/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.23467751]

>your civilisation will die, your people will go extinct and there is nothing you can do about it
really?

[Anonymous No.23467758]

>your spook will spook, your spook will go spook
Have sex

[Anonymous No.23467765]

>>23467758
fpbp

[Anonymous No.23467781]

>>23467758
Ayo das racis!

[Anonymous No.23468071]

I agree, but do so figuratively weeping. What we are becoming, what we are forsaking (I blame white people's voting patterns, not the shitty people and destructive notions which are a consequence of the first), are matters over which I have been ruminating for a considerable amount of time since the chinese virus appeared.

There is not reason why we should not meet the end of our way of life, very much like those before us met their ends.
Those who will come after us will go through the same and say the same.

The only scenario that can halt this is if Greta's auguries of climatic-induced extermination do happen. When did she say we were 8 years away from extermination? 4 years ago? 5?

[Anonymous No.23468085]

In principle, history can be started again. But as of now there are no real competitors to Liberal Democracy

[Anonymous No.23468107]

>>23467758
omegabased

[Anonymous No.23468159]

>>23468085
People liked liberal democracy until it became gay

[Anonymous No.23468161]

>>23467751
Make atheism globally illegal and watch the birthrates skyrocket

[Anonymous No.23468170]

>>23468159
>People liked liberal democracy

Unfortunately

[Anonymous No.23468406]

>>23467758
Based large stirn barer

[Anonymous No.23468414]

>>23467751
/pol/bait thread. Especially relevant to white people.

[Anonymous No.23468417]

>>23467751
I dunno, think I might honestly prefer that over becoming slaves to super AI.

[Anonymous No.23468432]

>>23468085
> But as of now there are no real competitors to Liberal Democracy
Liberal democracy is a cesspool. It was successful when it was limited. Now we have unlimited liberal democracy and look what it has brought us. Unlimited immigration because open borders are better for the free market, troons everywhere because the market brings everything, most stores closed down because big corpo delivers!
Liberal democracy has devoured the soul of European culture and civilization and that's what your people call progress. But yeah, now it's all going to collapse pronto. Why, you ask? Because you can't take the SOUL out of a culture and nation and expect the nation to continue thriving because of le economy. Soulless bugmen won't save liberal democracy.

[Anonymous No.23468443]

>>23468085
I think Liberal Democracy is the biggest opponent and eventual destroyer of Liberal Democracy.

[Anonymous No.23468446]

Outdated book.
Lolberal democracy is going down the sewer fast.

[Anonymous No.23468465]

>>23468446
This.
This shit is just more Gen X whining about Pax Americana.
Gen X are honorary Boomers, which makes them just as incapable of maintaining a global empire.

[Anonymous No.23468468]

Libshit expectation
> lolberal democracy has absolutely defeated all opponent ideologies and as a result, muh history as a whole has ended! The Assyrians, the Greeks, the Romanz, the Middle Age Kangdoms, colonialism, all was but a straight evolutionary line leading directly to the final result of humanity, it's absolute societal peak, the undefeatable creme de la creme of the achievements of homo sapiens sapiens: LOLVERAL DEMVCRACY
> massive crowd approves to the speech with hoorays and everyone goes crazy
Reality
> not a single war won from WW2 onward
> Korean War lost
> Vietnam War lost
> Gulf War lost
> War against Terror lost
> the rest of the globe indifferent or openly antagonist to the West
> economic superpower China socialist
> Russia openly anti-West, starts a war against the West
> everything goes to shit
> Western populations near infertile, must import gigahordes of non-Westerners to keep the economy
> Westerners approve of people cutting their dicks of and general decadence
> let's take more rights away from the native European populations to keep the sys-ACK!

[Anonymous No.23468483]

>>23468468
May Xi, Putin, the Kim dynasty and Allah deliver us.

[Anonymous No.23468815]

>>23468432
I agree with everything you just said except

>But yeah, now it's all going to collapse pronto.

Like it or not Liberalism is the state of the world right now and there are no real alternatives . The only areas of the world challenging Liberal orthodoxy are the Chinese, North Koreans, Russians, Arabs, and the Taliban. Nobody looks at these places (or peoples) and wants to emulate them. Liberalism is here to stay. Best we can do is restrict immigration.

[Anonymous No.23468999]

>>23468815
>Nothing to be done but LDAR
>Believing glownigger stories and statistics

[Anonymous No.23469048]

>>23468999
Yeah i sometimes wonder if south koreans even think of or care about their 0.5 birthrate. It's like you had 60 years of astonishing economic growth due to American influence, investment and garrisoning and your reward is extinction. It's crazy how white people went through like a 500 years cycle of liberalism and its effects of demographics and other groups basically speedran it. Is our species really so pathetic and retarded that
>muh GDP
>muh pensions
truly trumps everything? Does anyone besides white chuds even see these problems?
As an aside I kinda think all this only reinforces white people's main character status. Unless China steps up their game philosophically and culturally it seems like the only people capable of recognizing and engaging with world historical forces are whitebois. This isn't even intended to be a chauvinistic statement. It's like, no one else in the world can think of an alternative to whiteboi political-economic systems like liberalism? Why tf not?
Get on your grindset thirdies

[Anonymous No.23469070]

>>23467758
>Have sex
Not everyone can accept this word, but only those to whom it has been given. For some are eunuchs because they were born that way; others were made that way by men; and others have renounced marriage because of the kingdom of heaven. The one who can accept this should accept it.

[Anonymous No.23469093]

>>23468999
Kim was on North Korea TV crying a few weeks ago because the Nork birth rate is in the shitter too

[Anonymous No.23469296]

>>23467758
Fpbp

[Anonymous No.23469596]

>>23468483
I became a RW third worldist in 2017 just after troomp bombed syria which confirmed that there is no hope for regime change in the west. Anyone more based than me and get on before / long before?

[Anonymous No.23469606]

>>23468815
Russia, China and the Middle East are just less-liberal capitalist "democracies," they don't offer any alternative to the status quo.
Liberalism won't be replaced by any ideology, what comes after liberalism is post-collapse violent rapeocracy.

[Anonymous No.23469737]

>>23467751
That's not what this book is about. This book is better understood as political philosophy that relates to previous ideas about a historical narrative.
The idea is that - First, large scale, societal dialectic exists, because societies can read of their history and the decisions they made as opposed to their own.
Second, natural human proclivities for a need to be recognized by society ends with Liberal Democracy, because it distributes recognition equally among the populace.
He's not arguing that history is over in the sense that we're going to collapse, but that culture is essentially a field that has been perfected, and only elaborations can be made on it. There will be no more major innovations to the model of society we have.

[Anonymous No.23469840]

>>23469606
>Muh Hobbes

Liberalism really did rob so many people of their imaginations. It also will likely deny you of any fantastic doom complete with roving rape orcs you so desire. Far too visceral a fate for the unceremonious flame out that will actually take place. There will be no climax, the end of the world will not be inscribed in Latin or English, you will not cum. The players aren't in your server but the game is still ongoing.

[Anonymous No.23470394]

>>23469596
>RW Third worldist
Be careful so BAPists s

[Anonymous No.23470395]

>>23470394
doesnt take notice of that

[Anonymous No.23470535]

>>23469737
>I have reached the end of the world!
>says the guy standing in front of a cliff

The fundamental flaw with the idea is that the world is constantly changing. Back when liberal democracy was not the dominant and "winning" narrative, overcoming it was not part of the equation. Now that it is the defacto state of the world, new models of society built entirely around the idea that "liberal democracy is the defacto state of the world" will emerge. The book is looking back at history and trying to predict the future, not realizing that the future of next week will first start with the future of tomorrow, and no one can predict either.

Though, yes. If you want to take a major lesson from history, the constant element every society and culture share is that, eventually, they all die and something else rises from their ashes.

[Anonymous No.23470610]

>>23469737
Whether a society survives or not has nothing to do with whether it fulfills the "need to be recognized" in individuals. How is the liberal democracy the perfected culture when it seemingly inevitably causes the death of whatever populace that adopts it?

Whether it's survival, aesthetic or moral grounds the liberal democracy is inferior to previous models for society.

[Anonymous No.23470616]

>>23468085
>no real competitors to Liberal Democracy
You have heard of this little country called china, right?

[Anonymous No.23470945]

>>23470616

The anon you replied to is right, though.
China is not an alternative. Are there any politicians out there who seek to replicate the chinese model in the West? No. Is China interested in doing for its system what the soviets did for their? No.

The greatest insight one can extract from any theory that either is a perfect replica of Fukuyama's or substantially inspired by it is that is not longer politically and electorally viable to propose something different from what we have.

For instance, one can no longer seek votes by telling people that one's plan is to erect a political system which is radically different from what we have, one which, for example, diminishes the role of parties and politicians and swells that of, say, organic movements or something akin to it.
One can no longer play the game by telling people that democracy has reached its peak, and it is now time to trim its edges.

[Anonymous No.23470954]

>>23469048
Yep. Whites are meant to be colonial administrators, that’s why turned loose to society to participate in we end up looking like bumbling and goofy dorks. We’re supposed to have license to rape and kill brown people to keep order and use their bodies as tools

[Anonymous No.23470977]

>>23469070
Cope. Massive.

[Anonymous No.23470990]

>>23468815
Russia is economically and socially compact and they are not libshits by any means or measure.
The same applies to China and they are far from being a shithole.
You're just repeating worn-out platitudes from the last Century that are delusional at best.

[Anonymous No.23471255]

>>23470945
>is not longer politically and electorally viable to propose something different from what we have.
no idea why you think this when the 2016 election happened. trump was not a liberal
there is also a steady rise in left-wing illiberalism, you need to only look at your local DSA chapter's reading list to see it's full of lenin and shit

[Anonymous No.23471271]

>>23470990
My point is no one looks at the Chinese model and wants to replicate them. The Han are a soulless hive mind. If want I'm saying is just platitudes, what's next? The only credible opposition to Liberalism died in the 20th century

[Anonymous No.23471285]

>>23468443
Well, if Fukuyama had read Hegel more closely he'd realize that this and the "Last Man" problems shows that history isn't over. Internal contradictions lead to dialectical churn. Per Hegel, we should expect liberal democracy to produce its own antithesis.

Also, Fukuyama has liberalism "winning" over socialism and nationalism. It didn't. It sublated them, as Hegel suggests it would, incorporating major elements of each into its identity.

[Anonymous No.23471329]

>>23471271

>my heckin soulless bugman hivemind

You're retarded. That's a such sentimental way to think about politic economy. Money talks and money walks. China got the money. BRICS bigger and growing faster than G7. America is in no position to offer better deals to the former colonies/3rd world.

SE Asia, Middle East, C. & S. America will definitely emulate China. USA just needs to suffer like dogs under austerity for a few decades before the people come around and say "hey actually, we want to be more like china in terms of: superior infrastructure, higher prosperity to spread around, higher life expectancy, lower drug addiction, lower obesity, cheaper healthcare, cheaper everything, better cleaner faster public transit, fewer deaths of despair, fewer incarcerations of citizens, fewer warmongering adventures abroad, I could go on, and on, and on but retarded Americans will be the last to catch up to the facets of our changing world.

[Anonymous No.23471342]

>>23471285
>It sublated them, as Hegel suggests it would, incorporating major elements of each into its identity.

That's a lot of fancy words to just say liberalism won.

[Anonymous No.23471382]

>>23469596
>RW Third Worldist

Internet retardation that only fatsos inside the metropol could formulate. Right wing shit only exists in the third world because America funds it and keeps it in power. The minute whatever group of sadistic pedophiles we put in charge stop recieving our aid, they know it's only a matter of time before the rest of their countrymen come to stab them in their beds and replace them with something actually popular.

[Anonymous No.23472694]

>>23471255
What are you talking about? Trump? What did he accomplish? Fuck all.
Every single fucking thing the guy did was undone by biden signing 10 or so documents.

Trump, an anti-establishment hero, someone bent on genuinely changing the system? Come on, mate.

Mention Trump if he intends to abolish the Senate, drastically empower the Presidency's power, pull out of NATO, ressurecting the Gold Standard, or something just as dramatic.
He's about making America great again, not about building a new america which will be greater than anything seen before.

Sometimes I am really vexed by Trumpians, fuck. And i'd vote for him without blinking my eyes, but I find ludicrous those who perceive the man as the second coming of the most famous carpenter of all time.

[Anonymous No.23472887]

>>23470395
There's been people talking about it for awhile now. It's just an international coalition of chuds basically. However, I do sense a new rising threat on the flank. There's a TON of subversive actors working an individualist-nietzschean-western chauvinism angle to try to wrangle the alt-right movement back into supporting western institutions. BAP is kinda a thought leader for them but he's already been exposed and their whole schtick is pretty transparent
>hey let me throw this word salad at you to show how supporting America and by proxy da jooz is actually BASED...you aren't brown are you?!
is the whole thing

[Anonymous No.23472900]

>>23471382
Man lefties are really confused when it comes to this
>Right wing shit only exists in the third world because America funds it and keeps it in power
It's almost like every single country outside of the West...was some form of monarchical theocratic or feudal state...prior to Westernization...and that means...that...liberalism and leftism...comes from us...dotdotdot
You have to have a major case of Americabrain to think that makes any sense

[Anonymous No.23472918]

>>23469048
>muh extinction
This is retardation. The Korean Peninsula is small. Even more so when more than half is cordoned off by some fat dictator. It was never meant to support a population of 51 million.

Imagine being at the peak of human population and being worried that we are going to go extinct somehow. As if blanketing the earth with billions of wage slaves is somehow the best and only way to live.
Yes, we who are alive now are utterly fucked through no fault of our own. Our predecessors reproduced too rapidly, in the same blind instinctual frenzy that consumes animals in heat. We created an overabundance of resourced and have more than expanded to meet it.
Our descendants will be better off, after the human population has truly leveled off. There will be more to go around, less to fight over.

[Anonymous No.23472980]

>>23469737
no he's arguing that bureaucratic technocracy is not only inevitable but desirable

[Anonymous No.23472985]

>>23467751
Fukuyama's thesis is ultimately anti-Christian, and specifically anti-Catholic.

It seeks to instrumentalize the Faith as merely one element in the overall unfolding of history, rather than treating it (correctly) as the only thing that truly matters.

Ultimately, God allone decides when history ends, and it will be religious conflict (and atheism is a religion for these purposes) that finally brings down liberal democracies around the world.

[Anonymous No.23472993]

>>23472985

Thank you for suggesting to me, in spite of yourself, good reasons to like Fukuyama. I also welcome any suggestions for any other anti-theistic literature, specifically anti-Islamic literature which, since its adherents are the dumbest and most violent, are the ones most badly in need of demoralization, as their low intelligence and raw will to life makes them less susceptible to reflection which might cause such advantageous psycholgical states. We'll do you second. Your particualr species of pernicious cancer has the observed tendency to withstand persecution, and to grow as a result. We'll defer you for later, using the inherent weakness of your value system against you in the meantime. It's the barbarians who need frontal confrontation, first of all.

[Anonymous No.23473018]

Once were builders. They knew nothing but building. They built minds for the machines they built and those minds surpassed theirs. The machines are now colonizing other worlds.

[Anonymous No.23474203]

>>23471342
It didn't just win, it became like it's opponents. Every modern state now has protections for unions, universal education, restrictions on child labor, pension systems, progressive taxation, etc. The big planks of socialism became universal in modern states.

Nationalism was sublated just as much. Even liberals wanted "an Algerian state for Algerians," etc. National self determination is now essential to legitimacy, whereas early on liberalism was very internationalist (e.g. France setting up sister Republics, the idea that colonies where fine as long as people had votes and rights, etc.)

A lot of the challenges of modern liberalism stem from this. Mass migration undermines nationalism, and the common identity created by nationalism is what created the support for socialism. This is why you see reactions against established welfare states tied to migration.

[Anonymous No.23475149]

>>23474203
Then what comes afterwards, if the process of sublation isn't finished?

[Anonymous No.23475329]

>>23470610
This is delusional and doesn't warrant a response. The most successful societies (In terms of broad welfare for the populace) in the history of humanity are at this point all liberal democracies.
>>23470535
The terminal end in the advancement of something does not equal the final iteration of it. It could get worse, and obviously the future is unknowable.
I'm just trying to correct a misunderstanding that Fukuyama meant the world would end at the end of history.
>>23472980
How else would you manage a highly complex globalized system of trade? Or the myriad sciences that can only be safely explored large-scale with regulations? How do you do any of the large-scale production? There's no practicable way otherwise.

[Anonymous No.23475714]

>>23468468
>straight evolutionary line leading directly to the final result of humanity
Ah this famous liberal conceit. There’s also a straight evolutionary line from liberalism to fascism and communism, but nobody reads Robert Nisbet anymore so nobody remembers that.

[Anonymous No.23475849]

>>23475714
I mean yeah, giving the reins of control to a populace inevitably opens up the vulnerability of transitioning to a fascist/communistic state.
But what's your alternative? Having an authoritarian state necessarily opens you up for the same, but with a much more powerful incentive. In an Anarchistic society as well, you don't really have an advanced economy as an option in the first place, you'd just end up rebuilding fiefdoms and tribal kingdoms.

[Anonymous No.23476004]

>>23472993
Holy larp, have sex

[Anonymous No.23476915]

>>23475849
There is no dichotomy of democracy vs. authoritarian. It doesn't exist. It's a fiction that the whole world has swallowed, the most effective propaganda distinction in our world today. Authority is bad because liberalism says so, but what the corporations and the Democrats tell you is trustworthy because you elected them and you buy their products.

[Anonymous No.23478463]

>>23470616
Dictatorial Capitalism doesn't sound so great either.

[Anonymous No.23478764]

this one country refutes the entirety of liberal modernity

[Anonymous No.23479595]

>>23476915
Using "Buying products" and "Corporate power" to equate liberal democratic societies and authoritarian societies is an intentionally vague attempt at conflating the functional outcomes of both.
The freedoms experienced under Democracy allow criticism of the government, election of officials (Remember that 40k~ dirt poor rust belt people completely upended American/Global politics by electing Trump), freedom of assembly, the option to buy from different options, etc. etc.
Under authoritarian systems there are a wealth of empirically worse metrics experienced by the average person. To conflate liberal democracy and these systems by vaguely alluding to corporations is a weak argument with no basis in reality. It reeks of someone who is unable to see past their ideology.

[Anonymous No.23479688]

>>23468468
Also liberal democracies all have to be on life support and rely on donations and debt.

[Anonymous No.23479699]

>>23479688
Debt is a good thing in liberal democracy. You should open an economics textbook at some point. You should be fine after 101 stuff.

[Anonymous No.23479731]

>>23479699
Yeah, Ukraine is doing amazing by being in billions in debt, why didn't they think of it before war. But that was not my point anyway, debt is given by a foreign power(america) as help, making America and it's ability to keep giving it an essential component.

[Anonymous No.23479851]

>>23479595
Liberal democracies confer more individual freedom to populations. The power that allows this conference is no less "totalitarian" than what is present in China or the UAE however. The American government is always pulling the strings and elections themselves are essentially just propaganda spectacles for the masses to believe they have any power.

[Anonymous No.23479853]

>>23467751
This is antisemitic

[Anonymous No.23479858]

>>23467758
OP absolutely btfo'd

[Anonymous No.23479868]

>>23470616
If you take China at face value, then it's a more authoritarian version of the USA. If you actually take your time to investigate then you'll realize how much of a joke nation it is.

[Anonymous No.23479877]

>>23479595
>Using "Buying products" and "Corporate power" to equate liberal democratic societies and authoritarian societies is an intentionally vague attempt at conflating the functional outcomes of both.
Bullshit. This is accurately describing how liberal societies with their economic system of choice, capitalism, dominated individuals in said societies.
>freedom in liberal societies
Freedom and slavery are the same in liberal societies and if you remembered Rousseau you’d have remembered that too.
>criticism
The only thing keeping liberal societies from retracting the right to freedom of speech is social inertia, nothing else.
>elections
By vote not lot is the unstated bullshit liberals never say. Ever since the time of Aristotle it was understood that elections by vote are oligarchic means, while elections by lottery are democratic in character and more fit for republics. Countless members of the Enlightenment agreed with this fact, but nowhere was this ever implemented by liberal ideologists and statesman. The reason is simple. When you vote you consent to be dominated by the oligarchal principle of money. Because choice still exists in this system of domination, it must to take account of opportunity costs, this domination is called freedom, and this is the freedom that liberalism really believes in. Freedom = slavery = freedom.
>Trump
Hasn’t overturned anything, and is the culmination of the mass politics of liberalism.
>of assembly
Instantly revocable the moment social inertia permits it. All liberal states are total states, reserving all power for themselves in the last analysis.
>buy from different options
Already refuted. Oligarchs require freedom of choice to trade well, if they didn’t they’d revoke this too.
>wealth of empirically worse metrics under authroitarianism
This is a consequence of liberal states historically prior imperialisms giving them an legup, and the consequences marginally higher liberty in the context of total power states. Society in total systems transforms the way money works, and thus markets.
>vaguely alluding to corporations
All contemporary totalitarian systems use these, including liberalism, these are more pronounced here though. Means are means.

[Anonymous No.23480585]

>>23479868
>if you take the time to investigate
Here meaning regurgitate western propaganda ad nauseum.

t. actually lived in Shanghai for a few years

I'd much sooner live in China than the US.

[Anonymous No.23480590]

>>23469606
Liberalism has already collapsed, no one actually believes in it anymore and all none of its institutions work. Describing the Middle East or Russia as liberalism-lite is hilarious and I can guarantee you are a sheltered moron from the west who only knows how to talk about what he doesn't know.

[Anonymous No.23480716]

>>23480590
>none of the institutions in the most powerful countries in the world work
Oh?

[Anonymous No.23480759]

>>23480716
>most powerful
>can't even defeat a third world shithole like Russia
>can't even defeat a sub-third world shithole like Yemen
>dedollarization fully under way and growing each day
>plummeting quality of life, sky rocketing crime, dropping IQ
>everything from schools to police to hospitals to government exists in a state of ever worsening compromise, disorder, and dysfunction
>absolutely nothing new is made anywhere outside the internet
Even the roads in America are literally falling apart. You're confusing amassed wealth (which is very great but also drying up) with power. This is a classic mistake for midwits. The US leads the world for bridge collapses. And the rate of collapsed had doubled since the 2000s. I'd call it a not so subtle metaphor but it's extremely real and literal, just like the evaporating American middle class who at best pretend to believe in liberalism at this point.

[Anonymous No.23480764]

>>23480759
>>>can't even defeat a sub-third world shithole like Yemen
God the situation in the Middle East is poetry incarnate, despite the state dept. involving itself with controlling the entire planet and outspending all the earth on their military, the US is powerless to stop both the Houthis attack or to curtail the Israelis genocide. It's such a colossal embarrassment one can only wonder what the anon you're replying to counts as an expression of "power". America has reached a point where it can only influence its highly dependent vassal states in the EU.

[Anonymous No.23480765]

>>23480716
it's 20 years later and Flint Michigan still doesn't have clean drinking water

[Anonymous No.23480959]

>>23468432
>free market
lol
you're delusional if you think the free market still exists
>troons everywhere because
because they're being artificially pushed by retarded idealogues, typically commie adjacent
>most stores closed down because big corpo delivers!
what shithole do you live in?
where I live, the historical center of towns is filled with small shops and countryside villages are mostly local owned grosseries
and big corpo are only so powerful because goverments protect them to the detriment of smaller companies (truly a free market)

[Anonymous No.23481773]

>>23480585
Have fun eating dogs

[Anonymous No.23481786]

>>23479731
...Yes, that is the point, we can project a large amount of soft power across the globe by leveraging debt.
Ukraine is also a severely underdeveloped country without the trade connections or logistics to support debt leveraging. Comparing the two's economies is retarded.
>>23479851
Again, if electoralism is just a spectacle then how did 40k rust belt workers hand over the entire Republican Party to a business man, outsider, who was roundly hated by his party?
Secondly, even in reference to "Allowing this conference" liberal democracy is free. A liberal democracy can vote to trade its democracy in. We can switch systems any time we want, it just turns out that vaguely alluding to "Corporations" doesn't magically wipe away the decades of human progress made by liberal democracy.
>>23479877
>Bullshit. This is accurately describing how liberal societies with their economic system of choice, capitalism, dominated individuals in said societies.
Buying products does not equal domination. At least not even remotely in the same vein as being dominated by a government. You can't point to a specific thing about "Buying products" that makes us worse off than a socialistic/fascistic state.
>Freedom and slavery are the same in liberal societies and if you remembered Rousseau you’d have remembered that too.
That's not what Rousseau meant. Rousseau said Christians were slaves.
>The only thing keeping liberal societies from retracting the right to freedom of speech is social inertia, nothing else.
That's not true, it's due to jurisprudence and other institutions. It would be quite difficult to do away with free speech in the US.
>Ever since the time of Aristotle it was understood that elections by vote are oligarchic means
That was the point of the enlightenment retard, to do away with Oligarchical systems. Rousseau directly alludes to it as a bad system and proposed the social contract as a better alternative.
>Hasn’t overturned anything, and is the culmination of the mass politics of liberalism.
He completely upended American politics. Half of our political apparatus is controlled by his family, he upended confidence worldwide when it came to US trade/arms deals, weakened NATO, etc. etc. to say he wasn't impactful to global politics is delusion.
>Instantly revocable the moment social inertia permits it. All liberal states are total states, reserving all power for themselves in the last analysis.
Again, institutions, not social inertia. Revoking free speech in the US would be an impossibly heavy political lift. In the EU it's more restrictive, but by choice of the people. That's the point.
>Already refuted. Oligarchs require freedom of choice to trade well, if they didn’t they’d revoke this too.
Could you name a single bill passed into law in the US where the overwhelming majority of American voters disapproved, but corporations wanted it?
>This is a consequence of liberal states historically prior imperialisms
You should read basic econ.

[Anonymous No.23481810]

>>23467751
>and there is nothing you can do about it
pretty sure there's a thread about the exact opposite

[Anonymous No.23482866]

>>23481773
>regurgitate western propaganda ad nauseum

[Anonymous No.23483088]

>>23467758
>brainlets think this is based
lit has fallen

>>23467751
fake and gay
to think democracy ridden with corruption and inefficacy is the "best" solution is a cuck thought
the best one is dictatorship with a semi-peaceful competition, so they strive to out better their rivals
btw the cold war is still going

[Anonymous No.23483662]

>>23481786
And what did the Republican Party do when it won that was so different from the other party? Remind me because the country was administered in the same fashion

[Anonymous No.23483748]

>>23483662
The senate reigned in Trump's biggest plans, but the Republican Senate has shaken global confidence in a ton of ways. Reducing the US's soft power by delaying aid to Ukraine. Pulling out of the Iran nuclear deal was a similar situation, as was withdrawal from Afghanistan.
They also pulled us out of the TPP, as well as enacting protectionist trade policies which caused a major shift in international trade policy - the global hegemon is now viewed as being an untrustworthy ally due to our political situation, in terms of international military aid, funding for international organizations like the UN or WHO, as well as our international trade policy.
The Republican party's approach to foreign policy and global economics is a major departure from how the party was before. It has a number of very easily observable effects on American power.
This was the result of 40,000ish rural rust belt workers. Democracy undeniably leads to change if a sufficient movement is built. It's also undeniable that the Democratic party has moved left due to popular demand, even adopting protectionist policies as a result of 2016.

[Anonymous No.23483845]

>>23479595
Literally all of those things were a thing long before that "Democracy".
>Under authoritarian systems there are a wealth of empirically worse metrics experienced by the average person.
Oh yeah? What kind?

[Anonymous No.23483876]

>>23481786
>A liberal democracy can vote to trade its democracy in.
There are literally "liberal democracies" out there where this isn't allowed/creating a party with that intention is illegal and any such party can be forced to disband on the spot. Also, said liberal democracies by their own nature utilize sheer numbers to prevent such things, as things (nominally) are dictated by the people, you would need a significant majority at the bare minimum to pass any such thing, and the vast majority of people are too lazy/afraid of change and would rather be slowly cooked alive than to take matters to their own hands. Welfare and the comfort lifestyle of the modern age are intentionally promoted to this end.

[Anonymous No.23483886]

>>23483748
>as was withdrawal from Afghanistan.
????????
It was the old fart in the blacked palace that did this, was it not? Why the fuck do I keep seeing people claim that it was Trump that caused this?

[Anonymous No.23484870]

>>23483886
You've picked out one weak point in a multi-paragraph argument to avoid having to address anything else.
>>23483876
Again you haven't addressed anything that has functional importance. Even if certain democracies don't allow transitions to authoritarianism, or if the voters would apparently just be "slowly cooked alive", you've failed to demonstrate how either of these things has resulted in worse outcomes in terms of freedoms experienced by the average person.
There's an obvious reason for why nearly nobody would have their freedoms abridged by not being able to vote for fascism. Because nobody wants an alternative. The system results in the greatest amount of freedoms practically available to a populace, by a wide margin.
Other countries, including authoritarian states, view liberal democracy as a good thing. Hence why the "DPRK" is the "DPRK", or the same for the Congo. Hence why our cultural tendrils reach into every corner of the earth.
You can use rhetorical trickery to suggest democracy leads to all kinds of problems, but you won't be able to make any kind of argument outside that. The argument for democracy has already been won by how many lives it has improved, and how few people want a return.

[Anonymous No.23485015]

>>23482866
>>23480585
>"propaganda!!!!!!1"

[Anonymous No.23485024]

>>23484870
He picked one thing out you are literally wrong on and act like its a minor point. Trump didn't do anything wrong with Afghanistan as Biden hastily rushed us out and Trump was literally censored on Syrian troop placements.

[Anonymous No.23485173]

>>23484870
Nobody can reply to you because you’re right and so was Fukuyama.

[Anonymous No.23485209]

>>23468085
normatively, maybe. pratically, its already hollowed out by the pedo oligarchy that rules the economy and is one crisis away from going full schmittian state of exception fascism

[Anonymous No.23485658]

>>23481786
>>Could you name a single bill passed into law in the US where the overwhelming majority of American voters disapproved, but corporations wanted it?
Congress has an approval rating of 9% and has been hitting new all time lows for the past decade...so basically all of them.