/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.6652114]

Why is Marxism still a thing among you guys here at /lit/?
The best argument against this crap are countries like South Korea, Republic of China and West Germany at the time.

While North Korea, People's Republic of China and East Germany turned into absolute fucking shitholes, the others prospered and are now among the top tier in the world.
High living standard, no mass deaths needed.
Why would you endorse an idea that leads to nothing but tragedy?

[Anonymous No.6652117]

>>6652114
THe best centuries of Sparta were communist.

[Evola « Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » Kid !vKJYJAzBlI No.6652120]

>>6652114
>Why is Marxism still a thing among you guys here at /lit/?

Its not there's only a few tripfags who push it like a forced meme.

you can tell because communism is the ultimate pleb philosophy while /lit/ is high brow

[Evola « Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » Kid !vKJYJAzBlI No.6652130]

>>6652117
>kings
>slaves
>currency

apparently this is communsim

[Anonymous No.6652132]

>>6652117

Yeah sure brah, that makes me totally reconsider and do it on an industrial level again.

[Anonymous No.6652137]

>>6652114
To be fair you could make an image just like that for Capitalism too.

The best form of communism would be anarcho-communism, where a government voluntarily dissolves after setting up the framework for a communal society. Like that will ever happen though.

[Evola « Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » Kid !vKJYJAzBlI No.6652141]

>>6652137
>The best form of communism would be anarcho-communism, where a government voluntarily dissolves after setting up the framework for a communal society. Like that will ever happen though.

it wouldn't evolve past hippies doing drugs in the woods

[Anonymous No.6652142]

>>6652114
What other alternative is there to fight capitalism with? Fascism? Please.
People who want "communism" that was used during the 20th century are complete idiots. If communism will ever be used again it should be changed and studied before actually being applied in the real world. I personally like the idea just because there is room for change. The biggest problem on the left today is figuring out how and what to change and that is why it's worth studying it.

[Anonymous No.6652147]

>>6652114
>one quote
>taken from two different sources
In other words, these sentence were never uttered by Marx in succession, and the 'they' of the second one may mean anything whatsoever. Great job, /pol/fag -bad infographics are a dead giveaway- you sure showed us.

[Evola « Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » Kid !vKJYJAzBlI No.6652150]

>>6652142
>What other alternative is there to fight capitalism with?

An insurrection of the old aristocracy against them modern world.

However fascism is preferable to communism

[Anonymous No.6652153]

The main thing to consider is why people are driven to such extremes that communism, fascisim or say the French Revolution becomes a viable alternative to their present miserable lives. It is these causes not the political terminology of the solution that matters. If the causes remain then forms of Communism/ Totalitarianism will remain and so do not fail in terms of that they are totally rejected as options.

[Anonymous No.6652155]

>>6652141
Thats why its happened and worked for years in the Spanish Revolution and also in Ukrainian Free Territory.

[Anonymous No.6652156]

>>6652150
I hope you're just trolling.
If not, it is time to go back to /pol/

[Anonymous No.6652158]

>>6652150

>old artistocracy

Most of them are extinct.

[Anonymous No.6652161]

>>6652141
Well exactly. It could work as a microcosm but never universally. George Orwell actually writes about a successful anarchist community in Homage to Catalonia, until the communists come and ruin it.

[Anonymous No.6652162]

>>6652150
>insurrection of the old aristocracy
Yeah, that will do the trick, some inbred old fucks with castles and deco swords taking down the state. Perfectly plausible.

[Anonymous No.6652165]

>>6652114
The reason it's still a thing and anyone with a brain that read any more of Marx's work other than the peice of garbage that is the communist manifesto is that he was right.

Communism wasn't the ussr or pol pot or Cuba it's the next inescapable step that will happen when capitalism has run its course. You can't rush it and it won't happen till our grandchildren, grandchildren are dead.

[Evola « Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » Kid !vKJYJAzBlI No.6652169]

>>6652155
>>6652162

>Thats why its happened and worked for years in the Spanish Revolution and also in Ukrainian Free Territory.

Except that didn't work very well.

[Anonymous No.6652173]

>>6652156
It's been buzzing around being loudly conservative for a little while now.

Don't respond to it, that's what it wants.

[Anonymous No.6652176]

>>6652165
/thread

[Evola « Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » Kid !vKJYJAzBlI No.6652181]

>>6652156
>I hope you're just trolling.
>If not, it is time to go back to /pol/

nope serious if you don't like it go back to reddit

[Evola « Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » Kid !vKJYJAzBlI No.6652185]

>>6652162
>writing off monarchy as something strictly material

yep typical leftist

[Anonymous No.6652192]

>>6652185
Ok how will the old aristocracy, which is, again, nothing but inbreds with deco swords and castles, convince anyone to bend the knee? Also, aren't you american? You don't even have anything like an old aristocracy.

[Evola « Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » Kid !vKJYJAzBlI No.6652200]

>>6652192
>Ok how will the old aristocracy, which is, again, nothing but inbreds with deco swords and castles, convince anyone to bend the knee?

http://www.moreright.net/category/monarchy/

>aren't you american? You don't even have anything like an old aristocracy.
german

[Anonymous No.6652203]

>>6652192
The Waltons and the Bushes are the aristocracy, those kind of powerful families don't go away just because the plebs go to the pols and check a box every 4 years. the evola guy is a simpleton.

[Evola « Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » Kid !vKJYJAzBlI No.6652209]

>>6652203
>The Waltons and the Bushes are the aristocracy, those kind of powerful families don't go away just because the plebs go to the pols and check a box every 4 years

powerful families don't go away but they stop being aristocrats

[Anonymous No.6652216]

>>6652200
You expect me to read all that shit? I've read some of their stuff a while ago, not very convincing tbh.
Und überhaupt, sollen denn nun die Hohenzollern oder die Habsburger hier die Macht übernehmen? Hast du dir die mal angeguckt? Oder stehst du eher so auf die Reichsbürger-Nummer? Mal im Ernst, du bist wahrscheinlich der größte Otto auf dem gesamten Board.

[Anonymous No.6652218]

>>6652114
I don't see any actual Marxist threads here. They are oftenly made by people who want to fight or are really misinformed. There are also some threads on which some anons try to start a fight by randomly mentioning how communism never worked. It is annoying to see little kids fight over something they know nothing about.

[Anonymous No.6652224]

>no mass death needed

What is colonialism? What is the second world war? What is today's immigration in the Mediterranean?

[Evola « Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » Kid !vKJYJAzBlI No.6652226]

>>6652216
>You expect me to read all that shit? I've read some of their stuff a while ago, not very convincing tbh.

well you asked a question that requires vast amounts of reading

>Und überhaupt, sollen denn nun die Hohenzollern oder die Habsburger hier die Macht übernehmen? Hast du dir die mal angeguckt? Oder stehst du eher so auf die Reichsbürger-Nummer? Mal im Ernst, du bist wahrscheinlich der größte Otto auf dem gesamten Board.

Naturally I'd side with the Prussians

[Anonymous No.6652245]

>>/lit/ is for the discussion of literature.

If you want to talk about politics, go to /pol/.

[Anonymous No.6652252]

>>6652226
>requires vast amounts of reading
No, it requires some common sense. Which you don't have, which is why read that edgy american nonsense.
>Naturally I'd side with the Prussians
Oh well, good luck with that I guess. Note, however, that prussia was one of the most progressive, enlightened places on earth in its time.

[Anonymous No.6652255]

>>6652245
/pol is for the politically incorrect. We are more sophisticated. Sophisticated adults.

[Anonymous No.6652298]

>>6652130
>>6652114
>Why is Marxism still a thing among you guys here at /lit/?
Existential crisis is a key aspect of the human condition, and people deal, or don't, with it in many different ways. People here on /lit/ generally read more then your average person, so unavoidably stumble into nihilism/absurdism sooner rather than later.

The majority of those who tumble down this particular rabbithole grind to a halt somewhere along the way, announcing they've hit rock bottom, ignoring the draft.

These people, there, dare not think they could dream they could imagine they could hope they could aspire to claim their freedom as individuals, harnessing willpower and staking ownership over the responsibility of creating their own fates.

They bow down before the great fearspook and are overtaken by the desire to be slaves, subjects rather than individuals. They want to prostate themselves before the highest authority they can find.

Many turn to God, not unlike the majority of the general population, but those whose worldviews are too secularly set, turn to the closest asymptote to the big G that civilization has produced: the state.

Therefore, upon contemplating the course of civilization,

From there, they willingly lose themselves in the postmodern, philistine wastelands of totalitarian collectivism.

[Anonymous No.6652318]

>>6652298
Well written.

[Anonymous No.6652324]

>>6652298
more people need to embrace their own illusion of will tbh

[Anonymous No.6652333]

>>6652114
Marxism's critiques of Capitalism ought to be incorporated into a Neo-Reactionary /Traditionalist framework. Removing Marxism's solution to Capitalism but using its analysis and critiques of consumerism could provide a strong foundation for Traditionalist thought.

[Anonymous No.6652350]

>>6652333
The Nazis and Fascists already did that

[Anonymous No.6652358]

>>6652117
Turkish girls are amazing

[Anonymous No.6652361]

>>6652114
All of those states' problems arose from being totalitarian, not communist.

[Anonymous No.6652368]

>>6652114
Many on here are sheltered NEETs who have never had a taste of real life.

They're also dirt poor, so they don't actually own anything they had to work for and which they're afraid to lose.

They only stand to gain from a far-reaching redistribution of wealth and means.

[Anonymous No.6652427]

>>6652255
Yeah but we want to keep it that way.

[Anonymous No.6652432]

>>6652114
40 years ago, Marxism was a thing because Communist governments existed that would give you sweet benefits like money and probably bitches for being a Marxist.

Nowadays, it's a combination of inertia and the fact that Marxist-derived ideologies are a good way to be edgy in First World countries without being arrested.

[Anonymous No.6652441]

>>6652368
>never had a taste of real life and by real life I mean capitalist indoctrination.

>dirt poor, so they don't actually own anything they had to work for and which they're afraid to lose
>capitalism works because of fear

"I worked hard for this so we shouldn't try and get a better system"

>sheltered and secure
>poor and want to gain from redistribution

Pick one.

Inb4 "The sheltered ones are rich, spoiled and lazy etc."

[Anonymous No.6652445]

>>6652441
>by real life I mean capitalist indoctrination
No, I mean actually having to work for food and shelter.

You know, basic survival.

[Anonymous No.6652446]

>>6652427
That is exactly why we should analyze Marxism from a philosophical perspective instead of having these kinds of discussions.

[Anonymous No.6652454]

cos young males love metanarratives

[Anonymous No.6652455]

Communism is just capitalist catharsism.

Why no discussion of socialism btw? It seems like an ideal blend of the two schools of thought.

[Anonymous No.6652459]

>>6652445
Yeah. Basic survival in capitalism. You're so thick that you can't even see that it is possible to survive as a group and not just struggle on your own. It is sad how you think capitalist individual survival is basic.

[Anonymous No.6652462]

>>6652455
Be careful. There are many different things you can call socialism.

[Anonymous No.6652467]

>>6652459
>Yeah. Basic survival in capitalism.
No, I mean basic survival.

>can't even see that it is possible to survive as a group
Of course I can.

Because when I say "work for food and shelter", I don't mean "hunt and grown your own food and build your own house".

Whether alone in the wild, or as part of society, you're going to have to do your part.

[Anonymous No.6652485]

>>6652467
Ok. So you think most Marxists never worked. I never saw any statistics so I can't really argue with that. It is also true that you should contribute to society but there is a problem in that. Not everyone can contribute in the same way. Not everyone is needed or even wanted to contribute. Should we just leave those people die. What is the point of society if it doesn't help its members?
You can't contribute because of the system>You don't contribute>"You don't have a right to criticize the society because you don't contribute in any way and it is probably just your own fault because our system is justice itself and freedom and you're just a worthless pleb."

[Anonymous No.6652491]

>>6652485
>all this rationalization

You're an able-bodied young man.

Get a fucking job, or go live in the woods or something.

[Anonymous No.6652496]

>>6652117
Not really true at all

[Anonymous No.6652505]

>>6652114
>While North Korea, People's Republic of China and East Germany

All different circumstances, all different things must be considered.

[Anonymous No.6652519]

>>6652505
>All different circumstances

Yeah, with one thing in common: communism.

[Anonymous No.6652521]

>>6652491
Oh yeah. It's just rationalisation. How did I not notice that before? Poor people don't exist. That is just my mind playing tricks.
I hate using the word patronising but that is exactly what you are trying to do.
Since these discussions are useless because you obviously don't understand the system you live in (and I believe you would argue that I'm projecting by saying this) I would suggest we end this retarded discussion and go back to reading some fucking books.

[Anonymous No.6652522]

>>6652521
>poor people are inherently useless

Wow. And you dare call me patronizing.

[Anonymous No.6652549]

>>6652522
Strawman is a common fallacy. You'll learn how to avoid it one day.

[Anonymous No.6652553]

>>6652549
I hope you will learn how to avoid it.*

[Anonymous No.6652556]

>>6652521
>>6652485
>>6652549
>if only I lived in a Marxist society, my parents wouldn't bug me to get a job as everyone else would pay my way

[Anonymous No.6652569]

>>6652556
>if only I lived in a Marxist society, my parents wouldn't bug me to get a job as everyone else would pay my way

That is the capitalist dream aka. yours.
There is probably some ideology having a party in your brain. I'm really feel sorry for you.

[Anonymous No.6652573]

>>6652169
That's because the Spanish were also fighting a Civil War, and the USSR was also trying to end the anarcho-communist collective

[Anonymous No.6652582]

>>6652556
Fallacy combo

[Anonymous No.6652650]

>no mass deaths needed

Are you stupid OP ? Don't you realize that in a capitalist world, life is costing money ? Of course deaths are needed. Just understand this:

High living standards come at the price of national exploitation in underdeveloped countries. Capitalist comfort brings death to a part of the world. Except brainwashed americans think mass market and overconsumption of natural and human ressources is the only way of living.

[Anonymous No.6652659]

>>6652445
No that's called alienation.

[Anonymous No.6652671]

>>6652114
>"marxism and communism is the same thing"

Also, since your thread seems to be oriented towards politics rather than social theory, you might want to go to this one wonderful board dedicated to discussing politics.