/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.4348375]

Recommend me books that will make me religious.

[Anonymous No.4348379]

Ironcally, reading the Torah/Bible/Quran will only make you an atheist

[Anonymous No.4348381]

The Silmarillion

[Anonymous No.4348393]

The Transcendental Unity of Religions by Frithjof Schuon.

Alternatively look into the various branches of Buddhism and pick one that calls to you as Buddhism's variants cover most spiritual preferences available in religion.

[Anonymous No.4348404]

>>4348379
Nope.

I was an atheist until the age of 19, then I read the Bible during a bout of depression and it lifted me from a dark place.

There are so many absolutely beautiful passages in there.

[Anonymous No.4348448]

meditations - aurelius

[Anonymous No.4348456]

>>4348404

That must have been a very selective reading

[Anonymous No.4348460]

>>4348456
Why? Are you honestly that put off by most stuff in the Bible?

[Anonymous No.4348478]

>>4348460

'Most stuff' as in all the stuff that is inconsistent with reality and normal ethical standard?

Yes, that

[Anonymous No.4348483]

>>4348404
The fact that most people need to be in despair to make a turn towards religion doesn't really speak in it's favour. It's not a desire so much as an escape.

[Anonymous No.4348505]

>>4348379
Maybe if you go in with a Sunday school understanding, read every line for what it is and don't bother to actually study what is being taught.

[Anonymous No.4348512]

>>4348505
>maybe if you use the wrong arbitrary interpretation instead of mine

[Anonymous No.4348514]

>>4348393
>and pick one
No, please no.

I've had enough of people that call themselves Buddhist or Gnostic or whatever and have never meet and been initiated in the cult. You aren't X, you're just being pretentious.

If you want to join a religion you should actually meet and discuss it with their teachers.

>mfw a Swedish artist claimed he had converted to Zoroastrianism.

>>4348375
I suggest you start by getting to know different religions as described by for example "A very short introduction" and then deepen your knowledge by meeting with practitioners and teachers. In the end religion is a very personal calling, you can't "make" yourself a believer, but by studying the beauty and complexity of religion, you can start to question.

Also note that religion isn't just "magic", it does strive to fix any and all inconsistencies within itself and becomes logical and applicable. Which is also why every religion sooner or later faces a schism.

Remember, faith can't exist without doubt.

[Anonymous No.4348532]

>>4348512
Not even that. So many of you faggots just go in and take what it says literally without ever consulting the thousands of pieces of work out there explaining everything about those verses from their historical significance, modern implications, and everything else.

And there really isn't that much division over any of this. Oh sure you have your denomination splinters but these are just splitting hairs while the bulk of what is written is largely agreed upon.

Just like every other fucking field of study. There are huge consensuses on what everything means that nearly everyone agrees to. It's just releasing the same shit over and over again doesn't make money or get you a nice spot in a university. So these guys are always throwing up ideas and nit picking words to find slightly different meanings into book stores just to see what might stick but none of it ever pans out.

[Anonymous No.4348545]

>>4348532
>consulting the thousands of pieces of work out there explaining everything about those verses from their historical significance, modern implications, and everything else.

Yes, this is called spinning

[Anonymous No.4348547]

>>4348375
I really like Hindu mysticism so reading books about that might make you religious. Try Bhagavad Gita?

[Anonymous No.4348556]

>>4348478
>new testament
>inconsistent with normal ethical standard
>"stop killing people and be nice to others"
Wow, how is this even possible?

[Anonymous No.4348560]

>>4348545
Most religions place a pretty heavy emphasis on the interpretation of their works, and have written a lot about it. Catholicism and Judaism are the obvious examples here. If you're going to dismiss a religion, you should at least dismiss it seriously and acknowledge the things it accepts as important to itself, like interpreting it. It's not "spinning".

[Anonymous No.4348562]

>>4348556

>'anyone who doesn't obey the will of my God will be tortured forever'

Yes, very inconsistent

[Anonymous No.4348565]

>>4348545
Ah I see, you can only argue against fundamentalist so you try and paint everyone as being such. Any showing that this perspective is and always has been a minority understanding is just going to go unheard and swept away.

[Anonymous No.4348568]

>>4348562
>not knowing that the "torture" described is just the eternal separating from God
>not knowing that if God exists there could be no greater torture
Here you go, please stop deliberately misinterpreting religion to affirm your own belief or disbelief, it's dumb. Just say "I don't believe" and be done with it, there's no point in doing this. You have nothing to gain by a false or misinformed/ignorant understanding of something.

[Anonymous No.4348570]

>>4348562
>equating suffering with someone torturing you

[Anonymous No.4348576]

>>4348547
the Gita isn't mysticism. it's as orthodox as you can get.
unless you mean mysticism as in brown religions.

[Anonymous No.4348602]

>>4348568

Again, more 'interpretation' so that religion can never be pinned down on anything or held responsible for anything. Your book clearly states that the penalty for finite crimes is infinite torture. This horseshit about 'you just don't get it' is called spinning. It's changing what words mean to fit your purpose.

>>4348570

Burning someone eternally seems like a fairly good example of torture, yes

[Anonymous No.4348607]

>>4348375
Ego and Its Own

[Anonymous No.4348625]

>>4348375
Orthodoxy.
The Everlasting Man.
Both by G.K. Chesterton.

[Anonymous No.4348629]

Initiation and Spiritual Realization by Guenon.

[Anonymous No.4348634]

>>4348602
>Your book clearly states that the penalty for finite crimes is infinite torture.

You're just showing off your ignorance now.

None of the words translated over to "hell" mean such a thing. The only descriptions of such come from parables and prophesies. One from Jesus who was relating his story to an actual place outside of Jerusalem the other in a long cluster fuck of a work describing the Roman empire.

[Anonymous No.4348638]

Wise Blood by Flannery O'Connor

or anything by her

[Anonymous No.4348639]

>>4348625
Chesterton is one of my favorite authors, but I didn't find either of those to make religion appealing. I'd actually say that Chesterton's fiction (The Man who was Thursday, Manalive) is the strongest argument he made in favor of his spirituality. To each their own, of course.

[Anonymous No.4348640]

>>4348602
>so that religion can never be pinned down on anything or held responsible for anything.
No, those interpretations are taken very seriously in the religions they involve. They're not "wishy-washy-oh-how-do-we-get-out-of-this-one" shit. It can all be "pinned down" well, especially in the most major branches (Catholicism, Orthodox and Rabbinic Judaism) that have remained largely unchanged for a long time and any changes are a big deal and have firmly decided interpretations of their texts.

>Your book clearly states that the penalty for finite crimes is infinite torture.
>Your book clearly states that the penalty for sinning against God is separation from God.
There you go. Also, stop with this "your book" nonsense, I'm not religious, I just think you're an idiot who's going out of his way to misunderstand religion so you can be upset about it.

It's clear that you're not interested in any sort of discussion on the subject though (and there is a meaningful one to be had, it's an interesting topic), and you're just looking to either vent your personal butthurt or trying to rile up someone else's by going out of your way to try and misinterpret and ignore religious thought, so I'm not going to bother responding after this.

[Anonymous No.4348646]

>>4348638
One of my favorite books (hence the picture), it got me interested in religion.

[Anonymous No.4348649]

>>4348634

Look, if the definitions used in the Christian system are so relative and can change instantly and without much thought, why should I even consider the idea? Your posts makes it seem as if Christianity isn't even fully consistent with itself

[Anonymous No.4348652]

>>4348640

>'s clear that you're not interested in any sort of discussion on the subject though

That's probably because 'discussion' to you means 'agreeing with everything I say'

[Anonymous No.4348654]

>>4348640
>It can all be "pinned down" well
Come on, really? Maybe if you're sticking with only a very narrow band of long-existing interpretations, but if you look at even a fraction of the interpretations out there this isn't the case. I'm not the guy you've been arguing with, btw.

[Anonymous No.4348658]

>>4348640
>remained largely unchanged

[Anonymous No.4348664]

>>4348654
We have a clear history of what interpretations have been made and when they were made.
>but if you look at even a fraction of the interpretations out there this isn't the case.
They can't all be true, so you have to take them one at a time, not all at once and assume they're all correct. Not sure what other point you could be making. You only get wishy-washy stuff with branches like Protestantism, which leads to fundamentalism and other unpleasant things.
>narrow band
Orthodox and Rabbinic Judaism, and Catholicism are pretty narrow bands.

[Anonymous No.4348666]

>>4348646
I know that's why I posted her pic.

Her view of God will blow your mind just like her characters in her books and stories.

Don't look now, but just as you thought you were the center of the Universe, god shows you a thing or two.

I'm still atheist though but I grew up Catholic so I like her stuff.

pic related

[Anonymous No.4348667]

>>4348375
Blaise Pascal's Pensées
they're absolutely brilliant on a rhetoric standpoint too

[Anonymous No.4348675]

Augustine's City of God and Meister Eckhart's sermons.

[Anonymous No.4348682]

>>4348664
>They can't all be true, so you have to take them one at a time, not all at once and assume they're all correct. Not sure what other point you could be making. You only get wishy-washy stuff with branches like Protestantism, which leads to fundamentalism and other unpleasant things.

This is either the most well thought out and subtle bait I've seen in a while, or you're genuinely retarded.

[Anonymous No.4348686]

>>4348649
>why should I even consider the idea?
Because they aren't. Hell is only described as a "place of eternal punishment and suffering" in Sunday school and in the south. A misconception that came out of people thinking they could just read the Bible and not have to talk to anyone else to find out what is being said. This in turn inspired tons of imagery of things like the Last Judgment or Dante's Inferno which are now just apart of pop culture and taken for whatever reason as being Biblical truths. Everyone grew up with the damn cartoon version of a red devil and a pitch fork so they just assume that that shit is true. Never bothering to look and see if such a creature actually fucking exist anywhere within the Bible.

But the people that were educated. That fucking understood what they were reading wasn't as simple as what was being described grew up with their explanations and decided to look at the language it was written it in start explaining what is meant. Took in the historical context to explain why things are described as such.
Which when it comes to Hell isn't a lot because neither Judaism or Christianity were overly concerned with the afterlife.

Christianity is consistent within itself its just no one fucking studies it anymore outside of academia and maybe a few preachers who are worth a damn. But when fucking Kris Kardashian can become a fucking ordained minister then you can see the sorry ass state the religion is in as far as actual teachings go.

Everyone thinks you can just flip the Bible open and instantly become a scholar but it's not. This shit takes research, dedication, and a willingness to learn to fully understand.

[Anonymous No.4348735]

>>4348393
>The Transcendental Unity of Religions by Frithjof Schuon.

This

>Alternatively look into the various branches of Buddhism and pick one that calls to you as Buddhism's variants cover most spiritual preferences available in religion.

I don't see how this is more true of Buddhism than it is of Christianity or Islam.

[Anonymous No.4348886]

>>4348735
Buddhism has both a(pa)theist and theist varieties, Abrahamic religions are inherently theistic.

[Anonymous No.4348926]

>>4348379
*toasts with mountain dew*

[Anonymous No.4348940]

>getting into religion
>nearly 2014

You'll only set yourself up for a life of conflict and cognitive dissonance, especially as society changes and technology progresses more and secularism increases. It doesn't have the psychological benefits it once had to the same degree anymore. I'd advise against it. Unless you have compelling reasons to believe in its truthfulness of course, in which case remaining non-religious would lead to more cognitive dissonance than converting.

[Anonymous No.4348944]

>>4348556
>cut out your eye if you look at a girl

thats not really in line with ethical standarts nowadays.

[Anonymous No.4348957]

The Slave by Isaac Bashevis Singer.

[Anonymous No.4349376]

Read the God Delusion Backwards.

[Anonymous No.4349418]

>>4348940
>implying you will give a fuck about society once you are in mode full mystic

[Anonymous No.4349439]

Sculpting with Time by Tarkovsky

[Anonymous No.4349528]

>>4349376
top lel

[Anonymous No.4349545]

War and Peace by Tolstoy

VIVARIKA!

[Anonymous No.4349560]

The Last Temptation by Kazantzakis

so many feels

[Anonymous No.4349564]

>>4348375
thus spoke zarathustra

[Anonymous No.4349580]

>>4348940
>le calculating nihilist face

[Anonymous No.4349693]

>>4348944
This shows you have no fucking idea what you're talking about.

[Anonymous No.4349706]

[Anonymous No.4349722]

>>4349418
Yes, you will. That's the problem. Mystics in the past had it easy to a degree because they were revered. Sadhus are whining in India because even they have to pay for their train rides these days. The times they are a-changing.

>>4349580
I think it's a fair position. There aren't many compelling arguments to convert any more.

[Anonymous No.4349727]

>>4349706
>le gaudy /pol/ image macro

Traditionalism is just larping and refusing to break character.

[Anonymous No.4349752]

>>4349706
>muh anti-hedonism
but also >muh ride the tiger

evola was a total hack, not to mention insane

[Anonymous No.4349786]

>>4349752
>tfw even the fascists were like 'yeah m8 why don't you go stand in that corner over there with marinetti'

[Anonymous No.4349788]

>>4349722
>muh arguments

do you even leap of faith bro?

[Anonymous No.4349791]

>>4348483
>implying anyone is free of that
that's what humans do, despair and fuckup

[Anonymous No.4349799]

>>4349791
Just because desperate people tend to turn towards religion for a bit doesn't legitimise it as a good coping mechanism in the long run. Especially in secularised first world countries where being openly religious turns you into a bit of an outcast.

[Anonymous No.4349801]

>>4349722
>muh arguments

do you even leap of faith bro?

[Anonymous No.4349823]

>>4349801
Doesn't really work for me, I'm afraid. Arbitrarily assumed positions never last for more than a few days for me before they backfire into great disappointment.

[Anonymous No.4349844]

>>4349823
>Arbitrarily assumed positions

That's really the opposite of divine inspiration, though. A religious experience is supposed to be a momentary but overwhelming unconcealment of an objective reality.

[Anonymous No.4349852]

>>4348375
Just let it come to you. I've found that as I've read more, become better educated and gained more life experience, I've become more religious.

[Anonymous No.4349907]

>>4349844
If one experiences a divine inspiration and a momentary but overwhelming unconcealment of an objective reality then it wouldn't be a leap of faith to act on it.

[Anonymous No.4349912]

>>4348375
the bhagavad gita

[Anonymous No.4349920]

>>4348375
>Wise Blood.

"Where you come from is gone, where you thought you were going to was never there, and where you are is no good unless you can get away from it."

Good shit

[Anonymous No.4349968]

>>4349799
>where being openly religious turns you into a bit of an outcast
This does not happen, anywhere.
The majority in nearly all first world countries are still religious or at the very least are part of a church.

[Anonymous No.4349987]

>>4349907
>2013
>being this logocentric

You're right tho, I'm just being a lazy troll

[Anonymous No.4350103]

>>4349987
>tfw your apathy gets the better of your contrarianism

It's okay friend, I know the feeling.

[Anonymous No.4350105]

>>4348375
pro tip: Christianity is about guilt and forgiveness. It's on the famous The Lord's Prayer ("forgive us our sins for we ourselves forgive everyone who is indebted to us")

It's one of the most revolutionary concepts in religions, to forgive others so you can also be forgiven... St. Paul used to hunt down Christians, then he converted and become devoted to these same teachings, because he felt god forgiven him, guilt was a major driving force in his life, or love...

Christian forgiveness is where the line is drawn between the secular and religious justice: "Render therefore unto Caesar the things which are Caesar's; and unto God the things that are God's"... it's where you see clearly the anarchist nature of the religion

[Anonymous No.4350114]

>>4350105
>interpreting the legitimacy of the imperial currency and ceasar's demand for taxes as anarchist

[Anonymous No.4350116]

>>4350105
I have a lot of guilt, but not so much in the way of forgiveness.

[Anonymous No.4350133]

>>4350114
He is making the point of the authority of God, not of men.

[Anonymous No.4350138]

>>4348375
declineofwestexplained dot blogspot dot com

you can finish this in about an hour. Shows you how important religion is to humanity.

[Anonymous No.4350139]

>>4350133
He's making the point of the authority of both regarding a certain domain.

[Anonymous No.4350238]

>>4348478
Not understanding ancient context and ethics.

>Get a load of this pleb.

I despise people who get all rustled over violence in the past.

[Anonymous No.4350257]

>>4348568
tfw i have tried to explain this to people for half of my life.


They honestly never learn or are willing to even listen. The balls they have to deny religion in that manner because it is for "stupid people" I usually have less respect for those people afterwards and some of them had been close friends. I've realized in life some people aren't interested in the truth and others are.

I once had a friend who was a non believer. I am a Deist personally, and after awhile my friend took interest in my person and asked me about it. I was acually really shocked he wanted to know more about Deism.

>tfw you convert your friend to Deism.

[Anonymous No.4350267]

>>4350257
This may also be of use to you.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OkbOGNzR99s

[Anonymous No.4350316]

>>4350257
>people who disagree with me aren't interested in truth
>people who inquire about my beliefs and copy them are

[Anonymous No.4350408]

>>4350267
Fascinating. Personally I know so little of Islam. It is just a lack of contact with it, but I've never really expressed a negative view of Islam.

[Anonymous No.4350417]

>>4350316
I think he's referring to the people who discuss how "christianity/religion is dumb because of stuff like you get tortured forever if you do something wrong" and don't make any effort to understand the religion or even get their facts straight about it, like what's been going on ITT, or at least earlier in the thread it seems.

[Anonymous No.4350423]

>>4350316
That isn't what I said at all. I said that people who dismiss religion on ignorant grounds and have no will to even attempt to interpret it before they reject it are fools.

They are no better than the idiots on pol who follow Nazism blindly or because of videos they have seen on the internet. Granted Hitler made some great speech, but a speaker alone should never compel you to do something and change your views. We live in the 21st century where you get a compulsory education. In fact it is illegal to not get one from 6-16 in the U.S

Use your education to make evaluations and soul search before you decide something owns you.

[Anonymous No.4351121]

>>4350267
>Islam

[Anonymous No.4351138]

>>4348638
I was exactly going to say this

Wise Blood definitely


>>4348393
this is another great pick. I didn't realize people on this board even read Shuon

[Anonymous No.4351165]

>>4348944
Autismax.

[Anonymous No.4351178]

>>4350408
Spoiler: It's basically Judaism/Christianity for arabs. Muhammad just stole the story and made it more palatable to muslims. He also had sex with a nine year old girl. Neither Jesus nor Buddha, nor any of the patriarchs in the old testament were ever recorded as having sex with children. Even if you're setting the bar really low, Islam is a pretty shitty religion.

[Anonymous No.4351180]

>>4351178
Also he had nine wives. If your'e ok with that, then join islam, pls

[Anonymous No.4351204]

>>4351178
Don't forget that Muhammad was also a warlord (who advocated genocide, as well, see Banu Qurayza), while Jesus/Buddha were pacifists.

[Anonymous No.4351733]

>>4351178
Islam is cool when Persians do it, not when Arabs do it.

[Anonymous No.4351740]

>not being a gnostic

11. Jesus said, "This heaven will pass away, and the one above it will pass away.

The dead are not alive, and the living will not die. During the days when you ate what is dead, you made it come alive. When you are in the light, what will you do? On the day when you were one, you became two. But when you become two, what will you do?"

[Anonymous No.4351743]

>>4351740
Have you ever tried to read Gnostic scriptures? Yawn, there heretical for a good reason.

[Anonymous No.4351754]

>>4351743

Obviously I have... seeing as I just quoted from one.

They're not for everyone, yeah-- they're by nature elitist. But don't complain just because you've never experienced glorious gnosis. If you can't take the mystic and psychological depth of it and just want to stay to your petty and human-made morality and dogma, I won't complain.

>If one goes down into the water and comes up without having received anything, and says "I am a Christian," he has borrowed the name at interest. But if he receives the Holy Spirit, he has the name as a gift. He who has received a gift does not have to give it back, but of him who has borrowed it at interest, payment is demanded. This is the way it happens to one when he experiences a mystery.

[Anonymous No.4351836]

>>4351733
Well everything is better when persians do it.

[Anonymous No.4351843]

Sure is Dawkins in here

[Anonymous No.4351848]

>>4348375
Sein und Zeit
- M. Heidegger

[Anonymous No.4352441]

bump