/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.3865159]

Spanish litfag here. I really like reading and I've been slowly making my way through the classics, which I fucking love. Thing is, I've been focusing so much on all kinds of foreign literature that I've kinda neglected my own language, which is retarded.
I have read the must-read Spanish classics (Don Quixote, Lazarillo, Cid, tons of plays as well, books you're assigned in HS...), but when it comes to more modern stuff, apart from Lorca whom I love and some other playwrights and poets from his time, I haven't really read a whole lot. Summer's here and I intend to fix that.
I've been wanting to read some Borges for a while and atm I'm staying at my parents', which means I have access to a shitton of his books. So where should I start /lit/? Also, any modern Spanish (language) book recommendations?

TL;DR HOW DO I INTO BORGES, /LIT/?

[Anonymous No.3865167]

>>3865159

Julio Cortázar.
Juan Rulfo.
Alfonso Reyes.
Paco Ignacio Taibo II.
José Lezama Lima.
Miguel Otero Silva.
Carlos Fuentes.
Manuel Puig.

[Anonymous No.3865189]

Posting in English so others can read if they want.

Most of his work is short stories so you can pick up any collection really. Ficciones is probably the best, but you can start anywhere. Also, he didn't really write it, but I really enjoyed "Cuentos Breves y Extraordinarios" which is a recopilation of flash fiction across the history and the globe made by him and Bioy-Casares

I would recommend Cortázar, especially his short stories. He is never recommended on /lit/ but it's such a shame because he is probably the best short story writer in Spanish.

Por cierto, que te pareció el Lazarillo. No me refiero a la relevancia literaria, que ya se que es mucha (al menos en España) sino a si es entretenido.

[Anonymous No.3865190]

>>3865167
Thanks :)

[Anonymous No.3865195]

>>3865190

De nada.

[Anonymous No.3865197]

>>3865159
¡Hola-hola, shurmano! :roto2:

[Anonymous No.3865198]

I fucking love El Aleph. I only read that and the one about the big library but El Aleph was actually really funny and had a more interesting theme.

[Anonymous No.3865202]

>>3865189
Thanks! I'll probably check out Ficciones then. I'll check out Cortázar as well.

El Lazarillo a mí personalmente me encanta. Tuve el gusto de asistir a una charla que daba una profesora de la Complutense de Barcelona que afirmaba que había descubierto el autor. Aunque me pareció exagerada la fe ciega que tiene en su investigación, me hizo ver el libro con ojos distintos, y muchas de sus ideas son realmente sorprendentes y una vez explicadas se ven tan evidentes... En fin, es un clasíco, un libro ameno, divertido y genial. Yo lo he leído tres veces, y me sigue pareciendo fantástico.

[Anonymous No.3865206]

To add on to what the others have already posted you could also try:

Juan Jose Arreola
Augusto Monterroso
Horacio Quiroga
Adolfo Bioy Casares
Ernesto Sabato
Rafael Sanchez Ferlosio

[Anonymous No.3865212]

>>3865198
>>3865206
Thanks. I really should start throwing more modern stuff in there, it's amazing how fucking little I know about these authors :/

[Anonymous No.3865226]

>>3865202
Gracias anon, la verdad es que me has convencido, empezaré el Lazarillo en cuanto pueda. Espero que disfrutes de Cortázar, es de lo mejorcito de la literatura hispanoamericana junto con Borges y Márquez

Sólo una pequeña corrección, estudio en Barcelona y te puedo asegurar que la Complutense de Barcelona no existe, es de Madrid. Quizás te referías a la autónoma.

[Anonymous No.3865242]

>>3865226
D'oh. Lapsus. :/ Era la Autónoma, sí.

[Anonymous No.3865302]

About Borges, I think his most solid one is Ficciones. Some of my favorite ones are not in it but all tales in it are enjoyable. Now, what I think us really worth it from others (and that you could easily find in the web either for download or for online reading, anyway):

1. In "Historia universal de la infamia:
- La viuda Ching, pirata
- El tintorero enmascarado Hákim de Merv
2. Artificios:
- Funes el memorioso
- Tres versiones de Judas
3. El Aleph:
- Los teólogos
- La busca de Averroes
- El Zahir
- El Aleph
4. El informe de Brodie:
- El evangelio según San Marcos
- El informe de Brodie
5. El libro de arena:
- El otro
- El espejo y la máscara
- Utopía de un hombre que está cansado
- El disco
- El libro de arena
La memoria de Shakespeare:
- Tigres azules

[Anonymous No.3865318]

>>3865302
To add to this, I support the anon who recommended Rulfo and add to it Jose Emilio Pacheco's "Batallas en el desierto".
Also, since you're interested in recent literature. Have you read Juan Ramón Biedma? I don't think he'll be remembered in posterity but he's a genuinely good storyteller.

[Anonymous No.3865333]

Get Borges's nonfiction stuff, it's better than the short stories. Also there's ton of it, like 1500 pieces or something...not sure if they ever put out a complete collection in Spanish though.

[Anonymous No.3865440]

Shit, OP here.

I just read the first story from Ficciones, Tlön, Uqbar, Orbis Tertius. I honestly don't know what to think right now. Shit is this really a good introduction to Borges? It seems like plunging head-first into something really specific and complex jeez.

I seriously need to sleep on it, that was too much, I fucking thought it was brilliant at times, there were some fucking amazing passages. The thing about the language was fascinating... Some other times though, it was just like.... what the actual fuck, this is just 2deep4me. Well not really deep, but to be honest I just can't stand philosophy and random paradoxes and shit, and it seems Borges is all about that kinda crap.... I don't like having my brain fucked with for no particular reason and leading to no useful outcome. And here I was expecting a nice little short story ;'(

Meh I'm probably just being a little bitch, but seriously I wasn't expecting this and I'm honestly so confused right now.... is all of his stuff like this?

>>3865302
>>3865318
Thanks. And no, I haven't read anything by him :/

Seriously though, is all of his stuff this trippy?

[Anonymous No.3865461]

>>3865440
>I just can't stand philosophy and random paradoxes and shit
oh boy... you might not enjoy Borges, even most of his tales about gangs and bars have philosophy written in the bottom

Ficciones must be his trippiest. I'm guessing you have thebook near you so make the tale Las ruinas circulares your next read. Borges just might not be your cup of tea

[Anonymous No.3865466]

>>3865440
TUOT is definitely one of his more heavy works, though it was the first story in the first collection of his I read also. He has some more digestible stuff. I'll especially recommend "The Immortal," which another quintessential work of his but more accessible. He has many philosophical motifs that pop up but they are usually more reader-friendly than is TUOT, which his just a top level mindfuck out the gate. Keep going, you won't be disappointed.

If I had to chose, Borges would probably be my pick for best writer ever. Can't wait to learn Spanish to read his original(I've read him in English and French).

[Anonymous No.3865483]

>>3865461
>>3865466
Well I mean I'm exaggerating haha, I'm just really shocked; I can stand philosophy. There's philosophy in all books right, what I don't enjoy is people shoving random, complex philosophical concepts down my throat for no reason whatsoever :/ Well it might just be me unable to understand why but still, I didn't enjoy it.

Idk I might be too pleb for this kind of thing, it's definitely a possibility. I'll keep trying for a little while longer though, not gonna give up after my first short story. At least it's reassuring to know that all the great classics will still be there waiting for me no matter what :3

[Anonymous No.3865491]

>>3865466
Also, if you learn Spanish, you should definitely read some Lorca! Jesus I can't get over how beautiful his poems and plays are...

I actually felt that Borges's language, while being good, doesn't really draw much attention to itself to be honest.

[Anonymous No.3865492]

Most of Borges' short stories are disguised as essays, so there's a lot of philosophy-like exposition. There's also a few essays disguised as fiction.

Read "El jardín de senderos que se bifurcan" next.

[Anonymous No.3865498]

>>3865492
Hmmm what the hell, I'll read another one before going to bed. "El jardín de senderos que se bifurcan" over ''Las ruinas circulares'' as >>3865461 suggested? Think I'm going to go with las ruinas, it's shorter.

[Anonymous No.3865508]

>>3865483
>Idk I might be too pleb for this kind of thing
Noah don't take it like that, it's completely acceptable for you not to like this or that thing. That being said, I don't think he's just shoving philosophical stuff that's unnecessary. I think the point very much reveals at the end of the story when the citizens of Earth [spoilers]adopt the language of the fictitious population and try to adopt their costumes[/spoilers]. I think he's quite explicit about simple ideas changing complex things (like the order of the world), the difficulty of changing ideas thus the decision to pretend such ideas are already implemented rather than convince people to pioneer them

It also permits us to reconsider how we think of past cultures. We don't see the Greeks today the same way we say them a hundred years ago and our society does care a lot and is influenced a lot about what the Greeks were, but it's not only appliable to that. The line between fact and fiction is blurred

[Anonymous No.3865512]

>>3865491
>I actually felt that Borges's language, while being good, doesn't really draw much attention to itself to be honest.
Not the person you're talking to but while I do like how he writes I understand what you mean. It's a contained, erudite style, and it can feel really slow and regular. As if with no passion. I hear that his poes are really passionate though

[Anonymous No.3865539]

OP here, just read ''Las ruinas circulares''. Didn't understand it, I think. Really liked it though. It was very beautiful, the prose was 10000xtimes better than TUOT. Interesting idea as well. This is what I mean when I say there's philosophy in it but it's not explicit and just blurting out theories and stuff.

Also, >>3865508 that makes sense, but man that story was just weird as fuck... Like the idea seems pretty simple and brilliant at the same time, but I think he overdid it with all the crazy examples and made-up words...

And yeah >>3865512 I agree for TUOT, but ''Las ruinas circulares'' was really good in terms of language, I think.

Oh and it's weird how all of you guys have been so nice and helpful. What the fuck's wrong with /lit/? :p

[Anonymous No.3865559]

>>3865539
>What the fuck's wrong with /lit/?
yeah, seems like we are lacking bitterness today. I'm glad you enjoyed "Las ruinas circulares", that means that you'll probably enjoy other tales of him like "La lotería de Babilonia", "El tintorero enmascarado Hákim de Merv" and "Tigres azules". That's just my guess

[Anonymous No.3865561]

>>3865159
>HOW DO I INTO BORGES, /LIT/?
Nobody will give you better advice: look for "mirrors" in his writing. It's not gratuitous that he's known for being obsessed with them. And when I say "mirrors" I mean it in a broad sense; look for oxymora and similar figures. There are mirrors in the structure of his short stories too.

[Anonymous No.3865565]

>>3865561
listen to this anon. there's even tales of him that mirror previous ones (different, opposing accounts of the same event, for example)

[Anonymous No.3865571]

Just in case you haven't visited the sticky:

[Anonymous No.3865573]

[Anonymous No.3865582]

>>3865559
Deep down you're all nice people if approached adequately, I know that :p

>>3865561
>>3865565
Thanks, I just read his poem ''Los espejos''... interesting stuff. Nice use of imagery, he really surprises me sometimes.

>>3865571
>>3865573
Thanks, but I really wanted to know about Borges specifically. What I meant was that if anyone had any other recommendations that they'd be welcome to share them.

[Anonymous No.3865592]

I have this edition, is a collection of non-fiction articles published in different magazines. Is not a complete collection but gathers a lot of stuff that AFAIK is no in "Obras completas" that contains most of the stuff written by him.

This book is 1200+ pages, but is from Debolsillo, so should be cheap.

I only read a few hundreds though.

>>3865333
I wouldn't say that he's better writing non-fiction, is true though that nobody never discusses his articles that are amazing works, I would love to have some spanish writers, journalist or literary critics that could write like him

[Anonymous No.3865606]

>>3865592
>nobody never discusses his articles that are amazing works
this is true though more and more from two years past to now I have been noticing a tendency for people to appreciate his non-fiction but still I don't see them discussed more in depth, just mentioned

[Anonymous No.3865609]

OP going to bed now. I won't delete the thread since it seems to be the first trolless thread in the history of 4chan and someone else might be interested in discussing Borges. I wan't to see how long you guys can keep this nice and respectful lit discussion going.

This was lovely, thank you all, and even though I'm not that crazy about Borges (yet?), I must admit his fans are amazing :3

[Beet No.3865798]

You should try and read Pedro Paramo by Juan Rulfo, one of the best short masterpieces in spanish literature. His only novel was enough to place him among the best of the best in Realismo Magico

[Anonymous No.3865960]

>>3865539
>Oh and it's weird how all of you guys have been so nice and helpful. What the fuck's wrong with /lit/? :p
>:p
Well, a lot of things you've written would come across as really annoying but I'm trying to raise my tolerance levels, so...
Also, it's what Borges would have done, just let things be, judge as less as possible and lead by example.

[Anonymous No.3867287]

>>3865606
probably you're right.
I've never studied literature or any other humanist branches so I don't feel like I'm able to discuss his works. I totally love his books reviews, of classics mostly.

[Anonymous No.3867511]

I bought this one. Cost about $40 in local currency.

The title is a lie, btw. It does have all of Borges' short story collections, but it's not a complete short stories collections. For example, apparently some editions of "El jardín..." have eight stories; this book has the one with seven. The eight story ("El acercamiento a Almotásim") and a few other missing ones can be easily found online to read. But yeah, why call it "complete" when it's clearly not.

Also, this edition by Lumen seems to be a relatively cheap copy of what I presume is the original edition

http://bimg1.mlstatic.com/jorge-luis-borges-cuentos-completos_MLA-F-4382536925_052013.jpg

Which looks like a hardcover and fucking nifty as hell. But thinner than my copy... so either it has smaller font (or larger pages) or the paper is thinner.

[Anonymous No.3868534]

I just wanted to tell you guys that this thread made me finally check out Borges, namely the poem "Los espejos" (because of the anons saying mirrors are important in his stories, I think). I'm a portufag, with the help of a dictionary spanish feels like my native tongue to me.

So I read it online. At first I was like "nice poem", not mindblowing but that's ok. Then I reread it, out loud. I still didn't completely understand the poem. I looked at the mirror and studied it, performing motions and analyzing how the projection differs from reality. Finally, I looked at it from another perspective: as the projection looking at me.

And I cried. Then I read the poem one more time, half silent, half aloud, and I cried some more.

Sorry for the dumb, sentimental post. I was just not expecting that. I mean, we see reflections everyday, and still... we can never understand them. Thanks, /lit/

[Anonymous No.3868723]

>>3868534
Ñawwwwwww it's ok.

[Anonymous No.3868754]

>>3867511
It doesn't have Almotásim? not even listed in Ficciones?

[Anonymous No.3868756]

Lovecraft wrote a story about a being that sees itself on a mirror and discovers he's a monster.

Decades later Thomas Ligotti wrote a sort of sequel to that story. This is the ending to his story, and I think it's appropiate given the current subject of mirrors, and the Espejos poem in particular.

[Anonymous No.3868763]

>>3868756
How I hate that ligotti is so difficult to find.

[Anonymous No.3868777]

>>3868754

Nope. It's not in the book nor in the index (should be between Tlon and Pierre Menard. The prologue even reads "las siete piezas de este libro", not the eight stories.

Incidentally, I just compared the index of the book to this one http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jorge_Luis_Borges#Cuentos and Almotásim is the only story missing. No idea why, though.

[Anonymous No.3868783]

>>3868777
fuck, how I hate when they do that. you've no idea.
at least I found out before buying it.

[Anonymous No.3868793]

>>3868783

Well, it's just that one story which you can easily find online. Still a good deal for almost all of Borges' fiction.

There's a separate volume titled Poesia Completa, which is about the same size and price, but I didn't buy that one. No idea if that's actually complete or not.

[Anonymous No.3868800]

>>3868793
I know, I have Ficciones already so I have the story there but I really like my "Complete..." books to actually be complete. Kind of neurotic here, you see.

[Anonymous No.3868803]

>>3868793

But yeah. I guess it'd be like buying a boxset of the complete Beatles studio recordings and find out it's missing Daytripper or something.