/lit/ - Literature

File: 266 KB, 1024x576, rust-cohle-1024.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 01:57:16 2015 No.6437792 [Reply] [Original]

>I think human consciousness is a tragic misstep in evolution. We became too self aware, nature created an aspect of nature separate from itself. We are creatures that should not exist by natural law…We are things that labor under the illusion of having a self, a secretion of sensory, experience, and feeling, programmed with total assurance that we are each somebody, when in fact everybody is nobody.

Is he right?

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 02:00:46 2015 No.6437807 we're too aware to be happy, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't exist by "natural law" at any rate matt became born-again at the end of the series. he's just butthurt 'cause he ran over his daughter

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 02:01:33 2015 No.6437809 Babby's first existential musing True Detective is for plebs who have never read anything about philosophy in their lives.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 02:21:22 2015 No.6437861 >>6437809 good job

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 02:24:55 2015 No.6437871 >>6437809 >the entire fucking show is about subverting Rust's views >people still bitch incessantly about this shit Fuck you, True Detective is great by /tv/ standard

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 02:26:46 2015 No.6437876

>>6437792
No, it's meant to express the inner mind and motivations of the protagonist. He's very unhappy and his conscious mind (his dead child) and memories are a source of torment.

It's not meant to be philosophy but it's a philosophical sentiment and you can sort of tell what kind of philosophers he would read (and give his best layman's interpretation of).

In that respect I think it's right on.

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 02:28:18 2015 No.6437881

>>6437809
The whole point of the show was contrasting different individuals approaching a similar situation. As the show progresses, you slowly realize the two have more in common than you'd think at first, they just have different methods.

Rust is also supposed to be annoying as fuck in the flashbacks. 99% of what he says you're meant to just roll your eyes at.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 02:29:45 2015 No.6437884 >>6437871 if by "entire show" you mean "the last scene of the last episode, in a tonal about-face," you're correct

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 02:32:38 2015 No.6437893 It's summer again.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 02:34:11 2015 No.6437901 File: 5 KB, 163x201, coyote.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>6437792 >natural law

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 02:40:04 2015 No.6437915 Where do people get this idea that consciousness functionally doesn't do anything at all? Like they think, without consciousness, everything would be exactly the same except nobody would talk about consciousness.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 03:02:00 2015 No.6437961 >>6437915 You can't think of "without consciousness", only of conciousness which is not conscious of itself.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 03:04:28 2015 No.6437967 >>6437961 >You can't think of "without consciousness" What?

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 03:04:35 2015 No.6437968 >>6437792 if you are seriously trying to discuss a meme quote about it's philosophical meaning I'd suggest reddit.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 03:05:50 2015 No.6437973 >>6437961 you are trying way too hard

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 03:07:01 2015 No.6437976 >>6437968 >I have nothing of value to say! Is he right or wrong? Lol I dnno but I'm not gonna reveal I wasn't as smart as a tv show ;^)

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 03:08:20 2015 No.6437981 no

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 03:24:04 2015 No.6438004 >>6437973 Not that anon, but this is /lit/. Not /tv/. You either have something to say in rebuttal or you don't. Stop playing this "don't make me think here" card because we can all see through it.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 03:38:28 2015 No.6438019 >>6437792 He's right that the self does not actually exist. Consciousness is also most definitely a tragic misstep.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 03:39:28 2015 No.6438023 >>6437881 >99% of what he says you're meant to just roll your eyes at. if you're a pleb, sure

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 03:40:39 2015 No.6438027 >>6438019 Then why hasn't the trait died out?

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 03:42:12 2015 No.6438031 >>6438027 It's not manipulative. Nature doesn't care if we suffer, just that we reproduce. It's a blind armory.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 03:42:25 2015 No.6438032 >>6438019 Nothing "exists". Fucking kill yourself, you sound like a 13 year old who finally decided to wonder what self-awareness was.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 03:42:55 2015 No.6438034 >>6438031 So then it's NOT a misstep because in contributes to survival.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 03:43:13 2015 No.6438035 >>6438031 maladaptive*

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 03:44:49 2015 No.6438038

>>6438034
If survival is your goal, sure. It's a double-edged sword, though, as the exceptionally self-aware kill themselves or don't reproduce.

>>6438032
>nothing 'exists'

Fuck off, stoner, your /b/-tier ramblings aren't welcome here. Read Heidegger.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 03:45:04 2015 No.6438039 >>6437871 to be honest, /tv/ has an amazing range. Its highs are the highest of the medium, and its lows the lowest. See its taste in art-house films. Absolutely excellent, hand to god.

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 03:46:58 2015 No.6438046

>>6437871
>the entire fucking show is about subverting Rust's views

How they fuck did you come to this conclusion? Almost everything that happens in the show supports what Rust is saying, you goddamn spastic. That's why everyone intelligent found the finale and Rust's transformation so jarring.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 03:48:49 2015 No.6438047 >>6438038 >as the exceptionally self-aware kill themselves or don't reproduce. >I'm so smart and that's why I'm so unhappy guys

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 03:52:09 2015 No.6438052 >>6438047 He's right, you have to be unintelligent to be happy.

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 03:56:08 2015 No.6438057

>>6438039
reddit just propelled them to move from the standard undergrad stuff to the standard grad stuff. same as /lit/, /fa/ and /mu/ as far as i know.

in the past couple of years, reddit (and SJW and so on) seems to be the main driving force in shaping 4chan's tastes by way of aversion.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 03:58:30 2015 No.6438059 >>6438052 You also have to be unintelligent to feel the opposite of happy.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 04:02:58 2015 No.6438066 >>6438059 Keep telling yourself that. We both know you're stupid, just leave it.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 04:04:01 2015 No.6438067 >>6438052 [citation needed]

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 04:06:44 2015 No.6438074 >>6438052 And you have to be 18 or older to post on this site. Holy fuck, this is cringe-inducing.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 04:08:30 2015 No.6438078 >>6438074 >waaaaaah the mean man is insinuating that I'm a fucking moron let's call him underage that'll show him I'd tell you to kill yourself but that's actually the smart choice so live as long as you can.

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 04:12:55 2015 No.6438082

>>6438078
>waaaahh I'm too stupid to find happiness in my life, I'm still stuck in my edgy teen phase but don't know how to get out so I'll lash out at people who call me out online to feel better about myself(I'm still a suicidal failure who gets no respect in the real world because I haven't proven myself to be intelligent, and everyone considers me dumb)

I'm telling you to kill yourself, your life is as bad of a joke as it gets.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 04:17:42 2015 No.6438084 >>6438082 >To be stupid, selfish, and have good health are three requirements for happiness, though if stupidity is lacking, all is lost. -Flaubert

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 04:19:09 2015 No.6438086

>>6437792
There is no such thing as 'consciousness'.

My cell phone is 'conscious' -- it complains when it's hungry and likes to self-reflect on its energy consumption and thought processes.

What idiots call 'consciousness' is actually 'free will'; 'consciousness' without free will is unimportant and unremarkable.

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 04:20:06 2015 No.6438088

>>6438084
Do you use quotes like that to comfort yourself from the realization that you are depressed because you are stupid as fuck, and a human failure who doesn't get respect from anyone in the real world?

There's a reason no one in your life takes you seriously anon(it's because you're actually fucking dumb).

Projection is a real thing.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 04:21:07 2015 No.6438090 >>6438086 I don't think you know what consciousness is. Go back to /sci/, retard.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 04:21:21 2015 No.6438091 >>6438086 Define "free will".

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 04:27:17 2015 No.6438102 Natural law is a spook

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 04:29:00 2015 No.6438105 >>6438090 >I don't think you know what consciousness is. Since you do, please explain and give a proper definition. Thanks. >>6438091 >Define "free will". 'Free will' is a theological concept.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 04:32:24 2015 No.6438109 >>6438038 >If survival is your goal, sure That's the goal of nature, so why shouldn't it be my goal?

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 04:37:07 2015 No.6438123 >>6438088 It wasn't me who was talking to you. It was Flaubert. I didn't say whether I agreed with him or not.

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 04:44:18 2015 No.6438143

>>6438123
Oh God, this is pathetic, I actually laughed. You should really start being more honest with yourself instead of trying to use respected philosophers as a crutch to find solace in your pathetic and miserable existence.

Face it anon, you're dumb as fuck. If you don't have access to a gun I recommend jumping off a bridge. You'll be doing yourself as well as the rest of us a favor. You're never going to stop being a joke of an existence.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 04:45:07 2015 No.6438144 >>6438105 >'Free will' is a theological concept. How is that a definition?

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 04:45:56 2015 No.6438146 >>6438144 He's either underage or a STEM major. This stuff goes over his head.

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 04:53:33 2015 No.6438153

G-g-guys, I'm a sad loser and a human failure who has never shown any semblance of intellectual prowess, but a few philosophers who are considered smart said that only stupid people are happy. That means I'm smart because I'm not happy! I feel less worthless now, because since a person who is respected said this, I will equate it with everyone who is unhappy is actually a fucking misunderstood genius! Even though I'm a complete failure and have never achieved anything of value or intellectual merit and my family and society thinks I'm a joke and stupid, I know I'm not, BECAUSE as long as you're depressed, that means you're smart! Whenever I see someone happy, it makes me sooo fucking bitter, but I just tell myself that they are stupid for ever feeling the emotion of happiness! R-right, guys? I'm s-smart, right? I'm not worthless, r-right?

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 04:56:30 2015 No.6438157 >>6438153 Why are you so emotionally invested in fighting straw men of people who disagree with you on the internet? Examine your life, examine your choices.

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 05:00:04 2015 No.6438165

>>6438157
Because I'm a fucking GENIUS, you STUPID FUCKING RETARD! I'm a miserable depressed loser who never accomplished anything he aspired to, but it wasn't because I was stupid, because there's no way I could be stupid! Depressed losers are geniuses! I'm depressed because I'm SMART! I don't actually need to do something to prove my intelligence to myself, I just have to cry myself to sleep!

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 05:03:42 2015 No.6438168 >>6438165 Do you find making an ass out of yourself (even though we're anonymous) as a constructive or even entertaining pastime?

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 05:05:42 2015 No.6438172

>>6438168
Fuck you, you're STUPIDER than me. There's no way I could make an ass out of myself, I'm a human failure. I'm crying right now, oh fuck, I'm such a loser, I'm a fucking failure, please kill me already(the fact that I feel like this means I'm smarter than you). SHOOT ME NOW FUCK

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 05:06:19 2015 No.6438175 >>6437792 Probably, but so what? He had reasons to be depressed with his daughter dying, drug abuse, PTSD and insomnia etc. Most people don't and can just go on with their lives.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 05:06:28 2015 No.6438177 >>6438153 nail, head, XD, fedora, pseudo etc

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 05:14:21 2015 No.6438188 >>6437901 Seriously that was the cringeist part of his euphoric fedora musing

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 05:18:34 2015 No.6438195

>>6438175
Being happy in a society that is built on stupidity, perpetuating stupidity and catering to stupidity is a strong implication of mental deficiencies. Only the mentally deficient would deny such obvious observations.

>>6438165
>>6438172
Prime example of mental deficiencies, the best part is the specimen are always completely oblivious to their deficiencies and readily demonstrate them at every opportunity.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 05:18:39 2015 No.6438196 File: 26 KB, 338x338, 1323126323563.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>6438192 >a society that is built on stupidity Please lend me your fedora, good sir.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 05:20:04 2015 No.6438197 >>6438192 >>6438195 Oh my God, irony at its finest. The typical teenage edgemeister embarrasses himself, as usual.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 05:20:27 2015 No.6438198 >>6438196 I'll lend you a book, start with the Greeks.

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 05:26:13 2015 No.6438208

>>6438195
>Being happy in a society that is built on stupidity, perpetuating stupidity and catering to stupidity is a strong implication of mental deficiencies. Only the mentally deficient would deny such obvious observations.

Intelligence means nothing if you're not going to do anything with it. If happiness isn't given to you when you examine the world - and you still desire it - you will have to put in some effort to find or create it yourself. That will probably have more to do with rigorous self discipline than anything else, and that is what truly defines adult humans and separates us from children and animals.

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 05:29:31 2015 No.6438214

>>6438192
>Being happy in a society that is built on stupidity, perpetuating stupidity and catering to society
>>6438195
>Being happy in a society that is built on stupidity, perpetuating stupidity and catering to stupidity

I think I'm going to screencap this for the perfect irony, holy shit.

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 05:31:05 2015 No.6438218

>>6438197
Do you find typing errors embarrassing? What low self esteem and how misdirected, I corrected it to prevent your inevitable confusion. Alas you have still managed to continue your perpetual state of confusion. What a scary place the world must be. Warm recommendation: direct your thinly veiled insecurity towards your meme spouting, poor linguistic abilities and juvenile demeanor. Alternatively direct yourself towards the little b at the bottom and top of this page and continue your complacent modern peasantry in fitting company. Be honest, have you read a book in your life? What appeal does a literature board have? You're only upsetting yourself.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 05:34:11 2015 No.6438223 >>6438208 If intelligence means nothing, pray tell, what exactly does happiness mean?

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 05:40:46 2015 No.6438231

>>6438208
>implying anyone with half a brain desires happiness
>discrediting the pursuit of truth for its own sake
>discipline is what separates humans from animals
>implying humans have more discipline than ants
>has hedonistic ideals
>propagates effort and "rigorous self" discipline
>my philosophy is based on a self help book

How did you cram so much incoherent nonsense into two lines you absolute fool

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 05:42:55 2015 No.6438234

>>6438218
I'm glad you proofread this post before embarrassing yourself yet again.

Accepting your own stupidity is really the most healthy thing you can do. Projecting and desperately trying to sound eloquent but failing miserably is actually even more ironic.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 05:52:10 2015 No.6438245 isn't this how the self conscious artificial intelligence be? just like we are to nature, they'll be to us.

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 05:52:23 2015 No.6438246

>>6438231
I didn't imply anyone desires happiness, I said if you do. If you'd rather pursue truth for it's own sake, then go ahead.

Yes, I would imply that humans have more self discipline than ants, in fact, I can just right out say it.

Don't see where you find the hedonism in my post. "Happiness" is not to be equated with simple physical pleasures if that's what you were thinking.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 05:54:31 2015 No.6438252 >>6438223 Nothing, but it feels good.

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 05:55:10 2015 No.6438253

>>6438234
Yes, proofreading and editing messages on a Danish kettle cooking forum is highly correlated with intelligence. I can just imagine the contemplative face of a true intellectual as they muse over every sentence to defend their anonymous reputation. I see, because you struggle with stringing sentences together it must be an immense struggle for everyone. Good train of thought. Do you have any more straws to grasp for? Perhaps an original thought? An idea that isn't composed purely of logical fallacies (mostly ad hominems, the other ones require some basic understanding of concepts)? No, I'm asking too much. God bless.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 05:57:21 2015 No.6438256 Biochem major - evolution can't misstep.

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 05:59:23 2015 No.6438261

and what's with all the projecting guys? if you are so well read and educated you should know there's no value judgements in metaphysical concepts such as these, so there's no negative value connotated with sadness or positive value related to happiness. it's purely a psychological qualia

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 06:00:58 2015 No.6438264

>>6438143
Goddamn, you're like Hannibal Lecter with your analysis! Wow. The ''I actually laughed'' and ''jump off a bridge'' stuff is particularly inspired and not cliche and ready-made at all!

>use respected philosophers

I only quoted Flaubert, and that was the first post I made ITT.

>>6438153
>>6438165
>>6438172
2/10 try harder.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 06:01:41 2015 No.6438265 >>6438109 Because nature is blind and stupid. Are you familiar with the term 'appeal to nature'?

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 06:04:30 2015 No.6438269 >>6438082 you don't seem very happy. you seem really butthurt, actually. it's obvious how tenuous a grasp you have on your mental welfare because of how insanely defensive you became the second it was challenged

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 06:07:14 2015 No.6438271 File: 68 KB, 294x450, 9780143107767.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] Are you ready for the official meme book of the hit HBO show True Detective™?

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 06:14:55 2015 No.6438283 >>6438271 Hyped, I cannot lie.

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 06:19:22 2015 No.6438290

>>6438143
>Schopenhauer, Nietzsche, Flaubert
>all dumb fucks
>should've jumped off a bridge
>I know better

Why are you so defensive? Do you feel this offends you personality? Take a moment to examine why you feel this way, perhaps you're correct. The vast majority of the human population is incredibly incredibly stupid compared to the highest percentile of intelligence, do you understand this or does it offend you too? Said highest percentile also happens to be largely unhappy, possibly because understanding the patterns of human relationships, society, nature and all that leaves one to rather depressing conclusions. Now it's only a correlation but if we have to choose between a) happy people are stupid and b) sad people are stupid, it's clearly the former as there's absolutely no correlation of happiness to intelligence.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 06:45:24 2015 No.6438312 Lmao, that one dumb female in the thread.

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 06:53:32 2015 No.6438330 [SPOILER]

File: 211 KB, 724x190, 1429700012876.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>We are things that labor under the illusion of having a self, a secretion of sensory, experience, and feeling, programmed with total assurance that we are each somebody, when in fact everybody is nobody.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 06:54:32 2015 No.6438332 >>6438057 >reddit Shut the fuck up retard.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 06:58:37 2015 No.6438341 >misstep in evolution >Implying evolution can be wrong >Implying a teleological endpoint for evolution >Implying this isn't just edgy bullshit

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 07:18:55 2015 No.6438367 >>6438341 fuck off you buzzword spouting monosyllabic faggot, go back to /b/. you don't even read

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 07:24:48 2015 No.6438382 File: 76 KB, 1000x667, 14187814.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>6438367

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 08:01:23 2015 No.6438444 >>6438382 what a fag

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 08:21:28 2015 No.6438476 File: 156 KB, 528x528, 1409406377196.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>6437809 >m'lady

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 11:56:46 2015 No.6439129 >>6437976 >>6437968 >go back to reddit!!!!1!1uno!2 >I sure showed him! ;3

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 11:59:47 2015 No.6439140 >>6438444 bailey jay is a beautiful fag

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 12:03:13 2015 No.6439147

>have cats
>observe they are just as conscious as humans
>actually seem smarter and more aware than most humans
>are sensitive to the slightest breeze or sound
>have delightful little personas and full of love and feels

who else despises philosophers and scientists who live with their heads up their asses thinking humans have some magical consciousness that other animals don't have? it's fucking retarded. there's no difference between my consciousness and an animal's, there's only a difference in thought process, which is largely a product of language.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 12:06:36 2015 No.6439159 File: 44 KB, 500x430, image.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>6439147

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 12:21:27 2015 No.6439219 >>6438046 I have an IQ of 170 and i didn't find the ending jarring ergo, you're wrong

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 14:34:30 2015 No.6439755

>>6438290
>>Schopenhauer, Nietzsche, Flaubert
>>all dumb fucks
>>should've jumped off a bridge
Nice straw man. This is what I meant when I said no one respects you or takes your seriously because you are legitimately stupid.
>>6438264
I'm not trying to subvert a cliche, I'm legitimately giving you advice. Once you get out of high school you might understand how discussions of substance work. Jumping off a bridge is a more surefire way to be successful in your suicide. Taking pills or setting up a helium tank are easy to fuck up, especially by someone of your intellectual capability. I know you hate yourself because you have never accomplished anything of merit and never will, and I know you long for the respect and qualifications of an intellectual, something you and I know you will never attain, and you and I both know why.

Not everyone is smart. I'm just trying to help you end your misery and shame of dealing with that realization, anon.

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 14:43:09 2015 No.6439784

>>6437792
Yep.

Here's Emil Cioran to back him up:
>Only those are happy who never think or, rather, who only think about life’s bare necessities, and to think about such things means not to think at all. True thinking resembles a demon who muddies the spring of life or a sickness which corrupts its roots. To think all the time, to raise questions, to doubt your own destiny, to feel the weariness of living, to be worn out to the point of exhaustion by thoughts and life, to leave behind you, as symbols of your life’s drama, a trail of smoke and blood - all this means you are so unhappy that reflection and thinking appear as a curse causing a violent revulsion in you.

>Wisdom disguises our wounds; it teaches us to bleed in secret.

Both of these quotes are from On The Heights Of Despair.

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 14:54:11 2015 No.6439825

True Detective is a really bad show. It fails as a mystery: the conclusion to the whodunit is based on some random bullshit evidence about green paint that doesn't make sense in the way mysteries should, that is, by letting you play along with the detectives solving it. It fails as a drama: the only interesting dynamic (because the mystery isn't) is between the two leads, but once they've bounced their ideas off each other once it has nowhere to go until a terrible, cheesy, tacked-on ending. It fails as a philosophical inquiry: the only interesting ideas (interesting from a character standpoint, certainly not interesting philosophical ideas) are stolen wholesale from some shitty philosopher.

Also the dialogue bloooowws.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 15:05:48 2015 No.6439855 >>6439825 I think the overall tone and atmosphere of the show is top notch and by far the best aspect of it. Also the acting is good and the directions is on point.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 15:08:10 2015 No.6439865 >>6437792 >>nature created an aspect of nature separate from itself. >is he right no.

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 15:17:28 2015 No.6439894

why exactly is it edgy or immature to believe this? People who say that "babby's first existential crisis" shit come across like they're just trying to feed some pathetic smug sense of self-superiority.

Evolution has produced hundreds of thousands of species that have failed for one reason or another. For humans, consciousness will lead to our self-destruction.

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 15:25:21 2015 No.6439915

>>6439894
>"babby's first existential crisis"
Being a nihilist requires a tremendous mental discipline. Most people will realise pointlesnes of life around 20 and forget about it 5 seconds later while they go for another beer. They will ocupy themself with love, children, job and other spooks. Only a few will trully embrace nihilism.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 15:36:16 2015 No.6439946 >>6439755 you got BTFO, just give up already, it is getting pathetic

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 15:41:09 2015 No.6439966

>>6439915
not the guy, but why do you think that closing your eyes from pointlessness of life is a good thing (if you actually do think that)? Isn't ignorance a bad thing in general?
disclaimer: I'm not a nihilist, I think that nihilism is something you can and should overcome, but you should never close your eyes from truth whatever that may be

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 15:42:35 2015 No.6439972 >>6439915 You don't embrace nihilism. You get stuck in it. Happened to me, and boy, did I went to grab another beer thanks to it. These days I have it mostly in control, though.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 15:51:45 2015 No.6440004 >>6439129 what the hell is up with plebs today, are we getting raided?

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 15:52:35 2015 No.6440007

>>6438034
I think what he was saying is that it doesn't effect survival either way. With or without full consciousness we reproduce, all that consciousness does is contribute to existential suffering. Which nature could care less about as long as we're still playing with our fun parts.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 15:53:47 2015 No.6440011 >>6437881 I'd have a beer (or a line) with Rust any day of the week before I hung out with Marty and his fucking good ol' boy friends. The takeaway from the end is that it's okay to be fedora like Rust, just don't be a dick about it. Be Good Guy Greg.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 15:55:22 2015 No.6440017 this thread gets a edgy/10

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 15:55:50 2015 No.6440020 >>6439946 If you want a self-loathing circlejerk, go to /r9k/. Then you can "BTFO" all those pesty normies. Here you're going to actually present a valid argument.

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 15:59:48 2015 No.6440037

>>6439966
>(if you actually do think that)?
No, I don't. I think it gives strenght.
>t you should never close your eyes from truth whatever that may be
Fully agreed

>>6439972
You get stuck in it if you can't handle it. For me the fact that life is pointless means only that I can have as much fun with it as I want. I don't have to achieve anything great to be remembered, leave world a better place or any such bullshit, I can freely follow my whims and not give a fuck about spooks.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 16:05:16 2015 No.6440060 >>6439147 If you mean your cat is just as smart as you - it's a bullshit. If you mean cat's consciousness is simillar to a heavily retarded human with simillar IQ - you are most likely right and most scientists will agree with you.

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 16:07:07 2015 No.6440072

>>6438253
You're really defensive about this.

The irony of you typing out a post about stupidity then losing your own train of thought and literally mixing up the word stupidity with another word that was or mind because you were trying to hard to sound eloquent that you completely lost your train of thought really says everything that needs to be said about you Your desperation and subsequent failure to prove your intelligence to us and to yourself is good entertainment for the rest of us though.

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 16:10:56 2015 No.6440091

Alright, I don't believe life has any inherent meaning, and that "happy" these days is used more as a word for "productive enough" than "in a state of bliss", but if all the edgemeister nihilists see the world as such a corrupt and stupid pit of shit, why don't they use their superior intellects to take control of the situation and use it for their own pleasure?

Are you people so awfully sensitive and annoyed at anything that the fact that the world is shit means you can't take any agency on anything in your lifes?

I mean, I hardly want to become famous or powerful or any of these spoopy terms, I just want to have time to engage in my hobbies (check), do some drugs (check), have friends whom I can talk to about shared interests (check) and maybe a nice girlfriend to do acts against god in bed and somewhere else (check, thank god), and as far as I got things figured out, I can just keep what I'm doing and do that while having a job that I don't find repulsive (I'm on my way to become a aesthethics professor).

Why aren't you doing shit with your lifes?

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 16:11:55 2015 No.6440095
File: 2.71 MB, 5616x2200, 9y4Zly1.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>6440020
i'll direct you to the post you ignored free of charge

>Why are you so defensive? Do you feel this offends you personality? Take a moment to examine why you feel this way, perhaps you're correct. The vast majority of the human population is incredibly incredibly stupid compared to the highest percentile of intelligence, do you understand this or does it offend you too? Said highest percentile also happens to be largely unhappy, possibly because understanding the patterns of human relationships, society, nature and all that leaves one to rather depressing conclusions. Now it's only a correlation but if we have to choose between a) happy people are stupid and b) sad people are stupid, it's clearly the former as there's absolutely no correlation of happiness to intelligence.

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 16:18:41 2015 No.6440127

>>6440095
There's even greater irony in projection. And of course, there are virtually no scientific sources that correlate depression/suicide with intelligence, trying to make a connection is as desperate as people who try to make connections with vaccines and infant mortality and other hippie bullshit.

Face it, you're depressed because you yourself are not capable of accomplishing anything that requires intelligence, and you're not capable of this because you are stupid. Desperately grasping at straws to make connections with your pathetic and miserable joke of human consciousness and intelligence only makes you look even more worthless.

Like I told you before, suicide by means of jumping off a bridge is a surefire way to end this suffering for you.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 16:22:42 2015 No.6440149 >>6440060 Consciousness has fuckall to do with IQ, they're completely orthogonal concepts, you fucking mongoloid.

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 16:24:55 2015 No.6440158

>>6438144
>How is that a definition?
It's not a definition, it's a friendly reminder that defining theological concepts is pointless unless we share the same basic set of theological assumptions and vocabulary.

I'm still waiting for you to explain to me why I am 'conscious' but my phone is somehow not.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 16:26:30 2015 No.6440163 >>6440127 This projection.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 16:28:14 2015 No.6440168 >>6440163 see>>6440020 This irony.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 16:30:07 2015 No.6440178 People who adopt their intelligence as their defining characteristic tend to neglect their other needs and wants, under the pretense that because they're smart they're somehow above baser things.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 16:30:58 2015 No.6440182 >>6439784 The Heights of Despair also contains the lines "Why should I live in history?" and "The world where nothing is solved", both of which are quoted verbatim in True Detective.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 16:32:06 2015 No.6440186 >>6438057 >in the past couple of years, reddit (and SJW and so on) seems to be the main driving force in shaping 4chan's tastes by way of aversion. This, we're complete reactionaries.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 16:59:43 2015 No.6440331 >>6440186 I'd say we're the opposite.

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 17:36:30 2015 No.6440526

>>6437792
>nature created an aspect of nature separate from itself

Impossible

>We are creatures that should not exist by natural law

Drivel

>We are things that labor under the illusion of having a self, a secretion of sensory, experience, and feeling, programmed with total assurance that we are each somebody, when in fact everybody is nobody.

Everybody is as much nobody as they are everybody

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 17:43:47 2015 No.6440561

>>6440007
>I think what he was saying is that it doesn't effect survival either way.
That's clearly wrong because language, memory, and predictive thinking are all extremely useful to survival.

>>6440158
If you use a term, the burden falls on you to define the intent of it in that instance of use.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 18:26:52 2015 No.6440729 >>6440561 Tell me how. And name me a few species that died out because they didn't have those things.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 18:31:32 2015 No.6440740 >>6440729 >Tell me how. There are 7 billion humans because of them. >And name me a few species that died out because they didn't have those things. Every species that was driven extinct by humans.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 18:52:25 2015 No.6440810 >>6438269 I'm very depressed, because I'm a genius. Only the foolish masses have grasps on their mental welfare! Poor fools, they will never be on my level. sigh

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 18:55:48 2015 No.6440824 >>6440740 What am arbitrary argument. So you're saying that the only reason humans are here is because of higher consciousness, even with millions of years of history to refute that claim?

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 18:57:22 2015 No.6440838 >>6440824 >even with millions of years of history to refute that claim? What do you mean? Do you think all this scientific advancement could have happened without it?

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 19:10:35 2015 No.6440894 >>6440838 Scientific advancement isn't the reason humans are here, that has nothing to do with anything. Scientific advancement is in no way vital to our continued survival as a species.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 19:17:05 2015 No.6440918 >>6440894 >Scientific advancement is in no way vital to our continued survival as a species. what the actual fuck

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 19:21:57 2015 No.6440939 >>6440918 Are you alright? Finding basic concepts hard to grasp?

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 19:27:01 2015 No.6440962 >>6440939 wow your smug non-argument really convinced me http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sun#After_core_hydrogen_exhaustion survive that without any scientific advancement

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 19:29:24 2015 No.6440975 >>6440962 Wow, your uninformed internet speak convinced me too. Why would you talk on a macro scale about a micro problem?

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 19:37:00 2015 No.6441005 File: 166 KB, 650x491, impact.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>6440894 >Scientific advancement is in no way vital to our continued survival as a species. Never go full retard.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 19:42:46 2015 No.6441028 >>6441005 >thinking our fates don't run parallel to the fate of the Earth. Too late for you, it seems.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 19:52:48 2015 No.6441089 This is the book board, go slap your intellect titties together somewhere else.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 20:04:49 2015 No.6441154 File: 7 KB, 225x225, interested-frog.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>6441028 >Earth is the only planet we'll ever inhabit >Human dispersal within and beyond the Solar System is impossible Good grief

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 21:05:53 2015 No.6441382 >>6438052 It's not that you have to be unaware to be happy. It's that once the shit hits the fan in your life, you become terrible self-aware

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 21:08:26 2015 No.6441387 >>6439755 There are people who have a lot of merits and achievements and still feel like they need that something all is vanity

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 21:10:55 2015 No.6441400 >all people relating intelligence, self-awareness, consciousness to specific things >all this misunderstanding of ontology read Heidegger

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 21:20:11 2015 No.6441445 >>6441154 >there are people that believe we'll actually colonize other planets Topkek, keep dreaming tyke.

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 21:29:16 2015 No.6441483

>>6441154
>actually thinks that we'll achieve the level of global cooperation and development that makes colonizing even Mars a possibility, nevermind that we will have the resources and knowledge to go beyond
It is possible, but only under full communism, comrade.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 21:30:24 2015 No.6441487 >>6441483 >he thinks under communism people will care about colonizing other planets top kek

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 21:34:51 2015 No.6441501 >>6441487 Why wouldn't they? Science and human development cease in communism? >select all the burgers

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 21:40:47 2015 No.6441516 >>6441445 Enjoy your stay on Shit-hole Planet, aka: Old Earth, population: you and a bunch of niggers

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 21:59:19 2015 No.6441576 >>6441516 They wouldn't let neets into the ships.

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 21:59:21 2015 No.6441577

>>6440127
Humans have two known states: depression that inevitably leads to suicide and happiness. You heard it here first. Why do I even bother.

>no correlation

>DEPRESSIVE SYMPTOMS, ACADEMIC ACHIEVEMENT, AND INTELLIGENCE
Preiss M. , Franova L.

>The sample consisted of 635 school children (304 boys and 331 girls) aged 9-11 years. The variables were assessed using the Children's Depression Inventory (CDI), Wechsler Intelligence Scale for Children (WISC), and the grade point average. The data indicate that depressive symptoms are related to academic achievement, in boys also to intelligence. The relationship between depressive symptoms and school grades reached statistical significance in both sexes. In boys, the CDI total scores were associated with full-scale and verbal IQ. Academic achievement was significantly related to full-scale, verbal, and performance IQ in both boys and girls. No gender differences in depressive symptoms or academic achievement were found. Significant gender differences in favor of boys emerged in full-scale and performance IQ.

>In mining data on Finnish military conscripts, the Finnish researchers found an almost unbelievably high correlation between high-scorers and those who later received bipolar diagnoses — 12-fold.

>“The finding of an association between progressively increasing risk of bipolar disorder and high arithmetic intellectual performance is rather surprising,” Tiihonen wrote, explaining the arithmetic test requires not only mathematical skill but rapid information-processing for the purpose of successfully completing the timed exam. High scorers with such rapid processing power may also share a tendency to experience mania, a state of high focus and psychomotor activity.

>Other research supporting a link between intelligence and mental health problems shows bipolar disorder may be four times as common among young adults who’d earned straight-A’s in school. Though long suspected, evidence for this connection was found by researchers at King’s College London, in a collaboration with the Karolinska Institutet in Sweden by comparing Swedish national school records to diagnoses for the disorder.

>In fact, the correlation is so strong scientists say the inverse is true: People of lower intelligence are the least likely to drink or use drugs. Now, scientists have identified a biomolecular connection between curiosity as a trait and intelligence in general, as evidenced by a 2009 study in Neuron from researchers at the University of Toronto and the Samuel Lunenfeld Research Institute of Mount Sinai Hospital. Specifically, the neuronal calcium sensor-1 protein was associated in a mouse model with spatial memory and curiosity. Interestingly, that same protein has been linked in humans to bipolar disorder and schizophrenia.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 22:01:48 2015 No.6441583 >>6441576 Yeah, that's why you're staying, punk.

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 22:06:09 2015 No.6441599

>>6441577
>>6440127

>you're depressed because
I'm sorry, your Tarot cards are playing tricks on you. I'm not depressed at all. In fact I'm happily married and have a successful career, thank you for asking.

I maintain that only a pure idiot is capable of sustaining a perpetual state of happiness, of course they're not really as it's physically impossible but fortunately they're stupid enough to delude themselves into thinking they are. Pretending to be happy is a fundamental part of their identity as they lack all other skills, understandably they become very defensive when the importance or validity of their only skill is challenged.

Exempli gratia:
>suicide by means of jumping off a bridge is a surefire way to end this suffering for you.

Our poor fellow is in such a state of infinite bliss that they can't help but encourage numerous fellow human beings who politely disagree with them on an entirely impersonal matter on a Danish kettle cooking forum to take their own lives.

The joys of idiocy.

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 22:22:55 2015 No.6441643

>>6439755
>googles logical fallacies
>finds one that seems vaguely related but isn't really
>accompanies it with a good dole of ad hominems derived from their own insecurities
>ignores anything that requires logic
>refers to this as a discussion of substance that other parties do not understand
>continues to entice someone they believe to be a high school child to kill themselves asserting that they have no merit as a human being based on a quote they posted

I wish I was more like you, senpai.

Anonymous Wed Apr 22 22:38:20 2015 No.6441713

>>6440072
>that was or mind
>or mind

>>6440020
>calls people to present valid arguments
>speaks entirely in the form of ad hominems with 'irony' and 'projecting' carefully inserted into every post
>has no idea these words don't mean what he thinks they mean

Oh god, I can't stop laughing. This is a goldmine, he's going to be a character in my next book.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 22 23:39:03 2015 No.6441921 >>6440729 useful =/= necessary, idiot

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 00:04:42 2015 No.6441995 >>6441577 >>6441599 >>6441643 >>6441713 Can't recall the last time I saw this much flailing desperation and poorly veiled rage on /lit/. Hilarious obsession. Irony, projection everywhere.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 00:51:00 2015 No.6442201 You don't even need to be intelligent to see life for the piece of shit it is, you just need to surrender the various delusions ingrained in your perception by society

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 01:35:03 2015 No.6442326 >>6441995 >irony >projection my sides

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 01:36:29 2015 No.6442336 >>6442201 That act does require some semblance of intelligence though, mostly self-awareness.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 01:40:58 2015 No.6442355 >>6437792 Sounds like an angsty fedora master with disdain for his slightly better than average understanding of existence.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 01:46:27 2015 No.6442371 >>6442336 Self-awareness is not intelligence. My phone is self-aware but not very intelligent.

Anonymous Thu Apr 23 01:54:24 2015 No.6442395

>>6441995

>and poorly veiled rage on /lit/. Hilarious obsession.

Your thinly-veiled contempt is the exact same thing here. Don't be so quick to throw the "posturing" word around, chances are you're probably guilty of the same thing in that very same post.

Anonymous Thu Apr 23 01:58:45 2015 No.6442406

>>6441995
>presented with evidence
>calls it projecting
>still doesn't know what the word means
>gets ethered
>literally has nothing to say
>complains of poorly veiled rage and desperation

>Fuck you, you're STUPIDER than me. There's no way I could make an ass out of myself, I'm a human failure. I'm crying right now, oh fuck, I'm such a loser, I'm a fucking failure, please kill me already(the fact that I feel like this means I'm smarter than you). SHOOT ME NOW FUCK

>Because I'm a fucking GENIUS, you STUPID FUCKING RETARD! I'm a miserable depressed loser who never accomplished anything he aspired to, but it wasn't because I was stupid, because there's no way I could be stupid! Depressed losers are geniuses! I'm depressed because I'm SMART! I don't actually need to do something to prove my intelligence to myself, I just have to cry myself to sleep!

>I'm telling you to kill yourself, your life is as bad of a joke as it gets.

>Face it anon, you're dumb as fuck. If you don't have access to a gun I recommend jumping off a bridge.

>jumping off a bridge is a more surefire way to be successful in your suicide.

> I know you hate yourself because you have never accomplished anything of merit and never will

>projection
>irony

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 02:04:18 2015 No.6442419 >>6442355 >all these buzzwords to say nothing kill yourself

Anonymous Thu Apr 23 02:16:34 2015 No.6442454

>>6442371
... Your phone is not self-aware. The first thing you might want to note is that your phone does not have a self, therefore it can not be SELF-aware. Self-awareness is a neurobiological/psychological phenomena connected with meta-cognitive reasoning and mirror neurons. Your phone does not have a brain, a psyche, consciousness or mirror neurons, I assure you. It does what it is programmed to do, i.e. it follows a set of prompts entered by a human (beep when value of x is y) with no consciousness or awareness of it. It does not look in the mirror and think 'Oh lord, I look pale today I must be hungry' and then beep in a plea for you to charge it.

It is in fact seen as being connected to intelligence, e.g. animals are tested for self-awareness when determining their intelligence, in humans it's highly connected with emotional/social intelligence. Although I didn't even state that it was intelligence.

I appreciate your Jaden Smith style musing and fond feelings for your phone (to the point of anthropomorphism) but you might want to understand what the terms you're using mean first.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 02:40:04 2015 No.6442520 >>6442371 >muh phones oh god they're reaching /lit/! bail! bail!

Anonymous Thu Apr 23 02:47:06 2015 No.6442533

>>6441995
>The study was expanded in 2012 to include more than 1 million participants, and researchers reported a link between artists, authors and scientists and the propensity to develop mental illness. Not only bipolar disorder, but a whole suite of mental illnesses, from drug abuse to anorexia nervosa and depression. A single gene, known as DARPP-32, is suspected to cause the link between intelligence and mental illness. A study found that people with schizophrenia were more likely to have the version of DARPP-32 that boosted performance on tasks involving thinking and filtering of information [source: National Institute of Mental Health].

Anonymous Thu Apr 23 04:14:31 2015 No.6442732

>>6442454
>meta-cognitive reasoning
My phone has that.
>and mirror neurons.
What? Are you seriously implying that if we somehow built a supercomputer and managed to upload a human consciousness onto it, then it wouldn't be 'self-aware', simply because the underlying hardware isn't organic? Despite the fact that it would act and think exactly like the original human being?
>It does what it is programmed to do
If you believe in materialism, then so does a human being. (And you _do_ believe in materialism if you don't believe in the supernatural.)
>it follows a set of prompts entered by a human
It does not. For example, it's aware that its charge is running low, and can react based on that. (Limit consumption, disable certain apps, complain to the user, etc.) No human prompting is involved here.
>It does not look in the mirror and think 'Oh lord, I look pale today I must be hungry' and then beep in a plea for you to charge it.
Really? What makes you say that? It certainly acts as if it's doing exactly that.
>you might want to understand what the terms you're using mean first.
OK, enlighten me then. So far you're failing hard to produce any workable definitions at all.

Anonymous Thu Apr 23 04:56:05 2015 No.6442787

>>6442732
For the love of god, start with the Greeks or go back to /sci/.

>My phone has that
Your phone thinks about thinking? What an amazing specimen you have in your hands. (You fucking retard)

Where exactly did I imply that? Do you struggle with reading comprehension? Do you believe your phone to be a supercomputer with the human consciousness uploaded onto it? I wouldn't be surprised at this point. Alternatively that could be said, yes. Considering the mechanism of self-awareness is similar to empathy applied to oneself and one's former states. It is highly debatable whether a machine could ever produce an empathetic process as it's based on emotion, it would be able to emulate the apparent response of emotion or empathy as far as the situation or the variables it consisted of were known but for the sake of example: is a program that calculates a result, then prints it the same as a program that copies the result from the former program and prints it without making the calculation or even having the ability to do so? Hardly.

>it does not
You.. The prompts are not entered in real fucking time, it does only what code tells it to do. It's not *aware* that its charge is running low, it prints x, plays x sound, switches to x preset o settings when x value is y, as it has been coded to do.

>what makes you say that
A basic understanding of electronics.

>enlighten me
I already explained what they mean, if you need further help google "biology for sub 60 IQ". I'm not qualified to train the handicapped.

In any case, I'm very proud of you for understanding the rather basic free will debate. Naturally any fool knows that humans are ultimately automatons and freedom is a construct with no base in the material world. I understand that this simple titbit made a thorough impression on you and you're eager to apply it to anything you can find to let the world know but don't fret, the world knows. Equating nature's genius for programming to that of a Chinese factory worker's only makes you sound like you fell on your head as a child.

Excuse my language, I can handle stupidity but smug ignorance is too much for my poor head.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 05:08:59 2015 No.6442801 File: 52 KB, 579x570, Klas känner känsor.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>6437901 MUN ETERNAL NATURAL LAW!

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 05:13:46 2015 No.6442809 Evolution is a fairytale, and not even a good one.

Anonymous Thu Apr 23 05:17:50 2015 No.6442818

>>6437881

How do people think this is a justification of the character? I agree that the show does not endorse Rust's views but the fact that you have to spend so much of the runtime listening to them is just unforgivable. I had to quit after 4 episodes because the dialog was just so overwritten I couldn't stop cringing.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 05:23:43 2015 No.6442825 >>6442809 Fairytales are pedagogical devices, and not even good ones.

Anonymous Thu Apr 23 05:30:53 2015 No.6442842

>>6442454
> Self-awareness is a neurobiological/psychological phenomena connected with meta-cognitive reasoning and mirror neurons.

If self-awareness is neurobiological then I ought to be able to hold it in my hands, like I can with any other neurobiological matter.

When a man has a thought, and certain neurons in the brain fire, how do you know that it is the neurons firing that causes the mind, and not the mind that is causing the neurons to fire? i.e. how do you know that the neuron firings are the cause and that the mind is the effect, and not the mind being the cause and the neuron firings being the effect?

Psychologically, we experience the latter, i.e. we experience our mind moving our body, rather than our body moving our mind. If the mind is just a secretion, an effervescence that neurons radiate, then how can this awareness of a unified, simple "self" arise? That's the problem that your metaphysics has to answer. My metaphysics solves this easily, by saying that the mind/self is a simple substance which uses the brain as its interface for certain operations (processing sensual data, imagination/fancy, etc.) You materialists assert that it is our bodies that make use of our minds; but we experience the opposite, viz. we experience our minds making use of our bodies.
Another problem is the argument from motion. There must be a body/substance capable of moving itself, otherwise there would be an infinite regress and no motion would be possible. This is not just true for the moment of the Universe's beginning, but for every moment throughout time - there must be a continuing substance which continues the Universe's motion, the main cog in the clockwork of the Universe. Now, we experience this self-caused motion, this self-moving body - our minds. The psychological phenomenon known as intention is experienced as a self-caused motion. Therefore, unless our psychological data is essentially deceptive (in which case psychology itself would be impossible), we must have in us this simple substance/body capable of moving itself. Now, we know this isn't the neurons or on any other gross matter, because we know that such matter is incapable of moving itself. Therefore there is a body/substance in us which is capable of making an intentional act, i.e. capable of moving itself. This substance is not moved/affected by the neurons in the brain or any other part of the body.

>>6442787
>For the love of god, start with the Greeks or go back to /sci/.

Wow, you are the one that needs to start with the Greeks. Read Plato.

Anonymous Thu Apr 23 05:39:03 2015 No.6442858

>>6442842
note: I'm not saying that all motions in the body or the brain are caused by the mind. Obviously, when something bumps into you and your body moves, that is not your mind causing that movement in your body. And when you take a certain drug and that alters the chemistry in your brain in some way, that is not an effect of your mind either. But this act of intention, and this act of self-awareness, and this act of consciousness in general, is not a secretion of the brain, but an act of a more subtle (less material, or even immaterial) body.
Biology alone cannot account for consciousness, because biological substances and mental substances are two different substances. Physical science in general cannot account for consciousness, because the substance of consciousness is not physical.

Anonymous Thu Apr 23 05:44:31 2015 No.6442875

>>6442787
>Your phone thinks about thinking?
Yes, that's exactly what it's doing when it throttles its CPU frequencies and shuts down services to lower power consumption. It also does diagnostics.
>it does only what code tells it to do
So does a human being.
>It's not *aware* that its charge is running low
Are you using some insane non-standard definition of the word 'aware' here? It certainly is 'aware', it analyzes its internal processes, senses and reacts, just like a human being.
>Equating nature's genius for programming to that of a Chinese factory worker's only makes you sound like you fell on your head as a child.
The fact that a phone is vastly simpler doesn't mean it's not 'self-aware' in exactly the same way as a human being.

Anonymous Thu Apr 23 05:46:39 2015 No.6442880

>>6442875
OK, so is a bear-trap self-aware, because it "senses" the bear foot in its pad and then "reacts" by closing the trap?

Is a door self-aware, because it "senses" my knuckles and then "reacts" with a knocking sound?

Is anything that moves / is moved self-aware according to you?

Anonymous Thu Apr 23 05:53:27 2015 No.6442894

>>6442880
>OK, so is a bear-trap self-aware, because it "senses" the bear foot in its pad and then "reacts" by closing the trap?
No. But if a bear trap sensed it was closing too fast or too slow and adjusted its sensing speed accordingly, then it would be 'self-aware'.

'Self-awareness' is, in other words, a feedback loop and a self-regulating process.

Anonymous Thu Apr 23 05:57:07 2015 No.6442901

>>6442875
>>6442787
Awareness comes from the substance known in Greek as the nous, νοῦς. Phones are not aware because they have no νοῦς.

If awareness is something that arises out of the interactions between material bodies then there are two possibilities:

- any time a material body interacts with another material body, awareness results (so when a snooker ball hits another snooker ball, the snooker balls are aware of one and other. This is a kind of animism, the idea that everything in the Universe has a soul/mind.)
- a certain configuration of material bodies, a certain structure, causes awareness. This is what the people who believe the mind is an effect of the brain think.

Anonymous Thu Apr 23 06:10:33 2015 No.6442918

>>6442894
But you must be intuitively aware that what we talk about when we refer to "awareness" is something entirely different than a simple causal loop.

The fundamental awareness is awareness of being, of existence. This is the first act of our minds. It is the essence of intelligence. Without this first act all other acts of awareness are impossible. It is impossible to be self-aware without first having the awareness of being, because the self is just a modification of being. It is impossible to be aware of any particular attributes of a being without first being aware of its being. The first thing that we notice about something is its being, and then we notice various facts about its being.

When I carry a chair from one desk to another, that is not an intelligent act, but a mechanical act. It's the fact that I am aware of the chair's existence, and that I myself exist and am moving the chair - that is the act of the intelligence.

Now, to say that something is intelligent or aware, is to say that it has the awareness of being/existence. A small box that is aware of nothing except being (aware that there is something, even without knowing anything about that something), is aware, is intelligent. However, a great machine the size of a city that could solve great problems purely by mechanical means is no more intelligent than a shovel, because like a shovel it is only a mechanism, a tool, the only difference between it and a shovel being the complexity of its design.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 06:11:43 2015 No.6442920 >>6442901 >Awareness comes from the substance known in Greek as the nous Orly? What is the chemical composition of this substance? Would would happen if I snorted 5 milligrams of nous?

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 06:13:50 2015 No.6442922 >>6442920 It's not a chemical, or, if it is, it's very subtle, i.e. more subtle than electrons and protons. Would a substance that subtle still count as a chemical?

Anonymous Thu Apr 23 06:35:29 2015 No.6442958

>>6442875
Are you genuinely mentally challenged or pretending to be in anti-intellectual pursuits? Try to use some of your remaining brain cells and really think about what it means to think about thinking. A phone shutting down services on low battery is the equivalent of an animal or human moving more slowly, refraining from moving, breathing slower, etc in response to slow resources or lack of sleep. This isn't even a conscious fucking process, it involves no thinking let alone thinking about thinking. If your phone had an existential crisis about how meaningless it was to throttle CPU frequencies and exist at all with no ultimate purpose other than amusing the human and oh god even the human has no purpose.. it would be thinking about thinking. (You honestly make me sick, as you're able to locate and press keys I'm sure it's the latter. Why do you have so little interest in understanding things and so much in talking about them?)

>So does a human being.

Humans are capable of adjusting to new situations, intuitive solutions, a self contained existence, repairs on self, etc. If you throw a brick at a human it will dodge. A phone will not sense the brick approaching despite having a camera to do so, it will not despair for its imminent death or make calculations to escape it despite your proposed self-awareness because such prompts have not been entered by humans and a phone does not have awareness or consciousness to create its own prompts.

Never mind, you're committed to willful ignorance and sheer idiocy - who am I to get in the way of that. Perhaps you're even right in a way, if you compare yourself to a phone there really isn't much difference. Neither seem to be capable of higher mental processes such as self-awareness or meta-cognitive reasoning.

Anonymous Thu Apr 23 06:45:18 2015 No.6442979

>>6442918
>But you must be intuitively aware that what we talk about when we refer to "awareness" is something entirely different than a simple causal loop.
Really? Enlighten me. Preferably without the bloviation that ultimately boils down to 'but muh feels'.
>The fundamental awareness is awareness of being, of existence.
My phone is aware that it exists. In fact, it is very diligent in communicating this knowledge to its base station every day.
>However, a great machine the size of a city that could solve great problems purely by mechanical means is no more intelligent than a shovel
'Intelligence' is a purely mechanical means itself. Google Translate is a more intelligent translator than you or I, yet functions in by 'purely mechanical means'.

>>6442922
>It's not a chemical, or, if it is, it's very subtle, i.e. more subtle than electrons and protons.
So it's a substance but not really a substance? Make up your mind.

>>6442958
>This isn't even a conscious fucking process, it involves no thinking
Really? What makes you say that? Again, enlighten me; why is a human being 'thinking', while a phone going through the exact same motions of cause and effect is not?

But do try explaining your reasoning without the histrionic outraged emotionality this time.

>A phone will not sense the brick approaching despite having a camera to do so, it will not despair for its imminent death or make calculations to escape it
Technically, yes, because a phone has to muscles with which to move.

A phone will, however, schedule automatic updates to fix its own broken software and will automatically scan for viruses and repair the damage they cause. Is that not fundamentally the same as 'dodging a brick'?

Anonymous Thu Apr 23 06:47:24 2015 No.6442981

>>6442958
P.S.
>If your phone had an existential crisis about how meaningless it was to throttle CPU frequencies
This scenario actually _does_ happen all the time. We call them 'software bugs' and 'glitches'. Empirically, the end result is the same as a human with an 'existential crisis'.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 07:05:45 2015 No.6443007 >>6442920 >not getting your fresh uncut nous every week from your local dealer to sniff before writing sessions It's how Zizek manages to remain so dank.

Anonymous Thu Apr 23 07:06:10 2015 No.6443010

>>6442979
>>6442880
What a fascinating trip back to the 17th century, it is as though all advancements in science and philosophy since this misguided period have been erased and your memory wiped clean. I recommend a history class, it might help you to resist the temptation of taking pre-industrial blunders for novel truths. Perhaps you would like to administer the Turing test to your phone to set your mind at ease, for all you know it's plotting to assassinate you in your sleep and take over your life -- I'm surprised you've remained so calm surrounded by foreign intelligence with a mind of its own.

Anonymous Thu Apr 23 07:08:19 2015 No.6443014

>>6437792
>We became too self aware
lol
> nature created an aspect of nature separate from itself
says the guy who is an atheist and can't get over how God created something that is an extension of him but not actually him, too self aware but not aware of this stupid bullshit?
>We are creatures that should not exist by natural law…
HAH? then what let us exist then? and what is natural law? what the fuck is he on about?!
>We are things that labor under the illusion of having a self, experience, and feeling, programmed with total assurance that we are each somebody
read: Descartes and Derek Parfit
>when in fact everybody is nobody.
I stopped taking him seriously at this point

Anonymous Thu Apr 23 07:12:09 2015 No.6443020

>>6443010
I appreciate your attempt to win an argument by citing anonymous Great Thinkers, but can you please try to make a point in your own words, please?

>Perhaps you would like to administer the Turing test to your phone
In case you're not aware: machines have passed the Turing test a long, long time ago already. In fact, whole cottage industries already sprung up to exploit this. Internet spammers exist only because we cannot tell a spam bot from the average (stupid) IRL human.

Anonymous Thu Apr 23 07:15:16 2015 No.6443026

>>6443020
>In case you're not aware: machines have passed the Turing test a long, long time ago already.
No. I know why you think that but you're wrong
>In fact, whole cottage industries already sprung up to exploit this.
What?
>Internet spammers exist only because we cannot tell a spam bot from the average (stupid) IRL human.
This does not constitute a Turing test

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 07:20:40 2015 No.6443031 >>6443014 >I'm smarter than a television show character

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 07:25:24 2015 No.6443036 >>6443026 >This does not constitute a Turing test Explain in your own words why it does not.

Anonymous Thu Apr 23 07:25:28 2015 No.6443037

>>6442979
Let me help you out, you're not very bright. Take your phone, place your phone in a vacuum. In case you're confused by the nature of a vacuum, no humans, computers, or other phones exist as far as your phone is concerned. Nothing does, just your beloved phone. Now does your phone schedule automatic updates to fix its own broken software? Will it perhaps write its own software? And change the update setting from "manual" to "automatic" when it senses the lack of human presence? Will it lower it's screen brightness if it's set on "manual" to preserve its last bit of battery? Surely it makes sense, no one would get angry. Will it compile its own list of viruses to scan for, figure out what damage they cause and how to fix it? Will it ever dodge a metaphorical brick?

As for the nature of thinking:
>is a program (x) that calculates a result, then prints it the same as a program (y) that copies the result from the former program and prints it without making the calculation or even having the ability to do so?

I hope I do not have to explain how this metaphor works.

For the love of god -- talk less, think more and stop clinging to your first semi-interesting thought, you can do better than this. Learning is a series of mistakes, how long you choose to spend in a state of inertia on every mistaken step is up to you.

Anonymous Thu Apr 23 07:27:45 2015 No.6443041

>>6443036
I can't seriously believe I have to explain that.
This isn't remotely coming close to what would be a Turing test.

Some Nigerian writes an e-mail about being the son of a billionaire, sends it to thousands of people, then waits for a couple of answers and writes replies to those.
Apparently the fact that he used a script to send those e-mails automatically makes you think it is some sort of Turing test.
This is insanity.

Anonymous Thu Apr 23 07:53:58 2015 No.6443085

>>6443020
In my own words? Oh but I haven't heard a single one of your personal words yet, we must be fair. You might enjoy following your automaton/flight of the ball train of thought to figure out whether the existence of personal words is possible at all. In any case I am not responsible for your knowledge or lack thereof, nor am I interested in winning an argument. Debate is for learning, you have nothing to teach me and no desire to learn. You're only good insofar as you amuse me.

.. Is CAPTCHA, in your unerstanding, the Turing test? Excellent.

>a long, long time ago
>machines
Was 2014 a long, long time ago? I suppose perception of time varies. I assure you it was not your phone that "passed" it, the use of plural is not appropriate either. The use of singular is debatable, the spectacle was dishonest, a form of cheating was involved which would void the result. Alas the Turing test is only an imitation game, a flawed one at that (more complete versions have been created). It is only that because Alan struggled with definitions, as do you in a much much more comical way.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 07:57:02 2015 No.6443088 >>6443041 No, no. He thinks CAPTCHA (or similar mechanisms are the Turing test. He needs an actual explanation of what the test is. He does not appear to be fond of search engines or books.

Anonymous Thu Apr 23 08:15:56 2015 No.6443121

>>6442979
>Google Translate is a more intelligent translator than you or I

.. Do you by any chance speak any foreign languages? Why am I asking, you don't. I warmly encourage you to partake in correspondence via google translate, the more official the better. Even human translators can't grasp or convert all the subtleties of syntax, meter, rhyme, meaning.. into another language and you think this can. I can't speak for you but I'm an infinitely better translator than Google Translate for any languages I speak and equipped with a vocabulary and grammar book, even ones I don't. It is a rather basic highly unintelligent program, it can't even translate basic sentences without numerous grammatical errors and entirely butchering the meaning.

What is emotional intelligence? What is social intelligence? What is art?

>What makes you say that
>why human think but phone no

Are you serious? Did you read any of the following? Try again.

>A phone shutting down services on low battery is the equivalent of an animal or human moving more slowly, refraining from moving, breathing slower, etc in response to slow resources or lack of sleep.
> it involves no thinking let alone thinking about thinking.

NEITHER is thinking you unfortunate Neanderthal.

>If your phone had an existential crisis about how meaningless it was to throttle CPU frequencies and exist at all with no ultimate purpose other than amusing the human and oh god even the human has no purpose.. it would be thinking about thinking

>no muscles
It has a camera. Is it or is it not aware of the brick approaching? Does it make calculations that come to the conclusion that it can't escape its unfortunate fate? Perhaps it could attempt to vibrate violently or set off its loudest alarm in an attempt to call for help or scare off the brick.

Anonymous Thu Apr 23 08:34:21 2015 No.6443154

>>6442981
>equates a software glitch to an existential crisis

I don't even have words for you anymore. Can you please explain why you're so opposed to logical thought and learning? I can suggest more effective ways of avoiding these processes: masturbate, play videogames. The "empirical result" will be the same.

For the third time:
>is a program (x) that calculates a result, then prints it the same as a program (y) that copies the result from the former program and prints it without making the calculation or even having the ability to do so?

a) a cry of pain in reaction to pain the same
b) a recorded cry of pain in reaction to a button being pressed

Are these the same process?

Is the process of an idiot accidentally stumbling upon a secret code by sheer luck the same as a genius breaking the code?

It is the process we're talking about, the human could very easily have no external reacting to an existential crisis. They might continue smiling and doing their job. How does this resemble a fucking software glitch in any conceivable way? Why do you grasp at every straw to keep your idiocy? Why do you attempt to engage in intellectual knowledge with no interest in truth?

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 08:38:47 2015 No.6443165 >>6442981 This is straight up 'cargo cult' thinking.

Anonymous Thu Apr 23 08:40:15 2015 No.6443169

>>6443154
Also, are you aware that neuroscience has progressed to the point where we can even predict simple decisions humans will make based on observing the processes that take place in their brain (different areas lighting up, etc)? We have a rather clear understanding of how a brain works, we also have an extremely clear understanding of how a phone work and how it does not. It is not up to debate, it is not a matter of opinion or perception, it is not some mystery where we make up our own story based on external output. Just because you lack all relevant knowledge doesn't mean it's a free domain for your childish imagination. I hope you grow up to be less of an ignorant fool, god bless.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 08:56:32 2015 No.6443202 >>6437792 His fucking tie knot HIS FUCKING TIE KNOT WHY

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 09:02:07 2015 No.6443209 >>6443202 he's not a fucking accountant

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 09:03:42 2015 No.6443213 >>6443209 the only XXI occupation allowed to look like civilised species is a single branch of services

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 09:05:42 2015 No.6443217 >>6443213 >literal autism

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 09:06:11 2015 No.6443218 >>6443217 >being a top memer

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 09:13:59 2015 No.6443231 >>6443218 I used the word literal to differentiate between my serious diagnosis and the employment of a meaningless buzzword with intent to harm.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 09:15:17 2015 No.6443235 >>6443202 If you're referring to the fact that it's not pushed up, it's because the top button is undone. It's a very common style, particularly in the 90s. Get out more.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 09:16:05 2015 No.6443238 >>6443235 >merican fashion

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 09:19:45 2015 No.6443243 >>6443235 it's also an infinitely better fit for rust as a character

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 09:20:45 2015 No.6443246 >To realize that all your life—you know, all your love, all your hate, all your memory, all your pain—it was all the same thing. It was all the same dream. A dream that you had inside a locked room. A dream about being a person. Is he right?

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 09:21:01 2015 No.6443247 >>6443231 Would the autistic not struggle with social norms, such as knowing how one is supposed to dress or say, what a proper tie knot looks like?

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 09:24:29 2015 No.6443255 >>6443243 Definitely this more than anything else.

Anonymous Thu Apr 23 09:28:00 2015 No.6443265

>>6443247
The autistic would not know that saying "he's not an accountant" is not the same as saying "only accountants wear their ties pushed up to their collar". An autist would not realise saying "he's not an accountant" infers the relative informality of the profession and relaxed dress code.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 09:29:37 2015 No.6443272 >>6443247 >proper tie knot get a load of this prescriptivist scum

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 09:37:39 2015 No.6443283 >>6437973 Get off /lit/ and go somewhere else

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 09:40:53 2015 No.6443288 >>6437792 No because we're not self-aware enough.

Anonymous Thu Apr 23 09:42:42 2015 No.6443294

>>6437792
It's stupid because misinterprets consciousness as metacognition.

Animals can be conscious and cognizant. Read any number of studies on chimpanzee social structure or any other semi-intelligent ape or monkey. That doesn't mean they're META-cognizant. That's what his grievance is with.

Anonymous Thu Apr 23 09:42:42 2015 No.6443295

>>6443265
It appears he understood you and replied in a similar tone. What he means is "people should dress properly regardless of profession". We can all be friends.

>>6443272
I did not state I agreed with social norms or their existence, it would be silly to claim that a proper tie knot does not exist within the system of social norm.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 09:42:51 2015 No.6443296 File: 100 KB, 800x568, 1427679636506.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >mfw reading this thread

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 10:03:18 2015 No.6443333 >>6443295 >he fuck off, samefag. no one else here is stupid enough to defend your retardation

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 11:22:24 2015 No.6443537 >>6443169 LE NEUROSCIENCE CARD LE SAM HARRIS TIER ARGUMENTS BEING THIS FUCKING DENSE HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 11:25:13 2015 No.6443546 File: 510 KB, 480x228, crying.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>6443246

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 11:56:35 2015 No.6443612 >>6443333 The quads of truth.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 19:44:51 2015 No.6445435 >>6443333 I'm afraid not, just a bypasser trying to understand your juvenile thought process. Still can't quite comprehend how you're this upset about one sentence from a stranger.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 19:46:41 2015 No.6445442 >>6443537 >gets ethered >responds in cargo cult memes Slogan for legalizing euthanasia.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 19:50:35 2015 No.6445452 >>6443169 You are an imbecile.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 20:19:48 2015 No.6445555 >>6445452 >>6445452 Let me get this straight, the person who thinks a phone is a functional equivalent of the human brain is calling someone an imbecile for pointing out there's a entire field devoted to explaining why they're wrong? Not surprising.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 21:15:40 2015 No.6445828 >>6439147 >there's only a difference in thought process, which is largely a product of language. Does this go all the way down to insects and single-cell stuff?

Anonymous Thu Apr 23 21:46:27 2015 No.6445931

>>6442842
>if self-awareness is neurobiological I ought to be able to hold it in my hands
>like I can with any other neurobiological matter
>other irrelevant dualist drivel

...

Go stand in a corner and think about what you've said. Do you also want to hold emotions and sensations in your hands? Or do you believe they come from your soul because you can't? Did you miss high school biology? The brain works through connections, transmitting information via electrical signals and neurochemicals. There is no "neurobiological matter" you can hold in your hand for virtually any process, you can theoretically "hold" every involved particle, as stated the primary part is mirror neurons. Philosophy should begin where science ends not where your elementary school understanding of science ends. It's been a long time since dualism was taken seriously, there's a reason for this. I'm glad you liked Plato, continue reading.

>How does the immaterial interact with the material
>how does the material interact with the immaterial (why is your mind affected by hunger or pain)
>how does the immaterial have an observable physical process and consequences (memory, decisions, emotion can all be observed)
>why for god's sake would damage to the body (brain damage) affect one's immaterial mind
>if mind does not lead body, body must lead mind
>what are false dichotomies

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 23 22:09:39 2015 No.6446022 >>6438046 >the tension between Rust's desires and what he says >the fact that despite his belief in the utter pointlessness of it all he always tries to do good >

Anonymous Fri Apr 24 04:13:22 2015 No.6447220

>>6442326
>>6442395
>>6442406
>>6442533
The desperation continues, I can't stop grinning!

You should try writing a book about a guy who is happily married and is respected in his life. It's also amazing that you still don't know what a straw man is, even after you googled it. And the fact that you can't see that a study focused on teenagers isn't substantial really just proves the point of how you literally are stupid.

This level of irony and projection is unprecedented. It just keeps coming! Congratulations, you've set a new record.

Anonymous Fri Apr 24 04:33:49 2015 No.6447260

>>6447220
>projection
>irony

>a study focused on teenagers isn't substantial
top kek, you heard it here first. how do you even type something this blatantly retarded without shooting yourself half way through the sentence? (also did you notice how that was one out of 6 studies or was your attention span's quota of 5 words per hour full?)

Anonymous Fri Apr 24 04:43:13 2015 No.6447288

>>6440331
I'd say you haven't been paying a whole lot of internet culture.

4chan is highly reactionary to the rights movement's move to the internet. We whine about some artificial concept of SJW's as much as SJWs whine about their artificial concept of patriarchy.

We're especially reactionary to what happens within the board. Every time we see something in earnest here, it's followed by very certain casual irony and understated rejection of previous earnestness. Literally every meme follows that cycle on 4chan. One that stands out in particular is the Scientology raids and the Guy Fawkes mask.

Anonymous Fri Apr 24 05:24:34 2015 No.6447363

>>6447260
Oh God, even more projection! At least you're letting your anger, and suicidal thoughts finally come out! The irony just gets even greater coming from you!

And you literally copypasted that from a pop science site for retards. The study was only done on angsty teens, and expanded to other teenage minds. We both know you aren't very smart, but I think that even you can figure out the issues with that study.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 24 05:25:58 2015 No.6447367 >>6447288 We aren't reactionary, we are contrarian. Being a reactionary just happens to be the contrarian thing of the moment.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 24 05:28:14 2015 No.6447375 >>6447363 >projection >irony >still can't read >still butthurt

Anonymous Fri Apr 24 05:33:42 2015 No.6447386

>>6447363
>implying studying certain ages is somehow less valid
>implying studying a mental disease with an onset in the teenage years in the teenage years is somehow less valid than god knows what

No actually, I can't figure out the issues. Please explain them to me, if possible use full sentences instead of buzzwords. I'm really slow.

Anonymous Fri Apr 24 06:19:39 2015 No.6447450

>>6443014
>says the guy who is an atheist and can't get over how God created something that is an extension of him but not actually him, too self aware but not aware of this stupid bullshit?
What is metaphor.

>HAH? then what let us exist then? and what is natural law? what the fuck is he on about?!
Nothing. His point is that we are an accident, he's just using language that exaggerates this.

>read: Descartes and Derek Parfit
Hahahhaha. There is virtually no serious (non Christian) philosopher who would actually argue that there exists distinct individual selfs. Everyone from the Eastern mystics to the German idealists realizes this. Cogito ergo sum.

>I stopped taking him seriously at this point
Because you're a faggot who copies memes from this site without realizing what they are.

Advanced search
Text to find
Subject [?]Search by post subject. Leave empty for any.
Username [?]Search for user name. Leave empty for any user name.
Tripcode [?]Search for tripcode. Leave empty for any.
Email [?]Search by email. Leave empty for any.
Filename [?]Search by image filename. Leave empty for any.
From Date [?]Enter what date to start searching from. Format is YYYY-MM-DD
To Date [?]Enter what date to start searching until. Format is YYYY-MM-DD
Image hash
Search in	All Posts OPs Only
Deleted posts	Show all posts Show only deleted posts Only show non-deleted posts
Internal posts	Show all posts Show only internal posts Show only archived posts
Order	New posts first Old posts first
Capcode	All Posts Only by Users Only by Mods Only by Admins Only by Developers
Results	Posts Threads
Action	[ Simple ]