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/lit/ - Literature

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6486573 No.6486573 [Reply] [Original]

>In the actual world Nietzsche was a twitchy, irresolute, nomadic nerd who never got a life outside literature. But consider the possible world in which Nietzsche got lucky early on and wound up a happy, affectionate, suburban paterfamilias. In this more satisfactory world, the ridicule of Wilamowitz Moellendorf (the John Searle of his day) failed to sink The Birth of Tragedy. On the contrary, that book enjoyed, simultaneously with Moriarty's treatise on the binomial theorem, a European vogue. Outrageously successful, Nietzsche's American lecture tours eclipsed those of Dickens. The many books about him by American fans and imitators (the old Mark Twain, the young H. L. Mencken), as well as the equally many books which excitedly warned against his dangerous influence, kept his name constantly before the public. Instead of breaking down at forty-five, he kept right on writing, joyously and prolifically, "having a great time" ("s'amusant beaucoup"; 141). Would success, sanity, and suburbia have spoiled Friedrich Nietzsche? Would perfection of the life have wrecked the work? Could he have written so well against resentment if he had experienced it less often? Could he have written The Will to Power if he had gotten some? Maybe not.

>> No.6486614

>>6486573
Rorty seems so based but I'm pretty sure no one makes philosophy graduate as butthurt as that man.

>> No.6486633

>>6486614
Can confirm. I'm a philosophy graduate; read one of his essays for a class and I was the only one in the room who didn't get butt mad. I was also the only one laughing.

>> No.6486635

>>6486573
The answer is yes.

Nietzsche wasnt a normalfag and as a normalfag he wouldn't have created the edgy yet deep works he did create. Normalfags are by definition shallow. You cannot understand the condition of man if you are a happy person.

To be a great philosopher or artist one must suffer and see it as the only way to break the chains. Otherwise you do it too half-hearted. Too sloppily.

Another option is to be autistic, obsessed or genuinely passionate about something. But the God of profound insight favours the broken.

>> No.6486953

>>6486633
Why? I haven't read Rorty. He hits in the soft spot, doesn't he?

>> No.6486982

>>6486953
>He hits in the soft spot, doesn't he?
Kind of. He was very against the anglo tradition of philosophy, which is mainly analytical.
The closest categorization for Rorty would be neo-pragmatism, not very close to the analytical approach to philosophy and being one of the few that, with some of his research, tried to introduce the continental tradition into the anglo philosophical academy.

>> No.6486986

Literally shitposting with the academic authority.

>> No.6486992

Nietzsche probably would have hated that. He enjoyed suffering.

>> No.6486998

>>6486633
>I was the only one in the room who didn't get butt mad. I was also the only one laughing.

You're so unique and smart, dude. Give us more anecdotes about how you were the special one who saw everything the right way.

>> No.6487009

>>6486573
>Could he have written The Will to Power if he had gotten some?

I've never read anything by Rorty, but is the above not the most crystallized version of the corny, dimwitted boomer sense of humor?

>> No.6487051

>>6487009
>Could he have written The Will to Power if he had gotten some?

yea, I dunno. But that quote triggers my shit so hard.

Reminds me of the type of person who says Schoppy was a bitter virgin, despite his womanizing being well documented.
And on the flip side you have Kant, the eternal virgin who was a party hosting gentleman and spoke well of women during his time.

Who the fuck thinks success actually effects your internal struggles in life so much? I can't respect this kind of retarded thinking.

At best he is saying "would it have been possible for life to distract him enough that he never got around to writing 'will to power' "

>> No.6487064

>>6486998
calm down

>> No.6487097

When I was taking philosophy classes, I would always get high As and praise from my professors if I wrote smug shit like this in my papers, even if I didn't know what I was talking about. Eventually I just changed my major to physics because philosophy is for faggots.

>> No.6487111
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6487111

>>6487097
>philosophy is for faggots
You'd watch your tongue if you know what's good for you, them's fighting words.

>> No.6487135

>>6486573
Literally
>Lmao If Nietzsche got his dick wet he wouldn't have worried all that philosophy shit. Nigga needs to get laid.
Rorty is cancer.

>> No.6487214

>>6486635
>You cannot understand the condition of man if you are a happy person
Stop trying to rationalise your depression by pretending you have some great insight.
That whole attitude is so bullshit

>> No.6487267
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6487267

>>6487097


We live in a world where I have to click pictures of pasta to call you a faggot. I'm not even angry at you anymore, just the fucking captcha-pasta shit we call existence.

>> No.6487272

>>6487097

Actually fuck it I agree with you, snide comment rescinded.

>> No.6488209

>>6486998
>>6487135
> butthurt philosophy grads detected

>> No.6488234

>>6486635
>You cannot understand the condition of man if you are a happy person.

This is bullshit, but I believe it.

>> No.6488419

>>6488234
I think it would be more correct to say that you cannot understand the condition of man if you have always been a happy person.

>> No.6488421

Didn't rorty say that he regretted spending so much time with philosophy? great philosopher there m8

>> No.6488427

>>6486573
too long cba to read lolz :D D;DDDD :P XDDDDDDDDD

>> No.6488429

>>6488209
Your too good for this world, anon. :^)

>> No.6488451

>>6488419
I don't think being sad sometimes guarantees you have any kind of insight into "the human condition."

Some sad people are just retarded. Some people have pretty terrible lives and still are happy.

I don't know how it works and neither do you.

>> No.6488476
File: 632 KB, 1464x1986, Nietzsche187a.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6488476

Pls tell me this is fake. I used to like Rorty before I realised the good pragmatic parts are taken from Nietzsche and the rest is degenerate.

He really thinks a fat ass at his desk eating red meat, downing alcohol, listening to avantgarde or hiphop or whatever, is better than a 19th century european who drinks tea eats vegetables and walks down to the concert hall to see Carmen. WTF how can he think the former is not a decline in culture? (not saying all of the USA is degenerate, just these anti-Nietzsche populist democrats usually.

>> No.6488484
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6488484

>>6486573
Has that guy ever opened any of nietzsche books??

There's so many things wrong here. Nietzsche always say that his health is at the center of his writings, he also never wrote the will to power. So he must have been getting some I guess by his logic.

>> No.6488490

>>6488451
never said it guarantees anything, I said it might be a requirement

>> No.6488494
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6488494

>>6488476
>degenerate

>> No.6488515

>>6488494
>le buzzwords
fine Rorty is "less restrained by convention, taste or morality". happy?

>>6488484
Yeah I'm shocked that this is the guy who supposedly "reintroduced" such philosophers into the Anglo tradition. I bet people like Wittgenstein were much more familiar. You can't even say he's referring to the Will to Power as a concept because he uses the full book title. And apparently OP was written as recently as 1998.

>> No.6488531

>>6488421
Poor sophists eventually realize they've just been playing word games and should have read Aristotle instead, but it's too late for that.

>> No.6488579

>>6487097
Lol, well-Rorty'd m80

>> No.6488670

>>6488494
le fedora meme

>> No.6488676
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6488676

>>6488515
Right. Nietzsche was totally constrained by morality

>> No.6488680

>>6488676
Right. Just not Christian morality.

>Schopeyplebs

>> No.6488681

>>6488421
A-ha! This is why philosophy graduates hate him so much.

They realize graduate school was a mistake and resent him for saying it out loud.

I knew there was a reason.

>> No.6488707

>>6487009
>>6487051
nice reading comp, faggots. it's pretty clear he means "had gotten some [power]" and not "had gotten some ;)".

>> No.6488792

>>6488476
>the good pragmatic parts are taken from Nietzsche and the rest is degenerate
Literally all of Nietzsche's technical stuff was said better by the the actual pragmatists

>> No.6488801

>>6488484
>Has that guy ever opened any of nietzsche books??
This is just a hunch, don't take my word for it, I might be wrong, but I were to take a stab, I would guess, probably, perhaps, that "that guy" has read more Nietzsche than you, Anonymous.

>> No.6488810
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6488810

Calm down anons, it's alright, he goes on to say:
>But the example of Derrida, like that of Dickens, should make us suspicious of the idea that loneliness and neglect are good for genius, and that fame and money always corrupt. Derrida remains as fresh, as moving, and as funny as ever, despite all the puffing and all the bashing he has endured. He has somehow managed to take both in his stride. He has kept himself as open to the books he reads and rereads, and as responsive to the power of fantasy, as he was when he started out.

>> No.6488822

>>6486635
>You cannot understand the condition of an unhappy person if you are a happy person.
ftfy

>> No.6488833

>>6488476
>/pol/

>> No.6488838

>>6488810
Except science and etymology confirms that the thoughts of sedentary writers such as Derrida and Rorty are decadent shite compared to great walking thinkers like Nietzsche and Aristotle.

>A sedentary life is the real sin against the Holy Spirit. Only those thoughts that come by walking have any value.

>> No.6488848

>>6488833
>Rorty is "less restrained by convention, taste or morality". happy?

>> No.6488858

>>6486635
Happiness is part if the condition, Anon, fuck yourself

>> No.6488863

>>6488848
>happy.

>> No.6488866

>>6487135
That isn't what he was saying at all, you idiot

>> No.6488871

>>6488490
If you think there's anyone who has never experienced sadness you're an idiot.

>> No.6488876

>>6488838
Fuck off and take a walk then, faggot

>> No.6488892

>>6486573
I don't get the point he is making.
It just seems like "fan fiction" about entry level philosophers.

>> No.6488900

>>6488892
He continues here >>6488810
It's from an essay about Derrida

>> No.6488920

>>6488900
Okay.
Thank you.

>> No.6488932

>>6488707
If it's "pretty clear", then why did 3/4 people interpret it the other way?

>> No.6488936

>>6487267
>the fucking captcha-pasta shit we call existence.

Lol

>> No.6488951

>>6488932
They might have bad reading comprehension. They also might be bitter virgins responding with ressentiment.

>> No.6488970

>>6488951
>They also might be bitter virgins responding with ressentiment.

And you're not a STEM major because you can't do middle school math.

>> No.6488983

>>6486573
The same way most athletes start underperforming once they are famous and eat and party instead of applying strict discipline and iron will.

And the same way a politician coming from a ghetto will likely forget his upbringing and enjoy his new-found luck instead of still doing meals on wheels every week.

You can smother a lot by giving people bread and games, wine and women. But how does that make anything he wrote less true or less wrong?

I don't understand why every discussion of Nietzsche ends in character assassination. Yes, he caught a disease and went crazy. Long before that, he was a renowned professor at an age where most people today still live with Mommy and go to school. Neither plays a role in judging his work.

>> No.6488992

>>6488983
>I don't understand why every discussion of Nietzsche ends in character assassination

That's how most discussions about anyone go these days. For some reason we've accepted that identity is more important the ideas.

>> No.6489007

Nietzsche always claimed that his terrible sickness and relationship problems were the best thing that ever happened to him, for they allowed to fulfill his will to power.

>> No.6489010

>>6488871
great sadness anon

>> No.6489017

>>6488983
I dont think Rorty was attacking his character, but instead making the point that true knowledge comes from hardship.

>> No.6489431

>>6488838
i like your style

>> No.6489519

>>6489010
Care to quantify and qualify that?

I could make an antithetical claim like "People who don't know great happiness can't be real people" and it would be as valid an assertion as yours--that is, invalid. A complete and fully lived life has moments of absolute sorrow and absolute joy, periods of melancholy and periods of ataraxia, and every emotion between these. Your position is insipid at best. Enjoy your sadness.

>> No.6489527

>>6488970
I don't see your point. I haven't mentioned anything mathematical in any of the few posts I've made ITT.

>> No.6489539

>>6489527
His point is that the "bitter virgin" meme is as cogent as the "you can't do math" meme.

>> No.6489602

>>6489519
I never said that people who are happy "can't be real people"(what we're really discussing is understanding human experience), I said that people who have always been happy could probably not understand human experience fully(nobody can fully understand, but let's not be pedantic). Though I don't think it actually prevents anything, if you have a powerful sense of empathy.

and what's the thing where whenever someone negates the ability of large amounts of people("I believe in monarchy" and so on) people jump at him with accusations of a unwarranted sense of self-importance? I said only people who have felt great sadness could understand humanity, then you jump at me calling me a depressed bitter prick(reading between the lines).

>> No.6489610

>>6489602
I assumed you were a depressed bitter prick because of the website we're posting on.

>> No.6489633

>>6486635
>And that's why I'm superior to normalfags
lelel

>> No.6489662

ITT: Teenagers buttmad at Rorty for not completely swallowing Nietzsche's dick.

>> No.6491311

>>6489662
>buttmad
>swallowing Nietzsche's dick
>calling other people "teenagers"

>> No.6491323

>>6489662

You flatter yourself.

>> No.6492647

>>6486573
>would Nietzsche be Nietzsche if he wouldn't be Nietzsche?

>> No.6493662
File: 446 KB, 2024x2478, Tiziano_-_Vanità_(Alte_Pinakothek_München).jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6493662

>Could he have written The Will to Power if he had gotten some?
>Could he have written The Will to Power
>a collection of notes and aphorisms compiled by his sister into a book after his death

what the fuck dicky, I didn't think you were capable of making such a retarded mistake

also
>Richard Rorty
>calling anyone else in the world a nerd

>> No.6493684

>>6493662
He did write it, though. The text was written by him.

>> No.6495311

>>6486635

>You cannot understand the condition of man if you are a happy person.

This is true. Heidegger ontologics can demonstrate this.

>> No.6495367

>>6493662
He wrote the aphorisms you ninny.

>> No.6495432

>>6486633
Which one was it?

>> No.6495460

>>6487267
Kek
>tfw I had to go through two rounds of imaginary street signs and one round of pasta to give you this kek