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/lit/ - Literature


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5369822 No.5369822[DELETED]  [Reply] [Original]

Ok so I've heard of and read a few feminist philosophers, but what about the other side? Are there any prominent MRA philosophers?

>> No.5369826

Why would you willingly want to read something like that?

>> No.5369830

>>5369822

OP get this trash out of here it's not even worth th HHHHHNNNNNNHHHHHHGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG

>> No.5369834

>>5369826
For the same reason I go to church as an atheist.

>> No.5369835
File: 150 KB, 245x320, ego.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5369835

>Ok so I've heard of and read a few cancer philosophers, but what about the other side? Are there any prominent ebola philosophers?

STOP.

BELIEVING IN.

SPOOKS.

>> No.5369837
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5369837

>>5369822
Start with the Greeks.

0/10

>> No.5369842

>>5369822
>that hip to waist ratio
>Those tits
W-what were we talking about again?

>> No.5369844
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5369844

>>5369837
I'm looking for something a bit more contemporary.

>> No.5369850

>>5369822
that chick is fat.

>> No.5369852
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5369852

>>5369850
Low test male detected.

>> No.5369856
File: 601 KB, 500x281, Kate Upton.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5369856

>>5369844
Why? It's the same arguments they've been making since the beginning.
So what? get a more contemporary. >>>/pol/

>> No.5369871

>>5369852
i like traps, fuck off.

>> No.5369872
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5369872

>>5369856
I'm looking for less about MRA dogma and more about counter arguments for modern feminism.

>> No.5369892

>>5369872
If you're interested on classical scholarship, as opposed to philosophy, Mary Lefkowitz counters feminist interpretations of women in Greek myth, in the book "Women in Greek Myth."

>> No.5369895
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5369895

>>5369871
Because 4chan was made just to please you.

>> No.5369900

>>5369872
Literal human trash.

Your arguments should lead to your conclusions. If you need to find arguments to support your ignorant opinions, maybe that says something about said opinions and you in general.

>> No.5369901

>>5369871
a/s/l?

>> No.5369909

gonna need tissues tonight

we can't get legally in trouble for dling these pics right?

>> No.5369912 [DELETED] 
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5369912

>>5369892
I'm kinda looking for something about how modern feminism relates to Misandry and the victimhood complex. About how feminism has left it's origins of equality and now focuses on giving women special rights and exemptions in legal and social norms.

>>5369900
So because I want to be better educated about things that concern me I’m "Literal human trash?"

You sound like a mean spirited person. Maybe you should relax a bit.

>> No.5369919
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5369919

>>5369901
>>5369871
Looks like we got ourselves a looove connection

>> No.5369921
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5369921

>>5369909
Not legally, but your dick will be pretty sore for a few days.

>> No.5369928

>>5369912
>So because I want to be better educated about things
You're cherry picking to support your conclusions.
And you can find all this on google btw.

>> No.5369932

>>5369895
>>5369912
>>5369921
>what is a blue board

>> No.5369934

this is a blue board you stupid shitlord, fuck off to an MRA reddit

>> No.5369937

>>5369912
No, that isn't why you are trash. It's because you came to believe something without justifying it, and now you are asking for a formal rationalization of your laughable ideals. There isn't one, but you can always fuck off back to reddit or wherever the fuck you came from if you want to keep pretending

>> No.5369938
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5369938

>>5369928
>You're cherry picking to support your conclusions.
I'm simply looking to read about about the other side of the debate.

>>5369932
>>5369934
This is 4chan babe.

>> No.5369940
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5369940

>>5369937
You don't even know me or my "laughable ideals."

Why are you so hostile and angry?

>> No.5369941

>>5369938

blue boards are sfw boards

>> No.5369942

>>5369938
It's not a debate. There is no dialogue. No academic philosopher would ever endorse the idiotic MRA agenda. Leave.

>> No.5369944

>>5369938
Without a shred of interest in the counter.
And I pointed you there already >>>/pol/

>> No.5369948
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5369948

>>5369941
What's more Ironic than a "SFW" board on 4chan?

>>5369942
Are you really trying to imply there doesn't exist a culture of victimhood and misandry in contemporary feminism?

>>5369944
>>>/pol/ is a bunch of racist retards. If I wanted to read a echo chamber of jew conspiracies I would've posted there, but I didn't.

>> No.5369950

>>5369948
I'm not implying anything. I'm outright stating that you are a victim blaming shitlord.

>> No.5369951

>>5369948

>What's more Ironic than a "SFW" board on 4chan?

It's just the rule. Follow it or get bant.

>> No.5369955

>>5369950
He knows.

these kinds of things happen around this time Sunday, don't they?

>> No.5369958
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5369958

>>5369950
Firstly I don't even really believe you're a SRSbot you're just a bad troll, and since you don't appear to have anything intelligent to say I'll just ignore you until you do.

>> No.5369961

>>5369958
You've done a great job so far. No one here wants to hold your hand. Go away.

>> No.5369962

>>5369958
Says the ban evading troll

>Hey man. It's 4chan. Every board is /b/ on 4chan

>> No.5369963
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5369963

these posts, they taste like an MRA.

>> No.5369967

>>5369912
Don't know if I'd call it victimhood, but one of Lefkowitz's claims is that feminists portray women as passive objects that men abuse (sounds like victimhood to me), whereas she claims women in Greek myth were often praised for their intelligence and strength of character (think Penelope in the Odyssey, tricking the suitors).

Can't help you at all with modern feminism though, since I avoid it like the plague. I guess you could always read it and try to apply the same ideas to non-classical texts/thought.

>> No.5369968

>>5369822
http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/identity-politics/#4

>> No.5369972
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5369972

>>5369961
Please babe. I wouldn't want to touch that hairy grease soaked ball of lard you call your hand anyways.

>>5369967
>>5369968
Thanks.

>> No.5369976

>>5369963
this post has the feeling of a /b/tard

>> No.5369979

>>5369822
Just go to /pol/ or something. There is no prominent well respected MRA philosopher, as there is no need for one. Not to say mens rights is not too important, it is just that the only aspects that are of any importance, are already attached to ideals of feminism. The equality under law, the unreal physical expectations brought about via entertainment, etc... Maybe you should read some general gender study's.

>> No.5369983

>>5369948
What authors are you taking as contemporary feminism?

>> No.5369987

>>5369958
No, no, that's the answer to the hot girl posts, not the other way around. You're getting it all mixed up!

>> No.5369990

>>5369872

I don't think you're going to find effective counter-arguments against feminism by looking at MRA stuff. I think it's mistake to look at it as a debate between two sides, as modern feminism and MRA are sourced from the same basic premise -

"People fear what they don't know, and hate what they can't conquer"

>> No.5369991

>>5369963
>blood type gaylord
I have to admit I laughed

>> No.5369994

>>5369948
Woah woah, don't diss racism, there's nothing wrong with using race as a way to identify and avoid poor people and criminals.

>> No.5369995
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5369995

>>5369983
No author specifically just the contemporary culture generally.

>>5369987
Ok.

>>5369990
Well it doesn't have to be "MRA" per se. Just anything about misandry and feminist victimhood complex. I would just assume those to be MRA topics I just haven’t looked into it before.

>> No.5370001

He's not even serious. Let it go.

>> No.5370005

>>5369995
>No author specifically just the contemporary culture generally.
How can you make a counter argument to something as abstract as culture inside another culture?
And this poster said it: >>5369990
Most MRA claims are already inside feminism since decades ago. You should read about the subject and find your own arguments against it from your reading experience.
Although that quote at the end of the linked post is stupid, you can fear things you think you know (like, urban blacks) and you can hate things you already conquered (like, well, urban blacks)

>> No.5370007

>>5370001
We want the pictures, butter, that's the sad truth. Although the quality ahs been going down really quickly.

>> No.5370009

>>5370005

no it's a good quote ur dum

>> No.5370012
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5370012

>>5370001
Serious about what?

>>5370005
Well can you give me a few authors who deal with the topics I was talking about then so I can narrow down my search to something a bit less general than decade of literature.

>>5370007
I apologize.

>> No.5370023
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5370023

>>5370012
That one isn't a celebrity fyi

>> No.5370028

>>5370012

what happened to her leg, is she ok?

>> No.5370031

>>5370012
My friend on IRC says that a garden hose couldn't fix this trainwreck, I disagree. What does /lit/ think? Would you fuck skanky-floor cutter girl?

>> No.5370035
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5370035

>>5370023
I know it's one of the Ariana Grande fakes.

>> No.5370037

>>5370031

I'd be her friend

>> No.5370039

>>5370023
I was sure you liked large cocks.

>> No.5370046
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5370046

>>5370039
Strict vagetarian

>> No.5370047
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5370047

>>5370046
I guess we have a lot in common then.

>> No.5370048

>>5370039
Some people like big cocks AND cute girls, some people even like them together but that's another story.

>> No.5370055

David Benatar

>> No.5370073
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5370073

>>5370055
>David Benatar
Thank you. I'll try to get ahold of his book.

>> No.5370081

>>5369940

this one is disgustin

>> No.5370086

>>5369822


mras and feminists are mostly the same insofar as they are both equalitarian scum. what youre looking for are elitist writers of one stripe or another.

>> No.5370106

>>5369834
>tfw I started really enjoying mass and feeling happier after it
>tfw my atheist side is losing the battle

>> No.5370132

>misogynistic philosophers
Pretty much every single major one in human history

>philosophers of misogyny
Weininger. If you're counting polemical stuff, Schopenhauer.

>philosophers of dissident feminism, feminism other than entitlement/persecution feminism, etc.
Simone de Beauvoir (mostly), Camille Paglia, Mary Wollstonecraft, Esther Vilar, Norah Vincent, Roy Baumeister

>specifically MRA stuff
Warren Farrell, Marc Rudov, Christina Hoff Sommers, Baumeister again

>> No.5370144

>>5369972
>babe
A-are yuo a grill?

>> No.5370146

>>5370144
put your dick away, champ, it's a gay dude.

>> No.5370150

>>5369912
Christina Hoff Sommers
not MRA but a definite critic of modern feminism

>> No.5370157

>>5370146
>Implying I couldn't shave it, put it in lingerie and pretend otherwise.
Please kid, remember where we are.

>> No.5370173
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5370173

>>5370150
Thanks, anything specific by her you recommend?

>>5370132
I'm not looking for misogynistic writings. I'm looking for misandronistic.

>> No.5370174
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5370174

>>5370047

I don't understand the context of this one. Why is Selena wearing that see through one piece thing outside and with some other girl around? Is it some private backyard where they (erroneously) thought they wouldn't be observed? Why can't I have fun libertine experiences with gorgeous starlets?

What books should I read to become a ferocious alpha male who flings his seed into the womb of the world?

Which philosopher to get the clothes off her?

>> No.5370176

>>5369948
>contemporary feminism

Whenever I hear people use reductive terms like "contemporary feminism," I know that they know nothing of feminism.

Seriously, sometimes I read people type things like "original feminism was like X but modern feminism is like Y."

Yes, because there are two strains of feminism: old and modern.

Anyway, I have a feminist text question, as well.

I'm a feminist, but base my political stance mostly on sociological journal articles I read on various metrics where gender disparity exists.

I don't tend to read feminist texts, because I feel like they don't tend to be very empirical, and are almost uniformly unfalsifiable sentiments and indignations, rather than data. I haven't read their books, but any excerpts or interviews with Dworkin or Mackinnon I've come across seem to pretty much be drivel. I'm more open to reading The Second Sex (though I'm not familiar enough with Existentialism to know if I'll have the context to appreciate it) and The Feminine Mystique, but being older texts, they seem more like they are more useful for understanding the history of the movement than current issues.

Anybody have any recs?

>> No.5370183

Donna Hoff Sommers

Equity Feminism is the only viable feminism.

>> No.5370187
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5370187

>>5370174
No books for that. It's called good looks and wealth.

>>5370176
>Whenever I hear people use reductive terms like "contemporary feminism," I know that they know nothing of feminism.
>I don't tend to read feminist texts, because I feel like they don't tend to be very empirical, and are almost uniformly unfalsifiable sentiments and indignations, rather than data. I haven't read their books,

>I haven't read their books,
>I haven't read their books,
>I haven't read their books,

So fuck off? If you don't know shit about feminism why are you critiquing me for saying "contemporary feminism" you hypocritical shitlord.

>> No.5370199

>>5369835
Stirner's philosophy is the ultimate spook. A super-spook, if you will.

>> No.5370242

>>5370199
Fuck you spook supporter.

>> No.5370294

>>5370183
I think you mean "Christina Hoff Summers."

And I disagree, those like her and Cathy Young co-opt the term "feminism" while mostly defending the status quo.

They promote this very attractive (which is probably why it is so popular) conception of "equality" that focuses squarely on de jure political equality, ignoring all the sociological forces that contribute to inequality, and attacking any attempt to address these as being contrary to equality. Of course, I don't think it's malicious, as it's probably motivated by a naive belief in the realization of equality through the absence of legal barriers.

It's the same thing as the American bootstrap myth. "If you're poor, it's your fault; nobody else did it to you; everybody has an equal shot." "Women can vote and work now, so any gender-based inequalities that are pointed out are imaginary products of a victim complex, and any attempt to correct them is against liberal values."

We have a propensity to take our present conditions for granted as natural, non-biased, and the "default." If there are more men in positions of authority and power than women, that's just how the coin landed, not the product of sociological forces that can be changed; Any attempt to change this fact is in itself non-egalitarian and biased.

>> No.5370297

>>5370294
lol, yeah I started thinking of Donna Summers I guess.

>> No.5370299

>>5370242
If it pleases me to believe in spooks, I will believe in what I wish. I am free to do so.

You show an awful amount of concern for whether other people believe in the "correct" philosophy. Is this concern for other people's beliefs motivated by-- altruism?

>> No.5370313

>>5370187
>I haven't read their books

I haven't read the original texts, but I've read plenty enough secondary texts to know the history of the movement, and the waves and the strains and a broad overview of the diversity of philosophies under the banner.

I know enough to have recognized that you are understudied.

I know enough to critique you.

>> No.5370315

>>5370294
I doubt you've listened to or read Christina Hoff Summers if that is what you get out from her.

Sure she is on the liberal side of the feminism (European liberalism) but what she's saying is that Third wave feminism is built on a flawed perception of the world with misconstrued statistics to support their work, and she goes on to show that some things like the wage gender gap can be logically understood if you break down the numbers. And that the wage gap isn't nearly as bad as it is believed, and that the systematic changes isn't really about forced affirmative action, instead girls need to pick educations that will lead to high positions - like civil engineering, chemistry, biology, computer science.

>> No.5370321

>>5370299
Some people can fool themselves into believing in things they know aren't real, but they should be mindful of the spooks they play with.

You use the word "altruism" like it's a bad thing. In this world. Heh.

>> No.5370329

>>5370321
Actually believing in altruism.

>> No.5370342
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5370342

>>5370329
And what spooks where you defending just then?

>> No.5370387

>>5370299
The only way spooks can ever be pleasing to believe in is as a mechanism of sour grapes/sweet gruel.

>> No.5370432

so, jennifer lawrence looks amazing naked

what a surprise

>> No.5370464

>>5370242
Sorry, but Marx already covered this. Go read it. Stirner's philosophy does not do away with spooks, it instead creates a super-spook.

>> No.5370476

>>5369830
hehehe

>> No.5370517
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5370517

You will never ever know what it feels like to be loved. Maybe one day you will have the money to visit a prostitute and lose your virginity but it will feel unnatural, emotionally cold and disappointing. You will never ever have a woman other than your mom who respects or accepts you. Now go back to jerking off to your huge porn collection. You are disabled, handicapped, abnormal and society would benefit from your suicide.

>> No.5370521

>>5370517
Jokes on you. I already lost my virginity to a prostitute, which was fun, because I had to piss before, so I walked through the brothel without a shirt and all the other hookers whistled at me, after I was done with mine, I sat at the bar, she came over, kissed me on the cheek and offered me a drink. It wasn't awkward or cold at all. It was fun.

>> No.5370531

Please tell me the tumblr-esque replies in this thread are just people trolling the OP for his shitty thread.

>> No.5370533
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5370533

>>5370517
Why are feminist so hostile to different opinions?

>> No.5370541

>>5370521
>because I had to piss before
Wait... how does this lead to being topless in a brothel?

>> No.5370542

>>5370035
Is this a trap? Please don't be, pleasepleasepleasepleasepleasepleasepleasepleasepleasepleasepleasepleasepleasepleasepleasepleasepleasepleasepleasepleaseplease

>> No.5370543

>>5370533
Why are virgins so whiny? Why do they spend their time making resentful threads on 4chan instead of getting laid?

>> No.5370545
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5370545

>>5370543
I lost my virginity when I was 12.

What part about my post have been "resentful?"

>> No.5370551

>>5370545
Sure you have. Keep lying on the internet. And keep posting porn. It makes your virginal lies so much more believable lol. How socially retarded are you?

>> No.5370554
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5370554

>>5370551
So what part about my post is resentful?

>> No.5370558

This is a SFW

why are you posting this

>> No.5370562
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5370562

>>5370558
So you can fap while working?

>> No.5370563

>>5370558
Because he's mentally ill.

>> No.5370565

>>5370562
i dont to fap to still images this isnt the 90s

>> No.5370566

Typical femiNAZI response to a genuine criticism:
>Y CANT U GET LAID U WHINY VIRGIN LELEELLEEL XDXD

And you still expect normal and rational people to take your movement seriously? Lol.

>> No.5370572

>>5370566
>implying there are girls here

>> No.5370573
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5370573

>>5370565
But this way you get to be intellectual. You get to use your imagination.

>> No.5370577

>>5370573
This isn't a painting son its a shitty cellphone picture of 7/10 bodies

>> No.5370578

>>5370566
Hello, my dear redditor. Welcome to 4chan. We do not respect your whiny virgin feelings. If you show insecurities here, you will be mocked relentlessly. Wipe up your tears and go back to your hugbox.

>> No.5370579
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5370579

>>5370572
There are 2. Well at least they say they are.
You are right. They are probabbly dudes.

>> No.5370581
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5370581

>>5370577
Are these better then?

>> No.5370583

>>5369871
Fuck off fag

>> No.5370585

>>5370541
Toilet was on the other side of the building.

>> No.5370587

>>5370578
>virgin shaming
>2014

>> No.5370592

>>5370587
Too close to home? Are you having flashbacks of all the rejections?

>> No.5370594
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5370594

>>5370578
That's Ironic.

>> No.5370595
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5370595

>>5370577
My standards are lower. Virginal problems.
But you are right, I was just randomly shitposting and trying to make a sense of his NSFWing.

>> No.5370597

>>5370578
The OP should go back to reddit.
And you should go back to tumblr.

>> No.5370599
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5370599

>>5370035
Is this a trap? Someone tell me plox

>> No.5370601
File: 48 KB, 469x463, Those+are+some+good+maymays+friend+_6f67e31c52471863af16582fedf6cfa2[1].jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5370601

>>5370592
It's the female equivalent of pic related. It adds nothing to the conversation and is only used as a device to get out of a losing argument.

>> No.5370603

>>5370601
So many projections in your post.

>> No.5370605

>>5370601
Complaining about virgin shaming is the MRA equivalent to complaining about slut shaming. He just called you male equivalent of a slut in terms of a put down, and you're whining about him "shaming" you.

>> No.5370618

>>5370605
I don't care about the insult as much as I care about the usage of it. It is used in the same way that u mad bro? or *tips fedora* is used.

>> No.5370626
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5370626

>>5370599
Idk. I don't think so though. Looking at the jaw structure and shoulder width I'd say no.

>>5370597
When did feminist critique become something that wasn't inherent to 4chan? Are you new here?

>> No.5370642

>>5369822
>>5369822
sauce?

>> No.5370650

>>5370626
The whole "tfw no gf" cancer and the constant whining about women came here from reddit. It was never inherent part of 4chan and we don't want it here. We used to be the elite of the internet. Remember when Anonymous was legion? Of course you don't because you're a newfag.

>> No.5370651

>>5370626
Thank God.

>> No.5370653

>>5370650
I'm not sure if you are serious. But >tfw did not come from Reddit.

>> No.5370664

>>5370626
That is Monroe right? I wish she could have done hardcore. However that anal fingering was pretty god damn HNG.

>> No.5370665

>>5370626
When did virgin shaming or griefing and trolling become something that wasn't inherent to 4chan? Remember where you are, reddit scum. We are not your "muh feelings" hugbox.

>> No.5370670
File: 7 KB, 175x250, lemad.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5370670

>>5370650
So I suppose it's safe to assume /lit/ has some of the lowest quality trolls on 4chan then.

>> No.5370677

>>5370670
Even the lowest quality trolls are more 4chan than whiny neckbeards crying over their lack of gf. Go back to reddit.

>> No.5370678

>>5370626
It's not so much an issue of "feminist critique," but MRA shit is typical reddit.

>> No.5370691

>>5369900
Is this facetious? It better be.

>> No.5370692

>>5370626
You know pretty well that so called "feminism critique" is just an excuse for no-life /r9k/ neckbeards to circlejerk over their bitterness and virginity in a disgusting display of hatred for women in general.

>> No.5370698

>>5370321
FFS I knew something was up and I just figured it out.
That faggot Feminister is using flutterfly's name after he was revealed to be a guy and ridiculed.
Fuck off

>> No.5370705

>>5370650
>The whole "tfw no gf" cancer and the constant whining about women came here from reddit

I got infected with Ebola because of the immense amount of newfaggotry in this post.

>> No.5370709
File: 471 KB, 540x960, 1407351297774.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5370709

There is no such thing as "MRA philosophy". It's just an endless circular repetition of "I hate women because I'm bitter because I never had a girlfriend and my hatred for women makes it impossible to find a relationship." Since there is no medical label for this condition yet, I'll give it the name "cancerous personality disorder" because just like cancer it is uncurable and can only get worse. We could almost pity these poor creatures who are doomed to a life in solitude and mental suffering, but then again it's hard to feel compassion for someone whose only activity consists of making himself look despicable and worthy of contempt.

>> No.5370712

>>5370709
>implying

>> No.5370779
File: 29 KB, 313x500, ALFA SHIT.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5370779

>>5370174
This is the equivalent of the Bible for Alpha males.

#LadsOnTour #TopBanter #Maleism

>> No.5370800

Only the extreme forms of Feminism take a "side", all of the reasonable ones argue for both genders.

I'm sick of people saying shit like "I'm not a feminsit because I'm for both genders!" or "Well what about the menz!!?"