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/lit/ - Literature

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4216475 No.4216475[DELETED]  [Reply] [Original]

do your friends read?

i live in ex-communist ultra pleb country
personally, i have like 2 friends who enjoy reading, overall i know no more than 5 people who read. and i am student. i am an avid reader, and i try to keep it a secret, beacuse if somebody knew, he would try to avoid me. also, you can't admit you enjoy studying. it's the same with classical music. and if they find out you dig philosophy, from that moment on you are plagued. i'm not bitching, it doesen't really bother me, but thats the way things are.

anyone else has same experiences?

>> No.4216476

You have wodka?

>> No.4216486

>>4216475
I dont even read and I bet none of my friends do either

>> No.4216487

I don't have any friends.

>> No.4216495

i am friend with a handful of professors and some literary people but for the most part i only know illiterates.

just today i was talking to someone who identifies as a leftist, but ignores the bulk of ideological critique post-marx and focuses on the fucking macro-economic part. not to mention that she dissed psychoanalysis as "unscientific", and tried to argue marx was entirely scientific in his work.

i hate that i care about these retards i know.

>> No.4216502

Yeah most of us are from North America, and the majority of our populace don't read either. Or if they do read, they read The Hunger Games. There is also a large community devoted to the disdain of education (i.e., the imgur community, if you'd like to discover an online faction of this ideal). The big advantage to being in North America is that no one really cares if you do read, so you're free to do it anywhere you want. Some people may see you on the bus with a certain novel or text and judge you, but such judgement doesn't manifest physically.

>> No.4216521

>>4216502
>There is also a large community devoted to the disdain of education
It's not all that surprising an attitude considering your humanities have become more about interpreting things in the dogmatic liberal way than intellectually challenging each others point of views.
Your universities even instituted speech codes to prevent such discourse and yet have the gall to spew forth comments about the anti-intellectualism of the american public.

>> No.4216528

>>4216502
typical fedorabeard

>>4216521
typical /pol/tard

do we have any actual people in this thread?

>> No.4216532

>>4216487
m2 : (

>> No.4216571

>>4216528
>typical /pol/tard
Never gone to /pol/. I have however read Bloom and listened to the kind of tripe that passes for lectures among your fluffier academics.
To actually make the theology of the perpetually offended a part of policy is fucking disgusting.
Of course it's symptomatic of the anti-intellectuality dormant in your universities since it was brought up from within.

>> No.4216576

>>4216571
>Never gone to /pol/.

so? keep your rehashed to yourself, please.

>> No.4216630

>friends
top lel m8

I wouldn't be reading shitty books if I had friends.

>> No.4216665

>>4216576
You sound like such a faggot. Do you act like this in real life? You surely can't you'd get your teeth knocked out.

>> No.4216678

I have a few "friends" if they can be called that, that read

don't really talk to them that much though

>> No.4216696

>>4216665
>>>/b/

>> No.4217203

it's not that the american populace celebrates ignorance and stupidity as the above poster so believes, but rather that "we" celebrate modesty, optimism, and 'being #2' to the point where it can literally become a self propagating protocol of "proper manners". You want to condescend to your friend about how they're idiots because they don't read derrida and foucault? enjoy losing all of them and in consequence, loosing important networking for your professional life. Putting yourself as "above other people" is simply not considered polite and people admire the "ivy leaguer who insists she is just a normal kid" and "self made meritocratic tech millionaire" archetypes even though it's insanely hypocritical- like saying you want the best of the best but not THE best, second to the best because you perceive them to have "underdog status" LOL
also, i absolutely detest the so called "business world optimism". a shark is still a shark even if he dresses casually, enjoys hiking and pixar movies, and uses techno-utopiastic keywords in his resume instead of business jargon. one day education is the "future" and "innovative" , the next education is trashed and villainized as "robot factories". Back in asia, "good manners" means everybody wanted to emulate "high class elegance", here it means everyone tries to understep each other so they can be seen as "modest honest true normal good down to earth " vs "pretentious arrogant elitist"

>> No.4217205

They don't read and if they found out I read they'd probably call me a faggot nerd and beat me up and not want to be friends with me anymore.

>> No.4217218

The closest is a coworker of mine who used to jokingly take the piss out of me for reading a lot, until one day he asked me for definitions a few times and our boss not so jokingly said he wouldn't be so stupid if he read more. Because he's decided he can't read more than one hundred pages and is a Metal is My Life kind of person, now he tries to talk to me all the time about Lovecraft.

>> No.4217253
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4217253

yeh here in the usa most the populace is pleb retards who watch sitcom/reality TV all day. reading has become more and more scarce. I read at least a book a month, sometimes more sometimes less. I really enjoy good literature but have virtually no one to talk about it with, since none of my friends read much. Or at all.

It sucks /lit/

and my latvian friend

>> No.4217278

>>4217203
So basically asians are shitty aspiring bourgeois stereotypes ripped from 1800s France, whereas Americans are humble? Good to know.

>> No.4217292

My girlfriend is a reader, but that's about it... unless you count my parents.

I got my good friend to read The Martian Chronicles recently, because he's a sci-fi and horror geek. Other than that, all my friends are too in tune with the electronic/technology age to read anything.

>> No.4217294

>>4217205
You're in bad company.

>> No.4217536

>>4217253
>sometimes less
so not "at least"

>> No.4217725

I've recently met a girl who's into Schopenhauer and Nietzsche, and although nothings happened yet I hope it will bloom into a beautiful and intelectually stimulating relationship.

There's a man I met in a hostel and hardly talked to but we later started a conversation on facebook and got into talking about Rimbaud and Sade and gangster rap. I'd like to meet up with him again sometime because I feel we could become good friends and he seems like he'd be down for experimenting with drugs and sex in a way my normal friends aren't.

Other than that, I have a friend I used to be in a choir with who although I don't think he's an avid reader he has a very impressive bookshelf of religious philosophy and sometimes we'll listen to classical music or hang out at the gun range together.

Sometime's I'll talk to my dad about Kafka and Somerset Maugham, but for the last few years he's been presuing a career as a farmer and mostly reads books about plant irrigation now. His best friend married an extremely rich women and retired young so he can travel the world, and sometimes we'll talk about Carl Hiaasen and politics.

For the most part though I don't know many avid readers. Its rare to find someone who reads a lot and enjoys literature or the fun stuff in life.

>> No.4217730

>>4217725
how do i hook me a wealthy boomer sugar mama

>> No.4217743

>>4216475
>do your friends read?
my friends play video games
my friends speak incessantly about video games
my friends are silent when I try to talk of something else, or ask their opinion
I don't give a damn for their opinion; I just want to know they have one
"Why don't you google it?"
They don't have one
unless I make extensive efforts to "organize" a night to drink I don't see my friends
I never hear from them, I never see them
but I do see them "active" on steam, bnet, and skype
I've stopped making efforts to drag them out to drink, for coffee, to chat and catch-up
now I truly don't see or hear them
and you know what? I kind of like it better this way sometimes, but sometimes not

tl;dr
>implying I have friends
when/if I make some new friends, oh-hohohoho, you'd better believe that they'll be readers

>> No.4217752

My only friend reads a lot. Actually we became friends because we read a lot so we share our thoughts and make recommendations. We often lend to each other books, and we also gift.

But that's all. He's my only good friend. I'm very glad.

>> No.4217758

>>4216495
>i hate that i care about these retards i know.
Caring about someone and respecting them are two entirely unrelated things.

>> No.4217767

>>4217725
Forgot to mention, but my old french teacher is an elderly hippy who can read latin and traveled all over Asia when she was younger. We used to have great conversations about literature and eastern philosophy. Haven't talked to her for a few months though.

Glancing over this thread, I'm supprised by how few people here know literate people. You guys must have had those moments when you sit next to some kid or old lady on a plane and spend the next two hours in a deep conversation about lovecraft or mathematics or religion or something like that.

>>4217730
I've been hitting on old rich ladies whenever I play bingo with my grandmother. It hasn't gotten me any sugermamas yet, but I figure its worth a shot.

>> No.4217770

No, my friends do not read. It doesn't make me like or respect them less. I don't view my friends as things with which I can exchange witty banter and debate "deep shit". Contrary to popular beliefs, friendship is not based on common interests but on emotional connection. If you're lucky enough to find friends that share your interest, well good for you. In my experience, people who share my interests are either borderline autistic or enormous, self important twats. Makes me think that maybe I am also like that.

>> No.4217771

>>4217730


theres going to be alot of them in the comming decades as generations of women have been wasting their youth on the cock carousel before hitting the wall and becoming desperate.

>> No.4217777

>>4217771
>damn women, wasting their youth having sex with people who aren't me
>its the end of the western civilization I tell you

gb2/r9k/

>> No.4217782

I was at dinner the other night talking to my friend who studied English Literature. I asked him if he enjoyed Borges. He said that he doesn't know who Borges is.

>you can't admit you enjoy studying

That is something I find alarming. OP's situation is worse but I know nobody who graduated university and continued their studies in an auto-didactic manner except for me. It's as if they didn't enjoy/care about what they studied and saw education simply as a means to an end. I'm not arguing anybody is better here (I'm certainly not) but it seems I was the only one who thought studying did not start and stop in the classroom.

>> No.4217789

>>4217743

for the longest time i was like your friends, a shut-in who is more than happy playing some online game with mates on skype than going to some building to get drunk in with a lot of people and noise, so much noise that having an actual conversation is not exactly possible.

recently though ive decided that i actually do want a social circle and ive started going out to the pub with housemates. the thing is, i still prefer 3 hours on skype with my gamer mates than 3 hours in the pub with some housemates. i dont even know what i want from my social life. its like im making all this effort to go out and meet people, just so i can find a couple cool people, or a gf, so that i can revert back to type and just spend a bunch of time inside again, but with them for company.

>> No.4217792

>>4217203
> people admire the "ivy leaguer who insists she is just a normal kid" and "self made meritocratic tech millionaire" archetypes

Except that most people find these types insufferable.

>> No.4217796

>>4217725
>talking about religious philosophy and classical music at the gun range
>intrepid, world-travelling, gold-digging friend

Man, your life...

>> No.4217808

>>4217796
WHere do you live? I'm sure there are people like that all over, its just a matter of meeting them.

>> No.4217817

Germany here, I have two long-time friends (I know them for more than 25 years), one of them reads, but only borderline-edgy stuff like Bukowsky, Heminway, Steinbeck. The other one mostly doesn't read or if he does it's mostly really really crappy SciFi. He can't read Lem because it's too boring, can't read ANYTHING other than SciFi and Fantasy. And I would say these two are above average. I know people who are over 40 and have no single book in their house, never read anything after school and have problems following long sentences.

>> No.4217825

>>4217817
do you consume more english culture than german, not strictly literature but all things. I realize that you probably just use an english image board because english is such a huge language.

americans consume very little modern german culture

>> No.4217835

Four of my friends aren't even literate, and I only have six friends overall.

>> No.4217857

>>4216475

>>ex-communist

There's your problem. I live in Romania and even though I've never been socially excluded because of my interests, there is a pervasive anti-intellectual sentiment in most ex-communist countries. Before, I assumed it was because intellectuals are commonly associated with the Left.

However, I think it's more to do with the fact that decades of communism has snuffed out the old generation's interest in well...pretty much anything. Nevermind reading, people over 40 in this country are don't have any sort of hobbies. They are bitter, frustrated, anti-intellectual, humorless, rigid, self pitying assholes.

The younger generations are no better. The anti-intellectual sentiment is carried forth. They are not as grey and depressing. Mostly it's petty bourgeois attitudes, sterile hedonism, corporate worship, rural non-values crammed into urban contexts. Such is life.

>> No.4217875

Most of my friends read , even if its only a little, or infrequently. And decent enough books too.
Two of my friends read often, eve more than me (one of them would fit right in here, whilst the other sticks to classic sci fi novels mostly )

Where do you guys live where nobody reads?

>> No.4217879

>>4217857
>Mostly it's petty bourgeois attitudes, sterile hedonism, corporate worship, rural non-values crammed into urban contexts

I am afraid you won't find anything substantially different in the west. It's not really anyone's fault: intellectualism has never been held in high regard by the general public. Nowadays even a little bit less then before, I think, because it's such a large part of the population has a high education and academic careers are a more common choice than in the past.

>> No.4217880

>>4217817
>He can't read Lem because it's too boring
Maybe he should read his better works. Solaris not being one of them.

>> No.4217881

Only my gf reads, then I have a friend who just reads English literature. Most of my friends don't read for shit.

>> No.4217882

>>4216475
if someone doesn't read i don't call them a friend

so there

>> No.4217884

2 friends of me (guys) don't like reading "real books" but they have a super taste when it comes to comics/mangas/franco-belgian comics (I live in France so there are common). They even have some connections with cartoonists (they're, like me, 18).

My third friend (a women) is 26yo and has a Master's Degree in french literature, so she loves it and she sometimes recommends me stuff.

>> No.4217902

>>4217884
what is there beyond tin tin, asterix and corto maltese

>> No.4217903

>>4217884
What is it with french people and comics anyways? I've been living in france for the last few months and it seems like thats all anyone ever reads. Why so many comics yet so little 'real' literature? Whats with them being so popular here?

>> No.4217921

>>4217882
so you don't have any

>> No.4217935
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4217935

>>4217903
I don't know either, and it's a bad thing that the "grand public" tend to be attracted by shitty humorous comics.

But some french comics are awesome.

>>4217902
All Moëbius' (Blueberry, L'incal, Arzach and his other one-shots), Enki Bilal's and Lewis Trondheim's work are some god tier classics, but not really mainstream.

For some classic series, I'd say Blake & Mortimer, Spirou and Fantasio, Bécassine, Boule & Bill, Lucky Luke, Mélusine (she's qt).
Lanfeust de Troy if you like young adlut fantasy, Kaamelott if you know the TV show (I recommend it, that probably is the best french serie of all time).

I probably forgot some essentials, forgive me.

And for some recent authors, I'd recommend you to give a look at Bastien Vivès', Manu Larcenet's (Blast is awesome) and Winshluss's work.

>> No.4217997

I'm a literature major so I have a bunch of friends who read at school. Some of my friends back home read as well, but there are probably just as many who would rather play video games. But I'm not ostracized over it like OP, they just rib me a little about getting excited about books.

>> No.4218149

>>4216475
Post-communist Russian here. I've used to read about 50 books a year. Now I read about 20-30 due to work and associated reading (that I don't count as "books" per se). I have plenty of friends with a similar reading habits.

>> No.4218180

I myself don't read. I'm not an intellectual, but I'm not anti-intellectual.

>> No.4218213 [DELETED] 
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4218213

>>4216475
>i live in ex-communist ultra pleb country
So do I, unfortunately.

My best friend is an engineer, and he only reads technical manuals/ literature he needs for his job, and watches historical documentaries. He's a slow reader and finds books boring, he says he'd rather watch a film. The other best friend is a cinephile, and only reads books occasionally if he thinks it's worth his time like 1984, The 120 Days of Sodom etc. My girlfriend loves to read those typically women's romantic novels, thrillers by King, Nelson DeMille, YA books like Harry Potter, you get the point. And we've got a common friend that has a book with her all the time, she loves fantasy and sci-fi novels. So in my circle of friends at least people read at least occasionally.

>>4216521
>Your universities even instituted speech codes to prevent such discourse and yet have the gall to spew forth comments about the anti-intellectualism of the american public.
I'm not sure what you're talking about, I had an American in university and he was more than happy to actually be able to speak openly without worrying he'll get fired for not being politically correct.
Picture somewhat related.

>> No.4218689

>>4217935
Were could one find french comics like Blueberry online to read?

>> No.4219470

>>4217743

I'm really glad I read this. My friends are exactly the same and for a long time I thought that maybe I was doing something wrong - that doesn't necessarily mean I wasn't - but no matter what I do, I can't get them to do anything besides play video games and trying to talk to them about anything is incredibly boring because they just have nothing to say about anything; they don't seem to listen to music, watch movies, watch TV, watch sports, read books, anything. All they do is play video games and, for one or two of them, go to work. While it's shitty, it's nice to know I'm not the only one.

>> No.4219496

>>4217782

It's that which really made me hate university. I studied Film and literature - inb4 STEM: I have a job working for a media company - and I felt like I was the only one there who was actually interested in what I was studying. In the UK, the anti-intellectualism and right wing nature of society has ended up labelling the kind of thing I studied as a soft subject so they fill it with idiots just to meet quotas and not only do they fail but they produce a really toxic atmosphere for leaning stuff.

>> No.4219505

>>4217203
>americans
>valuing humility

>> No.4219509

>>4216495
This is the gayest post ever. 1/5

>> No.4219519

>>4218689
I really don't know, sorry.

If you can read french, try to get a t411 account (free), that's a french torrent website, so french comics' scans can be found.

>> No.4219520

>>4217935
Muh nègre.

>>4218689
Well I usually borrow them at my local library of course, but you can find a fair amount of them on Torrent 411, which is a French tracker.

I also highly recommend the man who is for me the unmatched master of comics: François Bourgeon.
He made three series which are perfect in all regards, be it drawing, thematization, scenario, dialogue, characterization and world building:
"Les Compagnons du Crépuscule", set during the 100 years war with fantastic elements
"Les Passagers du Vent", set aboard ships doing the triangular slave trade
"Le Cycle de Cyann", which is some of the most exotic sci-fi I've ever seen

>> No.4219525
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4219525

>>4219520
forgot pic

>> No.4219538

>>4217782
sudying isn't enjoyable. sometimes it is, but a lot of times it isn't. the courses are all set rigidly, if you take your interest into something that is marginal in course or not even in it - you're wasting your time or rather you're doing it on your own free time. it is set up so that doing the best academically comes from understanding your professor's inclinations and what he wants out of you and disregarding anything marginal. if you want to do well just educate yourself on your professor's tendencies, look up some old exams, study the two or three things that are always there and disregard the rest. the fact that anything else has to be done on your own free time is what makes studying a soulless experience. that way you end with some pricks who are simply instruction following idiots who do better than someone who has a good understanding of the big picture (bit of an exaggeration of course). not really surprising though, they like to pump out instruction following people who aren't too independent in thought or too smart, but JUST smart enough (inb4 *tips fedora*)

>> No.4219539

>>4216571
>I read The Closing of The American Mind and now I'm an expert at what goes on in university.

>> No.4219544

>>4217782
I feel you, the same thing exists in STEM.
I actually had a great time in prep classes, people around me where genuinely interested in intellectual pursuits in mathematics and logic.

And then when I got into engi class I suddenly was around people who apparently all hated math and were just hoping to completely forget about it as quickly as possible so they could become business consultants.

>> No.4219573

I don't have friends.

>> No.4219585

Yes, now they do. I know it sounds pretentious as fuck but one of the things I've loved most about moving to uni is being surrounded by people who love books. Even the STEM people here read a fair bit.

>> No.4219597

one of my closest friends reads regularly, and we tend to discuss literature, philosophy, science and other related subjects whenever we hang out. i have another friend who reads a fair amount (mostly classic sci-fi) but sadly we don't see one another all that often since he moved a few years ago.


as far as i know, none of my other friends are avid readers (a couple have expressed interest in adopting the hobby, but they've yet to follow through), but i was recently integrated into another friend's (non-reader) clique so i'm not really sure if my new friends are into reading or not. they seem to be underachievers though, and a few are even high school dropouts, so that might point in the direction of "not."

this is not to say that any of the people i socialize with are dull or anti-intellectual. even amongst the non-readers i can have interesting discussions on a variety of subjects.

>> No.4219611

>>4216475
>beacuse if somebody knew, he would try to avoid me
you're doing something wrong. I have like one friend who actually reads and one who reads 2 classics a year. Still people know I like reading and don't avoid me at all. You must be communicating your interests in a way that makes them uncomfortable

>> No.4219614

>>4217758
>are two entirely unrelated things.
that entirely depends on your priorities

>> No.4219631

>>4217777
you know what was the point of that post: women that marry because they had to settle for something would be more willing to have an adventure and more willling to give (because they have less choices, if they want to get younger people they would have to be willing to give more because those young men have more choices than her)
it's not about gender, it's the same the other way around but no one asked about a sugar daddy

>> No.4219668

I'd guess like 3% of my generation in my country reads anything worth reading. As for the other large majority that read, they read shit. In my university, (we're ranked #2 in the country) I'm classmates with a bunch of Creative Writing majors and Lit majors, and they consider bullshit like John Green or Murakami as the peak of literature. Oh and they write fan fiction. Write like they're trying to be included in Western literature too.

The education system doesn't really allow well for appreciating literature. Good local lit is few.

>> No.4219804

>>4216475
i wouldn't consider anyone a friend if they don't read.

so yes

>> No.4219825
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4219825

>friends

Even at times in my life when i did have a social life no one read. fuck if i asked anyone if they had read anything lately they reacted like if i asked them if they had had their cod liver oil lately or something.

>> No.4219853

I'm part of my university's book club, but unfortunately most of the people there have terrible taste. We're reading a book by Neil Gaiman right now

>> No.4219881
File: 179 KB, 580x377, tomoko.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
4219881

>shut-in
>no friends
>family hates "nerdy things" like reading and math

>> No.4219930

>>4216665

Pretty much this. The guy is raising valid criticism of mainstream American humanities. I studied at an American university and my English department was full of professors who are ashamed of the West. Guess what our discussions were based around in the Shakespeare class? Performativity and gendered bodies. Chaucer? Patriarchy and intertextuality. I'm better off just reading the texts on my own than getting preached at about how white male privilege is the biggest problem in the world. My philosophy department didn't really give a shit about all of that, so those classes were much more serious.

Penn and Teller touched on this issue in one of their episodes. Here it is. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hUDAxWlNrQ4 .

>> No.4219943

I got my friends into Lovecraft during high school, but that's really been it. I know people who read just because of who I am, but they aren't my friends per se.

>> No.4219947

>>4219930
pls cry more.

>> No.4219948

>>4219631
>2013 and onwards
>"choices"
>instead of being "worth" a net worth, we're worth our debt, instead of having a green number floating above our head, we have a negative red number
>lel i would never commit myself to a person who's "worth" $-120,000 of debt

>> No.4219961

>>4217203

I have to say, it's a little bit difficult to get your meaning here.

What's with this line?:

>You want to condescend to your friend about how they're idiots because they don't read derrida and foucault?

Why would we want to do that?

There is nothing arrogant about reading books. There is something arrogant about reading books with the pretense of appearing smart.
It is perfectly possible for two people genuinely interested in literature to have a well-mannered discussion about it.

And what's up with bringing optimism into this?

To the point of the thread: sure, it's a nice idea, that everybody would study literature or philosophy or science. But not everbody does. Plenty of people do, so go hang out with them if you want to have an intellectual discussion. After all, that's what we're trying to do here. Being well-read might isolate a person if that person goes on diatribes about it. But anybody with good character would save it for the right conversation or in writing a book.

>> No.4219962

Most of my literary connection to friends comes through movies, which isn't all that bad, I think cinema is a good medium for art and storytelling, and it's exciting to connect to others through it. So really, while most of my friends don't "read", I feel I get the same experience talking about and viewing movies together.

>> No.4219974

>>4217752

This is pretty much what every reader needs. One true friend with whom it's not bragging to talk about books.

>> No.4219980

>>4217782

Yeah, you are better for teaching yourself, that's the whole point.

>> No.4219991

ITT: /lit/ learns the meaning of the 18th-century term "rabble".

>> No.4220014

>>4219947

I'm not crying about it- I left to study on my own and work.

>> No.4220028

>>4219961
"after all, that's what we're trying to do here"
>/lit/
>where every thread always has to have someone making fun of another person for being no lives ("but you can't call me a no life! i'm not like the rest of you all!")
>where everyone participates in social signalling whether or not they want to admit it ("you pleb you cancer plebs plebs")
>where the go-to rheteroical style of trying to appear as "level minded, rational and correct" is to respond in diplomatic "it's just SOME bad apples, not me!!"

okay but back to the original post, my point was that the so called "anti intellectualism" isn't so much celebrating "stupidity" but just what is considered self regulated proper manners. I get that your interests are genuine, but to bring it up to people in an informal setting (at parties lol amirite anons?) would make you seem condescending and elitist. (let's be honest here, even if a /lit/anon doesn't react IRL, he will go home that night and complain about "the plebs" on this board)

>> No.4220061

I am a freshman in college and i have noticed an air of anti-intellectualism. It's not hostile, but it's alienating and judgemental. I think it is just a first impression thing though. I admit I enjoy the assigned readings and can talk about them for hours, while they hate them and do nothing but complain. They don't seem to care though, as long as I am not smug or a pseudo-intellectual, which I am happy to accept.

I would rather be surrounded by anti-intellectuals than arrogant pseudo-intellectuals.

>> No.4220067

>>4219853

I went to the first meeting of mine and they said they were rereading all of A Song of Ice and Fire. I never went back.

>> No.4220072

>>4220028

Yeah, you raise really valid points. A paradox in American culture is that the brand of humility you mentioned is valued at the same time as confidence. Congratulate a friend on their physique or intellect and they'll do that thing you mentioned where they say "no there's somebody so much better than me. Even the biggest celebrities receive an award and feign incredulity.

The problem comes from making a comparison in the first place. Those obsessed with comparing themselves to others will always be motivated to appear strong or smart to others. But it's important to them to conceal that motivation with mock humility. Those genuinely interested in good fitness or intellect will probably respond with actual humility, since it's their craft we're talking about here, it's how they spend their days.

It reminds me of actual good manners: if somebody compliments you on your shirt, the appropriate response is "thank you" and not "OH THIS OLD THING?! IT'S A PIECE OF CRAP"

>> No.4220147

>>4220072
Yeah absolutely, in fact you explained the paradox better than I.

However you seem to really really really want to make a distinction between the "authentic" and those who are "trying to emulate the real authentic"; is that because you are trying to "defend" yourself (or your friends)? I personally feel this desire to be fruitless, nowadays i have given up and jokingly label myself "hipster trash"- playing the "public persona" game until someone wants to have an actual conversation about our interests... and solely the interest itself rather the interest as an accessory piece.

i noticed that in asian cultures, there is no shame in eagerly jumping into the "social climbing game". They buff their resumes, grab at prestige, pretentiously pretend to understand things they don't; yet "we" do all of this as well but shield it with humility to conceal our motivations. I once saw a essay where a friend made excuses and tried to write a sob story as if her parents wealth were an obstacle instead of an advantage. The fact she got negative feedback and rejected only further proves the intricate and delicate "craft" of "self regulating your persona/choosing carefully what we say/how we say it".

>> No.4220208

>>4220147

Don't get too hung up on all of those made-up categories and rules about how you're supposed to act. I would definitely maintain the distinction between being motivated by real interest and being motivated by appearance.

The problem is that we're talking about the distinction in the context of education. Well, here's the big question: is self cultivation motivated by the effects of excellence, viz. popularity, honors, wealth or excellence itself? Is it possible to be motivated by excellence itself?

Please read this essay by David Hume.

http://www.econlib.org/library/LFBooks/Hume/hmMPL17.html

>> No.4220226
File: 132 KB, 309x280, 1377481934795.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
4220226

>>4217743
>>4219470


holy fuck I'm not alone! These posts are word for word my current situation with my friends.

>> No.4220748

>>4219519
>>4219520
Thanks. I just wish someone would seed these things...

>> No.4220828

The saddest thing happening right now, is the cult of mediocrity floating above prestigious institutions.
I am right now doing a double degree - one in History and the other in Business. I am aiming at a Master's Degree and hope to do a PhD.
I am aiming for a business degree in one of the world's most prestigious business school because I am from an industrial family. One day, I may have to take over my family's business and it's not a small one. That's the reason why, I still owe something.
But I also aim for a History degree because god damn, I love research. It's tiring, sometimes I am sick of it, but at the end of the day, I love it and quite proud of my work. I am working right now on a thesis about American History.

The saddest thing about this whole deal is that when I was a kid, I've dreamed of an institution where people like to read and study just for their pleasure. I've started to read since I was 4 years old; one of my very first books was about world geography - this was also the time I've fallen in love with the Swiss and Saudi Arabian flag because I thought they were so beautiful.
But now I've reached both top tier universities after fierce selection, I am disgusted by my surrounding. The worst thing about it, it's the cult of mediocrity, allowing people to just pass with mediocrity, without any passion, lowering the level.
I might sound elitist or let's say, like an asshole, but I'm really sick of people around me, just doing 1 hour work per day, not knowing where the hell are they going and not even picking up my ideas or advices. They all have interesting theses to work on and yet, they're not into it, and all that they worry about is how to get laid or when is the next party. That's all. And they don't want to hear anything else.
Thank God they will get fired next year because they don't work enough but that's kind of sad. We live in a time in which we have access to almost everything as a student, thanks to libraries, thanks to the internet, and they don't enjoy it.

Yes, I'm mad and disappointed. And I'm not even a freshman.
And the funny thing is, the only friend who reads a lot and with true passion is in a business school. Totally not the kind of place you'd expect to find well-read people.

>> No.4220842

>>4217935
help me out bro, i vaguely remember a comic piece that is now at least decade old that featured some alien life interacting in alien jungle ecosystem with wierd-ass predators and prey and stuff, i'm pretty sure it was french/belgian

any idea what it might have been? i've been searching for ages

>> No.4220843
File: 11 KB, 250x327, lordbyron.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
4220843

My girlfriend read English literature at one of the top universities in the world, so she's significantly more literate than I am. My best friend's also an avid reader - especially of poetry. Aside from that, both my parents read incessantly. A lot of my other friends haven't read since high school.

>> No.4220863

>>4220842
It's pretty vague.
Could be "Six saisons sur Ilo", part of "le cycle de Cyann" aforementioned.
Could be "Aldebaran" by Leo
Could be "Arzach"
Could be "le garage hermétique"
Could be "le Monde d'Edena"
Could be "Les Aventures d'Alef-Thau"

On a related note, I highly recommend "La Folle du Sacré-Coeur.", which is about a Jewish heideggerian philosophy professor at la Sorbonne who gets drawn into a mad story after having sex with one of her students who believes they are the new Zachary and Elizabeth.

>> No.4220896

>>4216630
How do you not have friends? I'm literally autistic (severely so) and I have some friends. Not that I think you're really missing out on anything, I just don't understand.

>> No.4220897

>>4220863
thanks ill check them all out, the search continues

>> No.4220901
File: 108 KB, 728x1038, chninkel.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
4220901

>>4220842
Could be "le Grand Pouvoir du Chninkel" too.

>> No.4220910

>>4220896
Not him, but I don't really have friends anymore either. I used to have a couple and they moved away. After that, I made some more friends but then chose to stop talking to them.

>> No.4220915

I'm a girl and I read!

>> No.4221160
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4221160

>>4220828

Double degree of Psychology (with concentration on cognitive) and english. Firstly, I'm pursuing psych, because I grew up surrounded with a variety of psychological problems (substance abuse/mental issues i.e. depression etc) and English because I have a faculty for writing (and do love it). However, I've noticed with my peers in each respective fields that all are just chasing the degree for the sake of having a degree. Absolutely no care whatsoever about anything other than themselves and what they will be able to do after uni. Its frustrating because if I want to discuss various topics from either field, some usually drown me out and change the topic to something else entirely.


Its like high school all over again. They only care about themselves and their needs (albeit I do this sometimes as well) but the integrity of getting to learn something, to contribute something worthwhile matters nothing to them, only what they can gain.

>> No.4221176

>>4217789
>>4219470
>>4220226

>>4217743 here

Let's go have some coffee together.

>> No.4221198

>>4221176
then play some super smash right bros??

>> No.4221210

>>4221198
of c
we'll blast dubstep loudly because it is the best music and it'll be so loud as to make conversation impossible

>> No.4221220

>i have like 2 friends
like 2 more than me ;_;

>> No.4221256

"i live in ex-communist ultra pleb country" also and i feel your pain, OP
People always ridicule me for my taste in music; I can endure any kind of music but that classic shit is my overall favourite(Tchaikovsky, Strauss and Brahms are my favourite composers) I also enjoy jazz very much.

Even though people don't want to accept i listen to this kind of music i am also being laughed at when in boring classes in school i pull out a book and start reading it or in the recess.

What is more Philosophy classes, Law and Ethics were my favourite.
Other classmates never liked when i point out flaws in their hypothesis when they try to make themselves look smart.
No matter what i say there will always be a comment from somebody saying something as "stfu you philosophag", or a sarcastic "oh, you always know everything".

I don't know why 99% of the people i am surrounded by hate knowledge so much and have never considered reading anything that is outside the textbooks which they rarely open at all.
Most of them have never read any literature other than the works of some authors that are studied in school, even than only like 3 people in my class have read the novels and short stories and not just the poems we study.
People think their brain will rot if they read a book.
I lost faith in this society.
I should write a dystopian like book that is actually realism.