending on your dose of course

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 19:27:26 2015 No.7159634 >>7158638 I took 3 hits of MDMA the first time I did it, and I had insane visuals, and a joint actually helped calm it the fuck down.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 19:40:14 2015 No.7159693 >>7158517 Joyce was high on farts.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 19:44:30 2015 No.7159708 >>7159622 There's decent evidence that psychedelics can make the symptoms of derealization and depersonalization worse. If you look at any website about this stuff it's the one warning they all give.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 19:47:38 2015 No.7159728 All these permanent effects people are discussing... They won't happen from taking 3g of shrooms once or twice will they?

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 19:51:34 2015 No.7159740 >lol do DRUG man!!!! >>7158880 >dude i am wise like monk monk are wise because they were CHILL!!!! if u do drugs ull be humble and cool

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 19:53:21 2015 No.7159747 >>7159728 Generally not. 3g of dried cubensis is actually high for your first time though.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 19:57:28 2015 No.7159771 >>7159488 >mixing uppers and downers will kill you nice meme faggot

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 19:58:44 2015 No.7159776 File: 67 KB, 407x482, 1322963024099.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>7159740 >this insecure

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 19:58:47 2015 No.7159777 >>7159728 I have been microdosing LSD every other 3rd day for the past 2 years. I've never felt better.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 19:59:40 2015 No.7159779 >>7159771 >>7159488 >>7159391 Don't they cancel each other out and just get you barely high or not high at all?

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 20:01:09 2015 No.7159788 >>7159776 >insincere druggies calling anybody else insecure

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 20:03:49 2015 No.7159800 >>7159779 Coming from a guy who goes out to bars and then does coke to sober up enough to drive home: no it won't kill you. They'll temporarily cancel out

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 20:10:58 2015 No.7159826 In the good old days, you needed a depressed person to do a good job. These days, hipsters "tryout" depression using drugs because depression to hipster is a "hip" thing to have. Hipsters are the worst thing to happen to our culture.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 20:36:08 2015 No.7159911

>>7159266
Back now. My friend was late so I decided to rush another response and made some wording mistakes, but thank you.

I disagree. If a tradition's religious salvation is a specific state or cognitive change that isn't based on faith or holding some idea, then it is completely up for discussion for non-religious people, me being one of them. In other words, in many cases these traditions are actually making scientifically testable claims which directly overlap their soteriological models and do not require any appeal to their metaphysics or supernaturalism (in fact, some of these traditions reject supernaturalism and assert that ALL of their claims actually occur within the perimeters of the natural world).

Secondly it is exactly these religious states, exactly the soteriological goals, that were being explicitly invoked by people like Leary. They were not saying "x is like enlightenment", they were essentially advocating that "x is exactly the Buddhist enlightenment, exactly Buddhahood, exactly the dharmakaya, exactly nirvana, exactly the bardo trances" and so forth. So it really isn't besides the point at all when it is directly being invoked by, in these cases, uninformed parties.

Same goes for a general discussion by people talking about their hallucinogenic experiences, all to often they directly conflate their experience with what these traditions speak of or what is discussed in movements like transpersonal psychology, which all to often misrepresents these traditions.

I agree with an earlier anon, it is fine to say that this or that experience appears similar to a description of a religious experience as they understand it, the issue is when it is directly conflated or identified as the same (or fanatically asserted as sufficiently similar without having the faintest clue of the details of what is actually being compared and without any rational justification).

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 20:43:06 2015 No.7159935 >>7159348 True, but this will occur in the case of any overwhelming or traumatic experience.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 20:44:25 2015 No.7159939 >>7159609 welcome to the club it's good to have you

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 20:46:20 2015 No.7159948

>>7159037
That's fair. This still is still besides the point though, usually these studies have relatively small numbers of people and don't include incredibly large doses.

Furthermore there are methodological limitations to how many of these studies are done, for they systematize experience in a way to give general categories. I would argue we are far too early into methodologically sound studies for any of them to categorically isolate the rare experiences, at least in such a way that you could say seriously that lasting personality or cognitive changes are "just slighter lower".

http://www.sciencemag.org/content/349/6251/aac4716

Especially since only a third of psychological studies can be reliability be reproduced.

Lastly, in cases of very high doses, it goes back to what I said before about rare experiences on very high doses in very specific settings. In other words experiences that are rare for those taking large doses.

An example if one study determined that only about 1% of LSD users ever experience true hallucinations opposed to mere distortions, and my contention is that some of the rare experiences being discussed are a fraction of those experiences involving true hallucinations.

So it is still besides the original point T.M. was making.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 20:49:06 2015 No.7159959 >>7159708 There is also a little evidence coming from studying meditation that derealization and depersonalization may help with depression, but for some might amplify anxiety issues.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 20:50:42 2015 No.7159964

since the last time i took a bunch of mushrooms (about a quarter with no tolerance), i haven't felt the need to go to excess drug-wise again, and this is coming from somebody who isn't satisfied with under four hits of the acid he's used to, which is pretty shit.

>went to visit my brother and take some mush with a bunch of randoms
>terrible fucking idea
>i've eaten the quarter before I arrived which was a bad idea as well
>brother is a criticizing fuck who gets on my shit a little from time to time
>he unloads his expectations of me on me
>i start feeling the fragility of everything between us, go for a walk
>by then the mush had fully kicked in
>as i was walking i couldn't stop smiling--i was back in my hometown and things were looking up
>went back to the house, bunch of strangers partying
>everybody's entering and i feel too scared to face their morphing faces so i head to the backyard for a smoke
>girl comes out for one as well
>there's this moment that seemed to stretch on forever because as she came up to me i thought i recognized her (i only thought i did)
>get lost in her words
>become dormant, wander around as i peak
>end up in the basement stuck in a time--thought loop--the kind where you are in a constant state of resetting.

it's difficult to explain what was going on in the loop, but i died and was reborn countless times with a frequency of maybe three or four rebirths per second, childhood memories flooding my head, myriad scenarios of the whole life cycle shooting through.
needless to say i don't want to be there again.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 20:51:15 2015 No.7159967 Any fellow psychonauts tried ariocarpus fissuratus? It's a cactus used by the Tarahumara. Fucking subtle, but strong trip. Damn. . .

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 20:54:56 2015 No.7159975

>>7159559
It's environmental man.

Get comfy somewhere safe where you feel at ease and you're less likely to wig.

Enjoy something familliar and innocuous, like a movie from childhood.

It's possible for even relatively high strung folks to safely enjoy a trip, but you have to be mindful not to fixate on bad thoughts, or you'll bum yourself out.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 20:57:29 2015 No.7159986

>>7159967
Not exactly, I have done NMT with non-methylated N,N-DMT though, so pretty damn close to NMT + Hordenine.

It is good stuff. I am out for now though, I just reviewed two of the other comments I made and I am clearly too intoxicated and tired to continue for now. Repeating words, skipping words.

Take care all.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 20:59:43 2015 No.7159992

>>7159609
This sounds great. My fear with drugs is the ego loss thing. If I can have a semi clear mind, I think I could make it through any sort of bad trip. How do you avoid letting the drug destroy your immediate thoughts? Or is that impossible to mediate and missing the point?

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 21:03:29 2015 No.7160003

>>7159992
I'm not sure if it's even a case of your immediate thoughts being destroyed.

Quite the opposite actually, I had a terrifying experience with 60x Salvia which for a brief period shut down my faculties of sight and hearing, and my ability to recollect or predict.

I was trapped in a blank present of swirling molten brass and TV static noise for what on the inside seemed like an hour, and outside was more like five minutes.

I had no idea who I was and wondered if I was dead.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 21:04:00 2015 No.7160004 >>7159992 see >>7158946 >>7158985

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 21:25:00 2015 No.7160058 I have the impression that psychs are to meditation and dreams what fast food is to balanced home cooking, but then I've never taken drugs or meditated seriously.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 21:31:11 2015 No.7160078

>>7160058
I'm not sure they're entirely comparable.

There are plenty of indigenous spiritual traditions that advocate a two-pronged approach, combining intense meditation with controlled use of psychoactive chemicals.

Psychs are perception-altering: they can make you see the familliar with a new eye, meditation on the other hand helps ground you in "yourself" so to speak, which can give you better leverage to fully comprehend your altered states.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 21:35:56 2015 No.7160090 >You'll never write the next Naked Lunch without becoming a filthy, junky adulterer

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 21:47:07 2015 No.7160132

>>7159986

>brew tea out of a large specimen of A.Fissuratus
>drink half of it
>at drum circle beside a lake, start to trip balls
>wade into lake
>feel the lake is a big drum
>start pounding the water
>excited as shit
>spaghetti.jpeg
>doesn't matter, don't care what anyone thinks
>start jumping
>feels fucking awesome
>jump higher and higher
>oh shit, son, my soul jumps out of my body, see the drum circle far below me, but the volume of it doesn't change
>soul orbits the earth
>returns to body
>still jumping in water, feels fucking great
>6 hrs later coming down as sun rises
>beautiful prisms of mauve, blue and pastel pinks weave into conveyer-belt spirals
>only visuals were this coming down experience
>Thank you earth, you are awesome
>Fuck you Interstellar for giving up so easily on earth.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 21:50:03 2015 No.7160140 >>7159008 >thinking people have to have "problems" to take drugs people take drugs because they are fun, get some life experience, nerd

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 22:06:07 2015 No.7160177 >>7158517 correct

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 23:26:53 2015 No.7160388

This is as good a places as any to share a mind altering experience I had with alcohol of all drugs.

After spending 36 hours awake or under the affect of very heavy drinking I crawled into bed, but despite being extremely tired I stayed conscious for the next 6 hours or so. Eyes open, staring up into the ceiling the darkness seemed to morph into faces that were accompanied by auditory hallucinations of things that had happened the day before. It was as if all the jumbled sensory impression I'd absorbed were being being projected like a film through my eyes, repeating and fading out of view as they were put into a kind of chronological order. Much of it had no accompanying memory to give it context and I think must been the raw chaotic data from after I became blackout drunk, it felt like I was becoming a schizophrenic. Next came the experience of forgetting as these bundles of light, noise and unaccountable sentences were compressed into a smaller and thinner space on the film until they vanished, I remember that the fragments of conversion that featured my name were the last to go. It's truly astonishing how much of life we forget and how edited and imperfect the recollections our brains piece together are. I think this stage lasted about 2 hours. The rest of it is harder to explain, my personality kept on being there on the verge of completeting a thought or stance on things, while my body twitched/jerked and internal organs gurgled. It was as if my personality was not of the body like the other senses, not a driving component of the brain because something bellow was providing the mental shifts while it just hung there, the side affect of real processes, like a secondhand odor.

Words are obviously failing me, but what I've been trying to describe is a kind of waking sleep. I attribute this to alcohol, because sleep deprivation and dehydration have never produced similar effects on their own for me. I like to think I have aytypical drinking habits, drinking every two or three months (seldom to the gross extremes of this story) and never once having a hang over. What I do feel normally is an altered awareness like I'm walking around with a different amount of sleep than usual for a week or so afterwords (even if I kept to my normal schedule around the drinking). This would probably be a tame experience for some of you guys, but for me it has had first a profound and then a lasting affect. Namely the onset of extraordinarily active, lucid dreams and what feels like a more moldable sleep cycle.

Does any of this sound legit to proper trippers or have I been engaged in the neurological equivalent of contemplating your own farts after a heavy meal?

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 01:40:58 2015 No.7160810 >>7160388 I dunno, that doesn't sound very much like my experiences with real psychs.

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 02:59:50 2015 No.7161000 >>7159622 Yoga will help 'Satyananda - a systematic guide to tantric techniques'

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 03:42:50 2015 No.7161038

>>7158500
>Mfw almost got acid once
>mfw the dude lived with his mom and she found them and burned it
>mfw he found out later from the guy he got his shit from it had meth in it
>mfw
Also my cousin became a schizophrenic after he did acid and spent 10 years in a mental health hospital. So I might have a genetic disposition toward such.
I'm glad I didn't get it after all.

That being said if I was offered some pure shit I would take it. But I don't fucking know anybody that sells drugs. Or anyone for that matter.
Lost the friends I had in HS after I graduated and I don't talk to anyone outside of class requirements now days. (2nd year in College).
NET Status

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 05:25:29 2015 No.7161166

>>7158760
>I know this is ridiculous, because my former self should be inseparable from my current self, and therefore no way to tell the differences.

you do realize there is no such thing as a continous self which persists through or even 'has' this current conscious experience, right?

I mean I thought we all knew that. There is no self. Just changing conscious experience.

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 05:40:26 2015 No.7161182 >>7161166 Self is the observer of changing consciousness. The ability to observe changing consciousness without content per se is what constitutes the self. Meta'd. Genuinely sorry about the above post, sounds insufferable.

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 06:07:46 2015 No.7161215 >>7158650 This is awful advice, it's an incredibly common theme that someone starts tripping, smokes some weed and it immediately goes south.

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 06:09:28 2015 No.7161221 >>7161215 Depends on the individual subject. Generally I've found that smoking a little grass buoys me up when I'm on shrooms, but I'd never advise someone inexperienced with either to mix them.

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 06:20:23 2015 No.7161228 I know what my exact interpretation of Hell is, thanks to psychedelics. I got to live in it for a few hours.

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 06:27:04 2015 No.7161235 Anyone here had any experience with 25i/nbome? I'm thinking of getting some Also, is it a bad idea to trip alone for the first time or is it more favorable?

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 07:00:58 2015 No.7161264 >>7158500 My insane dreams are enough for that thank you very much.

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 07:25:19 2015 No.7161293

Wanted to share my experiences here.

Went to a 5 day festival last year and decided that since I'm in my late 20s now's the last chance I got to really do any drugs. So I do X, have a good time. The next morning I'm wandering around the festival and I find a book stall under a hippy dome and spent like 4 hours reading "The Door's of Perception". So I'm down to do acid, but I know this might be a big trip so I'm going to wait for one day to do it right. Next day I get 4 hits of 100micrograms and decide "OK". Take one, ewww tastes like licking a battery fuck. Go figure. Well hmmm....maybe I was supposed to tongue it. Shit I swallowed it, am I doing this shit right? Man I should take another one and try again, damn these papers are so tiny. So take that one. Damn this one didn't do anything either! It's been like half an hour! Shit I'll just down the next two and tongue the ever loving shit out of them. MAN! Maybe I should find some more acid I can't WAIT for it to kick in IT'S going to be FUCKING GREAT!!!

About half way down the block I realized the acid was working and I had just taken a life altering amount. Dammmmnn......

So, lesson learned. Never have more drugs in your pocket than you're willing to take all at once, at least with acid. The come on is a sneaky mistress.

As for me, I met God, who happened to be a sunny hill just saying, BEING, "love love love" and I must have climbed that fucking hill 99 gagillion times. Totally ignored the concert for the day. Basically a strong acid trip converted me from atheism to "born once" natural spiritualism. Go figure.

I also want to comment on "mental strength" vs "mental stability". This is TRUE from my experience. As soon as I realized what I had done at the concert I started making rules in my head. Remember those t-shirts that say "Suppose you've traveled back in time..." and give you all the cool science things to remember? I thought of a shirt that said "Suppose you've overdosed on acid at a festival..." and made rules for myself so I didn't lose my mind. This is much harder than it sounds, because in that state you can't lie to yourself in the way people often do sober. These rules must be deep emotional truths or they don't work. I think a lot of truly smart people are very good at lying to themselves about how unhappy they are in their lives and much of their mental hardware is focused on distracting themselves from how fucking miserable they are (how many lawyers do you know?). Whereas a lot of really dumb people are perfectly content. Drugs often slow down your head enough that you can't keep suppressing your bullshit anymore and the subconscious comes out to play. Which can be GREAT or TERRIFYING depending on what's in the cellar.

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 08:11:24 2015 No.7161357 >>7158500 I had a trip and "never came down" and ended up on a psych ward, it happens. Only haldol could calm me.

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 08:22:19 2015 No.7161375 >>7158500 I tried LSD, I find it hard to not concentrate any more.

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 08:27:18 2015 No.7161382

>>7161293
>because in that state you can't lie to yourself in the way people often do sober.
Ive never experianced this or anything like it, every time take acid its more like i get an idea in my head and just run with it, untill my hole reality becomes circulated by that idea.
Its easy to think that this might be something hidden inside of your psyche but really i think its your brain trying to cope. If you go in thinking its going to be mind altering it will be. The scary part is these ideas always linger on even after the trip is over. So you could end up beliving things that youve just fabricated on the trip.

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 08:29:50 2015 No.7161384 >>7161357 This is what scared me the most.

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 08:31:21 2015 No.7161388 >>7161384 *scares

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 08:34:10 2015 No.7161392

>>7161293

Are you trying to say that you made rules for yourself on acid which were to prevent you from an overflow of dark truths hidden in your subconscious? Why not use the chance to come to terms with it so you can finally be free of the weight? Why not learn to embrace the darker truths of life in a calm, controlled manner? That must really require some self control.

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 08:49:07 2015 No.7161418 >>7161293 >Take one, ewww tastes like licking a battery fuck. LSD is tasteless. If it's bitter, it's a spitter. nBOME can kill you for no discernible reason, at recreational doses. It's the cancer that is killing acid.

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 08:49:43 2015 No.7161421 >>7161392 Not him. But really delving too deep in to this kind of thing can only lead to depression. Thank god there's anime.

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 08:50:07 2015 No.7161424 >>7161357 Kindly explain or elaborate? The drug doesn't stay in your for more than a day at most.

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 08:52:13 2015 No.7161426

I did shrooms for the first time last night. It was pretty good. I didn't do enough for proper hallucinations, but I did have some small visuals, mostly my thought patterns were different though, which was the fun part.

I drank a couple beers beforehand and smoked weed throughout. My friends who are more experienced with Psychadelics have a ritual of taking a bong hit whenever you feel you're getting too out of it, and I kinda agree. If you're used to being stoned it's nice to go back to the comforting, familiar, relate able high of the weed.

I felt like I had the optimal dose for my first time. I was fully functioning in most ways but my appreciation for everything around me was altered. I found I couldn't go long without some form of mental stimulation though, being lost in my own thoughts made me anxious, so I'd just jump into some conversation or listen to some music. I got really obsessed with the atmosphere in the room and couldn't be around my friend who was with us and roaring drunk, shouting the place down.

It felt like I was letting it was over me without falling completely into it, but I was also aware that there was definitely another level above, where I would totally fall into it and lose all track of myself.

All in all, a good time, had a laff with some m8s. Don't particularly want to do it again though, it was a nice experiment.

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 08:55:44 2015 No.7161432 >>7161293 >acid >taste You got some sort of research chem.

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 09:24:08 2015 No.7161493 >>7161221 The vast majority of people discussing such matters on places like shroomery advise people not to mix them and that it made their experience worse.

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 09:27:41 2015 No.7161495

>>7161424
>>7161424
Hell, LSD is fully metabolized before one even reaches a peak experience. Though this actually supports the notion that some people's brains don't react too well.

Though, we don't know what this anon actually did drug wise, he could of done something like DOM or DOB. Both of which are common for people to psychologically overdose on.

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 09:30:03 2015 No.7161497

>>7161424

It triggered something in me; turned out I had mental illness in my family. When I first came out I just felt really happy and full of good ideas about myself and the world. These ideas kept building and moving faster, eventually I became psychotic, like thinking the universe was talking to me through signs, and COMPLETELY misunderstanding people in conversation, thinking everything people said was about helping me or killing me. And weirder stuff than that too. After a few weeks I became pretty delirious and hadn't slept at all in days and got taken to the hospital.

I had another similar manic/psychotic break three years later but this time with no drugs. It's hard to say whether I would have had those episodes had it not been for psychedelics.

I still think psychedelics are the best thing that ever happened to me and would recommend them to my own grandmama but now I have to take lithium twice a day.

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 09:37:33 2015 No.7161507

>>7161497
I have heard of similar experiences, many resulting in psychosis and a few not. Kudos for keeping it together and still being able to appreciate a past experience you can't change.

There is an uncommon saying in Zen traditions about how "enlightenment is controlled psychosis". Ati Dzogpa Chenpo traditions also say that there is a very fine line between real enlightenment and psychosis, and that one is walking a razors edge as one approaches it. Furthermore that it is out of controlled thoughts/ideas that actually tips one in the direction of psychosis, so they train extensively in modulating even the supersubtle thought structures.

I bring this up because you say specifically that ideas kept building and moving faster, prior to the psychosis. I wonder if you have sufficient meditative experience where you could sufficiently modulate thoughts if psychosis would have occurred.

During your second break, did it seem like ideas/thoughts played a major role like they did leading up to the first break?

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 09:38:59 2015 No.7161511 >>7161507 have had*

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 09:48:13 2015 No.7161521

>>7161497

Oh shit, I've had that too after heavy psychedelic use. Interpreting signs that held no meaning really. I mostly just brushed it off and interpreted the interpretations, so to speak. By that I mean, I'd have insight that whatever I had perceived to be a sign really wasn't a sign, and then ask myself why I might think that. Was quite useful actually. It's the heart vein of madness/creativity. Seeing signs and connections that aren't really there.

Never did have a psychotic break after that though. Started meditating regularly, and that really calmed down the delusions of reference until it dissipated.

To make this tangentially lit-related, have you ever read Signs and Symbols by Nabokov? It's an interesting take on this entire thing.

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 10:08:32 2015 No.7161548

>>7161507

The second break I felt it coming and recognized the signs and did everything I could to keep myself calm.

Like the first break it started with a sensitivity to hue and an increase in my sense of smell. My thoughts did move fast but I did my best to audit them, criticize them, etc. I also went out of my way to hang out with normal/grounded people, and eat food even though I had no appetite. I made my room totally black and drank lots of beer to help me sleep.

Still despite doing everything "right" I reached a point of raving delirium and hallucination and delusion. I smashed my apartment while being attacked by demons, I saw the future and the past, I had moments of timelessness, my sleep was no sleep but rather a trance in which I could travel into other people's dreams, I could not hold a conversation because I was too confused to follow a sentence, etc.

I have all these emails and letters I was writing to different friends at the time to help keep myself sane. I made rules for myself, like that any "signs" I saw that meant I "should" do something were delusions; and that any telepathic powers could not be acted on or God would smack me in the face; and basically I had this awareness that everything is delusion and I was just in a world of bizarre mental delusions that prevented me from interacting with the world, but no more or less delusional than spending 40,000$ on a hunk of metal or falling in love with some pretty girl you don't know.

Didn't make a difference though, once you start having auditory and visual hallucinations it's hard to maintain sanity. I ended up back in the hospital.

During both breaks I read the Tao Te Ching and understood it so well I felt like I could have written it. Which is kind of a grandiose delusion in and of itself but I hope you get what I mean.

>>7161521

Nah but sounds interesting. William James' Varieties of Religious Experience is pretty interesting in terms of what psychiatrists call psychosis, too. And Jung goes without saying.

I actually very much want to go crazy again and see how it resolves but I'd have to quit my job and probably become homeless; I'd also need real-life people to watch me and make sure I didn't hurt myself or someone else tbh.

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 10:11:51 2015 No.7161554

>>7161548

There is real freedom in psychosis but it's a dangerous level of freedom. You truly don't care whether you live or die. You're already dead, and you're immortal at the same time. Everything is simultaneously true and false. It's true monism. You become everywhere and nowhere. It's ineffable and it's not suited for our consumerist society so we invented haloperidol.

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 10:26:34 2015 No.7161575

>>7161554

I was weeping with joy and terror at the Idea I had grasped. I was laughing for the same reason. Psychiatrists call that "labile mood" and "inappropriate affect" but it was one mood and the two "affective" states were two equal reactions to it.

You talk to fast you can't be understood, they call that "pressured speech", but really there's one giant Idea in your head and it's too big for words so you end up babbling incomprehensible

You're aware of your own potential and how much you can do in the world so you get strange notions in your head like that you're the reincarnation of some great historical figure or that you're working for the CIA, these are "grandiose delusions".

You can see the connections between all ideas such that you might connect a toilet with Atlantis or an open window with Heaven or a bowling ball with Hell, that's "flight of ideas" (it starts out more comprehensible but ends up being that loose)

You're full of the holy spirit and can't sit still or sleep, that's "insomnia" and "psychomotor agitation"

You can't focus on any one thing because your mind comprehends Everything, you're "distractible"

I'll stop posting now I can go on and on, wish we could still sage.

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 10:27:12 2015 No.7161576

>>7161548
Thanks for taking the time to respond. I can appreciate that you did your best to audit them and criticize them, but that isn't exactly what I am referring to as far as modulating thought structures. I am talking about things like completely reorienting how thoughts arise, eliminating any cognitive reaction or identification with them, and the capacity to rapidly cause the cessation of thoughts.

So for example ending percepts, leaving an unmodified stream of sense data, rather than any of that sense data being experienced in terms of concepts. Ending attentional directionality, where the attention instead is panoramically distributed without the peripheral-center dichotomy to a great extent. Ending typical memory imprints relating to the reflexive self-conscious memory and ending that mode of memory completely, leaving in its place a non-reflexive non-self conscious memory. All of these converge to a total absence of any sense of a separate mental subject.

So raw non-conceptual sense data, for prolonged states of extreme hallucinations, seems to be a necessity for avoiding uncontrolled psychosis.

>>7161554
I have some limited experience with extreme hallucinations and what you are talking about here. It is a dangerous level of freedom which is why if there is a controlled psychosis, then that is the only reasonable way to go imo. I completely agree that it isn't suited at all for typical society, which is why unsurprisingly people that seriously pursue it live as isolated hermits for years, and when they did interact where often called "crazy yogis". It is an existential plenitude that beyond comprehension and rules.

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 10:30:24 2015 No.7161582

>>7161575
See what is interesting is I think it possible that all of that conceptual rumination, mania projection can be squelched completely, and that these factors are what pushes one into uncontrolled psychosis territory.

Imagine that freedom without that ensnaring web of discursive ideas and delusion.

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 10:31:25 2015 No.7161584 >>7161582 mania, and projection*

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 10:31:47 2015 No.7161585 >>7158576 But smoking weed while on shrooms is an amazing feeling

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 11:26:30 2015 No.7161673 >>7160388 It wasn't from alcohol, though its possible that the alcohol exacerbated the situation. Sleep deprivation and exhaustion causes hallucinations, but perhaps you experienced sleep paralysis?

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 11:35:48 2015 No.7161695 >>7158650 Idk man, I think weed might have made 25i much more of a mind-soup than it would otherwise have been. I'd rather have a lucid trip.

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 11:56:06 2015 No.7161744

>>7161576

So are you basically talking about using eastern meditative techniques to alter your consciousness in such a way that the fundamental cognitive habits/weaknesses that make insanity possible no longer exist?

Like it would be impossible to have racing thoughts if you knew how to have no thoughts, kind of thing?

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 12:02:36 2015 No.7161765 If I'm prone to panicking while on weed and maybe mildly schizophrenic, should I try hallucinogens. Ive heard people say that they're too different to compare, but most of the panic comes from the fear of being stuck in the trip.

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 12:32:54 2015 No.7161837

>>7161744
Basically yes where insanity means uncontrolled psychosis.

As far your example, yes it seems reasonable that if a person could engender a no-thought state or process that racing thoughts would necessarily be impossible.

These techniques utilize models developed after extremely rigorous observation of the mind and thought structures, and often they classify thoughts into three categories of subtlety.

The coarsest involving explicit internal dialogue or word making, these words can be silently thought.

The next more subtle category involves basically what the coarsest category of thoughts are referencing and made up of, they are intuitive thoughts that are non-verbal, in other words, wordless thinking. Also the the apprehension and discernment of categories utilizing memory, for example, upon entering a kitchen, the wordless apprehension of both peanut butter and hazelnut-chocolate spreads respectively, and their distinction from one another. As well as apprehensions of things like an indeterminate, apparently total object, a pseudo-totality mistakenly appearing as totally transpersonal and imbued with seeming oneness and totality. This often involves a preconceptual interest that drives the mental events to single out segments and figure structures within the every-changing sensory pseudo-totality appearing as object, taking such segments and figure structures as conserving their pattern within the change of the totality of sense-data

Lastly, you have supersubtle thought-structures (some more fundamental than others), which are the root of the coarser categories. They are directional thought structures that conceive a subject-that-is, an experience/action-that-is, and an object-that-is. They gives rise to the appearance of a separate mental subject or noetic pole of experience (the fundamental duality of subject-object) and action that when reified seems to be the source of the capacity and motility of actually nondual awareness. So with it the dualistic, positional, thetic, reflexive consciousness that has the mental subject as its core comes into being, and all experience has to fit into the resulting dualistic structure.

As such the mental subject appears to be an individual, autonomous, self-existing, positional, thetic, reflexive consciousness; and together with the phenomenon of being, are considered the core of the basic human delusion, and the root of not only unhappy and unpleasant consciousness but the very root of what these traditions consider to be the masked insanity that is mistakenly taking by a deluded society to be "sanity" (which is really just a harmonious adaptation to a deluded society). As such the repeated dissolution of all reification and hypostatisation of such thought structures should render an increasingly stable existential freedom and plenitude, and eventually with the total squelching of this process should render what is considered by these traditions to be definitive true sanity.

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 12:35:09 2015 No.7161844 >>7161837 mistakenly taken* by

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 12:38:17 2015 No.7161853 >>7161765 Do not risk it. Not worth it in your case. Especially not after reading this post.

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 12:53:48 2015 No.7161898

>>7161765

I would seriously consider getting a thorough psyche eval. if you believe you are mildly schizophrenic or are prone to panicking.

I do not believe that hallucinogens are for everyone (or even most people when used more than a few times at higher doses).

It is your decision but if you do decide to try it, I would advise taking serious steps, for months, learning how to reduce panic and calm your mind before you use those drugs.

Panicking during the experience may actually increase the chance of psychological harm. So learning to be open, remain calm, let go of tension, and so forth are very helpful in reducing potential harm. Now many say that some of the most important experiences they have had were the experiences that were especially difficult, but there is a huge difference between this and going into severe neurotic panic attacks or having a psychotic break. Reminding yourself that it is a temporary drug experience that will wear off can be very therapeutic, likewise harmful if you are inadvertently convincing yourself that insanity has been reached and that you are stuck now.

I would recommend checking out Leary's 'The Psychedelic Experience' to get some idea of just how radical these experiences can get. It goes into good detail on both the beatific and horrific possibilities.

Just remember when making this decision that there are probably good reasons why repressive mechanisms exist in the human psyche, and tearing down that house of cards to various degrees may not be in the best interest for most people.

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 12:56:52 2015 No.7161911

>>7161765

Look into microdosing if you really want to try psychedelics. I think I have some of the same tendencies you have, though I don't outright panic. I have extensive experience with psychedelics, and I much, much prefer microdosing.

Microdosing is really the most beneficial way to use psychedelics. You'll have a slightly tweaked way of thinking with a very, very small chance of horror. Usually, motivation and cognition gets a remarkable boost too, not entirely unlike stimulants, but just better and in a more profound manner.

Don't try a real trip dose if you have those tendencies - especially the fear you'll be stuck. It's a recipe for disaster.

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 12:59:55 2015 No.7161927

>>7161898

>Now many say that some of the most important experiences they have had were the experiences that were especially difficult, but there is a huge difference between this and going into severe neurotic panic attacks or having a psychotic break

My psychotic/panic trip was what caused me to quit smoking (for 1,5 years, started again recently, fuck) and start meditating daily (still do, shit is awesome). By far the two single most important lifestyle changes I've made for a long time.

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 13:05:06 2015 No.7161946

>>7161911

I'll elucidate a bit on this microdosing thing. James Fadiman did some preliminary research on it:

>"Micro-dosing turns out to be a totally different world," he (Fadiman) explained. "As someone said, the rocks don’t glow, even a little bit. But what many people are reporting is, at the end of the day, they say, ‘That was a really good day.’ You know, that kind of day when things kind of work. You’re doing a task you normally couldn’t stand for two hours, but you do it for three or four. You eat properly. Maybe you do one more set of reps. Just a good day. That seems to be what we’re discovering."

>Study participants functioned normally in their work and relationships, Fadiman said, but with increased focus, emotional clarity, and creativity. One physician reported that microdosing put him "in touch with a deep place of ease and beauty." A singer reported being better able to hear and channel music.

>In his book, a user named "Madeline" offered this report: "Microdosing of 10 to 20 micrograms (of LSD) allow me to increase my focus, open my heart, and achieve breakthrough results while remaining integrated within my routine. My wit, response time, and visual and mental acuity seem greater than normal on it."

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 13:07:55 2015 No.7161957 >>7161946 Oh yeah, and Hoffman himself was an avid microdoser, did it until his death, and quipped that it would have taken the place of Ritalin if it weren't for the harsh scheduling.

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 13:08:05 2015 No.7161959

>>7161911
This is a very fair sentiment and good advice.

Though I must point out that there is a very real difference in microdosing while already having had extensive high dose experience and microdosing without such experience. There is a tendency for the very experienced to have a much wider range of possible experiences on small doses than those who don't have a background of multiple very high dose experiences.

>>7161927
I am not trying to downplay how difficult your experiences were, but I will suggest you are not talking about a psychotic break when you say psychotic, while I was.
Secondly that though indeed the "especially difficult" experiences I am referring to can often involve feedback loops of great panic, I consider this to be rather different to the the "severe neurotic panic attacks" that I am referring to.
As the latter can involve crippling PTSD-like symptoms, the development of other severe anxiety or antisocial disorders, the need for medical intervention or hospitalization, and in general lifelong negative consequences.

To further clarify, sometimes people, after having experienced an especially difficult trip, may experience a full blown existential crises, and may have rounds of difficulties that they have to face for a decent period of time, but the difference between that and the aforementioned is of an order of magnitude.

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 13:14:11 2015 No.7161979 >>7161946 I fucking wish I could do this. I need a hookup and some way to regulate my intake though. Don't wanna go through life tripping face.

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 13:17:03 2015 No.7161985

>>7161979
Get some connects and buy in bulk, it is easy to store a lot of this stuff for a good period of time. Obviously the difficulties of regulating your intake depends on which drug you utilize.

When I used to sell, I had a cancer patient that would buy a gram of 4-aco-dmt every once in a while. He would micro-dose daily and said it was far more effective in dealing with the pain while still being functional and content.

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 13:20:42 2015 No.7161995

>>7161985
>4-aco-dmt

Speaking of that. I've been seriously considering buying bark online and using it to extract and make dmt or making ayahuasca. There are a lot of good articles online about it and it doesn't seem too dangerous. Anyone have experience with this? I do have room mates but they are gone for most if not all of the day so it's a non issue

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 13:23:50 2015 No.7162012

>>7161979
Secondly on that, depending on the drug you can buy decent amounts from legit labs in Canada and elsewhere, shipping relatively small amounts is surprisingly safe. They never had a problem shipping me a few grams at a time, and only refused me once and that is when I asked for a ounce and a half of MXE in a single order from a Canadian lab to be shipped into the states.

However, Chinese labs don't mind shipping you pretty large amounts. Received a kilo of 4-fa on one occasion and a kilo of 2c-t-7 on two separate occasions. They just shipped in a regular pouch without any attempt to hide it and it got through fine both time.

I also sent it to the address of willing crack heads that didn't know my face or name, through two intermediaries. So still be careful just in case.

>>7161995
It won't be 4-aco-dmt, but yes it is incredibly easy. I have been doing it for years and I always have a kilo of bark in reserves just in case it gets harder to get a hold of. I make a few grams at a time for completely personal about once a year or so.

Give me a second and Ill link you the easiest modern guide I know of.

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 13:25:15 2015 No.7162020

>>7161959
I won't go into the details of it but I had a bad trip in February and was unable to lead a proper life until August. Existential crisis is putting it mildly. I didn't lose my mind and I probably wasn't close to it either, but I was still convinced for some good time that it was only a question of when I would lose it.

Relatively fine today though. I really just want to finish my studies and get into full time work. I think I would completely eradicate the after effects of that trip then. Like I said I'm good now but still a lot of free room to ponder on things.

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 13:29:05 2015 No.7162037

>>7162012
https://wiki.dmt-nexus.me/Q21Q21's_Vinegar/Lime_A/B_Extraction_Tek

I recommend not doing the d-limonine version, it is harder to work with and much less efficient. Napatha works especially if you are using a decent freezer or a garage during the winter. If evaporating you still get almost no Napatha remaining, and it is clean burning. Hell even if you are eating it it's ld50 is through the roof.

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 13:34:35 2015 No.7162060 >>7161911 >>7161898 Thanks guys, appreciate the advice.

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 13:34:38 2015 No.7162062

>>7162020
When I use the term existential crises, I don't mean it mildly at all, I think the term is misused and misleading when used for anything mild. I am referring to a legitimate crises.

From what you have shared, it is inline with what I am talking about and is similar to what other people have relayed to me as well as my own personal experience, even up to being convinced that it was only a matter of time when you would lose it, and not being able to live a proper life in society for a period of time.

I still think this significantly different from the severity I am talking about, like with the anon who relayed he had a full on psychotic break and now takes pretty hardcore medication.

Again, I wish to reaffirm I am not downplaying your struggle in the slightest.

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 13:34:42 2015 No.7162063 >>7162037 Saved. Thanks much dude. I'm no chemist so I'm a little nervous I'm also a fully capable person and would take the necessary means for safety so that eases my mind.

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 13:36:08 2015 No.7162068 >>7161765 >mildly schizophrenic No. Do not do any psychedelics. It's not worth destroying your life over.

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 13:38:29 2015 No.7162077

>>7162063
Compared growing mushrooms or even something relatively trivial like extracting mescaline, that guide to extracting dmt is laughably simple. It really is a huge improvement on where the community was just 5 years ago. Totally fit for someone without any idea what they are doing, no background or understanding in chemistry or anything of the sort. It is a breeze and all the work takes a very short period of time. The longest portion is just dropping the temp while it is in the freezer or garage during winter, or a while longer if going the evaporation route.

If you can, definitely go the freezer/garage during winter route, easier and quicker than having to evaporate.

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 14:07:27 2015 No.7162219

>>7162077
Right on. That's the idea I've gotten searching online. One of the articles (actually most had this step) had a part where you need to use a hot plate to heat the mixture but they suggested that specifically because there could be fumes that are flammable. That seemed to me like only step with any danger. "Two dead in dmt making accident"

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 14:09:52 2015 No.7162229 >>7158500 Psychedelics are overrated and the most mellow of the hallucinogens. If you want true brain breaking insanity, take dissociatives and deliriants.

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 14:18:33 2015 No.7162267

>>7162219
That depends on what materials you are using and your approach. Other guides can indeed be less safe, especially older ones before certain breakthroughs in method were made. This guide doesn't need a hot plate because the only flammable product is introduced at the very end. Though a hot plate can be used, I have extracted dmt dozens of times and used this specific tek about over ten times, never needed a hot plate because a water bath was just more convenient for me.

I simply boil water and take that container to another room, then put a napatha-safe plastic container (or glass container) in it with the product in it, so it floats in the water, then add the napatha and stir. The water isn't going to ignite the napatha, even if it just was boiling a few minutes before, it won't cause combustion nor chance it.

It is totally okay to be cautious, but once you get through it the first time with this guide you will be shocked at how simple and safe it was. Best of luck.

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 14:24:04 2015 No.7162297

>>7162229
I actually find even high dose dissociatives, like MXE to be more mellow than certain high dose psychedelics. Same goes with moderately dosed deliriants like applethorn/dature compared to pretty high doses of particular psychedelics.

If you don't mind me asking, oh brain-broken insane one, what is the highest dose of any two particular psychedelics you have done?

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 14:39:57 2015 No.7162366

>>7162229

If you want true brain-breaking insanity, just drink non-stop for a few months, then quit cold turkey and enjoy the Irish Jig. Read Joyce while in delirium tremens for extra fag-points.

But then again, why would anyone want brain-breaking insanity? Psychedelics are taken to give insight and gain perspective. Not for pointless self-destruction. Deliriants are completely useless. You might as well huff glue until you began hallucinating from brain damage.

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 14:46:14 2015 No.7162380

>>7162366

I had semi delirium tremors when i was quitting. I had to go on benzos and shit. It's true that you become really paranoid and see insects crawling everywhere. I had like brain shocks sometimes where it felt like the brain was trying to synchronize itself and you forget everything you thought about the moments before it happens. Fucked up shit.

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 14:52:28 2015 No.7162396

I think the downside of my psychedelic use has been that its made me too introspective. I'm like hyper aware of my surroundings and how I feel in a given situation. I think constantly about what all the intricacies of a conversation or moment mean and sometimes this leads to life changing effects if I think an aspect of myself is worth changing. On the flip side though, it leads to insane levels of self scrutiny and utter helplessness. I have to keep reminding myself just because some of those thoughts are real doesn't make all of them real. It's kinda like a hell.

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 14:58:17 2015 No.7162419

>>7162396

You gotta try to adapt the mindset that there's just too much shit in the world to really try to grasp it all. Think pragmatically. Ignore the arcane shit, the little bits of info that leaks into your awareness from every direction. Just fuck it. Embrace the absurd. Think about what you know is true and focus on that.

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/lit/ - Literature