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/lit/ - Literature

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2377009 No.2377009 [Reply] [Original]

So I'm reading On The Road (inb4 baby's first hipster book blah blah blah)

And I keep hearing about Dean (neil cassady) inspiring so many people at the time, but when I read the book all I can picture is some tweaking douche bag that talks way too much when he's high. I guess maybe I don't understand how they were "pushing the envelope" because I don't know the social norms of the time. It doesn't seem at all taboo to me, and it wouldn't to anyone my age. So why do people lie about enjoying this sort of thing?

I hate it when people on speed think that the rest of the world wants to hear their bullshit.

>> No.2377017

WHELP I SEE IT'S ON THE RECOMMENDED READING LINK.

I'll be honest. I haven't read near as many of the titles as I'd like on my "must read" list, but I must be missing something more here.

The reason I got interested in the beat stuff was because of Burroughs. I've been struggling with heroin addiction for years now, and the opening lines in howl grabbed me as well. I took my ass up to a used book store and grabbed a copy of on the road for a few bucks.

Just trying to get some insight.

>> No.2377032

>be a drug user
>die at 47

good riddance
I don't know hy you would read this garbage, do you really think spitting on norms and traditions are a good thing?

Look at how unhealthy this behavior is, these filthy drug addicts dying early. Faggots getting aids, etc.

>> No.2377039

I don't get it either. I just came away from 'On the Road' with the impression that Neal Cassady was a douche-bag, and Jack Kerouac was a latently homosexual beta male (who writes like a rank amateur). I guess their sheer lust for life appeals to a lot of people, and their itinerant adventures . . . but, personally, as a total homebody, I didn't find that remotely appealing either.

>> No.2377041

>>2377039
>lust for life
>kill themselves through constant drug use

one of these is not like the other, you don't have to be high on drugs or drunk to be "living life"

>> No.2377047

>>2377039
I'm so glad that someone else feels the same way ^.^

>>2377032
I'm not saying that taboo shit is always great, but I had assumed that the edginess of the novel at the time is what attracted so many people from the "counter culture" movements, and honestly being a heroin addict it attracted me all the same...

I was just extremely let down =/. Nothing about this moved me.

>> No.2377056

>>2377047
It's not about being "taboo", it's about being necessary to the preservation of civilization itself. It's about healthy, intelligent behavior.

>being a heroin addict
>2012
.....
Why would you be attracted by some shitty novel presenting self-destructive behavior as something glamorous?

>> No.2377060

On The Road is a great description of young enthusiastic people feverishly searching for the next best thing. It's recognizable and enjoyable for all but the most bitter apathetic anti-socials.

>> No.2377065

>>2377056
Because I had heard so many people say that it was great literature... Because human behavior and different time periods really interest me.

Of course books that have drugs in them are going to interest someone who has been involved with them. I always take an opportunity to read into what it was like to be a junkie in another time..

Lack of research and knowing what I was getting into?

No idea.

>> No.2377068

>>2377060
I was just about to say that I did think it was FUN in a sense, but nothing that changed my life..

>> No.2377077

>>2377041
I think the point is that living longer =! better life. there's people who live for forever and a day and have never actually 'lived' as the beats have done. I'm not saying everyone should go out living recklessly but you should at least try to realise what makes you happy instead of banking on longevity.

So many people read one kerouac novel and their inner critic has it all sussed out

dean is the epitome of amor fati and that's why everyone gravitates round him.

>> No.2377093

Kerouac and his buddies lived authentically and for that he demands respect. No one's saying you have to adopt their life philosophy, their attitude towards drugs or women or employment. At the very least there's something you can learn from them. like appreciating the good times because fortune can be fickle. but you don't read books to learn. Of course the process will educate you, but that arises inadvertently or automatically. primarily, you read to open yourself up to experiences that would have otherwise been alien to you.

>> No.2377094

>>2377077
>there's people who live for forever and a day and have never actually 'lived' as the beats have done.

This is from braveheart and it's about fighting for freedom.

not being a filthy drug taking promiscuous degenerate.

>> No.2377100

>>2377094
never seen braveheart.

and it applies. i already said you it's not about converting you to drug use and promiscuity. quit your uptight moralising. you come off as a troll.

>> No.2377102

>>2377100
don't expect me to cry at your funeral when your liver explodes from all the drinking.

>> No.2377116

>>2377094
sorry have to respond again.

you honestly can't see how it applies here? and in any case if you value freedom like you imply then shouldn't you value their right to promiscuous relationships?

>>2377102

you're an idiot and a troll. i already made it clear that we don't have to emulate kerouac exactly (which implies thatI don't.). that would be the exact opposite of any lesson you could take from this book if indeed there is one. the wider significance is to live authentically. I'm always wary of people who think there's a an overriding moral to every story. I don't like books with agendas. On the road doesn't have an agenda.

>> No.2377121

>>2377102
if your moral outbursts are a response to moral agenda you thought kerouac is pushing then you're even more dangerous than he is.

>> No.2377123

>some tweaking douche bag that talks way too much when he's high

lold

>> No.2377124

>>2377116
If you value freedom, then obviously you want to preserve the society which has granted us this freedom and prosperity.

The only reason any of us are here today, is that our ancestors weren't filthy fucking degenerates like this scumbag author was.

>> No.2377128

>>2377124
There's plenty of 'filthy degenerates' that procreate so your point is worthless. Try harder.

>> No.2377138

>>2377124
>If you value freedom, then obviously you want to preserve the society which has granted us this freedom and obtained.

but that doesn't mean MORE freedom and MORE prosperity can't be harnessed. if you think we've reached the end point of prosperity then you're deluded.

>> No.2377141

>>2377138
I don't think you know what freedom is, or value it at all.

>if you think we've reached the end point of prosperity then you're deluded.
If you think we are still actually getting more prosperous, then you are a clueless idiot.

>> No.2377148

>>2377141
how does someone smoking weed in fringe on your freedom?


I didn't say we are getting more prosperous. I said it's stupid to assume there isn't room for improvement.

try harder.

>> No.2377151

Jack Kerouac was a terrible writer. The thing is, as a young person who craved adventure, I wasn't drawn into Kerouac's bullshit like so many people think they should be. I just went out and traveled and read actual good writing.

Sure, Kerouac may have been earnest but anything you could argue in favor of his novels would have been better written by somebody with more insight/better writing skills.

Also, the popularity of his writing is responsible for a lot of bullshit behavior re: high school/college aged kids who think that dipshit is the model for counterculture living/thinking. That's not his fault, but it still irks me.

>> No.2377155

>>2377148
It would be our freedom to exclude drug addicts from our neighborhoods, businesses, and so on.

>> No.2377162

>>2377151

Kerouac got self-pitying as hell in his later years. TC Boyle wrote a good short story about him: "Beat".

>> No.2377163

>>2377151
You get pissed off easy. There's a lot of things high school kids and people in general do that will piss us off. Obviously I don't think much of anyone who takes life lessons from books especially a single book.

And a lot of what kerouac wrote was written specifically by better writers of his generation

>>2377155

nah you could still set up a private space and exclude whoever you liked.
also it sounds like you said:

>freedom means my freedom to set up a totalitarian state
lol

>> No.2377181

>>2377163

Maybe, but part of it might be that I'm 23 and some of these people still come and go in my life, including a good friend of mine. And it's more of a scoffing than a contempt, if that makes any sense. I certainly have my faults, though.

What writers are you referring to, btw?

>> No.2377196

>>2377181
Do I do and withdraw from society. it can be emotionally painful at times but you can get over that with any and all forms of escapism.

I haven't read them but I was referring to ginsberg and burroughs because /lit/ likes them. I should have mentioned that.