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/lit/ - Literature

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5168089 No.5168089 [Reply] [Original]

Have you ever written something with female protagonist? What was your thinking process while writing? How did you get into character etc?

>> No.5168162

Yeah, this frustrates me. Video games and literature have diluted gender-based character dynamics. Sex has become a cosmetic with the same stupid mechanism beneath.

Never tried. But from my observations of humans....
Women have expectational process over rational process. This is further confounded by emotional statuses, which may overlap.
Women have plans for things, and they tend to have an inclusive (social) outlook for accomplishing goals. Men have goals, which they formulate plans to achieve, which might require social leveraging. Unsure about male emotions, as I believe them to be a societal lie.
Based on intelligence, the above gets interesting. Stupid women are easily confounded by problems, and revert to "stereoytypical" tactics, as much of their experience is emotionally defined. Stupid men have stupid goals, which cause problems, and overwhelm their plans. These two groups are fun to watch in tandem. The result of their efforts is unknown to them, and they tend to mimic behaviors they have seen previously to garner an effect.

Smart people are a different game, as women learn to utilize their emotions as feedback to modify their presentation and manipulation, whereas men have adaptable goals and plans.
And no matter how capable or intelligent, all people suffer from similar issues deriving from their parenting. Men and women often have "mommy" or "daddy issues."

I'm a bad source for either, being a bit inhuman.

>> No.5168176

>>5168089
I dressed as a woman and had sex with men.

>> No.5168303

i want to do an experiment (i guess on here, though a place with more women would be better) where i take excerpts from novels that talk about the thoughts of men (preferably ABOUT women), reverse the genders, mix these passages with ones originally about either sex, and see if anyone can tell the difference.

>> No.5168313

>>5168303
Of find this

>> No.5168334

>>5168089
>Have you ever written something with female protagonist?
yes

>What was your thinking process while writing? How did you get into character etc?
i just wrote a character that was faithful to itself

>> No.5168367

mang fugg you OP, as a woman browsing 4chan I constantly see how men put down women as irrational and emotional creatures most of which is true; however: I say treat people with respect as individuals. if a woman is manipulative and emotional then screw her and don't reciprocate respect but there are many intelligent women working in finance and the hard sciences who are not like you describe. Give them some credit

>> No.5168386

>>5168367
I agree. There's alot of irrational hate on 4chan

>> No.5168392

>>5168162
>Unsure about male emotions, as I believe them to be a societal lie.
Stopped reading right fucking there.

>> No.5168406

>>5168367
>>5168386
It's a shame, really. I really like 4chan for weeding out ridiculous with harsh ridicule, and it's obvious that you can argue for anything on here without the usual ''oh my gosh! how dare you say such a thing!'' mentality. If people would stop being so irrational in their posts, it could be a great website. (well, there could be some great boards. obvs /b/ and all that is long gone)
There are certain threads where this happens, but they are a small minority, sadly.

>> No.5168407

>>5168386
4chan hates almost everyone

Not even being edgy, that's how it is

>> No.5168432

>>5168386
Nigger where do you think we are

This is 4chan

>> No.5168455 [DELETED] 

>>5168406
No, it's a shame that most women are vapid whores and that anon actually thinks throwing a one paragraph fit about exceptions out of hundreds of people means anything.

>> No.5168463

>>5168455
they may be exceptions but they're the ones screwing our asses over with derivatives

>> No.5168551

>>5168463
What are you attempting to say?

>> No.5168805
File: 102 KB, 563x1226, GeorgeRRMartinonwritingwomen-94860.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5168805

>>5168367
Pic was just a joke...mostly.

I am just interested in how to portray women characters well. If there is something I should watch out for. You often can see books with female protagonists written by man having some criticism along the lines that it was obvious man created it. Thats what I want to avoid in my writing.

>> No.5169103

bump

>> No.5169463

>>5168805
First, women are people.
will continue; this post for bumping purposes

>> No.5169474

>>5168367
women don't need you to defend them, sir knightsalot

>> No.5169662

>>5168805
>>5169463
Here's some advice: you should check out some autobiographies of women while at the library. I can also help you; let me tell you about my childhood.

I wasn't raised to be very social. However my mom indoctrinated me with the advice that I would always be judged on how I looked and acted, so in spite of that I went out of the way to piss my teachers off. I went to a catholic preschool and primary school. My religion teachers had smarmy attitudes and often humiliated students. With my love of learning, I always carried around books. Of course I had few close friends. I was overweight and I thought I would stay that way for the rest of my life. So, during elementary school, I played computer games and stayed inside.

During eighth grade I began running and slimmed down. My attitude towards life turned cynical because of the crowd I was with. And unfortunately no boys wanted to date me. At home I cried and wondered if any one would ever want to be my friend.

In ninth grade my face suddenly became elegant and beautiful, and I was receiving comments and looks that I wasn't accustomed to: admiring gazes from boys and men, and dirty looks from girls my age. I wanted desperately to fit in until I realized that because I was intelligent and a critical thinker, I would always be different from the popular crowd. I also realized that I had great potential, and if I kept comparing myself to those around me and not cultivating excellence for its own sake, I would be putting myself down. It was during my library community service that I began reading Christopher Hitchens and litcore.

> tl;dr the birth of the female fedora

>> No.5169692

Yes.

I just write them like I would a man and throw in the odd bullshit female quirk here and there. It's pretty much what every woman wants to have anyway: the strength, durability, respect, etc, of a man, with gentle reminders that she is still a woman.

>> No.5169693

>>5168089
I am now. I just write a female character and try to touch on things women relate to in modern times. I don't see what's so assmadingly frustrating about the process like this guy >>5168162
; you're either in touch with what relates to women to or you're not. And if you're not then holy shit, why are you even attempting to write fiction?

>> No.5169701

I sit down

And I write a human

This human, however, in contrast to humans I am used to being, has a vagina

Strangely enough, until I am obligated to write about her period, there is little-to-no difference in writing them, because wow women are people too

If you are actually asking how I write about all the trivial shit modern western women like to do, like take excessive shopping trips, wear uggs, yoga pants and carry frappucinos, or claim a double standard, then my answer is that I do not write shit characters

>> No.5169719
File: 71 KB, 900x900, 1338933077525.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5169719

>>5169701
It has been a while since I last laughed on /lit/. Thanks anon.

>> No.5169726

>>5169701
>There is literally no differences between men and women

for real? do people on /lit/ really believe there are no gender distinctions?

i'm not even talking explicitly about whether gender distinctions are cultural or biological, in either case they do exist

>> No.5169728

>>5169662
You really focus on your looks too much.

>> No.5169775

>>5169726

I don't think there is much distinction in what people of differing sexes strive for.

We all want to be confident, successful, respected, funny, etc. If anything, when you start to pull in bullshit things - like what this guys was on about >>5169701 - you devolve into a teen pop writer.

>> No.5169816

>>5169728
I know I did, dude. When I was younger, I felt that my looks defined my social worth and I internalized my guilt, just deprecating myself to the point where I had no self respect. My change in appearance forced me to come to terms with the truth that being attractive does not equate to social status or respect, and if I wanted to find self-fulfillment in my life then I needed to work for it.

>> No.5169821

>>5169775
>I don't think there is much distinction in what people of differing sexes strive for

So what do humans strive for?

In any case, the most pronounced differences occur in sexual relations, which sexual tension is always present in relations between males and females. It's really impossible for a sexually fit women to interact with males in any environment and not have issues arise. This is why segregating the sexes works so damn well, people are more productive when they're not getting boners over a coworker.

>> No.5169845

>>5169816
Very shallow. Hopefully you don't blame anyone but yourself for it.

>> No.5169852

>>5169845
It's truly a damn shame, but unattractive people never get the respect that others do.

>> No.5169861

>>5169821
Sounds like you have sex problems. I like working with women, and I don't have your problems.

>> No.5169870

>>5169852
Yes they do. Unattractive people get respect from other unattractive people. What do you think the world is full of Adonises? Or is it just the attractive ones you believe have more worth? You have some serious sex issues.

>> No.5169871

>>5168089
Carl Sagan's protagonist in Contact was a female. Basicly, it was a normal character who now and then had some initial struggles with her gender in the scientific community, but most of the time Sagan seems to have forgotten or not cared that she was a girl.

>> No.5169876

>>5168162
>male emotions, as I believe them to be a societal lie

Next you're going to show me your tin-lined hat?

>> No.5169885

>>5169845
Alright there, sonny Jim. Calm down now. She said her mother raised her to think looks above all. You can't really blame a child for listening to their parents.

>> No.5169888

>>5169861
Nice armchair psychoanalyzing. I work with women all the time too without issues. Have you ever talked with an HR representative?

>>5169870
Not every single unattractive person isn't like and not every attractive person is liked. There's a clear distinction though, where attractive people are treated better because of who they are.

>> No.5169908

>>5169870
According to science, feedback from attractive people is considered bitchy behaviour while feedback from unattractive people is accepted as a honoust feedback opinion

>also I am intimidated by pretty girls

>> No.5169915

>>5169870
>>5169888
Attractive people are more easily percieved as intelligent. According to my body language book anyways.

>> No.5169917

>>5169888
Why is it that you only ever post platitudes?

>> No.5169918

>>5169888
>Nice armchair psychoanalyzing
>There's a clear distinction though, where attractive people are treated better because of who they are
>because of who they are

You're very dull, with dull ideas and an obviously dull comprehension of the facts.

Think of this: Unattractive people treat unattractive people with preference, and attractive people with suspicion. Consider the way attractive women are stereotyped as being stupid, mostly be ugly girls to make themselves feel better. Also, ugly people congregate with ugly people, and vice versa, because ugly people prefer those who don't make them feel bad.

You're just doing pop psychology.

>> No.5169926

>>5169917
You could always ask me to expand upon my words.

Believe it or not, making inferences, shitposting and then psychoanalyzing your opponent to be what you initially inferred is not a productive debate method.

>> No.5169931

>>5169908
Are you a man or a woman?

I agree with that statement there: attractive people are looked upon with suspicion. Ugly people want to demean them, and often do so in private. I've met a lot of women who say bad things about attractive women, essentially making up stories about how stupid they are, without evidence, just because it caters to the myth that attractive women are dumb and ugly women are smart.

>> No.5169933

>>5169918
>Consider the way attractive women are stereotyped as being stupid, mostly be ugly girls to make themselves feel better.
They are, but in reality, it only works like this: when attractive people are stupid, it's chalked up to them being attractive. But when an attractive woman expresses an insight, be it mediocre or actually interesting, it's treated as much more intelligent than when a landwhale does it.

>> No.5169934

>>5168367
>i'm a girl by the way
ayy

>> No.5169936

>>5169918
>Consider the way attractive women are stereotyped as being stupid
This is not true whatsoever.
A certain type of woman is stereotyped as stupid. The fake tan, platinablond fake tits like omg like type. A classic looking attractive girl is eveyrthing but stereotyped as stupid. You get a 10/10 brunette with sophisticated clothing, nobody will think she is stupid.

>> No.5169946

>>5169926
Sorry man I just didn't realize you were an idiot or I wouldn't have bothered to waste time on your lack of having anything to say.

>> No.5169947

>>5168162
>male emotions are a societal lie
>video game references
>claims to be inhuman

Underage, I found one, I found one!

>> No.5169952

underneath all that cultural socialization and gendered conduct rules, yes men and women are all the same. people operate under largely the same biological principles (i'm talking about neurotransmitters, escaping pain seeking pleasure etc., for the moment ignoring the ability to give birth). so, for all intents and purposes, if you're writing a female character, the internal thought process is going to be much the same. NOT to say that all females think the same as all males. but rather, there are ambitious women just as there are ambitious men, submissive women just as there are submissive men.

HOWEVER, the real issue is that SOCIAL and CULTURAL pressures and rules can be very different (OR similar) depending on the culture in which your character developed in. These pressures are what lead to the development of behaviors along certain lines, differentiated among sex/race/class; however they are guidelines and not laws. so on the one hand you have a woman or man who was born in an extremely impoverished neighborhood and had to be outspoken, tough, and resilient in order to attain resources to survive. on the other hand you have a woman or man who was born in the upper echelons of society who was raised to expect service from servants simply by raising a finger. consequently you get very different personalities arising from different socioeconomic backgrounds and not gender, but gender also plays a huge role in how people are socialized. honestly there's a lot more to say but

tldr men and women are the same on the inside as babies; gendered/socioeconomic pressures and socialization as they grow is what creates these binary perceptions.

>> No.5169954

>>5168367
>vindictiveness
>self-vindication: Narcissism
>pitiability ethic of self and others
>resentment morality

>> No.5169961

>>5169926
I'm not the one you've been responding to. This post is my third in the thread after the one you're responding and this
>>5169933

I'm just asking a general question: why is it that you only ever post platitudes?

like this gem
>Logic is just an attempt to allow two people to speak less ambiguously; just because people on 4chan do not understand logic does not mean logic is not a useful tool.

>> No.5169963

>>5169918
>Think of this: Unattractive people treat unattractive people with preference, and attractive people with suspicion.

Alright, I'm considering it. Can you argue this maybe with more evidence?

>Consider the way attractive women are stereotyped as being stupid, mostly be ugly girls to make themselves feel better.

I was speaking not about same sex interactions. Attractive men are treated better by all women, and attractive women are treated better by all men (we're speaking in a world that precludes homosexuality, for simplicity). Unattractive women don't even really treat unattractive women "better", they keep them around as unattractive people don't feel self-conscious around other unattractive people. Unattractive people become bitter towards attractive people because the attractive people get more attention.

>Also, ugly people congregate with ugly people, and vice versa, because ugly people prefer those who don't make them feel bad.

Uh, yeah.

You do know that you have absolutely and irrevocably failed to answer why attractive people tend to be paid more, be attended to more quickly by servicepeople, etcetera. This seems to be the case and is the result of all studies I've read. This doesn't mean in literally every scenario this will happen, and acting as though I'm saying this is blatantly tangential to the whole point. I'm talking about statistics, not absolute deductions

So anyway, I'm doing pop psychology? I've agreed with much of what you said, and you've not given any evidence that I can't dismiss offhand as similarly unsupported claims. You don't have to be vitriolic, either, we can function very well without asininity.

>> No.5169967

>>5169662
>dirty looks from girls my age.
Men on,y do this to faggy pretty Bois. If you could elaborate on WHY this envy is expressed and how, it'd teach a thing or two

>> No.5169969

“A writer needs three things, experience, observation, and imagination, any two of which, at times any one of which, can supply the lack of the others.”

If you're not a woman, the way to write about a woman is the same way you write about a samurai if you are not a samurai.

>> No.5169972

>>5169936
You don't have to respond to him. He is the one who believes all members of a set hold the same belief on a topic, and criticizes me for "pop psychology".

>> No.5169975

>>5169918
>Also, ugly people congregate with ugly people, and vice versa, because ugly people prefer those who don't make them feel bad.
>it's accurate tho

>> No.5169977

>>5169952
A lot of things wrong here, such as vastly different hormone levels /types. I think you're casually glancing over some chemical discrepancies here

>> No.5169981

>>5169946
Thank you for taking the time to share this deep and thought-provoking response.

>people operate under largely the same biological principles (i'm talking about neurotransmitters, escaping pain seeking pleasure etc., for the moment ignoring the ability to give birth)

I would agree that about 95-98%, or if not that then on the higher side of 98%, of what goes on in the brain is no different across the sexes. Though, things like visual processing and the like are basically inconsequential to culture; culture itself is somewhat of a product of each person's perception of the other, and gender differences are pronounced most clearly in mate selection

>> No.5169985

>>5169977
>hormone levels
Had therapeutic steroids as medical treatment in HUGE quantities, and let me tell you: hormones definitely have huge sway over emotion

>> No.5169986

>>5169933
I'm unsure where you got this idea, but I suspect it's from movies and television. Or you could be right and I've just been unaware of it. In my experience, it's the comment the person makes that results in the determination. Sure, I've seen some idiots make judgments based on looks. I've seen ugly people discount attractive people. I've seen ugly people be highly valued for their intellects. In my experience, it's all over the board. To say that attractive people's comments are thought more highly of isn't true; it's too dependent on the individuals doing the listening, and that's been so variable in my experience. I think you got this idea from the mass media, which portrays it like this, but not from reality, lengthy interaction with a great variety of people, who in my experience most often judge the comments of the speaker and not their looks. After a while, in a social group, looks are irrelevant, you become numb to it, you ignore it, and the more social people tend to not bother paying attention to what a person looks like but rather to what they say. It just seems to me you're operating with a myth created by American mass media.

>> No.5169989

>>5169981
>Thank you for taking the time to share this deep and thought-provoking response.
A large portion of your posts are basically like his. "Idiot" "retard" etc.

>> No.5169997

>>5169961
>why is it that you only ever post platitudes?

I like to pose rigid truths and argue them to see where they go. Whether I really believe much of the stuff I say is another thing, I like to debate ideas and see what I can learn about them.

And are you really somehow insinuating that platitudes aren't incredibly common here? Please specify in more detail how my posting habits cleave from the norm; I'm genuinely curious.

>> No.5170006

>>5168162
>women learn to utilize their emotions as feedback to modify their presentation and manipulation
this makes no fucking sense.

>> No.5170008

>>5169989
Yes, you're correct. I can be unnecessarily insulting.

>> No.5170016

>>5169986
>To say that attractive people's comments are thought more highly of isn't true
It absolutely is true though. You're looking at this too rigidly, no one is saying here that if an ugly person and an attractive person make opposing claims that the attractive person will always be considered correct. It's a matter of statistics.

>> No.5170021

>>5169967
Girls my age were interested in finding out how people work -- it makes sense that they thought I had a superiority complex because I was beautiful and intelligent, and they had their own self-esteem problems and couldn't stop comparing themselves to others. I often overheard these same girls spreading gossip about kids in relationships, and then admitting among themselves that they had no vision beyond becoming a housewife. Tbh anon, I their motives are unknown to me, but due to their cliquish behavior I thought they were emotionally immature

>> No.5170029

>>5169997
I'm not insinuating anything. I am saying that platitudes make up all of your posts (such as this one: "platitudes are common"), and the rest are insults.

>>5170008
No, I'm saying you make posts that contain nothing but an insult.

>> No.5170031

Human beings are irrational. Fucking neckbeards

>> No.5170032

>>5169981
You are such an idiot. What's entertaining is that you're completely oblivious to it.

>> No.5170034

>>5169954
this post

>> No.5170046

>>5168176
Are you female?

>> No.5170053

>>5170021
Seems like competition for sexual mates: one group puts down another to eliminate their reproductive possibilities. Imagine a male entering a group of females like this; he would be disinclined to interact with the competing group if he believed the put downs were true, thus increasing the first female group's chances of mating with him.

Silly? I don't know.

>> No.5170072

>>5170029
>I am saying that platitudes make up all of your posts (such as this one: "platitudes are common"), and the rest are insults.

Uh do you know what a platitude even is? I do not speak in platitudes that often and whatever you're trying to describe is too vague for me to understand. Saying "communism is a good idea but just doesn't work in the real world" is a platitude. If you mean I make many unsupported claims, then sure. What do you want me to do about it?

>No, I'm saying you make posts that contain nothing but an insult.

Can you cite one?

>>5170032
Are you trying to parody me?

>> No.5170073

If you ever want to get into character as a woman, go somewhere you can impersonate one online, and just chill for a while.

After only an hour or two of having no social guidelines or rules and no possibly faux pas you could ever make, of being able to do whatever you want, be as rude as you want, be as stupid and boring as you want, to let conversations hang and know with 100% certainty the other guy will pick up the slack even to the point of doing all the work, you'll have an esoteric understanding of what it is to be a woman. Now just remember that's all day every day for them.

Then realise that it's not necessary to write a book about that kind of creature, because you now know the reason they never fucking do anything worth writing about.

>> No.5170096

>>5170053
Actually that makes perfect sense: competition for boyfriends and status. Thanks for making sense of high school anon

>> No.5170103

>>5170096
I got to do a good deed today.

>> No.5170106

>The short answer imo:

Woman are mainly socially oriented in their thoughts
Man are mainly goal oriented in their thoughts

>> No.5170109

>>5168805
Interesting how it isn't a woman asking the question.

>> No.5170116

http://www.onfiction.ca/2011/02/actor-and-observed-man-and-woman.html

>> No.5170123

>>5170032
And just for future reference, calling me an idiot directly doesn't mean much to me, if you demonstrate my idiocy then it's more likely to.

Also, I'm not sure if you're aware, but I try to not say, "you are an idiot", I try to say "what you just said was idiotic". I don't doubt that I have directly insulted someone in the former, but it's not impossible.

And please, this passive-aggressive bantering is atrocious and painstaking to me. Please, if you have a problem with me and how I post, then do what you can to confront my posting directly. I like that >>5170029
this post calls me out for posting habits I have that are not acceptable. I try to be reasonable if I'm confronted in a reasonable fashion.

>> No.5170182
File: 172 KB, 900x1200, 1398185019122.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5170182

Thinking on it, nearly all of my fiction has a female protagonist. I'm not really sure why. Maybe it's because I've been surrounded by women all my life- my dad worked long hours growing up, and I had three younger sisters and a stay-at-home mom. Maybe it's because women have always been the ultimate "other" for me, and I have an insatiable urge to explore the unknown. It's probably both of those things and yet more.

I can't offer any advice, however, beyond trying to find a woman who likes to read and letting her critique your work. Writing women is something you have to feel. It's an art, not a science. They're exactly like men- and yet they're not.

>> No.5170207

>>5170123
Are you really so self-absorbed that you think I care about you at all?

Fuck you. You're a complete and total idiot. I have no need to clarify or to make an argument to justify it to you, because you're an idiot. Le Eliot Roger Face.

>> No.5170210

>>5170182
Dumn dem white girls thick

>> No.5170213

>>5170072
I mean that you do not offer a perspective on anything that anyone hasn't heard a thousand times.

>Can you cite one?

>>/lit/thread/S5083996#p5084004

>> No.5170219

>>5170210

Has to be photoshop. Probably fat butt fetishists

>> No.5170224
File: 35 KB, 910x272, Screen Shot 2014-05-20 at 8.27.32 PM.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5170224

>>5168089
i write using the opposite gender all the time. if you aren't already accounting for the things that make women different from men—environment, relationship with parents, fears and insecurities, etc.—then you're writing bad characters. this means that the people who say "it doesn't matter at all, just fill in the pronouns later" are exactly as stupid as people who say "write everything with gender at the forefront of your mind."

a woman is about as different from a man as a woman is different from a woman 100 years in the past. the biological difference is negligible.

>if you need to ask this question, you shouldn't be writing anything.

>> No.5170266

>>5170213
>I mean that you do not offer a perspective on anything that anyone hasn't heard a thousand times.

Maybe that's because 99% of the questions and topics on /lit/ are things people could answer by thinking on their own and doing research. Are you angry that I told you off in some thread? Piss off, /lit/ isn't really "intellectual". And yes, I made a low-quality post once. What do you make of it? If I could look through your post history I could pick a few and prove you're a moron too. Hiding behind the obscurity of anonymous doesn't mean your posting habits are good and assaulting another's character because you're too afraid to expose yours isn't honorable. If you want good discussion out of me, make a thread that isn't braindead garbage and make a post that has content to look into. Or, better yet, instead of coming back with one line meaningless insults, be the good guy and use rhetoric and language to spark discussion.

>> No.5170286

>>5170213
>>/lit/?task=search&ghost=yes&search_text=le+trole+faec

And of course, careful examination of the results of my name show quite a few more "anonymous posters" blatantly shitposting about me and quite a few posts of mine with real content. Selective memory is a bitch, isn't it?

>> No.5170296

>>5170266
Go to bed Le Eliot Roger Face

>> No.5170316

>>5168089
Yes, but it didn't turn out very well. She was basically Gandalf with a drinking problem. Which is fine, but there was really nothing female about the character other than her being really pretty in my head.

>> No.5170325

>>5168162
>But from my observations of humans....

Oh boy here we go

>> No.5170332

>>5170266
>Maybe that's because 99% of the questions and topics on /lit/ are things people could answer by thinking on their own and doing research.
Then why do you come here?

>Are you angry that I told you off in some thread?
No.

>Piss off, /lit/ isn't really "intellectual".
That's common knowledge.

>What do you make of it? If I could look through your post history I could pick a few and prove you're a moron too.
I'm not questioning your occasional impulsive idiocy, I am saying that you never say anything but the commonest of echos.

>Hiding behind the obscurity of anonymous doesn't mean your posting habits are good and assaulting another's character because you're too afraid to expose yours isn't honorable.
I am surprised that you even take the idea of "honor" seriously.

>Or, better yet, instead of coming back with one line meaningless insults, be the good guy and use rhetoric and language to spark discussion.
But this board isn't intellectual, so what's the point?

>> No.5170333

>>5168406
>>5168386
>>5168367
>>>/reddit/

leave if you don't like it

>> No.5170348

>>5168089
>Have you ever written something with female protagonist?
yeah

>What was your thinking process while writing?
didn't really think much about it.

>How did you get into character, etc.?
she was a human, like anyone else. i didn't let myself make too many assumptions about what a female should specifically act like. but if i went back and replaced the protag with a man, it wouldn't work so i must have hit upon something right.

>> No.5170457

>>5168089
I wrote a short play with a female lead. I just took a lot of inspiration from experiences with ex girlfriends and worked from empathy to figure out what I thought their motivations were and how they differed from my own.

>> No.5170462

>>5170332
>I'm not questioning your occasional impulsive idiocy, I am saying you never say anything but the commonest of echos.

Have I been talking with you for a while? In any case, I do not nothing but the "commonest of echos", and if you dug through my post history I think you will find that is evident.

>I am surprised that you even take the idea of "honor" seriously.

In what way are you mocking me? Do you think honor is a fiction? I take the concept of honor very seriously

>this board isn't intellectual

Did I call the entire board unintellectual?

Tell me Feminister, honestly, is this your first post in the thread?

>> No.5170507

>>5170462
Feminister vs Le Eliot Roger Face.

Can't wait.

>> No.5170568

>For me, the issue of feminism is just not an interesting concept. I'm more interested in, you know, SpaceX and Tesla, what's going to happen with our intergalactic possibilities. Whenever people bring up feminism, I'm like, god. I’m just not really that interested.

>For me, a true feminist is someone who is a woman who does exactly what she wants. If my choice is to, I don't know, be with a lot of men, or if I enjoy a really physical relationship, I don't think that’s necessarily being anti-feminist.

Elizabeth Woolridge Grant

>> No.5170584
File: 197 KB, 634x919, article-0-137700B7000005DC-588_634x919.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5170584

>>5170568
true human being

>> No.5170616

>>5170507
I actually suspect she's been posting in this thread for a while without her trip, given her thread of debate about my apparent posting of "common echos" and her replying to a comment that was a reply to the Anonymous poster. Did she simply forget to take her trip off?

Feminister, if it really was you posting in this thread without your name to try and browbeat me, then you are a pathetic person.

>> No.5170630

>>5170616
I just want to see a tripfight.

>> No.5170631

>>5170584
even fat girls are laughing at that guy

>> No.5170633

I am writing a short story with a female protagonist told in the first person.

My hobbies include: making tea, cooking, reading in the garden, gardening, collecting fine china, ...

I'm finding it to be pretty easy.

>> No.5170652

>>5168162


l
m
a
o

>> No.5170663

>>5170584

>> No.5170675

So is /lit/ the most intellectual board or is it just the most conceited? Possibly both?
Some of you definitely give me the impression of greatly enjoying the smell of your own farts, but maybe it's just the way you write and are actually cool guys AFK.
Either way, probably some of the less shitpostish discussion I've ever seen on 4chan.
Good job.
Carry on.

>> No.5170677

Indeed, not only have I written a book about one woman, I've written a few stories where all the major characters are women. It's fun. Girls can be incredibly expressive and silly, and I think this benefits slice-of-life stories.

>> No.5170682
File: 927 KB, 500x295, 1401922515619.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5170682

>>5170568
>>5170584
>>5170631
>>5170663

>> No.5170792

>>5170462
>Have I been talking with you for a while?
I started posting here
>>5169917
I put my trip on to be honorable 4 u

>In what way are you mocking me? Do you think honor is a fiction? I take the concept of honor very seriously
Yes, well, some people take the idea of astrology very seriously.

>Did I call the entire board unintellectual?
yes
>Piss off, /lit/ isn't really "intellectual".

>> No.5170794

>>5170631
her knees ain't laughing

>> No.5170863

>>5169726
There are differences between people. There are dumb uninteresting stupid women and men. The opposite also holds true also. This goes for any arbitrary dichotomy. I don't really give a damn about some social agenda to prove one is better than the other. As far as I am concerned, the issue is pretty juvenile.

>> No.5170913

I've always thought the best way to 'understand' women would be to read books written by them.

Read enough of them and you'll see they're as numerous and varying in quality, intelligence, temperament, and insecurities as men.

I figure you'd write them the same way you write anyone else. People are people.

>> No.5170932

>>5168162
Surprisingly insightful for a teenager.

>> No.5170956

>>5170932
don't lower your standards to YA tier

>> No.5171014

>>5170956
Now if I were doing that, it would have been an unqualified statement. The kid's advanced for his age, and when he's got some experience to back it up, he might just make a decent storyteller. As it is, he could probably get a movie deal. He's certainly got a better grasp of gender politics than Meyer or Rowling, since we're playing YA, and I can't help but feel Harry Dresden would be a much more interesting character if written by a CRAWLINGINMYSKIN-tier otherkin.

>> No.5171056

>>5168089
All my characters are female or androgynous beta fuccbois. I can`t imagine what it would be like to be a normal male( Chad Thundercock) or to write from that perspective.

It`s like having a loudspeaker blasting >"PUSSYPUSSYPUSSYLOTSOFSLOPPYWETTHOTTPUSSYGOOFYPUSSYPUSSYPUSSYVAGINAYOUMUSTOBTAINIT``
inside their mind.
because I don`t possess this inner voice, apparently I am gay, which I have no problem with being, even though I`ve never had sex with a man. I live in a country where it`s safe to be considered a homosexual, so that`s alright. The only people who ever call me a faggot are on the web, but sometimes I act extra gay and\or beta to piss them off, it's like taunting a vicious dog that chained up behind a fence. They loath anything that challenges or raises doubt about their worldview that pussy is the objective goal of human existence, which they use to excuse their brutish treatment of females.

Women are just put on this earth to suffer the advances of mean men. I see women as blameless sufferers who have no time to develop any personality because men are always trying to lay the dick on them and stuff them like a christmas goose any chance they get. Women spend all their time avoiding danger and hiding. The cruelty of capitalism forces them out into the world and into the wolfish jaws of the male sex, to be sold like meat. I imagine the closest thing to a female perspective would be like Watership Down, but even more alien, like constantly victimized, prey, in which every day you aren't raped or killed is a good day. Constant fear and desire for comfort, which I like other males, mock as sentimentality, moralizing, or poor taste.

>> No.5171073

>>5171056
Haha. That was good.

Women like sex.

>> No.5171097

>>5171056
Best new pasta

>> No.5171110
File: 394 KB, 584x622, this kills the lit.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5171110

>>5170792

>> No.5171134

what i do is, i imagine myself in a dress, born and raised as a girl, and then i change my life to what i am writing about, after i get the whole 'im a girl' way of thinking down, and i act as the character in my story, not as myself ... its kind of like waking up from sleep, you know nothing of yourself for a brief moment, or where you are (to use in search of time an as example)

mmm basically trying to remove yourself, and how you would behave, from the story. to become someone else. it is easier if you are observant and experience many kinds of people, or know a character type very well.

i dont know,

>> No.5171143

>>5171073
How could you ever know that they don't just pretend to in order to alleviate the guilt in the heart of the modern man?

Do you really think it makes a difference to men if women enjoy sex or not?

The occurrence of the "sensuous woman" is merely an attempt by females to ape the male definition of humanity, being the predatory capacity to seek and obtain sexual intercourse. The recognition an concession to a painful reality; that men will rape them no matter what they think of it; so then, why not attempt some technique of persuading men to woo them by other means than brute force. If women were to be truthful about their reservations about intercourse, men would simply rape them, seeing the fulfillment of male values of as superior to mercy. If women did enjoy sex, why wouldn't they all become prostitutes at least?

Even if the truly did enjoy sex in a limited capacity, which would be as far as your argument could go. The nature of male sexuality and it's insatiable lusting for carnal gratification is incompatible with any female enjoyment of intercourse, for men want always to do it ceaselessly and they always want women to stoop to increasingly repulsive and painful deeds like blowjobs and anal. Male sexuality is clearly founded upon the domination and debasement of women as revenge for the previous occasion upon which they (as a sex, for women are not individuated) denied them it. Maybe women enjoy being held or something, or like, lightskin nigga shit, but men don't enjoy that, they want to berry their dick as hard and deep as possible.

>> No.5171173

>>5170863
Of course neither men are women are "better" without relation to some state or purpose. Are men better at lifting heavy things? Absolutely! But I don't believe in inherent superiority/inferiority

>>5170792
I don't think you understood what I meant when I said it's not "intellectual".

>> No.5171232

Writing female characters really isn't much different than writing for males. Really, the only thing you have to take into account is their status and identity in whatever social situation you happen to be writing, and whether you're gonna follow it, subvert it, break through it, or submit to it.

>> No.5171239

>>5171143
You start with the assumption that women don't like sex. This is your beginning. And it's entirely wrong. Women love sex. Get over it. It's not hard to understand. Women and men love sex, together, with women, with men. It has nothing to do with gender roles or a hierarchy of social roles. People like sex! Wow!

tl;dr

Women like anal. Too.

I hardly believe you're being serious, but in case you are: go talk to a girl, for fuck's sake. And believe what they say instead of chalking it up to some sort of lie, because you seem to not trust women.

>> No.5171288

>>5171173
My god you're rescinding into your position to ward off any insinuation of prejudice rather than providing your actual motives. It's rather repulsive.

What I'm saying is I probably have more in common with someone like feminister or some other such creature than I do with your average joe. Or susy lou for that matter. I choose to surround myself with people whose company I enjoy and that tends to be a mixture of male and female, but truly those people have sailed far away from the mainland of average and normal.I don't really care about the generalities of the sexes and I feel like anyone who does other than for scientific purposes is just being petty or wants to serve some personal agenda. If we are to judge any group based on the average traits of the individuals in the group I really wouldn't mind letting every group be destroyed. But salvation lies in the nuance and complexities of individuals. The sames goes for ideas for that matter.

>> No.5171297

>>5168089
Imagine living your life according to the lessons taught by disney movies.
"Follow your dreams and what feels right at the expensive of your family, and social traditions"
Half of women think they are the main character in a disney movie. There is your value structure, now they act according to those principles.

>> No.5171299

>>5171239
>Women like anal. Too.

shouldn't this be some?

>> No.5171329

>>5171143
> implying women don't masturbate
> implying they don't want Chad to berry his manhood inside her
> implying they don't enjoy being inseminated by the man they love, and think it's incredibly hot
> being this unaware of female libido

nigga you must be twelve

>> No.5171337

>>5171288
Yes, I agree.

>> No.5171400

>>5171288
I mean, whoever you are, seriously: I don't have to pretend that men and women are not different in any respect in order to also judge each person as an individual. There are methods of inference far more useful than race, gender or whatever to judge a person by. I don't have to stick my head in the sand. I don't know, maybe you're incapable of accepting statistical data and also not being dumb as bricks when it comes to your interactions.

>> No.5171442

>>5171239
>Women like anal. Too.
Not as much as men.

>> No.5171453

>>5171442
Men are blessed with a prostate.

>> No.5172480

self bump?

>> No.5172494

>>5171337
I'm not saying you're wrong as much as I'm saying it's irrelevant on pretty much every meaningful level (to me at least) if you're right.