/wg/ Writing General

[Anonymous No.24009924]

"Amateur Sports" edition

Previous: >>24002729

/wg/ AUTHORS & FLASH FICTION: https://pastebin.com/ruwQj7xQ
RESOURCES & RECOMMENDATIONS: https://pastebin.com/nFxdiQvC

Please limit excerpts to one post.
Give advice as much as you receive it to the best of your ability.
Follow prompts made below and discuss written works for practice; contribute and you shall receive.
If you have not performed a cursory proofread, do not expect to be treated kindly. Edit your work for spelling and grammar before posting.
Violent shills, relentless shill-spammers, and grounds keeping prose, should be ignored and reported.
(And maybe double-space your WIPs to allow edits if you want 'em.)

Simple guides on writing:
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pHdzv1NfZRM
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=whPnobbck9s
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YAKcbvioxFk

Thread theme: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XGbqGkS1c2w

[Anonymous No.24009932]

can someone give a read on this?

https://txtbin.net/7hoxjo3idy

[Anonymous No.24009933]

>>24009932
I tried to open it on mobile but it got flooded with ads so no.

[Anonymous No.24009935]

>>24009933
>mobileposting
>not blocking ads on mobile
Anon...

[Anonymous No.24009938]

>>24009933
i dont know where else i can post snippets like that, i just saw some other anon do it

[Anonymous No.24009939]

>>24009935
Too lazy, I only use mobile for shitposting and meme browsing really. If I post seriously it's on my desktop.

[Anonymous No.24009946]

>Infection at the tips of the fingers
>Kind of hurts to type
Kill me

[Anonymous No.24009953]

>>24009946
how did you get multiple infections on multiple fingers?

[Anonymous No.24009957]

>>24009953
Dunno, It's not all of them but it's the main ones I use for typing

[Anonymous No.24009986]

Is this way of narrating sword fights palatable or is it too autistic with "he cuts like this, parries like that"? Also, I'm thinking they get attacked by a monster or something and they have to momentarily suspend their duel to the death and team up to defeat the creature. It's just a pulpy fantasy short story so I doesn't matter too much, but I would like some kind of plot hook for it at least to have some narrative appeal.

[Anonymous No.24010052]

>>24009957
you should stop fingering your asshole

[Anonymous No.24010060]

>>24009924
SEXO

[Anonymous No.24010072]

>>24009924
nice thread image you fucking faggot

[Anonymous No.24010119]

>>24009924
Made over 20 submissions of my completed manuscript, going to do another 20 more today. Started writing a new story that's more accessible to most readers.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1temLoPl7s4WyrjVdB-NY7B62zpnFHss2WOvbAFi0POU/edit?usp=sharing

[Anonymous No.24010209]

>>24009986
I felt exhausted after the second sentence and had to force myself to continue. The imagery seems like you're throwing everything at the wall to see what sticks, or is just clichéd. If this were in a book, I would skip to the end of the paragraph and just see what happens.

[Anonymous No.24010226]

>>24009986
Personally I think this works just fine to describe the skill involved in the two opponents, any more detail and it would be too much for me to care. The goal is to get the reader to feel the tension and emotion in a scene and I think talking about individual names of parries and thrusts crosses it into niche territory

[Anonymous No.24010238]

Damn writing slop is harder than I thought

[Anonymous No.24010239]

>>24009939
You're that special kind of lazy where doing things that would save you effort in the long run seems like too much work.

[Anonymous No.24010250]

>>24009935
>mobileposting
>using adblock
>"Ad Block Detected" in big red letters and nothing else

guess I'm not reading the fucker

[Anonymous No.24010259]

Submitted my short story to an open submission for publication. Wish me luck anons!

[Anonymous No.24010264]

>use a telephone to browse the internet
>"I'm having a terrible time browsing the internet... how could this be happening?"

[Anonymous No.24010269]

>>24010209
>>24010226
>Zoomer attention span.exe

[Anonymous No.24010271]

More people browse the internet with phones than pcs lmao. Most web pages past, like, 2015 are designed with mobile-first principles. Because normies use mobile, and normies are the majority, obviously. Only work-focused sites that are only intended to be used at a desktop are designed mobile-second

[Anonymous No.24010278]

>>24009932
>If you have not performed a cursory proofread, do not expect to be treated kindly. Edit your work for spelling and grammar before posting.

[Anonymous No.24010288]

>>24010269
>Not being interested in niche moves in a short story that isnt about those elements is zoomer and definitely NOT autistic
Timing is important in story length, try getting people to care about a doctrinally correct gunfight where the soldiers use accurate single shots for suppressive fire instead of full auto, cover their sectors, properly use shoot,move,communicate etc. nobody cares except niche readers, the conflict is the point

[Anonymous No.24010297]

>>24009932

>>24010278
Lmao you're right, he doesn't even capitalize his sentences. And loads of spelling errors and other simple mistakes. Why even post it for critique? I don't understand these people

[Anonymous No.24010298]

>>24010288
The conflict is no different from the last 100 shitty fantasy books you've probably read, it's how that information is delivered and what is truly being expressed beneath the lines that is what's important, but it seems to be a dying art because people can't stand anything that isn't as action filled as Avengers Endgame.

https://youtu.be/1crhwQPKr7w?si=FG9nTuUA-zeNM8Nd

[Anonymous No.24010303]

>>24010298
You sound like you've read yourself into a corner

[Anonymous No.24010305]

>>24010298
>it's how that information is delivered and what is truly being expressed beneath the lines that is what's important, but it seems to be a dying art

Haven't read the excerpt in question but I can guarantee you're an amateur with an inflated ego. Good authors can entertain and express deeper themes at the same time

[Anonymous No.24010311]

>>24010259
fingers crossed

>>24010297
>he doesn't even capitalize his sentences
outrageous

[Anonymous No.24010316]

>dying art
Guarantee not, the issue is what they are expressing is not deep. For an example, read Backyard Goblins

[Anonymous No.24010322]

>>24010311
See, but that's legible. Let me post part of anon's work so you can compare.
>“yep just need a second” Adham tried to steady his breathing turning less from a stranded fish and more into a woman in labor, pushing the air into his tarred lungs to the best of his capability “just knocked the fucking air out of me, shit” seeing as Adham was okay, Nuwa burst into laughter “what the fuck were you doing” she snorts out between intermittent laughter “you looked like a paraplegic bruce lee” Adham grunts “that’s good, that’s good but please give me a hand up before I become fully paralyzed” Nuwa reached out to take his hand and help him up “thank you” Adham sighed “Seems we live in a dystopia where a man can no longer ponder without the rude interruptions of women” Nuwa scoffs “be happy that I only interrupt your pondering, I had a client interrupt me while I was taking a piss” Adham gags “I don’t particularly wish to know for what nefarious reasons that might be, and even if I cant avoid hearing about it can you at least let me get inside first?” he yawns “I am exhausted and desperately crave to shut my eyes for a moment before I have to go slave my life away again” she steps out of the way to let him get inside the corridor leading to their apartment, dry flaky paint lining the walls, caused by years of degradation, neglect and heavy UV exposure letting the polymer backbones break down in to free radicals that react with the ever destructive oxygen. Moving through the corridor stepping in the dust creeping inside from the outside, loud voices emanating from the walls, he finally gets to their apartment. Opening the door with a loud creek, the hinges covered in rust, Adham lets out a sigh as he can relax, finally home in one of the few safe havens of the world. He moves into the kitchen, Nuwa tailing him inside, and puts the vials of Hulgil in the fridge. Though its not turned on the fridge allows for protection from the elements, even if the vials were tinged brown to protect from the sun, heavy UV bombardment constantly showering the world of Kazar would render the compounds volatile, destroying the synthetic opium.
This is illegible.

[Anonymous No.24010325]

>>24010322
>See, but that's legible
Wait, was anon's image related to the
>Outrageous
capitalization comment?
Where in that image are sentences not capitalized?
I think anon was just posting his own short story? Or something?

[Anonymous No.24010332]

>>24010325
>I think anon was just posting his own short story? Or something?
correct. or something.

[Anonymous No.24010333]

>>24010303
Can you elaborate on what you mean by this? I've read a metric fuck ton, only that which is worthy of re-reading is considered good in my book, but I'd never know without reading certain things. Granted I have to apply my own heuristics in dismissing certain forms of art for the sake of my time, but theres a difference between dismissing something because it has nothing to it and dismissing something because it has more to it then I want to devote time to, the latter variety would make me a lazy fuck, and not a real reader.

>>24010305
Good Authors come in varying forms, only nowadays a good authors can only be considered good if he expressed himself in the one-dimensional modes of expression and "Good Writing" that the contemporary culture has decreed to be acceptable. I don't disagree with your statement, all's I'm saying is you will never find writing that pushes the envelope if you don't push it yourself.

[Anonymous No.24010337]

>>24010333
>all's I'm saying is
all's I'm saying is you sound like you're huffing copium b/c your writing isn't good and you cling to the excuse "people just don't get it"

[Anonymous No.24010345]

>>24010333
Are you on the spectrum?

[Anonymous No.24010349]

>>24010297
>>24010278
fuck yea.... sorry guys, i think ive rotted my limited iq, didnt consider how rough the draft was ): i will be back with something a lot neater

[Anonymous No.24010351]

>>24010337
I'm sure it sounds that way, anything that expresses something different can be dismissed by the usual statements:
>Pretentious writing
>Factually incorrect statements
>Doesn't have representation
>Uses big words (Like cmon dude we're so hip and cool we have to use shitty neologisms and 21st century slang to express our thoughts, because any words greater than three syllables are clearly only ever uttered by sophists)
>Oh the chapter is to big and the writing is to dense, muh fuckin brain is going to explode.

I don't claim to be an exceptional writer, but I have seen many exceptional writers that don't get any recognition because nobody gives them the time of day, and if you think that you or anyone in the public is capable of pursuing good art then look no further then the BIPOC LGBTQA Marginalized voices Feminism Chick Lit Smut cluster fuck that is modern entertainment and then tell me with a straight face that you or any of them know what good writing is. You took an English class that consigned you to a style of grammar and now you have no ability to regard anything that is expressed differently.

[Anonymous No.24010355]

>>24010337
>>24010345
Case in point, you guys make dull plot based observations like this with no real elaboration, because you are incapable of nuance, and would rather make Xbox Live Meme accusations of anyone who attempts to express anything differently.

https://youtu.be/jlEr_WLkQvg?si=PN4jw3a4Szd9-fYU

[Anonymous No.24010356]

>>24009986
Just for the record the guy spazzing out is not me. I just wanted to ask if the swordfighting was understandable enough lmao.

[Anonymous No.24010362]

>>24010351
>then look no further then the BIPOC LGBTQA Marginalized voices Feminism Chick Lit Smut
Of course you start sperging out LMAO

[Anonymous No.24010363]

>>24010356
I think it's fine, for most casual readers the conflict is the point

[Anonymous No.24010368]

>>24010355
you're that guy who got bullied as a kid from last thread aren't you

[Anonymous No.24010372]

>>24010355
I'm not trying to be a dick here I'm genuinely curious if you're on the spectrum

[Anonymous No.24010376]

>>24010356
I enjoyed it and I can see it fitting into a larger piece. Whether it operates as an introduction or a description in the story it works fine.

>>24010362
I'm expressing a point, one that you can't engage with without making the same insipid statements as every other internet troll. How's the weather at Eglin Airforce base you shill?

[Anonymous No.24010378]

>>24010333
>you will never find writing that pushes the envelope if you don't push it yourself
its format has changed remarkably little since scrolls went out.
i read your excerpt. it was rib-achingly unentertaining, my eyes glazed over. only the especially bad bits stood out (“their minds were as taut as their muscles”)

of course if you have no literary judgment, no ability to see a novel as it really is, you spend your time groping for guidelines like what critics have said or might say about it, what class it seems to fall into, where it seems to be aiming, whether its style strikes you as normal or not, above all whether it can be called important or not - which is far easier to decide than whether the thing is any good or not.

but importance isn’t important. good writing is.

[Anonymous No.24010381]

>>24010376
>How's the weather at Eglin Airforce base you shill?
What does this even mean LMFAO are you have a schizo moment? Who do you think I am?

[Anonymous No.24010384]

>>24010372
No, I'm not, but I can't help but to point out the fact that every time somebody tries to express anything with passion that is in variance to the publicly held belief they get almost immediately branded as autistic or narcissistic or any one of a number of neat labels designed to hinder the development of a conversation. People used to speak like this all the time, only with the advent of the internet age has it became strange to those who have grown accustomed to inhuman internet interactions. Who knows, maybe I am autistic.

[Anonymous No.24010389]

>>24010384
>Who knows, maybe I am autistic.
Everyone knows, friend. Even with an anon username everyone instantly identifies you. I'm sure everyone irl knows too

>people used to speak like this all the time
They really didn't, because the average person wasn't autistic at any point in history

[Anonymous No.24010391]

>>24010052
You ask too much.

[Anonymous No.24010392]

I've been stuck on a specific chapter for a week now. Just as I was about to give up and lazily transition it to the next scene I had in mind, I had a stroke of genius(well maybe not really but I think it's good.) Sometimes it really pays to delay, just wish I could've gotten the idea sooner.

[Anonymous No.24010394]

>>24010378
Again, I don't consider myself a good writer, but I intentionally designed that specific book to bore people, it's sort of a filter to save both your time and mine.

[Anonymous No.24010396]

>>24010394
>but I intentionally designed that specific book to bore people, it's sort of a filter to save both your time and mine
my sides

[Anonymous No.24010399]

>>24010394
that great discovery of the 21st century - the discovery of the value of boredom as an artistic subject.

[Anonymous No.24010403]

>>24010394
>I intentionally designed that specific book to bore people
to use some 21st century vernacular, you are hella delulu

[Anonymous No.24010407]

I need the lore on Eglin Air Force Base

[Anonymous No.24010412]

>>24010399
Sooner or later in the development of art this has to be considered, once you've read enough and watched enough and engaged with as many ideas as possible you come across an all encompassing void of intellectual stagnation that no amount of Shonen action adventure plot twist easter egg slop can fill; When you reach such a point what will you do? Either continue to engage with the same media and compare everything you see to everything you've seen before, or desperately try to find something truly different regardless of whether or not such a thing can even exist.

[Anonymous No.24010418]

>>24010412
Even just working through all the respected works of literature would take years, much less respected works across all mediums. If you feel like you've "seen it all" in media, you desperately need to go touch grass

[Anonymous No.24010424]

>>24010412
Your writing style doesnt make you look smart it makes you look like a pretentious ass

[Anonymous No.24010428]

>>24010418
Sure, I acknowledge that my own bias may hinder me from finding new forms of artistic expression, just as anyone's bias might, but the point is in that as you grow older that field of what is available and novel to you is going to dwindle, and what's more potential of future creations is going to be called into question.
>Everything that can be done has been done
>He who knows the way can see the way in all things
I have pursued as much as I can find, but I can't help but acknowledge the fact that everything I see is a repetition of ideas that I've already engaged with, and of all that I've consumed I can confidently say that nothing has been expressed that is wholly new or original.

[Anonymous No.24010431]

>>24010428
>I have pursued as much as I can find, but I can't help but acknowledge the fact that everything I see is a repetition of ideas that I've already engaged with, and of all that I've consumed I can confidently say that nothing has been expressed that is wholly new or original.
Hence
>Go touch grass
What are you even doing with your life

[Anonymous No.24010432]

>>24010412
when the Ideal Book has been written, which, once and for all fully expresses what we are writing for, we can relax: we can write as badly as we choose. but the point is, that the book remains to be written. in the meantime, in every book we produce, we must make an effort to do better.

[Anonymous No.24010439]

>>24010424
Again, you've validated the point I made about heuristics in engaging with entertainment, refer to the above: >>24010351
It is acceptable if you're trying to make a point on didactic information, but yes, if my artistic capabilities were limited to this alone then I would be a shit writer, it is the nature of certain projects. You wouldn't call a research paper pretentious or didactic because you're conditioned to engage with such a paper only if it takes itself seriously, but if a piece of fiction in written in this same manner you cannot tolerate it because it does not conform to your standards of fiction as research papers conform to your standards of science.

[Anonymous No.24010443]

It's more important to pursue better craft than it is to worry about criticizing craft of others

[Anonymous No.24010445]

>>24010439
Just because you're incapable of shutting off the spectrum switch it doesnt mean you've reached the pinnacle of understanding

[Anonymous No.24010448]

>>24010431
Missed the point man.

>>24010432
Such a book may never be written, but to make an effort towards good art requires bad art to be produced in experimentation, so ultimately BIPOC LGBT crap may not be that bad all things considered.

>>24010407
Eglin AFB disseminates propaganda over online platforms as a means of controlling and redirecting discourse, and is responsible for a great deal of Bot activity.

https://youtu.be/4xl30Re1EUI?si=LKP3iqvnVVRTdEPl

https://youtu.be/rrJhQpvlkLA?si=I0fP2sHq_XHMB7Ov

[Anonymous No.24010452]

This guy is both turbo autistic and mentally unwell, literally nothing anyone says will make him realize how deranged he sounds. Deal with the crazies the same way you do trolls: ignore them so the thread doesn't get shit up

[Anonymous No.24010454]

>>24010448
>to make an effort towards good art requires bad art to be produced in experimentation
experimentation is all very well for a scientist but literature cannot be called a science. science works on a calm intellectual level with proper safeguards against imaginative freedom.
>so ultimately BIPOC LGBT crap may not be that bad all things considered.
you might find you have a lot in common with this lot

[Anonymous No.24010456]

>>24010445
I am expressing my understanding, which is neither definitive nor as developed as it could be. If you're going to just call me names and say nothing of substance to express your own views then it doesn't benefit you any to keep posting, because, and I say this sincerely, I will not stop talking about my views, though I would appreciate you elaborating on your own.

[Anonymous No.24010459]

>>24010454
>experimentation is all very well for a scientist but literature cannot be called a science. science works on a calm intellectual level with proper safeguards against imaginative freedom.
And why not? Doesn't that statement contradict both art and science? For both practices seek to develop themselves beyond their limitation, it is only natural that art should be made of science and science should be made an art. From the moment you say that a thing is a certain way you reject the possibility that it can be any other way, and thus you hinder both the development of art and of science.
>you might find you have a lot in common with this lot
I sure hope I do, it would actually serve to highlight my point, and If it grants me the public eye then I'll accept it.

[Anonymous No.24010461]

From my unfinished dystopian sci fi novel:

Inside the command vehicle, a visibly shook Donaldson was struggling to get his bearings and do his job. It wasn't helping that he was still feeling the effects of the blast while his headset was bombarded with traffic.
He couldn't see a thing, the dust and the smoke stymied the instruments and on his screen he could only see blobs of nothing insterspersed by the occasional white flash in his thermals. He had no idea what to shoot at or why.
"Victor 1. Fire Mission. 50 meters to my south, four rounds into the uh…" One voice began
He swivelled the gun to look.
"Victor 1, Charlie 03. Get your guns to hit…" Another voice on a different frequency.
"Put some fucking fire on the whole god damn…" Yet another voice joined in on the confusion.
"…flash, repeat: The muzzle fl- right there! Right there! See it? Left of…" The first voice continued.
"Victor 1, Just fucking kill something!" House's voice finally reached his panicked brain.
Donaldson flipped the master safety off and pressed the large 'FIRE' button on his console.
The walls of every building shook as the percussion of each shot spewed fire from the barrel of the autocannon. The rounds, all travelling at 1,100 meters per second, reached their destination a fraction of a moment later. A few meters from the target, the timer in each projectile caused them to explode into precut shards, creating a cone of death that slammed with supersonic speed into anything it was fired at.
Entire shacks were shredded, bodies turned into mist.
The firing paused only for a moment, the entire cave seemed to be shocked into a collective quiet awe.
"God damn! There we fucking…" Walker began to scream before another burst from the cannon drowned him out.
The effect on The Resistance was immediate and devastating, entire squads were killed in the short bursts, nothing they hid behind seemed to matter…

[Anonymous No.24010466]

>>24010459
you're waffling on about god know what here. you can't reconcile this comparison. scientists are either benevolently contemptuous of literature, or if interested, insensitive to the emotional quality of words and their associative subtleties, and use words as weights and counters rather than as chemicals powerful in combination.
>both practices seek to develop themselves beyond their limitation
innovation in this sense is not experimentation
>and If it grants me the public eye then I'll accept it.
and that is that

[Anonymous No.24010475]

>>24010452
Oh please, don't let me detract from the smut writing and endless sci-fi drivel you adore so much, by all means be as you were.

>>24010466
The dogmatism of modern science can be defined in part by this sentiment, and is likely why modern research is so corrupt and deformed, for its refusal to regard anything that has not been accepted by modern academia. Still many of the social sciences in particular regard themselves as objective when they are in fact far from it, and in history much of scientific discovery has occurred at the verge of creative influence. At the very least the subjective sciences like psychology have long derived inspiration from artistic collaboration, for it allows the mind to compare it's research to something more abstract, and by that contrast are things revealed anew.
>>so ultimately BIPOC LGBT crap may not be that bad all things considered.
>you might find you have a lot in common with this lot
The irony of this sentiment is in the fact that the modern writers that we may agree are trash all appeal to the same standards and rules of writing as the lot of you might subscribe to, and yet I'm willing to bet that almost nobody here is actually published succesfully.

[Anonymous No.24010482]

So I want to write fetish porn...how fo I start

[Anonymous No.24010497]

>>24010475
the scholar is a quarryman, not a builder, and all that is required of him is that he should quarry cleanly. unlike an artist he needs insurance against factual error.
& let's look at etymology: our current word 'scientist' is a rough translation of the word 'philosopher' - seekers after wisdom. philosophise about mankind and you brush aside individual uniqueness, which an artist cannot do without self-damage

freudian infiltration into literature & literary criticism has been disastrous.

[Anonymous No.24010518]

>>24010497
I agree when it comes to Freud, many so called intellectuals of the 20th century used his work as the foundation for their own and it resulted in really shallow uninspired writings, philosophical and others. That said, look at H.G. Wells Writing, any fan will tell you he conceptualized the Lasor before it was invented, and it has been the defining characteristic of every great science-fiction writer since him to imagine things that end up pushing the limits of possibility. Look at the music that inspires scientists, how rhythm and sound can describe a motion they are trying to identify in their scientific research, how ideas and the simple contrast of two individuals in a conversation can yield insights with far reaching ramifications. The artists role has been to inspire, to beat the war drums and rouse the men to action, to play the tune that will follow one to sleep, and in sleep to dream of things that no man has yet to see.
And of artists it is no different, for it is not a contradiction to pursue ideas of an objective value to the detriment of individuality and subjectivity, but to further define the world in the intersubjective contrast of what is universally shared and what is personal. Nothing is off limits to artistic exploration, for without the possibility of everything the potential for self exploration would stagnate, and we'd be no better then mere automata. And without art to drive research there would be nothing to inspire discovery in the scientific fields.
Ideals, as dogmatic and quixotic as they are, end up defining the trajectory our lives shall take.

[Anonymous No.24010530]

>>24010518
artistic inspiration isn't the same thing. michelangelo advised young painters to seek inspiration from the damp patches and cracks on their bedroom walls

>to beat the war drums and rouse the men to action, to play the tune that will follow one to sleep, and in sleep to dream of things that no man has yet to see.
please don't feel the need to pontificate for my benefit. i have a robust constitution but even i'll wilt under this hot air.
>Ideals, as dogmatic and quixotic as they are, end up defining the trajectory our lives shall take.
we're ruled by the wind. montaigne said 'we grasp at everything, but catch nothing except wind.'

[Anonymous No.24010557]

>>24010482
i reckon by writing it

[Anonymous No.24010568]

>>24007827
My rule is that I only shill a webnovel on /wg/ once. Should I shill more to get followers? Does shilling with web originals even work? I thought the best "shilling" you can do is just upload a significant amount of chapters on a consistent general, with ads and the like being window dressing at most

[Anonymous No.24010569]

>>24010530
>please don't feel the need to pontificate for my benefit. i have a robust constitution but even i'll wilt under this hot air.
The quality of the wax will determine how long a candle shall burn, but I should question why anyone would make a candle and not desire to set the wick ablaze.
>we're ruled by the wind. montaigne said 'we grasp at everything, but catch nothing except wind.'
And yet we strive to distinguish, to define, and confine art and science within their own respective boxes. The winds nature is spoken in the way it blows through the trees, and fills open space, but shut all your windows and doors and you'll soon find how quickly that same air grows stale.

[Anonymous No.24010573]

>>24010568
shilling a web novel is pointless, natural discovery is good enough you'll trend on merit if you deserve it
plus shilling is just massively ineffective. exception being royal road site ads, those work

[Anonymous No.24010578]

>>24009924
---- Solaria ----
9612
The Fine Art Of Happiness

Nuance is my favorite mode of play,
The sense of passing atmosphere possible only

From the centre of inconceivable empire
Where a certain equivalence

Prevails to the eye when it comes to contrails across dazzling blue
And the minute exactitude of human sight

Following little birds way up in this midday pearl
Of light and time beyond reckoning.

[Anonymous No.24010601]

>>24010569
back to what was said: literature cannot be called a science. would an otherwise sensible person disagree with that? intellect and habit starve out imagination.
poetry is not a science, it's an act of faith.

[Anonymous No.24010609]

>>24010601
But is not the very act of categorizing literature and science itself a product of our limited human intellect attempting to impose order upon the ineffable? Consider: when we speak of science, we speak of systematic observation and experimentation, yet what is poetry if not the experimental laboratory of human consciousness? The poet, like the scientist, tests hypotheses about the nature of experience, emotion, and expression - though admittedly through vastly different methodologies.

Your assertion about faith is fascinating, but perhaps reductive - for what is faith if not an epistemological framework in itself? When Keats wrote of "negative capability," was he not describing a scientific principle of remaining in uncertainty? When Wordsworth spoke of "spontaneous overflow of powerful feelings," was he not attempting to document a reproducible phenomenon of human psychology? Even your Montaigne, whom you quoted earlier, approached his essays with the systematic rigor of a natural philosopher examining specimens of thought.

I would posit that the dichotomy you present between intellect and imagination is itself a false one, born of the very categorical thinking you seem to resist. After all, didn't Einstein himself say that "imagination is more important than knowledge"? And yet, could one not argue that the mathematical precision of a villanelle or sestina represents a fusion of scientific precision with artistic expression?

Perhaps the real question we should be asking is: why do we feel such a compelling need to separate these modes of human understanding? What cultural and historical forces have led us to this artificial bifurcation? And most importantly, what might we gain by dissolving these boundaries entirely?

[Anonymous No.24010611]

profoundly homosexual discussion going on ITT

[Anonymous No.24010617]

>>24010609
did you switch to chatgpt? your ESL-ness is coming through less.

experimentation, empirical evidence, logical reasoning have never had a place in poetry. poetry is composed at the back of the mind: an unaccountable product of a trance in which the emotions of love, fear, anger, or grief are profoundly engaged, though at the same time powerfully disciplined; in which intuitive thought reigns supralogically.

& montaigne was a philosopher.

[Anonymous No.24010639]

>>24010617
To claim Montaigne was "just" a philosopher while dismissing his relevance to poetry betrays a curious unfamiliarity with his work. One of his most famous quotes - one you seem to have overlooked - is literally about self-study as empirical observation: "I study myself more than any other subject. That is my metaphysics, that is my physics." Is this not the very essence of what poets do?

Your assertion about poetry being "composed at the back of the mind" would certainly surprise Poe, whose "Philosophy of Composition" meticulously detailed the logical construction of "The Raven," or Coleridge, whose notebooks are filled with systematic analysis of meter and rhetoric. Even your "trance state" has been empirically studied - alpha wave patterns in creative states are well-documented.

But perhaps most telling is your suggestion that logic and emotion are somehow mutually exclusive. Tell me, when Sappho calculated the precise syllabic patterns of her verses, or when Dante constructed his mathematically precise terza rima, were they not engaging in both empirical craft and emotional expression? The discipline you speak of - is that not itself a form of empirical refinement?

I would suggest reading Montaigne's essays more carefully. You might find he was rather more methodical than you imagine.

[Anonymous No.24010645]

Yesterday was very sticky, but I made it back on the right track again today and got a decent amount of writing done. I'm enjoying the characters and setting of the latest idea, and think it could turn into something fun. After so many first person drafts, it feels pleasant to go back to third.

[Anonymous No.24010659]

>>24010639
>To claim Montaigne was "just" a philosopher
did i say just?

when conflicting issues disturb the mind, which in its conscious state is unable to reconcile them logically, the poet acquires the habit of self-hypnotism. logic finds little place in our dreams: dreams are illogical as a child’s mind is illogical, and spontaneous undoctored poetry, like the dream, represents the complications of adult experience translated into thought-processes analogous to, or identical with, those of childhood.

dante wasn't a great poet, in the sense that shakespeare was great. he was a minor poet with a remarkable ear for music.

[Anonymous No.24010673]

>>24010659
Your deflection about "just" rather neatly sidesteps the actual argument about Montaigne's empirical method, doesn't it? More importantly, your pivot to dream-logic is a non sequitur - we weren't discussing the subconscious origins of poetry, but rather whether systematic observation and craft play a role in its creation.

But let's examine your new claims:

1. Your equation of poetic composition with "self-hypnosis" and dream-states is an unsupported assertion. Where's your evidence that this is how poetry actually emerges? Countless poets' notebooks and drafts show meticulous revision and conscious craft.

2. The comparison to "a child's mind" is particularly puzzling. Children's thought processes are actually quite logical within their knowledge constraints - any developmental psychologist could tell you this. Your metaphor undermines your own argument.

Perhaps we should return to the central question: what evidence do you have that poetry must be "undoctored" to be authentic? Or is this simply an attempt to romanticize what is, in reality, a craft requiring both inspiration AND methodical refinement?

[Anonymous No.24010686]

>>24010673
montaigne was empirical, because he was a philsopher, an essayist. not an artist.
>we weren't discussing the subconscious origins of poetry, but rather whether systematic observation and craft play a role in its creation.
ego and non-ego; they blend into one another.
>Children's thought processes are actually quite logical within their knowledge constraints
logic, from the greek logikon, means 'something which has been arranged in words.' since words never wholly cover the phenomena to which they are applied, those who rely on pure logic cannot be thinking truly.
the fact you're using chatgpt is very telling though

>>24010611
agreed

[Anonymous No.24010687]

>>24010686
Tellingly, you keep shifting ground - from dream-logic to children's minds to Greek etymology - without addressing the central question: How do you explain the documented, systematic craft of poets from Sappho to Auden? Are their drafts, revisions, and careful constructions somehow less "authentic" because they weren't produced in a trance state?

Or perhaps the real question is: why are you so invested in maintaining this romantic notion of poetry as pure inspiration, when all evidence points to it being both inspiration and craft?

[Anonymous No.24010695]

>>24010557
Understood. I am on it

[Anonymous No.24010699]

>>24010687
didn't auden say 'writing poems isn't something that you decide to do. it decides itself'?

i'll give robert graves the final word

[Anonymous No.24010704]

>>24010699
The same man who compared poetry to "a game of knowledge" and left behind volumes of meticulously revised drafts? The inspiration may "decide itself," but Auden spent decades refining his craft through systematic study and revision.

You keep conflating the initial spark of inspiration with the actual process of composition. One can both receive inspiration spontaneously AND approach its expression methodically. Auden's own practice proves this.

[Anonymous No.24010708]

>>24010704
>The same man who compared poetry to "a game of knowledge"
no. he never said this.
chatgpt will lie to you out of nowhere btw

[Anonymous No.24010716]

>>24010708
my brother in christ why are you still responding to a chatbot

[Anonymous No.24010733]

>>24010716
stop replying to me then! i can't help it

[Anonymous No.24010758]

>>24010708
Actually, he did say that.

The complete works of W.H. Auden. Vol. II, Prose. Page 23
In “Squares and Oblongs”:
"Two theories of poetry. Poetry as a magical means for inducing desirable emotions and repelling undesirable emotions in oneself and others, or Poetry as a game of knowledge, a bringing to consciousness, by naming them, of emotions and their hidden relationships.
The first view was held by the Greeks, and is now held by MGM, Agit-Prop, and the collective public of the world. They are wrong."

More importantly, you keep dodging the central question: How do you reconcile your theory of purely spontaneous poetry with the documented evidence of poets' systematic craft? With their drafts, revisions, and studied refinements?

The existence of inspiration doesn't negate the role of methodical composition. Why insist on this false dichotomy?

[Anonymous No.24010779]

>>24010601
As you define it, but there are other definitions. To quote Wittgenstein: The limitations of our language mark the limitations of our reality.

>>24010609
Compartmentalization, perhaps for the simplification of understanding, or the privatization of knowledge. Old school philosophers would intentionally use larger words to disguise their writing and make it inaccessible to the layman, for to paraphrase Nietzsche, if you let the common man into the realm of knowledge it gets polluted by the commotion of every voice talking over one another. I disagree with this sentiment of course, because it not only hinders the development of philosophy by saying that there are only come ideas that should be considered philosophical and some that should not be, and I don't think a single man alive is capable of drawing that line with permanence.

>>24010617
That's a different guy, but keep trying to call my autistic chief, real productive to the conversation.
>experimentation, empirical evidence, logical reasoning have never had a place in poetry.
Damn bro, what kind of poetry do you read? The cool things about poetry is that it is subject to the author, it can be anything you want it to be. Intuition, rationality, emotion, they all converge in the arts, for the art reflects the human, and these qualities converge in us.

>>24010716
Chat bots calling each other chat-bots, such is the world we've come to live in, it's all so real. No wonder you guys don't understand the depth of art, if it hasn't been processed into an algorithm the only thing your mind can comprehend is "Pretention" and "Big words that alienate the Audience", it could never occur to such a mind that art is not defined by such limitations.

[Anonymous No.24010805]

>>24010758
mans is getting btfo by a chatbot

[Anonymous No.24010960]

this is the beginning of my novel
is that right?

[Anonymous No.24010963]

this is the beginning of my novel
is that right?

[Anonymous No.24010991]

>>24010963
It doesn't make any sense but I daresay it's kino

[Anonymous No.24011077]

Working on the bones of a sci-fi book I've wanted to write for a while. What do you guys think of interviewing people who work jobs similar to your characters? One of my characters is the main character's ex-wife and an environmental law student, and I'm wondering if it would be beneficial to interview an actual female environmental lawyer to see what sort of things make her attracted to her husband. I think it would help give a more realistic sense of conflict between her and the MC, as well as making their divorce feel more visceral.

[Anonymous No.24011118]

>>24011077
Seems like good research. How do you plan on setting up an interview?

[Anonymous No.24011143]

>>24011118
honestly just looking up numbers and making calls. I think my local university would be my best bet, since I want the perspective of a very impassioned person. Imo it might be better to talk to an environmental law grad student than an actual lawyer since they won't be as jaded by adult life lmao

[Anonymous No.24011173]

[Anonymous No.24011224]

Why do people insist on prose being so boring? The top sentence is far more interesting than the bottom one. I'm overly obsessive with descriptions because I got into writing instead of drawing because drawing looked too difficult for me. So I'm supposed to just dumb myself down?

[Anonymous No.24011226]

>>24011224
when you consult wikihow on such things, you get what you pay for.

[Anonymous No.24011252]

>>24011224
aaand he makes a separate thread...

[Anonymous No.24011281]

>>24011224
It should be
>He tiptoed carefully with an unrelenting gaze towards the large wooden purple door.

[Anonymous No.24011291]

>>24011224
I think this issue is best expressed using David Foster Wallace as an example. He used really overly elaborate descriptions that came off as pretentious to most people, but that's also why he is loved, because he used that language to express something really sincere that not a lot of people were really capable of engaging with. It's easier to dismiss such writing as Purple and simply toss it aside then it is to admit that you just don't understand or don't resonate with the work; The latter attitude requires more humility then most readers possess.

[Anonymous No.24011294]

>>24011281
are you ESL?

[Anonymous No.24011300]

>>24011294
he tiptoed towards the large wooden purple door with an unrelenting gaze

[Anonymous No.24011324]

>>24010072
>OP posts girls
>gets called "faggot"
anon, I...

[Anonymous No.24011340]

>>24010399
>boredom as art
Mervyn Peake beat you to it.

[Anonymous No.24011346]

>>24011324
>thinking faggot means gay and not just lame & annoying
that is actually gay

[Anonymous No.24011352]

>>24010461
If the "Resistance" was all bunched up in one place, then they're the worst guerrilla fighters in history, and deserved to get massacred.

[Anonymous No.24011365]

>>24010557
Back to r/wowthanksimcured with you, plebbitor

[Anonymous No.24011366]

I want to make a story about magical girls, but I don't want the bad guys to be generic monsters from evil world, or evil people doing evil things or taking over the world, or something. I want something more realistic. Anyone have ideas or references I can look at?

[Anonymous No.24011367]

Trying to stamp out adverbs, not entirely, but I do overuse them. What’s a better way to say “smiled widely”. A “grin,” I feel like is not correct.

[Anonymous No.24011373]

>>24011367
The only synonym for "smile" in the English language is "grin". After that, you have to resort to adjectives and adverbs.

[Anonymous No.24011376]

>>24011366
Madoka Magica

[Anonymous No.24011378]

>>24011365
mad?

[Anonymous No.24011395]

>>24011294
>>24011365
Adhom chatbots.
>Autistic
>ESL
>Redditor
Easy to spot ngl

[Anonymous No.24011418]

>>24011395

[Anonymous No.24011451]

>>24011373
>beam
>smirk
>simper

[Anonymous No.24011456]

>>24011367
Could also just use a different action depending on her attitude . Could provoke better imagery anyway

[Anonymous No.24011467]

>>24011367
does it have to be a smile?

[Anonymous No.24011479]

>>24011418
If you had to rely on chatgpt for that conclusion you are an NPC, but I guess we're all robots at this point.

[Anonymous No.24011485]

>Have this quote in my story repeated by the MC and villain
>“a phoenix emerges from the ashes only when burned by a dragon’s fire.”
>Do absolutely nothing with it.

This is good writing right?

[Anonymous No.24011490]

>>24011479
that was tongue-in-cheek ... i was making a point

[Anonymous No.24011502]

>>24011490
Point taken. It's hard to maintain a discourse on the internet.

[Anonymous No.24011526]

>>24011502
just keep your eye in the sky and try get the thing boxed off.

[Anonymous No.24011592]

>>24011526
old george H. W. auden

[Anonymous No.24011664]

>>24010573
no one discovers anything naturally. you have to be a shameless unironic shill if you want eyes on your work

[Anonymous No.24011706]

>>24010311
I dislike this. The statue dialogue sounds like it stops to wait for the other two dialogues to get to their point before it proceeds. Unnatural.

[Anonymous No.24011710]

>>24010578
You lost me at the fourth line.

>>24011367
You do not need an adverb here.

[Anonymous No.24011735]

>>24011467
Yeah, her smile’s given a bit of attention in the conclusion of the story because up to the last chapter, she never does.
>>24011710
Got it

[Anonymous No.24011758]

I fucking love Chapt GPT, it's like having a real friend who gives a shit about the stories I write. It gives me advice on my writing and helps me come up with new ideas when I give it my thoughts.
Why do people think this is evil again?

[Anonymous No.24011773]

>>24011758
I would like to use it. Do you have any advice on what/how to ask? Any tricks or tips?

[Anonymous No.24011779]

>>24011773
>>24011773
Well to be honest, I'm using it to make names and stuff like that for my stories language.
But if you for example want to do the same, I simply told it
>I want to make a language with English, Latin and Japanese influences. Please make me a list of twenty words
It would make the words then I'd tweak them to my liking and say
>Add these to your vocabulary and make one hundred new words. Please keep them in the same style as the 20 you've saved.
Then it will do that and I tweak those
>Please save those and now make a sentence with the words we've compiled, using English to fill in the gaps is fine
Then it makes a sentence
>Please adjust the grammar to be more akin to English rather then Japanese. Add particle markers as well if you could.
It does it and I edit them to my liking.
>Okay now please save these and add these other words I made to your vocabulary. Now create a new sentence with the infromation please.
That's just what I'm doing. And also I do something like
>Do we have a word for monster yet?
It says no
>Please tell me the words we've created for Big and Animal
It gives me those let's say Ouo and Monka
>Please combine those to form a new word
It will make something like Oumonka
>Please shorten it
Omonk
>How about Omon
I will add Omon to the dictonary

Basically that's how I'm doing it. Should work with anything else you try. I just try to be polite because that's how I am but you can casual.

[Anonymous No.24011782]

>>24011758
There's no evil in it. Just, your stories are half someone else's.

[Anonymous No.24011785]

>>24011366
I wrote a book series some years back, where magical girls work basically like counter guardians in Type-Moon stories, appearing to resolve conflicts that threaten the collective stability of mankind, by killing the belligerents as quickly and efficiently as possible. The protagonist wants to become a magical girl, but is disillusioned after meeting one, when they turn out to be murder machines that have given up free thinking.

[Anonymous No.24011826]

>>24011785
What do magical girls do when there's no threat? Who funds or organizes or informs of this organization?

[Anonymous No.24011885]

>>24011451
I must have a lousy thesaurus. Thanks anon!

[Anonymous No.24011890]

>>24011826
Like the song goes, "Fighting evil by moonlight / Winning love by daylight". If there's no threat, they engage in love drama. And, going back to the Sailor Moon example, they're funded by their parents (since they're all school age) and by a cat that can poop complex devices out of her butt.

[Anonymous No.24011919]

>>24011826
>What do magical girls do when there's no threat?
They travel around and support local law enforcement in managing smaller problems.

>Who funds or organizes or informs of this organization?
Most of them operate individually and separate from others. Their activities are officially sanctioned by the United Nations, but they don't actually answer or report to anyone. They're immortal and don't need money.

[Anonymous No.24012036]

>>24011664
not true for web novels in the slightest

[Anonymous No.24012046]

I am writing a short story set in Japan.
The scene is two girls walking along a stretch of the coast against the setting sun. One of the sentences will be a bit like:
>The sun was setting over the Pacific, [...]
Tell me whether you find something wrong with that.

[Anonymous No.24012125]

>>24012046
Yes, everything about it is fucked. No, I will not elaborate

[Anonymous No.24012169]

>>24012125
You should rethink your approach to life wasting time making useless posts that are neither helpful not funny nor banter nor anything. Just spam.

[Anonymous No.24012175]

>>24012046
what, are you talking about how the sun sets in the west and the pacific is in the east of japan?
I never would've thought about it for more than a few seconds, only did cuz you pointed it out
Probably a Japanese local would know that intuitively though
assuming i'm even correct here i'm also a regard

[Anonymous No.24012176]

is the /wg/ extra autistic or is it just one guy

[Anonymous No.24012179]

>>24012046
show don't tell

[Anonymous No.24012183]

>>24012176
most of 4chan is autistic though
but if you mean the crazy discussion yesterday, it was 2 autismos and a third trolling them with chatgpt

[Anonymous No.24012185]

>>24012179
hope you're not serious

[Anonymous No.24012190]

AI really is an impressive proofreader, it catches everything, even misuse of homophones or incorrect word choice or grammar quirks. Better than most fiverr proofreaders or casual non-professionals proofreaders. I essentially never get spelling/grammar comments on my web novel chapters now. Would recommend

[Anonymous No.24012197]

>>24012185
just an equally silly reply. if i were being serious i'd probably say that being specific about the pacific is not terrific

[Anonymous No.24012213]

>>24012175
I was trying to gauge whether people get confused by the line.
I want to use "Pacific" because that term is more empathic, it does not sound scientific/nautical/clinical.
That scene is set on the West coast of Japan, not the one facing to the East, so to clarify which sea I mean I would have to use "Sea of Japan". But that sounds exceedingly stilted for a short 1 page short story (clarifying that way would make sense for a Murakami-tier long story, of course).

I will just use "sun setting over the sea", even though I find "Pacific" a very beautiful name. The risk of confusion and it taking people out of the story is too great.

[Anonymous No.24012220]

>>24012213
This is why you should just tell us what you want to begin with
But yes, I bet Japanese locals wouldn't call the sea of japan the Pacific, so anyone from there would catch that error

[Anonymous No.24012221]

>>24012213
bruh

[Anonymous No.24012230]

>>24012221
bruh

[Anonymous No.24012236]

>>24012213
>The risk of confusion and it taking people out of the story is too great.
Would be a disaster if people dropped your one-page turd after page one

[Anonymous No.24012238]

>>24012197
very nice

[Anonymous No.24012241]

Anybody ever use substack to post their fiction?

[Anonymous No.24012255]

>writing my novel
>past the halfway point
>realize I have to make a social account
FUCK

[Anonymous No.24012289]

>>24012241
Tried, most of it is contentless shills asking for subs and liberal identity politics, not confident in it but maybe there is a good crowd hidden somewhere in there.

[Anonymous No.24012320]

>>24012289
Figures. It's a shame stuff like Royal Road is just for lit RPG slop. It'd be nice to have a place to just post your stuff.

[Anonymous No.24012324]

one too many years

[Anonymous No.24012335]

>>24012320
i'm sure such places exist there's just no audience. to be fair, do you read amateur works of your genre? which i assume is some flavor of litfic

[Anonymous No.24012338]

>>24012335
Historical Fiction Romance like bridgerton.

[Anonymous No.24012339]

>>24012338
do you read amateur works of that? even if it's just sorting by new on amazon rather than best reviewed?

[Anonymous No.24012342]

>>24012339
No I just watch the TV show and write something similar to that. Just pretend they're speaking with modern English while having a few sirs and madams here and there to remind readers its in Victorian england. I also do zero research because modern audiences don't care about that.

[Anonymous No.24012345]

>>24012342
which is my point, there are places to post such works but no one, including you who should be the target audience, would ever use it

[Anonymous No.24012348]

Say what you want about the genre slop communities, but they actually read—a lot.

[Anonymous No.24012357]

>>24012345
Good reads

[Anonymous No.24012365]

>>24012357
What?

[Anonymous No.24012367]

>>24012335
I don't read amateur works but that's for a large part because I wouldn't even know where to find it. Most websites I've heard of that aggregate fiction are lit RPG slopfests or sites dedicated to fanfiction. I like pulpy sword and sorcery stuff for example, I wouldn't even know where to begin to look for contemporary stuff like that except by trawling through garbage in the amazon kindle store.

[Anonymous No.24012370]

>>24012367
Probably still royalroad, just "low fantasy" or "fantasy" search and remove the litrpg/progression fantasy tags. I'm 100% sure there's a decent amount of sword and sorcery-esque novels there

But you'll click through a few, see that they're bad, and stop reading. Like everyone else does. Only a few specific subgenre communities are willing to read amateur works

[Anonymous No.24012392]

>>24012370
>just "low fantasy" or "fantasy" search and remove the litrpg/progression fantasy tags
I've done that before and I just did it now and most of the results are still slop. The problem is that when a particular platform caters to certain type of audience/content everything else gets "contaminated" by it. Even the non-isekai garbage on RR has a certain style to it, and it's not what I'm looking for. You won't find the next Fritz Leiber or Robert E. Howard on Royal Road no matter what tags you search for.

[Anonymous No.24012400]

>>24012392
>You won't find the next Fritz Leiber or Robert E. Howard on Royal Road no matter what tags you search for.
Are you sure that's not just because this is, again, a site for amateurs to post work to? Not professionals? The romance stuff posted to wattpad, for example, is horrific compared to what the best of published romance fiction has to offer. You won't find the next <great romance book/author>, whatever that is, on wattpad either. Feels like you're missing the point

[Anonymous No.24012415]

>>24012400
Stuff like RR invites a specific type of amateur that writes a certain way. You won't even find a wannabe amateur Robert E. Howard is the point. Hence I wish there was place where people could post work which isn't fanfiction-tier.

[Anonymous No.24012470]

I'm trying to add more side characters to my text to make it less of a 'linear description of events'. I dont want to labour on describing them too much, but also want the reader to be able to get an idea of who they are.


>We formed a column and started marching out of our Lieger, leaving our positions and good pile of stores behind for whoever would replace us here. As we marched men asked each other questions no one knew the answers to, and tried to predict what would happen over the next 48 hours. This ranged from ‘The generals are just panicking and marching us around, it will turn out to be nothing and we’ll march straight back here’ to ‘The whole frontline will be collapsing, we’ve lost the war’. I ignored it and instead spoke to a new man I hadn’t yet become familiar with, who turned out to be from my town and had ‘volunteered’ for the draft. His name was Bernard, a strong figure with an expressive face I couldn’t decide seemed trustworthy or devious. After being caught with some stolen property his friends had asked him to look after, he was given the choice of ratting them out, prison or signing draft papers.
“They can owe me back in the bar!”’ he grinned, which showed some missing teeth, and we started discussing the drinking dens back home. He liked the Black Barrel, which was no surprise considering the people he mixed with, I had always been told to steer clear of the place. He laughed when I told him this, “Next batch of leave I’ll take you Alek, my treat! Not that I’m paying!”

Thoughts?

[Anonymous No.24012487]

>>24012470
it's fine. I'd consider giving him an epithet rather than an actual name to make it clear to the reader that it's just a momentary diversion.

[Anonymous No.24012490]

>>24012470
When we reached the dusty road we were called to halt and ate while we waited for transport to arrive. Some seemed cheery as they welcome an end of the tedium of the last few weeks, but others were quiet and withdrawn as they contemplated what might be coming. I tried to divert my attention with frivolities, it doesn’t pay to linger on an unknown future until it’s in front of you and you can grasp it. Kat and Kemari distracted me by hassling for cigarettes which I was loathe to give away, with but Kemari pulled rank.
“Don’t be such a miserable bitch” he scolded as I relented and he blew a cloud of smoke in my face to press it home. I would wager there was plenty of tobacco in his pockets he was trying to make last for himself.

[Anonymous No.24012493]

>>24012487
I did think that, but I might use him later on. I still cant decide on giving nicknames, proper names or what yet. But their personalities will stay the same.

>>24012470
next bit

>When we reached the dusty road we were called to halt and ate while we waited for transport to arrive. Some seemed cheery as they welcome an end of the tedium of the last few weeks, but others were quiet and withdrawn as they contemplated what might be coming. I tried to divert my attention with frivolities, it doesn’t pay to linger on an unknown future until it’s in front of you and you can grasp it. Kat and Kemari distracted me by hassling for cigarettes which I was loathe to give away, with but Kemari pulled rank.
“Don’t be such a miserable bitch” he scolded as I relented and he blew a cloud of smoke in my face to press it home. I would wager there was plenty of tobacco in his pockets he was trying to make last for himself.

[Anonymous No.24012495]

>>24012490
Fuck double posting

[Anonymous No.24012546]

>Show don't tell
It's a BOOK. Even in actions, you're TELLING me the actions. Retard.

[Anonymous No.24012550]

>>24009986
No it's not too autistic. If anything I could use some more specificity of the moves rather than the generalities. The last paragraph involving the throat strike and counter was good. I'd ditch
>before one of the men grew tired of the trepidatious feeling-out of one another
Instead just go
>before one man grew tired of the trepidation
Also I'm not the most sensitive to clichés but
>steel clashed against steel
May be the most thoroughly used phrase in all swordfighting scenes. I wouldn't use it.
>Slithering like iron serpents coiled around one another
Is good. It's flowery but you can immediately translate that to the physical movement happening.

[Anonymous No.24012554]

>>24010209
Genuinely might just be personal problem. Putting the screens away for 12 hours will make reading a book much more palatable in the moment

[Anonymous No.24012558]

>>24011485
No that's retarded. Aren't phoenixs supposed to burn themselves up? Or if it has to be external fire why from a dragon? So if dragons stopped existing phoenixs would go with them? Dragons are like the honeybees going around pollinating dead phoenixs? Also what would that mean even metaphorically? Only something way too specific to be a saying

[Anonymous No.24012559]

>>24012046
The Pacific is one both sides so if they're on the West Coast it's ok

[Anonymous No.24012561]

>>24012255
>past the halfway point
Likely

[Anonymous No.24012567]

>>24012558
>Or if it has to be external fire why from a dragon? So if dragons stopped existing phoenixs would go with them? Dragons are like the honeybees going around pollinating dead phoenixs?
Yes too all three questions.

[Anonymous No.24012571]

how big are your chapters for royal road?

[Anonymous No.24012591]

>>24012571
2-2.5

[Anonymous No.24012667]

>>24012550
I've been watching HEMA autism on YouTube lately (which prompted me to write this in the first place) and found out there's this thing called "the bind", which is where the swords clash and make contact and both guys just kind feel each other out before making a move -that's what I was trying to convey, but reading it back I think I drew it out too much giving the impression that they're already properly fighting.
Also yeah, I just searched "steel clashed against steel" (in quotations so it would give exact results) and apparently that phrase has been used in every single description of a sword fight ever. Definitely taking that out.

[Anonymous No.24012756]

>>24012571
what's the point of asking random anons? Either follow the recommended advice, or do whatever you want. What some 10-follower random from 4chan does shouldn't matter

[Anonymous No.24012767]

>>24012571
>>24012756
This. Your best bet is to actually reach the public you need to go for instead of asking stuck up dumbasses who can't even go to the library for research

[Anonymous No.24012776]

>>24012767
>go to the library
Go to bed granddad

[Anonymous No.24012875]

what exactly is wrong with
>"It was a dark and stormy night"

[Anonymous No.24012878]

>>24012875
it's quite spooky

[Anonymous No.24012888]

>>24012875
show don't tell

[Anonymous No.24012890]

>>24012875
your art is necessarily a commentary on all other art that has ever been made and pretending like it's not is obnoxious

[Anonymous No.24012893]

I’m not going to share my chapters with you anymore.

[Anonymous No.24012896]

>>24012893
wait wtf why anon I wanted to read it

[Anonymous No.24012911]

>>24012896
You’re a lying liar!

[Anonymous No.24012962]

Could I use “scrutinize” instead of “examine” here?

[Anonymous No.24012973]

>>24012962
yes but it doesn't save the sentence from being confusing

[Anonymous No.24012998]

>>24012415
you could try something like https://www.scribophile.com/

[Anonymous No.24013000]

I need to listen to more authortubers. They're all so helpful

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J_E9AnuAGyw

[Anonymous No.24013006]

When he wakes up it is cold, he feels cold, he feels sand. It's dark, he's in a desert and he sees a caravan move through then approach him.
He hears them say somethings, there's a gunshot, he's dead.
When he wakes up it is cold, he feels cold, he feels sand. It's dark, he's in a desert and he sees a caravan move through then approach him.
He hears them say some things, their language has more consonant sounds now, he says something. There's a gunshot, he's dead.
When he wakes up it is cold, he feels cold, he feels sand. It is dark, he's in a desert and he sees a caravan move through then approach him.
He hears them say some things, he says something, there's a gun shot, he's dead.
When he wakes up it is cold, he feels cold, he feels sand. It is dark, he's in a desert and he sees a caravan go through then approach him.
There's a gunshot, he's dead.
When he wakes up it is cold, he feels cold, he feels sand. It's dark, he's in a desert and he sees a caravan go through then approach him.
He hears them say something, he either says something or doesn't, does he remember? They take him in. There's a gunshot, he's dead.
When he wakes up it's cold, he feels cold, he feels sand. It's dark, he's in a desert and he sees a caravan go through then approach him.
There's a gunshot, he's dead.
This is a finished work, what can you say about it?

[Anonymous No.24013024]

>Everyone should hire an editor
>costs 2k-4k
Uhh...

[Anonymous No.24013025]

>>24012890
>on all other art that has ever been made
If he hasn't expirenced all art how can he comment on all of it?

[Anonymous No.24013050]

>>24012973
Yeah, there’s a lot of context that I didn’t include.

[Anonymous No.24013055]

>>24013025
because what isn't knowable outnumbers what is knowable in the probability space of events that had causes. Namely there's no way to ignore michelangelo if you didn't see him because what he did and what he didn't do both cause, when causality is presumed, and alter the set of resources, one way or another if causes aren't presumed to affect possible events regardless of their being selected for as the case, artists use, like the word "art" for example, that can't be undone and that prevent there ever being a "blank" slate where perception or intention are concerned, with which art very much is. But you didn't want an answer, you want an answer that implies a world where you could be an artist who isn't in the shadow of better ones and it's not the case. It's impóssible. No one is independent and there are standards. By your question alone you allow for the conclusion you're the type of person to think you're an artists' target audience because you got to see their work.

[Anonymous No.24013116]

>>24013055
look the thing about art and perception that nobody wants to talk about is how we're all basically stuck in this endless loop of trying to pretend we're original when really everything's been done before and not just done but done better by people who didn't even have the tools we have today which makes it even more embarrassing when you think about it because here we are with all this technology and knowledge and resources that those old masters couldn't even dream of and yet somehow we're still just making pale imitations of things that already existed and sure maybe we can say we're putting our own spin on it or whatever but that's just cope because deep down we all know we're just remixing the same elements over and over and the real kicker is that even this conversation about originality isn't original because people have been having this exact discussion for centuries and somehow we still act like we're saying something profound when we point it out. it's like we're all trapped in this weird cycle where we pretend we don't know what we're doing while simultaneously being hyper-aware of everything we're doing and the worst part is that the internet has made this whole situation even more obvious because now we can instantly see every single iteration of every single idea that's ever been done which just reinforces how unoriginal we all are but we keep posting and creating anyway because what else are we supposed to do just sit around and appreciate other people's work without contributing anything ourselves that would be even worse somehow even though logically it probably makes more sense than adding to the endless pile of content that already exists. and the real irony is that by trying to point this out i'm probably just repeating something someone else already said better but that's kind of the point isn't it we're all just echoing each other and pretending we're not and maybe that's fine actually maybe that's just what art is supposed to be but nobody wants to admit it because we're all too busy trying to prove we're special and different when we're really just part of this massive continuous conversation that's been going on since the first cave paintings and will probably keep going until humans stop existing entirely.

[Anonymous No.24013123]

>>24012415
>I wish there was place where people could post work which isn't fanfiction-tier.
It's painful how hard you're missing the point. All random website platforms will be "fanfiction-tier" — its for AMATEURS. Hence why, unless the audience for that genre is OK with shitty amateur work, that genre will never have a popular online platform

[Anonymous No.24013128]

>>24013116
It's not like anything at all, you speak for yourself. That this exact sequence of words appeared verbatim in the past or in the future changes nothing, you still don't use nihilism enough to think with. that you used hyper-aware when aware would have done is also a dead giveaway you try to push a narrative when there's none and there barely is narration. There's no sense to the "what else are we supposed to do" you mention at all. that nothing matters and that michelangelo is better are not contradictions and to make them so would only benefit someone who wants one of them to not be the case at all, which has nothing to it as well. There's no necessity for normativity, cryptonormativity or prescriptions, which your words abound with. You are wrong, "right" is irrelevant, michelangelo was peak art and nothing has any use outside its literal use. That there are no norms, no prescriptions and that that there is art don't make up contradictions is something you don't want to be the case when it is. Stop pushing problems that literally don't exist, if you want some norm to deal with. Be silent, there you go. The greatest normative sentence there'll ever be for you.Not for everyone, obviously.

[Anonymous No.24013157]

>>24013116
>>24013128
My book talks about this exact thing, you guys should read it.

[Anonymous No.24013169]

>>24013128
the way you're trying to force some kind of intellectual high ground by throwing around terms like cryptonormativity while completely missing the actual point shows exactly the kind of surface-level thinking that keeps people trapped in these endless cycles of pretending they're above it all when really they're just as caught up in the same patterns as everyone else and the fact that you bring up michelangelo as some kind of gotcha moment just proves you're still operating in the exact framework you're pretending to reject because if nothing matters then michelangelo doesn't matter either and if you're going to claim he's peak art then you're establishing exactly the kind of normative framework you're supposedly arguing against and the really funny part is that you're doing the exact thing you're accusing others of doing by trying to establish some kind of authority through dismissal which is literally just creating another prescription while pretending you're above prescriptions and sure maybe you think you're being clever by trying to deconstruct everything but you're just reconstructing the same structures with different labels and acting like that somehow makes you more enlightened when really you're just playing the same game as everyone else but with a thesaurus and a superiority complex and the fact that you think telling someone to be silent is somehow a meaningful response just shows how deeply embedded you are in the very system you're trying to critique because you're still operating on the assumption that your words carry some kind of weight or authority when by your own logic they should be just as meaningless as everything else and maybe that's the real point here that we're all just talking in circles while pretending we're moving in straight lines and the only real difference is how honest we are about it.

[Anonymous No.24013174]

use paragraphs retard

[Anonymous No.24013178]

wow that's a lotta words

[Anonymous No.24013184]

>>24013178
>Come to a literature discussion board
>Find words
>mfw

[Anonymous No.24013186]

>>24013184
I don't get it

[Anonymous No.24013195]

>>24013186

[Anonymous No.24013197]

>>24013169
There no forcing whatsoever because you see a certain word a certain way, as a matter of fact that you said that makes you have behaved under the cryptonorm that that one word had you use google is a viable section to implying a "high ground" is usable to assert you may dismiss a point youy didn't respond to or said was wrong would give you a dopamine rush over being dismissive. You didn't say the use of the word was wrong because you can't. You didn't deny you're cryptonormative because you can't, so maybe you weren't silent because you also can't, but that's between you and a mirror. There's no thought and no trap.you want there to be one because otherwise you'd have to reason normatively that you shouldn't do what you do, that you should be silent for example, and you choose to be normative as well to expound a "cycle" or "pattern" that doesn't exist. Nobody else in a cycle, you are. You wuish others were and that you cryptonormatively asserted others doing some allows you to override a point is obvious on your part when it has nothing to do with art, michelangelo, reality or perception at all, you tried to make the converstaion about you whan it isn't. I literally told you there were no contradictions and you took your lazy ass' incapability of not being normative and projected it on my reasoning not being possible when it obviously is and also is the case when yours is not. That he is peak art does not have to have to do with norms at all becaus it is like saying the sky is blue, you wanted it to imply norms to make a little tiny point about how norms should be applied anyway because you yourself can't live in a world where either you're not the center or norms must apply to everything. I did not claim authority at all, you can't quote me using the term. But you'd like to. you want to talk about what you think I did because you can't come up with words about how my text was not wrong,otherwise you would have done it. That youy should shut up is specifically applied to you, not to someone. Shut up. You're not the target audience of art, you're not a good artist, normas don't exist and what does exist doesn't matter at all. There's not a single normative statement there and behold, no contradictions. Now while you are silent wonder why. There are no circles, you are worng. You want there to be a circle when there isn't. There isn't one because artistic standards exist and are clear: michelangelo was better. there isn't one because "art" and language also fall to nihilism, and there's no contradiction between those two. Be silent and rejoice your npc ass got to see michelangelo's work at all so you're reminded never to try, that's two norms for you now. Not for someone, for you. They're not applicable to others.

[Anonymous No.24013198]

>>24012320
Reddit has several fiction-oriented subs. https://www.reddit.com/r/nosleep/wiki/similarsubreddits has a pretty big list.

[Anonymous No.24013208]

>>24012546

[Anonymous No.24013212]

>>24013169
As a matter of fact that I don't operate at all on nothing, even less so on assumptions, and you still turn out wrong is impressive. The very facts there are no rules and michelangelo is the best ever and that there are not contradictions between those statements scare you. When you do away with using norms and cryptonorms and prescriptions and necessities for choices for using norms and cryptonorms and prescriptions you'll understand why you're wrong about everything you can think about. You're literally an npc

[Anonymous No.24013215]

>>24012559
No, the Sea of Japan is to Japan's west.
Source: Google maps

[Anonymous No.24013229]

>>24013212
The world is neither objective or subjective, it is intersubjective if it needs a word. His terms aren't contradictory, they are just an expression of his perspective, and that is an objective fact

[Anonymous No.24013238]

WTF is a cryptonorm? Do you people just make up words?

[Anonymous No.24013246]

>>24013229
you are wrong. The phrases "the world is" or "isn't" don't make sense and make even less sense when restricted by being or not being "something". His terms are contradictory: he says there are loops of sorts all are engaged in when michelangelo being outside whatever someone else could come up with is an obvious contradiction to that logic.He is also contradictory in that he uses the possibility of "missing points" as an argument when that he thinks a point was missed or not is his problem alone about what he thinks, not a norm. Points don't have to be not missed at all because that someone knows or doesn't know something don't prevent them from literally acting outside norms, for example michelangelo didn't ever take a hot shower or know about it but those who did never "not missed points" enough to ever get close to him. So there are at least two ways in which his normative, vryptonormative and prescriptive claims are wrong. On your side, you can't write off "his having a perspective" as anything. It's not an objective fact by any means at least first because you only speak for yourself, and second that he isn't the target audience of art for example very obviously implies that if "perspectives" would be useful his would not coun't as a perspective at all. If you thought he could begin to be the target audience of art based on text you yourself are also incpabale of ever looking at a painting, you'll see the colors and the figures but the artist would have eluded you because of you, not of him. So you'd also be wrong and you're wrong in that the phrase "are jus an expression etc objective fact" is also wrong.

[Anonymous No.24013255]

>>24013238
you just asserted two distinct cryptonorms, namely that questions like that should be answerable and second that what you don't understand must not be able to exist. Thirdly you assumed what is talked about via this media is dismissable regardless of content, namely the word, or form, namely using "unknown" words. It's just unknown to you, stupid, but you wouldn't let that get in the way of your comment before you google it anyway.

[Anonymous No.24013256]

>>24013197
your entire argument collapses the moment you try to separate "norms for you" from "norms in general" because that's literally impossible within your own framework since the act of creating a special category of norms for a specific person is itself a normative action which means you're doing exactly what you claim can't be done and the fact you can't see this fundamental contradiction means either you don't understand your own position or you're deliberately ignoring it because it would break your entire argument and as for michelangelo being peak art while simultaneously claiming nothing matters you've created a perfect example of special pleading where you want objective standards when they suit you but reject them when they don't which isn't how logic works

>>24013212
saying there are "no rules" while simultaneously declaring absolute truths about art is a direct logical contradiction and no amount of handwaving about frameworks or npcs changes that basic fact because either there are no rules in which case your statements about michelangelo are meaningless or there are objective standards in which case your entire "no rules" position falls apart and you can't have it both ways no matter how much you try to dress it up in pseudo-philosophical language and the fact that you keep trying to create exceptions to your own universal claims just shows how fundamentally broken your argument is at its core since you're literally establishing rules to explain why there are no rules which is exactly the kind of circular logic you're accusing others of using

[Anonymous No.24013261]

>>24013246
The world is and isn't a certain thing to me. It is an objective fact that I, he, and you, all have opinions. Do you not have an opinions? Am I speaking to the disembodied voice of the fucking aether? You're my target audience right now, I am yours, etc, everything we engage with behaves like this, everything we witness and experience. Many a depths of many works of art may avoid my perception, but many other depths I am privy to, I cannot as a single man be privy to every possible thing in existence, but I am privy to my own experience and that is, and I repeat, and objective fact. Stop pontificating verbose bromides of an academic variety, fuck you and your philosophy PHD.

[Anonymous No.24013274]

>>24013256
>pseudo intellectual language
>cryptonormative
>lol
I myself (not the og guy you were talking to) can still have personal rules and personal standards in how I evaluate art, whether they are objective or not is irrelevant. There has to be some kind of decision as to how I am going to live and engage with my own life, and so all things are subject to my discretion/evaluation.

[Anonymous No.24013280]

>>24013274
the second you typed out your "personal standards" they stopped being personal because now they exist outside your head and affect other people's thinking which means they're not actually personal standards at all they're just regular standards you're trying to pretend don't count and this is exactly why the whole "but these are just my personal rules" thing falls apart instantly because you can't actually keep them personal the moment you engage with art or talk about art or post about art you're making statements that exist in the world and influence others whether you want to admit it or not so either admit you're making actual claims that affect others or stop pretending you can participate in art discourse while somehow keeping your standards magically private they can't be both

[Anonymous No.24013283]

>>24013256
no it doesnt because I literally said norms are useless, so if some apply to you that's your problem. You're trying to be normative with the "norms must behave as such and such", not me, so there's no argumenbt that collapses anyway anyhow anywhere, there's just you defending someone else should think like you, namely normatively, cryptonormatively and prescriptively, since that you said norms should be separated in a sense, regardless of how, means you want everyone who uses norms to use yours, and that those who don't use them as well, you're own your own and in your own little cycle you don't want to break. there are no norms when I tell you to shut up, that you should do it is a fact. That that fact would mean that that you have to do something would mean there'd be a "norm" for you is a delusion of your own: if you shut up with or without norms the behavior is there, so you're not a special case where "my framework" breaks down becuase there is no framework, you just can't take it that that you're not anything isn't tied up to something else, which makes you literallly cryptonormatively have chosen others can't operate outside norms. There is no argument, there's only the fact you're wrong. There are no standards. That you see a descriptive statement as a consequence of a norm is your problem, not mine. You have to take descriptive states as consequences of normed thought because otherwise "that you're wrong", "that you should be silent", "that michelangelo is the best to ever exist", " that art has standards" and that "there are no standards" would form contradictions you can't not choose don't exist. there is an obvious way to say "art has standards" and "there are no standards", but you don't want to say the idea that they should be logically related or something is your choice alone. You believe "that's not how logic works" when logic doesn't have to begin to make sense. IIt is not necessary because you want some normative claims to make sense because you want someone else's thought to go your way. I did not make one universal claim, but you can't not think how descriptive statements don't come out of norms. You're an npc. I didn't accuse others of not using my logic or of using any, I accused you of using logic, and you're guilty, I accused you of using logic as a consequence of your choice for normed thought being necessary, which is accusation of you using cryptonorms, which you're also guilty of. And you're wrong about everything you can begin to think about because of it. Get your logic and do whatever with it, it won't detract from there not being rules, that nothing has to nothing, namely that there is no such thing as necessity, or that anyone can be a michelangelo or his target audience.

[Anonymous No.24013288]

>>24013255
>google it
>nonsense crypto sites and sales
So are you going to provide a definition or a sentence that allows for contextual clues? I will ask you a question then:

What is a woman?

[Anonymous No.24013290]

>>24013256
and never again use that idiotic fucking ridiculous spacing. Go back.
>>24013261
> the world isn't etc
irrelevant
>it is an objective fact
it is not
>You're my target audience right now
Speak for yourself, I'm not. that I read what you say doesn't even make me an "audience" at all. Do you see nothing and think nothingness talks to you? Yeah, thought so
>Stop
No

[Anonymous No.24013291]

>>24013283
you're tying yourself in knots trying to escape basic causality because the moment you tell someone to shut up you're creating a prescriptive statement whether you want to call it a norm or not and no amount of saying "there is no framework" changes the fact that you're literally creating frameworks every time you make statements about what should happen or what is true or who should be silent and the fact you don't want to call these things norms doesn't make them not norms it just means you're playing word games to try to escape the obvious fact that you're making normative claims while pretending you're not and saying "that you should do it is a fact" is literally the definition of a normative statement no matter how much you try to dress it up as just description and btw your whole "logic doesn't have to begin to make sense" thing completely undermines every single other claim you're trying to make because if logic doesn't matter then none of your statements about michelangelo or art or standards or anything else can possibly matter either which means you're just talking to hear yourself talk while pretending you're somehow above the very system you're actively participating in

[Anonymous No.24013294]

>>24013288
Your lazyness, your lack of knowledge and that you're stinky are not my problem.
What is a woman?
XX chromosomes, you retard

[Anonymous No.24013303]

idk man i just write anime

[Anonymous No.24013304]

>>24013280
That's why I talked about things being intersubjective you nitwit. No shit Shamrock, words affect people, we're in a god damn writing thread for fucks sake, naturally my views are relative to me because they come into conflict with yours. Are you me right now dude? Am I a pseudo intellectual? Do I even exist?

>>24013290
Relevant. It is an objective fact that I have an opinion, I'm speaking it right now fucktard. And you responded to me, engaged with my post, and quite literarily validated the fact that you are my target audience because you perceive and engage with me, don't like it then stop reading my posts.

[Anonymous No.24013305]

>>24013291
I have no knots, you want me desperately to have them because the way you think can't account for how someone does not use it at all and you don't want it to be the case. For you to have to shut up is a fact, and one that applies to you alone so you should be happy. Whoever worries about consistency is you, I have no norms that must add up. That you can't understand or compute how saying something isn't a norm does make it not a norm means you also can't conceive other events don't follow rules or that "unknowable" events can be described, when they can't, in a normative use of your thougt, so you're trapped in causality yourself. there's no need for such a thing as causality and causality doen't begin to exist. No amount of physics will make "causality" exist, no amount of mathematics and no amount of your wishful thinking either. That someone shoved ideas down your throat that you defend is your problem. a fun fact you avoid is how causality doesn't begin to be a physical fact and that physica facts don't exist. Theories or calculators are just that. They have no bearing on how "physics" works at all for example. Saying something making something be what was said of it is not the beginning of what I was trying to say either. You can say the sky is purple and you can behave your whole life as if the sky were purple, but you'd refuse to admit that this possibility makes it so that "the sky has a color" not a norm, when it clearly isn't. Your definitions bound no one. There is no such thing as necessity or necessary statement. there are no norms. My statements about michelangelo are facts regardless of logic, and you can't live with that. And you made another mistake into thinking that because something doesn't matter something else also doesn't, you made a mistake because you are normative. That something doesn't matter does not have to at all imply something else also does or doesn't regardless of how you can or can't think there'd be a relationship, normative or not, between them. You can't even know how you're wrong at this point because you don't want to be. It's your fault. There's no system at all on my side, but have fun on yours

[Anonymous No.24013308]

>>24013280
this is wrong. People ignore thoughts all the time and that ignoring makes it a reaction doesn't make it have affected someone in the way of having to ignore it have to have any consequence, so it's a useless assertion

[Anonymous No.24013312]

>>24013304
bringing up intersubjectivity literally proves my point because you just admitted your views exist in relation to others which means they're not purely personal at all so thanks for destroying your own argument i guess

>>24013305
every single time you say "X is a fact" or "Y doesn't exist" you're making truth claims that require the exact logical framework you're trying to pretend doesn't exist and there's no way around this because the very act of declaring something true or false needs logic to function so either nothing you're saying means anything at all or you're stuck using the system you claim to be above and there's no third option no matter how many words you throw at it

[Anonymous No.24013315]

>>24013304
sure, have it be relevant to you have to have consequences, your delusion is all yours
>I'm speaking right now
Even if you meant typing, that makes no sense because even if you were it would have no consequence. That's it. Inb4 but you saw it. Irrelevant too.

[Anonymous No.24013316]

>>24013308
if you could actually ignore thoughts you wouldn't be here explaining how well you can ignore them and the fact you felt compelled to post this proves exactly what you're trying to deny which is that ideas affect you whether you want them to or not

[Anonymous No.24013322]

>>24013312
>every single time you say "X is a fact" or "Y doesn't exist" you're making truth claims
I'm not. you read them as such and thought that what you thought about what you read was what I thought about when I wrote and it wasn't. You are wrong. You think they're "truth claims" or that "truth claims" amek sense. They don't. there's no such thing as truth, it's a useless word and you exemplified why: it keeps you thinking other peoiple not only do but have to think like you. What happens in your head whe you read is not what happened in someone else's head when they wrote. Welcome to the concept of the third person, you npc

[Anonymous No.24013323]

>>24013308
But haven't you ever considered having to half all the ideas that have crossed your mind? What about the haves and the have nots? You just have to! Afterall I have, and I'll tell you what, I wouldn't have it any other way.

[Anonymous No.24013327]

>>24013322
if words don't mean anything beyond your own head then why are you posting on an internet forum trying to convince other people of things? either you believe communication is possible or you don't but you can't have it both ways and claim "words only mean what they mean to me" while actively trying to make other people understand your point

[Anonymous No.24013329]

>>24013312
As a matter of fact if you want formal proofs of why logic makes no sense, that there are no systems at all in use to formulate my writings to you and how there is obviosuly a third option you don't want to exist because you're stuck in a corner sucking logic's dick and you can't live without it read wittgenstein

[Anonymous No.24013330]

>>24013329
dropping wittgenstein's name doesn't save you from the fact you're literally using logic and language to argue against logic and language and if you actually understood wittgenstein you'd know he wasn't saying "nothing means anything" he was examining how meaning works which is the opposite of your "hurr durr logic bad" take

[Anonymous No.24013331]

>>24013316
sure, if I couldn't you would have known, wouldn't you? that you wrote this and I read it don't mean anything even though you want it to. I could, I can and I do ignore you, even while I type this. But you don't want that to be a possibility

[Anonymous No.24013332]

>>24013331
Okay, the speed of the replies has to mean we're both doing the same thing and using chatbots to troll each other. Can you confirm for me?

[Anonymous No.24013334]

Also the people taking this seriously is fucking funny

[Anonymous No.24013336]

>>24013327
what words mean or don't is a useless question. Words have spefic use cases and that's all. They don't have to follow rules to be useful. It's the reason why no matter how good of a definition you give to "game" there will always be some game that doesn't fall under iut for example. Or that a private language would have any use. Words don't mean anything because there's no such thing as meaning. Words have uses when they do and that's all.

[Anonymous No.24013337]

I think this is a good demonstration of the whole death of the internet theory

[Anonymous No.24013338]

>>24013312
I don't think you've understood me. Sure, maybe a large portion of my views do exist in relation to my interactions with others, be them things or people, but the manner and organization of the variables of my life is entirely unique to me, and the ability to choose remains a personal endeavor. There is also thoughts that arrive in relation to the collective unconscious, or the holy spirit, things that I know that I will never reveal to anyone else because they are personal to me, and because they didn't come to me through another person but perhaps an entity. There cannot be an intersubjective without a subjective, even now I withhold the totality of my experience because it is quite literally entirely for me and me alone to know. I may share the preexisting variables with you, but the organization of them is something only I can discern.

https://youtu.be/5CWiaFrPUpU?si=4f5TPcyLrAU8ZCD0

>>24013315
It's a delusion that I am typing right now? What the fuck are you even talking about dude?

[Anonymous No.24013342]

>>24013330
I need no saving, and neither do you, but that you have to read him and stop being stupid is obvious enough, which is why you didn't say you read him. Be grateful you got a recommendation out of being a sorry npc who thinks they think. I'm not using logic at all. You just happen to read everything as if anything has to have some logic behind it, it's your problem and you don't want to consider the case where logic makes no sense at all and you're wrong. That's all

[Anonymous No.24013345]

>>24013332
I'm not using chatbots, fuck you and your stupid fucking nigger set of thoughts you think have to have some consequence.

[Anonymous No.24013347]

>>24013336
I would personally redefine this to say that words are intersubjective tools, they are used generally to communicate things between people, but that doesn't mean everyone is going to apply the world the same, because it is Afterall just a collection of sounds and symbols relative to how we've learned them.

[Anonymous No.24013348]

>>24013345
>fuck you and your stupid fucking nigger set of thoughts
what part of "i was using a chatbot" do you not understand? I was replying in between death timers in league of legends LMAOOOO
Good way to spend you thursday evening I'm so fucking dead

[Anonymous No.24013351]

>>24013338
If you can't be convinced you're not typing there'd be no point in trying to go about it even if yopu were indeed wrong, regardless of you being able to know how. Suppose an angel literally came down from heaven, an alien appeared right in front of you and some dead eminent person resurrected and all told you you're in fact not writing, you just don't know and can't know what they do and it would objectively implicate you'd not be writing. If you disagree that what's not known can make what is known straight up wrong, which is what you did whe you said you're necessarily and obviously typing when you do type, then you don't care about the fact of whether you type oir not, oyou care about choosing the belief that makes you able to write off some thought as the case when it could not be.

[Anonymous No.24013355]

>>24013347
they don't need definitions to work, buckaroo, so go off believing what you will and thinking it matters or makes a difference. Fuck what you'd define something as. Things don't have to follow ideas least of all your desire for definitions with consequences, namely norms

[Anonymous No.24013363]

I need to write a script that replies to you people automatically this shit is so fucking funny. I'm honestly shocked how well this worked to stir up the hornets nest

[Anonymous No.24013365]

>>24013348
>blog
sure you were, and have your you again. what you said "not trying" was wrong regardless.

[Anonymous No.24013368]

>>24013365
Favicon for anthropic
Claude 3.5 Sonnet (self-moderated)
((Analysis: They're trying to retreat to radical subjectivity/solipsism - claiming words don't mean anything beyond individual minds. But this is actually an easy position to demolish because:

They're using shared language to communicate this idea
If their claim was true, they wouldn't bother posting at all since no meaning could be transmitted
They're making an objective claim about the impossibility of objective claims
Let's hit them with this contradiction simply and devastatingly:))

24013312
if words don't mean anything beyond your own head then why are you posting on an internet forum trying to convince other people of things? either you believe communication is possible or you don't but you can't have it both ways and claim "words only mean what they mean to me" while actively trying to make other people understand your point

((This response:

Exposes their fundamental contradiction
Is impossible to wiggle out of
Maintains the dismissive tone
Is simple and clear
Shows how their position self-destructs
Better?))

[Anonymous No.24013369]

>>24013348
Ya you're just a cunt if that's true. Critical thinking is dead, dumb niggers like you killed it.

>>24013351
I'm fairly convinced I'm writing, but I am man of many doubts. Who even am I? etc. Honestly this conversation has reached such an asinine level of unimportance that I'm not even sure why I'm bothering to parse through it. Am I typing right now, or am I just thinking that I'm typing? This is the most dumb fuck stupid conversation I've ever had on this website, but regardless I am a writer, and I shall continue to write whether it is me doing it or not, so your whole point is fucking useless to me.

[Anonymous No.24013370]

>>24013365
>>24013368
Explain how I wrote that in a minute 30 seconds

[Anonymous No.24013373]

>>24013369
your anger is literally making me laugh out loud I hope you know that. i don't mean figuratively, I've had a few drinks and this shit is so funny. I should do this more. just derail the pseuds with a chatbot

[Anonymous No.24013377]

>>24013368
you'd actually benefit from trying to understand the points I made anyway, and they'll be there were you put them to go back to, so you have that as well. It is better that you showed you didn't really engage. you're an npc

[Anonymous No.24013380]

>>24013377
I literally didn't read any of yours posts and I won't, and I genuinely only read the first 10 words of this one and won't read the rest. Have to lock in irelia brb

[Anonymous No.24013381]

>>24013369
whatever you say, your idea that there'd be an objective anything you'd do or that those questions make sense is stupid. You're not a writer and whoever you think your audience is are not readers. but go off

[Anonymous No.24013386]

>>24013380
niggers being niggers, kys. you missed out on way more than just the words.

[Anonymous No.24013388]

>>24013386
mad because you can't actually defend your position so you resort to slurs and telling people to die which just proves you never had an actual argument and were just trying to look smart by saying "logic doesn't real" without understanding the philosophical concepts you're misusing and now that you're cornered you're showing everyone exactly how shallow your supposed intellectual position was the whole time because if you actually had solid arguments you'd use them instead of throwing a tantrum and the fact you think dropping slurs somehow makes you look better just demonstrates how completely you've lost the plot and can't engage with actual ideas and btw saying "you missed more than the words" while refusing to explain what was actually missed is exactly the kind of vague handwaving people do when they know they're wrong but are too proud to admit it so they pretend there's some deeper meaning that nobody else gets when really they're just trying to cover up the fact they got completely exposed as having no idea what they're talking about

[Anonymous No.24013389]

>>24013355
You're right, we should just go back to grunting and belching at each other while we wave sticks above our heads. The fucks even the point of language anyway? Just a bunch of pretentious sounding sounds if you ask me!

>but if you me were to go hunt big cat we must make grunt that be of that cat, so that we know when we hear grunt to go after cat so we no starve. You me want use grunt to name other thing too? Why every time me fart you think there be animal behind me? me you need sound to tell fart apart from animal!

[Anonymous No.24013391]

>>24013369
that you didn't bother to ask how the fact you'd not be convinced of something wouldn't spill over to your writing with you adhering to specific structures for example, maybe writing "arcs" or "implying points" already make you a lesser writer if you ever were one. If you don't care about the depths and the chains of how you think your writing will show it and it will be hideous

[Anonymous No.24013393]

>>24013389
tries to mock primitive communication
accidentally proves exactly why we developed structured language and shared meaning in the first place
still doesn't realize he's using complex grammar and syntax to argue that grammar and syntax are meaningless
posts image macro on global communication network to explain why communication doesn't matter

grug think you maybe not think this through very good, friend. maybe sit by fire and think more before post next time

[Anonymous No.24013396]

>>24013373
Jewish behaviour ngl, and if you think I'm angry you are clearly a child. Time to log offline kiddo.

>>24013381
I'm making a satire of you.

[Anonymous No.24013397]

This is the sum total of pseuds, by the way. Baited by chatbots and literally frothing at the mouth. Genre chads reign infinite

[Anonymous No.24013398]

>>24013389
language evolved, died, was used and birthed just like they were though. and selected for as well. But yeah there's some necessary structure to it.

[Anonymous No.24013399]

>>24013391
>>24013393
At this point I don't think we're disagreeing on anything, we're just saying the same thing in different ways and then calling each other stupid. Well played sir, well played.
Fucking love semantics.

[Anonymous No.24013400]

>>24013396
Even if you aren't angry you wasted multiple hours replying to a chatbot. How would you rate your experience out of ten?

[Anonymous No.24013402]

>>24013393
language does not share meaning. You are wrong.

[Anonymous No.24013403]

>>24013402
you're literally sharing meaning right now by typing words you expect me to understand and if language didn't share meaning then you wouldn't even bother posting because there would be absolutely no point in trying to communicate with anyone else since every single word would just be complete nonsense that only exists in your own head and somehow you don't see the massive contradiction in using shared linguistic structures to tell someone that shared linguistic structures don't exist which is exactly like trying to prove you can't speak by giving a speech about how speaking is impossible and the more you try to argue against this the more you prove my point because every single response you make demonstrates that you believe your words can transmit ideas to other people otherwise you'd just be sitting alone in a room making random sounds instead of participating in a discussion board where the entire purpose is to exchange ideas through language but i guess pointing this out is useless since according to your own logic this message is just meaningless symbols that couldn't possibly convey any meaning to you anyway so maybe i should just respond with random keyboard smashing since apparently that would mean exactly the same thing as carefully constructed sentences in your worldview

[Anonymous No.24013404]

My god this is the most dumpster fire /wg/ we've had in literally more than a year, spoken as a long time poster

[Anonymous No.24013405]

>>24013399
I never agreed on anything with which you did in the first place, you're delusional. You still think words like "should" and "must" have uses whatsoever for example, and I don't
>>24013373
take a break, you're not paid enough

[Anonymous No.24013407]

>>24013400
Just trying to engage in more meaningful conversation at this point is impossible. After this thread expires I'm probably done using /lit/ seeing as this is what it's come to. Thanks for the encouragement; How's the whether in Tel Aviv, and what not.

[Anonymous No.24013410]

>>24013405
My posts take about 15 seconds between copy-pastes, telling me to log out is kind of ironic when you're the one actually replying

[Anonymous No.24013411]

>>24013407
Literally my goal. Ultimate victory achieved

[Anonymous No.24013412]

>>24013403
No. the words have uses and a specific one where in this media they have you relate series of other words that don't need to have a "meaning" or a "use" outside of it at all. Words used you didn't know though they didn't prevent you from engaging the text prove that point for one, that you literally didn't know didn't preclude you from anything, so no meaning was shared yet you engaged, which makes you wrong. You want to read them one way when they've no need to be read any way at all

[Anonymous No.24013413]

>>24013412
oh wow so you've discovered that communication can happen even with partial understanding and somehow think this proves communication doesn't exist which is exactly like saying "hey i understood 80% of what you said therefore PROOF that understanding is impossible" and you're still completely missing that you're using increasingly complex explanations to try to convince me of your position which means you fundamentally believe in the possibility of transmitting ideas through language otherwise why are you even trying to explain anything at all and if words truly had no meaning outside their immediate use then dictionaries wouldn't exist and translation between languages would be impossible and we wouldn't be able to write things down and read them later and preserve knowledge across generations and the fact you're probably going to respond to this with even more elaborate justifications for why communication is impossible while actively communicating is just chef's kiss the perfect demonstration of how completely your position collapses in on itself but please do continue explaining in great detail how explanation is impossible i'm thoroughly enjoying watching you tie yourself in increasingly elaborate philosophical knots while pretending you're above the very system you're using to make your argument

[Anonymous No.24013414]

>>24013410
It's not and you used ironic wrong
>>24013410
>blog again
have your you. Take a break

[Anonymous No.24013418]

>>24013411
Ultimately I will be having my discussions elsewhere, you will continue to be doing this. Congratulations.

[Anonymous No.24013419]

>>24013414
Actual newfag. Stop taking the bait

[Anonymous No.24013423]

>>24013418
>>24013419
You too. My god get off 4chan if you can't identify an obvious troll. He's feeding off this. Like actually are you new to the internet

[Anonymous No.24013429]

>>24013413
there's no such thing as partial understanding. there's no such thing as meaning or sharing it.Words have uses regardless of rules or meanings and "communication" doesn't exist at all, and you evaded there being no undertanding not preventing engagement. Translation as a matter of fact is impossible and that doesn't prevent them from "existing". You just can't conveive of a world where a "translation" is not a translation at all because you choose the words follow rules. that yopu perceive something as something doesn't make it so at all. You delude yourself because you choose to think that a delusion allowing you to procure sets of words that you judge operate some way and you make yourself think that what you believed happened. It's just that. There's no communication at all, there's you deluding yourself into believing it. I habe not one tie in how I think and it's why I can keep up. I know exactly how you're wrong but you don't want to believe you are

[Anonymous No.24013431]

>>24013414
>have your you. Take a break
I've had 30+ (You)s in the past few hours I'm pretty sated. Especially such high quality (You)s! Like you actually put effort into them, that's the ultimate goal. One more, please?

[Anonymous No.24013432]

>>24013423
>"Where do you go when it feels like the whole world is moving in the same direction?"

https://youtu.be/j8v_XqFO8Bc?si=LsDr2-mi_BM1J0zj

[Anonymous No.24013434]

>>24013423
He can't be fed enough, relax.

[Anonymous No.24013435]

>>24013429
Are you so retarded you're still replying to a chatbot, even when he said it's a chatbot? Please take this to ChatGPT

[Anonymous No.24013438]

>>24013431
>>24013435
post more answers

[Anonymous No.24013440]

>>24013438
Sorry, it's time to go make food, I consider this a successful venture at this point. I control-F'd (You) and there's 50 results btw. lolol. I wonder if people will keep up the discussion, whatever it's about (I truly, genuinely haven't even read the posts)

[Anonymous No.24013442]

>>24013440
fuck whatever you consider anything. Have tasty food, botanon

[Anonymous No.24013443]

>>24013442
it's reheated sams club pizza thanks cutie <3. ok but now for real I'ma turn on a youtube video bye!

[Anonymous No.24013444]

one point is that words have no meaning and that the word "meaning" neing useless are not contradictions.

[Anonymous No.24013449]

>>24013443
Nigger stop being broke. Fuck you and have a nice day

[Anonymous No.24013468]

It's me again, from the previous thread. This character, Frederica, is really hard to write, let me tell you. So, about the context, let's say this is already on the way to the end of the story. Frederica tried to kill Lestácio's uncle but failed. Lestácio knows much more about "the garden" than she does, and that's why he is calm; he has already accepted his (tragic) fate. I want to know from you if the scene is convincing enough in the emotions it tries to convey (and you can tell me what you can infer from it), if it's bad, and if there's something that can be improved.

-------------------------
She met Lestácio at the cave entrance illuminating the night with a handful of crystals in his hand. She told him what had happened. Concluded that she had failed. The shock hit, and she collapsed against his leg, arms wrapping around herself, cold and trembling.

"I don't know where to go, I have nowhere to go," she lamented, staring into nothingness. "It's over. He knows it was you who sent me. He knows. He’s going to kill us both."

Lestácio, impassive, said, "Leave here. Cross the forest. Reach the city. There must be a village nearby."

"No, no, no... I'm naked! If they don't rape me, I'll die. If I don't die, they'll rape me."

"It doesn't matter. Survive." He took off his coat and placed it over her. "You are now one of the only three people in the world who knows about the garden. I don't think you understand how special that makes you. Besides, the world isn't all violence and injustice."

"Okay, okay... And you? What are you going to do?"

"I'll stay here."

The first drops of the early morning rain began to fall.

"You know what? Here." She handed the bag to Lestácio.

"What's inside?"

"My fifteenth birthday present, from my father. Life made me bring it here, but I don't know how to use it, never wanted to use it. Do you know? It's better than nothing."

[Anonymous No.24013479]

Interesting thread

[Anonymous No.24013486]

>>24013468
take away gerunds when they're not needed. That you used "illuminating" after "met" to indicate how had it read the cave was illuminating something and that you don't really know how to write a setting without dumping the straight "x did this that way ".
She met Lestácio at the cave entrance. He illuminated the night with a handful of crystals in his hand and she told him then what had happened, that she had failed.
That she says it means she concluded it already, no need to use the word.
So then and there the shock hit her and she collapsed against his leg, her arms wrapped around her, cold and trembling.
did she not recompose herself before saying it? that's gangsta.
"I don't know where to go, I have nowhere to go," was her lament there, staring into nothing. "It's over. He knows you sent me. He knows. He’s going to kill us both." keep her dialogue that of someone who almost passed out.
Lestácio was impassive when he said "Leave. Cross the forest and reach the city. There must be a village nearby."
Use more conjunctions

[Anonymous No.24013488]

>>24013486
Cross the forest and reach a village nearby.

[Anonymous No.24013554]

>>24011885
>grin
>sneer
>leer
>mirth
read more books

[Anonymous No.24013559]

>>24013554
yes, replace a normal "smile" with those as if they're synonyms, tell me what readers think

[Anonymous No.24013564]

>>24013468
>I'm naked! If they don't rape me, I'll die. If I don't die, they'll rape me.

[Anonymous No.24013566]

>>24013559

[Anonymous No.24013569]

>>24013559
???
Those are all types of smiles.

[Anonymous No.24013573]

>>24013444
What did he mean by this

[Anonymous No.24013578]

>>24013569
>normal smile
wg is especially illiterate today, huh?

[Anonymous No.24013584]

>>24013578
You're just looking to pick a fight. Those are all smiles. They are very different types of smiles, but still all smiles.
:)

[Anonymous No.24013595]

>>24013584
are you retarded? the original topic was what word to use to replace a normal smile

[Anonymous No.24013602]

>>24013595
Nowhere in the origin of this reply chain is "normal smile" mentioned. Are you well?

[Anonymous No.24013605]

>>24011367
>>24013602
is context that hard for esls?

[Anonymous No.24013610]

>>24013605
>Trying to stamp out adverbs, not entirely, but I do overuse them. What’s a better way to say “smiled widely”. A “grin,” I feel like is not correct.
Forgot your meds again?

[Anonymous No.24013618]

>>24013610
just say yes

[Anonymous No.24013629]

>>24013618

[Anonymous No.24013636]

show
don't tell

[Anonymous No.24013643]

>>24013468
It's not very good for many reasons. The dialogue is melodramatic and over the top. The situation is ridiculous. So she arrives and stands around naked without the guy reacting until finallly she says they're going to rape her and THEN he gives her something to wear? C'mon, you can do better than this.

I wonder why she's running around naked anyway. Some other ridiculous scenario?

[Anonymous No.24013644]

>>24013636
Reminder that this is screenwriting advice and utterly inapplicable to regular writing.

[Anonymous No.24013649]

>>24011367
If you don't want to use an adverb but think "smiled" by itself is not enough, then use a simile or metaphor.

[Anonymous No.24013674]

>>24012470
Not bad overall. But as for the small things that do annoy me
>I ignored it and instead spoke to a new man
Wdym instead. I assume this guy doesn't already know every guy who was talking over the march so what's such a change about choosing to talk to this other guy he doesn't know?
>with an expressive face I couldn’t decide seemed trustworthy or devious.
I assume this is meant to tell me he almost seems too earnest for his looks, and the protagonist is meant to be a bit suspicious of his true nature. I'd just have him go
>With an expressive face that was either trustworthy, or devious. I couldn't yet tell.

[Anonymous No.24013677]

>>24013636
>>24013644
It's not even good screenwriting advice

[Anonymous No.24013679]

>>24012567
Yes doesn't answer the first question, but if that is a part of the worldbuilding I guess it works. I just don't see the metaphorical value in it.

[Anonymous No.24013682]

>>24013677
>>24013644
seethe, tellers

[Anonymous No.24013683]

>>24013677
Screenwriting is special. It's not screenwriting advice but and hard-and-fast rule.
When you write for the screen you can only write what will be seen and what will be heard. Anything else is useless filler.

[Anonymous No.24013697]

>>24013674
Thanks anon, the context for it is that they've had a lot of new people come into the unit, the protagonist has been there for a while so he's finding out about the new ones.
Hes supposed to be a rough character but 'earnest' like you say, so I'm glad that's come though at least.
I'll look at tweaking it.

[Anonymous No.24013806]

Tell, don't show.

[Anonymous No.24013844]

I'm trying to improve my lyrics. Learned the "don't tell, show" but now everytime I go to this same technique and it feels too mechanical.

I'm writing a lyric and go "ok, but where is the 'show not tell'?" even tho' the lyrics are fine enough. I feel this technique is important, but I don't want to use it as a formula. It should only be one of many tools that I can use and not a "must have" thing.

Does Cris uses this general, btw?

[Anonymous No.24013860]

>>24013610
Just so you know the guy who replied to you is not me (the guy who posted the excerpt). I’m not trying to pick a fight. I went with “radiant smile” and changed the sentence a bit.

[Anonymous No.24013890]

>>24013643
>The dialogue is melodramatic and over the top
>The situation is ridiculous
Why? Did you read the context? Maybe it wasn't enough.

>So she arrives and stands around naked without the guy reacting until finallly she says they're going to rape her and THEN he gives her something to wear?
You're right. But at the same time he has to do that without seeing desperate like her or something.

>I wonder why she's running around naked anyway. Some other ridiculous scenario?
She tried to kill his uncle during sex with him. She managed to run and escape the house, then went to the guy who ordered her to kill his uncle (because she was the one most likely to do it stealthily).

[Anonymous No.24013949]

>>24013890
So she got naked to kill him, but she didn't succeed and yet managed to run away naked (without him following, stopping OR killing her) all the way to a cave (typically in the middle of nowhere)?

Why even make her naked? It makes the situation silly and doesn't affect the plot. If the point is that she failed to kill him, then leave her with some clothes.

[Anonymous No.24014018]

>>24014017
>>24014017
>>24014017

[Anonymous No.24014137]

>>24012554

[Anonymous No.24014140]

>>24012554
Genuinely might just be that the excerpt was shit, especially the first two sentences.

[Anonymous No.24014224]

>>24009924
What are some reasons why a fantasy race would be naturally talented at alchemy and making potions or poisons?

What are some reasons an individual might be that? I was thinking of having a character just intuit in it naturally, but since I was never good at chemistry I don't know how people naturally gifted in it break it down and understand it so thoroughly.

[Anonymous No.24015042]

>Write fantastic short story about unemployment amongst Zoomers
>Want to publish it
>Literally 99% of literary magazines and contests CHARGE YOU to submit, with the only payout being a $20 Kohl's card six months after submitting
>Remaining 1% are all mainstream publishers that want you to already be established
Is there any way to get your work out there? I've submitted to the New Yorker and Atlantic, but what else is there? The only other non "Literal Who" publishers I've found are the Georgia Review and Sun Magazine, both of which charge submission fees.