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/lit/ - Literature

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4396530 No.4396530[DELETED]  [Reply] [Original]

what do /lit/ think about serial killers. is it modern phenomen tied to specific society? are they important from the psychological standpoint, can they even be classified as humans?

personally I don't undertand why some of them consider s.k. intelligent, as I see it they have extremely limited understanding of people, humanity and world in general. they look confused, often pretty dull. not to mention those glass empty eyes. Sometimes I wonder how people cant notice something is wrong with them, since for me its obvious.

>> No.4396541

It isn't tied to modern society, there have been infamous murderers in every time and place since the dawn of man.

>> No.4396546

>>4396541
GRAND THEFT AUTO CAUSES EVERY MURDER.

>> No.4396559

>>4396541
Yeah, but currently there are way more. And about 75% of them (or something crazy like that) are in the U.S.

A few years ago, I was really interested in this sort of shit. [It provided an interesting way to procrastinate on AP psych studying while staying up late.] There's this goofy-haired criminologist from Northwestern University who appears in a lot of documentaries as well as academic outlets. His work reveals that your claim here is demonstrably false. [I know I'm being vague with who it is. If I find the name, I'll post it.]

>> No.4396568
File: 14 KB, 226x233, Jack Levin.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
4396568

>>4396559
Jack Levin is the guy I'm talking about.

>> No.4396576

>>4396559
There are more because it's more reported. Five hundred years ago a murderer either didn't get caught or was simply killed without it being released as news to the whole country.

>> No.4396585

>>4396576
There were also far greater opportunities for violent people to live without their sociopathic tendencies being noticed. More war, torture, no forensic evidence, etc.

>> No.4396593

>>4396559
Do you really think there are more serial killers in media-crazy USA than there are in Mexico, Brazil, South Africa, India, etc., or that there's just a larger sensationalism around it?

School shootings happen more often because of the media circus, you could consider that a product of America. Serial killing in general can be traced back much further than the dawn of modernity, and as previously stated you have to account for the lack of documentation and the ease of staying hidden.

>> No.4396598

>>4396576
It doesn't simply scale with population. I've pointed you to a guy who's written many articles indicating so. Stop clinging to your armchair and find something substantive saying so. Because I have genuinely never heard a criminologist say anything that wasn't to the contrary. Even Anne Rule has written to that effect.

In Chicago, ~500 people have been killed every year for a very long time. And believe me, it doesn't make the "news of the whole country" when it happens. Do you seriously think shit like this was happening before, say, the industrial revolution. In specific places at specific times? Sure. But to wave away the high incidence of (serial) homicide in the modern world as merely a product of more getting reported to the police is flat out ignorant and lazy.

>> No.4396601

>>4396585
>>4396576

So you claim environment affects their behavior? (because if its genetical, their historical number would be insignificant since population then was considerably smaller than today)

>> No.4396602

>>4396593
>Do you really think there are more serial killers in media-crazy USA than there are in Mexico, Brazil, South Africa, India,
Sorry. I meant to say 75% more in contrast with Europe (or maybe even western Europe). And that, obviously, is after scaling for differences in population.

>> No.4396633

>>4396601
A lot of murder and rape happened throughout history during wars and shit. Rape and murder were incredibly common during times of war. Are they factoring in every time somebody committed an act like that back then with the idea of modern serial murder? People got away with a lot of shit back then. And the violet, sadistic nut bags got to butcher people without being held responsible. How many people did the Mongolians and Huns butcher/rape for no reason other than entertainment? They were probably far more violent than we are now.

Nobody does anything like that anymore.

>> No.4396634

>>4396530
they are wortless sick morons, you should ignore them

>> No.4396638

>>4396633

>Nobody does anything like that anymore.

l
o
l

>> No.4396652

>>4396638
As a massive army consisting entirely of horse riding warrior rapists who ate hearts and shit. Be pretty easy to function as a sociopath if your entire culture revolved around conquering and violence and they didn't even try to hold you responsible for what you did to your enemy.

>> No.4396654

>>4396633
that was moraly justified in their society, there were no restrictments about sadism where they lived. if they were raised in some peaceful orderly place, would they still fell urge to do it?

>> No.4396667

>>4396654
Aren't most serial murderers victims of repeated abuse/violence? Instead of being a part of a whole culture it's just how that one SK was raised. If you're beaten and abused from the time you were a little kid you're going to be fucked up. But we live in a peaceful society now like you said, so when they do something crazy we respond to it differently.

>> No.4396687

>>4396667
lot of people where victims of domestic violence, some on even worse level, and the don't end up as rapist/killers

>> No.4396711

>>4396667
Depends on the serial-killer. Killers like Gacy and Dahmer were not abused; but I would suspect someone like Bundy may have been.

I think it's more to do with nature than nurture -- though, that doesn't rule out nurture, entirely.

>> No.4396729

>>4396711
Gacy was abused mentaly and physicaly by alchoholic father, he called him sissy and constantly telling him he would grow up being queer.

>> No.4396763

>>4396530
>personally I don't undertand why some of them consider s.k. intelligent
Serial killers tend to be psychopaths, and psychopaths are naturally prone to manipulate people into having a certain image of them. Most of them are also narcissistic, so they feel the need of attention, which leads them to making people believe they are intelligent ot somehow above everyone else.

>> No.4396770

>>4396729
Oh. I thought his malfunction was tied to his head-injury.

>> No.4396909

how do recognize serial, /lit/?
what if favourite character is serial I don't know?

>> No.4397349

There are more serial killers now because there are more people. It gets reported more now, because there's a greater mechanism for reporting it. The serial killers in the USA really are nothing compared to the ones in Central America and Eastern Europe. The one that really stands out is Pedro Lopez who raped and murdered hundreds of little girls and nobody knows who the fuck his is, but you instantly know about Gacy from just a picture.

>> No.4397413

>>4397349
there are no serial killers in Europe, nigga. Nobody in Europe even knows serial killer concept. They see it only in Hollywood movies.

>> No.4397421

it's a fad. A "meme" if you will.

For the super edgy

>> No.4397424

>>4397413
Are you serious?

>> No.4397458

>>4397424
no, he speaks thruth

>> No.4397481

>>4397458
Not really though. Taking 2 seconds on google can yield results of at least 5 European serial killers in the past decade and that's from just skimming the page.

>> No.4397497

>>4397481
There are 800 million people in Europe. 5 serial killers is insignificant number.

>> No.4397507

>>4397497
5 is not the total sum. It was what I saw first. There are probably more, but I can't be bothered to look it up since just establishing that they exist refutes the post I was quoting,

>> No.4397517

>>4397507
well let me correct myself - they exist, but their number is insignificant. they don't represent important problem in Europe, it is treated as any other crime, unlike usa

>> No.4397529

>>4397517
By that logic the number of serial killers in the US is insignificant as well.

>> No.4397610
File: 66 KB, 620x387, jamesholmes_2283166b.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
4397610

I feel empathy for some serial killers

>> No.4397615

>>4397610
I don't, I despise them. all of them

>> No.4397621

Serial killers were scarier in past with lack of forensics and intelligence. You could easily get away with it.

Now you actually have to be smart.

>> No.4397637

OP here, do they all appear to you as sick, disturbed etc. (at least those popularized by media) or you have problem distinguishing them from rest of the people? Could they fool you in RL if you had chance to meet and talk to them?

>> No.4397655

Too ingrained in the social conscious

>> No.4397657

>>4397637
only the "best"

>> No.4397677

>>4397615
No sympathy for the devil?

>> No.4397682

>>4397677
they are not the devil

>> No.4397723

>>4397621
>Serial killers were scarier in past with lack of forensics and intelligence. You could easily get away with it.
>Now you actually have to be smart.

Yeah, but see serial killers are still exceptionally difficult to catch. The reason is that unlike most other murderers, they kill strangers.

So for forensics to help you
A) You have to find relevant forensics (not as easy as CSI makes it out to be)
B) You have to have the serial killer on your radar in some manner (your best bet at this, due to a lack of social connection with the victims, is to have them in a database due to a prior arrest or conviction)
C) You have to match said forensics to said individual in a manner that leaves no room for reasonable doubt.

>> No.4397726

>>4397637
OP, you're projecting the knowledge you have of them and claiming that you can 'see it in their faces'. Gacy only looks suspicious to you because he's in a mugshot and you know he's a serial killer. If you'd met him in real life, you would have had no inkling.

I imagine that his victims would have noticed something at some point, since Gacy was actively trying to set them up so he could kill them. But anyone else probably didn't notice anything.

>> No.4397741

>>4397726
most serial killers are going to be disconnected, they are going to view people as abstractions in a schema in their mind, not actual human beings

there are countless reports of lots of killers being shy and antisocial

>> No.4397745

>>4397741
They're also incredibly manipulative to the point where they can convince you that they're not disconnected.

>> No.4397753

>>4397745
no, not all of them

lots of them were awkward. Unable to express themselves in any way

>> No.4397759

>>4397753
I'm talking more of "spree killers" here, I guess. The ones you would find in college.

>> No.4397761

>>4397682
this. sure, I think there are some embodiment of Satan with very devised plan, but most of them are just pathetic confused cowards.

>> No.4397771

"Spree killings" are more modern now than serial killers.

The aurora shooting, virginia tech, columbine, boston bombings, etc.

>> No.4397773

>>4397726
actually I watched his interviews and documentaries lots of times, For one period it was like obsession for me. However, I never saw him as charismatic, charming or everyday guy.

>> No.4397789

>>4397773
But you knew going into those viewings that he was a serial killer. Could you really tell he was a violent child murderer from just seeing him? If you can, you should go into law enforcement.

>> No.4397794

>>4396909
tony the tiger is my favorite, should I be worried about having him in my kitchen?

>> No.4397801

>>4397789
Serial killer - of course not, but sociopath,manipulator who obviously has serious mental problems - definitely

>> No.4398073

>>4397753
>>4397741
>>4397773
>>4397801

I wasn't trying to suggest that you would find Gacy or all serial killers charming or normal (though some of them you would). Though, you have to bear in mind that Gacy worked as a clown and was well loved and respected in his community, so he couldn't be that odd. Chances are if you had known him you would have at most thought he was a bit odd.

Even with more antisocial serial killers, the unusual features they would display are hardly features that only sociopaths or serial killers display. Unless you're paranoid, you would probably just assume they were shy or maybe even damaged, but it's doubtful you would think they were a serial killer.

Some serial killers might come across as overly aggressive and angry. But even in that case, you probably wouldn't suspect they were raping and torturing women in their van every other week. You'd probably just think they had anger management issues or were a mean drunk

>> No.4398081

>>4396711
Lionel Dahmer (Jeff's father) said that he was sexually abused when he was eight years old by a neighbour, Jeffrey denied this and said he couldn't remember the incident.

>> No.4398341

>>4398081
Any one who has seen some real abuse isn't particularly eager to talk about it.They lie and cover it up to not look weak or be pitied

>> No.4398409

>>4398341
Or they keep talking about it so the appear stronger than others by having "survived" it. They may also use it to manipulate others for their own solipsistic reasons.

>> No.4399969

>>4398341
Yeah this is true, then why did Jeffrey tell people he was sexually assaulted the time he got out for Christmas when he was in prison for indecent exposure? He said he was drugged in his favourite bar and woke up tied upside down and got attacked with a candle. In that case he said "I was the victim." Is it just because he was an adult when he was sexually assaulted that he feels more comfortable to talk about it?

>> No.4400004

>>4397771

Boston bombings should not be grouped with spree killers really, the Tsarnaevs were enacting political violence in a way that was only indirectly a product of psychological trauma and isolation as we would say Holmes, Cho, Klebold & Harris were.

>> No.4400049
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4400049

1 in a hundred people are psychopaths. It's quite a high number. They're charming, above average intelligence, have a liimited capacity for empathy and no conscience. Not all are serial killers obviously.

A lot of serial killers can be thought of as fetishists, extreme sadists. Kind of like those guys who get off on balloons or cars.