/lit/ - Literature

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Anonymous Mon Sep 29 02:37:33 2014 No.5501976 [Reply] [Original]

Is it wrong, as a man, to wish for a great war?
I have wondered to myself if men are mean't to fight and nothing more.

That sad realization that the very essence (masculinity) is rotting away, all the while I wonder if the invention of nuclear arms fucked all of us over whilst a stalemate is concerned.

Is it wrong, as a man, to want violence?

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 02:41:07 2014 No.5501985 >>5501976 >Is it wrong to want violence? depends on your personal ethical system you're using to evaluate actions as right or wrong >as a man I don't see how gender even plays into this

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 02:42:37 2014 No.5501989 Spoken like someone who has never been involved in a war.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 02:43:05 2014 No.5501991 >>5501976 Good, then I assume it'd be your pleasure to serve in the front line or the door of the carrier.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 02:45:38 2014 No.5501993 >>5501989 >>5501991 >Implying I didn't serve three tours in Afghanistan.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 02:46:11 2014 No.5501995 >>5501993 You didn't.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 02:47:44 2014 No.5501999 >>5501976 Go join ISIS or the Kurds and enjoy your violence.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 02:47:52 2014 No.5502000 >>5501995 What did you say to me you little bitch?

Anonymous Mon Sep 29 02:48:02 2014 No.5502001

>>5501985
>I don't see how gender even plays into this
It's typically men that go to fight wars, and bring home the glory and scars afterwards.

I can understand why one would want a war, and I understand it even more with economics brought into the picture.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 02:48:08 2014 No.5502002 File: 180 KB, 628x640, IMG_2353.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>5501976 shooting someone or getting both your legs blown off are not any more or less manly than not doing either

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 02:48:13 2014 No.5502003 >>5502000 Nice trips.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 02:49:44 2014 No.5502008 File: 13 KB, 57x59, tfwkek.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>5502003 aww cool i never got trips before

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 02:50:13 2014 No.5502009 Yes

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 02:50:48 2014 No.5502011 >>5501995 I'm not gonna try to prove anything to you, man. If you don't believe me, that's fine.

Anonymous Mon Sep 29 02:51:10 2014 No.5502013

>>5501993
If you did, maybe you just enjoyed the killing and maybe you want another war so you can keep doing it. Either way, we'll never have another "Great War" like we did in WWII.

1. Technology has advanced to a point where war is fought with a push of a button. No more fighting down an opponent with your bare hands and looking them in the eye.
2. There is no great evil, no genocidal world dominating nation that wants to shit over everything they don't own. War is complicated and much of it is rooted in financial interest.
3. Nuclear war has put is in something of a global stalemate. Probably why we don't want Iran or anyone in the middle east working on nuclear power. We don't want to give them that sort of leverage.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 02:51:21 2014 No.5502014 >>5502000 he said you didn't

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 02:53:46 2014 No.5502022 >>5502013 Enjoying such things. I sometimes don't want to admit the fact that I have some lose screws.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 02:55:16 2014 No.5502024 >>5502011 noone belives you and if you didn't care then why post it in the first place

Anonymous Mon Sep 29 03:04:02 2014 No.5502055

>>5501976
People who have fucked up enough to have no stake in the world as it is desire a different world, see:

-zombie apocalypse people
-world war people
-'happening' people

Masculinity is rotting away, what kind of bullshit is that? Are you going to start whining on about Feminists?

If you want violence then go join UFC, assuming you're not a limp-wristed faggot who just dreams about something he never really wants to happen.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 03:07:55 2014 No.5502067 File: 64 KB, 500x446, 1409440158023.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>5502022 3deep5me

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 03:11:39 2014 No.5502079 >>5502013 THE ENEMY CANNOT PUSH A BUTTON IF YOU DISABLE HIS HAND

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 03:11:49 2014 No.5502082 >>5502055 >He honestly thinks masculinity isn't dying.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 03:11:53 2014 No.5502084 >>5502008 >>5502009 >>5502011 >>5502013 >>5502014 all those years passing by nothing lasts... but nothing is lost

Anonymous Mon Sep 29 03:31:07 2014 No.5502170

>>5502013
>There is no great evil, no genocidal world dominating nation that wants to shit over everything they don't own. War is complicated and much of it is rooted in financial interest.

Mate, that's always been the case. World War Two is possibly one of the few wars in history that was actually fought against a bad guy.

>>	« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » !mxvabIoSIE Mon Sep 29 03:36:39 2014 No.5502194 File: 44 KB, 450x570, Yoda-you fail.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>5501976 >Is it wrong, as a man, to wish for a great war? >Is it wrong, as a man, to want violence? Yes. As wars are not great and "masculinity" is a spook.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 03:37:35 2014 No.5502202 >>5502170 >implying there are objectively bad guys

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 03:38:53 2014 No.5502208 >>5502170 >fought against a bad guy thisiswhatamericansactuallybelieve.jpg You probably also think Americans are the good guys, right?

Anonymous Mon Sep 29 03:42:15 2014 No.5502231

>>5502202
>>5502208

Should've said "bad guys", sorry. But even thought World War Two behind the scenes was just as cynical as every other war, at least there one side was more unpleasant than the other by a noticeable margin. That's not to defend the Soviet Union, the United States or the British Empire, just to say that their opponents in this one case happened to be worse.

Anonymous Mon Sep 29 03:42:47 2014 No.5502235

>>5501976
"War is to man as argument is to philosophy."

All shitty rhetoric asside, I sincerely believe that we should strive to create a world in which wars can actually be fought without endangering the species as a whole. War is important to human evolution. Without war degeneracy of the species permiates society at every turn. Nihilism consumes us. Purpose leaves us.

It isn't masculinity that war saves, it's humanity.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 03:44:06 2014 No.5502241 >>5502170 >bad guy kek

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 03:44:46 2014 No.5502243 its always the fat virgins that glorify war because their lives are so shit they think they can get glory if they sign up for something that will chew them up and shit them out off yourself OP war is nothing but horror and suffering

Anonymous Mon Sep 29 03:45:00 2014 No.5502246
File: 152 KB, 768x1024, 1391382174039.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

Seeing as war is the chief means by which culture recovers from the illness called politics, the loss of war as an stratagem is tragic indeed.

Now we all get to watch the world rot under the tyranny of modern politics.

How badly we need another Napoleon today. But could one even succeed? I highly doubt it.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 03:45:55 2014 No.5502252 File: 327 KB, 555x557, jesus-facepalm.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>5502235 >War is important to human evolution.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 03:46:01 2014 No.5502253 >>5502194 shut up you feminist hog, you've no right to comment on the subject of masculinity

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 03:46:13 2014 No.5502254 >>5502243 Most of the people that make this thread are fat virgins, bro. Sorry to break it to you.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 03:47:14 2014 No.5502260 ITT: real life fedora neckbeards

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 03:47:44 2014 No.5502263 >>5502254 >these >threads >*aren't Jesus.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 03:48:34 2014 No.5502268 >>5502252 Are you shitting me? Is every lifeform in existence not at war with the world itself? Read some Nietzche.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 03:48:44 2014 No.5502270 File: 251 KB, 634x713, merchants.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>5502013 >War is complicated and much of it is rooted in financial interest. but that's always been true anon

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 03:49:15 2014 No.5502275 >>5502260 Why is it that whenever someone makes one of these threads they are always labeled as some fedora neckbeard? When did that meme become associated with such individuals?

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 03:50:09 2014 No.5502281 >>5502275 because you are a virgin

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 03:50:09 2014 No.5502280 >>5502254 >tfw skinny non-virgin

Anonymous Mon Sep 29 03:51:22 2014 No.5502285

>>5502275
Idk. Honestly most of these people have never been in a real fight in their whole lives. They've never had to hold themselves back from killing a man. It's just the cost of civilization that all of these men become docile and domesticated. Thinking that it's healthy.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 03:51:32 2014 No.5502286 >>5502281 Not really, but if that makes you feel better, go ahead and label me as such.

Anonymous Mon Sep 29 03:51:49 2014 No.5502290
File: 623 KB, 846x469, doublefedora.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>5502275

because this is how we argue on 4chan

try anything more intelligent around here and you're looking at a three day ban for off-topic posting

don't forget to tip your janitors it's all they get

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 03:52:55 2014 No.5502293 >>5502290 I realize this, Anon. Trust me. I don't even try anymore.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 03:53:33 2014 No.5502296 File: 147 KB, 1280x720, maxresdefault.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>5502285 >>5502286 >>5502290

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 03:54:50 2014 No.5502299 >>5502268 No, that's unscientific schlock. War isn't any more "important to evolution" than peace and cooperation. Maybe crack open a textbook instead of getting knowledge from a philosopher.

Anonymous Mon Sep 29 03:57:08 2014 No.5502308

>>5502296
You think killers are attractive in this day and age? You think I'm like this because I want to be? I think violence is an acceptable solution to some problems. Is there nothing you would die for? Nothing you would kill for? You sicken me. You are whats wrong with the world. Even mocking me and attempting to rustle my jimmes is a sign that you are a complete pussy whipped faggot.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 03:58:51 2014 No.5502316 >>5502308 war (tribal skirmishes) may have played a significant part in the evolution of man. that being said, organized industrial warfare is indiscriminate in who it kills

Anonymous Mon Sep 29 04:01:42 2014 No.5502329

>>5502299

Pretty sure we have the difficulty of organic life to thank for the sophistication of contemporary organisms.

You don't need a textbook to understand that. The chief effect of war is that it concentrates the diffuse energies of a people into a few channels and allows these to develop at phenomenal rates. Computers and the Internet were created as a result of the nuclear arms race. We can sit here and troll each other because 70 years ago the entire world was at war.

Anonymous Mon Sep 29 04:03:29 2014 No.5502337

I'm not going to lie, it isn't all that surprising that most historical leaders have been...well, men with 'militaristic-like mindsets'. It almost seems like only sociopaths are fit to lead other men. And don't fucking sit there and tell me that men like Gaius Julius and Alexander weren't fucking sociopaths, or at the very least had SOMETHING wrong with them.

Anonymous Mon Sep 29 04:03:38 2014 No.5502339

>>5502316
And I do not advocate the use of weapons that would endanger the species. I only point out that the lack of violence and war has made man soft. The modern world must change into something that enables us to become stronger. Not the pacifistic, nihilistic, shitfest which currently dominates all aspects of our lives.

Anonymous Mon Sep 29 04:07:10 2014 No.5502349

>>5502339
As much as I like peace, I hate to admit the how awesome the surge of new tech is every time we do go to war. I mean the internet was originally a military thing. Hell, even the Cold War did a lot. If we didn't hate the Russians so much, we may not have bothered going to space.

If there is anything good that comes out of war it's that when we're not fighting something bigger, we're fighting amongst ourselves. When a nation has a common enemy, they put their differences aside and collectively come up with some cool shit to use against the enemy.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 04:08:24 2014 No.5502353 >>5502339 i hadnt meant to reply to you. >>5502316 was meant for >>5502299

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 04:09:01 2014 No.5502356 >>5502329 I'm saying you have a misunderstanding of evolution and see it as a part of a narrative or something else. Evolution doesn't require anything, it is a process.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 04:09:03 2014 No.5502357 Written by someone never actually involved in real conflict a day in his life. Masculinity is more than savage killing and violence.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 04:19:48 2014 No.5502379 >>5502357 You don't know me, man, so don't assume shit about me.

Anonymous Mon Sep 29 04:23:58 2014 No.5502389
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>>5502349
I agree completly. I also enjoy the fruits of peace. As well as the fruits of past war. We live in an age of wonder where all men can be free and happy.

But this is a lie. People live in poverty for no reason at all and there is no one to blame. No one around to cast a dark eye towards.

Our world seems to have run out of enemies.

But it actually hasn't. The earth itself is dying. We've lost all biodiversity, and a wealthy elite plan for a future apocalypse that few are privy too. The war we fight now is agaist shadows, ideologys, concepts.

There will be a time when man must fight a race other than man. But for now we must turn inward and see that the real enemy are amongst those who enforce this peace.

The real enemy are those who control you from behind monitors. Those who seek to enslave you in loops of words and thoughts. Those who imprison you in chains which you cannot see, behind invisible bars.

Break free friends. Anger is a tool to be used. You must fight the condition beset upon you. The world itself is your enemy.

If Plato were alive today I believe he would ask: "Why is there no great republic? Why does everyone sit chained inside of the cave with the glory of all the achivements you've made at your backs?"

Never give up on changing this retched shithole. This world that dares to turn it's back on the greatest men who have lived.

I won't friends. I'll die fighting it. And Any of you, ANY of you, who wish for "peace", who have such conviction; step forth so I might strike you down.

Anonymous Mon Sep 29 04:25:06 2014 No.5502394

>>5502357
>Masculinity is more than savage killing and violence.

It's aggressiveness, its decisiveness, its being emotionally inert in the face of changing circumstances, all of which are an equal fit in times of peace as they are in times of war. OP is a babby.

Anonymous Mon Sep 29 04:27:20 2014 No.5502398

>>5502285
>They've never had to hold themselves back from killing a man.
Good, who'd get to such a point? Who'd even want to?

People who desire war (subsequently the loss of life, livelihood, property and other things) are either deranged or, as said, losers who are dissatisfied with their lives and find meaning in that spectacle.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 04:27:43 2014 No.5502399 >>5502379 I'll assume shit about what you very blankly state in your words, anon.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 04:34:17 2014 No.5502422 >>5501976 The short answer? Yes.

Anonymous Mon Sep 29 04:44:06 2014 No.5502453

>>5502389
You know, peace never lasts long and I'm pretty sure it has to do with the way generations forget.

The generation that fights in wars (against a great enemy, the topple of an oppressive ruling class of power) know how hard life was before revolution, how hard life was during, and how hard it was to rebuild after.

With each successive generation, people forget because they haven't lived through what their grandparents have. They may be the ones who are quicker to go to war. They may be the generation quicker to give up certain rights to a the new social elites. They forget and so we start the whole cycle of peace and war all over again each generation.

The next big war scares the shit out of me considering the kinds of weapons that exist today.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 04:55:03 2014 No.5502501 >>5501976 >Is it wrong, as a man, to want violence? No, it's the most honorable form of Being. Just make sure you want peace(not perpetual) after it. Also War is the thing that drives art into further greateness, pacifism is what makes art shit.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 05:00:57 2014 No.5502522 >>5502013 >There is no great evil, no genocidal world dominating nation that wants to shit over everything they don't own. What about the USA? They have been the evil since WW1.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 05:03:36 2014 No.5502530 >>5502453 We'll meet in battle someday anon. And we'll laugh at the "plesant" times in our lives. We will wonder why all these anons are not in that trench with us. And we will die as brothers. Godspeed.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 05:04:12 2014 No.5502531 >>5501993 You fought against an utterly inferior enemy for three tours, congratulations

>>	Piracy !!1zjmpE5cmno Mon Sep 29 05:08:24 2014 No.5502548 >>5501976 Wrong isn't right word, asinine might be better. A great war is puts the world on the precipice of nuclear war, which is practically the end of our species

kitty !kitty/EnNg Mon Sep 29 05:42:27 2014 No.5502647
File: 244 KB, 650x800, 017612f9f7577527b793a34e553d6ebd.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>5501976

>>I have wondered to myself if men are mean't to fight and nothing more

>I wonder whether the girls are mad,
>And I wonder whether they mean to kill,
>And I wonder if William Bond will die,
>For assuredly he is very ill.

Omnisexual Tyrannosaurus !!33slhp0V42i Mon Sep 29 06:01:25 2014 No.5502684

>>5501976
>Is it wrong, as a man, to want violence?
No, read Phenomenology of the Spirit. We know we exist, but violence is our way of radical empirical testing. Even when you know someone loves you, if they radically demonstrate it empirically, it makes the love more solid. With violence we affirm our distinction from the Other by obliterating it, in love we affirm our distinction from the Other by absorbing it so it ceases to be threatening to our existence. Both exercises are required to affirm Subjectivity. Without them, Subjectivity is something we can only prove to ourselves theoretically.

Omnisexual Tyrannosaurus !!33slhp0V42i Mon Sep 29 06:04:39 2014 No.5502693

>>5502684
We need to have (love) our cake (Other) and eat (hurt) it to, in order to reassure ourselves of our own existence as something other than a component of the Other. This is most practically realized by focusing the hurt outside of society, in war, so we don't end up eating the cake we have. As a community, we function as the cake to have for each other, and other communities are the cake we dine on.

Read Phenomenology of the Spirit.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 06:19:44 2014 No.5502742 >>5502389 >There will be a time when man must fight a race other than man. Yes, the great Human-Racoon war of 3056 will be our great undoing

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 10:58:23 2014 No.5503785 >>5502647 you have no place on this board

Anonymous Mon Sep 29 11:26:26 2014 No.5503877

>>5502082
>he honestly thinks masculinity didn't die multiple times through history because it's a subjective concept that changes with new technological advancements

romans would have shit on the men of renaissance, the men of renaissance would have shit on the men of the louis XIV's time etc

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 11:34:57 2014 No.5503918 >>5502231 >Soviet Union >Worse than anyone kek Good job supplying and fighting alongside a more evil power than Nazi Germany you fucking Americans.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 29 11:36:59 2014 No.5503929 >>5501976 This is common OP, and touches upon very deep things - namely, having place.

>>	kitty !kitty/EnNg Mon Sep 29 11:37:55 2014 No.5503938 >>5503918 what do you want, usa had its 70 years of anti-soviet propaganda and it actually didn't end completely too

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