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/lit/ - Literature

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6373462 No.6373462 [Reply] [Original]

Is becoming intelligent and therefore aware of a "bigger picture" in life the worst thing that has happened to humans as a species?

Wouldn't we have been better off just foraging and going our whole lives with only the objectives of surviving and reproducing? The introduction of critical thought just seems to have cause much more harm than it has good.

Sure we have the capacity to learn about the universe in which we live, but if there isn't really a "bigger picture" to anything, what good does this knowledge serve at all?

>> No.6373475

>>6373462
/lit/ - literature

>> No.6373480

>>6373475
This question has philosophical connotations.

Philosophy is, in fact, /lit/.

>> No.6373481

It ensured our reproductive success, from a biological standpoint that's all that matters. Even if global warming or nuclear war were to kill off most of us, the survivors would also be able to use the same intelligence to adapt to the new conditions and repopulate the world, possibly learning from their ancestors mistakes.

The only real downside is that some humans feel sad some of the time. It really doesn't stand up against 7 billion people and 10,000 years of civilization.

>> No.6373483

>>6373462

Vaping weed, virtual reality, and the growing interest in a potential cure for aging tell me it was all worth it, but at the same time if all I did was hunt all day before breaking a leg and dying alone in the woods I wouldn't really be able to care about that much at all.

It's a mixed bag, and really comes down to a personal preference more than anything because it'll all drift away in the end no matter what.

>> No.6373486

>>6373462
depends on many things especially how you apply the intelligence.
smart enough to stay low, smart enough to resist temptation then there ya go

>> No.6373496

>>6373483
That's the thing though, everything will end one day.

Even if we find a way to stop aging, we'll never be able to become truly invulnerable and immortal. Even if we condition the human body to never age and live forever, eventually something's gonna happen that's gonna kill you. If you somehow manage to jump to every planet before the last one gets swallowed by a collapsing star, you can't escape the next big crunch.

So in the end, I guess it was all just another advancement of a simple, primal, futile animal instinct: Find someway to ensure your species' survival, no matter what.

>> No.6373501

the worst thing that has happened to the human species was when we came up with the concept of something being 'worse'

>> No.6373520

>>6373501
How do you mean?

Like, say we start at 0. We have nothing but 0 (and for the sake of example, let's let 0 mean hunting and gathering). Then someone suddenly comes up with 1, and we become fascinated with one, to the point where we start clearly seeing 0 is worse than 1, and we need to all be at 1.

Then someone comes up with 2, then 3, and so on and so forth. And with numbers being infinite, we started a futile chain of events that will never reach a logical conclusion, when everything was completely satisfactory at 0.

Is that sort of how you mean?

>> No.6373524

>>6373462
Why is a lack of a "bigger picture" bad?

>> No.6373530

>>6373520
we should have skipped all of historical progression and went straight to Stirner

>> No.6373533

>>6373524
Because, as far as we can currently tell, there isn't actually a "bigger picture". At the very best, it's a romantic notion.

We developed the futile feeling of desire and that just complicated things far beyond the trouble the things we desire are worth.

>> No.6373538

>>6373475

>being this new

>> No.6373539

>>6373533
You feel let down because you were expecting an overarching meaning to life, and are upset to find out there is none.

Why can you not live life expecting nothing? Why not view things for what they are, instead of comparing them to grandiose notions of idealistic meaning?

>> No.6373544
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6373544

>>6373462
The lament is as old as we can remember. The pining for childhood or a golden age of man, sometimes closer to godhood sometimes nature.

It all seems so better, so idyllic.
It is just an idea though.
I create some pretty nice nostalgia feelings this way, I also hope for a better future.

>> No.6373547

>>6373496
The realization that this is the truth makes people unhappy, so they develop ideologies to avoid this nihilism.

>> No.6373569 [DELETED] 

>>6373462

>Is becoming intelligent and therefore aware of a "bigger picture" in life the worst thing that has happened to humans as a species?

The guilt that comes with intellectual advancement is important. You must pass through that guilt to find your inner child again and finally arrive at wisdom.

The guilt is egotistical claim, when you give up your egotistical claim you see yourself reflected in your fellow man and understand that you are the both murderer and the murdered.

>> No.6373570

>>6373539
I don't feel let down about anything, really. (other than the usual feelings we have either developed or have been conditioned to feel)

I believe fully that there is no meaning to life, and because of that, I feel like the development of advanced thought that can even conceptualize the notion of a "meaning" was nothing but an evolutionary by-product to further our reproductive capabilities.

Buddhism fascinates me for this reason. The Buddha didn't spin some bullshit, he got right down to it and said "Life is suffering". And it is because of our desire that were evolutionary by-products that we suffer because of this.

>> No.6374018

>>6373547
I laugh in my blind alley

>> No.6374134

>>6373547
explain the guy freezing his ass off in the frozen tundra who smiles he talks about his dogs dying?

>> No.6374142

What is the underlying structure of the universe?
Dank memes?

>> No.6374146

Schopenhauer
Nietzche
Camus
Sartre

Not that hard to pick up a book guys

>> No.6374158

>>6373496
It is not simply enough to survive, more people are surviving in the 21st century yet we're more anxious and depressed than ever. No, people must grow, we must become more.

>> No.6374174

>>6374146
can you give a brief summary of what each of them contributes? been looking for some stuff to read on this subject.

i've read the plague but wasn't moved by it. but that's it.

>> No.6374189

>>6374174
>can you give a brief summary of what each of them contributes?

>Schopenhauer

Philosophical pessimism. Life has no intrinsic value, except punctuations of pleasure, but everything is mostly suffering.

>Nietzsche

Nietzsche came as a reaction to Schopenhauer's denial of life and of life's essence. He believed Europe at the time of his life was suffering from an acute sense of Nihilism, since it had lost the metaphysical meaning that God and religiongave to people(i.e God is dead). Nietzsche believed that humans had to "overcome" their innate humanity, in order to progress as a species, and thought it was his job as to solve this problem.

>Camus

One of the leading philosophers of Absurdism, and one of the major contributors to atheistic existentialism.(Even though he denied the latter).

His idea was that human life is intrinsically absurd, in that we constantly crave a meaning to our existence and cannot find that meaning. His response was a choice. Either we create our own meaning, and accept the absurdity, or we commit suicide. Camus wants us to imagine that it is better to rebel against the absurdity than to commit suicide, because suicide is not a solution to the problem, only a refusal to accept that the problem exists.

Currently reading Sartre actually, so I haven't gotten a clear idea yet of him, but I hope the rest helped somewhat.

>> No.6374203

>>6373475
faggot

>> No.6374205

i guess u could say its a good thing... AND a BAD thing....... u know? haha

>> No.6374219

>>6374189
thanks for the summaries. schopenhauer seems a bit too, well, pessimistic for him to seem of much help to me.

>Nietzsche believed that humans had to "overcome" their innate humanity
how well do you think he accomplishes this?

>Either we create our own meaning, and accept the absurdity, or we commit suicide.
i feel like there should be another option here. also from what i read just now it seems he doesn't really give any insight into how you are to make your own meaning without it seeming fake. is there any of that?

>> No.6374233

>>6374219
>how well do you think he accomplishes this?

Considering that Nietzsche went to great lengths to be misunderstood by everyone, I'm not really sure. When I read Thus Spoke Zarathustra, his seminal work expounding the ideas of the Overman, and the overcoming of Man, the only thing I really was left with was that he was a fantastic writer, and capable of amazing prose.

But honestly, I think he just left his work for people to individually interpret as they wish.

>really give any insight into how you are to make your own meaning without it seeming fake. is there any of that?

Of course, he says that many people turn to religion, as a source of comfort and meaning, but from what I gathered when I read him, he really starts from a premise that people who read him have given up on religion. Other people might not agree with me on that though.

As insights, not really. In the Myth of Sisyphus, he really expounds the virtues of rebelling against the absurdity, i.e doing things for the sake of doing them, no matter how meaningless they seem, cosmically speaking.

>> No.6374240

>>6374233
myth of sisyphus sounds like a good place to start then... thanks m8. i like camus' ideas but his books just haven't done anything for me.

>> No.6374241

>>6374240
You should read that yes, and The Stranger as well, they are good books even if you don't get anything life changing out of them.

>> No.6374242

>>6374205
You would be doing us all a favor if you just ceased to exist