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/lit/ - Literature

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22992866 No.22992866 [Reply] [Original]

>Someone says they don't like a classic
>Ask them to explain and they attempt to
>They literally just don't get it

Every single time. You think people would learn by now that to assume the answer to the question "Am I missing something here?" is always "Yes"

>> No.22992875

>>22992866
has it ever occurred to you that they might be right, and you're just attributing meaning that isn't there because you liked it?

>> No.22992879

There are classics that are actually bad, though.

>> No.22992881

>>22992879
Here we go...

Which one?

>> No.22992883

>>22992881
Lord of the Flies

>> No.22992885

>>22992875
Which classic are you referring to that you believe everyone except for you is putting in meaning that isn't there?

>> No.22992891

>>22992883
I will admit that there's not much for you in that novel if you aren't white.

But if you are white, it is a classic for a reason.

>> No.22992893

>>22992866
>someone says they like a classic
>ask them to explain and they attempt to
>they literally just say they like it or it was 'well written'

every single time.

>> No.22992896

>>22992885
none. I'm was trying to get you to rethink your idea that every single person you talk to is simply misunderstanding a book they don't like.

>> No.22992899

>>22992881
You diary desu

>> No.22992900

>>22992896
You've failed to do so by not giving me a concrete example in defiance of my original statement.

>> No.22992901

>>22992866
most people 'get' classics books
you are not special because you understand a fucking book, that is the point, almost everybody 'gets it'.
When will you animals understand that 95% of people, including yourselves judge books and stories almost entirely on emotion

>> No.22992902

>>22992900
Who talks like this

>> No.22992904

>>22992902
Myself, nigger.

>> No.22992905

>>22992891
It's a classic because people believe what it's trying to say. The only problem is just that it's completely wrong.

>> No.22992907

>>22992875
>and you're just attributing
All meaning is attributed. What a retarded fucking statement.

>> No.22992909

>>22992905
What do you believe people believe it is trying to say?

What do you believe the novel is actually saying?

>> No.22992911

>I didn't like it
>Oh yeah? Explain why or I'll bitch online
It must make you perpetually angry to know people like things you don't and vice versa

>> No.22992916

>>22992901
>most people 'get' classics books
Going out into the world and interacting with real people will quickly dissuade you from this delusion.

>> No.22992917

>>22992907
moron

>> No.22992918

>>22992909
>human nature bad
>human nature bad

>> No.22992920

>>22992911
I think more than people liking things I don't like, I'm more upset at people liking things I do like for the wrong reasons.

>> No.22992921

>>22992907
you know what I mean, dickhead

>> No.22992924

>>22992904
You forgot to capitalize your name.

>> No.22992928

>>22992924
I love how long it took you to come up with that and it still wasn't as witty as you hoped.

>> No.22992932

>>22992901
I don't think most people can "get it", and many that can are incapable of engaging with it beyond merely "understanding it". IMO the prerequisites are an IQ of above 100 and a correct attitude. The emotional aspect to enjoying classics among people who genuinely care is more of a sense of intellectual beauty, rather than just enjoying it because it hits the right buttons.

>> No.22992935

>>22992907
Much true! I attribute to your comment a meaning of "I suck cocks every day and eat nothing but human sperm"

>> No.22992937

>>22992904
It's very pseudesque

>> No.22992938

>>22992920
what are the right reasons?

>> No.22992941

>>22992938
They vary by the "thing" in question.

>> No.22992948

>>22992937
Thank you, Kafka is my muse.

>> No.22992949
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22992949

I believe that most people are unable of "getting" classic literature.

I believe the BIGGEST (but not only reason) for this is that most people lack a properly comfy chair for reading classic literature.

Without the correct chair, one cannot properly read the classics.

>> No.22992950

OP, you could at least tell us what book got you to post this thread so we have something tangible to talk about.

>> No.22992953

>>22992949
/thread

>> No.22992957

>>22992950
I think the conversation has gone on swimmingly without me having to do so.

You're more than welcome to provide your own counter-examples of classics you believe you "get" and still don't like.

>> No.22992960

>>22992941
OK, give me the right reasons for one or more of the following please
>Moby Dick
>Don Quixote
>The Sound and The Fury
>Great Expectations
>Orlando Furioso
show me the ways

>> No.22992968

>>22992866
>Don't like female authors, simple as

>> No.22992970

>>22992957
I've liked most of the classics I've read but one that I'm split on is The Great Gatsby.

>> No.22992972

>>22992921
No I don't.

>>22992935
Says more about you than me really.

>> No.22992973

>>22992960
Nta but
>Moby Dick
A modern epic in which you can feel the writer's passion in his words. This is what, once you start feeling it, makes the WHALE FACTS chapters some of your favourites

>> No.22992976

>>22992960
Here are the sorts of people I despise:
>Moby Dick
People who like it for being "the best American novel"
>Don Quixote
People who like it for being "a critique of the aristocracy"
>The Sound and The Fury
People who like if for "giving a voice to the voiceless"
>Great Expectations
People who like it for it being "not David Copperfield"
>Orlando Furioso
I'll admit that I've never met another soul who has read it. Perhaps if you give me your reasons for liking I can add some new hatreds my list.

>> No.22992979

>>22992881
Jane eyre

vanity fair

>> No.22992986

>>22992976
That is a list disliking people for liking books for the wrong reasons. What are the right reasons?

>> No.22992987

>>22992979
Jane Eyre is pretty fucking dumb. I didn't hate it or anything but it shows that writers got away with a lot more bullshit back in the day.

>> No.22992988

>>22992979
Most likely you lack a good grasp on the social context.

>> No.22993005

>>22992986
Moby Dick as a love poem for the death that humans must face at some point. Don Quixote as a treatise on the power of escapism. The Sound and the Fury as an American continuation to Joyce's prologue. Great Expectations as standing evidence to Dickens ability to actually write about things that matter. Orlando for giving modern Italians a soul to build their body around.

>> No.22993075

>>22992976
>People who like if for "giving a voice to the voiceless"
That was CM Punk actually

>> No.22993138

>>22992881
Dracula

>> No.22993143

>>22993138
That's unambiguously a classic though and the only people who disagree are filmtards who don't get that what the book does is impossible to render satisfactorily in a visual medium.

>> No.22993151

>>22993005
>Don Quixote as a treatise on the power of escapism.
Quixote is a treatise on the power of innocence, the imagination, and believing in something with every fiber of your being. That you can transform the world around you by simply believing in it with all sincerity and willing it into reality with the power od your heart and soul. Why in the second chapter he turns a whorehouse, pimp, and two prostitutes into a castle, a king, and two virginal ladies in waiting, simply by willing it into existence, and they start to believe it too. They mock him a little at first but then it becomes reality when they knight him.

Thinking it's a treatise on 'escapism' is far, far too shallow of an interpretation

as for Moby Dick, it's a treatise on existential crisis, which is different than facing "death".

>> No.22993156

>>22993143
I didn't say it's not a classic, I mean that it's dogshit, easily the worst classic I've read

>> No.22993159

>>22993156
You literally just didn't get it.

>> No.22993163

>>22993151
>Quixote is a treatise on the power of innocence, the imagination, and believing in something with every fiber of your bein

Right, escapism.

You refuse to acknowledge it as such because you believe escapism has an inherently negative connotation.

>> No.22993168

>>22993163
no, that isn't escapism, it transcends escapism. It's one thing to deny reality, it's another to transform it. See the difference? Your view it too shallow. The emphasis is on what transforms it, not what he is 'eacaping'. Something can't be escaped from of it isn't aknowledged to exist in the first place. You sound like a brainlet who doesn't eant to accept a superior interpretation.

>> No.22993172

>>22993168
Lmao, we're literally saying the same thing, but you want to deny it because you hate succinct answers. It's escapism, which can be a good thing.

>> No.22993176

>>22992866
>>Someone says they don't like a classic
>>Ask them to explain
why would anyone have to explain their taste? there are hundreds of writers writing in hundreds of different styles and only an absolute pseud would pretend to like them all

>> No.22993177

>>22993176
I only like the good ones.

>> No.22993185

>>22993172
>we're literally saying the same thing
we are quite literally not saying the same thing since we disagree with eachother.
There is disagreement, but not necessarily opposition, which means it is literally not the same thing. Maybe one day you'll understand Quixote better and the subtle difference in ideas between words.

>> No.22993191

>>22993185
There can be disagreement on style when there is agreement on form. You choose to define the meaning of escapism without labeling it as such. Simple as that, senpai.

>> No.22993200

>>22993191
but that isn't escaping, because I have already explained to you that you can't escape something that is not aknowledged to exist. He never aknowleges the pimp, whorehouse and whores as such, so he never escapes them.

Escapism is a coping mechanism to leave a toxic environment. Quixote doesn't want to become a knight because he hates the world, finds it toxic, and wants to eacape it, he becomes a Knight because he loves virtue, honor and glory of God. See the difference?

A legitimate example of escapism is a girl being molested by her father and starts to create imagined scenarios in her environment to escape her reality so as not to aknowledge the continued suffering and trauma of the molestation.

I am aware of the definition of eacapism, and Don Quixote is not that, not by a long shot. You dishonor him and the story by calling it a "treatise on escapism".

>> No.22993204

>>22993200
Just because you deny reality, reality does not cease to exist. Don Quixote is escaping this reality by overlaying it with his own mind. That is a good thing. It is also escapism.

>> No.22993205

>>22992949
Most “classic literature” was originally written for normal people to entertain them, Homer and Aristophanes being good examples. There is nothing which should be difficult to get.

>> No.22993208

>>22993205
>Most “classic literature” was originally written for normal people to entertain them
Uhhhhhhhhh
>Homer and Aristophanes being good examples
UHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

>> No.22993214

>>22993205
Homer was attempting to teach morals, not to "entertain"

>> No.22993227

>>22992905
>>22992918
>human nature bad
William Golding was British, the boys in Lord of the Flies are British.
The book isn't about human nature, it's about British nature, which in fact, is bad.

>> No.22993229

>>22993227
Did you not read the book? Half of the boys are Irish.

>> No.22993234

I have already defined escapism in my own words, but now I'll take the literal dictionary definition.

>Escapism: the tendency to seek distraction and relief from unpleasant realities, especially by seeking entertainment or engaging in fantasy.

Don Quixote is not doing this. He is not being a knight to entertain himself. He is not being a knight to escape trauma or an unpleasent reality. He is doing so out of love of Knights, Virtue, Honor, Glory and God. He is engaging in fantasy, that's true, but the variety of circumstances surrounding that fantasy are vastly different than those that would be necessary to define it as "escapism".

You are injudisciously using that word. You're either extremely stubborn in refusing to budge on this, since I have exposed your ignorance, or you're simply a lowbred midwit who is incapable of understanding.

>> No.22993237

>>22993234
meant for >>22993204

>> No.22993239

>>22993234
>He is not being a knight to entertain himself. He is not being a knight to escape trauma or an unpleasent reality.
He is though. I never denied he also does what he does out of a love of Chilvary, but to say he is not escaping from the boredom of his dusty library or from the machinations of his extended family is simply not correct.

>> No.22993247

>>22993239
Then we simply disagree, and I still maintain we are not saying the same thing, and that your interpretation is too shallow.

>> No.22993249

>>22993247
I hold that your definition of escapism is incomplete and I'm still confused why you hold to such a negative view of what is an essential coping mechanism for human beings to survive a social existence.

>> No.22993435

>>22993229
Well now the book makes MORE sense

>> No.22993462

>>22992866
>>22992875
What even makes a classic?
I always thought it became a fad among the elites for a bit than it was pushed onto the rest of us plebs in order to make us somewhat like them.

>> No.22993467

>>22992881
Moby Dick.
Whole book is essential a "be me" greentext from the protag where he autiaticly spends a chapter naming whales and smuggly shit talks other works describing whales.

>> No.22993474

>>22992881
Moby Dick.
Whole book is essential a "be me" greentext from the protag where he autiaticly spends a chapter naming whales and smuggly shit talks other works describing whales.
>>22992920
>liking things for the wrong reason
A book can provide different perspecives and meaning than a movie can do to the medium requiring the users imagination in general. That is a good thing anon, you get perspectives on the same story you would not have thought of before.

>> No.22993486

>>22992866
Liking something is just opinion. Just because it's a classic doesn't mean everyone who didn't like The Brothers Karamazov didn't "get it."

>> No.22993797

>>22993486
I think people who don't like Dostoevsky don't get him.