/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.23373203]

As we find ourselves entrenched in the decadent phase of the cycle, madness pervades. Cultural erosion runs rampant, with traditions, the very bedrock upon which our societal structures and cultural heritage were built, being mercilessly uprooted from their rightful place. What remains is the inexorable descent into the abyss, where nations meet their demise through the grip of Caesarism, an irreversible march towards oblivion. Attempts at forging new nations are futile endeavors in this twilight era. We stand witness to the conclusion of this epoch, denied the privilege of witnessing the dawn of the next. Future generations will inevitably witness the rise of their own Hitler, Mussolini, Aurelius, and conquerors, while we are left bereft. Change -during our lives,- if it comes at all, will be but a facade, veiling the impending deterioration. Prepare yourself for the journey ahead, for there is naught but the illusion of improvement before the inevitable descent into further darkness. Enjoy your sojourn while it lasts.

[Anonymous No.23373219]

>>23373203
this shitty prose is good evidence for declining standards..

[Anonymous No.23373234]

>>23373219
How is it shitty? It's not good by any means, you can call it mediocre at best, but not SHITTY.

[Anonymous No.23373251]

>>23373203
Mutatis mutandis

[Anonymous No.23373261]

>>23373234
I wouldn't be so mean about it if not for the traditionalist rhetoric, because you're kind of implying that you're a herald of the old ways or somehow "above" the decline yourself. The whole paragraph reads like it was written by someone whose first language is not English. I'd say it's good for a teenager -- someone who is experimenting with more complex language for the first time. I'd give it high marks if I were a middle school teacher.

[Anonymous No.23373268]

>>23373261
Lol, look at me. Even I'm an ESL today. I used herald improperly. I was thinking of something more like standard-bearer

[Anonymous No.23373272]

>>23373261
OP here, which writer would you recommend to learn prose from. Since you know so much, i would appreciate it if you were so kind as to tell us your opinion.

[Anonymous No.23373274]

Such a godless mind is to be pitied, even prayed for. This man is broken, spiritually broken. He peers into an abyss and can only envision a future of descent. Such dim musings do not satisfy or edify, and fail to demoralize. Such vain scribblings do not compare to what is higher.

The bedrock survives. In radiant contrast, the unbroken, shining line of holy faith guarded through the generations, the everlasting hope of the faithful, who do not walk downwards toward an abyss, but in confident gratitude journey upwards to paradise.

[Anonymous No.23373287]

>>23373272
Any and all writers. And keep writing. I think you can be a good writer with more practice
>>23373274
For instance this paragraph is a bit overcooked. What does the following phrase mean?
>Such a godless mind is to be pitied, even prayed for.
Sure, it sounds pretty, but what does it actually mean? It is emulating the style of grand pronouncements like what you might read in Spengler or something, but not their content.
>In radiant contrast
How can a contrast be radiant?

[Anonymous No.23373312]

>>23373203
Also why is Aurelius placed next to Hitler and Mussolini

[Anonymous No.23373318]

This board is faustian af (bad affect)

[Anonymous No.23373322]

>>23373287
>Sure, it sounds pretty, but what does it actually mean?
this is what i'm talking about. I'm convinced that every expression i used in OP can be explained with what Spengler had already written. Any person that reads Spengler would have understood what i meant. The post you referred to, does sound similar, but contains no clear meaning, as if the paragraph has been written for the sole purpose of showing off prose without having actually understood what was being discussed.

[Anonymous No.23373347]

>>23373312
All of them are good rulers... better than all others in their eras, i suppose. Hitler went against the filth of equality and democracy, then chose to approach things pragmatically. What caused him to fail was the delay in Brabarossa, caused by Yugoslavia, coupled by the bull-headed character of the Aryan, the mindset that "There is no going back!", which caused him to not retreat from Stalingrad despite the unfavorable circumstances like the soviet winter, and military implications.

Sure, he didn't win, but he took a step in the right direction.

[Anonymous No.23373353]

>>23373347
I'm surprised you don't consider Hitler a sign of degeneration, considering Spengler's opinion of him, as well as his modernism and disregard for German tradition and old world morality.

[Anonymous No.23373364]

>>23373203
two more weeks

[Anonymous No.23373367]

>>23373353
>I'm surprised you don't consider Hitler a sign of degeneration, considering Spengler's opinion of him, as well as his modernism and disregard for German tradition and old world morality.
Ultimately, he was part of the degeneration cycle. But what could anyone have done? He was the less degenerate of the bunch. What can be done?
>>23373364
two more centuries*

[Anonymous No.23373370]

>>23373367
He murdered millions of innocents. How could that help?

[Anonymous No.23373379]

>>23373370
No such thing. Greatness and happiness are incompatible and we are given no choice. No one living in any part of the world of today will be happy, but many will be able to control, by the exercise of their own will, the greatness or insignificance of their life-course. As for those who seek comfort merely, they do not deserve to exist.

[Anonymous No.23373391]

>>23373379
So why do you call yourself an advocate for tradition when your morals are totally alien to traditional Western morality?

[Anonymous No.23373411]

>>23373391
I just think that it's important to understand the facts of our time and through them to envisage, interpret, and delineate the future — which will come whether we will or not. An epoch so conscious of itself as the present is impossible of comprehension without creative, anticipating, warning, leading criticism. Tradition is so good a criticism that it's the best i can convince myself to advocate for.

[Anonymous No.23373434]

>>23373411
Why can't you talk plainly? You are answering questions like a politician. I do not see how your replies are relevant to my question. What is "Tradition"? The way you speak, anyone can call themselves a traditionalist without meaningfully engaging with any set of actually existing traditions. How can you justify the industrial extermination of Jews via the writing of someone who was opposed to both industrialism and anti-Semitism? Have you even read Spengler or have you just absorbed memes about him?

[Anonymous No.23373452]

>>23373411
LOL KEK
Gibberish ESL slop

[Anonymous No.23373462]

>>23373434
I don't need to have the same exact opinion as Spengler, i'm not a sponge that absorbs his writings and waits patiently for someone to squeeze so as to check if i did my homework. I take from Spengler what i perceive to be useful, then i discard the rest, taking what i desire and adopting it into my worldview until it is complete. Maybe it will change as i read more of Spengler, maybe not. Either way, you cannot tell if the genocides happened or not, for the second world war is currently -especially because of how recent it is- the most manipulated period we know of. Racial supremacy, given the right circumstances and personnel, can grant a country the greatest power. War is the first and greatest proponent of progress, as human history has shown us. As inefficient and wasteful as it seems, it bestows upon the citizen a reason to fight and evolve against his contemporaries, and declaring yourself as the greatest race ( depending on what you perceive race to be ) is the same as pitting yourself against the rest of the world. The long wars that emerge from this will ensure the continuous growth of your countrymen, especially with a unified, unbroken purpose. Now, why Jews in particular? You can take a guess.

[Anonymous No.23373465]

>>23373452
>subhuman scum can't into language

[Anonymous No.23373471]

>>23373465
Are you describing yourself? You can't write English properly.

[Anonymous No.23373478]

>>23373471
i put a greentext to imply that you're the one who would be describing himself as per what was written in the greentext. Get off this board, you ape.

[Anonymous No.23373486]

>>23373478
Is this an epic troll or are you genuinely retarded

[Anonymous No.23373490]

>>23373486
Nah, you're either stupid or disabled, but i can't tell... so on the off chance you're just a disabled retard, i behave with compassion, hoping you get to understand a shred of what no one else will bother explaining to you.

[Anonymous No.23373491]

>>23373490
You are brown.

[Anonymous No.23373503]

>>23373219
People who make vague criticism of prose are retards with nothing to add to anything. Also, it's never not funny when prose pseuds ignorantly direct such criticism to translated works.

[Anonymous No.23373513]

>>23373503
OP here, was my prose adequate or not?

[Anonymous No.23373531]

>>23373513
Oh, I didn't read it. Lol.

[Anonymous No.23373532]

>>23373513
Just read it. It's a little pompous sometimes but overall it's fine. Perfectly serviceable.

[Anonymous No.23373535]

>>23373532
thx for the feedback

[Anonymous No.23373623]

>>23373203
No idea man but I think none of that shit really matters for the common man. The common man just exists like he always did for thousands of years. Yeah sure he also feels the change in certain aspects of his life but it's not substantial. I think hyperreality more or less only applies to radical groups like marxists/fascist LGBTQ fanatics and so on. Or at least they are the major occupators and endulgers in hyperreality.
But I'm not even sure rn if talking

[Anonymous No.23374140]

>>23373370
>He murdered millions of innocents.
No he didn't. Allied propaganda was a mistake.

[Anonymous No.23374162]

Refuted by Popper. Nobody has any excuse to read Spengler, or any other historicist cope

[Anonymous No.23374232]

>>23373203
>Cultural erosion runs rampant
It's called change. People make the culture, and today they happen to make a culture you don't like. One that includes worshipping the dead less.
>traditions, the very bedrock upon which our societal structures and cultural heritage were built
The main tradition is to question traditions.
>mercilessly uprooted from their rightful place.
No such thing as a rightful place for traditions. Nothing wrong with uprooting bad practices.

[Anonymous No.23374460]

>>23373203
>traditions, the very bedrock upon which our societal structures and cultural heritage were built
I hate idealism so goddamn fucking much dude

[Anonymous No.23374519]

>>23373219
fpgamrp

[Anonymous No.23375080]

>>23374232
>>23374460
faggots

[Anonymous No.23375163]

>>23374162
Where does Popper addresses the issue of historicism?

[Anonymous No.23375222]

>>23375163
In the book he wrote about historicism

[Anonymous No.23375334]

>>23373203
Spengler thread!
Also, I have to disagree, we live in just the righ time to see the dying breaths of Faustian constitutionalism and its transition to Caesarism. Mind you, this transition will not be mediated by figures in the Vein of Caesar, Sulla, or Augustus, because those forms are from an alien world-system and world-vision.
The Faustian Caesar, to my interpretation, and some other's finds its shape in the charismatic Businessman-Philanthropist-Commander. People like Donald Trump, or Elon Musk will be the Caesars of the age, for better or worse.
>>23373274
They all said this. The old gods are eternal, those stalwart conservatives tell you, but you look outside their hermitages and no one takes those silly idols seriously.
Soon, your ancestors may sink into mysticism and absorb whatever garbage flows in from foreign lands. Who knows, your great grand-child may very well be an affiliate to a self-help cult about Our Lady of Guadalupe!
>>23374232
Spengler specifically talks about the total erosion of any social differences as a culture enters late stage civilization. Early stage civilization is not much better nut it's less apaprent. All defining features of western identity as it used to exist are being quickly eroded away and replaced with a formless mass, what Spengler called the fourth state.
The worst part about this current social revolution is that there will probably be a reaction attempting to impose a forced and artificial 'RETVRN TO TRADTION' long after the guy is out of the bag.
>>23374460
Spengler believed all societies go through a similar but not identical set of economico-political phases that are nonetheless warped by the specific culture and world-vision of the people.

[Anonymous No.23375354]

>>23375334
>People like Donald Trump, or Elon Musk will be the Caesars of the age, for better or worse.
By God! We truly are in the darkest times.

[Anonymous No.23375384]

>>23375354
It's just the form Faustian Caesarism seems to take at it's most comfortable: The politically active businnes-man politician. Instead of using military power to circumvent the faltering rules of the constitutional states, he uses money and enterprise.
It has precursors in figures like Cecill Rhodes, Henry Ford, and all those other politically/socially active 19th century/gilded age billionaires.
If you want a real shiver-inducing example, take Peter Thiel as an example of the same.

[Anonymous No.23375447]

>>23375384
Money is such an abstract concept wish people stop thinking of it as if it was something concrete

[Anonymous No.23375452]

>>23375384
Confused its for it's.
Over.

[Anonymous No.23375456]

>>23375222
''The Poverty of Historicism'', I assume. Thought it could be an essay from a more general collection of his writings.

[Anonymous No.23375460]

Return to tradition.

[Anonymous No.23375465]

Embrace the old ways.

[Anonymous No.23375469]

>>23375447
Look, it is not about the money, it is about the power they wield through it. Their companies and everything within that, their social and political clout; their capacity for innovation, to fight against the state's attempts to castrate them, which is the main conflict of early Caesarism.

[Anonymous No.23375471]

Your ancestors call out to you.

[Anonymous No.23375477]

>>23375469
Cecil Rhodes, Ford etc, weren't powerful because they were rich, they were powerful because of where that fortune stemmed and what it went into.

[Anonymous No.23375479]

Come home, white man.

[Anonymous No.23375486]

Respect your heritage.

[Anonymous No.23375496]

[Anonymous No.23375502]

[Anonymous No.23375714]

>>23375334
>Soon, your ancestors may sink into mysticism and absorb whatever garbage flows in from foreign lands
you meant descendants, right?

[Anonymous No.23375752]

>>23375714
Yes.
I am just retarded. I will not be spared. Somehow, I didn't notice that. I apologize,

[Anonymous No.23375756]

>>23375752
Don't worry, we all make small mistakes. Now that you've noticed your mistake, next time you'll do better. Take it easy anon.

[Anonymous No.23375770]

>>23375714
>>23375334
>soon
It's already happening. Look at the prevalence of anime, and Eastern theology with narcissists. Worse yet, the way that virtually all of Western Europe act like Americans.
The West has fallen.

[Anonymous No.23375772]

>>23373203
Indisputably the instinct of preservation is stronger than one commonly supposes: the Roman Empire maintained itself in a state of dissolution for half a thousand years. The period of two-thousand years, which great historic civilisations have hitherto covered in their evolution from barbarism back to barbarism, would carry ourselves to somewhere about the middle of the next millennium. Can one imagine the state of barbarism at which we shall have arrived, if our social system continues for another six-hundred years or so in the footsteps of the declining Roman world-dominion? I believe that the Saviour's second advent, expected by the earliest Christians in their lifetime, and later cherished as a mystic dogma, might have a meaning for that future date, and perchance amid occurrences not totally unlike those sketched in the Apocalypse. For, in the conceivable event of a relapse of our whole Culture into barbarism, we may take one thing for granted: namely, that our Historical science, our criticism and chemistry of knowledge would also have come to end; whilst it may be hoped, on the contrary, that Theology would by then have come to a final agreement with the Gospels, and the free understanding of Revelation be opened to us without Jehovaistic subtleties—for which event the Saviour promised us his coming back.
And this would inaugurate a genuine popularisation of the deepest Knowledge. In this or that way to prepare the ground for cure of ills inevitable in the evolution of the human race—much as Schiller's conception of the Maid of Orleans foreran its confirmation by historical documents—might fitly be the mission of a true Art appealing to the Folk itself, to the Folk in its noblest, and at present its ideal sense. Again, to even now prepare the ground for such an Art, sublimely popular, and at all times so to prepare it that the links of oldest and of noblest art shall never wholly sunder, our instant efforts may not seem altogether futile. In any case, to such works of art alone can we ascribe ennobling Popularity; and none save this dreamt-of Popularity can react on the creations of the present, uplifting them above the commonness of what is known to-day as popular favour.

[Anonymous No.23375806]

>>23375770
until which century do you anons think the phase in which we're in and the phase of Caesarism will pass, and how will it?

[Anonymous No.23375811]

>>23375806
In my opinion, it'll either happen "soon" (i.e. sometime in the next 100 years) OR not for several generations.

[Anonymous No.23375835]

>>23375811
idk what to think of this. I guess it's unfortunate that i won't be able to witness the other parts of the cycle and experience them for myself. Other people could argue otherwise; that no one would want to live through the last parts of the cycle. What do you think?

[Anonymous No.23375888]

[Anonymous No.23375894]

>>23375888
what is this and why are you posting it?

[Anonymous No.23375917]

>>23375835
I think it's impossible to give a true opinion. On one hand, this feels most hellish. On the other, I believe it is impossible for us Children of Winter to really even be able to conceive of anything different. We'd both be totally unrecognisable in terms of how we act in another time.
I suppose I can't complain.

[Anonymous No.23375929]

>>23375770
I mean, yeah, this is an emergent process. It doesn't happen out of nowhere one day.
The syncretic mystery cults of the Apollonians started up long before the Roman empire. They just culminated during it.
It's funny to speculate what cultural flotsam might get captured by them next, though.
Also, alongside this you'll see Qanon type autism and weird tranny-spirituality sprinkled throughout.
>>23375772
You have not tried to understand Spengler. You mention Rome, but neglect to mention that according to Spengler the Rome of Greco-Romans reached its final form with Aurelian, and thereafter valiantly faced ravaging hordes that would end the remnants of their civilization until the bitter end. While the east, which lasted nearly a thousand more years, was absorbed by the nascent middle.eastern Abrahamic (mostly) culture. Eastern Rome, and thereafter Byzantium, was not hellenic Rome, but something else, much younger and much more vital. Byzantium then went through an entire civilizational life cycle until it perished a little after becoming Fellaheen.
>>23375806
According to Ozzy Spengon we ARE in Caesarism right now. Since 2000. Just very early Caesarism, don't expect IMPERIVM to come any time soon. But maybe in your lifetime...
>And this would inaugurate a genuine popularisation of the deepest Knowledge.
Actually just a geriatric attempting to crawl back into a figurative uterus. A moribund culture seeks its origins in the mysticism of its youth.

[Anonymous No.23375941]

>>23375917
>this feels most hellish
i agree with this.
>On the other, I believe it is impossible for us Children of Winter to really even be able to conceive of anything different. We'd both be totally unrecognisable in terms of how we act in another time.
i guess. Since we are the product of our environments, we are now making a judgement on experiences beyond our comprehension. Even if we make an assumption on how we would feel if born, or surviving until another time.

Current life feels like a prison from every considerable perspective. People who remain optimistic are deluded.

[Anonymous No.23375960]

>>23375941
>People who remain optimistic are deluded.
Well, I'm optimistic insofar as it doesn't make activities such as procreation utterly meaningless, and that not all of human civilisation will be like this forever. Furthermore, I like to entertain that things are happening now, and I do somewhat believe that this is, indeed, the early age of Caesarism.
But I know I probably won't even see the finalised fruits of Caesarism anyways, nor will I see civilisation heal.

[Anonymous No.23375963]

>>23375929
>According to Ozzy Spengon we ARE in Caesarism right now. Since 2000
how do you think this cycle is going to end? The state of things looks grim.
Also i guess i'll read all of Spengler's works to see what he thinks man ought to do depending on which part of the cycle he's in. Would be interesting to see his perspective.

[Anonymous No.23375965]

>>23375929
>You have not tried to understand Spengler. You mention Rome, but neglect to mention that according to Spengler the Rome of Greco-Romans reached its final form with Aurelian, and thereafter valiantly faced ravaging hordes that would end the remnants of their civilization until the bitter end. While the east, which lasted nearly a thousand more years, was absorbed by the nascent middle.eastern Abrahamic (mostly) culture. Eastern Rome, and thereafter Byzantium, was not hellenic Rome, but something else, much younger and much more vital. Byzantium then went through an entire civilizational life cycle until it perished a little after becoming Fellaheen.
It's not my words, it's Wagners. Who had a much greater understanding of history than a pseudo-scientist like Spengler.

[Anonymous No.23375968]

>>23375963
>how do you think this cycle is going to end? The state of things looks grim
Well, Caesarism is merely a blip in the middle of collapse, not the cure for it. Unfortunately.

[Anonymous No.23375996]

>>23375929
>The syncretic mystery cults of the Apollonians started up long before the Roman empire
In Anatolia and the Near East, right?

[Anonymous No.23376021]

>>23375917
Good for you, there are people who aren't from the west in this God-forsaken world. Their opinons are biased too, of course. But you know, different perspectives.
>>23375963
>how do you think this cycle is going to end?
Do you mean the Meta Culture-Vision cycle or western Culture-Civilization. If it's the latter then it will end like all other's, a few hundred years in the future the last vestiges of adaptability will fade away, it will take on final form and the civilization will sink back into whence it came. Fellaheendom is like pre-culture but worse.
>The state of things looks grim.
Hold fast my friend, like Spengler once said, like the sentinel who stood watch in Pompey one must accept their fate with open arms.
>Also i guess i'll read all of Spengler's works to see what he thinks man ought to do depending on which part of the cycle he's in.
No oughts, only probabilities. But here's a primer on the stages of the cycle using a biological analogy.
Pre-culture: Incapable, brimming with hope and energy, essentially childhood.
Spring: Youth, adolescence, Energy and foolishness, naïvete.
Summer: Adulthood, mature creative and mental capacity, peak of creativity and physical potency.
Autumn: Middle age, Plateu of capacities, expansion, slow degradation.
Winter: Early old age, diminishing mental, physical and creative capabilities, unadaptability, uncertainty, crisis.
Post-culture: Senility; Impotency, chained to the past, low physical and mental capacity/acuity.
Take into account a Fellaheen people may one day recapture the spark of culture and be-invigorated. Because pre and post culture are essentially the same, Post culture transitions to pre culture, but very slowly.
>>23375965
Ah, well, I doubt it. But we must agree to disagree on this, wagnerfag. Because this quote is pointing north while Spengler is in the West. SO to speak.
>>23375996
Yes, Isis. Mithras, they then went to Rome where they explode into their most popular forms. Along with these, the Roman aristocracy also had a fancy for Religions like Judaism and the cult of Sol Inivictus. It's in Juvenal somewhere.
The Faustian version of this might be a bunch of Scientology and NXIVM clones plus insane Qanon and tranny Vtuber shit. This is only speculation, though.

[Anonymous No.23376057]

>>23376021
>No oughts, only probabilities.
Spengler also said that those who merely seek comfort, do not deserve to exist. What does he mean by this? ( this was in Hour of Decision, so i might as well read it to find out )

[Anonymous No.23376064]

>>23376021
>But we must agree to disagree on this, wagnerfag. Because this quote is pointing north while Spengler is in the West. SO to speak.
I can accept that. They have different philosophies belonging to different centuries, despite the overlap.

[Anonymous No.23376172]

>>23375888
y2k > aero >>>>> memphis >>>>>>>>>>>> dogshit > flat

[Anonymous No.23376208]

>>23375460
Refuted by J.J McCullough (PBUH) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9P7H87sdV7k

[Anonymous No.23376282]

>>23376208
>no fun allowed
what a fag

[Anonymous No.23376306]

>>23376282
facts don't care about your feelings

[Anonymous No.23376652]

>>23376057
It's an instatiation to action. The hour of decision was a cry for europeans to awake and change their course.
It went unheeded.