[ 3 / biz / cgl / ck / diy / fa / ic / jp / lit / sci / vr / vt ] [ index / top / reports ] [ become a patron ] [ status ]
2023-11: Warosu is now out of extended maintenance.

/lit/ - Literature

View post   
File: 472 KB, 1920x1080, calvin2.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2329685 No.2329685 [Reply] [Original]

dear /lit/, I offer up to you a poem. please critique it. feel free to verbally rape my writing abilities, I will be able to take it

‘Jigsaw Falling Into Place’

My shield, my buffer, my reason for treason;
How I have abused and confused myself over you.
Replacing one pain with a lesser one,
Escalating it to the truest truth,
A triumph of emotion over reason.

Picked you up from the shambles of my love,
Painted the picture for this shoddy puzzle,
Picked through what I had created and
Pieced you back together with only the loveliest pieces.
My twisted creation, perfect and pure personified,
Michelle.

>> No.2329700
File: 24 KB, 289x426, 1271913722150.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2329700

bump

>> No.2329715

I'd be happy to criticise your poem if you will post it, so far all I see is prose.

your prose is shit

>> No.2329725
File: 24 KB, 500x313, it was different back then.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2329725

beta as fuck

>> No.2329765

>>2329725
how so?
>>2329715
noob as fuck question here; what's the difference between a poem and prose?

>> No.2329796

Just look at all those shitty abstractions.

>> No.2329802

the main problem i have with this is it's not very good

ugh i need to get back to work

>> No.2329977

>>2329802
>>2329796
explain further please

>> No.2329984

>>2329977
ttry reading it aloud

>> No.2330006

>>2329984
it flows to me......:(

>> No.2330029

>Jigsaw Falling Into Place
This is the name of a Radiohead song, if I'm not mistaken. This is not a very promising title - it foreshadows cliches. Poetry is all about originality and memorability, to me.
>reason for treason
This is very crude soundplay. Rappers make better plays on words than this. I'd recommend reading some Dylan Thomas, whose soundplay is very sophisticated, to get a feel for how to do it well. Listen to/read Under Milk Wood:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xy0srtmv3og
http://oedipa.tripod.com/thomas.html
The sound of this poem makes it one of my personal favourites:
http://www.poetryfoundation.org/poem/178641

Now it's my turn to use a cliche: show, don't tell. Let us narrow down your poem into abstractions - don't do it for us. Recount an incident with Michelle that shows us that she is "twisted creation, perfect and pure personified" and all the rest. Read some Ezra Pound to learn about this:
http://www.poetry-archive.com/p/the_garden.html

Keep at it OP. What poets do you like, out of interest?

>> No.2330039

>>2330029
thank you for all the advice! I agree, this was not a very good poem. I will take all your advice and go over your links and whatnot. I don't really have any favorite poets. writer-wise, I particularly enjoy Hemingway and Steinbeck.

>> No.2330046

>>2330029
could you critique this one? It is my favorite one and in my opinion my best-written one. still, feel free to rip into it. I very much value any advice. poem is too long so I'll post it after

>> No.2330051

>>2330046
She made me feel like poetry wasn’t enough.
When we listened to Jeff Buckley cry ‘Hallelujah,’
In a dusty disused single apartment room, sitting still before the laptop laid on a worn and carved old desk,
Facing full length windows struck with fat drops of the April rain,
While gray clouds darkened the red and gold leaves hanging from black branches,
Ignoring the moving world

I sat and she leaned on me,
Winding her arms around my chest and the music soared and her heart pounded to the electric beat,
Pounded for me.

I knew only that I wanted more than anything
To write something, to do anything, that would make her heart pound like that.
I can still feel it, hot on my warm neck in the dust against the dusky rain.

I smell her breath and feel her hair,
Sliding down the front of my bare chest,
And I feel her lips resting softly against my eyes
And hear her breathe in the dark mornings
When I couldn’t sleep for fear I would lose my waking dreams.

She begged me to be real and I tried but we died and she cried.

I could not stop dreaming, could not live in the world of concrete reality –
How could I, when she, reality spun from a fervid, half-believed and worshipped dream, waited for me?

>> No.2330057

>>2330029
Under Milk Wood is my favourite play of all time, but its humour is very British

>> No.2330061

>>2330051
cont:

She was like tea in October,
When death is in the air and children are in the streets and you don’t care,
Because what you hold in your hands is hot and strong and sweet and makes you feel alive,
And you don’t want to let it go.

It’s hazy now, but they still come to me,
The sensual memories and pangs of moments passed,
Scenes from around the world and the promises we made.

But I wasn’t enough to give her what she gave me:
Yellowed visions of autumn days and winter nights,
Early morning sighs of contentment that haunt me even today, blackmailing me into writing this,
Even if it will only ever reach the eyes of the half that is yearning to pull away, like a mutt tied to a stake;

Even if it fails to make her heart beat hard and fast for me, for me.

>> No.2330067

>>2330051
>disused

How can it be disused if you're using it?

>> No.2330070

>>2330061
This is a shitty poem man, edit it like fuck before reposting

>> No.2330086

:( tips and advice please? /lit/ you break my heart

>> No.2330091

>>2330051
I remember seeing this in another poetry thread. I was quite impressed. I can see that this is much more grounded in memorable concrete images than the first poem, so well done for that. I quite like the free-flowing style - it reminds me a lot of Frank O'Hara. It has a sort of urgency and earnestness that I like. If I were to be a critical, I would say that the overall sentiment is perhaps a little... over-sentimental. Perhaps too sweet like a romantic film. But I like the way you wrote about the writing of the poem - nice way to explore the effect that your relationships have on your writing. I like that. So, yeah - I think more original/striking observation is what you need. I'm not sure how to develop that though - I suppose only reading more poetry and thinking about it in your everyday life can develop that.

I like it - I'd give it a 7/10.

>> No.2330095

>>2330091
would reading more poetry be the main way to improve my poetry? what else can I do?

>> No.2330114

>>2330095
Well, there are writing exercises as well. Like I've been getting into automatic writing lately, and using elements of what I produce to write my poems. I think when reading poetry, you have to figure out what chimes with you and why. Think about what you read during the day and see parallels between real life and reading. It's much easier to write something good if it's honest and based in real life - so know what to look for in everyday life and it will help you write.

>> No.2330133

>>2329685
This thread makes me blush of embaressment.

Tips to OP.
Show dont tell. Dont be so abstract. If you love someone, tell them with words that really mean something.

Imagine someone giving you this poem. Or rather, record yourself reading the poem and play it to yourself.

>> No.2330137

>>2330095
Yes, read poetry. Find sentences and words that you like, write them up in a notebook to remember them. Use them later on in conversation.

>> No.2330144

>>2330133
http://vocaroo.com/?media=vn75v4UoUksxXRCkf

I love doing this.

>> No.2330146

>>2330133
you spelled embarrassment wrong. however, I do not disagree with you; I do not doubt that my first poem is terrible and the second one I posted is also lacking.
please, some tips on showing rather than telling. I'm reading ezra pound and..it's still hard to truly understand how to show rather than tell

>> No.2330148

>>2330144
lol good man. OP here and there's no way in hell I'm listening to that shit.

>> No.2330185

>>2330146
With show dont tell it means.
Instead of writing:
Michelle was in love with tom.
You instead write:
Michelles palms always became sweaty and she blushed and started to stutter when Tom entered the room.

Or instead of:
It was a cold day in january.

The wind howled at the window pane as the falling snow outside created huge banks where the cars got stuck. Not even the kids that usually could be find building snowmen and making angels in the snow could be seen on this day.

Or something to that extent. These are terribly shitty and cliche examples but still.

>> No.2330205

Can I hijack this thread and just turn it into a general poetry critique thread? Because I've got one that i've been wanting to share but i don't really think that we need two critique threads going at once. I'll nitpick yours OP in a separate reply. Deal?

>> No.2330211

>>2330205
I'm not OP either, but I think this is a good idea. Please do it. I might share some of my own as well.

>> No.2330235

>>2330185
General poetry writer tip:
Start reading poetry.
You'll never know what is good or bad if you don't read it.
Most people have an idea of what "poetry" is but it generally fall short of the truth.
Also, take your time with poetry.
Edit it not once or twice but perhaps 20 times.
Rest between each sitting so you dont stare yourself blind on the text.
And if you prompt must write poetry for some fucking girl, then just show it to dat fucking bitch.
Why would we want to read it? How could we possibly relate.

>> No.2330236

>>2330205

From above, Orion shook his finger
At us exploring each other’s heart lines,
Floating through scattered sidewalks,
Attempting to rethread our cracked moments
Amidst dogs barking,
Parents pestering,
Taillights speeding,
Sluttish time spinning away.
We gazed hapless at the twinkle
Of window lights laced together,
Meant to reflect between our eyes,
Dizzied by the spinning of our stars,
The legendary dust of creation
Happening to blow into one another
Helpless in the cosmic wind,
Gripping tight to our universal ignorance,
Hoping to hold on for a small infinity more.


Thinking about titling it "Seasonal Asterisms" for various reasons but idk, i feel like a douche titling things that only some people will get. So if anything comes to mind, feel free to throw out a better title.
(And while it is largely irrelevant... punctuation help? like i really have no clue as how to punctuate poetry properly or if there are any rules to follow)

Also, going to work on OP's first piece.

>> No.2330283

>>2330236
Some nice images, but I think your syntax is a bit repetitive - ing, ing, ing. It seemed like it was for emphasis at first, but by the end it seemed like it came down to lack of invention. As for punctuation, perhaps your poem would benefit by less of it at the end of lines. Try only using commas if they are needed midline - it might improve the overall aesthetic of your poem. See TS Eliot's Hollow Men for an example. This is just an idea - maybe it's better, maybe not:

From above, Orion shook his finger
At us exploring each other’s heart lines
Floating through scattered sidewalks
Attempting to rethread our cracked moments
Amidst dogs barking
Parents pestering
Taillights speeding
Sluttish time spinning away.

We gazed hapless at the twinkle
Of window lights laced together
Meant to reflect between our eyes
Dizzied by the spinning of our stars
The legendary dust of creation
Happening to blow into one another
Helpless in the cosmic wind
Gripping tight to our universal ignorance
Hoping to hold on for a small infinity more.

>> No.2330288

>>2330283
Also, I'm not a fan of "sluttish time". It seems a little crude, and not in a good way.

>> No.2330294

>>2329765
You can't be serious? How can one, attempting to write poetry, not know that distinction?

>> No.2330307

>>2330294
>>2330294
Well, in modern times the two have been rather juxtaposed.

>> No.2330313

>>2329685
>>2330205
>‘Jigsaw Falling Into Place’
c'mon now. you can do better. it doesn't really advance the theme you're trying to present other than warning the reader that this is going to be a cliche love poem.

>My shield, my buffer, my reason for treason;
never use rhyme just for the sake of having your poem rhyme. and i understand the idea youre trying to present with shield and buffer but they arent cohesive with treason and lack in subtlety.
>How I have abused and confused myself over you.
>Replacing one pain with a lesser one,
hmmmmm... too early to judge. i like how you tied the fist lines idea of protection to replacing pain, but i'm not sure about the "abused and confused." it seems like a 2 steps forward, one step back kind of thing.
Escalating it to the truest truth,
>make sure every word you say in a poem is essential, original, and not redundant. also chose verbs wisely.
A triumph of emotion over reason.
> not bad, but again. not sure what the subject of your poem is and the theme that you are trying to get across to the reader. do you love her? are you using her? is she using you? it seems like unnecessarily vagueness masked by high poetic diction.

cont below

>> No.2330314

>>2330313
>Picked you up from the shambles of my love,
how/why was your love in shambles? this all seems very confused. i cant tell what character roles you are trying to place the lovers in.
>Painted the picture for this shoddy puzzle,
is this just in here because of the title? seems a bit out of place.
>Picked through what I had created and
>Pieced you back together with only the loveliest pieces.
flows well i guess.
>My twisted creation, perfect and pure personified,
you are trying to create a more beautiful lover? yet she is "twisted." and pure personified does not sit well with me either. it flattens the characters and your poem. the girl just doesnt seem realistic. i understand the brokenness and coming back together, yet you paint it very bleakly and selfishly.
>Michelle.
MICHELLEEEEE MY BELLE snhuuahh vwahh blaw twuh something, tres bien ensemble, tres bien ensemble. that's all i get from that line. and it might work if you are solely giving it to that woman or reading outside her window or something of the like. but if it is just for her, tie the little things that make her unique into the poem as opposed to just her name. anyone can put a name at the end of a poem.

idk. Its not atrocious at all, I’m just being harsh. Like, if you were to read this to me I wouldn’t cringe, but it could easily be edited and improved. you dont have to take anything of what i say seriously. i'm no more of a poet than you are. but that's just what i would say if i was in a class and asked to analyze this piece. it comes together more as you read, but yeah... i would mostly stress subtly, word choice, originality, characterization and organization. just things to keep in mind. good luck bro!

>> No.2330357

>>2330283
i can defiantly see how i went a bit "over-parallel" with the ing, ing, ine now. i wanted to keep the action list "pestering...speeding" like that, but yeah. i suck at verb tenses. in fact, i can see how changing the rest of the ing's might hopefully offset that?

also, i started out with no commas and added them later. i'm in the misdt of looking through similar pieces and seeing which i like better. i currently modeled the end punctuation after "Dulce et Decorum Est" because it matched the sortof sentence structure i was going after the best. but if you know of pieces of similar length or formatting, please recommend. The second best i found was "And then we cowards" by Cesar Pavese, so i might toy with something like that.

>>2330288
i agree sluttish time is crude, but i'm a sucker (as is my professor) for Shakespearean allusions. And i thought it fit well with the underlying motif of holding onto innocence... maybe it didnt work as well as i wanted it to.

thanks guys. defiantly going to play with the verb tenses. and if anyone is curious about what an editing process can do you should see the first draft of that poem. it makes me retch.

>> No.2330361

>>2330307
improper use of the word juxtaposed. you are not helping your case sir.

>> No.2330368

What do you think of mine, /lit/?:

churning I
swirling world
quivering pillar of reason
burning void
shattered ours
my love how well we fall

alternatively:

churning we,
burning world
quivering pillar of doubt
swirling void
consumes all ours
Haha how well we fall

>> No.2330369

>>2330307
In Rhyme's Reason, John Hollander explains that the "building blocks" of poetry are non-literal language. Verse, traditional or non, is the design you use to arrange these building blocks.

>> No.2330378

>>2330369
One mans opinion I would say.

>> No.2330385 [DELETED] 

Are you bukowski and dickinsons teenage love child? But no, really. I think the "haha" makes it seem a little amateur. And i don't quite get the "alternatively:"... why not just make it a part of the stanza. overall, i like the way you switched up "burning" and "swirling." has a nice effect and a unique style.

>> No.2330393

>>2330368
Are you Bukowski and Dickinson's teenage love child? But no, really. I think the "haha" makes it seem a little amateur. And i don't quite get the "alternatively:"... why not just make it a part of the stanza. overall, i like the way you switched up "burning" and "swirling." has a nice effect and a unique style.

>> No.2330415
File: 23 KB, 517x282, disappearances.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2330415

>>2330378
Yeah, probably. I like his explanation though, because it draws a distinction between poetry and verse - an advert jingle may be verse, but probably isn't poetry. Frank O'Hara on the other hand, without rhyme or metre, is poetry.

Pic is something I wrote.

>> No.2330451

>>2330415

I don't know shit about poetry but I enjoyed that one

>> No.2330455

You mean "A Jigsaw PIECE falling into place".

>> No.2330519

Another poetfag here, check this shit out:

You birth the cancer
that is addictive and more
You quit the addict
that is now in impotence
Sudden is your stroke
at the throat that is still
Double is your damage
as you risk more and more now
By the passive blind that is growing
and the still unborn that are clogged
In his macular cell
the Smoke King kills

I made this using only words from the backs of various cigarette packs. Does it work or is it a piece of shit?

>> No.2330540

>>2330519
Is it meant to lack punctuation?

>> No.2330548

>>2330540

I guess so. Maybe I shouldve put spaces between every two lines

>> No.2330550

>>2330455
> metonymy
> The use of a single characteristic or name of an object to identify an entire object or related object.

>> No.2331024

hey guys, OP here. glad to see that I'm not the only (incredibly) amateur writer here.
here's another random poem of mine; it's more spontaneous and unedited than my other stuff but I'm curious as to what you guys think

‘the dove will make everything okay’

A boy in a hot air balloon floats away,
30000 children die.
crystallized angel dust and lies,
children born never to play.
meaning is jammed into the meaningless;
found by the ones who couldn’t care less,
meaning is jammed into the meaningless;
shoved down the throats of the ones who couldn’t care more.
explosions of sorrow and cruelty,
blanketed by the enormous wings of the white dove.
with wings spread it soars high above,
selecting which rays of light reach our eyes.
a short marriage captured in photos,
with not a single glimpse of entire genocides.
thousands of words exchanged from behind pedestals;
who’s even listening?