/lit/ - Literature

[a parent No.5734932]

Today is my 5month old son's pediatrician check up. The first time he got his shots, it took me by surprise how disturbed they were when I questioned it. This mentality no doubt disturbed me. Ever since his first vaccinations I have been considering the real implications presented by Foucault. I have decided I will postpone his 2nd shots until I am thoroughly convinced.

I would like to open a discussion about vaccinations as an instrument in biopower.

[Anonymous No.5734953]

explain your verbiage. this is a /lit/ board and not a fucko board specifically.

[Anonymous No.5734959]

>>5734932
>I have decided I will postpone his 2nd shots until I am thoroughly convinced.

inb4 dead child

[Anonymous No.5734968]

>>5734932
was fuckault a noted anti-vaxer tinfoiler then?

[Anonymous No.5734989]

>>5734932
Your right to question. Wrong to endanger your child, dump it in the trash and die idiot

[Anonymous No.5734996]

>doubt for institutions qua institutions and freedom of discourse are the most important legacies of western civilisation to humanity
>we can't even observe them on a daily basis

[Anonymous No.5735001]

Shots are a way that the upper-classes dumb down the lower classes by injecting developing brains with nerve damaging mercury (in the form of Thermosaul, a "preservative" in vaccinations and flu shots).

Much like how alcohol is administered in the lower castes of BNW.

Scarey, the more you know.

[Anonymous No.5735002]

>>5734932

Yeah I don't know if you're trolling or not but Foucault, I think, isn't about something like mandatory vaccination being bad. Local level stuff like that isn't his concern, just how they make sense in an overall strategy of power.

See his analysis of a plague-ridden town & how the authorities contained it. Obviously, it saved loads of lives. But his concern was how the forms of control could be taken up in new ways, how they created new subjects and new relations, not that specific instance.

[Anonymous No.5735016]

>>5734996
>>5735001
so much stupid
go back to homeopathy

[Muck Bulligan !!ryE2gEjGbpu No.5735053]

>>5734932
your concern has at best a tenuous connection to foucault's ideas. they were taken aback when you questioned their actions because you, as a parent, were assumed to understand the facts of vaccination, and your line of questioning (almost definitely) showed that you had made no effort to do so.

if the dynamic were different and you actually knew more than the distributors of the vaccine, then you'd have a case for discussion. as it stands, you're don't, and you're a moron.

[Anonymous No.5735055]

>>5735016
lol look it up free mason.

[Anonymous No.5735097]

If it's a hot-button #issue, it's guaranteed to get hostile preconceived responses by some people. Like if you had a few sincere questions about gay marriage or abortion, rather than answer them directly some people would first go out of the way to respond "politically", ensuring that either they were seen as having the enlightened opinion or that you felt guilty for supposedly not having that opinion (even though you never implied you didn't) or both.

[Anonymous No.5735103]

>>5735001
>>>/pol/
>>>/x/

[Anonymous No.5735105]

>>5734968
People will subvert any ideas to fit their narrative.
See Neitzche and the Nazis.

[Anonymous No.5735125]

>>5735055
dude i've written more stuff on other websites about this than you will ever know. it's depressing to see this same anti-intellectual paranoia dragged up here as well.

p.s. it's thiomersal (or thimerosal), halfwit

[Anonymous No.5735141]

>>5735001
>>5734996
Yeah guys, who needs vaccines!

[Anonymous No.5735144]

>>5735125
lol so mad, but y? Cus im rite?

[Anonymous No.5735148]

>>5734968
his ideas are perfectly applicable to the subject

not so much to the science itself but the response that people get for doubting it. people can be stupid for doubting, sure, but the status quo mainstream institutional stance grinding forward to ridicule people for daring to question what 'everyone knows' to be so 'obviously true' as to be 'self-evident', and doing so in the guise of willing volunteers who defend it expressly because it is the status quo mainstream institutional stance, is perfectly aidsian.

[Anonymous No.5735150]

>>5735141
Scandinavian countries manufacture vaccines with far lower mercury concentrations than some other places in the world *cough cough*.

[Anonymous No.5735151]

>>5735144
not mad. just pity you really.
and you're not "rite"

[wolfe !!0H7lwQ+D+jI No.5735161]

Watch this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lhk7-5eBCrs

[Anonymous No.5735163]

>>5735151
lol but y u mad?

[Anonymous No.5735169]

>>5734968
no

[Anonymous No.5735176]

>>5734932
Get him vaccinated

[Anonymous No.5735182]

>>5735161

Damn. Beat me to it anon.

Yeah. That.

[OP No.5735183]

>>5735148
That's right

It was his check up and then they gave him shots and I was like WTF

When I Asked about it there was this weird tension in the room. I was disturbed by how formal it was. They should give you a step by step before doing it. That's what made me postpone. Like, I have to do my own research, cuz I'm just getting sheep gazes. But if all check out ill vaccinate him. As of right now, the atmosphere around it is disturbing

[Anonymous No.5735185]

>>5734932
>Foucault
You're a fucking moron. A philosopher has no place in the context of medicine.

[Anonymous No.5735193]

>>5735185
>A philosopher has no place in the context of medicine.

pls be joking

[Anonymous No.5735200]

>>5735183
this is why I'm antinatalist
plus I'm autism virgin anyway

[Anonymous No.5735209]

>>5735161
wow trash man great discussion

[OP No.5735216]

>>5735161
?

[Anonymous No.5735229]

>>5735001
knock, or the Triumph of Medicine (1950)
louis jouvet
from jules romain

[Anonymous No.5735262]

>>5735193
No. As a general rule immunizing your children is an excellent preventative measure against their early death. Disregarding quantifiable empirical evidence because Fuckall gave you the moral wibbles is retarded.

[Anonymous No.5735275]

vaccine cause autism

[Anonymous No.5735282]

>>5735183
professionals will tell you it's always a cost/benefits question. (some will add : Duh!)
what they don't tell you (I know this from the inside) is that Big Pharma pays their studies, their adult training, their restaurants, their social life, and their sunny vacation trips.
keeps this in mind when they give you the offended look when you ask why this new expensive med rather than the reliable one.

but in the end, it will be a matter of trust (unless you become an MD yourself).
the idea is to find a Doc you can trust. Not necessarily homeopathy, but someone with a minimum edge who will inspire trust.

[Anonymous No.5735288]

>>5735185

[Anonymous No.5735299]

>>5734996
>>5735001
>>5735055
>>5735148
>>5735150
pls go

[Anonymous No.5735306]

>>5734932

I'm a med-student. People like you are hated by every single one of us. The problem when people don't take vaccines is not that they fuck themselves up, but that they affect the community's hoard immunity, thus fucking everybody up.

Take your fucking shots so we can do our fucking job.

[Anonymous No.5735309]

>>5735183
Those weren't sheep stares, those were the stares of people converting to the philosophy of eugenics.

[Anonymous No.5735322]

>>5735275
you, mr anon, are a moron

[Anonymous No.5735323]

>>5734932
enjoy your dead kid.

[Anonymous No.5735329]

what the fuck is a 'patrician check up'

[Anonymous No.5735335]

>>5735282
>the offended look when you ask why this new expensive med rather than the reliable one.
- the advantage of the brand new one is that it's not addictive.
- how do you know it's not addictive if it's brand new?

[Anonymous No.5735339]

>>5735282
which of course is why there are campaigns to introduce openness into pharmaceutical trials, such as alltrials.net

just because big pharma = bad, doesn't mean quackery = good

as this is /lit/ try reading some ben goldacre or something

[Anonymous No.5735343]

>>5735275
I suppose you would know first-hand.

[Anonymous No.5735344]

>>5735001
All of the large fish you eat (tuna and salmon mostly) have hundreds of times more mercury.

[Anonymous No.5735347]

>>5735339
try reading about corruption.

[Anonymous No.5735352]

>>5735347
you haven't heard of ben goldacre, have you?

[Anonymous No.5735363]

>>5735352
and you haven't read Jules Romain.
name-dropping 1-1.

[Anonymous No.5735370]

>>5735344
>tfw eat a can of tuna every day

[Anonymous No.5735375]

>>5735363
it's romains dude

[Anonymous No.5735381]

>>5735375
glad you looked him up.
you can actually read Knock, now.

[Anonymous No.5735383]

>>5735370
Unless you see signs of mercury poison you're fine (but you might want to tone it down a bit).

[Anonymous No.5735398]

>>5735383
What are the signs? Self-hatred?

[Anonymous No.5735400]

>>5734932

[Anonymous No.5735414]

I'm the only person in this thread who actually referenced a text by Foucault.

Jesus /lit/

This is how every thread ends up. I hate you guys so much.

[Anonymous No.5735427]

i'm surprised they don't make the flu shot mandatory or at least incentivize it more

[Anonymous No.5735441]

>>5735400
it's the best bait I've seen in /lit/

[Anonymous No.5735468]

>>5735427
Its mandatory for those who don't know better. Imagine all the lower class/uneducated who take their perfectly healthy newborns to the check up and have to go through something they hardly understand ( LET ME INJECT YOUR CHILD WITH SMALL DOSES OF DISEASE FOR THE SAKE OF DAS VOLK)

[Anonymous No.5735473]

>>5735306
Fuck you and your parents

[Anonymous No.5735484]

>>5735002
Pls more.

[Anonymous No.5735493]

biopower isn't bad. and this is only interesting if you look at it in the opposite: poor countries not having biopower to vaccinate their populations and the havoc that causes.

[Anonymous No.5735506]

>>5735427
flu shot is different. most people don't benefit from it. only old and/or vulnerable people

for most vaccines like mmr, chickenpox, diphtheria, polio etc, there is really no valid argument against them except OMG BIG FARMA R EBIL, MUH FREEDUMS etc

[Anonymous No.5735532]

>>5735398
weakness, fatigue, rashes, decreased cognitive faculties. Gooogle is your friend.

[Anonymous No.5735542]

>>5735532
>Gooogle is your friend.
nigga we snowden now

[Anonymous No.5735545]

>>5735532
those are also the symptoms of spending too long on 4chan

[Anonymous No.5735556]

>>5735306
Yeah, I doubt you're a med student.

[Muck Bulligan !!ryE2gEjGbpu No.5735561]

>>5735493
biopower is a power dynamic, not a capacity. you can have the capacity to vaccinate a population and not use biopower to do so.

[Anonymous No.5735564]

>>5735542
Believe me Google is your best, and only, friend.

[Anonymous No.5735566]

>Vaccines are harmless

http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myofasciite_%C3%A0_macrophages

[Anonymous No.5735569]

>>5735262
OP is not disregarding empirical evidence and advocating against vaccination, OP is struck by how odd it is to not be satisfied with full disclosure of what is in the needle before it is stuck in the child. Anything could be injected into his child but society is aghast that OP would have thought to question what is in vaccination.


He is not anti-vaccine, but would like to have the empirical proof actually brought up in discussion before the procedure, like reading a contract before you sign it.

[Anonymous No.5735572]

>>5735556
I doubt you're real (this is /lit/ not /sci/ right?).

[Anonymous No.5735575]

>>5735572
i think it might have been the "hoard immunity" that gave it away dude

[Anonymous No.5735582]

Vaccination in itself isn't particularly wrong, even more the vaccines that have been around since our father's times and have been working okay this far. The main issue, at least as I see it, is new vaccines as means to coerce monopolies at an international level. There is an absurd amount of money in inventing a popular vaccine and companies don't get big by thinking in ethical values before monetary.

[Anonymous No.5735627]

More importantly than vaccinations, why are you reading your 5month old Foucault? His historiographer qualities do not recommend him about starting with the Greeks, at Herodotus, as any good parent would.

Now he won't have the natural syntax of the grammar instilled alongside the plebby French you are teaching him, he's fucked for life and you might as well just ask them to inject him with pure mercury the next time, so he might find some place in the history of idiocy for his novel qualities, like Newton.

[Anonymous No.5735635]

>>5735627
What in the everliving fuck are you blabbering about?

[Anonymous No.5735637]

>>5735627
>about
*above
Apologies, my rage at this obvious child abuse overtook my prepositional competence.

[Anonymous No.5735644]

>>5734932
The fact that this is being discussed says a great deal about this board.

[Anonymous No.5735659]

>>5734932
>>5735001
>>5735055
>>5735144
>>5735275
fucking retards

I am 80% certain this is all either bait or a scheme to make poststructuralists look stupid

[Anonymous No.5735701]

>>5735183
bruh your kid can fucking die if you don't get him vaccinated.

I'm not sure if you're a troll or not though.

[Anonymous No.5735705]

>>5735506
People in the west don't get smallpox vaccines anymore you dolt.

[Anonymous No.5735716]

>>5735705
show me where it says smallpox, you dolt

[Anonymous No.5735860]

>>5735569
hopefully your kid is made retarded by whooping cough or measles and whatever is wrong with your genes ends with you

[Anonymous No.5735875]

>>5735860
Wow

[Anonymous No.5735922]

>>5735335
>vaccines are addictive
>even though they're usually only administered once

[Anonymous No.5735939]

>>5735922
No. Depending on what vaccines we are talking about, they ARE distributed for the rest of the year. Get your facts straight

[Anonymous No.5735971]

Reminds me of how Bill Maher hates religion for being 'anti-science' but is opposed to vaccines himself.

[Anonymous No.5735999]

Holy shit, is this real? Do people actually seriously argue against vaccinations? I had heard about neglecting parents, but I thought it was a rare occurrence.

Some sauce for you: http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/reference/vaccines-and-autism/

[Anonymous No.5736004]

>>5735999
Yes it's caused outbreaks of preventable disease in America.

They really do clap this hard.

[Anonymous No.5736022]

>>5735701

Do you realize how stupid a statement this is

[Anonymous No.5736086]

>>5735939
>>5735922
>usually
>USUALLY
Holy hell, read mofo.

[Anonymous No.5736202]

>>5735971
Really? Not that Bill Maher is an authority on anything, I agree with a lot of it but cmon this nigga is the Rush Limbaugh of the televised left he's militant on just about every fucking opinion of his and I'm half certain his image is more important too him than his menses soaked views

[Anonymous No.5736218]

>>5735185
LOL. This guy.

[Anonymous No.5736296]

>>5736202
He's just your average idiot, really. Except, of course, he has a tv show.

[Anonymous No.5736880]

>>5735306
this

[Anonymous No.5736956]

>>5735148
that's all well and good, but there is a line with the words fucking idiots nicely tooled into it and op jumped over it with a shiteating grin. time for op to understand how nurses and doctors might need to smile and hold their breath when they weren't trained as fucking waiters catering a party of idiots.

[Anonymous No.5737006]

>>5735306
>hoard immunity

[Anonymous No.5737031]

>>5735637
that poster was making a joke as if the child is the one who read foucalt.

>child abuse
your reading comprehension SUCKS.I guarantee he will get the vaccine for his kid, he just found it strange that they would not answer his questions and so he's being GOOD PARENT and making sure everything is kosher.
and yes, you are obviously thinking emotionally

[Anonymous No.5737164]

>>5737031
>tfw I was both those anons
>tfw I don't trust me enough to know I'm not you
I j-just w-wanted to make j-jokes at the p-paranoid people.

[Anonymouse !7tLDpBrPEk No.5737244]

>>5736956
A pediatrician who does not know how to communicate with parents is roughly as offensive as a waiter with foul body odor.

Explaining what is in a vaccination, discussing current research on said vaccination, and putting a parent at ease are all part of the job. If a doctor wants to lord their brilliance and work beyond the realm of common comprehension they should become a cardiologist.

As a previous poster said, OP is obviously going to get his kid vaccinated. He was opening a discussion about the theoretical implications of blind vaccination, and based off of the responses in this thread they are very, very valid.
> all this blind ad hominem

[Anonymous No.5737271]

>>5735053
this is the best response

[Anonymous No.5738140]

The responses in this thread are impressively stupid.

>>5734989
If he didn't consider the possibility of the vaccine being a danger, he would have nothing to question. Your post is one fat contradiction, based on the common sense that one thing is dangerous and the other is just right. "It's okay to question as long as you have nothing to question".

>>5735185
What you are saying is that there is no place to think in medicine, medical professionals as soldiers, civilians as cattle. In your argument you say "just because Foucault says so..." imagining that the discussion here has its ground on the authority of the philosopher, that is, imagining that the logic behind questioning these things is the same as the logic that lead one to accept the authority in question here. It remains as one blind argument "don't question it, it's right because it's right".

>>5735306
To question is dangerous, of course, but not to question is just as dangerous, except this last possibility is not even considered, as much as it is not considered that alternatives could be better than what we have. You should be thankful to those who question it, that's the only way to attest for quality and remind us why we do a certain thing. "Just go and let we do our job" is one miserable way to live and see the life of others.

Maybe today vaccines are just okay, but you miss the point that to blindly accept it as it is, in favour of some magical authority that medical science does not have, specially when in face of the corruption of these institutions (pharmaceutics, etc), is to choose not to check whether it will remain that way, whether its effects are desirable, whether its method is as safe as the authority of the method claims it is and so on.

[Anonymous No.5738173]

>>5738140

[Anonymous No.5738182]

The other day I went to a local burger joint for lunch. No sooner had I ordered my meal than I saw it being prepared. What kind of chemicals were they using? Why were they not discussing the possible implications and health risks of improperly cooked meat? Cancer, mad cow disease, heart disease; so many important risks beung brushed aside!

I'm amazed that they would just prepare all these things to be put into my body without my knowledge, without any discussion at all. I have postponed my next visit.

I would like to discuss burgerpower.

[Anonymous No.5738202]

You should preface this sort of thread explaining what biopolitics is or you're going to get a bunch of responses from people who don't read. To everyone else, here's a PROTIP: it doesn't matter whether vaccinations are effective, that isn't what is being discussed.

[Anonymous No.5738268]

>>5735306
Way to retard, retard. And it's *herd* immunity.

[Anonymous No.5738297]

>>5735183
It's not uncommon for them to trial medicines in vaccines, just because parents aren't usually very skeptical about what's in them. The vaccines themselves can cause allergic reactions in some cases, but the majority of the complaint, which most people don't understand, is about this practice and the sometimes fatal side effects of it. You should be wary of any waters or teas you're offered when you go for your next visit; these might have drugs in them that work to make you more suggestible. Good luck, friend.

[Anonymous No.5738366]

>>5738297
>You should be wary of any waters or teas you're offered when you go for your next visit; these might have drugs in them that work to make you more suggestible

this is the most tinfoily of all the tinfoil hat things i have ever read. even mr tinfoil, four-time winner of the world's biggest tinfoil hat competition, couldn't beat this, even on his tinfoiliest day

do you actually believe this?

[Anonymous No.5738371]

>people taking this thread seriously
im in class so i dont have access to an appropriate mocking reaction image but rest assured if i did it would be devastating

[Anonymous No.5738374]

>>5738371
>posting on 4chan in class
You're not in a position to mock anyone.

[Anonymous No.5738377]

>>5738366
>this is the most tinfoily of all the tinfoil hat things i have ever read. even mr tinfoil, four-time winner of the world's biggest tinfoil hat competition, couldn't beat this, even on his tinfoiliest day
What stupid country is to blame for this sense of humour?

[Anonymous No.5738381]

My parents were nuts who chose not to vaccinate me and my brother. I was lucky, yet the latter is dead.

Dying young from preventable disease is one of the most pointless, idiotic ways to go. The sad thing is that they still believe they've done nothing wrong.

[Anonymous No.5738382]

>>5738297
>It's not uncommon for them to trial medicines in vaccines, just because parents aren't usually very skeptical about what's in them.

yeah that's completely illegal

Here's how vaccine studies are done in children:
http://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736%2814%2961060-6/abstract

You ask the parents, assign the kids randomly to control group or vaccine group, and follow up with them over 25 months.

>You should be wary of any waters or teas you're offered when you go for your next visit; these might have drugs in them that work to make you more suggestible.
lol

[Anonymous No.5738392]

>>5738382
Congratulations on having such a close relationship with your confirmation bias. You knew your opinion before you went and looked for 'proof' of it (one random study). You've seen through our lies; you must have; you've looked at numbers.

[Anonymous No.5738398]

>>5738392
Congratulations on not listening to anonymous people on the internet, enjoy america

[Anonymous No.5738407]

>>5738398
Hi, can you make your post relevant to Foucault/literature please? Thank you.

[Anonymous No.5738421]

>>5738366
He's implying that both things are at the same level. Do you have troubles with reading comprehension or no understanding of how humor works?

[Anonymous No.5738460]

>>5735200
>vaccines for children are a hassle
>therefore antinatalism
God damn it, /lit/, I thought we'd gotten over this obsession.

[Anonymous No.5738464]

>>5738460
Antinatalism is right, though.

[Anonymous No.5738476]

>>5738460
It's the same one or two guys pushing it, that's why it seems so present at times and then no one even thinks about it.

[Anonymous No.5738478]

>>5738460
Antinatalists are this season's transhumanists. Just wait it out and they'll disappear.

[Anonymous No.5739146]

>>5738478
Maybe, but ded babby still best babby.

[Anonymous No.5739398]

>>5735306
>Wow, just trust us implicitly you fucking idiot, why would we explain anything

[Anonymous No.5739403]

>>5739398
>people trying to save my miserable life are my enemy

[Anonymous No.5739416]

>>5739403
>I have to blindly trust people who show contempt for me and openly recognize that they don't doubt doing what their superiors say for virtue of being their superiors.

[Anonymous No.5739437]

>>5739416
sorry dude, you've lost me. your shitpost is ambiguous at best. can you try that again with a bit more punctuation?

[Anonymous No.5739453]

>>5739437
just because you're a doctor doesn't mean you want the best for your patient just like a politician doesn't always want the best for their citizens. especially since doctors are notorious for giving their patients over priced or unnecessary drugs because they get fucking kick backs from drug companies. fucking disgusting.

is that such a hard concept to grasp?

[Anonymous No.5739454]

>>5739437
You are being an asshole about people wanting to udnerstand what's going on, something that's quite common among nurses and doctors in big hospitals; and your previous argument is "you should trust us because we know more" which implies that you apply the same logic to every step in the chain because they know more than you.
You're saying that you don't like me and that you don't know what you're doing, why would anyone trust anyone who says that?

[Anonymous No.5739465]

>>5739453
>>5739454
?????
i'm not a doctor or a nurse

however, you are a paranoid deluded nutjob. also, you are semi-literate at best. go catch measles and die

[Anonymous No.5739502]

>>5739465
We're very obviously two different people you massive retard. And if you're seriously suggesting doctors aren't paid my drug companies you're incredibly naive and ignorant especially since there's a huge fucking site that documents it. Also implying that politicians always want the best for their populace and aren't paid by lobbyists is also incredibly naive and ignorant.

How old are you?

[Anonymous No.5739558]

>>5735306
>med student
>hoard immunity

[Anonymous No.5741334]

>>5738374
LOL

[Anonymous No.5741374]

>>5739502
> And if you're seriously suggesting doctors aren't paid my drug companies blah whine buh huh

jesus fucking christmas. who suggested that? nobody.

but the point remains. "big pharma = bad" is not a synonym for "vaccinations = bad" or "alternative medicine = good"

[Anonymous No.5741381]

>>5738202
My lack of definition was a hopeful filtering of all those who would not talk about what you they did not understand. And that failed

Bring up bio power and people start talking about tin hats