/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.2921485]

I just read all 5 books of the Ice and Fire series back to back and need more!

Any recommendations to keep me going until the next book comes out?

[Anonymous No.2921492]

>>2921485
The Farseer Trilogy by Robin Hobb. One of those rare examples where a woman writes good stuff, even about male characters.

[Anonymous No.2921495]

>>2921492

I think im looking for something that has the same level of world building as Ice and Fire

Looked up Farseer Trilogy and it seemed to lack that

[Anonymous No.2921499]

>>2921495
Ice and Fire has pretty shitty and generic world building, right? Farseer Trilogy is rather generic as well. Both are low fantasy and focus a lot on power structures and politics and relationships and place fantasy elements as something secondary. I would say they are pretty alike in a lot of ways.

[Anonymous No.2921502]

>>2921499

you sound offended. was not my intention.

[Anonymous No.2921519]

Try Patrick Rothfuss' "The Name of the Wind" and "The Wise Man's Fear".

[Anonymous No.2921517]

Honestly there isn't much fantasy out there of a high quality, you're better off with sci-fi if you want genre fiction. Read Asimov's foundation series if you haven't already, it's sublime

[Anonymous No.2921521]

>>2921502
I'm not offended at all. But I am serious about the shitty world building.

Now I'll have to admit that I've only seen the TV show Game of Thrones as far as Martin's work goes, but the world just isn't all that interesting and original. It's a mix and mash of obvious European history. Carth is based on Cartage. He didn't even bother with a name. The Dothraki are a mix of a bunch of nomadic people. A bit of huns and mongols and all that. Emphasis on horsemanship and warfare and tribalism. Westeros is largely Roman in the south and Germanic in the north. But the continent is inspired by Britain. The wall is basically Hadrian's Wall. The Wildlings are Picts. Iron Islanders are a haphazard bunch of Irishmen or Scottish Islanders. Braavos is a latin type of naval swaggering cultural folk with macho but delicate dudes, based of Renaissance Venice. There isn't a single thing in Game of Thrones that I haven't seen that I can't instantly associate with greater European history. I've played computer games with more interesting world building.

[Anonymous No.2921524]

>>2921519
AHAHAHAH.

No, fuck off.

[Anonymous No.2921525]

>>2921521
>I'll have to admit that I've only seen the TV show Game of Thrones as far as Martin's work goes
Why are you discussing this on a literature board then? You are talking about the TV program, not the book. There is a board for discussing the /tv/ series, and this is not it.

[Anonymous No.2921527]

>>2921524
What is your problem with those books?

[Anonymous No.2921534]

>>2921521

gtfo, we are talking about books.

[Anonymous No.2921536]

>>2921527
They're awful Mary-Sue shit. The story of every book can be summarised as "THE PROTAGONIST IS GOOD AT EVERYTHING. HE IS THE SMARTEST MAN IN THE WORLD AND ALSO THE GREATEST WIZARD IN THE WORLD AND HE IS A BETTER WARRIOR THAN EVERYONE ELSE AND HE ALSO PLAYS A MEAN GUITAR BECAUSE HE IS THE BESTEST MUSICIAN OF THEM ALL AND ALL THE WOMEN LOVE HIM AND HE HAS LOADS OF SEX AND HE IS GOODLOOKING AND COOL", and it panders to borderline post-pubescent young-adults who read them thinking "I wish I was like him and that nobody had bullied me at school".

They're just awful in every way imaginable. There is nothing redeemable about them.

[Anonymous No.2921548]

While we're at it, is the Way of shadows worth reading?

[Anonymous No.2921547]

>>2921525
I'm pretty sure the world in which it takes place doesn't become magically original in print.

[Anonymous No.2921550]

>>2921547
I'm pretty sure you're on the wrong board.

[Anonymous No.2921553]

>>2921550
Pretty sure this thread is on the wrong board.

[Anonymous No.2921555]

>>2921547
How do you not see that they're two different things?

[Anonymous No.2921559]

>>2921553
Of course it is, nobody is disputing that.

[Anonymous No.2921565]

>>2921547
>>2921521
You're basically right, he also draws on the War of the Roses quite heavily, and his use of language can be a bit grating at times (would that I could ad nauseum etc). Despite all this it's very immersive and the plot in the first three books is fantastic. It's not high art but there's a reason it's so wildly popular

[Anonymous No.2921566]

>>2921536
Owned.

[Anonymous No.2921570]

>The First Law Trilogy by Joe Abercombie
It's everything I wanted from ASoIF but never got from it. Miles better than ASoIF.
>The Gentlemen Bastard Sequence by Scott Lynch
It's like Ocean's Eleven set in Braavos.

[Anonymous No.2921572]

>>2921555
Of course I see that. I just don't believe that the books in which this showwas based doesn't portray a shitty hodgepodge of European history like the tv show does. I mean, as far as I know, all the other factors are pretty much alike. The tv writers didn't create wholly new characters. Did they create a whole different world?

[Anonymous No.2921612]

>>2921572

More than half of you comparisons to real world counteparts are way off anyway.
>south of westeros roman
>iron islanders irish and scottish
>qarth - carthage

Just... no.

[Anonymous No.2921618]

>>2921612
but qarth is carthaeg becoz th name iz a bit the same dummy. gorge rr murtin riped it of

[Anonymous No.2921636]

>>2921492
>One of those rare example where a woman writes good stuff

You genre-fiction neckbeards are as uncultured as you are pathetic.

[Anonymous No.2921638]

>>2921485
>until the next book comes out?
I have bad news for you. There never will be another book

[Anonymous No.2921652]

>>2921636
>You genre-fiction neckbeards are as uncultured as you are pathetic.
Wow, you are an argumentative little cunt, or a woman. Everyone (but you, apparently) on /lit/ believes there are few good female writers. While literary fiction has a few good female writers, the majority of the shit fantasy novels produced are by women. The rules does apply in fantasy, as well as literature.

[Anonymous No.2921656]

>>2921612
Qarth is an overseas seafaring wealthy Republic of trade surrounded by desert being the most important city in it's sphere. Sure sounds like Carthage to me.

South of Westeros has plenty of Roman cultural traits, and it fits within the idea of southern Britain. The Iron Islanders come across as very Celtic, and their barren and rocky islands remind of nothing else but Irish and British isles. Apart from the Northeners being rather Nordic, the whole of Westeros fits in with Britain pretty well.

Of course it's never truly spot on, since he mixed and mashed and twisted a lot around, but the world as a whole can hardly be considered to be very original.

[Anonymous No.2921660]

>>2921652
>Everyone (but you, apparently) on /lit/ believes there are few good female writers

>on /lit/

[Anonymous No.2921662]

>>2921652
>I speak for everyone on the board hurr durr what's the difference between subjectivity and objectivity

[Anonymous No.2921677]

>>2921656
No, it is not original.

But Qarth is fucking nothing like Carthage and the Iron Islanders are even less like the Celts. Qarth is some kind of orientalistic fever dream of the Persian trading hubs, and the Iron Islanders are so obviously and clearly pop-culture vikings it is astounding you couldn't see it.

[Anonymous No.2921704]

>>2921660
>On /lit/
You're right. Only women think there are a lot of good female writers.
>>2921662
I apologize for implying I speak for the board. I was just pointing out that the general (not the opinion of everybody) opinion is that there aren't many decent, noteworthy female authors.
And because I was nice enough to reply to you, can I ask a single question: are you a woman, or a troll?

[Anonymous No.2921721]

>>2921704
hateful sociopath detected

god back to /pol/ and take your misogynist with you

>debating about gender politics on the internet
>a life
pick 1

[Anonymous No.2921725]

>>2921704
>can I ask a single question

No.

haha loser you just got dominated by a woman, how does that make your virginity feel?

[Anonymous No.2921729]

>>2921721
>Hurr I don't have an argument so I'll just throw out meaningless buzzwords.
>Implying I go to /pol/ for any reason other than to laugh at retarded Stormfags.
>take your misogynist with you
Nice grammar, cunt.

[Anonymous No.2921730]

Just finished both Gentlemen Bastard books

read that shit

[Anonymous No.2921735]

>>2921729
>women generally are inferior
>an argument

Apply yourself.

[Anonymous No.2921736]

>>2921729
keep getting dominated, my little bitch boy

[Anonymous No.2921739]

Wheel of Time

Please contain your rage orgasms /lit/

[Anonymous No.2921740]

>>2921735
Name twenty female authors that are good. I can do it with men for both fantasy and literature.
>>2921735
>>2921736
>Samefag
Also, fuck you, OP. This isn't your thready anymore

[Anonymous No.2921741]

>>2921652
>>2921652
>everyone on /lit/
Nope.

>While literary fiction has a few good female writers

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

What?

>the majority of the shit fantasy novels produced are by women
>implying there is an amount of fantasy novels that are not shit

I've got some bad news for you...


>>2921704
>general (not the opinion of everybody) opinion is that there aren't many decent, noteworthy female authors

The general opinion among who? Virgins? Where are you getting this general consensus from?

>And because I was nice enough to reply to you, can I ask a single question: are you a woman, or a troll?

I'm the original person you responded to. I'm neither a troll nor a woman. I'm a cultured young man whose worldview isn't polluted by an ultra-conservative sex-starved misogyny. Believe it or not, you /pol/tards are the minority among the literate.

[Anonymous No.2921745]

>>2921740
Do it for men and literature. The burden of proof is on you, my misogynistic friend.

[Anonymous No.2921747]

>>2921740
DOMINATED

YOUR MASCULINITY IS NOW THREATENED

[Anonymous No.2921749]

>>2921677
Iron Islanders fit in perfectly as Hibernian raiders. It's an island nation of poor rovers. See Irish piracy during the Roman era. They also portray way less Nordic cultural traits than the Northeners.

Why you would say that Qarth is nothing like Carthage after the similarities I just mentioned is beyond me, especially when you give no reasons to think otherwise.

[Anonymous No.2921755]

>>2921741
>Where are you getting this general consensus from?
From being on this board for over a year now?

>implying there is an amount of fantasy novels that are not shit
>Robert E. Howard
>Jack Vance
>Gene Wolfe
>Tolkien
>Michael Moorcock
>Joe Abercombie
>Scott Lynch
>Richard K. Morgan
>Implying any of these people are shit authors.
Try and read a fantasy novel before you blindly hate a whole genre

[Anonymous No.2921770]

>>2921740
>name twenty female authors that are good

>Mary Wollstonecraft
>Virginia Woolf
>Carson McCullers
>Sylvia Plath
>Margaret Atwood
>Elizabeth Barrett Browning
>Mary Scott
>Charolette Bronte
>Anne Bronte
>Emily Bronte
>Jane Austen
>Mary Shelley
>H.D.
>Maya Angelou
>Alice Fulton
>Alice Walker
>Zora Neil Hurston
>Harper Lee
>Toni Morrison
>Iris Murdoch
>Edna O'Brien
>Radclyffe Hall
>Edna St Vincent

This isn't even hard you untutored troglodyte.

[Anonymous No.2921772]

>>2921745
>Literature:
Jack Kerouac
Ernest Hemingway
F. Scott Fitzgerald
Thomas Pynchon
Kurt Vonnegut
James Joyce
Cormac McCarthy
William S. Burroughs
David Foster Wallace
William Faulkner
Mark Twain
Herman Melville
Fyodor Dostoyevsky
Jack London
Vladimir Nabokov
Oscar Wilde
Homer
Dante
Leo Tolstoy
Chuck Palahanik (I probably spelled that wrong)
Kilgore Trout

[Anonymous No.2921775]

>>2921770
>90% overrated shit-tier and insignificunts

[Anonymous No.2921773]

>>2921755
>they're all genre fiction shit, even Tolkien

I bet you're slightly angry now

[Anonymous No.2921776]

>>2921770
Okay, Good job. I bet I can beat you at naming twenty more.

[Anonymous No.2921778]

>>2921773
>Fiction shit
>Implying this whole board isn't about "Fiction shit".
Butthurt non-fiction fag detected.
The only thing I'm slightly rustled about is your staggering ignorance.

[Anonymous No.2921781]

>>2921775
>Kerouac
>Wilde
>Trout
>London
>any good

[Anonymous No.2921784]

>>2921778
>implying fiction is comprised solely of fantasy

I bet you think it's all fantasy because an author made it hurr durr!

[Anonymous No.2921787]

>>2921781
>Actually believes Kilgore Trout is a real author, let alone a real person
>Pic related

>Kerouac
>Bad
Pick one and only one, you greedy little pig.

[Anonymous No.2921788]

>>2921749
The books are about feudal conflicts and intrigue. Of course there will be analogous historical groups/eras. The 'obviously x is y' argument can be made whenever an alternative reality is thrown up.

[Anonymous No.2921791]

>>2921787
drug addict detected, shouldn't you be smoking some dope or making a thread about Buddhism?

[Anonymous No.2921792]

>>2921784
Well, all fiction is fantasy, by which I mean a constructed story where fictional events play out, since the words are synonymous, dumb fuck. But, to the point: you don't understand I was making fun of your poor choice of words?

[Anonymous No.2921794]

>>2921791
>Drug addict
>Implying I'd corrupt my already perfect, doughy body
No, but "On the Road" is the best work to come out of the Beat Generation, and it influenced the counterculture movement.

[Anonymous No.2921795]

>>2921792
I guess I didn't realize someone could derive pleasure from arguing about the semantics of words on an anonymous image board

but hey, you learn something new every day

[Anonymous No.2921797]

>Beat Generation
barf
>the counterculture movement.
quadruple barf

I get it, I get it, but Jack the Ripper was influential too, in his own way.

[Anonymous No.2921803]

>>2921795
Wow, I'm surprised you admitted you can't grammar.

[Anonymous No.2921817]

Kerouac was certainly better than everyone or anyone who has or will ever post on this board.

[Anonymous No.2921821]

>>2921817
Tao Lin has posted on this board. He sucks in the big picture, but is certainly better than Kerouac.

[Anonymous No.2921835]

>>2921536
3/10
>The story of every book can be summarised as
>HE IS THE SMARTEST MAN IN THE WORLD AND ALSO THE GREATEST WIZARD IN THE WORLD
Wrong, he's beaten out several times. Most notably by Demon Devi.
>HE IS A BETTER WARRIOR THAN EVERYONE ELSE
He gets his ass beat in the first book within the first fifty pages. In the second book he loses fights to children.
> HE ALSO PLAYS A MEAN GUITAR BECAUSE HE IS THE BESTEST MUSICIAN OF THEM ALL
Plausible, as he grew up in a traveling troupe, but he never claims to be the best.
> ALL THE WOMEN LOVE HIM AND HE HAS LOADS OF SEX
Also not true. To throw another wrench in your claim that all the books are the same, he doesn't even have sex in the first book.
>They're just awful in every way imaginable. There is nothing redeemable about them.
A matter of opinion.
While I would agree that the sex in the second book is way overdone, I would have to say that I find the love of music, and how it changes the character, to be a redeeming quality in the book. I feel a kinship with the character in that sense.

While I'm certainly not advocating these books as the apotheosis of fantastic literature, look at all those holes in your hate. I only read each book once and am citing these from memory.
Step your game up, troll.

[Anonymous No.2921973]

>>2921656

So qarth is "overseas" overseas from what? westeros? Its so fucking far from westeros that its got little contact with it. Also i cant think of many ways for a city to thrive in a desert other than commerce. Is carthage your very definition of "seafaring city in a desert"?

The guys from the iron islands are so different from scottish and irish people that i dont even know where to start. The only similarity is "they live in islands"

What about the south of westeros is roman?

[Anonymous No.2921986]

>>2921817
Kerouac was mediocre and a miserable shitty drunk asshole.

[Anonymous No.2922034]

>>2921739
I liked wheel of time though.
Sure there where many instances in the books that did not have to be there at all, and many of the characters and side plots are unnecessary, but overall I liked the whole series.

The extra stuff made it more interesting for me just because of all the background and world it fleshed out.

[Anonymous No.2922048]

>>2922034

Many fans of Ice and Fire have this sad misplaced rivalry with WoT, but I thought they were all very good.

[Anonymous No.2922067]

thats cool i just finished dance with dragons this morning.

[Anonymous No.2922086]

[Anonymous No.2922106]

>>2922067
I just finished the first a few nights ago.

> Be burning scrap wood from construction project
> I can't throw the final sheet of wood in because the fire is too hot to get near
> Think to myself, "I am the blood of the dragon."
> Step after step, I walk into the heat and throw in the last bit
> Realize that I'm the rightful heir to the Iron Throne

[Anonymous No.2922984]

>>2921797
I would beat you in a fight.

[Anonymous No.2923012]

>>2922984
What the fuck did you just fucking say about me, you little reek? I'll have you know I graduated top of my class in swordsmanship, and I've been involved in numerous secret raids on the Others, and I have over 300 confirmed kills. I am trained in warfare and I'm the top Lord Commander in all the Night's Watch. You are nothing to me but just another Wright. I will wipe you the fuck out with precision the likes of which has never been seen before in Westeros, mark my fucking words. You think you can get away with saying that shit to me over little birds? Think again, dog fucker. As we speak I am contacting my secret network of hot widlings chicks across the North and your crow is being traced right now so you better prepare for the Long Night, maggot. The Long Night that wipes out the pathetic little thing you call your life. You're fucking dead, kid. I can be anywhere, anytime, and I can kill you in over seven hundred ways, and that's just with my bear hands. Not only am I extensively trained in wall climbing, but I have access to the entire arsenal of Azor Ahai and I will use it to its full extent to wipe your miserable ass off the face of the continent, you little shit. If only you could have known what unholy retribution your little "clever" comment was about to bring down upon you, maybe you would have flayed your fucking tongue. But you couldn't, you didn't, and now you're paying the price, you goddamn idiot. I will shit gloominess all over you and you will drown in it. You're fucking dead, bastard.

[Anonymous No.2923016]

>>2923012
You know nothing, Jon Snow. You are dead.

[Anonymous No.2923024]

>>2923012
>I can kill you in over seven hundred ways, and that's just with my bear hands

[Anonymous No.2923031]

It still makes me laugh whenever I think about how it got so Grim Up North that they had to build a fucking wall to keep it out.

[Anonymous No.2923033]

>>2921485
> until the next book comes out
Implying GRRM's inevitable heart-attack is going to wait until that hairy man has finished the series, or even the next book...

[Anonymous No.2923036]

>>2923031
GRRM has obviously been to Scotland.

[Anonymous No.2923048]

>>2923031
>>2923036

When the Roman Empire - after conquering much of Europe - decided to invade Britain, they were so shocked by the savagery of the native 'Wildlings', (and whatever else Scotland contained) that they actually had to build a fucking wall to keep them contained.

That tiny piece of Britain known as Scotland became the most fortified and guarded place in the whole of the Roman Empire.

[Anonymous No.2923051]

>>2923036
GRRM has obviously been to a few buffets.

[Anonymous No.2923066]

Iron Islands = Norway
Westerlands = England
the North = the Rus, Novgorod
the Reach = fantasy France
Dorne = Al Andalus
Riverlands = generic western european
the Vale = generic western european
Stormlands = generic western european
the Freys = Byzantium

[Anonymous No.2923084]

>>2921485

You're kind of out of luck if you want something similar and as good or better. Despite /litards consensus, the series is one of the strongest in fantasy literature, possibly the second strongest. The only one better is Book Of The New Sun, but it's half scifi and quite different.

Oh yeah, don't try to read Malazan series. It has zero compelling characters. It's only good if you're aspergerish and care mostly for worldbuilding.

[Anonymous No.2923092]

>>2923066
Iron Islands = Denmark
Westerlands = England
the North = the Rus, Novgorod
the Reach = fantasy France
Dorne = Al Andalus
Riverlands = Netherlands (although the Netherlands didn't exist until the 1600s)
the Vale = Germanic duchies in the alps
Stormlands = Scotland
the Freys = Habsburgs

[Anonymous No.2923099]

>>2923066
> the Rus, Novgorod

Novgorod was absolutely nothing like this fantasy 'North'.

Also, 'the Rus' is a mythological place or a group of people from legend. Historians aren't sure what the hell they/it was supposed to be

[Anonymous No.2923103]

>>2923084
Comparing BotNS to aSoIaF is like comparing a Las Vegas buffet to the city sewer because both are all-you-can-eat.

[Anonymous No.2923121]

>>2923092
>Iron Islands = Denmark
Denmark or Norway, we can agree about the Norse inspiration.

[Anonymous No.2923154]

I have yet to read it myself, but the Prince of Nothing series seems high regarded by /lit/.

[Anonymous No.2925144]

>>2923084
Tehol Beddict
Fiddler

[Anonymous No.2925157]

Great fantasy:

>Book of the New Sun - Gene Wolfe
Incredibly complex sci-fi/fantasy with excellent prose and a beautifully constructed world and concepts
>The Second Apocalypse Series - R. Scott Bakker
Two gritty/dark fantasy trilogies filled with philosophy with a very epic backstory. Kinda reminds me of Book of the New Sun as some of the backstory gets to be science fiction-y
>First Law trilogy - Joe Abercrombie
Gritty/hilarious fantasy kinda similar to ASOIAF. No shitty young boy on a wizard quest here.
>Malazan Book of the Fallen - Steven Erickson
Massive complex fantasy series that goes all over the place, about gods and battles and shit.
>Chronicles of the Black Company - Glen Cook
Gritty dark fantasy about a mercenary unit. Some don't like it but meh, it's pretty good.
>Acacia - David Anthony Durham
Great fantasy, similar to ASOIAF, written by a black guy

[Anonymous No.2925164]

>>2923154
I heard someone call it a mix of LOTR, the First Law Trilogy and Nietzschean philosophy

[Anonymous No.2925192]

>>2921772
Wilde was gay and as a representative of the homosexual community i give his vote to the women side of the argument, only to piss the redneck off.

[Anonymous No.2925236]

This is what I read after ASOIAF and I constantly recommend it, for the first two and half books it feels a lot like a generic fantasy but after that, the third book and the ending it will completely blow away every expectation you had from the series. Joe Abercrombie is also a fucking brilliant character and dialogue writer, everyone feels real and the character development over the course of the books is top notch.

[Anonymous No.2925269]

>>2921772
>homer
>a dude

lel