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/lit/ - Literature

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4146486 No.4146486 [Reply] [Original]

Do you think there is a relation between the complexity of the plot and how good it its?; what about the complexity of the prose and the quality of the book itself?.

If not, why some writers choose a complex argument or prose? -talking about good books, not the ones which are written with obscure prose to seem deep-.

>> No.4146490 [DELETED] 

>>4146486
because they're niggers

>> No.4146508

>>4146486
What kind of relation? Positive? Negative? Inverse? If you're just asking "are the two connected, than yes. Yes they are

>> No.4146523

>>4146508
Positive.

>> No.4146538

more layers, more content, and more relationships between data means a wider net, more chances for people to find something that they like, and something they haven't come across before, it doesn't guarantee quality but increases the probability for it

>> No.4146566

>>4146538
That's like saying that rolling a dice twice increases the chances of getting a 6. The problem is, that you simultaneously decrease the chances of it being a 6 on average, and risk creating a book that appeals to no one by trying to appeal to everyone.

The reasonable thing to do is find a sweet spot between total simplicity and the overly complex.

>> No.4146570

>>4146486
Cos some people love obscure stuff and others don't

>> No.4146574

>>4146566
But rolling a dice twice increases the chances of getting a 6.

>> No.4146586

>>4146574
Yes, I said that.

>> No.4146605

Complexity doesn't guarantee quality, but it is positively correlated with it. It is not good simply because it's complex, but because of other factors that also are correlated with complexity,

>> No.4146657

Kinda.

Complex doesn't always mean good. Look at Die Hard, it doesn't have a complex plot, but it's a great movie.

>> No.4146665

So not every complex plot is good? What makes a complex plot good?

>> No.4146674

>>4146665
A real written one with interesting and developed characters.

If you do it right people will like the depth you give and the tweests. If you do it wrong then people will be turning back a few hundred pages, scratching their heads and wondering what's going on.

>> No.4146722
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4146722

>>4146486
I hope that all the hipsters from /fa pay /lit a visit a see that finnegans wake is the most difficult to read, most obscure book and so being the faggot hipsters they all are they buy it. The hipsters then climb to the hills and sound their mating call so that they may share the finnegans wake with each other and revell in their faggotry and ignorance.

Soon after a hipster set foot on foreign land and made his mating call the hipsters of afar were alerted to the presence of finnegans wake and so they too went out and bought it, excited by its obscure gibberish. Finnegans wake soon then becomes a worldwide phenomon after the activities of the hipster became known to the public through the hipster'sraiding of small african villages where they would burn down their shacks and sacrifice an african baby to the great James Joyce. The hipsters would then flee back to their respective countries, leaving a trail of finnegans wake.

After years of hipsters running an underground crime circuit in ireland led by the spirit of James Joyce, the media shuns finnegans wake as is it assumed to be the source of the hipster's worldwide power and influence.

A worldwide witch hunt is started to catch the hipsters.

The governments of the world then decide it is for the best to begin burning copies of finnegans wake. The public agree because of the media scaremongering and also through their fear of the hipster legion. The public begins razing the houses of any known readers as they fear the person may be dealers of finnegans wake. Readers who are not killed in the fires are tracked down and clubbed to death. Book critics are hung, drawn and quatered and their remains are hung out on their burnt out houses for everyone to see.

Little do they all know Thom Yorke is the leader of the hipster movements as wants to overthrow the corrupt governments of the world and replace all politicians with kurt cobain sex dolls in order to fufill his totally non erotic fantasy.

The world is far past anarchy by this point.

The majority of /lit goes into hiding. Some stick up for what they believe in and they are the first to die, while others commit suicide as they do not want to live in a world where the eupohoric are killed for what they love. Anyway the majority of /lit goes into hiding in order to discover the true meaning of finnegans wake so they can prove to the government it is not the source of the hipster's power and to prove it is just a book. They meet once a fortnight to compare notes and record any progress they have made on the book (and also to have gay buttsecks) and all live in underground shelters with running water, a kettle , and an unlimited supply of ramen.

>> No.4146741

can a literary work stand as "beautiful" through just its plot rather than its aesthetics?

>> No.4146747

>>4146741
That's most of them

>> No.4146753

>>4146747
so can a plot be told in a robotic, overly-formal prose style yet still be seen as beautiful in plot construction and depth alone?

any examples of this?

>> No.4146757 [DELETED] 

>>4146753
Maybe Gravity's Rainbow?

>The caravan has halted. It is the end of the line. All the evacuees are ordered out. They move slowly, but without resistance. Those marshaling them wear cockades the color of lead, and do not speak. It is some vast, very old and dark hotel, an iron extension of the track and switchery by which they have come here. . .

Seems robotic enough for you?

>> No.4146799

>>4146722

>hipsters

We haven't moved on from that yet? See you in another year /lit/, stay high-school~

>> No.4146826

>>4146753
any of pkd's books

>> No.4147685

>>4146753
Gravity's Rainbow.

>> No.4147944

Basically, it all comes down to 2 different factors:
A. What do you want out of this book?
B. What is the book doing?
It's impossible to say the only good books are the ones with complex plots or complex prose, because that totally ignores character-based and minimalist writing.

>> No.4147947

>>4146753
Hemingway. I like his prose, but it's robotic, emotionless, and bare. However, his whole "iceberg theory" thing makes judging his books on his prose a waste of time; it's all about interpretation.