Cyberpunk and Neuromancer

[Anonymous No.22821776]

I read Neuromancer expecting a deep dive into the cyberpunk experience and what I found is quite...shit. No different from film Noirs, cyberpunk as a genre seems to draw from this and not innovate whatsoever.

[Anonymous No.22821788]

>>22821776
Read Lot49

[Anonymous No.22821797]

>>22821788
Is it better? I've been told for the real Cyberpunk experience I should watch Ghost in the Shell instead. Found neuromancer too edgy and too fast, like some snorting coke trying to tell a story before the high went away.

[Anonymous No.22821809]

>>22821797
Yes

[Anonymous No.22821816]

>>22821809
Thanks, I'll read it and post about it in the thread

[Anonymous No.22821831]

>>22821776
What I found to be amazing is how much CDPR plagiarised from Neuromancer. The basic story concept is the same, and lots of world building stuff(like datashards) are 1:1 stolen but had the name changed in order not to look too obvious.
The fact that there was no backlash about this following the game release catastrophe, means that either people dont read anymore, or nobody cares about Necromancer.

[Anonymous No.22821842]

>>22821831
Probably both

Novels are just the video games of their time and have been rendered irrelevant

[Anonymous No.22821851]

>>22821842
Some novels are good, but when it comes to literature, its as basic as it can get

[Anonymous No.22821872]

>>22821831
>means that either people dont read anymore, or nobody cares about Necromancer.
Both. People are as ignorant as they come and Neuromancer is a relic.

[Anonymous No.22821883]

I think for cyberpunk i liked Do androids dream of electric sheep?. Way better that Neuromancer

[Anonymous No.22821971]

>>22821883
What do you like of it, anon?

[Anonymous No.22822081]

Do you think we're reaching cyberpunk levels irl?

[Anonymous No.22822116]

>>22822081
>bloated governments and multinationals ommipresent
>bodily modification promoted heavily
>faux revolutionary anarchy in the streets every few years to destroy working and middle class housing and businesses while they get bought up by real estate investors
>feds against working against their own people physically and psychologically
>transhumanism and overt world government to be on the rise in the coming decades
i'd say so yeah, but it's a lot gayer than i imagined it being.

[Anonymous No.22822149]

>>22822116
>bodily modification promoted heavily
More like bodily mutilation!

[Anonymous No.22822164]

>>22822149
if only you knew anon, how bad things are gonna get. please protect your family and your community from man-made horrors.
https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/news/articles/billionaire-family-pushing-synthetic-sex-identities-ssi-pritzkers

[Anonymous No.22822204]

>>22822164
Damn, is it that bad? Why is the future so gay?

[Anonymous No.22822403]

>>22821776
Have you read every other cyberpunk book?

[Anonymous No.22822466]

>>22822403
No, but I didn't want to after reading Neuromancer

[Anonymous No.22822676]

>>22821831
>The fact that there was no backlash about this following the game release catastrophe, means that either people dont read anymore, or nobody cares about Necromancer.
No, it's the fact that ripping it off is like ripping off Lord of the Rings. It's such a foundational work in the genre that it's impossible to write a cyberpunk and NOT at the very least be taking inspiration from it, possibly secondhandedly.. Also most people who played and enjoyed CP2077 do not read anything more intellectually challenging than twitter posts.

That said, Gibson's prose is an awful slog to get through and I vastly preferred Ubik and Electric Sheep.

[Anonymous No.22822695]

>>22821797
>too edgy and too fast, like some snorting coke trying to tell a story before the high went away
well do you want a deep dive into the cyberpunk experience or not?

[Anonymous No.22822714]

Is there one of those /lit/ approved cyberpunk and post-cyberpunk book list images floating around? Because if there's not, then one needs to be made.

[Anonymous No.22822757]

>>22822714

[Anonymous No.22822849]

>>22822081
We're already there expect with dogshit aesthetics and tech

[Anonymous No.22822858]

>>22822714
take a look at this

[Anonymous No.22823028]

>>22822757
>starfish
>cryptonomicon
>10 billion days
these aren't cyberpunk

if anything, throw Diamond Age on there. and Synners

[Anonymous No.22823035]

>>22823028
i'm blind diamond age is already on there

[Anonymous No.22823086]

>>22821776
Try Virtual Light. Neuromancer is retard-tier fantasy and horribly written. Virtual Light he had editors and it's more grounded in reality.

>>22822757
>>22822858
These are fucking bad lol.

[Anonymous No.22823137]

>>22822466
Okay so you haven't read any cyberpunk. Bad thread.

[Anonymous No.22823151]

>>22823137
>after
well, he's read at least one cyberpunk.
I know it's /a/ but I think he should try Ghost in the Shell, which is another very influential work in the cyberpunk genre. The Manga or the SAC TV series. The movie is... Kinda odd.

[Anonymous No.22823910]

>>22822695
I want out of the irl cyberpunk experience!

[Anonymous No.22823931]

>>22821776
You have to remember that cyberpunk is by and large pulpy scifi garbage. It’s only fairly recently that the aesthetic has been considered more seriously as a vehicle for critique of certain trends in contemporary culture. The aesthetic itself has been dated for a long time, it’s just that people are starting to recognise more of the world in it which means it has a certain degree of staying power.

You could almost say the same with dystopian fiction - at this point it seems beyond obvious and trite to describe the world as “Orwellian”, but that certainly doesn’t stop people from talking about Big Brother surveillance programs.

[Anonymous No.22824205]

>>22823931
I see, so people tend to overuse the term whenever any cheap copy appears and always forget the subtext behind what created the word. A case of aesthetics and style over substance.

[Anonymous No.22824237]

>>22824205
Cyberpunk is already an aesthetic that is derivative of science fiction. The only real distinguishing trait is that it presents a world in which society and culture fails to develop alongside the technological advancements of the future. I think it’s that combination of near (present day civil unrest) and far (future technological crises) which is what makes the appeal so enduring and relevant, even if the aesthetic itself has been done to death.

[Anonymous No.22824272]

>>22824237
I think you coded it, its basically orwellian scifi, The neon colors and cyber implants have been done to death which is what makes it so boring. You read one book and you've basically read all of them.

[Anonymous No.22824290]

>>22821776
>>22821797
What is it with this obsession of cuberpunk? It such a shit genre, I guess unwashed retarded masses love shit.

[Anonymous No.22824369]

>>22824290
>Look at meeee! I'm not like other the boys!!

[Anonymous No.22824378]

>>22821776
Sorry boo boo that’s the warning you’d have gotten from the 100 previous Neuromancer threads. Great heist novels, not so much philosophical treatises. Though if you read the trilogy there are ideas that develop in the background over the course of the series that are pretty cool.

[Anonymous No.22824594]

>>22824272
I think that makes the genre a really valuable cultural expression in the context of the post-postmodernist “slow cancellation of the future” perspective. C.f. Jameson, Fisher

[Anonymous No.22824644]

>>22824290
the 4 posts above you were discussing exactly that
+ Bladerunner/The Matrix/Akira/Ghost in the Shell/Robocop/Ready Player One/Judge Dredd/Transmetropolitan/& most recently Cyberpunk 2077 have all raised interest

[Anonymous No.22824730]

>>22824594
Indeed, and its scary

[Anonymous No.22825077]

>>22824644
But isn't it good for the masses to consider their Orwellian future?

[Anonymous No.22825241]

>>22821831
>plagiarised
It's a love letter to classic cyberpunk, and it doesn't try to hide it. Why would there be a backlash?
Also
>The basic story concept is the same, and lots of world building stuff(like datashards) are 1:1 stolen but had the name changed in order not to look too obvious
you haven't read anything other than Gibson, have you?

[Anonymous No.22825350]

>>22825241
No, you got me there, anon.

[Anonymous No.22825433]

>>22821788
Lot49 is not better than Neuromancer at all

[Anonymous No.22825840]

>>22825433
Why do you think so, anon?

[Anonymous No.22826010]

Which Neuromancer heroine makes the best waifu?

[Anonymous No.22826098]

>>22821831
you do know cdpr didnt make Cyberpunk right? Blame Pondsmith, if anything

[Anonymous No.22826219]

Anybody who doesnt like neuromancer is a loser asshole who cant into one of the most sublime aesthetics, the specific type of prose is part of the charm

[Anonymous No.22826282]

>>22826219
Its shitty prose that jumps from one place to another with no rhythm or sense

[Anonymous No.22826505]

>>22821797
Ghost in the Shell is fantastic. It and the first Blade Runner are the greatest works in the genre.

[Anonymous No.22826764]

>>22826219
holy cope. gibson is a fucking meme hack who admitted he didn't even understand how a computer worked when he wrote the shit.
>>22826505
agreed. the first GITS only too, the second and the TV show are complete dog shit.

[Anonymous No.22826841]

>>22821776
If you want something more fun read Snow Crash. It's so politically and emotionally unprofound that it borders on a Marvel movie stuffed into a book.

[Anonymous No.22826850]

I read All Tomorrow's Parties first and found it better than Neuromancer.
>>22821831
>plagiarised
information wants to be free asshole, get out of here with muh intellectual """""property"""""
>>22821797
You should start with PKD imho, his short stories.

[Anonymous No.22826898]

>>22822676
>It's such a foundational work in the genre
Okay, I get that stealing some worldbuilding stuff from neuromancer (jacking in the cyberspace, the degeneracy and the easy augmentations, the drug epidemic, the hologrammic projections, the chaotic techno gangs, etc) were inevitable, but did they have to steal main points of the book's plot as well? Johny silverhand from cyberpunk is the construct from Neuromancer and there has been a war before Night City's existence just like in Neuromancer. Maybe they wanted to make a story that belonged to Gibson's cyberpunk universe(this is why the city is called Night City" in the game), or maybe they went too hard with their references, they forgot when to stop. I dont know.
Im sure in terms of writing a plot, CDPR writers could have been more original.
>That said, Gibson's prose is an awful slog to get through
I agree. Neuromancer prose feels like iits all over the place, and that kind of writing tires me as well. I get that he probably wrote it like this to feel like having a junkie in front of you, telling his story while being a bit high, but the result was really tiresome. The book's points about AI were pretty good for its time.

[Anonymous No.22826913]

>>22825241
Have you played the game though to see how unapologetically they have taken stuff from the book, as a "love letter"?
Vice city was based on Scarface, but all they took from that movie, was a chainsaw easter egg and the last scene where Tony montana dies, but its being played out under a different set of rules.
Read this>>22826898
To be fair, you wont be finding many gritty noir cyberpunk stories in the market, so Cyberpunk pretty much had to work with that book as a reference point. It could have more original with the plot.

[Anonymous No.22827035]

>>22826850
Pay your mortgage chang

[Anonymous No.22827837]

>>22821776
Which modern country is closest to the cyberpunk dystopias?

[Anonymous No.22827875]

>>22827837
South Korea. Samsung pretty much openly runs most of the country.

[Anonymous No.22827936]

>>22827875
>Samsung
I hope they at least give them corporate issued waifus

[Anonymous No.22828322]

Are there any cool books about fighting the system and fixing the cyberpunk dystopia?

[Anonymous No.22828426]

>>22821776
That's because Gibson created the "Cyberpunk" movement.

[Anonymous No.22828621]

>>22822858
What in the actual fuck is that?

[Anonymous No.22828643]

>>22822466
Did you even think before posting? You can't rule out an entire genre based solely on the one book you didn't like

[Anonymous No.22828647]

>>22828643
I just did bro

[Anonymous No.22828648]

>>22827837
Rio de Janeiro, drug dealers basically run society there and the State has little power. As you have rampant poverty, people couldn't care less about their gender, however, and have more pressing issues such as making sure there is stuff to eat tomorrow

[Anonymous No.22828651]

i like how Gibson writes, the characters are terrible and mostly incel pandering and pornographic, but the atmosphere and pace are great, just enjoy for what it is, trashy synthetic drug for the mind, enjoy the experience and that's it

[Anonymous No.22828654]

>>22828647
That basically means you're a retard, congratulations

[Anonymous No.22828661]

>>22822858
>lain
im not a tranny though

[Anonymous No.22828701]

>>22828661
Lain is most pure and old 4chan than what we got now though so trannies got nothing to do with Lain.

[Anonymous No.22828725]

>>22828701
it was trannies all along, that anime was like when the CIA put crack into the inner cities, but for obliterating nerd communities into trooning

[Anonymous No.22828737]

>>22828725
Explain any examples where trannies were presented or mentioned in Lain, c'mon I'm waiting.

[Anonymous No.22828757]

>>22828737
its subliminal, gets the idea into basement dweller's minds that they could be cute too

[Anonymous No.22828761]

>>22828757
That doesn't make any sense, anyone can interpret whatever they want on it. Also, in what episode does that happen? Seems like you didn't watch Lain at all.

[Anonymous No.22829174]

>>22821776
Is it possible to get decks like those of Neuromancer?

[Anonymous No.22829241]

>>22821831
>means that either people dont read anymore
Reading is not only a dying hobby, but literacy itself is going down. The internet and its consequences have been a disaster for the human race. And most of the new releases are trash written by women.

[Anonymous No.22829286]

>>22829241
Why are people more illiterate now that literature is available everywhere?

[Anonymous No.22829299]

>>22828426
You mean Bruce Sterling. Gibson is cringe.

[Anonymous No.22829319]

>>22829286
because we're living trough the end of white civilization

[Anonymous No.22829323]

>>22822757
Bleeding Edge has no business being on there.

[Anonymous No.22829791]

>>22821776
The plot as a whole is more of a skeleton. It's more about the flow of the writing and descriptions as well as the implications of what's described. It's 100% a pulp adventure novel but with a dash of Karouac and techno-mysticism.

[Anonymous No.22829800]

>>22826764
Cybernetics ain't reducible to electronics, fag

[Anonymous No.22829893]

>>22829800
What else does it include? I can only think of biomechanics

[Anonymous No.22829913]

>>22829800
lol cry more faggot. gibson not understanding simple things like a PC is why neuromancer is more fantasy than sci-fi. u probably think kojima is original too. go back to pleddit lmao

[Anonymous No.22831180]

>>22829913
That's what ruins it, we need true scientists writing Cyberpunk

[Anonymous No.22831718]

>>22829174
closer I've got

[Anonymous No.22831725]

>>22821776

[Anonymous No.22832650]

>>22831718
Makes me sad.