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/lit/ - Literature

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4968271 No.4968271[DELETED]  [Reply] [Original]

Why haven't you studied your Aristotle /lit/?

>> No.4968279
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4968279

thx for 2000 years of backwardness, faggot

>> No.4968287

The average person nowadays knows far more than Aristotle ever did.

I won't waste my time reading his guesswork.

>> No.4968300

Because nowadays the average 5 year old is smarter than Aristotle.

>> No.4968305

>>4968271

Aristotle literally broke my philosophical endeavor and it took me half a year to get back into it. I still have a bookmark halfway through Metaphysics.

This motherfucker is the driest, most inconsequential philosopher in the world.

>> No.4968336

>>4968305

Learn to think, bruv. His every word bears fruit.

>> No.4968342

>all the plebs ITT

Is this the kind of person I'm forced to share this board with?

>> No.4968351

>>4968342
>these guys don't even pretend to like Aristotle, like I do. fuckin' plebs

>> No.4968352

Actually, I spent the last two weeks reading Categories, Prior Analytics, and Posterior Analytics. Fuck those were dry reads. If you can follow him though they're quite interesting to read.

Now reading On The Soul, and plan to read Metaphysics, Ethics, and Politics before I move on to later philosophers. Am I missing anything?

>> No.4968356

>>4968300
You have a strange definition of smarter.

>> No.4968357

>>4968351
>having to pretend

Confirmed for absolute pleb.

>> No.4968363

>>4968342
I don't think it's possible to be forced to share, how can you even be forced to do anything? You can always kill yourself as a last resort.

>> No.4968378

>>4968352
There's many small treatises that are pretty interesting and they're some of my favourites.

On Generation and Corruption, On Dreams, History of Animals, On youth and old age, On the Heavens, On Sleep, etc.

They're the least relevant if you're just trying to see his philosophical system and his logic, but I find them very interesting from a historical point of view.

>> No.4968404

I wonder why Plato is considered the "essential" first philosopher when it was Aristotle who explicitly and systematically tackled every single area of philosophy. He wrote a treatises on Metaphysics, logic, aesthetics, politics, ethics--not to mention his natural philosophy works which while flawed from our perspective were the best explorations of the natural world.

>> No.4968412

>>4968404
A lot of Aristotle's writings either build off of or critique Plato's ideas. An understanding of Plato is required for a full appreciation of Aristotle.

>> No.4968415

>>4968412
Also, a lot of the questions that Aristotle attempts to answered are first posed in writing by Plato.

>> No.4968418
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4968418

Cause the important point is not the resemblances but the differences.

>> No.4968433

>>4968352

This guy here >>4968305. Don't get me wrong, I'll be revisiting shortly. I was 21 and not in the mood, expecting Plato or Aurelius or Epectitus or anyone but fucking Ari.

I really enjoyed Rhetoric though, that shed a lot of light on persuasion.

>> No.4968456

>>4968412
But a lot of Plato's ideas in turn build off and critique the ideas of Heraclitus, Anaximander, Pythagoras, the sophists, etc.. Aristotle did it in the rigorous, formalized way that would become standard, unlike Plato who's dialectic, dialogue method was pretty much only utilized by himself (not counting the few dialogues written as companion pieces by Hume, Berkeley, and so on).

Who really continues to work in the tradition of Plato? Philosophy has been Aristotelian since Aquinas.

>> No.4968463

Aristotle is very impressive to people who have, at best, a rudimentary understanding of how the world works. Everyone who has grown beyond that point intellectual is going to be bored to tears by him.

>> No.4968469

>>4968287
u fuckin troll 3/10 made me replay

>> No.4968565

>>4968271
I started with the Art of Rhetoric. Should have been called "how to trick people into thinking you are right"

It was essentially a very well-thought out version of a speech and debate class. Almost finished, gave up in disappointment and disgust.

>> No.4968608

What Plato writings are essential?

>> No.4968639

>>4968608

Just read them all. It isn't too much.

>> No.4969426
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4969426

>reading Aristotle
>mfw

>> No.4969454

>>4968271
Because I'm just starting.

I was having a discussion about him with my teacher. He says that Aristotle was actually opposed to slavery. He said that ideally, humans are not meant to be slaves but because of unequal gifts, they are.

Since you're the expert, what do you think about Aristotle's views of slavery.

>> No.4969473

>>4969426
what does rust cohle have to do with anything

>> No.4969794

>>4968565
You should understand that Aristotle distinguishes between dialectic, rhetoric, and more rigorous, scientific inquiry. The latter is outlined in prior and posterior analytics and is probably more in line with what you would consider a more tasteful method of inquiry and discourse.

>> No.4969834
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4969834

Because he was wrong about everything :)

>> No.4971441

>>4969834
>hasn't studied him
>claims he was wrong about everything based on secondhand opinions

You got dat dere intellectual lazyness m8

>> No.4972812

>>4969794
Is not rhetoric just a subset of dialectic?

>>4969454
Not OP, but ideally, there would be no slaves, only wage earners in their place, so that one feels like they have a piece in their society. Slavery does nothing except create a schism between members of society and create a reliance on a method of labor that will not last forever.

>> No.4972840

>>4968271
I only studied his work about drama in my intro to theatre class way back in freshman year. in hindsight we only really read a summary of his 6 elements of drama in our textbook. maybe I should go back and read what he actually said.

>> No.4973145

>>4968271
Because Aristotle singlehandedly undermined philosophy as a legitimate pursuit by saying: "Muh empirical evidence"

>> No.4973193

>>4973145
This is the one thing that bugged me about Categories and some of his other works. While I can't construct a fantastic argument in response, his 'Everything comes from what we can sense' was something I wholeheartedly disagreed with.

>> No.4973204

I studied Aristotle years ago. The reason why I stopped studying Aristotle is because there isn't any reason to continue reading his works. I read to be introduced to new ideas, or to have my ideas challenged. Aristotle does neither.

>> No.4973213

>>4973204
>Aristotle's Metaphysics, Ethics, Politics, and Posterior Analytics
>not new

Unless you started with philosophy works after Aristotle than proceeded to read Aristotle afterwards, how could this be?

>> No.4973285

>>4968608
Apology, Crito, Republic, Diotima

>> No.4973296

>>4973193
Yeah, essentially, as much of an asshole and as wrong as Plato was, he was really one of the few philosophers who managed to stay within the discipline without bullshitting out of it.

>> No.4973298

>>4973285
I think it's important to read Medea by Euripides before you read the Apology.

>> No.4973304

>>4973285
You forgot Euthyphro

>> No.4973385

>>4973296
What qualifies as bullshitting out of it?

>> No.4973397

>>4968271

Why?

I have every reason to not study Aristotle.

He's bad and your post was bad and you should feel bad

>> No.4973689

>>4973397
You're going to have to substantiate your claims a bit more if you don't want to seem like an ignorant cunt.

>> No.4973769

>>4968352
Poetics!

> dat Birth of Tragedy-Poetics connection

Nietzsche said he was the best of the Greeks for a reason you fucking faggots.

>> No.4973787

>>4973769
Nietzsche didn't know shit tho

>> No.4973793

>>4973787

And if you shit towards the sky it rains on everyone.

>> No.4974046

>>4973689

>taking the bait

>> No.4975160

>>4968271
Wasn't Aristotle supposed to be a chicken legged wimp?

>> No.4975167

>>4973787
btw nietszsche did know a thing or 2 about greek philosphy and shit. Translating greek shit was like his occupation before becoming a writer

>> No.4975223

>>4973204

Aristotle refutes the history of philosophy over the course of his work.

>> No.4975783

>>4975223
>history of philosophy
All things considered that's not much.

>> No.4975956

>>4973145
All of our activities require perception and sensation. To think of the soul or of the mind as capable as reasoning independently (as in the case of Plato's theory of forms) is absurd. Aristotle is based for realizing that we can't think of sensation, or mind, or soul as independent, autonomous actualities. They are either, as in the case of the soul, actualities of potentialities of the body or inconceivable in any fashion but the potentiality of the senses incomprehensible without the actuality of sensing.

>> No.4975966

>>4973193
>Everything comes from what we can sense.

What does it feel like to smell without something to smell? What does it feel like to see without something to see? How can we think and reason without sense perception?

>> No.4975971

>>4973285
Pheado and Apology are all you really need in addition to the Republic.

>> No.4976197

Fuck Metaphysics is a tough read.