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/lit/ - Literature

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5737283 No.5737283 [Reply] [Original]

Why aren't there any female main characters in Tolkien's books?

>> No.5737289

What a stupid question.

>> No.5737290

Because they're about wars in a pseudo-medieval fantasy world

>> No.5737294

Tolkien was a luddite and a mysoginist.

If you read his books or his background, you'd know this.

>> No.5737295

>>5737283
god, they managed to make that ear so ugly

c: rotdert elfe

>> No.5737297
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5737297

Because an author is not obligated to make his work foolproof to unintended interpretations.

How fucking likely do you think it is that one of TLOTR's underlying themes was "women are weak"? Keep in mind that one of the most powerful beings in the books is female.

>> No.5737300

>>5737283

he realized men and women are equal, so it doesn't matter what the ratio is.

>> No.5737306

a woman literally kills the baddest motherfucker in middle earth next to sauron.

>> No.5737307

>>5737297
>Keep in mind that one of the most powerful beings in the books is female.
shelob? :3

>> No.5737321

>>5737307
>Shelob
She got her ass kicked by a hobbit, so probably not.
I was thinking Galadriel.

>> No.5737339

>>5737306
I don't remember Tom Bombadil dying in the books?

>> No.5737349

>>5737321
i'm pretty sure, if that hobbit thrust his dagger in galadriel's belly it would affect her way more than shelob...

>> No.5737434

Main female characters weren't especially abundant in Tolkein's time except as family or love interests.

>> No.5737451

>>5737349

I don't think strength is measured in stabs to the gut.

I got mugged as a kid and was stabbed in the belly, but I don't think that bumps up my power rating much.

>> No.5737458

>>5737451

i'm sorry to hear it, i didn't want to remind you that

let's reformulate it another way, by sheer physical power and endurance galadriel was nowhere near shelob and it's you (or at least anon of >>5737321) who brought the physical puissance to the account, not me

>> No.5737603

>>5737458
i don't mind being reminded of it, to be honest it did not phase me much personally although i know some people get ptsd and shit after being mugged.
sorry thats really off topic.


what i would say is that most humanid characters in LOTR are not physically strong. Nobody really has any anime powers. giant monsters can take hits and live because of their sheer size in most cases but sometimes a special weapon can take them down quickly.

Galadriel might not have the brute force of shelob, but she most likely would be able to wear the right without it really effecting her which makes her mentally one of the most powerful characters alive at that point in time. and if she and shelob got in a fight she would fuck shelob like an ordinary spider with magic.

and in the past she was part of a bunch of battles with powerful ancient characters. she has definitely seen some shit. if i remember right she was a battle commander when elves fought some angels and shit. she is probably on the same teir of mental power as sauron himself, and she can call storms and wind strong enough to destroy a castle.
she could read saurons mind while he could not read hers, and she can talk over massive distances and see the future.

shes fairly marry sue in the LOTR universe.

>> No.5737618

>>5737603
>she was a battle commander when elves fought some angels and shit. she is probably on the same teir of mental power as sauron himself, and she can call storms and wind strong enough to destroy a castle. she could read saurons mind while he could not read hers

no where in any of his books does Tolkien say any of this. Are you actually fucking retarded?

>> No.5737634

>>5737458
Do you ever get reminded of bad things on here, kitty?

>> No.5737642

>>5737618
she was a leader when the noldor fight balrogs and shit in the silmarillion

>> No.5737690

Tolkien drew heavily from his personal experiences in World War I where women were absent from the trenches.

>> No.5737862

>>5737300
underrated post

>> No.5737896

>>5737339
Bright blue his jacket is and his boots are yellow.
Fuck with him and he'll turn your bones to jello.

>> No.5737908

>>5737634
no, not really

>>5737642
shelob was a single mother, a strong powerful woman who ain't need any man

>> No.5737912

Because he was a sexist cishet shitlord.

>> No.5737920

>>5737908

shelob is a basic bitch. she cant even fuck with galadriel

>> No.5737959

>>5737283
You just haven't read all of his books.

>> No.5737968

>>5737908
7/10 keks good job kitty.

>> No.5738181
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5738181

>>>reddit
>>>tumblr

SJW scum

>> No.5738195

>>5737294
>misogynist
I don't think you know what that word means

>> No.5738222

>>5737283
Females are not main characters in real life.

>> No.5738224

>>5738222
They are today.

>> No.5738231

>>5738222
No one is.

>> No.5738233

>>5738231
We are both the characters and authors of life.

>> No.5738256

Can you imagine if Sam and Frodo were girls?

I can't imagine two girls being close friends like that much in the same way I can't imagine a new color.

>> No.5738257 [DELETED] 

Because Tolkien held views about race, class and gender that would make Mussolini blush.

>> No.5738266

>>5738256
Can you imagine two straight men?

>> No.5738274

>>5738266

>durr sam and frodo were gay

lol

>> No.5738291

>>5738181
S.H.I.E.L.D.S is horrible

>> No.5738299

lol

>> No.5738320

>>5737283
Why should there be one?

>> No.5738335

>>5738291
but the boobs are great

>> No.5738337

>>5738256
I'd read a gender-flipped LOTR

>> No.5738341

>>5737283
He's a Catholic and thereby a misogynist.

>> No.5738384

>>5737618
No, he's right. You just haven't read enough Tolkien. Galadriel was absolutely one of the most powerful beings in Middle-Earth, and it was her magic that destroyed Dol Guldur. "Galadriel with her ring cast down the walls, foul pits, crevices, caused grasses, and fruit trees to grow. The evil realm of Dol Guldur was finally destroyed. Galadriel caused an Elanor flower to grow in the middle of the old fortress. The forest was cleansed."
The Lord of the Rings, Appendix B: The Tale of Years (Chronology of the Westlands), "The Third Age"

>> No.5739393

>>5738384

Although to be fair by that point Dol Guldur was just stone, without Sauron's dark magic to sustain it even a team of human construction workers could have taken it down.

>> No.5739460
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5739460

>>5739393
Granted, but still not something most folks could do. It was held by an army led by Khamûl, the second most powerful ringwraith (next to the Witch-King), and Galadriel and Thranduil drove them back three times even before the Ring's destruction. It's hard to say how much of her power is her own, and how much came from Nenya, but the same is true of Gandalf and Elrond, who bore the other elven-rings. Certainly she is as powerful as anyone on the good team in LOTR, including Gandalf. Tolkien valued wisdom and insight more than raw power, though.

>> No.5740957

>>5739460
i'm pretty sure when tolkien said that galadriel and tranduil drove orcs from dol guldur he actually meant that it was lorien army who actually did the real work

>> No.5741036

It's like you guys missed the whole point of both Eowyn and Merry being denied the right to accompany the Rohirrim when they answered the call of Gondor.

Eowyn represents women and Merry represents minorities.

The old white guy says "Sorry, no women or non-traditional people allowed" and then they together kill the fucking witch king.

This is so straight forward, especially for Tolkien. Women and the underrepresented are necessary to move beyond the great evil.

Do people here even read books?

>>5737603
You mean so well but you're so retarded. Yes, the niece of Feanor is obviously a badass. And surviving the Helcaraxe is extremely impressive in its own right, let alone surviving through the First Age and the Second. She's clearly awesome.

But how you describe her makes her sound like some munchkin in a D&D game. Do tone, subtlety, and literal reading all mean nothing to you?

I hate you so much /lit/. You're just like my undergrad class on Tolkien when you like him: a bunch of idiots who haven't read anything or- even worse- a bunch of idiots who have but only read him because of "FUCKING DRAGONS AND MAGIC AND ELVES OMG WOW SO AMAZE".

I'm fine with people not liking Tolkien, that's ok. But if you like him please at least don't be fucking dumb. That's such a huge part of why so many people don't think he's a good writer.

>> No.5741046

Because Tolken caters to male demographics and male fantasy. Its a sexist book and you should be ashamed of you're self.

>> No.5741107

>>5741036
>t's like you guys missed the whole point of both Eowyn and Merry being denied the right to accompany the Rohirrim when they answered the call of Gondor.
>Eowyn represents women and Merry represents minorities.
>The old white guy says "Sorry, no women or non-traditional people allowed" and then they together kill the fucking witch king.
>This is so straight forward, especially for Tolkien. Women and the underrepresented are necessary to move beyond the great evil.

tolkien simply meant that it's better to risk lives of some women and minorities to make them fight the big boss to spare the real men of danger and that rohirrim were stupid for not understanding it, otherwise they would drive the whole shire and all the ugly women into the battle

much sexist

>> No.5741115

>>5740957
And I'm pretty sure that when Galadriel is involved in an ass-kicking operation, she's responsible for a fair deal of the ass-kicking efficiency.

Galadriel is one of the five or six most powerful characters if you don't count the Balrogs (along with Sauron, Gandalf, Saroumane, Elrond and perhaps Cìrdan) in Middle Earth at the time of LotR, and I'm not giving her due credit. Fëanor, the most talented elf ever and a guy who dared to challenge Morgoth (that is to say Sauron's boss) was afraid of Galadriel.

Your willingness to posture as the token non-feminist woman of /lit won't change that.

>> No.5741147

>>5741036

I was going to say, "eowyn is a female main character in lotr".

Surprised it took that long for anyone to mention it.

In fairness, she's really the only female main in lotr at least. The rest of the middle earth stuff, there's a lot of female leads.

>> No.5741223

>>5741147
she's not a main character

>> No.5741274

>>5737690
This anon is correct.