/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.2418802]

>that annoying girl in class who finds something "disturbingly sexist" or chauvinistic in every piece of literature written by a man.

[Anonymous No.2418816]

why are there no women's faces in money?

continuous oppression of the female sex by the patriarchal rulers.

[Anonymous No.2418820]

Why does it have to be a girl who complains, you sexist monster?

[Anonymous No.2418824]

>that feel when women actually still believe that they are unequal.
>that feel when those same women encourage men to always pay for dinner, buy gifts, etc. and just generally treat women better

[Anonymous No.2418827]

>>2418816
Where is your God now?

[Anonymous No.2418829]

>>2418816
Sacajawea coins?

It's not the modern government's fault that the historical role of women was marginal. Who do you want to be on the dollar bill? Abigail Adams?

[Anonymous No.2418830]

>that feel when niggers and women never accomplish anything in any field because they're too caught up in how they're niggers and women

BLACK GUYS DRIVE LIKE THIS WHITE GUYS DRIVE LIKE THIS I SEE HOW YOU WHITE FOLK BE SHOPPIN FOR HATS BLACK FOLK THEY ALWAYS BE CRAZY AND ABURAHRUAGRBUARGH MY PERIOD HAPPENED TODAY THIS IS A MAN'S WORLD THE BOY'S CLUB I'M A WOMAN HEAR ME ROAR WOMAN WOMAN WOMAN VAGINA PERIOD VAGINA LABIA LABIA VAGINA CLITORIS VAG

GENDER THEORY WOMEN'S STUDIES STUDY OF WOMEN'S STUDYING STUDIES OF GENDER STUDIES IN RURAL SOUTH AFRICAN GENDER STUDYING GENDERS STUDYING WOMEN WOMEN'S HISTORY OF WOMEN'S LITERATURE OF WOMEN'S ISSUES IN WOMEN'S STUDYING OF WOMEN WOMEN WOMEN WOMEN VAGINA PERIOD CLIT

We have updated the original CHA manual in response to the changes in graduate student funding, the job market, scholarly publishing, and other academic practises across North America since 1999. For example, funding for PhD studies in Canada has improved significantly since we wrote the first version of the manual, and the internet has transformed our teaching, research, and publications. Departmental websites have made it easier for job candidates to research the department that interviews them, but also raised the bar with respect to how much candidates are expected to know about a hiring department's faculty and the university as a whole. Employment equity policies and the growth of multidisciplinary fields such as sexuality studies and disability studies have led to progress in hiring and support for openly gay, lesbian, bisexual, and transgendered (GLBT) faculty, faculty with disabilities, people of colour, Aboriginal faculty, and especially women.

[Anonymous No.2418831]

>>2418830
However, we do not want to exaggerate the changes; we still have a very long way to go towards addressing pressing equity issues. We have seen an enormous growth in Canadian Aboriginal history, for example, but the scholars remain overwhelmingly white. The manual acknowledges the failure of history departments across Canada to recruit or hire more than a handful of Aboriginal historians and historians of colour: the CHA (unlike the AHA) has shied away from adopting strategies to promote the diversification of the Canadian historical profession. This is frustrating because racial diversity is not just a big city issue, but a national and international one. The handbook also discusses the continuing problems of discrimination and sexual harassment on the job, and the challenges of juggling family and career.

[Anonymous No.2418832]

>>2418829
>>2418827
Czech 'em. Czechs have two women on their currency.

[Anonymous No.2418833]

trust me bro, it could be worse... a lot worse

[Anonymous No.2418834]

>>2418816

>2012
>Forgetting the civilised world.

[Anonymous No.2418836]

>>2418827
in america. the only place that matters.

[Anonymous No.2418839]

>>2418836
see
>>2418829

[Anonymous No.2418843]

>>2418830
>>2418831
I can't tell if this is just a troll strawman or garbled nonsense.

I'm not insulting all women.

[Anonymous No.2418846]

>>2418843
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexual_capital

Is there a gender difference in strength of sex drive?
http://www.csom.umn.edu/assets/71520.pdf

Sexual Economics: Sex as a Female Resource for Social Exchange in Heterosexual Interactions
http://www.csom.umn.edu/Assets/71503.pdf

Cultural Suppression of Female Sexuality
http://www.femininebeauty info/suppression.pdf

In the history of mankind as a species, some hundreds of thousands of years, 40% of men have successfully passed their genes to future generations, whereas 80% of women did. Today's human population is descended from twice as many women as men. This is statistical, scientific, genetic proof that women function as sexual selectors, and men evolved risk-taking and ambition behaviours to compete for mating rights. The study was conducted by Michael F. Hammer. A lecture on the implications:
http://www.psy.fsu.edu/~baumeistertice/goodaboutmen.htm

Esther Vilar's seminal work on the concept that women enjoy a parasitic relationship with men.
http://www.naturalthinker.net/trl/texts/Vilar,Esther/ManipulatedMan.html The text itself.
http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Esther_Vilar&oldid=442296393 Synopsis.
http://www.theabsolute.net/misogyny/vilar.html A preview.

Female characters are defined more by their passive attributes and their emotional responses; male characters more by their actions. This is why male protagonists are preferred in fiction, by both women and men.
http://www.onfiction.ca/2011/02/actor-and-observed-man-and-woman.html

[Anonymous No.2418847]

>>2418843
Culture sees men as expendable blank slates, whose self-sufficiency is their own responsibility, and who must prove themselves worthy of accolade or interest. Conversely, women are inherently valuable, but typically function as inert commodities or motivation for male actors. The TVtropes links serve as quantitative evidence that this basic dichotomy proliferates the culture, to the point that it can be casually and humorously catalogued.
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/GenderDynamicsIndex
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/MenAreTheExpendableGender

"Without the higher powers of the imagination and reason, no eminent success can be gained in many subjects. These latter faculties, as well as the former, will have been developed in man, partly through sexual selection,- that is, through the contest of rival males, and partly through natural selection,- from success in the general struggle for life; and as in both cases the struggle will have been during maturity, the characters gained will have been transmitted more fully to the male than to the female offspring. It accords in a striking manner with this view of the modification and re-inforcement of many of our mental faculties by sexual selection, that, firstly, they notoriously undergo a considerable change at puberty, and, secondly, that eunuchs remain throughout life inferior in these same qualities. Thus man has ultimately become superior to woman. It is, indeed, fortunate that the law of the equal transmission of characters to both sexes prevails with mammals; otherwise it is probable that man would have become as superior in mental endowment to woman, as the peacock is in ornamental plumage to the peahen."
Charles Darwin

[Anonymous No.2418848]

>that annoying 4chan poster in class who thinks that it's some kind of a personal achievement to be born on the white male "winning team"

[Anonymous No.2418852]

>>2418816
Hahaha. Do you even travel at all, nigger?!

[Anonymous No.2418854]

>The TVtropes links serve as quantitative evidence that this basic dichotomy proliferates the culture

[Anonymous No.2418869]

>>2418848
OP here

Wow, /lit/ is much more reactionary and uncompromising than I thought. An assault on one person who happens to be a female is apparently an assault on the entire female gender. In fact, the mere suggestion that there might be a flaw in SOME feminist ideology is received as sexist male-supremacy that is undoubtedly tied to racism and all the other detestable prejudices. This is exactly what I'm talking about.

Enjoy your pseudo-intellectualism.

[Anonymous No.2418875]

>>2418869
>that annoying 4chan user that is so wrapped up in himself that he becomes unable to spot obvious facetiousness

[Anonymous No.2418876]

>>2418836
HAHAHAHAHA FAGGOT

[Anonymous No.2418883]

>>2418869
Welcome to /stormfront/, OP.

[Anonymous No.2418886]

>this girl character is too uninterested in sex!
>this girl character is too interested in sex!

[Anonymous No.2418890]

>>2418883

[Anonymous No.2418901]

>>2418890
Tiem?

[Anonymous No.2418906]

>>2418846
>>2418847
You are completely correct. Feminism (amongst other things) has allowed academia to ignore male oppression. Yet, if we look at these problems from the perspectives of "male" and "female" oppression, we are distracting ourselves from the greater evil.

Each of us is oppressed in a unique way, relative to the cultural labels from which we are compartmentalized. The all encompassing problem is this very objectification and commodification of reality.

You seem like an intelligent fellow, so I'm curious to hear your opinion on this matter.

[Anonymous No.2418907]

>>2418886
>the female characters are portrayed as too weak and unwilling to fight
>the fact that the female characters must adopt masculine roles and exhibit male aggression is a disturbing attack on femininity.

[Anonymous No.2418910]

>>2418906
>arguing with copypasta

[Anonymous No.2418930]

>>2418910
>You are completely correct
>arguing

are you some kind of retard?

[Anonymous No.2418942]

>>2418846

Copypasta, but still good.

I may add:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KA0sqg3EHm8
http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1928189,00.html

TL;DR. Women are generally 'parasites', hypergamy is common, trading sex for stuff is common.

[Anonymous No.2418947]

>>2418930
My bad. Your response was just so asinine, I only assumed it was a witty, sarcastic insult.

[CLINT No.2418949]

>tfw women complain about Chaucer being sexist
No shit, so was every man back then.

[Anonymous No.2418954]

>>2418949
>tfw women complain that Joyce was sexist

[Anonymous No.2418955]

>>2418949

If you want to troll her, insist vehemently that the Wife of Bath is a feminist character and that she's being sexist for judging her otherwise

[Anonymous No.2418960]

>>that annoying girl who finds something "disturbingly sexist" or chauvinistic in every action of a male because they're male.

[Anonymous No.2418992]

>>2418846
>>2418846
Ground breaking two posts, chap.
How did you access a past revision of a wikipedia page, may I ask?

[Anonymous No.2419046]

>>2418947

[Anonymous No.2419099]

>>2418831
Canada is a frozen wasteland, fuck off.

[Anonymous No.2419320]

>>2418954

But her arse was full of farts that night.

[Anonymous No.2419688]

maybe we should save the books from the evil clutches of the feminazi run libraries and hide them to preserve them for future generations! If the had their way, there would not even be any male writers and books by males would be banned and burned! WE must act NOW!

[Anonymous No.2419713]

>start reading The Manipulated Male from the link

This does not correspond with my experience of women of relationships. i am a prick who has never been a gentleman, though

[Anonymous No.2419756]

>>2419713
the 1970s deferential courtship behaviour has seamlessly transitioned into ALL WOMEN BEING WHORES and men dividing between alphas/betas in a return to harem systems

of course they still randomly expect doses of classical chivalry because the vagina has a voracious appetite and must have as many cakes as possible in addition to eating them

[yRаn !mHBuh/tvfE No.2419771]

So way back in a Political Theory class we discussed the cave as one would expect.

I had no idea that that day I would meet, the stupidest girl on the planet.

So the concept of the cave was fucking blowing her mind and she asked questions such as

"Wait how did he get all those people to chain up in there?"

"Wouldn't they die of starvation after a while?"

"This seems really abusive it's like when parents lock their kids up."

The realization it was an allegory never quite clicked with her.

She went on later to say she enjoyed the fact Plato made so many biblical references in The Republic as it proved a Christian nation would be the most successful.

[Anonymous No.2419796]

>In top English class back in High School
>Annoying Feminist butch 'lesbian' in my class
>I'm sort of the class clown, always tease her
>One day I walk into class
>She runs up to the teacher
>"OH! MISS! I'm still reading Divine Comedy like you told me too!"
>Realize a couple of weeks later the teacher mentioned Divine Comedy to her, only to have her read it and suck up to the teacher about it - Every. Single. Class.

It was cringe-worthy as fuck. The teacher eventually got sick of her banging on about Dante and his fucking poem so she just sternly said 'This has nothing to do with what we are talking about'.

Never heard of Dante or his comedy again.

[Anonymous No.2419819]

>>2419771

hahahaha lollin hard at this

what did the professor say?

[Anonymous No.2419825]

>>2418816
>not a britfag


i feel sorry for you son

[Anonymous No.2419827]

It's threads like these that numb the my ever present sense of shame from dropping out of high school and not attending an institute of higher education.

In my more deluded moments I fancy myself as a modern H. L. Mencken

[Anonymous No.2419870]

>>2419771
There was a girl in a film class I sat in who didn't know the German's lost in WWII

[Anonymous No.2419871]

>>2419870

>German's

Man, it's time for bed

[Anonymous No.2419876]

>>2419771
>>2419771
>>2419771
>>2419771
surely no on is THAT stupid

[Anonymous No.2419896]

>>2418816

Seriously, do your research.

[Anonymous No.2420152]

>Class on medieval warfare and associated literature
>Subject involves English archers hitting French kuh-niggitz with arrows
>Girl with dyed-blond hair sits close by
>Professor explains the longbow
>Namely, it had an effective range of such-and-such yards
>Bottle-blond cuts him off and starts yapping
>"You need to stop using fancy science terms, I don't know metric!"
>Class-wide reaction

[Anonymous No.2420156]

>>2418802
>that guy in class that keeps talking about how there were no good female writers.
>never heard of Virginia Woolf
What kind of chuckle fucks are we letting into college these days?

[Anonymous No.2420159]

>>2418834
>civilized world
>having a monarchy

sure bro

[Anonymous No.2420162]

>in class
>girl asks why females don't have more positions in politics
"Margret Thatcher"
>she shuts and realises why more females are not welcome in politics.

[Anonymous No.2420167]

>>2420162
The Iron Lady
The biggest Blow to feminism.

Even Towie can't dent feminism as much as she did.

[Anonymous No.2420176]

>>2418816
Queen Elizabeth is on tons of money

[Anonymous No.2420185]

>>2420156

>that guy who goes straight to v. woolf whenever 'good female writer' comes up and has no one else to suggest after that because he's entry level as fuck

[Anonymous No.2420187]

>>2420185
It beats teh guy who tries to suggest the Bronte Sisters.

He could however have had Megan Boyle

[Anonymous No.2420189]

>>2420187
Everyone could have Megan Boyle. Have you seen the list of guys she's fucked? It's longer than a 40 year old black man's rap sheet.

[Anonymous No.2420193]

>>2420185
>>2420187
Woolf has got me more pussy than the Brontes. Though the number of gay and metro men who love Emma is astounding. Austen is like pussy repellant.

[Anonymous No.2420321]

>>2418942
Man, watching that video and seeing the difference in how the male and female presenters present the information just drives the differences between men and women home so much more. Not only is what they're presenting supporting these differences, but so is the way they're presenting it; the man goes more for the straight facts and thoroughly explaining examples, whereas the woman tries harder to "entertain" the audience, make them laugh, and even throws in snide remarks when discussing things that can be seen as sexually advantageous to women (their ability to have multiple orgasms in a row for example).

Watching that was certainly an educational experience.

[Anonymous No.2422153]

>mfw my largely female-composed human sexuality class just reaffirms the prof's worldview, and I just observe 'cos I'm skipped over.

[Anonymous No.2422157]

>>2418802
I had this shit happen when we were talking about Stieg Larsson. I could not stop laughing.

[Anonymous No.2422169]

>parasites
>women

mfw

[Anonymous No.2422181]

>Go to College
>Realize it's not so bad.
>Quit after two weeks.
>Never go back again.

[Anonymous No.2422421]

>Be in Literary Theory lecture
>This week, feminist theory!
>Be one of about three males in the room
>At least 100 females
>Lecturer asks 'who here is a feminist?'
>One woman puts her hand up
>Lecturer says 'that's one more than usual.'
>She is 'that annoying girl'
>Avoid her whenever possible

[Anonymous No.2422446]

ITT: /lit/ doesn't know what feminism is.

[Anonymous No.2422457]

>>2422421
I'm a feminist. And I'm a man. You cynical teens can go fuck yourselves.

[Anonymous No.2422461]

>>2422446
You mean /lit/ doesn't know what feminisms are

[Anonymous No.2422467]

>>2422457
The majority of people, I would say, are actually feminists. The trouble is they're all such retards they don't even realise it. Probably because they operate under the assumption that FEMINISM = MISANDRY HUR DUR

[Anonymous No.2422470]

>>2422421
Why the fuck are modern women so masochistic? Seriously, the only people i've seen being against the notion of a female president have been women. The only time i've ever asked a women if she was a feminist, she literally told me that would rather be barefoot and pregnant than be a professional.

Anti-feminism is a bigger problem among women than it is among men.

[Anonymous No.2422473]

>>2422467
Sorry, but no. Proper feminism is long dead and saying that 'most people are feminists' is simply naive. Today's feminism is mostly about I HAVE A VAGINA, HEAR IT ROAR, entitlement issues and gender issues in general having to do more with biology than society.

[Anonymous No.2422474]

>>2422467
Yeah. When I started Uni at 18 I was amazed at how many people weren't self confessed feminists, though would jump over existentialism or environmentalism or whatever. Especially women. Shit's crazy.

[Anonymous No.2422476]

>>2422473
You're confusing post-feminism and feminism. Third wave feminism has nothing to do with having a roaring vagina.

[Anonymous No.2422477]

>>2422473
Oh yes. How silly of me. I should have known that proper feminism is dead. I'm so sorry Anonymous. I shall listen to all that you say in future, oh wise Anonymous. Please fill me with knowledge. Clearly your word is the authoritative one in all the land. Please forgive my arrogance.

[Anonymous No.2422479]

>>2422474
I don't get your complaint. The fact that we don't feel the need to highlight we are feminists is a good thing. It shows that feminism had become a social norm. Like homosexuality. Many people don't need to say they are pro-it because it todays times, it's the norm.

Jeez

[D/Gen !ONuNxgYHI2 No.2422482]

>dat feel when i keep hitting it but it won't turn off!

[Anonymous No.2422483]

>>2422479
Pro-homosexuality is the wrong term I feel.
Accepting of it seems to fit better.

[Anonymous No.2422487]

>>2422483
>Accepting of it seems to fit better
>Accepting

>Implying that homosexuality is something that needs to be 'accepted'

Way to show your implicit attitudes there

[Anonymous No.2422493]

>>2422479
>The fact that we don't feel the need to highlight we are feminists is a good thing. It shows that feminism had become a social norm. Like homosexuality. Many people don't need to say they are pro-it because it todays times, it's the norm.
That wasn't the case at all. My compatriots were under the assumption that feminism was misandry, and certainly weren't up on third wavers. I'm not claiming I was up on third wave at the time, but I at least knew it existed and wanted to talk about it.

Contemporary feminist theory is often kind of accepted, I agree, but it's often the more "difficult" concepts that are accepted outright, like liminal genders. This is in part because there is a need to accept them as part of social cohesion. However, I found the views of many on things such as women's rights were actually kinda backwards, either specifically anti feminist, or stuck in second wave mentality.

tl;dr Swings and roundabouts.

[Anonymous No.2422499]

>People not thinking homosexuality is a mental illness
>People not wanting to send women back to the kitchen
What the fuck is wrong with you?

[Anonymous No.2422504]

>>2422499
We live in a civilised nation where milk and honey flows from the heavens.

[Anonymous No.2422507]

>>2422504
>honey
>not Maple Syrup
Poser detected.

[Anonymous No.2422509]

>>2422504
>>2422507
That sounds horrific wichever way it is

[Anonymous No.2422510]

>>2422504
How can bags flow?

[Anonymous No.2422515]

>>2422510
>be Canadian
>milk bags are cheaper
>feel bad about all that plastic waste
>buy cartons
>feel like traitor to my race

[Anonymous No.2422542]

>>2422515
>Canadian
>Never seen milk in a bag.

Is it a thing for the Eastern Provinces? D:

[Anonymous No.2422552]

Where are all these feminists who actually believe in equality then? They certainly aren't anywhere conspicuous. Check the comment is free section on the guardian (a mainstream British left wing news paper) and nothing written by feminists will be anything but blinkered self indulgent moaning or obvious man hating, not to mention lying about fictious pay gaps and other myths. I understand that there is probably a generation gap and this is more representative of older uglier feminists (wave bullshit) but I think it's dishonest to try and pretend that it's "just about equality" when it's clearly more about "what is good for women" sure sometimes the two correlate but mostly they don't nowadays. I just see feminists as annoying, hypocritical and pointless; and haven't seen much to change that opinion.

[Anonymous No.2422560]

I've found the most useful side of feminist thought emerging from Luce Irigaray, formerly of the Lacanian school of psychoanalysis. Her project of sexual/sexuate difference is some of the best poststructural theory I have ever read. I would encourage anyone on here to read it, especially in light of comments like 'feminism is the norm', when it is clearly not the case, at least where I come from (Australia).

[Anonymous No.2422561]

>>2422552
>Check the comment is free section on the guardian (a mainstream British left wing news paper) and nothing written by feminists will be anything but blinkered self indulgent moaning or obvious man hating, not to mention lying about fictious pay gaps and other myths.
>comment is free
You get what that means, don't you?

[Anonymous No.2422562]

>>2422552
>2012
>Reading MSM
>ISHYGDDT

[Anonymous No.2422569]

>>2422562
You probably get your news from watching The Young Turks

[Anonymous No.2422572]

>>2422561
I mean the people who actually write the articles, the actual commentators are rather enlightened by comparison. But replace it with Salon or feministe or any other mainstream liberal feminist website if you like.

[Anonymous No.2422576]

>>2422572
I read all of them, and have not found what you're describing. It sounds like someone's annoyed they're no longer part of an arbitrary priveleged group.

[Anonymous No.2422577]

>>2418816

[Anonymous No.2422579]

>>2422560
>Luce Irigaray regards E=mc2 as a "sexed equation" because she argues that "it privileges the speed of light over other speeds that are vitally necessary to us".
lol

[Anonymous No.2422581]

>>2422576
Probably because you are what I'm describing.

[Anonymous No.2422584]

>>2422579
>i read this book once, well actually i only heard of this book from some out of context quote by Sokal, well actually i only heard of the quote by Sokal...
I have more than a decent understanding of relativity. I can tell you there is nothing wrong with Irigaray's little analogy or example, whatever you want to call it.

[Anonymous No.2422589]

>>2422584
>women thinks she can understand science
>probably doing a degree in sociology
>probably reads pop-sci
lol

[Anonymous No.2422593]

>>2422579

Well, her theory is not total, or perfect. What theory could be? I don't agree with her analysis of supposed scientific binaries like solid/fluid, that is, here analysis of their widespread institutional development and which side may or may not be favoured. Or, obviously, her thoughts on E=mc2. But nonetheless, your response is just juvenile.

[Anonymous No.2422598]

>>2422589
>be a male postgrad physics student
>come to /lit/ to get away from /sci/ducks and their abysmal understanding of contemporary science and have interesting discussions instead
>yet there are some among us
If you really want to understand what you are trying to talk about, read up on dimensional analysis. Though you probably won't understand it, that's what you need to put such a quote in context.

[Anonymous No.2422617]

The whole idea of 'feminism' is flawed now, because it works from the perspective of oppressed females. I like to call myself an equalist, and I lack many of the qualities that I most despise in females (and males).
One of the main issues with our societies at the moment revolves around the idea that men and women need to possess one another in order to have a satisfying life. Jealousy is the root of all evil. Women are not discriminated against in any critical way, and the way that society is structured (ie. in that women are more often provided for than providing for) can be explained by modern theories about the way that humans mate and relate with each other.

What is so important about sex that one needs to try to prevent one person from doing it with anyone else but oneself? The risks today are minimal due to birth control, condoms and DNA testing. Women can work, so they don't need to worry that their provider is going to run off with another woman.

To make the point - yes, obviously reading texts written in the past will have more sexism in them than most written recently. Our standards have shifted, and the same is true of texts being more racist, more 'middle class' and more anti-non-Christian. It is pointless to go over it constantly. Having studied a large amount of literature from the Renaissance onwards, I can say that it's all been done before.

Do I get annoyed at women who assume misogyny in literary texts? Yes. It's never so clear-cut as they seem to think, and one woman's 'penetrated' is another woman's 'enveloper and smotherer'. I have had lecturers be the ones to jump to these conclusions before, and I have always done my best to turn the tide.

The fact is, some people just LIKE to have persecution complex. This happens in both genders, and in all levels of society.

Hum. That was longer than I intended.

[Anonymous No.2422624]

>that annoying woman who thinks a baby falling out of her vagina makes her opinion more valid
>waves tits around while breast feeding
>HURR DURR PERFECTLY NATURAL IF YOU DON'T LIKE IT DON'T LOOK

allofmyrage.jpg

[hakas !u/t2Vf0FFs No.2422628]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BsjwGpBmMvk

[Anonymous No.2422637]

I dislike how the word 'chauvinism' has been misappropriated by feminists. It's quite a useful word.

[Anonymous No.2422644]

>>2422617

Ho hum. Egalitarian here.

[Anonymous No.2422660]

>>2422617

>Women are not discriminated against in any critical way, and the way that society is structured (ie. in that women are more often provided for than providing for) can be explained by modern theories about the way that humans mate and relate with each other.

I'm afraid you're retarded.

[Anonymous No.2422664]

>>2422579

could someone explain to me how a person can say this and still be considered worthy of anyone's time. this is a serious request

[Anonymous No.2422669]

>>2422660

Well of course this is the prime forum for debate; why don't you present your differing viewpoint?

I would give the name of a book if I could remember it. It's a study of social and mating habits of humans throughout the world, conducted using a survey that covered more than ten thousand people randomly selected from many countries, all with differing outward customs. They even studied societies where women were considered to be in the position of power, and found that even so, men with more wealth were desired of those with little - among other things.

Since this is a literature forum, I would expect more from someone disagreeing than a vague and unsupported insult.

< pic related.

[Anonymous No.2422677]

>>2422664
I'm curious, too. I don't know whether to feel superior or inferior to her after reading that.

[Anonymous No.2422684]

>>2422660
Distinguish between women living in America and women living in bumfuck, rest of the world.

You don't want to be born a woman anywhere in the world, any time in history, ever. It's a shit life.

Neither do you want to be born a woman in America. But their material advantages are pretty awesome. It still doesn't make up for being a woman. But their life is comparatively peaches and cream.

Basically, fuck women.

[Anonymous No.2422685]

Give examples please. She may have a point given the literature you've been assigned to read.

[Anonymous No.2422689]

>>2422677

maybe it's some kind of next-level thought-experiment that I'm too stupid to understand, I honestly don't get it. that's why I'm asking

[Anonymous No.2422694]

>>2422684

Ah, well I accept that point. I was talking from a UK perspective, and I really ought to have made that clear. In the UK, that statement is certainly true. There are people who disagree, but I would lump them in the category the OP made evident.

[Anonymous No.2422699]

I'm so grateful to be male. Jesus Christ. Thank you based God.

[Anonymous No.2422705]

>>2422684

'Neither do you want to be born a woman in America. But their material advantages are pretty awesome. It still doesn't make up for being a woman. But their life is comparatively peaches and cream.

Basically, fuck women.'

Oh, and THAT's misogyny.

[Anonymous No.2422711]

>>2422705
I'm a very bread and butter misogynist. I have observed and lived among women all my life. I love them and care for them and support them, but I do not respect them and view them as my equals. Women are inferior to males.

[Anonymous No.2422735]

>>2422711

So, by inferring from your comment, about America being America, and the rest of the world being 'bumfuck', I conclude that you are from the US.

What part of the US are you from? I'm suddenly rendered curious by your unflinching and blatant admission of misogyny. I like that you get in a bit of side-swipe racism too, you're an all-round guy.

Enlighten me?

[Anonymous No.2422745]

>>2422735
>I'm suddenly rendered curious by your unflinching and blatant admission of misogyny.

You're surprised at what anonymity on the internet does? People tend to speak the truth much more freely on 4chan, in between all the shitposting and trolling, then anywhere I've seen, both online and off.

I'm a lawyer, and whenever I congregate with my peers in private, the misogyny is out and in the open. You'd be hard pressed to find many professional and academic men who are not blatantly misogynist when amongst other men.

[Anonymous No.2422748]

>>2422735
babbys first time on 4chan? welcome

[Anonymous No.2422752]

>>2422745
Oh no lol, I'm a transfer from /b/.

>>2422748
My surprise was mainly that I generally see it presented in language that implies the intelligence of a beanpole and numerous angry swears and puerile additions that make it more likely to be ignored than questioned. Also, it tends to be justified in terms of anger, which seems not to be so much the case with the post I quoted.

What country are you a lawyer in?

[Anonymous No.2422759]

>>2422752
Exactly. I don't hate women. Don't get me wrong. Where you err is to conflate all misogynists with the typical r9k neckbeard autist, who hates women because he cannot know them. I know women. As I've said already, I love them and care for them and support them. Women are important to humanity and to man! But they are not equal. I don't want to kill them all, I don't want to burn them at stake, and I don't want to deny them opportunities. I simply do not respect them as my equals.

I live in North America, in one of the wealthiest and most beautiful cities in the world.

[Anonymous No.2422772]

Well, the OED bears you out. It stipulates hatred OR prejudice.

*smile* I'm a great appreciator of different perspectives, and would love to know some of your reasoning for this inherent inequality - if you can perhaps present it in a way that would not have you lynched by a mob of females.

I think that a lot of the problem is that in the past what is valued in people has been stipulated 'male' and the masculine is the accepted standard of life. This, of course, renders the un-masculine inferior. It is a circular point - are men 'masculine' because that is how they are expected to be? Is all of it social conditioning anyway? If so, then are not men just made to be the useful ones, where as women encouraged not to be from the beginning? Or is it that people judge worth by men's standards, pushing anyone with 'feminine' qualities into the 'useless' heap to begin with?

I would perhaps suggest though that in psychological terms, many men are actually on the low end of the autistic spectrum without having any disabilities in that area at all. I suspect that what one doesn't understand, one doesn't appreciate the worth of. Just as Americans are known as brash and loud and unsubtle in comparison to Europeans.

[Anonymous No.2422791]

>>2422772
Your line of reasoning is one that I've heard over and over for the last 20 years. I certainly heard a lot of the social conditioning POV at the University and post-graduate level. Social conditioning is a factor, but it is not the dominant factor. Women are passive, men aggressive. They are generally physically and mentally inferior for the tasks which I, misogynist that I am, rank as being valuable to humanity.

I appreciate feminine beauty and passivity, but I respect far far more raw intelligence and brute force. Women are a wonderful complement to the more dominant male.

Basically, I'm wading into this with you because I also struggled with 10 years of conditioning by the liberal academia in regards to race and gender being social constructs. I fervently fervently wanted to believe in the truth of that argument as a young man, and I think, deep down, that I still do. Unfortunately, having lived and experienced many different people, across many different walks of life, across many different continents, I no longer can remain convinced of the ideals I once held in such high esteem.

There are biological reasons that complement social conditioning, which can explain why Africa is still mired in war and catastrophe, and why women still remain subservient to men throughout the world. I don't hate blacks, women, or anybody that I'm prejudiced against. I simply have (what I like to think is) a realistic view of the human race, in all of our flawed and beautiful imperfection. We are not all equal. We will never be equal. As a lawyer, part of my job is to account for these fundamental inequalities in society and to compensate and adjust for them. I fight for those who are weaker, but I don't idealize them to be something they are not.

Thanks for the discussion, btw.

[Anonymous No.2422800]

>>>/stormlaw/

[Anonymous No.2422814]

>those females that don't realise they are the ones bringing sexism and misgyny into arguments

Hate.

[Anonymous No.2422819]

I was a feminist once. Basically I was disappointed that women didn't act like men and assumed that if we were equal in nature, there must be an outside influence at work that should be stopped. I was never vocal about it, thank god, but now I see that women are just fine with being women; they don't have to stand up for themselves, because they have many men willing to serve as their footstool in the faintest hope of getting into their pants. I suppose my wanting to help them was just a variation on that theme, the variation being that I wanted them to learn to help themselves. In parallel to that realisation, I learned about the physical basis of the mind, i.e. our body is not a soul's puppet, there's no difference between the two; finally I realised that if women are physically different on the outside, there's no reason they shouldn't be physically/mentally different on the inside.

[Anonymous No.2422829]

>There are biological reasons that complement social conditioning, which can explain why Africa is still mired in war and catastrophe,
Shit, here was me thinking there were explicable, solvable political causes for these problems. But nope, it's just "biological reasons" thanks /lit/ I'll get back to sleep now.

[Anonymous No.2422834]

>>2422819
hope you're just trolling

[Anonymous No.2422841]

>>2422829
You don't think politics has anything to do with the people behind it? Politics, derived from polis, meaning village, settlement or sedentary group of people?

And thanks for saying you're going to bed, otherwise we wouldn't know you won the race to the last word.

[Anonymous No.2422845]

>>2422834
...Yeah, why not. I don't really have such an unfashionable opinion. That would be just improbable.

[Anonymous No.2422847]

>>2422791

It is very interesting to have this discussion with a person who can have a calm debate about it.

I will not argue each point individually, because both I and you have heard those arguments before. I would say however, that the nature/nurture argument has never yet been resolved, so you cannot truly use it as a foundation for anything but your own personal opinion. I'm still undecided about it myself.

The women = passive, men = aggressive argument I have heard many times, and it has never been particularly convincing to me. Partly, this is because I see a patch that sits in between these two states that most of the human race falls into. I also have little respect for a man who cannot control his life without being aggressive. Women are more subtle and communicative than men perhaps, and men more forceful and aggressive - but that's just stereotypes. Stereotypes are used to control people, and why do you have to have controlling influences in place if your target group is indeed inferior and passive?
Misogyny can be read as a reaction to the fear of a woman's sexuality that was proliferated from Christianity (in the UK at least).

Anyway, interesting thoughts. Sorry for the delay, I accidentally deleted my first reply.

[Anonymous No.2422855]

>>2422819

I can see the reasoning for this, and different is just different - not necessarily inferior.

Perhaps that is the issue? People equating the two when really difference is just variation, and the variations are inherently useful in some circumstances, and a handicap in others.

[Anonymous No.2422864]

>>2418949
But Wife of Bath portrayed women in a good light.

[Anonymous No.2422876]

>>2422864

The Renaissance was the turning point. That was when women were becoming more discriminated against... the culmination was the Victorian era in the UK where women were denied the most legal rights and sexism was the most institutionalised. In feudal times, and before the Normans conquered and brought a new kind of Christianity to England in 1066, women followed their men to battle and their lives were not considered inferior. If you think about it, the sex that can create life? How can that be inferior? Fertility figures were worshiped in pagan cultures, and goddesses were ruthless and strong.

[BobbyL No.2422882]

Keep the women down, that's what I say. Actually fuck this, I'm converting to Islam. Fuck yeah three wives.

[Anonymous No.2422885]

>>2422882
Actually, the Islamic man has the right to four wives, but he must prove that he has the means and need for as many, and that he is worthy before the marriage is approved. You could also become a Mormon.

[Anonymous No.2422893]

>go to camp
>one of the male counselors has a "this is what a feminist looks like" t shirt
>think it's a joke for the next two weeks
>once, he even dresses up in a dress and runs around the campgrounds
>finally, we're at an assembly and someone says that they appreciate his "acceptance of feminism into his everyday life"
>puzzled, I say "So it's not a joke?"
>get glares from the girls sitting around me
>some fat cunt sneers, "You don't have to be a woman to protect women's rights."
>witch cackling proceeds

>later, I get home and check facebook
>click on his profile
>he has a picture of himself in a dresses with full makeup on and pictures of butch lesbians as his profile pictures
I have never gagged so hard in my entire life

[Anonymous No.2422949]

>>2422876
There was no turning point because patriarchy has been the norm for all history. Aboriginals had no books, no culture but what they could remember, no settlement or economy in the sense we know it, basically cavemen, but they were still patriarchal.

Fertility goddesses had as much to do with corn as babies. And ancient religion was much closer to magic than modern religion, which has finally caught on to the fact that we can't supernaturally influence our environment, and pretends that a hidden power can do so at its own whim. (Atheism is the next step up.) But originally, gods and goddesses were spirits to be bargained with, flattered, threatened, whatever, not lords of the universe.

And believe me you don't know what patriarchy is until you read up on greek and roman social customs. As for following men to battle, well, is being a cheerleader who will get raped if her team loses really that impressive? Given that their village would've been stormed shortly afterwards and vaginipenile enrapenings would still have ensued. In fact, there's a famous story about a group of captured barbarian women who committed mass suicide rather than be raped. That doesn't sound very independent of them.

The roman view, in fact the typical pagan view, was that men created life, and that women were just fields to be sown. We know it's a team effort nowadays, but whichever sex feels like being boss will claim to be the sole creator of life, like yourself, missy. Paganism isn't all scented candles, pottery courses and fruity flute music.

[Anonymous No.2422958]

>>2422949
>Aboriginals had no books, no culture but what they could remember
You are now aware that, until very recently, written works were mostly mnemonics for oral histories and knowledge.

[Anonymous No.2422961]

>>2422893
This is what liberal thinking has done to the world. We're now giving positions of authority over our children to degenerate, psychologically damaged cross-dressers.

[Anonymous No.2423192]

>>2422949

Haha. That's exactly my point,m these sorts of beliefs were from southern Europe and the Middle East. Call me anglocentric if you like, but that's the history I know - so that's the history I'll tell.

[Anonymous No.2423311]

>>2423192
>Call my world view narrow if you want, because it is, so I'll keep babbling on about it and making sweeping generalizations that are largely inaccurate. It just can't be helped, I'm going to be wrong and you're going to like it.

Fucking women, how do they work?

[Anonymous No.2423440]

>I also have little respect for a man who cannot control his life without being aggressive.

I don't think brute force cares whether or not you respect it. That's the beauty of aggression. The legal system we have in place in the West does a very admirable job of compensating for physical weakness by punishing those who wield their strength against weaker, defenceless opponents. But this is relatively a modern thing, to be able to disdain physical aggression. In most cases, you'd be grovelling on the ground, getting raped, and then you'd die. It was a hard-knock life back then.

I recommend Foucault's History of Sexuality.

[Anonymous No.2423446]

>>2423440
That's kind of misleading, because it's not like all societies before the contemporary West were Hobbesian states-of-nature. There's been civilizations w some form of rule of law, even if it wasn't one that necessarily lived up to Western standards of equity and justice, for quite a long time... I mean, it's not like if you were a Roman citizen or a Chinese bureaucrat you had to be deeply concerned about that at all times.

[Anonymous No.2423466]

>>2423446
I take your point, but let's be real. Rule of law existed only in the major metropolitan areas in the daytime. It's midnight? You're out in a rural area? You're a girl? Stay inside. Get a man to protect you.

[Anonymous No.2423486]

>>2423466
Granted. Depended enormously on place and time, of course, which to a certain extent it still does today (we all know which neighborhoods are "good" and "bad"). And there was more or less in different times and cultures... but yeah, I'd agree, it's more possible to ignore physical aggression that it has been historically. I mean, you don't really need to worry about the Mongols these days.

[Anonymous No.2423494]

>>2423486
>I mean, you don't really need to worry about the Mongols these days.

SOON

[Anonymous No.2425537]

>>2423192
Yeah, why not. Patriarchal laws only turned up ten minutes before the locals learned how to write them down. The illiterate barbarians of northern germany were actually feminists till they could record otherwise.