Learning how to talk

[Anonymous No.23246583]

How do I become more articulate, in not just writing but also speaking? I used to think it was knowing a wide range of vocabulary but there's clearly some core syntactical problem that eludes me. Maybe it has to do with the way my thoughts are structured in my head, maybe it has to do with how I translate those into language, maybe it's something else. Regardless, I'm noticing it more and more and it makes me reluctant to speak because I realize how stupid and discursive everything I say is. There's no drive or direction and so many words feel extraneous. I feel like there's some hidden dimension to speaking that's perpetually out of my reach. Are there resources for me to learn how to get the most out of every word and really grasp the structure of language and use it to my advantage. Would studying and reciting poetry or the speeches of famous orators help with this?

[Anonymous No.23246588]

>>23246583
Believe it or not the key is to move your hands while talking. You can better feel the shape of your speech that way. Think of the truly great orators throughout history. They all use gestures while speaking. It's not just for dramatic effect, it's a way to keep yourself on track.

[Anonymous No.23246726]

Your post reads fine to me. Reading poetry/speeches/well-constructed prose will help most if you're simply unfamiliar with good English but it sounds like that's not really your problem. Just talk to yourself. Formulate your thoughts out loud, make them cohere into a complete, pleasing form, notice when you express them inadequately or can't complete them and try again.

[Anonymous No.23246737]

>>23246583
Go outside and talk to people, and listen to how they speak. You'll notice that in comparison you sound stilted and rambling. Normal people value efficiency in words and you just took an entire paragraph of waffling pseudo-intellectual BS to say something that could've been 1-2 short sentences - this isn't high school, you're not trying to meet a word count here.

[Anonymous No.23247399]

>>23246737
>Go outside and talk to people, and listen to how they speak. You'll notice that in comparison you sound stilted and rambling. Normal people value efficiency in words and you just took an entire paragraph of waffling pseudo-intellectual BS to say something that could've been 1-2 short sentences - this isn't high school, you're not trying to meet a word count here.

This. Real life teaches you brevity and conciseness, specially when dealing with other people.

You're too stuck in your head, OP.

[Anonymous No.23247415]

>>23246737
I thought it was important to detail exactly how I feel so the advice can be catered more specifically

[Anonymous No.23247416]

>>23246583
Where's the central guy supposed to be looking exactly? Only two others in the background are looking forward and their eyes are fixed on the same trajectory which is far below the central guy. The man behind the central guy is looking even higher. Did the guy who painted this have depth perception problems?

[Anonymous No.23247439]

>>23247415
You did fine and your words read just fine, the other faggot's trying too hard. This isn't a real-life social setting, you're allowed to distend your language a bit. I have the same problem and you articulated it better than me, I've also become hyper-aware of this intangible quality that I am missing and I can safely say you didn't ping my radar for it.

[Anonymous No.23247546]

>>23246583
The Benjamin would take a piece of writing that he was fond of, take a few words out, reread the passage and fill them in, leave it for a few days, repeat, and work his way up to recreating the passage using the style that his brain abstracted from this process and adhering to the general essence; Benny was a massive autist though. I'd say write, read, and feel (i.e. try to feel the world less through the medium of language when you don't have to, doing this you will have more material to work with) more.

[Anonymous No.23247579]

Where do you guys dispose of your cum? I was reading one of today's top threads on Reddit about bad habits in your partners and one of the top discussions was about a man who cummed in his wife's trash can. I kept reading this discussion over the afternoon and saw a lot of complaints about the smell that cum generates, which worried me because I don't notice a smell. I usually just cum in my laundry hamper, but now I'm starting to worry that it leaves a smell which will cause my wife to get suspicious that I'm masturbating. I can't cum in the shower because if the drain gets blocked from the cum she will get suspicious and sometimes I leave stains on the bath tile without noticing it. Ive tried using the toilet before but I can't cum in a standing position, and for me it's too awkward to lie down next to the toilet with the septic smell. What are most guys with wives doing with theirs? I had heard that some guys like to eat it from their hand afterwards but I don't like the taste and I'm not keen on having the stench of cum on my breath or getting my anus 'lubed up' with my own semen and getting a case of the faggot farts. Are men just expected not to cum on things?

[Anonymous No.23247597]

what took me absolute years to learn was that learning how to talk can never be learned like a discursive step by step process of 'do this, then this, then this, then when they are doing this do this' - such mechanical instructions, EVEN IF THEY ARE TECHNICALLY CORRECT, because good speakers display those characteristics, are wrong BECAUSE THEY ARE MECHANICAL. all good speech is organic, natural, free flowing, more akin to improvisational piano than memorising a particular composition. the more you try to mechanically copy 'good speech', the more it will unwittingly become stilted and forced.

instead, you have the more difficult task of making speech beautiful without the aid of discursive techniques. this means that rather than whats happening in the particulars of your speech, what matters more is EVERYTHING ELSE YOU ARE DOING IN YOUR LIFE. the speech is a summation and expression of everything else happening in your life.

to keep things brief, some of these rules centred around abolition of restlessness and blameworthy behaviour will create a natural confidence which enhances all speech-
-no lying
-spend time in nature
-spend more time in quiet contemplation
-minimise distracting behaviours
-minimise sensual activities
-minimise idle talk in daily life, try to speak only when there is a genuine purpose
-read beautiful books written in simple language - Plato, Seneca, Plutarch, Xenophon, Cicero, Vitruvius, Quintillian, Tacitus,

the other really important thing, despite it sounding strange, is to QUIT MASTURBATION. its talked about in Think and Grow Rich, but the retention of sexual energy is a great natural vitalising of ones behaviour and speech

[Anonymous No.23247632]

>>23246583
Writing every day made a huge difference for me. It took time. Years, actually, but I still see incremental improvements in my ability to express myself
>extemporaneously
.

[Anonymous No.23247646]

>>23247597
good post. strong, clear speech can only be an effect of other things. I have never, ever, ever succeeded in writing or saying something beautiful after sitting down with the express intent of writing or saying something beautiful. take care of your energy-system, plug its leaks, and the speech will come

[Anonymous No.23247980]

>>23246583
You have to have drive to develop conversations. For drive you need a passion or some way to view things.

First I'd practice just speaking for hours only about what other people want to and forcing yourself to find an interest in it.

I think debating is a helpful practice too but in the same line where you practice "steelmanning" or arguing against a stronger position.

Just define the sky and aim for it.

[Anonymous No.23247987]

>>23247980
Also syntax derives from words (like phonetics etc). What words you choose depends on some fundamental value (say onomatopeias etc).

[Anonymous No.23248148]

>>23246583
You won't like this, but talking to yourself all the time like a schizo makes you more articulated. Writing a journal is fine too but it only translates partially into speech.

[Anonymous No.23248231]

>>23246583
Quintilian has a book on Oration.
Largely forgotten person and work but I found my mothers bookshelf in the garage with it in it and read it in my teens, very foundational change for me to have read in my teens.

[Anonymous No.23248269]

>>23246737
Agreed, op sounds like the last time he touched pussy was when his mother queefed him out.