Ancient Greece was the height of civilization, and they all were openly bisexual.

[Anonymous No.6359792]

>Why can't we be that awesome?

[Anonymous No.6359798]

>Ancient Greece was the height of civilization

Strange that's not how you spell Rome

[Anonymous No.6359811]

>>6359798
Yes it is actually

Rome stole everything worth anything from the Greeks

[Anonymous No.6359820]

>>6359811

perfected upon*

All the Greeks did was bum and squabble amongst each other. Rome was the greater of the two civilizations.

[Anonymous No.6359828]

>>6359820
perhaps militarily, not philosophically


for fucks sake Christianity ruined everything, including today's culture

[« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » No.6359833]

>>6359792
>>6359798
Neither were. They had some things going for them.

Conservatives always look to the past with rose-colored glasses, seeing some kind of golden age. They're likely only recalling their childhood.
See the past with clearer eyes and try to bring back what worked, or learn from their mistakes and try to do different. Because it will always be different. History isn't cyclical, it just can look that way at times.

[Anonymous No.6359834]

>>6359828

literally the only response that post warrants

[Anonymous No.6359837]

>>6359833
>conservatives
I take it you're american. Do you buy into the liberal/conservative 2 party dichotomy? if so, why?

[Anonymous No.6359838]

>>6359834
but he's right


Fucking Justin Bieber and Taylor Swift and hand over heart nationalism inscribed with religious undertones... the bullshit list goes on and on

[Anonymous No.6359842]

>>6359838

[Anonymous No.6359844]

>>6359834
>>6359842

your tips can't dislodge reason from an argument, this isn't a game of Jenga

[Anonymous No.6359847]

How do you think, permitting we exist that long, the civilizations 1000 years from now will view our culture?

What will their philosophy be like? Will they shame us for still quarreling over Sextus Empiricus?

[Anonymous No.6359849]

>>6359844

>reason

lol

[« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » No.6359869]

>>6359837
Is there a better word to describe that? "Reactionary"?
Do you buy into the Optimates/Populares dichotomy?

There are these varying degrees throughout history. One is to the "left" of the other and vise versa. I am well to the left of both of 'em.

>>6359849
Take your fucking hat folder back to your christfag threads, you flipping jackass

[Anonymous No.6359873]

>>6359811
And the Greeks stole everything worth anything from the Minoans, Egyptians and the entire mid east. Your point?

[Anonymous No.6359875]

>>6359869

I'm not even religious dude, it's just you guys are such stereotypically deluded atheists I can't help but spam the hat meme at you.

Like seriously, you're using the word "Christfag" in a serious way and trying to blame Christianity for problems it has little or nothing to do with.

[Anonymous No.6359886]

>>6359792
>Ancient Greece was the height of civilization
Fucking /lit/ memes...

[Anonymous No.6359887]

>>6359869
Well the Optimates/Populares would be more quantifiable because someone is either of noble birth or they aren't. That's not an endorsement though.

I'm merely asking because I can't see a discernible difference between the ideologies of liberals and conservatives in contemporary america. Do you vote?

[Anonymous No.6359892]

>>6359875
>the defining religious ideology which forms the canvas upon which all latter-Greek Western thought and action is written upon is irrelevant

topkek


The sentences you are writing on your computer right now - your actual hands on your keyboard - are in effect still very much guided by the ghosts of an entire Christian system, you're too dull to see how it intrudes into the fabric of our current being, even after one has refused to follow the doctrines in a specific manner... it's still realized in our psychology and in the way we treat others and the environment... still a world "made for us"

[Anonymous No.6359894]

>>6359798
It's amazing that the amount of lead in the atmosphere reached a level with Roman smelting that wouldn't be surpassed until the Industrial Revolution. It's hard to appreciate today just how extensive Roman industry was.

[Anonymous No.6359897]

>>6359886
it was the apex, in no small part due to the comradery and willingness to suck your best friend or intellectual lover's cock

[« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » No.6359903]

>>6359873
The Achaeans or the Hellenes? They all eventually became the Greeks.
Psst. Hey, the Minoans stole from the Egyptians yo. Of disregard them entirely then.
Mehhhh naw man.

>>6359875
You have little understanding of what Christianity has done throughout history, and yes, I gather you aren't even a Christian, but you're suing it's only defense mechanism to derail a thread, for... what reasons? Ah, you're a jackass.

[Anonymous No.6359904]

>>6359892

ok buddy ;)

[Anonymous No.6359915]

define civilization.

[Anonymous No.6359923]

>>6359903

[Anonymous No.6359933]

>>6359903

[« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » No.6359941]

>>6359887
There's not much light between most of them, but there is a difference. It's all we're given.
I do waste a stamp on it, but to no effect I'm sure.
Most people around me have given up caring and the nation wide voter turn out reflects this same feeling.

[Anonymous No.6359959]

>>6359904
I bet YOU'RE the one who wears a funny hat; that means you're wrong!

[Anonymous No.6359983]

This is Laocoon and his sons. There's nothing bisexual about the OP except OP.

[Anonymous No.6360027]

>and they all were openly bisexual.

biggest meme in history. The lower classes would never engage in homosexual acts and it was usually relegated to a small percentage of the population, intellectuals, who believed their dicks were too good for women.

That being said what we know about the Greeks still isn't entirely clear. I mean, it's like if our civilisation was wiped out and a new one found only Playboy magazines from ours and based their perception of us on that.

[Anonymous No.6360161]

>>6359792
go suck a cock then

[Anonymous No.6360172]

>>6359844
Without Christianity Rome would have collapsed much much sooner than it did.

[Anonymous No.6360178]

>>6359792
>they all were openly bisexual.

try again.

[Anonymous No.6360180]

>>6359887
there is a clear difference in their ideologies. to put it briefly, small vs big government. is there a difference in their actual policies? domestically, yes. foreign policy wise, america acts as america does.

[Anonymous No.6360187]

>>6359792
>and they all were openly bisexual
You didn't start with the Greeks, didn't you?

[Anonymous No.6360394]

>>6360027
> The lower classes would never engage in homosexual acts and it was usually relegated to a small percentage of the population, intellectuals, who believed their dicks were too good for women.
THere's as much bullshit here as the op.

[Anonymous No.6360399]

>>6360394

refute me. Go.

[Anonymous No.6360420]

>>6360399
Absolutely no evidence or reason to believe that the lower classes were magically immune to homosexual acts or that it was only to be found among intellectuals.

[Anonymous No.6360429]

>>6359828
19th century Grecophile plz go

[Anonymous No.6360433]

>>6359844
>>6359828
>>6359798
>>6359820

[Anonymous No.6360453]

>>6360433
What on earth is fedora about those last to posts you linked? Isn't it meant to refer to aggressive anti-religious 'euphoria'?

[Anonymous No.6360457]

>>6359828
I WAS BORN IN THE WRONG GENERATION
I'M ONLY 15 AND I'M READING NIETZSCHE AND PLATO, NOT THAT MODERN STUPID CHRISTIAN STUFF LIKE KIERKEGAARD!

[Anonymous No.6360463]

My Ancient Greek prof used to say that the only thing the Romans did better than the Greeks was waging war and aqueducts.

[Anonymous No.6360466]

>>6360463
Clearly not a history prof.

[Anonymous No.6360470]

>>6360466
He's also a cabaret artist on the side (ie a comedian), so his sayings weren't the most profound or to be taken seriously at all times.

[Anonymous No.6360472]

>>6360457
>Kierkegaard

Tippa dee ol' fedora to you, sire!

[Anonymous No.6360482]

>and they all were openly bisexua
Except they weren't you degenerate faggot.

[Anonymous No.6360485]

lmao OP just wants to fuck dudes without feeling bad

[Anonymous No.6360498]

>>6360027
>The lower classes would never engage in homosexual acts
Why wouldn't they?
Besides, who cares what they think, they're literally fucking plebs.

[Anonymous No.6360521]

>>6360470
Interesting combination of jobs he has.

[Anonymous No.6360538]

>>6360521
Yeah, odd person. I went to one of his cabarets and he mostly jokes about soccer, or formal logic.
You can imagine how well it goes, career-wise.

[Anonymous No.6360545]

>>6360482
>degenerate
Please atleast read Max Nordau before spouting this meme phrase.

[Anonymous No.6360551]

>>6360485
>lmao OP just wants to fuck dudes without feeling bad
Then why go to /lit/ when /fit/ is just one letter away?

Anyway...Greece may be considered the pinnacle of western philosophy or drama (and that too is VERY debatable), but "civilization" is too general and very problematic. For example, weren't their visual arts (the statue) surpassed by Renaissance artists? Wasn't their architecture also obviously inferior to the Gothic cathedral? Wasn't their military inferior to Roman legions?

And being bi (cause that's what you really want, rite?) is fine today too. Don't need Greeks for that.

[Anonymous No.6360647]

>>6359834
>>6359842
>>6359849
>>6359875
>>6359904
>>6359933
>>6360433

[Anonymous No.6360653]

Actually, we, right now, are the height of civilization.

[Anonymous No.6360656]

>>6360485
Why would you feel bad about that? Sounds like you need to go back to /pol/

[Anonymous No.6360657]

>>6360457
>kierkegaard
>modern christian

[Anonymous No.6360658]

"Height of civilization" is subjective; stop being spooky

[Anonymous No.6360659]

>>6360653
Yes, I, who am too scared to answer the door when the pizza delivery guy arrives, am the height of civilization.

[Anonymous No.6360669]

>>6360659
You're right, keeping slaves, diddling adolescents, having anyone who isn't a male citizen of the polis over 21 after military service not vote, THAT is the height of civilization. Obviously.

[Anonymous No.6360683]

>>6360669
Lol, the modern elites are diddling kids, not adolescents, voting is heavily gamed by the amount of money which goes into who people think they can vote for (lobbyists, etc), and slavery is still absolutely at large.

[Anonymous No.6360690]

pansexuality =/= bisexuality

[Anonymous No.6360692]

>>6360690
Who wouldn't want to be raped by Pan?

[Anonymous No.6360694]

>>6360669
>blaming the ancient greeks for diddling adolescents
>what is the Bohemian Club

[Anonymous No.6360697]

these threads are so pathetic, you people have no idea what "classical values" are and yet you keep eating shit spouted out by Enlightenment faggots in powdered wigs

[Anonymous No.6360700]

>>6360694
The Bohemian club is dress up and hookers for the rich and powerful out in California. At least that's what Harry Shearer says.

[Anonymous No.6360701]

>>6360027
Actually, it was the slaves, artists and intellectuals who were most homosexual.

It's not even clear if owning pottery with homosexual depictions on the side was always legal in Athens. It is clear that the Athenians did not widely consent to Dorian vices.

[Anonymous No.6360703]

>>6360683
>the modern elites are diddling kids
[citation needed]
>slavery is still absolutely at large
Not in the first world.

>>6360694
>a couple of old men who may or may not diddle adolescents is the same as having the whole of society accept and encourage diddling adolescents

[Anonymous No.6360707]

>>6360703
>Not in the first world.
Sex slavery most definitely is. I get that it's not accepted or legal, but saying it's not at large is just inaccurate.

[Anonymous No.6360710]

>>6360669
There's more slavery today than there has ever been.

[Anonymous No.6360716]

Greeks didn't have a modern concept of "homosexuality" or "bisexuality." Nor did most ancient cultures including the Hebrews. That's something we project on them because we do.

What mattered was whether you were an active/penetrating partner vs. a passive/penetrated partner. Women were expected to be passive and men were expected to be active. Passive men were impermissible whether they be passive to another man (and the active man in a homosexual pairing was NOT particularly frowned upon) or passive to a woman.

[Anonymous No.6360721]

>>6359820
>All the Greeks did was bum and squabble amongst each other. Rome was the greater of the two civilizations.


>the US are better than Europe

well memed

[Anonymous No.6360729]

>>6360707
>Sex slavery most definitely is
Fair enough, that is true.
>I get that it's not accepted or legal
I think that is a pretty important difference, though.

>>6360710
>There's more slavery today than there has ever been.
Sure, because there's way, way more people.
The percentage of people in any developed country living in slavery is definitely at an all-time low, though.

[Anonymous No.6360735]

>>6360716
>Passive men were impermissible
But what about the eromenos? It's not like they had much of a choice, and getting fucked in the ass by an eraste was part of the process

[Anonymous No.6360737]

>>6360716

this is interesting. In Renaissance Italy, a man who received fellatio from another man was the one considered to be a woman and was often shamed for receiving it. Whether the man giving head was still considered a man.

[Anonymous No.6360742]

>>6360729
what you call sex slavery exists only because the cost of access to sex is high (thanks to the feminists-humanists)

[Anonymous No.6360743]

You're allowed to be bisexual, m8, but I'm not. Don't force your sexuality on me.

[Anonymous No.6360749]

>>6360735
Boys were considered to be partly feminine until they matured, so it was fine.

[Anonymous No.6360752]

>>6360737
Really? That's pretty odd, but interesting. Do you have any source maybe, I'd like to read more about Renaissance men fellating each other, for reasons of historical research, I mean.

>>6360742
I'm not sure what you mean by that. Aren't sex slaves sold into prostitution, which in turn is rather expensive to the client?

[Anonymous No.6360753]

>>6360716
Why is it that every time ancient homo/bisexuality is mentioned on /lit/, someone always posts this, as if no one knows about it or as if it's relevant.

[Anonymous No.6360755]

>>6360743
I'll force my sexuality on you bby ;)

[Anonymous No.6360759]

>>6360721
>the greeks are comparable to an entire continent while the Romans are comparable to the modern US
Even better memed

[Anonymous No.6360760]

>>6360753
>why does /lit/ keep talking about the exact same shit over and over day in day out?

[Anonymous No.6360770]

>>6360752
>Aren't sex slaves sold into prostitution, which in turn is rather expensive to the client?
expensive perhaps, but still better yield than the traditionnal manners ot have some.

[Anonymous No.6360771]

>>6360752

My lecturer was making a point about it the other day. Here is an example he was posting:

"…the greatest and most indecent case that has ever been
heard, such that it’s a wonder the earth doesn’t open up to
swallow such criminals. Be informed that ser Simone from
Staggia, otherwise known as ser Simone Grazzini, formerly
Official of the Palace … maintains his man servant [garzone]
in his home like a woman, and vice versa he lets himself be
used by the said garzone, whose name is Valore di Lorenzo di
Valore….Not content with this, over various occasions he has
given more than 50 florins to a dyer who does this disgraceful
thing to him, that is, the said dyer is the one who indecently
does it to ser Simone….This is a case that would merit a
Hebrew punishment." - 1496

[Anonymous No.6360815]

>>6360742
You're a retard.

[Anonymous No.6360828]

>>6360737
How does that work? I would have thought it would be the other way around, not just in one country or culture but in generally all of Europe. >>6360771 doesn't support it, since both catching and pitching is being criticised.

[Anonymous No.6360829]

>>6360433
Nice meme

>Anybody who disagrees with me is a fedora

[Anonymous No.6361017]

>>6359792
>Ancient Greece was the height of civilization,
>And they were bisexual

I like these statements because they clearly spell out the enormous amount of ignorance showed by "greek fags" that haven't read a single book from the greek.

Sure, the greeks were highly advanced but their society was atrocious.

>slave owners (sparta was nr 1)
>blood sports (pankration)
>highly competitive everything was competition
>practiced eugenics
>master and slave mentality
>no quarrels about genocide not even if democratic (melian dialogue)
>highly xenophobic
>women were second rate citizens and frowned upon

The list goes on.

[Anonymous No.6361032]

real fedoras dont read philosophy they read manga and dawkins

[« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » No.6361084]

>>6361032
>real fedoras
>read [D]awkins
You don't understand what a "real fedora" is
"Real" ones hate Dawkins and anyone who mentions they're atheist. Real ones have no defense for their idiotic belief system. If they dare read philosophy of any kind it's not to question the universe but to validate their ancient unsalvageable faith.

[« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » No.6361179]

>>6360180
>to put it briefly, small vs big government
Uh. No. They're both for big government.

I'll put it briefly: Everything the GOP does is for the wealthiest, Democrats do what they can for everybody *including* and *especially* the wealthy.

[Anonymous No.6361254]

>height of civilization
>not the modern west and other industrialized nations that were influenced by it (including japan)

computers, internet, planes, cars, mastery of electricity, landing on the fucking moon, modern medicine, overcoming the Malthusian trap etc.

plus the social progress of eliminating slavery, freedom of speech and press (or in europe mostly free speech, due process, the concept of a weekend coupled with skyrocketing incomes etc.

i mean ya, it's starting to go down the toilet with this excess of guilt and self hate and all the negative things in society that spring from it, but it's still the best

everyone who says rome or greece or any ancient civilization was the height is fucking delusional. they were great for the time though and did a lot of important though

[Anonymous No.6361274]

>>6360180
>small vs big government

Who do you mean? The greeks defined themselves after their contribution to the polis (the state).

[Anonymous No.6361286]

>>6360703
>[citation needed]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/10953043/20-establishment-figures-in-elite-paedophile-ring.html

[Anonymous No.6361288]

>>6361017
are you trying to make me like the greeks even more?

[Anonymous No.6361294]

>>6361017
Those sound great. Where do I sign up?

[Anonymous No.6361307]

>>6361017

>>6361017
>>slave owners (sparta was nr 1)
>>blood sports (pankration)
>>highly competitive everything was competition
>>practiced eugenics
>>master and slave mentality
>>no quarrels about genocide not even if democratic (melian dialogue)
>>highly xenophobic
>>women were second rate citizens and frowned upon

perhaps you can explain why all those are bad ? (serious remark)

[Anonymous No.6361313]

>>6360815
Nice meme

[Anonymous No.6361408]

>>6359828

[Anonymous No.6361459]

>>6361254
Yea but how long do you think this shit will last? It's been a mere 65 years since post-war growth into the modern mega-state and I don't think it'll last for much longer. We're consuming resources at way too fast a rate.

[Anonymous No.6361844]

Civility is nothing to be proud of. It simply means you have possessed by something...uncanny. A nation of gheists... now isn't that something to behold.

[Anonymous No.6361856]

>>6360716
>>6360753
It's entirely made up tho, the greeks had an insult for gays and if you were caught doing anything with a man you would lose citizenship, exiled or killed.

The boy thing was mentorship and had nothing to do with sex. Women did the same thing with young girls.

There's no real proof they were gay except for 3 vases(lol) and translating the greek word love as "gay butt sex" every time it's used.

[Anonymous No.6362036]

>>6361856

When you say "Greeks" which state do you mean? Because some Greek states like Spartar and Thebes openly practiced homosexuality and even believe it contributed to war morale while in others like Athens it was seen as a decadent secret.

[Anonymous No.6362663]

egypt >> hellenic cultures

[Anonymous No.6362795]

hat joke killed this thread

[Anonymous No.6363001]

>>6361459

assuming you're still here, overall the west is fine especially because of the US/Southern America that can easily pickup slack at least when it comes to growing enough food and mining enough raw materials until things like asteroid or deepsea mining become commonplace

the people who are the most fucked are countries like china, india, and africa because they're not self-sufficient and suffer from crippling corruption. Mao is a good example of what will happen to china if the don't get their shit together

[Anonymous No.6363230]

>>6361856
Holy shit, the denial in this post is some major projecting.

[Anonymous No.6363302]

>>6360694
>implying the Bohemian Club does shit

I know two members and they don't do shit lol. It's like the Masons, plebs like to wish these secret groups do crazy things but in reality all they do is MAYBE take a few drugs.