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/lit/ - Literature

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5071505 No.5071505 [Reply] [Original]

/lit/ likes its literary gossip here and there. Why aren't we talking about Ed Champion's 11,000 word hatchet job on Emily Gould?

http://www.edrants.com/emily-gould-literary-narcissism-and-the-middling-millennials/

Whether or not you agree with it, the surrounding reaction (on Twitter, etc) is kind of interesting in an admittedly petty way.

>> No.5071511
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5071511

Because I already did this when I reviewed "And The Heart Says Whatever" on Goodreads.

>> No.5071537

>>5071511
post it

>> No.5071561

>>5071537
Gould is too cool for school, has made salad with Tao Lin, and seems to be quietly recanting her days at cultural black-hole Gawker. Toss in some awkward, borderline-transgressive sex and a blurb from Jonathan Franzen and you're good to go for the 2010s. It's a good thing I got this for free at the Borders going-out-of-business fucktastrophe.

>> No.5071575

>>5071505
I thought that was Fionna Apple.

It's nice to be reminded of that cupcake fascism article.

I generally agree, though his feeling that all writing needs to be overtly-political is a bit ridiculous.

>> No.5071584

>>5071505
I have no idea who either of these people are. Is it worth wasting any time finding out, then reading this?

>> No.5071595

>>5071584
Probably not. Champion's essay is actually pretty exhausting, especially because it's so scornful. You might get interested for a bit, but I suspect you'd regret the time invested later on.

>> No.5071666

>>5071505

I SIMPLY CANNOT STAND THIS SELF-SATISFIED CUNT. I HOPE SHE SUFFERS FROM TERTIARY SYPHILIS.

>> No.5071672

>>5071595
Different person here, this is precisely what happened to me. I'm all in favor of reading some guy trash another guy (or girl, or whatever), but this is some tedious shit. I'm bored already. Need to keep pushing through "The Sword of the Lictor."

>> No.5071676

>>5071666

triple six confirmation

>> No.5071737

>>5071666
The article was worth it for this link:
http://www.vqronline.org/essays-articles/2014/04/grand-unified-theory-female-pain

>> No.5071763
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5071763

>>5071505
>the surrounding reaction (on Twitter, etc)

You mean women retreating right into the "defenseless and scared" position while white knights blurt out "misogynist" and use clinical language like "you should seek help"?

>> No.5071767

>>5071763
>@thebookslut
Is she for real?

>> No.5071801

>>5071763
The feminist movement really has payed off. Look at this strong, confident woman.

>> No.5071839

>>5071763
Jesus, Mary, and Joseph, I know her.

>> No.5071840

>barely halfway down the first page
>some shit about white and privileged

okay cool. there's no way these millennial could be more obnoxious that whatever retard wrote this article, no matter how shit their books are.

smacks of jealousy that one scribbler and the scribblers he admires are less popular than these women.

>> No.5072041

.. It's literally an entire essay shittalking somebody.

>> No.5072070

Ha, I've never actually paid attention to Tao Lin before but he's fucking hilarious in that cooking video. It doesn't make me want to read his books at all, though.

>> No.5072076

>>5072070
>that moment where he doesn't know if he should go ahead and talk and just points and hisses

>> No.5072081

>>5071505
Oh god, she needs to put down the thesaurus

>> No.5072098

I'm enjoying this a lot.

Has she responded to this? How would one even respond to getting wrecked this thoroughly?

>> No.5072099

>praising Lena Dunham
>saying 'people of color' non-ironically
>praising Junot Diaz's race baiting nonsense about how come there aren't more African/Inuit transgenders in MFA programs or whatever
>putting all that effort into roasting some nobody I've never heard of
The author seems like an even more pretentious twat than the pretentious twat he's attacking.

>> No.5072101

>>5072076
>>5072070

do you mean this vid?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d2BJSV8Q1Yw

>> No.5072106

>>5072101

ignore me just realized what thread im in

>> No.5072107

>>5072099
>praising Lena Dunham
Dunham is reflective, self-aware, and self-critical. It makes sense that he would praise her in contrast to a narcissist like Gould.

>> No.5072112

>>5072107
plus Girls is a great show

>> No.5072117

>>5072107
>Dunham is reflective, self-aware, and self-critical
If she were any of those things she wouldn't have a fucking lumpy butt.

>> No.5072119

>>5072112
"great"? no. somewhat entertaining in an indulgent way, sure.

>> No.5072121

>>5072101
Yes, start at 5:50 for the build up to the hiss. I fucking piss myself every time.

>> No.5072129

>>5072119
>Implying this wasn't one of the best scenes in television history
also a good illustration of my point about Dunham
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wW1IhB3CXxU

>> No.5072142

>>5072129
>Implying this wasn't one of the best scenes in television history
You mean when they had Shoshanna completely break character in order to shoehorn in a dramatic climax? Yeah, I feel comfortable saying it wasn't one of the best scenes in television history. Not even close.

>> No.5072148

>>5072142
>break character
you mean break the perception of the character created by the Hannah-centric narrative of the show and her one-dimensional role on the periphery of the show?
Kinda the entire point.

>> No.5072153

Who's worse, Gould or Penny?

>> No.5072156
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5072156

>“Dudes, I saw A-piss-a with her shirt off today,” he told Paul Westlay and Doug Terrien. Those chuckleheads chuckled, as they always do at their lord and master Joel’s crappy jokes, which are nearly always at someone else’s expense.

this is wonderful
traditional ceremonial seppuku livestreamed on Jezebel is the only possible response

>> No.5072222

>>5071505
it's funny b/c i feel like these are the "grown ups" in the literary world that some of us are going to replace. seeing them snipe back and forth and use childishly dishonest tactics on twitter is so disappointing.

>> No.5072229

>>5071737
yeah this is pretty good. what's the sontag essay she's referring to? google just links back to the article when i search the quotes.

>> No.5072233

>>5071763

>i really am tired of being scared of this fucker

what an absolute ploy that victim card move is.

fucking pathetic the things they will do to try and control the means of discourse whilst playing innocent

>> No.5072235

Links/caps of some of the reaction on Twitter?

>> No.5072371

>>5071767
I'm shocked she named her twitter account after her well-known literary site

>> No.5072394

>>5072229
I'm pretty sure its Illness as a Metaphor, mostly because of the tuberculosis mention

>> No.5072429

>>5072076
>>5072101
>>5072121
Does he actually have to think about breathing?

>> No.5072430

>>5071737
You should read the collection that essay's taken from, she's great.

>> No.5072433
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5072433

>>5072222
Quads confirm it, you are DFW's successor.

>> No.5072434

>>5072153
I haven't read Penny as extensively, but it still has to be Gould.

>> No.5072443

>>5072153
Both. Is it OK if I like /pol/ just because they managed to piss in Penny's cereal?

>> No.5072517

Holy shit this chick got BTFO. The thing that got me was the sections from her novel. This woman is a published novelist? Shit gives me hope. Comments section is a hilarious as well.

>> No.5072561

>>5072235
http://www.dailydot.com/lifestyle/new-york-lit-emily-gould-ed-champion-subtweet-war/

Guy tried to throw himself off a bridge apparently. Crazy shit

>> No.5072580

>>5072561
Wow.

It's really pathetic how people try to lazily, baselessly smear Champion as a misogynist, when reading the piece would clearly debunk though.

And as an obsessive creep, though as Friedman says he *is* obsessive, but that's not necessarily a bad thing.

This was pretty brutal, but that's good.Gould *is* a narcissistic, heartless opportunist. A shitty writer and a parasitic "journalist." Fuck her.

>> No.5072581

This is embarrassing to everyone involved.

>you were too young to see BEE and DFW go head to head
>fuck my life

Also I think obsessing over writing a book is just unhealthy. There are barely any publishers, right? And they probably all have the same background (yes, they're all straight-white-rich-men). Why the hell does it matter that you can't get your novel published when the internet has decided that your blog is worth reading?

I obviously like books but so much of this is bullshit

>> No.5072584

>>5072580
>clearly debunk though.
clearly debunk that

>> No.5072596

I really wish he didn't snap and could write an equally vitriolic response to all this bullshit painting Gould as a victim of misogyny

>> No.5072604

>>5072580
Yeah you kind of get what he's talking about in his rant when you read all those self-satisfied tweets dismissing him

As for the stuff about misogyny, I think he could have done without saying she "slept her way to the top" or whatever. Most of his criticisms are totally on point, but since his target is a woman, the intense scathingness of his tone will always be interpreted as nothing more than hatred for women.

>> No.5072613

>>5072604
You're right. I wish he hadn't been so emotionally invested in this. As much as I enjoyed reading the pure contempt he has for this woman, he would have done the world a much greater service by writing a more tactful takedown. He pretty much doomed himself and any chance of this piece making a dent in her reputation or career. 11,000 words down the drain.

maybe Kimmel will say something. He gave her a pretty good thrashing himself in that video

>> No.5072614

>>5072596
He left a response on this blog post about the whole thing that seems relatively clearheaded.

http://pdxxcollective.com/2014/06/27/whats-really-behind-middling-millennials/

>> No.5072636

>>5072614
That's good, I'm glad he defended himself against the accusations of misogyny. I've never met a misogynist who'd praise Lena Dunham

>> No.5072647

I find it shocking that ostensibly well-educated adults can be so narcissistic. You'd think that somewhere along the line they'd read a book and go "oh shit, that's me!" or see a Woody Allen movie and realize they're the type of pseudo-intellectual that's being parodied.

>> No.5072653

>>5072647
that's what makes her a narcissist

plus I don't think she is especially well read, judging from her own writing. what's her educational background?

>> No.5072658

Seriously, if all of these people stopped writing and moved to rural Alberta to live on communes or whatever, would anything of any value be lost?

Have any of these people done anything of any literary value or interest whatsoever? I include all sides in this pointless fucking controversy, to be clear.

New York City is the greatest pox on American literature currently existing.

>> No.5072659

topkek, there was a topic about Prime Teen Pussy that was deleted yesterday but I just read this paragraph in a page that I got to from OP's link.

I knew it, all these trendy journalism websites are an excuse to get down and out PTP interns.

>Along the way we plucked up a couple of n+1 interns, underage Lolitas in slutty dresses. They were sucking lollipops and carrying six packs of Blue Moon. These girls seemed like they would fuck anyone for a byline, and the men were even worse, charming them with discussions about Gaddis’ The Recognitions or the glory of the em dash. Everything I had begun to suspect — that n+1 was a place where old guys who never got laid in high school finally have their pick of the fine young crop — felt wholly true in those moments leading up to entering Sebastian's house. I felt suddenly hollowed.

http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2008/07/au_revoir_new_york_media_scene.html

>> No.5072662

>>5072653
>that's what makes her a narcissist
elaborating: it is totally normal for adolescents to be self-absorbed and "narcissistic" (personal fable). some people, like Gould, never grow out of it. that's the most significant part of Champion's criticism, in my opinion. she is the poster child of infantilization, and the twitter warriors crying bitter misogynist are your archetypical cupcake fascists