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/lit/ - Literature

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4701053 No.4701053 [Reply] [Original]

I want to write something very ambitious.

What's the greatest thing you can imagine, /lit/?

>> No.4701059

>>4701053
World-wide war with each country having its own part on the story.

>> No.4701065

>What's the greatest thing you can imagine, /lit/?

Imagine having four or five friends that you trust and love as much as your best friend.

>> No.4701067

The greatest thing I can imagine? A city, with one large skyscraper and bridges connecting all of the buildings, located in a valley bearing a resemblance to Yosemite Valley, with an enormous tree situated in the city's epicenter.

>> No.4701070

a story chronicling the creation and death of the universe from the first few quarks to emerge post big bang to the big crunch crushing everything once more.

>> No.4701074

A book with one character.

>> No.4701079
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4701079

To me, The Divine Comedy is the grandest and most ambitious work ever created, simply because of the scale of what it encompasses.

Dante takes the highest of all the literary forms (epic poetry) and writes a story that traverses Hell, Purgatory, and Heaven, all the extraworldly realms of existence. In the process, he encounters figures, learning, and ideas from ALL of Western Civilization up to his point. Everything from Homer to Dante's own contemporary poets is included in some form in the Comedy. He's gathered the breadth and depth of all learning that he's aware of and funneled it into a journey across the cosmos as he knows it, all directed toward the highest goal he can think of: praising God.

I think it's time we had a work of similar scale that encompasses everything between the Divine Comedy's completion to our own day. Something that takes the REST of Western thought and organizes it towards a single grand theme.

>> No.4701087

>>4701053
>What's the greatest thing you can imagine, /lit/?
Chevy truck month

>> No.4701092

>>4701074
a story with one character that appears to have several characters until the very end of the story. e.g. a man with multiple personality disorder that sits in a room talking to himself

>> No.4701097
File: 72 KB, 900x900, Identity.2003.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
4701097

>>4701092

>> No.4701100

>>4701079
Never read it. Is The Divine Comedy worth reading? Is it boring?

>> No.4701110

>>4701100
Yes, and yes. For me, it was one of those books that I had to force myself to read but found to be far more rewarding an experience than almost anything else I might have done with that time.

>> No.4701111

The ephemeral presence of God

>> No.4701121

Not particularly great but I find that not revealing the main char's gender until the very end gets some interesting reactions

>> No.4701128

orgyofthewill.net

this

>> No.4701129

Just keep writing and never end what you're writing. Introduce new characters and let central characters fall out of focus and die. Write about rich-ass rappers, Roman consuls, Civil War soldiers, serfs, the Maya, a merchant during the crusade, women in 1500 AD Vietnam. Don't try to connect any of it thematically. Just write and write and write. Tell every story and let the theme be "life is too diverse for a theme statement."

>> No.4701131

Find a concept that quickly goes fractal in possibilities and run it to a satisfying conclusion.

Good topics for this include war, time travel, unique world building, and politics.

Alternatively, pick a topic or aesthetic that's never been done before, or do something fucked in the head, and make it work, like writing the entire book in limerick and still having it be awesome.

>> No.4701133

>>4701053
Write about your generation and capture it's problems in an original way.

>> No.4701142

>>4701131
>time travel
has there ever been a good story involving time travel?

>> No.4701145

Has any story ever been about the collapse of the dystopia? You always hear about "But the dystopia was doomed to fail"- what would actually look like? Does someone outside the dystopia swoop in? Internal revolt? What is the straw that breaks the camels back, and what happens once it falls?

As far as I know, no one has written the collapse and post dystopia story.

>> No.4701152

>>4701145
I think it would be like the soviets, more embarrassing than epic.

>> No.4701153

>>4701079
Let's do it. An epic poem which at least encompasses the breadth of the mass media society in which we live, and its effects in myriad form.

If there's one thing our generation needs, it's to understand the effects of electronic media culture since its 20th century creation until now.

Given the underpinning renaissance era philosophy had in fueling the industrial revolution which underpins our current consumption culture (reflected in cultural and material consumerism), the relationships are at least easy enough to trace. What exactly the poem would be about, that's harder to say. I imagine its form would be cinematic, like Neal Stephenson's writing (not to imply Stephenson is the epitome of modern writing, but his prose has a cinematic element which is impossible to ignore and which embodies a modern approach to The Story).

>> No.4701154

The story is irrelevant for the most part. In this day and age, ambition is metatextual. Make the most ambitious metatextual statement and you're good, even if the actual story is just a guy going to the woods.

>> No.4701148

>>4701142
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_End_of_Eternity
One of the better things he's written.

>> No.4701162

>>4701153
>like Neal Stephenson's writing (not to imply Stephenson is the epitome of modern writing, but his prose has a cinematic element which is impossible to ignore and which embodies a modern approach to The Story).
Can you elaborate on this?

>> No.4701163

>>4701142

The film Primer did a good job with it, I feel. Four engineers accidentally discover time travel which opens the potential for "clones" of oneself and splits the timeline. The rest of the film is cataloging the clusterfuck that emerges. By the end, I think there were at least five timelines going at once and about 12 variations of the main characters in various states of time and disarray were running about trying to fuck each other up.

>> No.4701164

>>4701153
I don't think it'd be cinematic. I feel like that's too Romantic for us. Our internal monologues read more like Tao Lin prose. I'm not saying write it like Taipei, but grandiosity is itself opposed to the zeitgeist.

>> No.4701181

>>4701152

Doesn't make it less ambitious. Like, just assuming you did it with 1984, for example, Big Brother's fallen. Suddenly, the curtain's removed: what was real, what was not? What happens to the proles? The party? Who takes control and how? What do external politics look like? How does a populace recover from years of brainwashing? There's a lot of meat in there that hasn't really been picked.

>> No.4701186
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4701186

>>4701111

What in the blueberry fuckmuffins just happened?

>> No.4701194

>>4701164
But it's not grandiosity which embodies cinematic writing, it is the ironic and irreverent style, which mass media culture has seemed to march steadily towards.

>>4701162
Like I said earlier, irreverence. I'm afraid I don't have a book on hand, but I'm thinking about Snow Crash specifically, and some of his earlier work as well. It is hyperbolic, but in an honest tongue-in-cheek way. "Maybe they'll listen to Reason." sounds like a line from James Bond. And the descriptions of events as well are focused on a surface-level description of occurrences whose detail is almost pornographic.

>> No.4701201

>>4701181
more like
>I can't believe everyone was this much of an asshole for no goddamn reason for all this time

>> No.4701211

>>4701194
Now that I think about it, "The House of the Venerable and Inscrutable Colonel" being played absolutely straight probably should have given that away immediately.

>> No.4701216

Create a new epic that brings unifying a unifying cultural context for the genoration that follows the mellenials

>> No.4701223

>>4701201

>implying that it's the only dystopia
>implying anyone thinks Big Brother was an asshole
>implying those massive armies roaming around are just going to surrender

Please.

>> No.4701224

>>4701164
Ironically, the way Dante wrote the Comedy, at least in my experience, works fairly well for our ADD society. Each Canto is, what, five pages? At most?

Maybe we could have our own Cantos, only they could be even shorter, like a page or two long. So the poem would have lots of Cantos, and be a sort of commentary on how in our society higher numbers are better in just about everything?

>> No.4701228

Write a book using only punctuation. You must legally change your name to a punctuation mark or series of punctuation marks so that the cover will be entirely punctuation as well.

>> No.4701230

>>4701059
That would be a fucking good idea, actually. Brb in a hundred years or so with my magnum opus.

>> No.4701231

>>4701228

?

>> No.4701234

>>4701223
>implying the armies even exist
>implying tanks and airplanes aren't just being shipped to the sahara and then recycled as scrap

>> No.4701238

>>4701110
So you forced yourself to like it. You like the idea of liking it and that's why you enjoyed it, because you forced yourself to. Definition of pleb, everyone.

>> No.4701242

>>4701231
...?

>> No.4701246

...
!
-
"!!"
"?"
"!!"
"!"
!!
-
.
...
!!!
?
"."
"..."
!
.

gib money plz

>> No.4701254

>>4701238
>implying i genuinely like anything

>> No.4701252

>>4701234

>implying that the armies weren't the only real thing the empire was producing
>implying that the city he was in wasn't part of the multistructured experimental containment projects testing a number of forms of governance
>implying they didn't only notice Winston because his trips to the wilderness with Julia brought him outside of the containment zone without official moderation, jeopardizing the experiment's insular nature

>> No.4701259

>>4701211
Continuing on the original idea, I think that we can safely replace the Divine Comedy's reverence for the afterlife with our modern reverence of science and futurism.

Inferno:Purgatorio:Paradiso::Past:Present:Future

Our current society seems to wait for science to solve our problems and usher in a new kingdom. In line with the tongue-in-cheek and irreverence of the Cinematic Style, I think it would be easy to use this as a tool to abuse this idea, to point out the folly of supplanting ideology with scientism. To use the irony which, in modern society is used against ideology, against futurism. The irony of hoping that human nature will change without human ideas changing.

But, of course I want to use that style to abuse the anti-ideological sentiments because I hold them in disdain.

>> No.4701260

>>4701092
Mallone dies.

>> No.4701264

>>4701223
bad governments run on cover-up and lies. when they go down they lose to inevitability, fuckups and general lack of anyone being in charge of anything.

the drama of a revolution is someone trying to salvage something. if you remove that it's just a lame comedy.

>> No.4701269

>>4701238
I'm that way with everything because I'm lazy, I have to force myself get out of bed because I know staying in bed will just make me regretful by evening.

>> No.4701285

>>4701264

Not necessarily. Who's to say that that's the fault of the lies and cover up and not how it's handled? Why can't bad governance perfected be just as viable as good governance perfected? You make assumptions based on living in a relatively peaceful society with singular hegemonic power. Remove that, and who's to say the drama isn't deciding who decides what salvaging means: one state, another, or the people?

>> No.4701303

>>4701246
>Beautiful. Avant-garde. A new approach to literature.

>> No.4701306

>>4701285
if it was perfected it would no longer be bad. it would require a lot of words to explain but evil is just unnecessary and ineffective.

>> No.4701308

>>4701259
Was it meant to be ironic that you equate Hell with the past?

http://www.sacred-texts.com/chr/dante/in10.htm
>the condemned have knowledge of future things, but are ignorant of what is at present passing, unless it be revealed by some newcomer from earth.

What is "the Cinematic Style"? Is it a montage or a sequence shot?

>> No.4701321

>>4701306

>Implying that perfect destruction of dissent and perfected coverup still isn't bad even if it's just as effective as long as an alternative exists

>> No.4701326

>>4701321
opportunity cost

>> No.4701329

>>4701326
>Implying economics is relevant to a discussion of subjective morality

>> No.4701333

>>4701308
It is meant to be ironic, but not irony from Dante's passage, that is just a happy accident. I don't agree with that sentiment, which is why I want to use irony to debase it.

What I mean, by cinematic style, is pornographic levels of description, and irreverent and tongue-in-cheek hyperbole (like I was talking about earlier). I still have no idea where I'd go with these ideas. I'm just starting to rough them out in my head. I'd want it to be rich in symbolism, which is hard if I also want to be cinematic.

I have a lot to think about right now.

>> No.4701337

>>4701329
>implying that was what was implied
>implying this is a question of morality

>> No.4701348

>>4701337

>reread made mistake mk got me #rket
>implying that we haven't been in agreement this entire time that a government which perfected government through oppression wouldn't be as effective as a government which perfected it through an alternative to opression.

>> No.4701353

>>4701053
A good video game.

>> No.4701355

The singularity. A point where all consiusnesses become interconnected and grow ever more complex. Minds being born and growing at rates which throttle the limits of physics. The entirety of this force transcending humanity and the Earth, and then spreading from star to star. This titanic phenomenon will occur all while the universe is slowly getting colder and farther apart. Epic thoughts will race through a dying cosmos in a way to make "approaching infinity" an intimate part of daily life. The singularity will spread from wing to wing of each galaxy in turn, ultimately ending an utterly static and beautiful pose. Life will dance for a very long time and then stop. No one will ever see the final or closing acts. Perfect quietness will be all that remains.

>> No.4701359

>>4701053
A good anime.

>> No.4701360

A book about either destroying the universe or creating a new one in this ones stead, with the author giving a justification no one can rebuke.

>> No.4701364

>>4701355
>A point where all consiusnesses become interconnected
You know I've heard this brought up before and by golly if it doesn't sound like the worst thing ever.

>> No.4701369

Novelize the Merzbox.

>> No.4701373

>>4701353
All of the stories have been told. Video-games are a wholly novel form of media whose classics have yet to appear

>> No.4701382

>>4701333
Rich symbolism is easier in a cinematic style, I would think.

>> No.4701387

>>4701373
I think the sentiment that video games have not reached their full potential as a medium is pretty pandemic.

>> No.4701388

>>4701382
Yeah. It's very hard to be subtle in literature because it's not like in music and cinema where there's an easily ignorable background to the foreground. Like if a piece of furniture is red and that symbolizes something you'd have to be pretty perceptive whereas in a book if they go through the trouble to point out that the piece of furniture is red then you know right away what it means.

>> No.4701409

I've been thinking of writing a book, that would look at the historical development of a government of a one state in a "fantasy" world. I mean it can't be our world, because then it's not fiction.
But instead of first person narration or general narration, that most fantasies have, it would be written in a "foucauldian" way, where formation of government and power would be exposed through the archive of various historical texts, architecture and landscape.
I think this would demand a really in-depth world building, to make everything look like it has history.
And I like the previously proposed idea ITT about fall of the "dystopia", just that you know it wouldn't be that dystopic, but more of a tyrannical government that would then transfer to something else.
Also making completely different world means that politics should be different from our, so no republics and empires or kingdoms, but something completely different.
I need to think about this a bit more, but it's an interesting idea.

>> No.4701415

>>4701387
Are they even going in the right direction?

>>4701343
>Smartphone games are being designed to be as addictive and digestible as they possibly can be.

>> No.4701425

>>4701382
In a sense, yes. But it's also more difficult in some ways. To maintain the constant self-loathing that the mass media holds for itself means to hate its own form and ridicule anyone for trying to perceive anything out of itself. "How quaint that you would try to perceive anything from my work." As the other anon pointed out, the fact that literature has to be selective (even in cinematic style) about what it chooses to describe means that creating symbolism may be too blunt.

>>4701369
>kkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

>> No.4701458

>>4701388
I got this feeling reading Watchmen. Took me a re-read to notice all the Gordian knot symbolism.

>> No.4701466

>>4701415
At the risk of sounding like a prentious idiot I'm going to say that smartphone games don't really fall under the same category as console/PC stuff. Extremely different genres at the very least.

>> No.4701492

write a sexually ambiguous erotica

>> No.4701507

>>4701466
They certainly don't fall under the same category. Smartphones games will reign supreme and push everything else out of the ring.

But I'd rather not try to hijack this thead, seeing how its content is much more interesting. Even more optimistic, in a sense. For all the time I've spent being disgusted by society I can't say I've ever thought of writing an epic poem to satirize it.

>> No.4701511

>>4701409
almost all ideas about reinventing fantasy end up sounding like tolkien's stuff

>> No.4701519

>>4701415
No, because they are trying to make epic movies while aping shitty books.
They need to go back to the arcade era when any story told was told through playing, not through unlocking cutscreens.

>> No.4701520

>>4701511
He's inescapable. It's like he's Plato and modern fantasy is Western philosophy.

>> No.4701524

>>4701511
Either that or DnD

>> No.4701527

>>4701520
I disagree, but then again I don't read high fantasy because I don't like being getting my ass pumped with dicks.

>> No.4701528

>>4701511
Yeah that's the biggest problem I face.
I'm not even sure I'd even use the standard Tolkien races.
But then it ain't that fantastic. Maybe do it like GURRM did it and have mostly humans appear with few magical creatures thrown in to remind you of hey it' fantasy. But I don't like how he did it either, nor do I want to do it like that.

>> No.4701537

>>4701528
you're silly. he was already doing it right. the problem isn't that he's been copied, it's that he's been copied poorly.

if you write something that's actually like LOTR you will become a millionaire.

>> No.4701541

>>4701053
Porn tailored especially to my kinks and fetishes

>> No.4701546

>>4701528
Just change things, man.
Instead of middle earth, use the coast. Instead of elves, use mermaids. Instead of defeating the dark lord, go conquer the powerful kingdom beyond the sea. Instead of dragons and orcs, use chimeras and giant starfish.

I have no idea why people have it that difficult for writing fantasy.

>> No.4701551

>>4701355
>insufficient data for meaningful answer

>> No.4701562

>>4701507
The thing about trying to write an "epic poem to satirize society" is that none of the targets of its satire will read the damn thing. Just more self-congratulation for the echochambers that are literary circles.

Satire is supposed to motivate change, no?

>> No.4701568

>>4701121
I'd like to see a romance about this. MC has extremely attractive but androgynous features, and people who don't know MC's gender awkwardly hit on MC. The people always spaghetti everywhere.

>> No.4701574

>>4701537
Yeah I get that. I don't say he did it badly, but I want to do it different.

>>4701546
This is exactly what I want to avoid. I want to write more a treatise of how power, government and state developed over time, just that this is happening in a fantasy world.

Maybe I shouldn't go with fantasy, but some other "genre fiction", not really sci-fi, not really medieval fiction either, because it would span the ages.

Basically I'd like to present what happened to a "fantastical " enviroment of constant medieval times, that is so present in the fantasy and how this changed into "modern" society.

>> No.4701578

>>4701230
I'm working on one like that myself, an urban fantasy-sci fi thing, but I decided to make it a comic instead of a book because there's just too much visual shit to waste it on a non-visual medium.

The plan is to make a book detailing the events happening, a guide of the factions and characters in each one, a guidebook detailing the countries' traits and important places, and a script/storyboard with the cool fights; and then contract a cool illustrator to draw the entire thing.

Shit'll kill me.

>> No.4701589

>>4701562
I think literary circles still don't really recognize the deep problems of our society. The message seems unspoken, even among them. But that is, of course, my perspective. Just one of many people who think society is ill, but in a way others haven't recognized yet. You're right, it may be hard to captivate people with a poem.

>> No.4701591

>>4701562
Would a TV-series work?
>tfw you know they'll say they get it and then do nothing

>>4701574
If you want to do that, then avoid Tolkien and GRRM because they went full retard with everything outside of the quests(Tolkien) and political intrigue(GRRM).
GRRM went full potato with that one too, though.

>> No.4701599

>>4701591
>GRRM went full potato with that one too, though.
That's what actually got me to start thinking about doing something like this.
Because GRRMs politics are really, really shitty. Especially for me, a pol.sci. student with interest in history. So I'm trying to come up with a good way to do this.

>> No.4701608

A really compelling non-fiction book, based entirely on original reporting (ie stuff you witnessed personally or had happen to you).

>> No.4701614

>>4701608
So an autobiography/personal diary, just of something really interesting?

>> No.4701615

>>4701608
>stuff you witnessed personally or had happen to you
>ambitious
sasuga /lit/

>> No.4701622
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4701622

>>4701591
>>tfw you know they'll say they get it and then do nothing
>yfw a TV-series has already made that point.

Maybe this is the best of all possible worlds.

>> No.4701637

>>4701562
The only thing that is going to change anything at all is when the technocrats cancel their plans for a new and improved semi-conductor foundry when they just can't be bothered to deal with the astronomical costs anymore.

Right now? Yes, everyone is pretty much just waiting for some clownish professor somewhere to build a supercomputer that has the answer to everything.

I don't know what else there is, anon. At the most you could hope for some fucking documentary that analyzes the satirical works in question - after the author's untimely demise.

>> No.4701647

>>4701614
Either, as long as it's compelling.

>> No.4701650

I think writing an epic poem to satirize modern society is a little too much. For me, there's a certain degree of sincerity baked into epic poetry, even so-called satirical ones like "The Rape of the Lock."

>> No.4701655

>>4701647
>>4701608
What should I experience and write about then? Surely that makes some difference.

>> No.4701657

>>4701637
I'm a technocrat and I don't take part in that gay stuff you guys want to satirize.

I think you're confusing correlation with causation, there are dumb-dumbs in whatever era of history you look at, regardless of the presence of the silicon chip.

>> No.4701742

>>4701657
We could spend a while looking at all the ways our attention spans are getting fucked sideways but I'd rather not derail the thread too much.

Suppose no one wants to read the satire right now because they're too busy playing flappy bird. A shame. Perhaps future generations will be able to appreciate it when we are dead and gone.

Or maybe we'll produce such a satire for no other purpose than to be able to entertain ourselves without having to leave our echo chamber.

With a bit of luck, a movie adaptation of the work will convince a number of young grasshoppers to join our cult.

>> No.4701825

>>4701742
You're just an idea guy, so it's not like it'll happen anyway

>> No.4701887
File: 113 KB, 804x477, city-thingie.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
4701887

Related to the thread. Kind of.

In your opinion, what would be better for an urban fantasy setting?
Creating a whole alternate world that works pretty much the same like our current world, or just add things over our current world?

>> No.4702000

>>4701269
Are you me?

>> No.4702009

>What's the greatest thing you can imagine, /lit/?

A qt3.14 gf who loves literature as much as I do

>> No.4702019

>>4701887
Personally I would say our world but in the future where magic is suddenly introduced to the world.

>> No.4702065

>tfw you are just too stupid to be comfortable to write about anything that seems a little more complex
A-And if I write something stupid, /lit/?

>> No.4702129

>>4701622
I saw that, it's great.

>> No.4702138
File: 876 KB, 500x357, oblomovism.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
4702138

>>4701269
kenan & kek.jpeg

Every day I fight with this dilemma for hours. Sometimes I work an hour up towards getting up, get up, take two steps, change my mind and dive back in for a quick nap.

>> No.4702163

>>4702138
Shit nigga I'm not this bad.
You got like depression or something, I'm just lazy.

>> No.4702181

Re-imagine the entirety of human history in a completely authentic manner using valid principles of psychology/sociology/anthropology/etc., so that you arrive at a completely novel society. Then write stories set in that world.

>> No.4702184

>>4702009
and isn't a stuck up nerdwad

>> No.4702206

>>4702181
You'd need like a good score of people working in perfect tandem for their entire lives to get one century of history.

>> No.4702211

>>4702206
But then, I suppose he did ask for "ambitious."

>> No.4702229

Titan AE

>> No.4702257

>>4701887
alternate reality

>> No.4702259
File: 98 KB, 576x432, tree.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
4702259

>>4701053
I want to propose something ambitious.
Been meaning to for a while.
In fact, I know you, me, all of us aren't up to the task even. I think we can make a decent start of it though.

...

This needs it's own thread I think.

>> No.4702266

>>4702259
Even if it's good no one'll listen with that trip

>> No.4702283

>>4701097
Oh fuck, that twist.

>> No.4702285

>>4701551
Kek

>> No.4702300

>>4702266
It's not a trip.

Is OP still around?
[Thinking how to phrase my thread]

>> No.4702314

Virtual reality.

>> No.4702395

For years now, I have always had the idea in the back of my head that I wanted to write some sort of Tolkienesque with desert elves. To me, elves belong in the desert. I know little else besides that.

>> No.4702417

>>4702019
I'm considering that since one of the characters in the first part revolves around having a tablet.
Plus, I wouldn't have to come up with pretty much everything.

>>4702257
I'd still have to build an entire contemporary world, bro.
The question was if the trouble would be worth it.

>> No.4702437

>>4702300
I'm monitoring but aren't you a known shitposter or something

>> No.4702450

>>4702437
Some infants cry about seeing me post. I could assume they dislike my point of view, leftist, atheist. Or maybe I'm not "patrician" enough for the snoots. -I admit to my mistakes when I make them.
I deny the "shitposter" label.

For my idea: Do you like the Odyssey? Or the journey in general, even.

>> No.4702473

>>4702395
>desert elves
Hey that's weird and kinda different. I'm intrigued.

>> No.4702477

I'm writing an atheist version of Paradise Lost

>> No.4702482

>>4702477
Go to bed Philip Pullman.

>> No.4702490

>>4702482
A WELL WRITTEN atheist version of PL, not a ya pos that takes up space in the fantasy section

>> No.4702493

>>4702450
I guess? It's not really about what I like.

>> No.4702497

>>4702477
Milton was barely a theist lets be real

>> No.4702503

>>4702473
What is the stereotype of elves? Lithe, tall, white, good with magic. All of these things (bar whiteness) are useful in a desert setting (see Maghreb peoples). Magic especially, since it would allow a people in so hostile a climate to flourish more easily. I also tend to imagine them as more Arab-looking in cities of tinted glass made from their mountains of sand. I just have no idea what to do with it. A friend and I were mulling about a D&D campaign around a sand city, but nothing came of it.

>> No.4702526

>>4701053
Writing in meter.

>> No.4702545

>>4701053
Ten novels in one sitting. Go!

>> No.4702567
File: 103 KB, 1280x696, 1395804528673.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
4702567

>>4702493
It's a group project (I can only write concepts it seems) >>4702563

>> No.4702575

>>4702300
Yes it is, disregard me, there is a cock in my ass.

>> No.4702595

>>4702545
stephen king pls go and stay go forever

>> No.4703618

The origin of a prophet and the religion he creates

>> No.4703622

>>4702567
that idea is so dumb that i'm embarrassed for you.

>> No.4703630

>>4701053
If you want to know the most ambitious thing you could possibly write, read Tlön, Uqbar, Orbis Tertius.

>> No.4703649
File: 179 KB, 1280x800, logh-characters[1].png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
4703649

I've always wanted to write a book with an extremely large cast of main characters, with even more minor characters.

>> No.4703859

>>4703630
I know why you say this but, could OP grasp the real ambitiousness of writing one short story like that?

>> No.4704924

>>4702526
what does that mean?

>> No.4705760

>>4703649

How many books would you intend to make of that story?

>> No.4705823

>>4703649
>>4705760
I would probably write it as a television show, and make at least 110 episodes of it.

>> No.4707982

>>4703649
The crazy thing is that all the characters are extremely well written

>> No.4708012
File: 1.37 MB, 800x1200, mzi.deoycfpg.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
4708012

I think this movie tried to encompass pretty much everything. Fictive realities generating infinitely more meta realities to encompass our reality which is just another fiction. Shit's trippy as fuck.

>> No.4708014

The moral of this movie was think less, do more. Stop thinking about your art and start making it. /lit/ Im looking at you.

>> No.4708018

>>4708012
I still can't decide whether I admire that movie or loathe it.

Either way, I certainly didn't enjoy it.

>> No.4708021

>>4708014
you could think more and post less. what if the people posting about contemplating things forever just post more often than those who get things done?

>> No.4708034

>>4708018
I feel kind of the same, but the ending redeems it completely. I was nearly crying at the end.

>> No.4708081

being genuine on the page is as ambitious as it gets. let's see if you can maneuver it

>> No.4708150

>>4701079
I agree. But I'd add Paradise Lost by Milton comes close in scope. I covers the Fall of Man and Satan becoming Satan. I only read Books 1-3, 6, 8-10 for class but if fucking blew me away. AND Milton was blind so he dictated every line of blank verse. Insane.

>> No.4708154

You'll never beat L Ron Hubbard in writing ambition.

>> No.4708161

>>4708018
HA! I fee the same exact way. I love Kaufman and PSH (RIP) but I grapple with this film every time I watch it.

>> No.4708817

>>4701053
not the greatest thing I imagined. but something I'd really like to invest some time in the next years. it's about a comparision between processes of resilience in human psychology and in a natural environment.
I have this idea in my head since years but I need to find more ideas and material to even start to write something.

>> No.4708838

>>4708817
Sound interesting anon, I might steal this.

>> No.4708843

>>4708838
oh purrfect

>> No.4708847

SNY is one of those movies once you get it you don't want to watch it again.

I'd definitely watch Death Race or Transformers 2 again and again, tho.

>> No.4708858

anon gets a gf

>> No.4708867

>>4708154
That's business ambition.
Get it right.

>> No.4708885

>>4702503
I'd like to read something with Dark Elves in the desert, that seems more fitting. Pale skin is better for underground and really dark skin is better for sunny environments so I dunno why D&D stuck dark elves under a mountain :/

>> No.4709129

A novel written half in minimalist-style third-person half in stream of consciousness first person about an old man living in the woods in the middle ages eating hallucinogenic mushrooms and going on a quest to find "the orient". 800 pages long

>> No.4709144

>>4709129
Written kind of in the style of hermann broch

>> No.4709140

>>4701053
create a world all of your own. thats the hardest thing to do. that and practical magical realism, fucking shit is impossible. i dont know how the japanese do it so well

>> No.4709201

I tried to write a story once that only contained two characters
One of the characters is the author of the story itself and is dismayed at the fact the other character lacks his own autonomy
He tries to change this by having the other character read his manuscript, the very manuscript that you the reader are supposed to be reading
The other character then engages the author in a dialogue about the nature of his existence that turns into an infinite regress
The book was literally supposed to continue on like this until I, the author, died.

>> No.4709226

>>4709201
Do you have autism?

>> No.4709227

try to describe an object in a room in 800 pages or more

>> No.4709231

>>4709201
What did the author read?

>> No.4709305

>>4709231
the idea came partially from breakfast of champions and partially from waiting for godot
I was going to make the story meta-referential including extensive research on a hypothesis that a friend of my dads came up of with that Kilgore Trout was actually a fictional character (fictional even within the 'universe' that Vonnegut creates)

At some point the author becomes aware of how painstakingly pointless the entire process is and tries to force the other character to kill him which fails since, as the author writes, the character refuses.

There's also a scene where the author has the other character write part of story which also fails since, in actuality, it is the author writing the character writing the story.

Basically it starts out as a story about an author who tries to give one of his characters autonomy and winds up as a story about an author who is desperately trying to escape his own narrative

>> No.4709333

Chocolate french toast.

>> No.4709341

>>4709227
Didn't Proust cover this?

>> No.4709358

>>4709341
without using any narrative devices

>> No.4709406

>>4709140
>practical magical realismk
What's this?

>> No.4709411

I think a modern day Candide could be pretty cool. Don't make it as much a comment on religion as government though.

>> No.4709431

an aspiring young businessman in offered a promotion by his boss, making it harder for him to balance work life and family life

>> No.4709465

>>4701053
Write a complete history of the Roman state as told through the eyes of multiple generations of a single family starting with the founding of Rome in 753 B.C. all the way up to the final fall of Constantinople in 1453.

>> No.4709469

>>4701059
I'm working on that exact thing. There are 8 different countries involved.

>> No.4710084

>>4709469
>tfw you always kill a thread

>> No.4710087

Put Balzac to shame. Finish the human comedy.

>> No.4710099

I will refer to the most ambitious works of fiction I know of.

War and Peace is a complete picture of human life. Not exaggerating. Every aspect of living is covered here. You can try to top that.

Out of all works of fiction except War and Peace, Malazan Book of the Fallen juggles the most characters, concepts and plotlines without fucking up.

Imagine The Dark Tower minus all the plotholes. That would be sweet.

You can also try retelling all of world history in a novel form by conforming to a pre-existing literary structure. Like it has a main character and villain and theme and all that shit.

>> No.4710119

>>4709406
magical realism that ties in with the theme, something that isnt just used to make the work more interesting. like how flcl used the horns and shit to represent his libido. i know some stories use magical realism for no reason at all and, although i do find it interesting, it is disappointing

>> No.4710133

>>4701145
Well, Hunger Games.

>> No.4710192

>>4701153
We won't see a mainstream work of contemporary literature that will reflect the spirit of our times unfortunately. All the books we read are dated and our culture has been evolving way too fast in recent years.

What you can do is refer to slam poetry. All together, the body of slam poetry written in recent years contains more piercing insight and beauty than any novel that our shitty book industry can shit out. In it's own way it's even more epic because of the depth of subjects covered.

On personal struggle:
Shane Koyczan - Blueprint for a Breakthrough (long Ted Talk that incorporates some already existing pieces)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aV805a2XJgA

Andrea Gibson - The Madness Vase
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DtZp7MQE2ZM

Mike Rosen - Repair Shop
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AEGaNSWc0jY


Politics/Social issues:

Javon Johnson - "Cuz He's Black"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u9Wf8y_5Yn4

Dylan Garity - Rigged Game
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bo3KFUzyMUI

Mike Rosen - When God Happens
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S2Ks06Al8c0

Unknown - People Starve in America
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zCIjP3RMnMk&feature=player_embedded

Hollie McNish - Mathematics
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bJX5XHnONTI&feature=youtu.be
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zCIjP3RMnMk&feature=player_embedded

>> No.4710335

>>4708012
favorite movie. It is literally 10 times better (imo) than my second favorite movie, but charlie kaufman should of made it a book

>> No.4710350

>>4709201
charlie kaufman pls go back to /tv/ your ship sailed

>> No.4710787

>>4701246
Read Damasio's Horde de Contrevent

>> No.4710810

>>4701053
Being able to write something better than the Melian Dialogue

>> No.4710822

>>4701128
wrf is this

>> No.4711517

>>4702259
Aren't you the person who tried to make /lit/ write a shitty Odyssey knock-off, with Odysseus being Native American or some shit? And then when people started criticising it for being a bad idea you retorted with "heh, I knew you weren't ambitious enough".
It's a bad idea.

>> No.4713170

>>4711517
It's an ambitious idea. Exactly what the OP asked for. Here it is again. Note the last line.

>A writing project for all interested.

>The basic framework for the story is an homage piece, the traditional storyline of the journey. Yes, that's right, The Odyssey. But in this retelling, the tale is set in a fantastical hybrid of our contemporary world. Our "Odysseus" (He'll need a new name) is a native American,* from the island of Catalina, just off the coast of Los Angeles. In the year 1965 he is drafted and sent to fight in the Vietnam war. After five long years of service our hero and some friends go AWOL in a stolen pontoon (Yes an Iliad can be added to this if anyone is interested)

>The ending has him getting home (1980 or 85 maybe) and fighting the suitors and all that, but the main project is in the getting there. It's the journey that counts.

>One should have a decent knowledge of the mythologies of the various environments of the Pacific. The Indo-Chinese, the Malaysians, the Balinese, the Australian aboriginals, all the Pacific islanders including Easter Island and Hawaii, and of course native American mythology.
Not that you'd need to stick too stringently to these tales. They're just a good base to start with as the character(s) try to make their way home.

>Next. You envision the adventures. Blend each of the books of the Odyssey with a classic of your liking. Lord of the Flies and Easter Island, maybe? Make a new adventure by paying homage to other journeys like Gulliver's Travels. Or to authors like Borges. Use the sirens, Circe, Scylla and Charybdis, but avoid doing complete rip offs. Go nuts, but take it seriously. Can you write a whole book in verse even?

>Well, I'm waiting for you to disappoint me.

*There's a reason I chose to make him native American. They have a mythology, a deeper tie to the land. This facilitating a Pallas Athena, who still seems optional at this point. In the telling of these stories, it's just incidental. He's Americanized and just as adversely affected as his fellow draftee/AWOL buddies.

>> No.4713177

>>4713170
That would really only work if a Native American were writing it.

>> No.4713182

>>4713170
>*There's a reason I chose to make him native American. They have a mythology, a deeper tie to the land. This facilitating a Pallas Athena, who still seems optional at this point. In the telling of these stories, it's just incidental. He's Americanized and just as adversely affected as his fellow draftee/AWOL buddies.
you're so cute when you're racist butterfly. <3

>> No.4713198

>>4713177
I said "Incidental"
And no. What is this, some kind of reverse psychology joke on political correctness?

The framework, the only thing I sketched here, is just to set the stage for a series of stories paying further homage to to some of the greats of literature since Homer. I only hinted at what they might be like, but can't anyone see what it could be if there were only enough talents on it?

And since some think Homer might not have even written them himself, or written them originally, why not take that cue and let it communally develop over time?

>> No.4713219

>>4713170
it sounds very pointless, unoriginal and disrespectful of the source material.

>> No.4713229

>>4713198
It's not political correctness, I'm just saying a white person trying to write a novel from a Native American perspective, especially one that incorporates Native American traditionalism and beliefs, will make Native American eyes roll. The only way to properly do it would require you to spend at least few years on a reservation; even if it were just half-ass, you'd still want Native American advisers.

>> No.4713280

>>4713219
>disrespectful of a myth

>> No.4713313
File: 1.27 MB, 1600x1280, Trees15.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
4713313

>>4713182
The Christian pantheon is dreadfully thin.
The oddity of this alternative world is another aspect I like.

>>4713219
Source materialS. The other unnamed stories. And there's always a balancing act when attempting an homage piece. You have to pay respect but keep the audience interested. Hence its ambition.

>>4713229
I think it detached enough to roll but a few eyes. There was general appreciation for Dances With Wolves, as I recall. And yes, spending some time talking with some native storytellers would be all a part of the scope of this ambitious project.

>> No.4713316

>>4703859
I didn't mean the short story, I meant the Encyclopedia of Tlön.

>> No.4713323

>>4713313
Dances with Wolves is written from a white guy's perspective.

>> No.4713335

>>4709465
So Blackadder with togas?

>> No.4713344

>>4713335
oh fuck someone make this