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/lit/ - Literature

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3790609 No.3790609 [Reply] [Original]

This was terrible. Uncreative, predictable, forced plotlines, no characters.

I have Foundation and PKD 'bladerunner' on the shelf... I hope these are on another level in every domain...

>> No.3790615

Foundation sucks. PKD is awesome.

>> No.3790629

Not gonna get much out of Clarke and Asimov if you expect decent characters.

>> No.3790641

The "big three" of sci-fi are terrible. If you want well written sci-fi, you may want to start with Le Guin or Herbert.

>> No.3790647
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3790647

>actually paying attention to genre fiction
Stay pleb.

>> No.3790655

>>3790641
>Herbert
>well written

Le Guin is good, though.

>> No.3790660

>>3790609
Wut? Rendezvous With Rama was fucking awesome.

>> No.3790656

>>3790609
You mean "Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep?"
How was it compared to the movie?

I really enjoyed Foundation myself, had an awesome story arc and made me think of the world on a larger time scale. (Don't make fun of me I read it when I was really young.)

>> No.3790661

>>3790655

I maintain that Dune is a classic. I don't have to read the sequels, nor acknowledge their existence.

>> No.3790685

I hate how everyone's first recommendations for SF are Clarke, Heinlein and Asimov.

Jesus, all three of them are so terribly dry and uninteresting.

>> No.3790694

>>3790685
That's because /lit/ never actually reads anything and won't question the opinion canonized somewhere.

>> No.3790696

>>3790694
But /lit/ constantly criticises the "big three"...

Do you even read threads?

>> No.3790695

Weird, I read that this weekend as well. Was similarly disappointed by the lack of characterisation but it's solid hard sci-fi. A movie adaptation with a decent script would be cool.

>> No.3790697

>>3790685
are we talking about their novels or their short stories?

My recommendation, if you want well written modern science fiction: Ted Chiang

>> No.3790699

>>3790695
>solid hard
I fucked up

>> No.3790701
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3790701

>>3790685
Hard sci-fi in general is pretty boring and made with autistic STEM majors in mind.

>> No.3790704

>>3790609
Yeah I don't know how Clarke made something so shitty and I never understand the praise it gets as great 'hard' scifi. I must of missed the interesting part.

Childhood's End though..

>> No.3790710

>>3790609
foundation is worse than Rendezvous with Rama but most PKD is good

>> No.3790711

>>3790701

As an autistic STEM major I find that insulting.

It's aimed at the same demographic that masturbates over Cosmos and then gets a job as a fedora salesman.

>> No.3790727

>>3790701

I dunno, I think Rama is a good example of a hard sci-fi story that's interesting enough to overcome shortfalls of characterisation and plot. It takes a lot of originality to make writing as sterile as Clarke's or Asimov's sustain a full novel.

>> No.3790738

I think it's quite foolish to even write 'hard sci-fi' taking place 200 years in the future with human beings as we know today. It's unknown how biotech, the Internet, the symbiosis of man/machine will shape the world and human beings in particular in the coming century. The human condition is already changing. Cellphones and computers are already part of us in a profound way. This was not the everyday reality only 50 years ago.

>> No.3790741

>>3790711
>masturbates over Cosmos
I want to do that.

>> No.3790742

If you want a feel for older SF authors with actual personality, the list goes on and on: Olaf Stapeldon, Leigh Brackett, Walter M. Miller Jr, John Wyndham, PKD, Walter Tevis, Harlan Ellison, Thomas Disch, John Brunner, Samuel Delany, JG Ballard, Robert Silverberg, Ursula K. LeGuin, Jon Crowley, etc.

Anyone who shoots you something by Clarke or Asimov as an example of the best the genre has to offer probably has not read much science fiction. As for Heinlein, he definitely had character, but was so obnoxiously abrasive.

>> No.3790780

>>3790609
Foundation is awesome. Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep is awesome.

>> No.3790798

Couldn't get into foundation or PKD but loved Rama

Am I in a minority here?

>> No.3790830

Alright thanks.Though actually you can keep the suggestions for now as I'll read the other two first. Then I'll be better able to describe what I don't look in sci-fi.

For Rama I was expecting something of a movie like Solaris by the first pages, but ended up with a shallow plot, weak storyline, no characters, a forced plot of mercury nuking rama, etc. The ethical issues that were brought up were silly weak and the implications of meeting a unknown civilization were poorly explored imo. The creatures exposed and rooms that were finally opened were really unimaginitive. The cylinder world concept was awsome though.

I guess it was mostly to be an action adventure which is not my particular favorite, but I could have enjoyed more if it were as decent of an adventure novel as 20,000 leagues. I think you cannot even write a good novel without your protagonist having any depth. Well, actually you can, if you blow my brain with mystery and metaphysics, but Rama didn't do that either. Overall I think lack of characterization was the biggest issue.

tl;dr - potato

>> No.3790831

>>3790609
Yeah, characters were bleak and predictable, though decription of Rama was somewhat OK. But don't read the other three. That Gentry Lee guy surely messed things up.

>> No.3790985

Foundation is horrible. I much preferred Asimov's Robot novels and stories.

PKD's SF has great ideas with shitty prose, while his non-SF has plain ideas with good prose.

Rendezvous with Rama is one of Clarke's best (along with The City and the Stars). His character writing is bad, though. If you didn't like Rama, probably best to not try other Clarkes.

Avoid Heinlein, no matter how much people tell you he's one of the SF masters.

>> No.3791004

I quite liked Rama. It was not so much a story as a portrait of an interesting theoretical scenario. It gave me some stuff to think and fantasise about.

>> No.3791006

Is there any sci-fi with strong characters?

>> No.3791007

I remember reading a number of Heinlein novels, trying to catch a glimpse of this genius that everyone says he is. The only one I enjoyed all that much to read all the way through was Time Enough For Love, and that's mainly because I love just about anything with a scope like that.

>> No.3791019

I couldn't even finish Starship Troopers. It was so bad.

I really love the film, though. Or at least I did as a kid. Probably seen it more times than any other film.

>> No.3791534
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3791534

>>3790647

>mfw undergraduate doesn't click that Literary fiction is just another genre

>> No.3791547
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3791547

>>3790742

This is excellent advice -

>> No.3791908

My favorites are Gene Wolfe, LeGuin and Jack Vance.

I'm reading The Dying Earth right now. It's amazing. There hasn't been a single boring part.

It's so depressing to read good SF settings knowing that they will never make it unmolested in a movie or video game.

>> No.3791913

>>3791006
The Stars My Destination