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/lit/ - Literature

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2622225 No.2622225 [Reply] [Original]

What is the greatest American novel of all time /lit/?

>> No.2622226

>>2622225
Why Infinite Jest of course.

>> No.2622227
File: 33 KB, 408x414, 1330091508622.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2622227

Shakespeare by Don Quixote

>> No.2622231

THE GRAPES OF WRATH

>> No.2622233
File: 45 KB, 640x960, 1332216652314.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2622233

>>2622225
Moby Dick. No question.
Arguably best of all time.

>>2622226
Was it even the best book of the 1990s?

>> No.2622235

babbitt

dat zeitgeist

>> No.2622238

The Grapes of Wrath
The Last Tycoon
Blood Meridian
The Sound and the Fury

>> No.2622240

Her nude-coloured top made me think she was topless.

Oh, and, Lolita.

>> No.2622246

>>2622240
That's written by a Russian in English.

Fuck off.

>> No.2622247

>>2622240
Murrifats wish they could claim that.

>> No.2622250

>>2622247
>>2622246
For fuck's sake, this conversation again.
It's an American book, in the same way T.S. Eliot is a European poet.

>> No.2622251

Invisible Man nigga

>> No.2622253

>>2622250
Nabokov is a Russian who fled to America, and went back to Europe the first chance he got.
He is by no means an American author.

>> No.2622255

>>2622233
there'd better be less of that flesh colored shirt in the images that will follow

>> No.2622256

>>2622253
This.

>> No.2622257

since peeps are talking nabokov i'ma make a quick post about how delightful a read i'm finding ada to be

it came across a little like a highbrow arrested development at the beginning but shit is rich and intricate

>> No.2622258

>>2622253
>He is by no means an American author.
Didn't say he was.

>> No.2622264
File: 283 KB, 960x938, 1336122189112.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2622264

>>2622255
More will follow?

>> No.2622267

>>2622264
yes, that is me implying that >there will be more images

>> No.2622268

>>2622246
The novel is written in English and takes place in America, showcasing American culture and even features a roadtrip. It's an American novel. Rephrase to "best novel written by an American" if you want to not include it.

>> No.2622273

I'm gonna say... The Great Gatsby. I've enjoyed it the most.

>> No.2622275

I honestly don't get the Nabokov hype...

>> No.2622278

>>2622275
That's because you're an 18 year old with no real taste yet.

>> No.2622280

>>2622257
his best novel, my favorite, and easily top 5 of 20th century novels.

>> No.2622288
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2622288

>>2622278

The word 'projection' comes to mind

>> No.2622295

>>2622268
No, it's a novel ABOUT America you stupid fuck

What about novels that take place across multiple locations? "This superb American-Chinese-French novel..."

>> No.2622301

The Ambassadors

>> No.2622302

>>2622288
>implying it's projection if I'm not in denial

>> No.2622306

>>2622295
Just stop, madfag.

>> No.2622308

>>2622302

>implying you're not

>> No.2622309

The Great Gatsby. Fitzgerald has a way with words that's unmatched by nearly all American writers.

Catcher in the Rye is excellent as well

>> No.2622312
File: 25 KB, 293x500, without_remorse_tom_clancy_book_cover.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2622312

Pic very related.

>> No.2622326

>>2622295
Lolita is a curiosity and a blend. He was an immigrant himself, as the characters in his books so often reflect and America is a nation of immigrants. I am willing to accept that Lolita doesn't have a static nationality adjective to attach to it for this reason. But it being strictly Russian does not feel or seem accurate to me at all.

>> No.2622366

The Stand

>> No.2622388

It's funny, Nabokov could write better than most native speakers of english.

>> No.2622394

The Great Gatsby.

>> No.2622397
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2622397

>>2622388
Probably because he took ENGLISH

>Aimed at the "Why are you taking such a worthless major" threads

>> No.2622398

>>2622388
Yeah, it's really funny that an actual genius, not just an internet hyperbole genius could use language that well, shocking really.

>> No.2622409

Lolita.

>> No.2622427

>>2622409
>youwish.jpg

>> No.2622436

The Sound and the Fury.

>> No.2623281

>>2622312
This

>> No.2623294
File: 12 KB, 220x260, 220px-Jose_de_espronceda.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2623294

Any of you chumps understand Spanish?
Anybody enjoy Romantic poems?

check it, it's my dude Jose de Espronceda going fucking nuts all over the genre

Trae, Jarifa, trae tu mano,
Ven y pósala en mi frente,
Que en un mar de lava hirviente
Mi cabeza siento arder.
Ven y junta con mis labios
Esos labios que me irritan,
Donde aún los besos palpitan
De tus amantes de ayer.

¿Qué la virtud, la pureza?
¿Qué la verdad y el cariño?
Mentida ilusión de niño
Que halagó mi juventud.
Dadme vino: en él se ahoguen
Mis recuerdos; aturdida,
Sin sentir, huya la vida;
Paz me traiga el ataúd.

El sudor mi rostro quema,
Y en ardiente sangre, rojos
Brillan inciertos mis ojos,
Se me salta el corazón.
Huye, mujer; te detesto,
Siento tu mano en la mía,
Y tu mano siento fría,
Y tus besos hielo son.

¡Siempre igual! Necias mujeres,
Inventad otras caricias,
otro mundo, otras delicias,
¡O maldito sea el placer!
Vuestros besos son mentira,
Mentira vuestra ternura,
Es fealdad vuestra hermosura,
Vuestro gozo es padecer.

>> No.2623296

>>2622233
>Moby Dick. No question. Arguably best of all time.

I emphatically agree.

>> No.2623312

Second Foundation, Isaac Asimov.

If you mean an actual zeitgeist novel, I'd say Gone With The Wind, Margaret Mitchell.

>> No.2623384

>>2622238

wait, is the last tycoon good? I enjoy fitzgerald quite a great deal but never bothered to pick up that one because it's unfinished

>> No.2623388

>>2623294
I could just about understand that. Pretty deep, sounds like he's a bit of a misogynist. I'd have to look at it for a while more to fully analyse and appreciate it though.

>> No.2623393

I love how competitive American literature is. Shame about Salinger though.

>> No.2623394

>>2622309
catcher isn't even salinger's best
>raise high them roofbeams motherfuckers

>> No.2623402

>>2623394
My point. It's a shame he produced so little, apparently because he was so focused on producing a 'Great American Novel'

>> No.2623419

Mason & Dixon

>> No.2623429
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2623429

Of Mice and Men
On the Road in my opinion, which isn't much, it perfectly captures an innocent, romantic America
And the Great Gatsby is arguably the best American novel.
>>2622226
You're so funny. It, like all books of modern literature, is one big compendium of white-people problems in my opinion
3/10 for making me mad. (pic related)

>> No.2623436

The Great American Novel of course. By Philip Roth.

>> No.2624266

>No Gravity's Rainbow

Boy, this board has changed.

But that one.

>> No.2625109

>>2622240
>>2622268
>>2622326
>then rephrase the question

His English was British, and self-admittedly "second rate" at that. Nabokov does not count, whether your aspie highness cares to acknowledge this or not. Ada and Pale Fire outclass Lolita in any case, f'ing guy. (If you're right about this then Celine's Journey to the End of Night is eligible, and Hunger from Hamsun as well)

>>2622250
>TS Eliot Brit. Naturalized
May as well be the Benedict Arnold of American Letters, lol.

>>2623393
>ditto
>>2623394
>amen brother!

>>2622235
>babbit zeitgeist
in chronological order. jg ballard, BE Ellis are more zeitgeistlichy, especially the latter's one that liberal arts college

>>2622273
>>2622436
Sound&Fury and Great Gatsby certainly are worthy candidates


Personally I'd nominate The Western Lands, Burroughs and the Recognitions, Gaddis. Saul Bellow's Mr. Sammler's Planet and KVjr's Slaughterhouse5 included as honorable mentions

>> No.2625119

>>2625109

You've never read Nabokov, you're just using Wikipedia.

What do people like you get out of this shit? Looking up facts, and delivering them in a snarky tone which you imagine sounds like an intellectual?

>> No.2625140

Ada is not better than Lolita, get the fuck out of here. You could make a case for Pale Fire, but I wouldn't. It's a lot more fun to read though.

Lolita is the best novel, period. But I don't consider it American. So Moby Dick. It's better than anything by Fitzgerald or Faulkner, and modern American classics don't quite hold up.

>> No.2625146

I was recently introduced to Melville, and I loved his work; however, I didn't read any of his novels, just "The Piazza Tales." I thought"The Encantadas" was a ridiculously beautiful piece... Should I just jump into Moby DIck now?

>> No.2625152

>>2625140

Yes, it's American.

>> No.2625154
File: 51 KB, 600x964, Melv-Typ.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2625154

>>2625146
I hear all his pieces are strikingly different from one another. Jump when you wish.

>> No.2625162

steinbeck shits on fitzgerald

how is this not consensus?

>> No.2625168

>>2625152
I know it is by technicality, but I don't consider it American. Nabokov was a Russian emigrant with literate sensibilities closer to European and other Russian writers.

When you think great American novels, I think Moby Dick, Great Gatsby, As I Lay Dying, Blood Meridian, Miss Lonelyhearts, etc. But Lolita is without a nationality.

>> No.2625175
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2625175

Hi, guise.

>> No.2625177

>>2625168

Nah, it's American.

>> No.2625179

Either The Volcano Lover by Susan Sontag or The Dead Father by Donald Barthelme.

>> No.2625181

>>2625168
Name me one of Steinbeck's works, ONE, that can hold a candle to The Great Gatsby.

>> No.2625184

>>2625181

the grapes of wrath and of mice and men are both better than the great gatsby

you high bro?

>> No.2625187

>>2625181

What's good about Steinbeck, though, is that I can read his books in one hand while rolling my thumb along the inside of my foreskin to remove the cum and juice.

>> No.2625188

>>2625177
Great dude, and I acknowledged that, but being that it's only an American novel by technicality, and that Nabokov is more a writer descended from Russian and European influences, I think it's safe and uncontroversial to leave it out of the running for the "Great American Novel," despite it being better, imo at least, than the other contenders.

>> No.2625199

>>2625188

The technicality being that it was written by an American citizen, in America, about an American milieu.

I'm kidding, but seriously, I don't think you'll find a great American novel whose decisive influences don't include European writers. A "Great American Novel", sure, but that formulation is corny and pointless. What's usually meant is an overlong, badly-constructed book about hicks nobody who reads would give a fuck about if they encountered them outside of a novel. By that criterion, it's probably Moby-Dick or Cormac McCarthy's Judge Shit on the Range, or something. I think "greatest American novel" is a more fun game, but it's all good.

My vote, if we exclude first generation immigrants, goes to The House of Mirth by Edith Wharton.

>> No.2625202

The House of Night series.
It is dynamic and tickles your fantasies.

>> No.2625215

>>2625202

So, I guess this killed the thread.

>> No.2625220

>>2625215

Nope, this did.

>> No.2625295
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2625295

>> No.2625314

>>2625215
Well I like it.
Hot vampire guys and chicks.
I heard Vampire acedemy gets a tv serie.

Also I love the Vampire Diaries series.
Can't wait for S4, also Delana ftw.

(Heterosexual guy btw, but I don't think you will believe the heterosexual)

>> No.2625449

>>2625295

Haha, look at that creep.

>> No.2625591
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2625591

>> No.2625595
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2625595

>>2625591
I call your light in August and raise you

>> No.2625611

>>2625595

well played, sir.

>> No.2625613
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2625613

Salinger
corpus

>> No.2625702

>>2625314
lord help me I don't even believe "guy"

>> No.2625704

>>2625591

AHA

That's it!

OK, /thread. Light in August is the correct answer.

>> No.2625728
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2625728

The old man and the sea.

But of course /lit/ prefers tacky prose spread out on 650 pages.

Hemmingway captures as much human emotion and meaning in 10 pages as other writers in 100.

If Moby Dick is a bland, watery gravy, The old man and the sea is the same gravy, reduced heavily and seasoned perfectly, made from an authentic stock, so that it is the first american gravy coming close to European cuisine.

>> No.2625755

>>2625728

The fact that you prefer shorter books because your attention span has been turned to fuck by over 9000 legends of Zelda wouldn't have anything to do with it.

>> No.2625757

>>2625728

It certainly passes the "hicks nobody who reads would give a fuck about if they encountered them outside of a novel" test.

>> No.2625760

>>2625755
I don't necessarily prefer short books though, try again.

>> No.2625769

>>2625760

Yes you do, your gravy/stock analogy drips with 'economics of attention'.

>> No.2625778

>>2625728

> If Moby Dick is a bland, watery gravy, The old man and the sea is the same gravy, reduced heavily and seasoned perfectly, made from an authentic stock, so that it is the first american gravy coming close to European cuisine.

But Moby-Dick isn't bland, watery gravy, it's chowder thick and rich enough to stand a ladle upright in. The comparison with Hemingway's entirely different work which also happens to be set on the ocean is frankly sickening, real 'great books got down to pure' stuff.

>> No.2625783

>>2625728

>If Moby Dick is a bland, watery gravy

Stopped reading there.

>> No.2625790

>>2625783
>>2625778
>>2625769
>Moby-Dick isn't bland, watery gravy,

That's why most readers skip the parts where Melville rabmles on about whales

>> No.2625794

>>2625790

No, most people who never finish the book skip those parts.

>> No.2625803
File: 13 KB, 300x451, Pynchon, Thomas (als een jonge man).jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2625803

>>2625755

If you can't say what you want to say in under 200 pages, then it's not worth saying, or you can't write.


or both, pic related

>> No.2625804

ITT: So many edgy moby dick readers

>> No.2625805

>>2625804
>edgy moby dick readers
if there has ever been a more oxymoronic statement, I've never seen it.

>> No.2625809

>>2625804

Are you really incapable of standing a serious discussion for any length of time? There's nothing edgy about saying that Moby-Dick is not Hemingway's book heavily diluted, it's just manifestly the case.

>> No.2625811

>>2625109

>Great Gatsby

You cunt.

>> No.2625814

>>2625809
I never claimed The old man and the sea is moby dick heavily dilluted, i compared them not on content but on style.

>> No.2625818
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2625818

>>2622226

>Why Infinite Jest of course.

>> No.2625821
File: 178 KB, 439x351, mongface_popeye_bird.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2625821

>greatest American novel
>ctrl+f Carlos Fuentes
>0 results.

Lit really is stupid.

>> No.2625828

>>2625814

Then you're extraordinarily lacking in perception. Seriously, that's like saying Thomas Pynchon's style is the long-winded version of Stephen Crane.

>> No.2625830

Huck Finn, of course.

>> No.2625836

Hem's best work is
The Sun Also Rises!

>> No.2625841

>>2625836

This is what teenage idiots actually believe.

>> No.2625862

Hem's best work is Lucy Church Amiably.

>> No.2625870

>>2625862

Not The Waste Land?

Plebs everywhere.

>> No.2625875

Hem's best work is
Indian camp!

>> No.2625882

>>2625870

Glad someone got it, but I was kind of joking on the square. The non-mantra parts of Stein's style are, basically, Hemingway. Yes folks, he got his stoic, clipped quality from a butch lesbian. Sure, sure, Kansas City-Star, yadda yadda yadda - that's the All-American Legend for the public school photocopies. The truth is, Hemingway's style is queer and arch as anything anyone had seen, and it took all the force of his macho (but really, *butch*) preoccupations and rhetoric for it not to be perceived as faintly camp in its four-square severity.

>> No.2625885

>>2625882

Interesting point - Hemingway certainly mooched enough dinners from Gertie for her to be a massive influence. Although to be honest, I think there are few modernists who aren't touched by stein (Eliot included) - her own work is of far less importance than her far-reaching influence. Though I may be biased because I fucking hate Stein.

>> No.2625955

>>2625882
That can never be a reason to look down on Hemingway.
Most Americans are influenced too much with his heroic image.

>> No.2625966

>>2625885

Oh indeed, what Hemingway took from her (apart from eats) is just particularly striking when you put them side by side.


>>2625955

Oh absolutely, I wish kids got Stein in school for compare/contrast. She's the only high modernist it's impossible not to understand.

>> No.2626026

>>2625181
Hell, I thought This Side of Paradise was much better than Gatsby.

>> No.2626033

Huck Finn. Maybe not the most fun to read but probably the most influential.

>> No.2626079

HAY GUYSE U KNOW TELL MEEEEEE WHAT IS THE BEST BUUK 4EVR LOL xD

It's even more disturbing how you people seem to get into childish arguments with that type of question at heart.

>> No.2626101

The Great Gatsby

>> No.2626107

>>2625821
Mexicans can't write the great American novel.

>> No.2626114

>>2622288

touché

>> No.2626130

V is da beast

>> No.2626486
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2626486

>>2626107
>>2626107

>thinking that Mexicans are not American.

>> No.2626492
File: 38 KB, 819x505, Great_american_novel.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2626492

>>2626079

I agree with this faggot. Pic related is what wiki says - it's as valid as anything else.

Fucking stupid argument, you should all be ashamed of yourselves.

>> No.2626513
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2626513

>>2626486

>mi cara cuando un mexigordo se cree Americano

Dadle gracias a Diosito Santo que vos sed considerados humanos.

>> No.2626529

>>2626513

Wow. That's fucking awful Spanish.

>> No.2626554
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2626554

>>2626513
>Dadle

0/10

>> No.2626566

>>2622225

Where'd you get those pics, OP?

>> No.2626576

Twain, specifically Huck Finn

>> No.2626580

Mason & Dixon. Scope, legibility, accurate to the time typography (whew!), well-wrought puns, beautifully-drawn characters, action a-plenty.

>> No.2626583

>>2626513
Pero... México está en América, marica.

>> No.2626601
File: 54 KB, 600x400, goat.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2626601

>mi cara cuando un meximierda cruzo la frontera para cortar mi pasto y fruta
>mi cara cuando le pago mierda a un mexigordo para que aguente mis squintles mientras hago mas en un dia que su mendiga familia hace en mes
>mi cara cuando un mexiputo era bisabuelo a los cuarenta años

>> No.2626609

Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas
For Whom the Bell Tolls
The Adventures of Huckleberry Finn

>> No.2626623

>>2625821
the first time that I see carlos fuentes in /lit/ I personally love him.

>> No.2626639

>>2626601
So...what's wrong about it? You hate spics because they have a worse life than you? Who's really mad here?

>> No.2626644

>>2626639

Not mad, just find it funny that a mexindio would compare himself to a glorious American.

>> No.2626663

>>2626644
But they're American. America is not a country.

>> No.2626672

>>2626663

>implying
>mi cara cuando un mexibajo no sabe de geografia porque sus papas no pudieron pagar su prepa

Nice education you mexismells have.

>> No.2626677

>>2626672
Are you a troll or just retarded?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Americas

>> No.2626681

>>2626644

From Europe, you all look pretty much the same, tbh, but we like Mexican food and writers better as a rule. They have a more interesting culture than the USA.

>> No.2626694

>>2626672
>mfw stormfags fail terribly at geography
>mfw I have no face but I still use that "mfw" shit to increase the stupidity of my post

>> No.2626903

American novel - Written by murrikan, for murrikan

Don't be literal faggots you know what we all want

>> No.2626924

STEP BACK, FAGGOTS. I GOT THIS!

The Octopus by Frank Norris.
Please, contain your orgasms.

>> No.2627962

>>2623384

It's damn good, I love it. It's a bummer that it's not finished but what is there is damn good.

>> No.2627966

>>2625704

Thank you, sir. We are correct.

>> No.2628231

> ctrl f
> "in cold blood"
> 0 results

All hope abandon, ye who enter /lit/

>> No.2628232

>>2625168
You're lying. No one thinks of Miss Lonelyhearts (though they would be right to)