Did you know?

[Anonymous No.23229422]

David Irving admitted that “at least 4 million Jews perished in German concentration camps”

[Anonymous No.23229446]

>>23229422
Was this before or after he was threatened with jail time?

[Anonymous No.23229591]

>>23229422
He famously demonstrated that you don't even need to deny the numbers to be a "holocaust denier", only the way it was done and who knew about it.

[Anonymous No.23229986]

>>23229422
Are his books worth reading?

[Anonymous No.23230034]

>>23229591
Denying the way it was done and who did it changes the entire thing. By your logic Turkey is totally correct in denying the Armenian genocide as well

[Anonymous No.23230036]

>>23229422
>did you know the holocaust is still real
You know, if you left it alone, people might not question it

[Anonymous No.23230050]

>>23229422
Nobody denies that Jews were persecuted and killed by the nonsense; not even in the camps. The real debate is the exact number and was there a deliberate industrialized system of genocide ordered by Hitler?

[Anonymous No.23230055]

>>23230050
*Nazis

[Anonymous No.23230176]

>>23230050
>The real debate is the exact number and was there a deliberate industrialized system of genocide ordered by Hitler?
Read Christopher Browning. You're at least 40 years out of date on the state of the historiographical debate.

[Anonymous No.23230180]

Only four? Doesn't seem like that big a deal.

[Anonymous No.23230187]

>>23230034
You can say that to a certain extent if you talking about the idea of a top down systematic genocide directly from the head of state but I don't think he is denying the Holocaust per say currently if you've seen his stuff, like he's said in 2009 on one of his interviews at the time that he believes there was an ad-hoc plundering operation headed by the SS and camp officials but with a cover up to hide what was going from Hitler.

[Anonymous No.23230191]

>>23229986
Even if you disagree with him about jews he wrote the only Churchill biography worth reading

[Anonymous No.23230247]

Wait, that doesn't make sense. Even the mainstream historians say that only 3 million or so died in the camps.

[Anonymous No.23230662]

>>23229422
https://irvingbooks.com/blog/support-david-irving/

[Anonymous No.23230702]

>>23230247
>Even the mainstream historians say that only 3 million or so died in the camps.

Maybe Jews. Most people I read run a 2:2:2 camps : actions : marches.

This is of course ignoring other classifications in German & German-associated mass killing. Personally I find the blindness to Soviet Citizens in Aktions 1941, Starvation 1941, POW encampment to death 1941 to be pretty pathetic. It is some of the most interesting reading on process of mass killing.

[Anonymous No.23230706]

>>23230191
Not a fan of Roberts?

[γρηγορεύω !!J89a5VVZH9B No.23230715]

>>23229422
How would he be in a position to "admit" such a thing?

[Anonymous No.23230925]

>>23230050
>Nobody denies that Jews were persecuted and killed by the nonsense;
Ever been on 4chan?

[Anonymous No.23230936]

>>23230050
Watch this video its graphic https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vywGZzb9O4M&embeds_referring_euri=https%3A%2F%2Fyastatic.net%2Fvideo-player%2F0xe7891f6f377%2Fpages-common%2Fyoutube%2Fyoutube.html&source_ve_path=MjM4NTE&feature=emb_title

[Anonymous No.23231011]

>>23230925
They're obviously referencing the historiography. Non-historians are unpeople. We need to seek an endlösung.

[Anonymous No.23231266]

What nobody understands about the holocaust narrative is that it's not a moral question, it's simply a historical curiosity. Whether it happened or not doesn't change the ethical question of whether it's ok to kill jews. And the answer to that question is yes.

[Anonymous No.23231418]

>>23230034
Jews being shot instead of gassed, as Irving claims, really doesn't change the entire thing. The SS doing it without Hitler's knowledge, on the other hand, would change quite a bit.

[Anonymous No.23231568]

>>23231266
Well considering how they regard their host nations' lives in a contemporary setting, I'd say they'd ought to have had it coming

[γρηγορεύω !!J89a5VVZH9B No.23231588]

>>23230050
>Nobody denies that Jews were persecuted and killed by the Nazis
What are you talking about?

[Anonymous No.23231611]

Omg SQUEEE!!!! Thank you for posting this here!! I couldn't get enough of the posts on /pol/, fuck having hobbies, i need to hear about Jews everywhere i go!!! Let's indoctrinate these trannies, the people here definitely haven't heard about how bad Jews are and if anyone disagrees we will definitely persuade them and change their minds instead of getting into a 100+ reply argument that goes nowhere!!

[Anonymous No.23231675]

>>23231611
cope

[Anonymous No.23231678]

>>23231611
Ironically this thread was posted by a Jew/Jew-friend seeking to debunk Holocaust denial

[Anonymous No.23231688]

>>23231678
>Holocaust Denial
How you deny something?.
Burden of proof is on them though?
Can´t prove a negative,just cause reasonable doubt.
It works in the same in way a law perspective.
The phrase Holocaust Denial does not make sense.

[Anonymous No.23231690]

mao orders people to kill some birds and 40m+ people die
shit, japan rolls into china and supposedly kills 6m.
other people suggest nazis actively purging a people can't manage 3..4..6 or 6 mil? don't know man.
either way, why get hung up on it?

[Anonymous No.23231698]

>>23231690
Look at the definition and numbers of Holocaust survivors.
At the start of World War II in September 1939, about nine and a half million Jews lived in the European countries that were either already under the control of Nazi Germany or would be invaded or conquered, either willingly or by force during the war.[8][9] Almost two-thirds of these European Jews, nearly six million people, were annihilated, so that by the end of the war in Europe in May 1945, about 3.5 million of them had survived.[1][10] As of January 2024, about 245,000 survivors were alive.[11]
>The United States Holocaust Memorial Museum gives a broader definition of Holocaust survivors: "The Museum honors any persons as survivors, Jewish or non-Jewish, who were displaced, persecuted, or discriminated against due to the racial, religious, ethnic, social, and political policies of the Nazis and their collaborators between 1933 and 1945. In addition to former inmates of concentration camps, ghettos, and prisons, this definition includes, among others, people who lived as refugees or people who lived in hiding."[3]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocaust_survivors

[Anonymous No.23231699]

>>23231690
>Yad Vashem, the State of Israel's official memorial to the victims of the Holocaust, defines Holocaust survivors as Jews who lived under Nazi control, whether it was direct or indirect, for any amount of time, and survived it. This definition includes Jews who spent the entire war living under Nazi collaborationist regimes, including France, Bulgaria and Romania, but were not deported, as well as Jews who fled or were forced to leave Germany in the 1930s. Additionally, other Jewish refugees are considered Holocaust survivors, including those who fled their home countries in Eastern Europe to evade the invading German army and spent years living in the Soviet Union.[2]

[Anonymous No.23231700]

>>23231690
And Bolsheviks killed like 20 million Slavs, but we only learn about the jews in school

[Anonymous No.23231703]

I feel like some genius could write an alternate history of WW2 and its causes that isn't propaganda for either side but just "defamiliarizes" the whole period and approaches it with completely fresh eyes

It would almost require a phenomenological preface where you instruct the reader on how to bracket out his existing prejudices, some subtle way of guiding people to "just look at Germany like any other state." People are almost doing that in this thread itself and in the other Holocaust thread, but some genius could synthesize it into a really coherent method and do it elegantly in a preface.

[Anonymous No.23231704]

>>23231703
It´s gonna be interesting when the last WWII and last holocaust survivor dies,then what you are talking could be possible...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_last_surviving_World_War_II_veterans
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Holocaust_survivors
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legality_of_Holocaust_denial