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/lit/ - Literature

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5190479 No.5190479[DELETED]  [Reply] [Original]

Roger Scruton on the sacred.

http://hwcdn.libsyn.com/p/b/e/c/bec4862f41aa43b7/Roger_Scruton_on_the_Sacred.mp3?c_id=7314160&expiration=1406341482&hwt=879ab00420433df12538a00aa15bd1f6

A very interesting thinker with who quietly insists upon many of the values "modernity" would have us transmute or abandon. Worth listening.

>> No.5190507

>>5190479
Bumping for based Scruton

>> No.5190546

I will guess some church paid him to write this.

>> No.5190550

>>5190546

It's an interview with a non-profit, university-based podcast...

I am sure Scruton would find something base in the act of taking money to propagate ideas he holds in good faith.

>> No.5190551

>>5190546
Did you even listen to it?

>> No.5190564

Good stuff, OP. He relies a lot on sensation and inference, but given his subject matter, that's to be expected.

I like the idea of sacredness as a relationship- a connection between you and something outside the bounds of your senses.

>> No.5190586
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5190586

>>5190479
I don't get all the miserable /lit/ types here who mock/hate the idea of a Platonic plain. Why do people enjoy the idea that they're sacks of animated meat with no purpose or drive and that all they're good for is stimulating dopamine releases?

>> No.5190619

>>5190586
I don't think they enjoy it, they just think that that is the inescapable truth.

Every truly serious atheist wishes Heaven were real.

>> No.5190635

>>5190546
I will guess you are wrong. He just likes beautiful things.

http://vimeo.com/55784152

Really worth a watch.

>> No.5190646

>>5190550
>I am sure Scruton would find something base in the act of taking money to propagate ideas he holds in good faith.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roger_Scruton#Activism_in_Eastern_Europe

World Health Organization and tobacco company funding

In 2002 it emerged that Scruton had been receiving a fee of £54,000 p.a. from Japan Tobacco International (JTI) during a period when he had written about tobacco issues without declaring an interest.[58][59] He wrote articles for The Wall Street Journal in 1998 and 2000, and in 2000 wrote a 65-page pamphlet —"WHO, What, and Why: Trans-national Government, Legitimacy and the World Health Organisation"—for the Institute of Economic Affairs, a British free-market think-tank. The pamphlet criticized the World Health Organization's (WHO) campaign against smoking, arguing that transnational bodies should not seek to influence domestic legislation because they are not answerable to the electorate. He wrote that overall he was against tobacco—his own father died of emphysema after smoking for many years—but that it was an innocent pleasure.[60]

The matter became public when a letter signed by Professor Scruton's wife to Japan Tobacco International was leaked, in which they were asked to increase the payments to £66,000 p.a., in exchange for which "We would aim to place an article every two months in one or other of the WSJ (Wall Street Journal), the Times, the Telegraph, the Spectator, the Financial Times, the Economist, the Independent or the New Statesman." The failure to disclose these payments has led to criticism of a perceived conflict of interest. Scruton was later dismissed from roles with the Financial Times[61] and Wall Street Journal.[62][63][64]

>>5190507
>>5190550
>>5190551
>>5190564
Go to bed, scruton.


>>5190635
Absolutely mind numbing. Nothing he says is even worth thinking about for a second.

>> No.5190647

>>5190479
>dualism
>2014

>> No.5190671

>>5190647

It isn't dualism, at all. Recall the part of the interview where he concedes that to call these experiences "psychological" was a tautology. It's a matter of socio-cultural circumstances, physiology, physical environment, and interpretation. It's an aesthetic judgment, basically.

>> No.5190682

>>5190646

That seems pretty damning, and I stand corrected on his character in that regard. I don't think it changes a single thing about his ideas on aesthetics and values. I think we can judge those independently of the actions of the person who put them forth.

Why such a hostile reaction, by the way?

>> No.5190713

>>5190682
He is a shill. I wouldn't waste my time. Go read something else.


Because I just woke up.

>> No.5190745

>>5190713

Do you have such readily packaged reasons for dismissing out of hand the ideas of everyone you disagree with on principle, or is Scruton a special case?

>> No.5190755

>>5190586
>Why do people enjoy the idea that they're sacks of animated meat with no purpose or drive and that all they're good for is stimulating dopamine releases?

I'll never understand some people's determination to see things this way. not only does it feel untrue, it's fucking booring.

>> No.5190784

>>5190550
>I am sure Scruton would find something base in the act of taking money to propagate ideas he holds in good faith.
You realise this guy is known for taking shitloads of money from big tobacco to shill for them, right? He completely lacks integrity.

>> No.5190796

Scruton is a cunt who roleplays at being old money but has to suck corporate cock to maintain his pretence.

>>5190586
Most people don't just pick the beliefs they think are the most fun, they pick the beliefs they consider most likely to be true.

>> No.5190800

>>5190784

This has already been pointed out. Again, I don't think it undermines anything that he says about aesthetics or values. Do you guys even know what "ad hominem" means? Tolstoy was apparently not very nice to his wife. Must we, upon learning of this, ignore the insights into the situation of women contained in Anna Karenina.

>> No.5190819

>>5190796

It's a matter of focus, or emphasis. Physicalists would have us simply stop at the facts of biology and physics--even though they are far from complete, especially for biology and its relation to human psychology--while people like Scruton would have us persist in exploring these feelings that do not go away no matter how much we know about the workings of our own minds and bodies, and persist in a way that doesn't reduce these experiences to mechanics.

>> No.5190982

philistines!

>> No.5190992

Scruton is such a fucking hack

>homosexuality is a perversion because it interfaces with the Same rather than Other
Okay then, all sex with your own race is a perversion as well

>> No.5191001

>>5190479
>sacred
continental hacks at it again

>> No.5191013

>>5190992

More ad hominem.

I am not endorsing everything the Scruton ever wrote or said or did. I am putting these particular thoughts of his up for discussion.

I can't say I expected much more than what I've gotten, but one does hope...

In any case:
>And gay rights activists? In the past Scruton has written that homophobia is understandable. "I took the view that feeling repelled by something might have a justification, even if it's not a justification that the person themselves can give. Like, we're all repelled by incest – well, not all, but most people are. And there's a perfectly good justification, if you look at it in terms of the long-term interest of society. And in that essay I experimented with the view that maybe something similar can be said about homosexuality. And I don't now agree with that, because I think that – it's such a complicated thing, homosexuality. It's not one thing, anyway. So I wouldn't stand by what I said then." Though yes, "people got very cross".
http://www.theguardian.com/theguardian/2010/jun/05/roger-scruton-interview

>> No.5191026

>>5190635
>Beauty is objective because I say so.

>> No.5191028

>>5191013
In any case his entire work on sexuality has been clumsily using terminology to support conservative values.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexual_Desire_%28book%29

>> No.5191031

>>5191028

Would you like to actually listen to the podcast and comment on what is said there? Or do you want to insist on changing the subject?

>> No.5191037

>>5191026

>lel look at this pleb arguing for the value of beauty
>what a continental slob, amirite?
>am i cool yet, guise?
>this is what you all think, right guise, so i think it too and that makes me cool, right?
>right?
>guise?

>> No.5191533

I watched Why Beauty Matters and he was dumb as shit, he seemes like an all round knob.

>> No.5191545

>>5191533
He's the Jeremy Clarkson of British philosophy.

>> No.5191546

>>5191545
Hahahahahaha
That's a funny post

>> No.5191549

>>5191533
>>5191545
>>5191546

stellar critical thinking, samefa--I mean, fellas

>> No.5191550

>>5191549
At least I dont need to use memes to fill out my posts ;)

>> No.5191556

>>5191550

:^)

>> No.5191561

""The whole thing is quite immoral - the stealing of private correspondence and making it public," protested Prof Scruton."

HAHAHHA nice defence lol

>> No.5191646

is he still getting funded by the tobacco industry

>> No.5192607

Reading his wiki page he seems pretty interesting. How's his Meaning of Conservativism?

>> No.5192653

>>5190586
That would work if there weren't closely related animals like apes, or others like dolphins, who are also highly intelligent, bordering on sapience.
Where is the cut off? Maybe there is also a dolphin plane, but surely not a rat plane or a slime mold plane?

>> No.5192672

roger scruton and peter hitchens inspire me greatly.