/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.6083304]

Hello /lit/

You may have noticed that videogames has been a hot topic the past year with misogyny, GamerGate, and SJW.

I was wondering if literature has taken the same kind of attacks by said SJW also?

-/v/

[Anonymous No.6083313]

>>6083304
not british here, what is SJW?

[Anonymous No.6083314]

[-]

[Anonymous No.6083321]

SJW is a meaningless acronym, you're just a callous reactionary who deserves what's going to happen in Comrade Stalin's next glorious purge

[Anonymous No.6083322]

>>6083304
It's mostly in shit tier books, no one cares.

[Anonymous No.6083331]

>>6083313
Social Justice Warriors

Tumblrites who fight for the name of feminism with hypocrisy and double standard.

[Anonymous No.6083334]

>>6083304
There was some dispute about "updating" children's books in Germany. Nothing essential as far as I know thought.

[Anonymous No.6083341]

underage thread

[Anonymous No.6083342]

Uh, I remember hearing about someone re-writing The Merchant of Venice since that's about a Jew loving money or some silly reason like that. People also want to censor Twain for having 'nigger' in his books.

[Anonymous No.6083359]

>>6083304
Well we're typically more progressive. I know I don't identify with most 4chan politics, and the gamergate thing is kind of gross. I hate how you guys harass people. You, /b/, and /pol/ give everyone else bad name.

That being said, yeah game journalism sucks and you should try to make it better. I don't like hugboxes. That being said, don't get pissed every time somebody tries to make a female character that isn't sexually provocative.

Also, go back to /v/. Don't come back here. Ever.

[Anonymous No.6083370]

>>6083304
Not anymore. In history, yeah, but books have had the advantage of being around a long-ass time. The problems literature has are the same kind of problems a painter would have, at least in regards to content offending the audience. People are willing to give a lot of credit to the medium.


Meanwhile, video games fucking suck.

[Anonymous No.6083383]

>>6083304
They do, if you like shitty books. But we don't read shitty books on /lit/. We're classier than that.

Now see your way out.

[Anonymous No.6083384]

Daily reminder Flann O'Brien dealt with this worthless argument nearly a century ago and people only started publishing it in the 60s and none of you fuckers read. OP none of these words mean what you think they mean, they all mean >>>/v/
Sincerely, my bicycle can think better.

[Anonymous No.6083402]

There is a satisfying amount of books with well written female characters that do not rely on sexual appeal, as both male and female readers and writers are significantly more emotionally intelligent than gamers. So no, there is nothing to complain about or attack.

[Anonymous No.6083424]

>>6083384

I'm genuinely a bit confused. When did O'Brien address this?

[Anonymous No.6083428]

>>6083304
History and this board has a huge sjw problem.

[Anonymous No.6083432]

>>6083321
Will I get tons of revolutionary pussy?

[Anonymous No.6083433]

>>6083304
Maybe in the fantasy genre, but that genre has always been full of shit and wish fulfillment.

[Anonymous No.6083437]

>>6083424
When Divney brings it up in relation to the robbery. /closes policeman's notebook

[Anonymous No.6083469]

>>6083437

I got my book down just to find out what the fuck you were talking about and got a top kek in return.

Fair play.

[Anonymous No.6083475]

>>6083304
sjws don't read anything besides YA fiction and storeis about doctor who making out with werewolves and stuff, so no, not really

[Anonymous No.6083487]

What the fuck is SJW and why have I only heard people complaining about them and never actually seen SJWs opinions myself

[Anonymous No.6083491]

>>6083487
Spooks, clearly

[Anonymous No.6083495]

>>6083304
Yes, SJWs have been ruining literature too.

Literature classes in colleges now have a larger focus on minority writers, not because they're any good, but because they're minorities. Just pick a college at random and take a look at their literature classes.

And every year whenever they come out with a list of the greatest novels of the year tumblr-cunts always tally up how many white men there are vs how many women they are. Here's a really great article about it:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/amelia-gray/in-defense-of-the-weenie_b_374212.html?view=print
http://www.poynter.org/news/mediawire/176705/why-88-of-books-reviewed-by-the-new-york-times-are-written-by-white-authors/

And in the publishing industry you're more likely to get published if you lie and say you're a bigenderqueer pansexual demi-African-Amercian twice removed. There was a story about an author who was going to be published, only under the condition that he pretended to be a black woman, but unfortunately after googling for several minutes I couldn't find it.


While searching for that story I happened to come across this bullshit:
http://www.theroot.com/articles/culture/2013/05/should_a_white_writer_tackle_black_characters.html
Yeah, let's dictate what white people should be allowed to write. They're not black so they shouldn't get to write about black people. And let's not let Ray Bradbury write about rockets since he's never been to space.

So yes, SJWs have infected the literary community. They're also the reason why politically charged YA fiction sells so well.

[Anonymous No.6083504]

>>6083491
SJW "attacks" and SJW opinions are both spooks TBH

they both allude to a "struggle" that is "bigger than you" where you must "play your part to defeat the other side"

pure ideology

[Anonymous No.6083524]

>>6083487
Because you don't hang on boards where the same dozen 'SJW images' are circulating over and over.

[Anonymous No.6083531]

>>6083495
The shit that pisses me off with "sjws" is when they pull the "You aren't ----(insult minority here) so you can't write about it/have an opinion/have any say in the matter/focus a story around it." Fuck you. I'm a writer, and I will write whatever the fuck I want. My story will not just be composed of just straight white males.

The best part is, if I DID only write about straight white males, they would still bitch.

I'm so mad right now.

[Anonymous No.6083533]

>>6083495
You read playboy tier trash.

[Anonymous No.6083540]

>>6083495
>not because they're any good

really? what if they are good

[Anonymous No.6083541]

>>6083495
>literature classes
Because wanking over the same fucking classics serves such a noble purpose. Shit, I wouldn't be surprised if they switched to lesser known authors simply to avoid having to scour the internet to see if a student's text analysis is stolen from one of the five thousands available online.

[Anonymous No.6083553]

>>6083531
you sound like a terrible writer anyway

[Anonymous No.6083554]

>>6083321
>you're just a callous reactionary who deserves what's going to happen in Comrade Stalin's next glorious purge

Stalin is dead.

[Anonymous No.6083555]

>>6083428
That part may just as much describe gamergate and /v/ as the "sjws" they claim to fight.

A grown man crying and throwing a tantrum because someone disagrees with him.

[Anonymous No.6083556]

>>6083533
you know Kurt Vonnegut, Jack Kerouac, Ray Bradbury, Norman Mailer, Haruki Murakami, Margaret Atwood, and Gabriel Garcia Marquez were published in Playboy?

[Anonymous No.6083559]

"SJW" is a rhetorical appellation for an extremely nebulous concept that encompasses a variety of disparate socio-political phenomena. As such its entirely inappropriate as a topic of sustained enquiry outside of the context of semiotic analysis.
Perhaps someone should informs the chaps on /v/ about this. They haven't been let on to it yet it seems.

[Anonymous No.6083574]

>>6083556
How does this make playboy sound good? All these authors are pleb garbage. You are a fool. Read more, stupid American.

[Anonymous No.6083576]

>Hurr durr sjws don't exist even though people literally call themselves that

Stop being such manipulative pieces of garbage for all of your unpopular lives

[Anonymous No.6083577]

>>6083556
Yes, Bradbury is seminal playboy tier. That it followed into your news outlets is no surprise. Perhaps you even play video games. Trash.

[Anonymous No.6083580]

>>6083576
See
>>6083559

[Anonymous No.6083582]

>>6083342
>>6083334
But that is mostly the cause of centrist soccer moms who are the source of this misbegotten hugbox generation.

Also, of course, the whole problem of Americans equating Liberals and Marxists on the net, like the rest of the world is on the same far-right page as they are.

[Anonymous No.6083587]

>>6083541
>Because wanking over the same fucking classics serves such a noble purpose.
It does.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cVLpdzhcU0g

When we talk about Plato's Republic, Chaucer, Cerventes, and Shakespeare, we're not just talking about white authors because they're white, we're talking about books which fundamentally changed the world and literature forever and are just as relevant today as they were back then.

[Anonymous No.6083590]

>>6083587
I don't believe Americans are allowed read these books before the age of 18 and marriage.

[Anonymous No.6083598]

>>6083577
>I only read maximalist books by David Foster Wallace and James Joyce for maximalist minds such as myself.

[Anonymous No.6083601]

>>6083587
And how does that make them more important to analyze? I mean, I'm assuming that the 'minority books' aren't part of courses concerning the history of literature, if they are then the classics would obviously be more suitable.

[Anonymous No.6083606]

>>6083587
>Plato's Republic, Chaucer, Cerventes, and Shakespeare,

dead white men, lol

[Anonymous No.6083608]

>>6083598
>I only know entrytier postmodernism and stream of consciousness
>even then only meme books
>can't decide whether pinecone or dawkins next
You play video games, don't you?

[Anonymous No.6083617]

>>6083601
wat

[Anonymous No.6083622]

>>6083590
No. The SJWs only have control over our schools, not our recreational reading.

[Anonymous No.6083628]

>>6083608
>dismissing a whole artistic platform
You may as well say film, dance, and paint is for plebs

[Anonymous No.6083629]

>>6083495
Things could be worse though. Although the gates are guarded now, and newer books are all neutered, there's a lot of older books out there that these people would probably want to ban if they read them, due to all the mainstream-at-the-time views on women and non-whites. They're too busy reading their YA series, though, so they mostly don't read those older books. Some of them read the occasional one then bitch about it online, but there hasn't been a concerted campaign against a single book yet.

[Anonymous No.6083634]

This book, along with Heroines by Kate Zambreno, helped me realize what people mean when they talk about the marginalization of female writers.

[Anonymous No.6083635]

>>6083628
>videogame
>art

I bet you watch anime too.

[Anonymous No.6083636]

>>6083601
They're more important because they stood the test of time. I posted the youtube video so I won't have to sit here and write you a whole fucking essay on why you're retarded.

[Anonymous No.6083637]

>>6083617
Understanding the entirety of the history of literature isn't the only analysis of literature one can engage in, and is of course impossible to begin with.

[Anonymous No.6083638]

>>6083622
>SJWs have control over our schools
o b s e s s e d
b
s
e
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d

[Anonymous No.6083640]

>>6083587
I don't think you'll ever find one course that includes all of those authors you just named

Meanwhile my uni has an entire class on Shakespeare and another on the Republic

[Anonymous No.6083642]

>>6083628
>artistic platform
Hahaha, oh shit you have to justify your artistic platform before admitting you play video games. That's a pretty big hang up for someone who reads playboy, even if you're reading it "for the articles".

[Anonymous No.6083646]

>>6083637
Well yeah I agree whats your point?

[Anonymous No.6083649]

>>6083628
please don't reply to the troll.

[Anonymous No.6083650]

>>6083553
It's because I am an edgy 19 year old, probably

[Anonymous No.6083652]

>>6083640
>I don't think you'll ever find one course that includes all of those authors you just named

Thanks, SJWs.

[Anonymous No.6083658]

most authors and readers are female, we don't really have the problem the video game industry has. Sometimes though people criticize older classics for their sexist and racist topics but nothing more.

[Anonymous No.6083659]

>>6083652
I don't think you'll ever find one course that includes all of those authors you just named because they belong to traditions disparate enough to be separated into separate courses.
There I fixed it so you can't insert your political biases. Can you stop being o b s e s s e d
0
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[Anonymous No.6083660]

>>6083652
the strawman police will come for you soon enough

[Anonymous No.6083663]

>>6083659
>writing things vertically
oh thank god, for a second there I thought I was talking to someone who wasn't an idiot

[Anonymous No.6083665]

>>6083658
But the important ones are male, just look at the Western canon.

[Anonymous No.6083666]

>>6083304
Maybe if you guys give your female programmers and designers more credit instead of death and rape threat, you'll look better in their eyes.

[Anonymous No.6083669]

>>6083658
>Sometimes though people criticize older classics for their sexist and racist topics but nothing more.
Pls that's the whole reason this board loves Nietzsche because he criticises everybody even when the critiques contradict each other.

[Anonymous No.6083671]

>>6083636
Okay. So? Does that mean you can learn more about analysis from analyzing them? Because that's what they're trying to teach, how to analyze. Not to analyze the right things. They assume that you'll keep reading whatever you want and analyze it to the best of your abilities, classics and non-classics alike. Their historical importance doesn't necessarily mean you can learn more about how to conduct an analysis from analyzing them. In fact, since they're so ingrained into our culture it can even be considered too simple to analyze them, as we're often familiar with many aspects of them whether we know it or not. I'm not speaking against the value of a classic education. I'm speaking against the idea that literature class is about finding the correct answer about these texts and then you can stop analyzing. Because if you're not going to stop analyzing, you'll have all the time in your life to analyze whatever it is you want to, and that's without the teachers having to try to spend hours trying to identify whether your analysis is taken from the internet or not, which is a somewhat uniquely modern issue they're facing.

[Anonymous No.6083672]

>>6083666
get raped, faggot

[Anonymous No.6083677]

>>6083663
>I thought I was talking to someone who wasn't an idiot
That makes you the idiot. And me. And all of this here.
This is 4chan after all.

[Anonymous No.6083686]

>>6083677
I was being facetious. I knew you were a retard all along.

Or do you not know when someone is patronizing you?

[Anonymous No.6083687]

>>6083666
And maybe film and TV should start crediting the lighting guy and costume designer next to the director. Painting should credit where they buy their paint from too. Maybe authors should credit their proof reader also.

[Anonymous No.6083691]

>>6083686
1
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o
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[Anonymous No.6083693]

>>6083687
>tfw no Vera to proof and type your manuscripts while butterfly catching
;_;

[Anonymous No.6083696]

>>6083687
I thought game design was more akin to directing than costume design, but if you say so

[Anonymous No.6083701]

>>6083691
>roll over and check your privilege, white man!
>how dare you defend yourself from my anti-white male rhetoric?!

[Anonymous No.6083706]

>>6083701
Who are you quoting?

[Anonymous No.6083707]

>>6083706

[Anonymous No.6083711]

>>6083701
>>6083707
Is there a name for the /pol/-style "pulling out the stops of your feminism folder regardless of how unrelated the images are to the current discussion" thing you do

[Anonymous No.6083712]

>>6083711
Yes, we usually call it:
>>>/pol/

[Anonymous No.6083716]

>>6083711
it's called fighting fire with fire

[Anonymous No.6083717]

Does /lit/ have janitors?

[Anonymous No.6083720]

>>6083666
there are only a handful of game designers that get any public credit, though

it's not a very glamourous profession

[Anonymous No.6083727]

>>6083716
But nobody else does this

[Anonymous No.6083729]

>>6083696
Point is, the director's name is the most important name on the credit next to the producer.

If a movie bomb, it's on the director not the guy who designed the outfits. If the movie is a success, well the credit still go to the director. Pray they credit all 500 of you when they go receive their award and someone will know want you did when you say you work on the movie.

[Anonymous No.6083733]

>>6083717
No we don't catch feelings in the same manner as /v/ and /pol/, it has to have good prose for it to work. Feel free to report it for not being /lit/ related or talk about books you're reading.

[Anonymous No.6083740]

>>6083733
I just mean in response to the guy shitposting screencaps. Unless you consider that prose.

[Anonymous No.6083741]

>>6083707
> Army excercises causes spinal and pelvic damage
> The victims get compensations
how is this related to feminism or how is this a negative thing

[Anonymous No.6083744]

>>6083717
>get your SJW rhetoric rocked
>start insulting all white men
>get insulted back
>where's the janitor?! My feelings! My feelings are being raped!

>>6083727
see:
>>6083691
>>6083659
>>6083638
Nice shitposting, friend.

[Anonymous No.6083753]

>>6083741
EQUALITY! BUT WITH BENEFIT BECAUSE I'M A GIRL!

[Anonymous No.6083757]

>>6083744
I just came in this thread to post that comment because I noticed the word SJW and saw a videogame in the OP picture, neither have anything to with /lit/.
And I've entered to find greentext and anime reaction images...

[Anonymous No.6083759]

>>6083740
Personally, William Burroughs' work is better. cummings had higher and lower points.

[Anonymous No.6083761]

>>6083757
Remember, our diversity quota for equal representation is 80% women 20% men

[Anonymous No.6083763]

>>6083761
O-okay you too

[Anonymous No.6083765]

ITT: stuff middle schoolers get really worked up about

[Anonymous No.6083766]

>>6083753
You usually get compensation from clearly work-related damages. They got more than the guys who were shot because those guys were shot by the enemy. And had bad lawyers.

[Anonymous No.6083767]

>>6083753
Are you implying that males could not be compensated for permanent physical harm?

[Anonymous No.6083768]

>>6083304
No, because we aren't mentally children like you /v/ apes are. Even /pol/ is more mature than you.

[Anonymous No.6083779]

>>6083761
So only 25 people work there? Because I'm not seeing anything about that being the full workforce.

[Anonymous No.6083782]

>>6083707
You do realize that by touting that article, you are attacking the U.K Law system which is an achievement of superior white race? Based on your own prejudice against it? Blindly hating your ancestors, aren't you, you fucking degenerate. You have no respect for anything but yourself, marxist scum.

[Anonymous No.6083785]

The rich are killing children

[Anonymous No.6083791]

>>6083768
This, when you are older you will start to realise most of these conspiracies are in your head.

[Anonymous No.6083795]

>>6083757
But the Hyrule Historia is clearly a book. And OP is asking a /lit/ related question, just not about the usually 2deep4u stuff that people on /lit/ read.

[Anonymous No.6083798]

>>6083304
Literature is safe.
Those whiny bitches don't read.

[Anonymous No.6083803]

>>6083795
everybody answered "no" and then he (or someone else) proceeded to spam images as if he didn't care

[Anonymous No.6083804]

>>6083798
But they do. YA dystopian future science fiction fantasy novels like Hunger Games and Divergent!

[Anonymous No.6083821]

>>6083359
>game journalism sucks and you should try to make it better
That's like saying "literature sucks and you should try to make it better." Nah, homie. Writers gonna write.

[Anonymous No.6083824]

>>6083821
But you have to strive for objectivity and they don't!

[Anonymous No.6083825]

>>6083804
You but those didn't push out any works of greater 'literary value,' at least not as far as I know. If ten good books are published one year, and the next ten good books and twenty bad books (by some imaginary objective standard), then I'm fine with having ten good books each year, regardless.

[Anonymous No.6083833]

>>6083821
Are book journalists like this too? I don't keep up with list thing that don't come through /lit/.

[Anonymous No.6083834]

>>6083804
Sure.
Let's them have that.
But in order to bitch about real literature they must read serious books first, and that is not going to happen.
Can you imagine those spoiled petit-bourgeois girls complaining about Pynchon being Muhsoginist, or Proust being a racist because there are no blacks on ISOLT? Of course not.

[Anonymous No.6083846]

>>6083834
>read serious books

What the hell does that even mean? Only books that /lit/ approve of?

[Anonymous No.6083847]

>>6083833
I haven't the faintest. I sure as hell aren't going to try to change them if they are. I'd rather bring a copy of The Emancipation Proclamation to Syria.

[Anonymous No.6083849]

>>6083304

They won't and never will. Attacking classic literature would push it from 'avoiding hurting people's feelings' to 'political agenda'.

There's too many historical parallels with groups of people trying to censor or burn books.

People would have pretty concrete evidence that they're trying to limit freedom of expression.

It would be absolute lunacy.

Trying to get Dracula altered because the female characters are "damsel'd" would be laughed at.

Yet I bet there are people out there who have suggested it, or have suggested banning it.

[Anonymous No.6083851]

>>6083540
I guess we'll see when we find a good one.

[Anonymous No.6083859]

>>6083849
But what if you want to write a book anon? It's not all just about the past. It's about the future!

[Anonymous No.6083860]

>>6083846
How about "books that are not exclusively for children", for instance?
You know very well what I meant. I'm tired of having this argument everyday. Fuck you.

[Anonymous No.6083865]

>>6083304
>attacks by said SJW

You mean criticisms by critics? Yeah literature has had a little of that.

[Anonymous No.6083868]

>>6083860
What books are exclusively for children?

[Anonymous No.6083879]

>>6083834
Pynchon is a huge sexists though. And he's shit. Pynchon's misogyny is well documented and that along with various other problematic aspects of his writing were brought up when his contemporaries critiqued his works, even up until his latest book.

[Anonymous No.6083881]

>>6083859

Just need to keep moving toward self-publishing as the ideal.

If major publishers only want to publish for SJWs that's fine.

When their sales drop because no one wants to read dA fan fiction, they'll pretty swiftly reconsider publishing the shit that's more on par with Game of Thrones.

[Anonymous No.6083887]

>>6083531
>implying you have visibility

[Anonymous No.6083890]

>>6083834
>girls
Check your privileges you white cis male scum!

[Anonymous No.6083894]

>>6083868
Genre fiction.

[Anonymous No.6083897]

>>6083881
Enjoy your coffee shop tour trying to sell your shitty book to hipsters and white chicks.

[Anonymous No.6083898]

They took the lesbian bits out of the Diary of Anne Frank!!!!

That was like the best part. Jewish girls are sex crazy.

[Anonymous No.6083902]

>>6083898
But muh straight little girl might become gay if they didn't! How am I suppose to tell her about being gay?

[Anonymous No.6083903]

>>6083894
Sometimes I love /lit/.

[Anonymous No.6083906]

>>6083897
These days it's more about making sure your book appeals to a very selective minority (MRA weirdos for instance) and then relentlessly buying adspace on forums/blogs they frequent.

[Anonymous No.6083911]

>>6083897
Indiegogo and Kickstarter exists.

[Anonymous No.6083921]

>>6083879
sauce?

[Anonymous No.6083947]

>>6083331
Sounds like a weasel word invented by conservatives and right wingers in order to justify their beliefs through fallacious reasoning.
>>6083304
I believe that such mass scale mobbing of members of specific underrepresented group is unique in the history of mankind.

[Anonymous No.6083963]

Will a janitor fucking delete this thread! I'm tired of seeing it on the front page!

[Anonymous No.6083968]

>>6083921
http://www.nytimes.com/books/97/05/18/reviews/pynchon-rainbow.html
>Pynchon implies that men of soul, like Roger Mexico, always waste themselves by loving treacherous beauties who sell out; there's no little sexism in this.

[Anonymous No.6083973]

Sci fi did about a decade back. 'Literature' won't be targeted because they usually only go after male majority fields, or where they're perceived to dominate: Comedy, sports, frats, gaming, computing, horror movies, comics.

Ones where they've failed have had lots of minorities already. BDSM(women enthusiasts), hip hop, porn(women get paid more). Gaming has a really diverse audience, a strong sense of identity, and has weathered moral panics before, so its not gone well for them.

[Anonymous No.6083985]

>>6083973
>Sci fi did about a decade back. 'Literature' won't be targeted because they usually only go after male majority fields, or where they're perceived to dominate: Comedy, sports, frats, gaming, computing, horror movies, comics.

Porn.

Which is like the Iran of the feminist's war on male pleasure.

[Anonymous No.6083988]

>this book does not appeal to me
Don't read it.
>this game does not appeal to me
Don't play it.

How hard is that to understand?

[Anonymous No.6084002]

>>6083985
>literature is not a male dominated field

Haha ok dude

[Anonymous No.6084003]

>haven't been on /lit/ regularly in about a year
>back then it was already starting to be more and more leftist but
>see this thread

god fucking damn, this place really did fall pretty far left of center. it was never /pol/ tier but it definitely feels different at least ITT with the amount of you faggots defending and using SJW terminology seemingly unironically, half of you apparently don't even know you're doing it

topkek

[Anonymous No.6084007]

>>6083988
Blowing my mind here, dude.

[Anonymous No.6084012]

>>6083973
It's less "muh presence" and more "muh representation" at the moment.

Videogame is still a small enough field to where it they complain loud enough, they'll get notice. As oppose to film and hip hop, which have proven that they don't care about representation as long as they get paid, which they will because they don't have a niche audience.

[Anonymous No.6084027]

>>6083903
>>6083894

[Anonymous No.6084029]

>>6083988
>don't like this book, I'll read this other book
>don't like this game, I'll play this other game... that is the same and still don't appeal to me

There are thousands of books, but only so many games, and not many appeal to that small demographic.

[Anonymous No.6084032]

>>6084027
My, that is one dapper-looking gentleman.

[Anonymous No.6084034]

>>6084002
Are you 60 years old and haven't stepped in an English department in 40, or is all your knowledge of literature from 4chan's dual hard-ons for modernism and the classics? You realize aestheticism is an edgy stance among academics now.

Literature was taken a while back my friend.

[Anonymous No.6084037]

>>6084029
Don't have a book you like go write the book you like.
Same thing, go make your game.