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/lit/ - Literature

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5278389 No.5278389[DELETED]  [Reply] [Original]

>tfw it's a day when you can get some nice reading time in but you're too depressed to even read

tell me some other bros are dealing with this silly bullshit

>> No.5278394

I dealt with that all the time until glorious Prozac.

>> No.5278408

>>5278389
i know how you feel, there are days when i go to work on autopilot and come home and just lay in bed until i sleep. depression in a bitch man. thought about ending it a couple times, i tried when i was 19 but couldn't man up enough to pull the trigger.

>> No.5278427

Depression is silly, and it took me 8 years of being morbidly suicidal to really see it. Depression, is a horrendously silly thing. It's irate to think that a brain that's sole purpose is to survive, though any means necessary, for as long as possible can be warped to thinking about ending its own existence every waking hour of the day. To do absolutely everything possible to ensure it's own demise. That it, even after all these years of development, it is still susceptible to suicide, to depression, to a live that makes one physically and mentally ill. I just drink a lot. I'm drinking now. And I write some, nothing serious, come on now you know that I am way to goddamn miserable to believe my horseshit would ever see the light of day, or the artificial light of a bookstore. But I write because it empties my head. I can tell you that I deal with the reality that I have been convinced by a malfunction in neurotransmitters that attempting anything in life is meaningful, worthwhile, because I have never once in my life ever felt any motivation, for as far back as I can remember. None that was decided upon by myself that is. I can remember when I was a kid and I would play in the kids football league, and play in the kids baseball league, and I never had a shred of fear or social anxiety or any fear that I could do anything wrong, and for a kid I was really goddamn good, it's the only thing I have ever been convinced I was really good at and felt pride for and was in pure confidence that I was good at it, as did all the coaches and blah blah and they said "he's going to be a prodigy in high school", ya know. I was just a kid, but I was a good kid at baseball and football. Puberty was not kind to me. I grew to a ripe old height of 5'9, destroying my knees in the process because every bit of my growth was done in one quick spurt, and the most I weighed was in my senior year of High School two years ago, 165lb's. I now weigh 146lb due to a horrendous diet of one meal a day (if a couple Chicken Banquet tv dinners count as a meal), a few snacks throughout, a job that keeps me on my feet for 30 hours a week, and the inability to drink anything but water and coffee and Jameson. As far back as I can really begin to remember my adolescence, I have never really been happy or motivated. Once I hit 13 all the troubles started. Not to mention my family life is one that creates sociopaths, but we will ignore that for the time being. I don't know what it is like as a young adult to be motivated, to be happy, to be cheerful, or to be successful. I hate every moment of every day, and I think if I knew I couldn't end my life at any moment that maybe I would consider this existence hell, but I can quit at anytime, and eventually, it will happen. I will kill myself, I just don't know when. I have no answers for you, simply a connection. We both sit at the bottom of the well, and maybe our echoes from our whispers can reach one another.

>> No.5278431

>>5278427
I just read the comment above mine, specifically
>there are days i got t work on autopilot

This, I must comment on. I find it utterly depressing that I go to work and only realize where I am and what I am doing halfway through the day. All of a sudden it hits me, 'I'm at work'. Sure, some people might say, 'Shit man, I wish work was like that for me, half the damn day gone", but it's not a good thing. It's horrible, really.

>> No.5278433
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5278433

I am currently experiencing this sensation anonymous sibling

>> No.5278460

>>5278427
This post makes me want to cry. I'm >>5278394 and I stopped taking my meds a month ago. It always scares me half to death to be reminded of how fucking bad it was before. I wasn't a happy child but the depression hit when I turned 14. I denied it for a long time and didn't tell anyone. I had legal troubles for truancy because I couldn't get out of bed for weeks at a time. Got court-ordered counselling that I lied my way out of. Fooling everyone was way too fucking easy and people close to me still bitch that I never told them. But it was so painfully obvious. I cried so much. I couldn't be around people. I grew my hair really long and had it cover my face whenever I went out. I didn't want anyone to see how hideous and worthless I am. I fantasized about gutting myself like a fish or slitting my throat just to make it through basic human interaction. One summer vacation i didn't set foot outside or bathe for three months. I finally attempted suicide via overdose at 18. Officially dropped out of HS after I got out of the psych hospital. Got a job. Steadily upped my Prozac from 20 to 40 to 60 mg and then added 150 mg of Wellutrin 'tip I could make it through a work week without sobbing in the back room. Meds killed my inspiration and whatever lust for life did keep me alive for so long. I slit my wrist and got stitches six months ago. I drink a lot. The beast is still there, slobbering self-loathing all over me, but pharmaceuticals have ripped all his teeth out.

>> No.5278467

>>5278427
>>5278460

if its any consolation it makes for pretty interesting writing

>> No.5278469

Life sucks man. indifference is at the heart of humankind

get used to it.

>> No.5278479

>>5278467
It is the only consolation. I stopped taking the meds so I can fucking write again.

>> No.5278483

>>5278479

surprised it would have that much influence. SSRIs? or Benzos?


also what do you write?

>> No.5278487

>>5278389
>go to coffee shop
>get a sizable amount of revision work done for one essay
>read a large chunk of Sublime object of ideology for other essay
>even get some personal reading finished
>go home, make myself a nice dinner
>hear that Robin Williams offed himself
>decide to get drunk so I don't have to think about suicide, or that I still sometimes want to kill myself too
>sober up
>realize I drank way too much coffee today and can't sleep
>jerk off repeatedly because what else can I do?
>tfw

>> No.5278490

Sunday morning I finally fall asleep around six thirty. I'm woken up around eight for church. After church and lunch I nap from two till five, I fall back asleep at ten thirty and wake up around twelve thirty in the morning and didn't get to sleep till I finished working all day yesterday.
I fell asleep at six and I woke up around eleven thirty and I have to leave for work in about two and a half hours.
I'm not reading because I don't want to get invested in anything when I'm trying to make myself be tired so I can fall asleep. So I just sit on 4chan trying to get to the point where I can go to bed but it looks like that's not happening again tonight.
I feel dead inside.

>> No.5278505

>>5278460
They put me on meds when I was 15. I later attempted suicide, OD'd, or attempted to on Vicodin, took too many and woke up in my own vomit. Parents were on vacation, I woke up feeling as if I had a years worth of hangovers sitting in que and they all got released that afternoon. I was put on Zoloft though. Went to a therapist, real nice lady, I liked her a lot. She chose the right job to say the least. I have this pathetic defense mechanism, which actually comes in handy sometimes, that I'm sure many many many many people have where I laugh in uncomfortable situations, or after I see something really horrifying, etc etc. I felt numb, man. And I was on them until I was eighteen. I met a girl, real nice when I was fifteen, real pretty, fell in love with her, teenage love you know, like you just look at them one day and everything around you just looks and feels different, the same scale as the first time you smoke weed and it hits you and you're just like 'this is weird', but not anywhere near the same feeling obviously, and the pills absolutely ruined that. I just wasn't there on the outside, inside sure thing, but as far as how I expressed myself and projected it I came across as a statue that just got dragged around. Eighteen, I dropped the meds after I ruined it with the girl. Went through the brain shocks, the crazy emotional shit, whatever, got off them, wasn't down with taking pills anymore. Feeling numb made me feel worse than fantasizing about the day I'll finally wake up and feel all that weight lift off my shoulders as I confidently begin to kill myself. To anyone else reading this shit, I'm not looking for sympathy, I don't fucking want your sympathy, and I don't ever complain about this shit, this is just who I am, what I have become, just throwing it out there neutral. It is what it is, fuck it. This is not meant to be a sob story. Regardless, I hid it pretty well until the physical portion as I aged began to really kick in. Sunken in eyes, the bags under the eyes, the dark circles, the pale face, the effects of years of terrible posture, bad immune system therefore being sick a lot and having that do a number on your physical physique.

>>5278467
That it does...writing I actually enjoy reading back to myself and overall feel rather...I guess good about. I know it's shit, but I like my shit so...there is that.

>>5278469
Not really what we are talking about here, but yeah. We are used to it. Sometimes it just helps to know someone else is used to it too.

>>5278479
be careful. Suicide actually isn't that big of a worry when coming off meds unless you develop really manic and really depressive stages, but if you just slowly go back to feeling miserable and shit, you're too depressed to even try to kill yourself, honestly. The biggest fear of suicide is when a depressive slowly becomes ugh...better or in the case of still being ill, manic.

>> No.5278508

>>5278483
SSRI and Wellbutrin is some weird other class of anti-depressant. I feel nothing on them. Muffled hatred for myself and very rarely a spark of compassion for others. The intensity of my suffering made for a great intensity of hope, love, inspiration, etc. I write poetry. Haven't in over 9 months. It hurts. Why live if I am unable to do the one thing I know I am alive to do? I live for that passion. It has two sides to it and it is fucking worth it if I could just manage not to be a pussy and off myself.

Meds was a choice of survival over living. No point to working and going to school and being social if my life is going to be empty. I need to find a balance.

>> No.5278519

I throw myself into reading philosophy and theology but when I take the time to really look into myself and see the endless posturing that I do in threads on this board as if I know what I'm talking about the truth is that I don't feel connected with anything.

Not a single thing.

I want to so badly. But I just feel empty.

>> No.5278521

>>5278490
What I hate is when I feel tired all day, can't get anything done without nearly falling asleep, fighting it for 11 hours, finally falling asleep, sleep for 13 hours, wake up, and still never actually wake up and still feel near falling asleep all goddamn day long, or night, whatever my sleep schedule happens to fall upon.

>> No.5278524

>>5278519
I tell you what, if there was a way to meet up with the /lit/izens at a fucking coffee shop a few times a week, goddamn I'd be one happy mother fucker. I just don't have anyone to sit around and talk to like this, I have great friends, friends I consider family closer than my real family, but we are all so very different. I have no one to talk with about books and shit, or any real meaningful intellectual (get off my back) topic. But even with what I have, I still don't really feel 'connected' to anything on a personal level. I feel connected, through a bond of sorts, but not in anyway that just doesn't feel like I had a strand of me throwing out there and it just stuck to the most common stickiest thing out there and I'm holding on. I wasn't drawn to it, I just happened to walk by, ya know?

>> No.5278527
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5278527

>>5278521
I hate my fucked up sleep schedule.
The ride never ends.

>> No.5278530
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5278530

this thread is heavy shit. damn.

>> No.5278537

>>5278519
>I throw myself into reading philosophy and theology but when I take the time to really look into myself
What happens to me is that I realize I'm just avoiding my issues by reading. I sometimes even start to read something specifically to get me out of nihilism, but then I just slowly drift into reading it in a too non-personal way, trying to abstract some general theory from it or move to related but more theoretical (i.e. disconnected) books.

>> No.5278547

>have fucked up family life
>heinously depressed for a long time
>around the time I start taking copious amounts of psychedelic drugs, I learn how to look beyond myself and my misery and see that there is a world I could help instead
>Suddenly I care about life and becoming a successful writer
>it's going alright and I have drive and purpose
>psychedelics appear to have mostly cured my depression, or at least done something to it, like helped me see it in an artistic light and less important than my goals
>previously highly anxious and awkward I am now much more outgoing, I speak well, I am open, and I am happy

History's gonna remember me as a case study testifying to the incredible power of shrooms and acid and other stuff

If you're morbidly depressed I suggest you try them

>> No.5278551

>>5278527
If you don't have a part time job, get one, if you can that is within your ability at the moment. It will give you days where you can wake up at a decent time, get something done, get a little money, and come home feeling tired. Yeah yeah, I hate the idea of slaving my life away to a shit tier job for a piece of shit cotton note that only has worth because we are told it is and live in a collective reality where this shit is worth our time and health and shit, but hey, part time jobs really aren't that lousy if you get one that isn't in the field you absolutely hate. Mine was working in food, can't do it, can't stand it, totally respect those who can.

>> No.5278556

>>5278547
>>5278460 here. I have 5 hits of acid in my room and you just made me a little more excited to try it.

>> No.5278558

>>5278547
Shrooms were great, in a small dose that didn't give me any real real deep insight. On a small dose they were FUCKING AWESOME. Lots of laughs, I was good enough to drive and me and buddy just drove through some country back roads on a perfect day and there is some beautiful fucking scenery and I had a killer goddamn time. But when I did acid, and a high dose of shrooms, my inner self really comes out, and I think about all the bad things, regardless of where I am or what I am doing ,and I just want it to be over. Very haunting experiences, man.

>> No.5278565

>>5278505
So, I'm the post ending in 69.

Here's a story I'd like to share:

last week I was riding the bus home. I had just come back from a day trip to the beach with some friends, nice folks. At the end, one of my friends told me "We love you, anon". It was sweet, and made me feel good, particularly because I didn't really know that this one friend felt this way. It was just a nice way to end that day, to hear this friend tell me that they cared for me.

So I'm sitting on the bus, and I'm beginning to wonder if I'm going to miss my transfer when I arrive. It was the last of the night. So I said something about this to another passenger, that it was on my mind. The driver heard this and reassured me that he would radio the station. They would try to hold the other driver. This was a huge weight lifted off of my shoulders. Me and a few other people were needing that transfer to get home.

one of the other people on the bus was this one chick with a noticeably ugly face, massive cleavage, and tattoos on her ankles on wrist. She was staring in a pocket mirror for much of the night, while writing shit on her phone. Out of nowhere, she suddenly piped up, and said, while looking at me and this one guy, a harmless, morbidly overweight guy I had seen before, "Well, I could get someone to pick me up, but if you miss that transfer, you guys are screwed."

I didn't know this cuntbag from eve, and she made this comment about me and some other guy she doesn't know.

I had had a really nice day, and this rat faced piece of shit wanted to ruin it.

Anyways we all made the transfer.

As I finally got off at my stop, to walk home, I first turned to the driver to say "thank you". Then I slowly turned to that cuntbag piece of shit, smirked and said "Have a nice night, class act" while staring directly at her exposed tits.

This is basically what the human condition amounts to

>> No.5278568

>>5278551
I'd love to have a part time job but I have some debts I owe my parents and I need to save enough money to be able to move out of my parents house within the next year or so since I'm turning twenty in less than a week and I gotta be out by the time I'm twenty one.
So for right now I'm working full time for a college textbook rental company in a big warehouse for decent pay and it's boring as hell.

>> No.5278582

>>5278556

Good luck friend. I hope it helps you out in some way. Do your best to spend at least some of the trip outside and some of it inside in total dark. And listen to some good tunes

It's not for everyone but try reading on it too. I love it

>>5278558

I've had my share of bad trips too man. They really are like hell is on earth. But I think there is a silver lining to each one, and they seem to branch off into two types. In one kind of bad trip, in which I am overwhelmed by negative repressed memories and intensified recent ones, wherein shame and paranoia, for example, become inescapable and everywhere, but because of the way I spend the trip and the not super high dose that is facilitating it I don't really get to the core of it all and make some sense of it, then the trip ends and although I feel similar to how I was before it, I can't breathe properly, almost as though what emerged on the trip is caught in my chest, waiting to be dealt with. The silver lining for these trips is the knowledge that there is something I must devote myself tod figuring out.

In the other kind of bad trip I've had enough to be so incapacitated by its sheer horror that I can do nothing but lie down and ride it out, and motherfuckers there is no more harrowing experience. The silver lining of these trips is in the aftermath, when you come down again and the comfort and simplicity of the limited reality of sober life reasserts itself. I tend to realise because of these trips that things aren't so bad after all.

>> No.5278583

>tfw I've been stuck in a bad spell of depression for a while and too paralysed with anxiety to even talk to my friends on the internet
>never go to anything they invite me to
>they all probably think I'm an arrogant asshole
>I love them all dearly

it's a normal sort of feel

>> No.5278596

>>5278568
Well, the whole getting out the house thing is cliche, but sometimes some platitudes help, and that one does sometimes.

>> No.5278597

>>5278583
Indubitably

>> No.5278599

>>5278583
>too paralysed with anxiety to even talk to my friends on the internet
I have so much social anxiety that I can only post on 4chan when it comes to the internet. I just dislike everything that has to do with me having an identity, it feels like a mechanism for judgment, shame, guilt, etc...

>> No.5278609

>>5278596

Yeah, I'm hoping leaving will help get some of my shit straight, I don't know though. This is the only house I've ever lived in and I was even homeschooled here so it's going to be a pretty big deal for me once I do leave.

>> No.5278612

>>5278599
That's because it is a mechanism of judgement, shame, guilt. That's why Reddit and tumblr is so popular.
It is all those things, but for some reason, just there, the community has warped their personalities to this always nice, always kind, even to the point that it is irritating for those of us who are used to being an anonymous anomaly. They are not that nice, they are not that kind, not really. They do it so they can fill their guts with pride at the fact that something has karma points, or gold, or someone follows them. Therefore, they take the mechanism for judgement, shame, and guilt and use it as a tool to only have good judgement, avoid shame, and to avoid guilt.
And if they are so vain as to believe that something they admit will affect that one profiles image, they make an account, and they have a name for it on reddit, a 'throwaway' account.

They are utterly fucking insane.

>> No.5278614

>>5278609
That's the awful thing. It's not even 'homesick' in the sick that you miss home, you just miss the feeling of ...being nothing. Being there, alone, in a place that offered nothing and took nothing that you weren't used to having taken.

>> No.5278619

>>5278612
but that's how the whole internet is.

>> No.5278625

Yeah, but on some sites some people are reddit tier insane, and others are there just to be there even with a profile.

Here, for the most part, we can say what we feel, and sometimes even exaggerate.
On reddit, you can only say what you feel if what you feel is the majority.

>> No.5278627

>>5278619
>>5278625
this was meant to be paired

>> No.5278636

>>5278614
That's what I don't like about the idea of moving out, it's pretty stable here and I don't have to worry about to much. I seriously hate the idea of having to have actual responsibilities, it's terrifying.

>> No.5278643

>>5278427
Watch those 'it's's and 'its's, man.

>> No.5278649

>>5278636
Small steps, as long as they are indeed steps.

>> No.5278651

>>5278547
Unless you were taking this drugs in isolation, I'd imagine it was more the re-entry into social experiences that helped open you up; or that the correlation was reverse, and you were beginning to gain more energy anyway when you started taking drugs with others.

>> No.5278653

>>5278643
I'm not writing a book on here, just getting my point across with as little effort as possible.

>> No.5278654

>>5278651
*were taking drugs
*causation was reverse

>> No.5278667

i assume most ofyou live in societies where the standard of living is pretty descent. how are you depressed people dealing with the fact that the majority of the people on earth have it much harder than you and struggle every day. i am a sad person most of the time but never hed to take meds for depression. sometimes it's enough for me to think about the fact that at least i know i have food and shelter and don't have to fight for it. that cheers me up. it relaxes me. i assume if you are really depressed these thought don't help.

>> No.5278670

>>5278653
No need to retaliate. I just imagine you'd rather hit the grammar right first try, so I was prompting you, to help you to refine it for next time.

>> No.5278694

>>5278670
It's all semantics.

>> No.5278697

Be careful not to try and force yourself to "think positive". That is terrible advice and I have no idea why people aren't imprisoned for giving it. You have to look at your soul as broken and that trying to "think positive" with a broken soul is like trying to lift weights with a broken arm. When people break their arms they put the arm in a cast and have faith that the body will heal itself over time; they don't try lifting weights every day and getting frustrated with themselves because their arm doesn't work. Same here with depression; you have to put your soul in a cast and let it heal itself. The more effort you put in trying to heal it the more it will hurt. That is more or less what all those drugs try to do anyway, viz. put the brain in a cast, numb it. Those drugs don't make you "think positive", they save you from the pain of thinking just as a cast on an arm saves you from the pain of lifting. That said, the worse thing you can do when you are depressed is think. It's ironic because the tendency of depressed people is to do nothing but think, and they will spend years believing that "if I only I can change my way of thinking, I can stop being depressed"; no, it's not your way of thinking that's depressing you, it's your depression that determines your way of thinking. Changing your way of thinking is like changing how you grip the dumbbell with a broken arm; it isn't going to change anything. One change you can make though is this: abstract the pain. What I mean is, don't think of your depression as though YOU were the cause of it, because if you imagine that YOU are causing the depression you will naturally feel intense guilt and self-loathing for doing such horrible things to yourself; and in a way it is by thinking yourself as the cause of your depression that you do in fact become the cause of your depression, leading to a vicious circle. So you have to abstract the pain as something not arising from yourself, but as a kind of burden imposed on you and that you just have to accept. Your aim should not be "positive thinking", it should be relaxation/tranquility/numbness, the kind of things that Eastern monks strive for. This simple act will dull the pain by a lot. Resist the temptation to think; all your thoughts will be coloured by your depression, and when you see their ugly colour it will just make you more depressed. Read the Book of Job and the Psalms. In the Book of Job Chapter 33 there is a passage which describes depression and it states more or less that God causes it in people to take them away from a sensual life and cause them to humble themselves and accept God. And there a certain Psalms that more or less describe King David going through depression; he sees that he became an abomination and lost all of his friends, etc.

"Be still, and know that I am God."

Also, if you are suicidal you have nothing to lose by shedding your fedora.

>> No.5278700

>>5278697
>Also, if you are suicidal you have nothing to lose by shedding your fedora

By believing in ...the christian god?
He dictates we are all failures doomed to fail, to the fact he had to reincarnate himself into a human and kill him off, just so these things he created that were going to be doomed to fail anyways could be saved, and even then, some don't believe.

He also murdered the majority of them once, and apologized with a rainbow....

I might not have anything to lose, but I certainly don't want that.

>> No.5278703

>>5278697
Also, read these books
http://www.naturalthinker.net/trl/texts/Kierkegaard,Soren/TheSicknessUntoDeath.pdf
http://www.ccel.org/ccel/john_cross/ascent.html
http://www.ccel.org/ccel/john_cross/dark_night.html

In that order. These take precedence over "literature". You won't understand either of the bottom two because they are too deep, but there's still a lot in there that will help.

>> No.5278706

>>5278697
>>5278700
not to mention even his most perfect creations fail him, doubt him, and turned against him, unless you want to talk about Job, in which God gambled with Satan for pride.....

Yeah, an eternity with that asshole sounds worse than a life of depression.

>> No.5278708

>>5278700
Read the Gospels m8.

>> No.5278711

>>5278700
>>5278706
You don't know what you are talking about. The picture you have in your head is not of God; it's a hobgoblin, a spook.

>> No.5278714

>>5278697
Jesus, Jude, this is so wrong. Thinking positive is absolutely the right answer to conquering depression, which is what religion is. Of course I figure you're just looking for attention, but still.

>> No.5278717

>>5278714
There's a difference between clinical depression and a vague melancholy/apathy. The latter can be cured by thinking, the former cannot. It's like the difference between a broken arm and a weak arm; a weak arm can be made stronger by lifting, but you can't do anything with a broken arm.
"Think positive" is acceptable advice (well, it's a garbage platitude with an ugly phrasing, "positive") for someone that is "feeling down", but not for someone that is depressed.

>> No.5278720

>>5278667

fallacy of relative privation

>> No.5278726

>>5278717
Incorrect. Both can be, and in fact must be, cured by positive thinking. This is why you're never just medicated, but receive therapy too. The brain will build what it's going to build. Take some LSD, Jude, and get back to me.

>> No.5278727

>>5278711

>not the TRUE god

>> No.5278730

Also, saying that religion is "thinking positive" is very reductive. The reason that religion can pull people out of a slump is not that it causes them to "think positive", but that it gives them a reason to live. Those are two completely different things. "Thinking positive" means trying to imagine birds and sunshine and lakes; religion is a whole system of metaphysics, teleology, eschatology, etc.

>> No.5278735

>>5278726
Why would you ever tell a depressed person to think positive? It's like telling a cripple to walk. It's just cruel.

>> No.5278737

>>5278730
Wrong. What Christianity is, is a finely engineered work of psychology, designed that people will need it, and all about thinking positive.

>> No.5278740

>>5278389
yes happening right now I hate everything

>> No.5278742

>>5278737
That probably applies to New Age adulterated Christianity. If Christianity is "all about thinking positive" then why the need for hellfire? Why the concept of sin and guilt?

>> No.5278743
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5278743

>tfw happy but too much of a procrastinating slug to read the books that's right next to me
>spend hours shitposting on various boards instead
>happily and stupidly waste the day because instant gratification

>> No.5278744

TULIP

>> No.5278747

>>5278743
Throw your computer away. Don't listen to that voice inside your head saying, "but you need the computer for emails and other practical things. And when you want to read analyses of books or find more books or order more books off the internet. You need the computer." DON'T LISTEN IT'S THE COMPUTER TRYING TO GET INSIDE YOUR HEAD TRUST ME IT WILL DO ANYTHING TO KEEP YOU ENSLAVED YOU HAVE TO CUT IT OFF FOR GOOD THERE IS NO COMPRISING WITH THIS M8 COLD TURKEY OR NOTHING

>> No.5278756

>>5278726

Dude, you can't tell a trip that they're 'incorrect'. They can't ever be 'incorrect'.

>> No.5278758

Just sit around in public, takes your mind off things.

>> No.5278760

To demonstrate the difference between clinical depression and a lighter melancholy.

I was so depressed one day that I couldn't smile. No, I don't mean that I couldn't feel happy enough to smile. I mean that I literally could not lift the muscles in my mouth to form even a "fake smile". I didn't have the willpower for it. I tried to do it and all I got in response was a hollow feeling in my chest. I would have laughed at how absurd it was, but I physically couldn't.

>> No.5278761
File: 280 KB, 468x486, litripfag.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5278761

>>5278756
We can, just not around scummy anonplebs.

>> No.5278763

>>5278711
Yeah...he is.

He creates his creations in heaven.
His greatest, turns on him, along with a shit ton of the others.

He creates humans and animals and creatures
one of his creatures tempts the humans
they fail

their son kills his brother

humans get so shitty, gods creations, and he kills them all
he sends Noah an rainbow saying he will never do it again

that is until he destroys the earth, and all the humans, who didn't repent

to repent, he had to send his self into a virgin as a human to be born to be sacrificed only after being doubted by his human self and then crucified for his self and his creations just so maybe a couple could ignore the rest of everything that had happened and listen to his human self only so far as to be comfortable.

That is God.
That is exactly it.

>> No.5278773

>>5278697
interesting analogy and a few good points scattered in there but i dont think youve quite got it yet

>> No.5278778

>>5278763
I'm not saying that your statements aren't true in a literal sense. I'm saying that you don't understand them.

>humans get so shitty, gods creations, and he kills them all
>he sends Noah an rainbow saying he will never do it again

The thing you aren't understanding here is the subject of the sentence, "he".

I'll tell you something though. There seems to be an opinion in the world today that every human being has an "inalienable right to life" and that not even God could take this away from a human being. This is false. Another thing that people don't understand is evil. They think that the greatest evil in the world is things like war, poverty, murder. etc. Now, these are indeed great evils, but they can be understood; you can put war and poverty down to human greed, etc., and murder you can explain as violent passion / wrath. These are understandable. But then when you get into mothers willing sacrificing their babies to idols the more you try to understand it the more difficult it is to understand. People have a low conception of evil. They think that people are naturally more or less neutral, if not rather good, and evil is just something that happens because of bad circumstances. They don't understand that evil is something that people can choose wilfully knowing full well that it is evil.

>> No.5278780

>>5278773
What have I missed m8? I'm interested in understanding this.

>> No.5278784

>>5278778
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3lWQEp94L5s

>> No.5278790

>>5278784
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qG7i6seX-7Y
The man in this vid is a respected ex-CIA, The woman had her children go through "Satanic Ritual Abuse".

>> No.5278792

>>5278790
and this one is very graphic and includes interview with kids themselves
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MUzQ7aqFyiU

Now when you complain that God killed all of humanity with a flood, you have to understand that this is the kind of thing that was going on on a mass scale.

>> No.5278796

>>5278792
i.e. God didn't wipe out a world of Bill and Brenda's smiley suburban homes.

>> No.5278805

>>5278778
>>5278780
>>5278784
>>5278790
>>5278792
>>5278796
What's going on here?

>> No.5278806

>>5278790
He's ex-FBI actually. Ted Gunderson.

>> No.5278812

>>5278805
evil

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CK20MpC5h_I
this one is cheezy because of the background music, and the translation is rough; however, the analysis that is given is sound.
I've talked about this vid on 4chan before and a guy claiming to work in advertising said that it was just a joke, but this is not the kind of thing that you joke about. In biblical terms this would be called an "abomination", because it is idolatry.
this is the kind of shit that gets people down the "iluminerty" rabbit hole btw.

Point of all this is that evil exists and God isn't cruel for punishing evil.

>> No.5278816

>>5278812
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hD6PHG_qfic
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wtSVBTne-KY

This is about "Bohemian Grove". A pagan club for powerful men. This one is well known. It includes US presidents (documented fact, not speculation). The second one includes the filming of a ritual in the latter half, just so you know what it looks like and why God got so angry with humanity.

>> No.5278817

>>5278742
Because it's also for order, duh.
>>5278735
Oh, but instead you wrap a story about god around them? I've seen depressed people enlivened by the hate of god, Jude; it's actually very common with boys who lose their mothers: they spend so long thinking "why" debilitated, then finally renounce god and sprout wings.

>> No.5278818

>>5278817
>then finally renounce god and sprout wings.
This is basically the psychology portrayed in 3:10 to Yuma, also.

>> No.5278820

>>5278735
>Why would you ever tell a depressed person to think positive? It's like telling a cripple to walk. It's just cruel

One problem with "depression" is that it's defined in terms of a psychological model of humans that might be inaccurate. "Depression" presupposes that humans are beings that are conscious, think, and feel, and "depression" is described vaguely in terms of these behaviors. This allows me to argue that a depressed person is capable of 'thinking positively" - that there is no fundamental impasse preventing them from doing so. Suppose you gave a "depressed person" a very corny and disgustingly positive self-help book and told them to read it. If they read it and comprehend it (parse it), then they're capable of thinking positively. In fact, they were thinking positively while reading it. Although the cripple is physically incapable of walking given his legs, the "depressed person" is still capable of arranging words into sequences that are considered "positive" and understanding their meanings & implications, whether he believes them or not.

>> No.5278821

>>5278805
looks like tripfriend thaddeus over here is having a psychotic episode induced by religious euphoria

anyhow, i only get depressed when i try to do stuff. whenever i put _effort_ into anything, i realize my own mediocrity. so i don't. my day is equal parts lying in bed sleeping, lying in bed not sleeping, and internet (movies, games, 4chan). it feels stale and bland but stable.

>> No.5278822

>>5278817
It's better to be suicidally depressed than renounce God and "sprout wings". Where are those wings going to take you once you've renounced God?

I think when people have a misfortune happen to them and they start to question God they need to be told that God isn't this angry guy that hates them and wants to watch them suffer; if people confuse God for Satan then it's no wonder that they "renounce" him.

>> No.5278828
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5278828

>>5278389
People in this thread need to read The Myth of Sisyphus

>> No.5278829
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5278829

>>5278822
>if people confuse God for Satan then it's no wonder that they "renounce" him
my god, obviously! haha! it's that simple! delightful!

>> No.5278831

>>5278667

>people on earth have it much harder than you and struggle every day

When people smugly say this it really pisses me off. I know you aren't saying this and I'm not pointing this post at you specifically, but it's like why shouldn't my suffering matter because others are also suffering? Does the degree of their suffering somehow negate mine? Why? Why am I not allowed to speak about how I suffer because we're in the first world you have you choose to feel liberal guilt?

This isn't at you specifically. It's at self-righteous assholes who live in the same society that I do but trot out this liberal guilt line again and again when they KNOW that they secretly suffer the exact same way that I do at times. They fucking KNOW it. It's such hypocritical crap. We're all human.

>> No.5278834

>>5278831
>Does the degree of their suffering somehow negate mine
Pretty much this, can't stand when people try to compare levels/degree/reasons for depression

>> No.5278835

>>5278820
>This allows me to argue that a depressed person is capable of 'thinking positively" - that there is no fundamental impasse preventing them from doing so.

I would argue that there is. In fact, I would say that a "fundamental impasse" which prevents a person from "thinking positively" is a good definition of depression. If a person CAN think positively then I wouldn't say that they were depressed. "Think positively" is a misnomer, what people really mean is, "feel positively", i.e. "feel better". It basically amounts to telling a depressed person to not feel depressed; at best it amounts to "get well soon", but most people say "think positively" as a command and not as a sympathetic wish. If you mean that a "depressed person" can put the logical connections together in his mind which shows him that "life isn't so bad after all", then yes, a depressed person can think that, but they can't feel it.

>> No.5278837

>>5278829
calm down

>> No.5278838

>>5278837
no, you calm down

>> No.5278840

perfect day for bananafishing!

usually I go outside

>> No.5278844
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5278844

>>5278837
>>5278838
both of you step back!

>> No.5278847

>>5278835
I think that people who say "think positively" have misunderstood the psychology of a man. They think that the mind is above the emotions and so if you change mind you change the emotions. This is only true to a limited extent. There are certain emotional faculties that can be controlled by the mind, but some are above the mind.
It's like St. Paul's spirit, soul, flesh (pneuma, psyche, soma). You are asking people to fix their pneuma (spirit) by changing their psyche (mind/soul), but you can't. Pneuma is above psyche and determines it; psyche does not determine pneuma. If you have a broken pneuma - a broken spirit - then no changes in your mind or body will help; at best they will alleviate some of the symptoms. The people that think that drugs can cure depression are the one's that confuse the hierarchy so much that they put the body above the spirit and the soul.

>> No.5278853

>>5278835
My point was to show that very little of value can be said about "depression" because it's so ill-defined.

>If you mean that a "depressed person" can put the logical connections together in his mind which shows him that "life isn't so bad after all", then yes, a depressed person can think that, but they can't feel it.

And then from here we'll go on to ask how this is possible (psychologically), what really is the difference between thinking and feeling, what it means to feel.... more ill-defined terms. And it's not clear that any of them accurately describe the way humans operate. I.e., it's not clear that the psychological model you implicitly construct when talking about depression in that way is an accurate model ("accurate" meaning "corresponds to 'reality'").

Psychiatry has been disappointing because the "chemical imbalance" idea is just replacing one "ghost-story" (consciousness, thinking, feeling) with another (ill-defined, unsupported chemical imbalances). (And if we suppose that SSRIs do work, then why is it that they work for a host of things: OCD, eating disorders, anxiety, depression... why are all of these caused by the "same chemical imbalance"?)

>>5278847

Still, what you say here is even worse, because now you're attributing validity to St. Paul's model of the human psyche, when again there's no reason to believe it's accurate. Maybe it's "intuitive", but that's essentially inconsequential; lots of "intuitive" things are false.

>The people that think that drugs can cure depression are the one's that confuse the hierarchy so much that they put the body above the spirit and the soul.
Well, if you kill yourself, the depression goes away. That leads me to believe it's physical, even though psychiatrists may as well be charlatans.

>> No.5278854

>>5278847
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kybalion

This esoteric book also has the same hierarchy.

>The Great Physical Plane
>The Great Mental Plane
>The Great Spiritual Plane

The Spirit is at the top. You have "mind over matter" but you also have "spirit over mind". If your spirit is defective then you cannot master your mind or your body. Telling a depressed person (broken spirit) to have positive thoughts (improve their mind) is like telling a retard (broken mind) to take better care of their body - they can't take care of their body because requires mind, and a depressed person can't take care of his mind because that requires spirit.

>> No.5278857

>>5278519
>I don't feel connected with anything
Same, L'étranger (The Stranger) recently hit me really hard tho

It made me realize that up until now I never felt any affection towards anyone
Then I met the first person and I fucked it up bad

>> No.5278859

>>5278853
>Well, if you kill yourself, the depression goes away.

Only if you think that the soul is a harmony made by the strings of the body and disappears when the strings are broken.

But your position is material monism. Is love physical because it goes away when you kill the lover? Is the theory of gravitation physical because it goes away when you kill the person who holds the theory in his mind?

>> No.5278865

>>5278519
If it makes you feel better you can blame every philosopher from Descartes through to Locke through to Hume through to Kant through to the present for their individualism which gradually destroyed all culture and human bonds and turned us into "social atoms".

Don't make the mistake of blaming "Capitalism" though. Capitalism is one of the symptoms, it is not the cause.

>> No.5278874

>>5278853
>Still, what you say here is even worse, because now you're attributing validity to St. Paul's model of the human psyche, when again there's no reason to believe it's accurate. Maybe it's "intuitive", but that's essentially inconsequential; lots of "intuitive" things are false.

I think if you reduce every person's psychology down to their principles you will find some basic structure like St. Paul's "pneuma, psyche, soma" or Freud's "superego, ego, id." When you get cognitive neuroscientists talking at length about the various operations in the brain and how they affect behaviour - if you reduced what they think a human being's psychology is down to first principles they would give you something that they derived INTUITIVELY like, "a human being is an assemblage of chemical reactions". The same with behaviourists, "a human being is a set of behaviours".

>> No.5278888

>>5278859

Now, just like your *hit thread* over here >>/sci/6696388 , you're playing "fast and loose" with words. Just because you can string words together in ways that sound plausible, it does not mean that the strings you have created accurately portray "reality." You want me to say "No, the theory of gravitation doesn't go away when you kill the person who ... " so you can appeal to a realm of Platonic Forms and justify your Folk Psychological models of people with greek-influenced theology. I'm not going to play language games, because they're just games.

And that's been my point all along. Depression is defined in terms of games that people have been playing with words (words like "thoughts", "feelings", "consciousness", "spirit" - words that they can't even define when you ask them to). If we talk about depression in their "lexical territory", then we end up saying things only about their model of depression. This is useful only if their model of depression corresponds to the actual pathology of depression, and the problem is that this has never been demonstrated, and probably can't be demonstrated.


>>5278874
The big difference is that physical models are testable and "psychological/philosophical" models aren't testable. If emotions are chemical, we should be able to influence emotions by giving someone chemicals, like LSD. If humans are thoughts and feelings, then what? It's gotten us nowhere -- you said it yourself (" a depressed person can't feel happy even if he can logically ... "). It doesn't matter what people actually think they are, because accurately perceiving how they function psychologically or neurologically is probably not one of their talents. Hunting is, foraging is, running is.... but there's no reason to believe that a person's intuitive psychological profile of himself is at all accurate.

>> No.5278897

>>5278831
>>5278834
Thank you for your reply. I understand that you don't point at finger at me but at others who are more asshole than me.

I am not putting down your suffering. I am just saying what works for me. I wouldn't call myself depressed. Just very sad because my life turned out the way it did. One thing that happend to me was that both my refrigerator and toilet broke at the same time while
i was unemployed. This caused a lot of discomfort. The things that were bringing me down before were gone from my mind. All i could think of was fixing these problems so i could live normally again. When things went back to normal i felt very happy for a while and
thought that life was great. After a while i got used it and became low again. You see what i am trying to say?

For what it's worth i realized that nobody will help me out of my situation. So i started sports and that was a great improvement. I also found small pleasures in life that make it a little easier to cope because i always something nice to look forward to. But like i
said i am not medically depressed. I know that it can be difficult. I have seen documetaries.

I can't stress the importance of exercise enough. I am not one of those muscle guys who is great at sports. I am just a slight fat guy who likes the feeling i get from exercising. I am glad you recognize that i am not disrespecting.

>> No.5278901

>>5278822
That's so stupid. I know one dude who fell into a complete pit of despair when his mother died, his father an alcoholic. All of a sudden, one day, he starts eating healthy, learning PUA, comes out of his room. He'd decided to live his life and forget about the torments. And on the side he argues against the nonsense which is Christianity, some monster in the sky who stole his mother away. What? We say to him, "No, no, bold boy, back into your room"? You take life in a miserable fairy tale, and you're not even sure why you do. Oh, and I spoke too soon earlier — hellfire and all that, it's to scare you; it's the oldest con in the book: conjure up something scary which must be conquered, then provide the means (unfortunately, then, such religions are perfectly suited to our psychology/consideration in this mad world (which shouldn't be used as an argument for god, unless it's a cunt of a god)).

>> No.5279185

>>5278901
I think we have accept that some people are really ill and they can't just decide that they will live and get over it. Some people are sick and can't do that. They need medical help. Where the difference is between that and just feeling sorry for yourself is not something i am qualified to talk about.

>> No.5279224

>>5278667
>tfw standard of living increase made me more depressed
>tfw what makes me functional is living where everyone and their problems will die soon

>> No.5279247

>>5278427
If I'm not reading my books I'm not reading all of that. But hope you're feeling better

>> No.5279265
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5279265

>>5278427
Thank you

>> No.5279274

>>5278901
>PUA
So let me get this straight
He "on the side" ie on the internet writes passive aggressive essays against Christianity, likely boiling down to his own bad experiences, completely ignoring the story of Job and Jesus' own betrayal and death, doesn't read history so death and suffering wouldn't be a stranger, all so he can feel superior for wearing a scuba helmet at the mall as a peacock and printing out the book of pook to hype himself up for women?

I fail to see how this mindset has any right to say they have some higher ground in anything. Instead of praying to a higher power and washing their stress away, they pray to themselves, which is currently broken, confused, and a poisonous worldview

>> No.5279315

>>5278697
so is this Feminister?

>> No.5279391

>tfw to busy writing to read

>> No.5279408

>>5279315
no

>> No.5279515

some of you will probably hate this advice, but.. have you guys tried doing weed? i have been very suicidal for a decent amount of years in the past, and weed really helped me (also helped with the eating and with going out more). that and moving to berlin, which is the most awesome city i know. i'm permastoned now, which is a different kind of life entirely, but it doesn't have to be a bad thing depending on your job, boss and responsibilities. the important thing is that i'm only very rarely depressed anymore, mainly in winter. and no suicide thoughts, just the occasional loneliness.

i'm sure it won't help everybody, but you could give it a try really.. if smoking is not your thing, don't worry, just get some brownies cake mix or whatever and knock yourself out.

i have a suspicion that the biggest problem most of you guys have is a severe lack of meaningful social interaction, people you can look forward to see and converse with. i've been there, and it almost killed me. i'm only saying this because it can be non-obvious to you if you're affected - but it is still extremely hard to work on this problem if you already are deep into depression. weed helped me getting out of this deepest hole so that i was able to start making social contact again, which thankfully worked out (mostly) and improved my situation further.

i hope this advice can be of help to anyone. if it doesn't help you, don't blame yourself, every person is different. other paths (which i'm not familiar with) might help you more.

>> No.5279532

>>5278828

keep reading.
you'll see how little that essay actually helps.

>> No.5279537

>>5279515
I don´t even know where do I get weed in Germany.

>> No.5279541

>>5279315
Yes, obviously.

>> No.5279571

>>5279537

for one there's street sale, then there's web platforms using bitcoins.

bigger cities have "usual spots". for example, hasenheide is a bigger park in berlin where you can get decent weed for your buck (just google around a bit).

if you're far from big cities or generally uncomfortable with buying on the street (which is wise if you have no experience at all), there's always bitcoin. buying drugs on the darknet is the safest way possible besides buying from family members, (which you might find an amazing statement you if you consider that the drugs are sent by mail). there are ebay-like platforms that can only be reached using tor (the successors to silkroad, perhaps you heard of that one) and since you pay with bitcoins, the transaction cannot be traced. the internet will tell you more about that.

>> No.5279575

>>5279571
Thanks, anon.

>> No.5279591

>>5278853
>(And if we suppose that SSRIs do work, then why is it that they work for a host of things: OCD, eating disorders, anxiety, depression... why are all of these caused by the "same chemical imbalance"?)

SSRIs change the brain chemistry in such a way that every person, whatever disorder or non-disorder he has, will likely feel _some_ effect.

And I would argue, change is likely to be to the good when your situation at the moment is very bad: If you randomly change the chemical disposition of a group of people who describe themselves, or are described, as having mental problems, the probability is high that any such a change will have a random positive tendency rather than a negative one.