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/lit/ - Literature

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6765969 No.6765969 [Reply] [Original]

I don't get it.

>> No.6765977
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6765977

>>6765969

>> No.6765987

>>6765977
Pynchon?

>> No.6765997

>>6765969
Yeah, fuck that shit.

>> No.6766002
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6766002

>>6765987
Even better :)

>> No.6766003

I'll take 'signs you're a plebbity pleb' for 400

>> No.6766004

>>6765969
The paranoia of being unsure if its all in your head.

>> No.6766014

>>6766003
Maybe I'm just too patrish.

:^)

>> No.6766026
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6766026

i think my best interaction with this book was right after the part where oedipa sees the muted trumpet everywhere, i saw lady gaga's tattoo
>pic related

>> No.6766042
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6766042

>>6765969
It's not that deep. The references to very old plays and emblems are interesting, but as far as what's actually happening, the book is simply meant to make you feel Oedipa's exasperation and paranoia that she's being played by a man/author she can't interrogate.

Inherent Vice is essentially a postscript to Lot 49, to perfect the impression Pynchon wanted to give of California in the 60s, so you might learn something from reading it (I think Lot 49 and IV should be published as one volume), despite what the elitists on here say about IV.

Pynchon even disowned TCoL49 in the foreword to Slow Learner. It isn't nearly his best, so don't go worrying that you've missed out on something huge.

>> No.6766309

>>6766042
Why can't Pynchon write a coherent plot? I've read IV and CoL49 and to be honest I do not think I am going to try any of his larger books. It's just not worth it if they are anything like those two.

>> No.6766319

>>6766309
>why can't Pynchon write a coherent plot?

You think that is the issue? You really think, in your narcissistic delusion, that it is Pynchon's lack of writing ability and not your lack of reading comprehension?

>> No.6766323
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6766323

>>6765969
It's about finding meaning where there is none. Any hint of a meaning in this book is an illusion, and that's the point its trying to make.

>> No.6766324

>>6766026
Don Anderson has a proper tattoo of the symbol as well.

>> No.6766334

>>6766309
What do you mean by "coherent"?
I've read IV, GR, M&D and tCoL49 and I can assure you that the central plotting of all of them is coherent. A few shaggy dog stories on the side doesn't make it nonsense.

>> No.6766360

>>6766334
Perhaps coherent wasn't the right word choice. Lets look at IV and CoL49

>early promise of shadowy conspiracy that gets the reader hooked, but this is never delivered on
>absent central figure of plot (Wolfman and Pierce) that remains shrouded in mystery
>wonky supporting cast of characters that don't really contribute anything but boy, they sure are wonky!

It seemed like with both of those novels Pynchon wrote a whole lot of checks he never cashed. He sets out all the ingredients for a great story but never makes anything out of them. Chekhov's Gun is shown but it is never fired.

My question is why does he do this. Is he trying to piss the reader off?

>> No.6766523

>>6766360
Watch Blow-Up.

>> No.6766538

>>6766360
>He sets out all the ingredients for a great story
Hooooo boy. What makes a 'good story'?

>> No.6766572 [SPOILER] 
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6766572

>>6766538
good is one

>> No.6766582

>>6766572
Oh 'good' makes it good.
That's pretty much what I expected from you tbh

>> No.6766584

LIKE SEX :DDDDDDDDDDDDDD

>> No.6766654

I thought I understood most of what was going on, but I just got to the part with the play and the Tristero and now I'm fucking confused as shit.

I'll probably go back through it again tomorrow

>> No.6766669

>>6765969
Read it again. It'll be quick and you'll be better able to sort out the signal from the noise. And here's a tip, it appears to all relate, but it doesn't actually.

>> No.6766832

it helps if you read it in one or two sittings. col49 was pretty light and funny when i just powered through and then reflected. some of the parts with Oedipa and the lawyer were goddamn side splitting

>> No.6766847

>>6765969
It's a bunch of silly wordplay and goofy situations taken seriously by the characters. Fun, but it doesn't really "mean" much of anything. I was surprised to learn that Thurn und Taxis was a real thing in the middle ages though after looking it up later.

>> No.6766857

>>6766832
My favorite part was when Dr. Hilarius flips out and is revealed to be a former nazi.

>> No.6766984

>>6766857
IKR
mine was Oedipa frantically putting on clothes to play the stripping game. idk why it stuck with me

>> No.6767018

>>6765969
The book was one big conspiracy on you to suck you into itself. One big trick played on you, anon.

>> No.6767200

>>6766984
or when oedipa's eating lunch with her lawyer and he starts playing footsie with her under the table, dialogue badly paraphrased below

>he said, "run away with me"
>to which she replied "to where," which shut him right up

>> No.6767727

>>6766523
I've already seen it.

So you're saying it was all in her head?

Yeah, there's the ambiguity for that, but I really wish there was the "tennis scene" so to say, so I that I could at least formulate some kind of conclusion or meaning to the whole thing.

It ultimately feels like half of a novel, and if that's the point then Pynchon isn't for me.

>> No.6767733

>>6767200
My favourite line in any book ever.

>> No.6767751

I have a feeling this is going to a lot better the second read, eh?

>> No.6767777

It's weird nobody mentioned the Torquato Tasso stuff

>>/lit/thread/S667543#p667619

It's just themes and motifs, look for them: paranoia, narcissus (reflection, double presentation of things, the nymph sign "looks like her"), torquato tasso, pay attention to the Remedios Varo paintings, read about project MKUltra to understand about Hilarious and the LSD

at least these things will keep your mind busy and you'll know there's more to this book than you can imagine

>> No.6767787

The one thing you're supposed to take away from it is that you shouldn't look for meaning iin every little thing.

>>6766654
The play is central to the story. You don't have to get it at first, just remember what it's about, roughly. Most of it will be revealed towards the end.

>>6766832
>it helps if you read it in one or two sittings

Also this. I read it in two sittings, but some of the characters made me backtrack. For such a small novel, it has a shit ton, it's sometimes hard to keep track of who's who.

>> No.6767795

>>6765969
Because it's pomo garbage.

>> No.6767799

>>6766360

real life isn't coherent. I enjoy Pynchon because he perfectly captures what makes life such a grand mystery.

>> No.6767915

>>6766042
>deep
It's an incredibly dense novella and a single reading cant possibly allow you any greater insight into what is going on.


To get a better grasp of the story, you need to make yourself familiar with Eliade's Hierophany (read The Sacred and the Profane, 1954) which describes the manifestation of something sacred. 'Hieratic geometry', 'outward patterns a hieroglyphic sense of concealed meaning', 'hieroglyphic streets' are not mentioned by accident.

Entropy is the second main concept integral to Oedipa's quest. The major source of ambiguity is Pynchon’s figurative use of the concept of entropy. Both measure the disorganization of a system (closed system as in mirror, reflection, the bathroom with the spray can in the motel, the convoluted actor-lawyer digression involving Metzger and Baby Igor etc). Contrast San Narsiso's landscape or the Yoyodyne shareholder meeting with the night time chapter in San Franciso, the place with the highest disorder.
Look up the Gift of tongues, Pentecost and why Ercole tears out Domenice's tongue in the play.

In the Sophoclean myth, Oedipus's father Laios 'pierced' (what's her former lover's name again?) his son's feet. In consequence Oedipa now drives an Impala (to impale = to pierce); thus her more modern means of transportation now bears a linguistic trace of the injury – and she almost literally travels in the name of the father.
There is so much going on. Read it again.

>> No.6767924
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6767924

ay yo OP, it's about culture and isolation

the whole passage of oedipa describing this remedias varo painting and her rapunzel fantasy are literally the key to the rest of the book. it's surprising how many people miss it because it seems almost too hokey and hamfisted for pynchon.

note; pierce never saves her from the tower, rather jimmys the lock w/ a credit card and joins her inside

also consider
the post's messages are being distorted (one might say .... muted?), and the only human connection exists within shady subcultures like WASTE and DEATH that continue inwards into group isolation