/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.6734210]

>college offering modern literature course for other courses during vacations
>one of the assigned books is The Metamorphosis
>third class
>some guy with pink and green hair complains he didn't bother to read because the introduction spoilered the ending

h-h-how can these people reach superior education?

[Anonymous No.6734244]

I have a friend who's about to finish his major who thinks AVGN is one of the greatest critics there is. He passed most classes with great grades and little effort and can't remember anything besides trivia from any of them

[Anonymous No.6734260]

>>6734210
It's because we've abandoned the western canon and our youth have no identity in the post-modern post-internet revolution world.

[Anonymous No.6734275]

>>6734244
Honestly, I'm majoring in fine arts - which, by all acounts, is pretty easy - but still, we must know our Benjamin from our Adorno, our Belting from Danto, and so on.

>>6734260
Look mate, I've barely touched the western canon, most of the stuff I read is from the XVIII century onwards, with very few exceptions (currently correcting it, though), and yet, I had already been exposed to fucking Kafa in like, 8th grade. He's a pretty popular author, anyone who's doing a literature course should know at least the Metamorphosis.

[Anonymous No.6734287]

>>6734210
Somewhat related: I've been wondering if one can be both an elitist and a leftist, particularly with regard to work rights and economic policy? The two positions seem inherently discordant, but , although I consider myself something of a rightist/traditionalist, I also sympathize with communist/marxist/socialist ideas. Maybe I should check out that millbank fellow.

[Anonymous No.6734291]

>>6734210
that guy is a pleb

but that being said, I normally skip the introduction and only go back to read it after I read the actual story just to avoid the spoilers

[Anonymous No.6734296]

>>6734291
>2015
>reading for the plot

[Anonymous No.6734304]

>>6734287
Adorno is your main man when it comes to somewhat reactionary leftism.

[Anonymous No.6734310]

>>6734304
>Adorno

Even though he is Frankfurt School? Maybe I'll check him out anyhow.

[Anonymous No.6734315]

>>6734310
Abandon this meme, the Frankfurt schoolers had some very poignant things to say, specially about the new media and art of their time.

[ΟΥΤΙΣ No.6734321]

>>6734287
Milbank is as much of a populist as he is an elitist. In fact he blames modernism for creating the highbrow-lowbrow rupture. But he is definitely a traditionalist and wants to revive the focus of family and traditional values, and he wants theology to regain its prominent in academics.

[Anonymous No.6734353]

>>6734310
>>6734315
The Frankfurt school was infamously conservative for a bunch of communists.

It's ironic that fascists are accusing people who believed that society is in decay of decaying society.

>>6734321
So he's a proto-fascist, or just a socialist with a conservative streak?

[ΟΥΤΙΣ No.6734381]

>>6734353
Neither, he wants a resurgence of Medieval though and values, while acknowledging things that were wrong and need to fixed, as well as accounting for the demands of industrialization. That doesn't mean a replication of the Medieval political system, he more wants a wants a combination of distributism and a guild system where the apprentices and the consumers and the community can share in input, and where people can have their living space and their workspace as close together as possible, if not outright the same space.

[Anonymous No.6734442]

>>6734296
I can't appreciate foreshadowing if I already know what happens.

When the original work was published, there wasn't some cheeky english MA fucker that immediately read it and threw his opinion in before the actual work itself. By saving the introduction for last you get an organic experience that's as true to the experience first edition readers had as possible.

[Anonymous No.6734671]

>>6734353
No, Frankfurt school called racists racist, whatever you think they are is just a /pol/ maymay because, guess what, /pol/ is regularly racist. There was no pc conspiracy, they just had a problem with racist people saying things that have no factual basis and called them out on it. Then the racists got way mad bro :( and blamed their anti racism on the fact that some scholars have Jewish heritage.
They had so much more to say and have made some extremely important arguments about media, art, communication, society, etc. If you're actually interested in modern philosophy, and not just what's hip on memeChan, then they are definitely worth reading about

[Anonymous No.6734683]

>>6734671
Also I'm not saying there isnt elitism on the left and I'm not saying the Frankfurt school had all the answers, I'm just debunking myths and emphasizing their importance in 20th C philosophy.

[Anonymous No.6734684]

If it took you this long to realize modern education doesn't actually educate you're not very bright either.

[Anonymous No.6735827]

>>6734381
So he's a feudal socialist with a reactionary streak?

The elitist populism just reminded me of fascism, and so did the mix of traditionalism and socialism reminded me of Georges Sorel, ergo 'proto-fascist.'

[Anonymous No.6735838]

>>6734671
>>6734353
Guise you are both right. They were against the culture industry AND against racism. Amazing, I know.

[ΟΥΤΙΣ No.6736539]

>>6735827
You're on the right track, but I really don't think he can be compared to modernist thinker. God is at the center of his ideology, everything revolves around God, his politics are completely derived from theology, particularly Medieval theology. The closest he comes to secular thought is virtue ethics and other classical ideas which were a large influence on theology.

As a fascist, I can't claim him as one of my own even remotely, because he cares far more about community than nation, and he completely rejects dialects, idealist or materialist, in favor of "paradox", which is why he prefers Kierkegaard to Hegel.

[Anonymous No.6736550]

>>6735838
But these people aren't both fascists and they don't agree on a definition of fascism yet.
This debate can go nowhere till someone gives us a definition.
I propose 'a socioeconomic system that discriminates against Jews.' Does anyone ha e a better definition?

[ΟΥΤΙΣ No.6736571]

>>6736550
Fascism is totalitarianism which sees the nation as an idealist construction existing only so long as it is willed into existence by the people.

[Anonymous No.6736581]

>>6736550
Fascism is a socioeconomic model characterized by a strong state for the express constitutional purpose of expanding the power of the nation over other nations, or of expanding the nation's economy without limit for the good of the nation. Unlike socialism, this is not Utopian and does not focus on the good of the revolutionary working class but rather on the good of the nation as a whole, regardless of class conflict.

[Anonymous No.6736600]

>>6736539
>>6736571
you would love coming to visit Argentina, greek-kun. i would present you to my peronist friends and you'd really like them.

[Anonymous No.6736653]

>>6734296
>Not reading once for a virgin experience and then going back to appreciate the nuances.
pleb.

[ΟΥΤΙΣ No.6736667]

>>6736600
Mmmm. That sounds very pleasant. How do you spend your evenings?

[Anonymous No.6736696]

>>6736667
Writing about /m/ in a genre studies approach because I find the idea of going to a congress to talk about animu incredibly hilarious and trying to structure my film studies thesis in a way that makes the visual aspects I want to deal with functional. And fantasying with suicide, of course.
Or you mean the reagular argentine? that would be discussing football, misunderstanding politics because they can't even remember 5 presidents ago and drinking mate. comfy in its own way.

[ΟΥΤΙΣ No.6736701]

>>6736696
Why are you fantasizing about suicide? seems like you need a cuddle