[ 3 / biz / cgl / ck / diy / fa / ic / jp / lit / sci / vr / vt ] [ index / top / reports ] [ become a patron ] [ status ]
2023-11: Warosu is now out of extended maintenance.

/lit/ - Literature

View post   
File: 41 KB, 500x375, 0_aa361_546a98c6_L.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5723212 No.5723212 [Reply] [Original]

"A lot of guys I know will say they're not really into art. Do they play video games? They'll say yes, of course. Well guess what? That's art."

>> No.5723219

>>5723212
That's correct.

>> No.5723221

thanks franco

>> No.5723231

>>5723212
they are art like pynchon is literature

>> No.5723236

Boy James Franco is pretty.

>>5723231

nigga, this is some weak bait

>> No.5723249

>>5723212
Just because someone likes videogames doesn't mean they are into art. Maybe they just play for that 'competency' bullshit or socialising.

>> No.5723253

>>5723249
Doesn't matter. Shmups are the highest form of video game art and they're all about the competition/score.

>> No.5723263

>>5723253
Care to elaborate?

>> No.5723307

>>5723263
I think a medium is still in its artistic infancy when the games normally consider to be the most 'artistic' are the ones most heavily plot-centric. Things like Planescape: Torment, Dear Esther, etc. I'd go further into this but it's not really the point I'm addressing, just leads into the one I am.

Anyway, shmups are pure gameplay. To me, they are the video game equivalent of poetry (short form, of course). It's got this rhythmic nature to it the other genres lack. Especially because most of the stage is pre-designed it allows for more artist control. There's nothing really forcing you to dodge or even move in most other games, thus there's no real inherent rhythm (though I'd put platformers next), but in shmups you do. A good shmup has good 'movement' in the same way a good poem has good prosody.

>> No.5723313
File: 226 KB, 800x600, deus_ex_wallpaper.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5723313

Since /lit/ loves philosophy, does it also love Deus Ex?

>> No.5723315

>>5723212
Art is the dumbest word in the English language.

>> No.5723323

>>5723313
what is it about?

will run in a modern computer?

>> No.5723329

>>5723307
what is the best shmups?

>> No.5723331

>>5723307
Why do video games have such retarded development? Film didn't take this long to mature.

>> No.5723354

>>5723331
Film didn't even have sound for its first 30ish years, and widespread color for its first 40-50ish years.

It has taken nearly 100 years for filmmakers to be able to put their imaginations, to their fullest extent, on the screen. And even then, a lot of the CGI was driven by the parallel development of video games and computer developed artistry.

>> No.5723356

>>5723354
>Film didn't even have sound for its first 30ish years
And yet it still produced materpieces far mature than shooters

>> No.5723363
File: 22 KB, 473x526, 1405040306065.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5723363

Video games are art

>> No.5723364

>>5723356
videogames will never produce a piece as great as M.

>> No.5723370

>>5723329
DonDonPachi, EspGaluda, Touhou: Imperishable Night, Einhander.

>>5723331
It blows my mind that as people are trying to make games more 'serious,' they're creating these cinematic games. It's so backwards.

>>5723354
He means artistically. By the 1930 you had genius works like The Fall of the House of the Usher, A Page of Madness, Un Chien Andalou, etc.

>> No.5723376

>>5723323
It's from 2000, so it'll run on anything.

You play as an augmented government agent who discovers a conspiracy by a plutocrat to control the world using a virus and a highly advanced AI. The basic idea behind the game was "what if every modern conspiracy theory were true?"

It has some interesting philosophical dialogues in it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1b-bijO3uEw

>> No.5723383

>>5723376
>2000

Recently I tried installing Diablo, it fucking hurts my eyes.

>> No.5723385

>>5723356
Eh, I think part of that has to do with the rosy-tinted glasses with which we always look into the past. Time has a way of sifting out initial impressions and leaves us with "masterpieces" for more frequently than the present. Most great works of art are discovered, or rediscovered, rather than immediately realized.

Video game historians, or those interested in the culture, will look back with perspective and find games that had mature themes and delivered immense experiences for their time.

>> No.5723388

>>5723383
It's not as bad as Diablo but the graphics are still dated. You can watch every major conversation from the game on YT anyways.

>> No.5723389

>>5723385
You say that but I doubt there will ever be an Erich von Stroheim's Greed of video games

>> No.5723396

>painters and sculptors who want to mirror reality
>such art

>video game developers who want to make the most accurate simulation(driving, flying simulators)
>juvenile shit

>> No.5723402

>>5723370
>Tohou

casual.

Go play some ketsui.

>> No.5723408

>>5723383

diablo's from 96 man

>> No.5723409

>>5723402
CAVE shmups are my favorite, actually.

>> No.5723411

>>5723385
The problem with this is that the closest they've got is Ken Levine. And while he can write for shit he's not Paul Thomas Anderson or early Aronofsky. Games are even more interested in profit than being anything else.

>> No.5723418

>>5723376
>that dialogue

thats steam-tier level dialogue.

>>5723408
I mean Diablo 2. it was 2000.

>> No.5723421

>>5723389
In some ways there already are games that surpass that. Certainly games are longer and more immersive. They can convey great themes about things like greed. They can also render parables, like that movie.

I'm thinking of the PS1 Final Fantasy games as an example of games which dealt with complex ideas, had interesting graphics and atmospheres for their time, and were about much more than just shooting nazis and getting bitches. Those types of games exist.

Not to discredit film, but once video games reach the stage where film is, I'm sure that we'll be able to structure a similar lineage, of sorts.

>> No.5723423

>>5723331
probably because the culture and discussion surrounding video games is so stupid

people think video games have to be more like literature and movies to be art, when in fact the opposite is true- no art form realized itself by aping other artforms.

the most artful games are games like doom, quake, pac man, dodonpachi, super mario bros, etc because they use the strengths of the medium to create memorable aesthetic experiences. the problem isn't that video games are undeveloped, its that video games have been moving in the wrong direction because they want to be taken seriously, undermining what makes video games meaningful.

>> No.5723425

What a pleb.

>> No.5723426

>>5723356
>maturity is art

>> No.5723427

>>5723418
stem*

>> No.5723435

Video Games threads are ALWAYS the fastest-growing threads on the fucking LITERATURE board, and they have people spewing as much fucking BULLSHIT as they possibly can, as FAST as they can

>> No.5723441

>>5723313
I liked it. I prefer the old Black Isle games, though.

>> No.5723447

>>5723421
>I'm thinking of the PS1 Final Fantasy games
b8 b8 f8kin b8

>> No.5723449

>>5723411
Avalon>Levine

>> No.5723458

>>5723370
none of those games respects your freedom.

>> No.5723461

>>5723458
Stallman please go

>> No.5723464

>>5723449
A step up but they're both terrible

>> No.5723468
File: 863 KB, 1920x1200, nier.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5723468

>not have experience the narrative and depth of Nier

Plebs.

>> No.5723492

I wish games had less story. How can we go from games like Castlevania with the story only being explained in the booklet to interactive films like The Last of Us?

>> No.5723499

>>5723492
exactly. games are about interaction and choice, and those things are directly contradictory to a film or literature style linear narrative.

>> No.5723502

>>5723492
I don't know how does the food you eat turn into toilet turds it's a myster for the ages

>> No.5723504

>>5723468
that image is 10x megacliched in it's content and form

0/10 would not even dirty my fingers to throw into a fire

>> No.5723507

Can't stand "story" in games because of how puerile and amateur it always is
gameplay > anything else

>> No.5723511

>>5723212
it's always disappointing when you meet someone new who plays video games.

>> No.5723514

>>5723504
pleb

>> No.5723541

>>5723507
I miss the 80s. The story was always "rescue the princess": prince of persia, mario, double dragon.

>> No.5723544

>>5723541
women trope,

>> No.5723551

>>5723544
>beat the shit out of others to get pussy.

Thats why those who grow up in the 80 are so manly.

>> No.5723553

>>5723551
its thre trope against woman

>> No.5723581

>>5723544
>trope
Stop.
>>5723553
Women don't have to play it.

>> No.5723584

>>5723581
the games should't be so exclusionary towards women by trope

>> No.5723588

>>5723584
Go to bed Anita. No one cares about you anymore.

>> No.5723589

>>5723584
Women can still play it if they want. It doesn't exclude them at all.

>> No.5723590

>>5723584
>games shouldn't be realistic

>> No.5723594

>>5723588
>>5723589
>>5723590
its trope is bad and women are physically incapable of playing the bad trope video game

>> No.5723596

>>5723594
>thinking the trope is bad

>> No.5723599

>>5723584
I don't like fps games. Does my taste make those games exclusionary? Should the private developers be forced to cater to my needs?

>> No.5723606

To me, any endeavour whose main goal is to induce emotions in others is art.

>> No.5723608

>>5723606
Ok, hoe does that stack up next to the actual definition?

>> No.5723610

>>5723606
so manipulative teenagers are art

>> No.5723614

>>5723610
No because their main goal is to get something, not to incite the emotional reaction itself.

>> No.5723619

>>5723614
So not only am I an artist, but that shitposter who makes threads with my old namefag name was inspired by my works.

>> No.5723627

>>5723606
This is the lowest tier. You'll grow up someday, we all started there.

>> No.5723640

>>5723619
I'm not familiar with your trip, nor do I want to be. I'm breaking my personal policy of never responding to tripfags, but yes, trolling is a art.

>>5723627
What's you definition fggt?

>> No.5723643

>>5723385
>La Passion de Jeanne d'Arc is mainly considered great because of nostalgia value

Full Imbecile

>> No.5723649

>>5723643
I totally have nostalgia for an era in which I wasn't even alive.

>> No.5723653

>>5723643
Well, people are certainly a lot more tolerant of its flaws once they've seen the impact it has had on the history of cinema.

Yes it's well-acted and in many ways Dreyer was smart to pare down everything that wasn't a white wall.

But is it really the pinnacle of cinema? Is it really so great that it stands above anything produced in modern times? Or is it that we value the film in relation to when it was made and the ripples it sent out into the future?

Sure it's a good film, but part of that is to do with historical context. It's not a completely timeless film.

>> No.5723655

>>5723649
There' a German word for that

fedora

>> No.5723677

>>5723653
It's absolutely beautiful and moving in ways very few films today can match, dude.

>> No.5723681

>>5723212
myst

>> No.5723738

>>5723492
Yeah, there needs to be a world, people that inhabit that world, the motives, emotions, desires, hopes, and dreams of those people, and the the ability for the player to impact the world in a meaningful way.

Narrative is best left for books and movies, video games need to let the player create the story themselves.

>> No.5724015

I have the answer to this issue, but I'm not going to share it

>> No.5724026

>That's art
Hahahaha right. Art is literature, painting, and some forms of music. Everything else are branches with no weight in the world of arts.

>> No.5724029

>>5724026
Everything is art, even the anal glands of a dog.

>> No.5724032

>>5723212
HNNNG
That's one handsome man

>> No.5724040

>>5724032
Faggot

>> No.5724133

ITT: People confusing "art" with "good art".

>> No.5724142

>>5724026
shut up

>> No.5724176

The definition of art has severely weakened over the past few centuries. What the fuck do we even mean by it anymore if anything can be art? The lines just become blurred. Why refer to anything as art in the end? It just is, like everything else that was created.

>> No.5724183

>>5724176
This is tier 2.

>> No.5724202

>>5723738
>Yeah, there needs to be a world, people that inhabit that world, the motives, emotions, desires, hopes, and dreams of those people
What are NPCs

>the ability for the player to impact the world in a meaningful way
Says who? What if it's the kind of story where the individual is helpless and victim of institutions, e.g. The Wire. In Soviet Russia, world impacts you.

>> No.5724387

>>5724026
Oh yeah??? well let me give you a taste of MY art!!!

*unsheathes my twin katanas* Well, let's see how tough you really are! *jumps into the air* TAAAAKE THIIIIIIIIIIIIS *spins around and slashes your face open* Not so tough now, huh????? *grabs you and throws you up* It's time to finish this little charade *holds my katanas above my head* YOU ARE FINIIIIISHEEEEEEEED!!!!!!!!!!! *jumps upwards so that you get impaled on my swords* Heh.... easy.....

>> No.5724390

>>5724387
aND then I HOPED on Soni'cs back aND we gots to go faster!

aND tails was They're 2.

>> No.5724465

>>5724387
;^)

>> No.5724480

>>5723212
>being this upset that he's right

>> No.5724974

>>5723551
>Thats why those who grow up in the 80 are so manly.
those also listened to gay music, so?

>> No.5725236

>>5723307
what a unique perspective

>> No.5725253

>>5724133
Yes, the only way for video games to be art is if you decide that bad and stupid shit can be art. What does this say about video games?

>> No.5725258

>>5724480
>he's right
Okay.

>> No.5725274

>>5723253
Danmaku are so fucking gorgeous.

I think the reason Schmups can reach such artistic heights compared to other genres is that they are extremely stylized, nearly abstract, and mostly do away with what parasitize modern games (scenarii mostly).

>> No.5725282

>>5724480

It's technically true, but it'd be like somebody who said they were "into novels," when all they read were potboiler genre novels, while knowing nothing about reading as a practice.

Being "into art" carries with it presumptions of education that are not present in the remark "playing video games" though they do both share the presumption that you spend a significant amount of time on the thing, feel an attachment to it, so on, so forth.

You can be "into video games" in the same way, but merely playing them doesn't qualify.

>> No.5725296

>>5724133
>good art

pleb