/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.22699952]

Is there any speculative alternate history where the Nazis win WW2, that isn't all "Nazis are... Le Bad" (or the equally retarded inverse) and most importantly, extends into the 21st century? I want to know what they'd be doing about the rise of AI, cryptocurrency, Tiktok, Fortnite, etc. Would they even care about muh race any more? It would be fascinating.

[Anonymous No.22699960]

>>22699952
My father knew one. The giant state is failling like the URRS and things like that

[Anonymous No.22699963]

>>22699952
The nazis literally did win. Just look at what’s happening in Gaza right now.

[Anonymous No.22699964]

>>22699952
The problem with that kind of speculation is it assumes that when you change something major in history, everything else stays the same and proceeds along the exact same lines, which is retarded. If the Nazis had won WWII, the entire second half of the 20th century would have been completely different, which means that a lot of that stuff probably wouldn't exist. It's hard to speculate on what technological developments would have played out the same, because there would be all new factors to consider. The tech boom in the 1980s and 1990s took a form that was pretty specific to American-style capitalism. The Nazis would have probably figured out computers, but I doubt they would have applied the tech to making video games and such. Digital currency might have made sense at some point but I doubt they would have allowed private cryptos to be developed that would compete with the state-controlled currency. Tiktok and Fortnite most likely wouldn't exist.

[Anonymous No.22699972]

>>22699952
??? Socialism has won ever since it was created to have a fake political spectrum after the revolutions.

[Anonymous No.22700080]

>>22699964
>If the Nazis had won WWII, the entire second half of the 20th century would have been completely different
That's more or less what I had in mind. I liked PKD's Man in High Castle but the alt history was very shallow. All I really remember is that the occupied US was split in half, The Jap Cold War and some crazy experiments in Africa. If it were extended further than the sixties, the author would have to flesh it out and at least touch on geopolitical and other developments around the world. NaziWorld™ is the most popular alternate history and lots of autistic people are invested in the concept so it should exist by now. Also, I disagree that video games and social media wouldn't exist. The potential for social control and at the very least data collection/surveillance is too great.

[Anonymous No.22700103]

>>22699952
>>22700080
my setting desu

I mostly focus on the immediate postwar and the decades following because as anon said it's really impossible to seriously predict what the late twentieth or early twenty-first century would look like. Not so much for technical reasons, a network like the internet has obvious advantages for socialism and mass communication, like you mentioned, but for geopolitical reasons. Europe could never realistically have broken America -and- Britain -and- the Soviet Union, so you have to come up with a way for those powers to be sidelined, or friendly, or at least tone down hostilities, and you end up with a multipolar setting with much more blending and pragmatism that's actually very hard to write.

I think the problem is also that people are often mostly interested in showing that Nazis BAD or Nazis DUMB or even sometimes Nazis GOOD but not in actually contemplating the trajectory of the world. So you get PKD taking Why We Fight at face value and TNO lending credence to every weird plan a German floated between 1930 and 1945.

[Anonymous No.22700244]

>>22699952
nazi faggot kill yourself

[Anonymous No.22700253]

>>22700244
I don't think PKD was a National Socialist.

[Cuckold Pete No.22700260]

>>22700244
God wants all of his nazi children to become dead nazis, nazi neutered nazis getting fucked in the ass by a homely overweight librarian with a love for cuckolding defetishism


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fEJD6y9I78U

[Anonymous No.22700702]

>>22700103
Where can I follow your work?

[Anonymous No.22700709]

I cannot specifically think of any books in which Nazis play Fortnite.

[Anonymous No.22700814]

>>22699964
>I doubt they would have applied the tech to making video games
Retarded nigger spotted. Board games were very popular, eventually someone would try to apply new tech to the field.
You seem to think the Nazis wouldn't allow for inventions in the field of entertainment, but in reality a sign of a successful far right state would be the creation of an apolitical middle class, which would develop new forms of leisure (see Francoist Spain)

[Anonymous No.22701303]

>>22700080
>>22700103
I think the value of PKDs "shallow" history is that it paints an infinitely more haunting portrait of world where the Bad Guys won, one where it almost doesn't even matter. I think it makes a far more interesting read than just seeing it as alt-history.

Anyways Nazi's didn't lose, Germany did. Half those fuckers just went right back to work at fucking Bayer, whatever Farben holding company America held onto for em or everyone's favorite benevolent liberal liberators NATO — Nazis After the Trial's Over

[Anonymous No.22701374]

>>22699952
Harry Turtledove:
>In the Presence of Mine Enemies (2003) alternate history: Follows the struggles of a family of secret Jews in Berlin, nearly 70 years after a Nazi victory in World War II. The events in the story follow a common theme of Turtledove's work by transplanting one set of historical events into another setting (the most prominent example being Southern Victory Series moving European history onto the American continent). In this case, the decline of the Soviet Union in the 1990s is translated to the Third Reich in the 21st century, and the secret Jews' way of life is reminiscent of that of Marranos in Spain.

[Anonymous No.22701379]

>>22701374
I posted this because it has been accused of "humanizing Nazis"

[Anonymous No.22702516]

bump

[Anonymous No.22702532]

>>22699964
Konrad Zuse invented the computer before Alan "Hungry-Bottom" Turing

[Anonymous No.22702534]

>>22699952
>>22700103
>>22701374
There aren't and less than 100 people have ever thought that deeply and as far. But you're on the best place on the internet (somehow, still) to figure your question out. The handful of political chans suffer from too shallow thinking in comparison.

[Anonymous No.22703038]

>>22700244
Calm down, Mr. Rabbi Sir.

[Anonymous No.22703353]

>>22700814
You get the right idea but miss on the followthrough. A fascist state in the contemporary world would produce video games, that much is obvious, but Francoist Spain wasn't actually the same kind of state as NS Germany or Fascist Italy. They ended up fighting on the same side, and have certain commonalities as do fascists and MLs, but fascists in a strict sense were/are interested in mass mobilization and politicization, not in a depoliticized middle class.

A modern National Socialist entertainment industry would look more like the Chinese entertainment industry than anything else, possibly with fewer gachas and more war propaganda.

>>22701303
When all state-sponsored political theory and all state action is targeted at suppressing fascism, to the point that even ethics has been reworked so that the ultimate good is avoiding the persecution of Jews, the fact that some Germans were allowed to keep their functionary positions doesn't really hold up as some great indictment, or proof of the secret Nazism of world liberalism.

Like, yeah, if you want to build a plane in the 50s and 60s you need a German who worked for Messerschmitt. But that German isn't actually making any policy decisions.

[Anonymous No.22703366]

>>22703353
>A modern National Socialist entertainment industry would look more like the Chinese entertainment industry than anything else, possibly with fewer gachas and more war propaganda.
I disagree. They'd be leading in game innovation unlike the Chinese but like the Chinese they'd make sure their game creations were designed to strengthen their society. They'd probably use human-level AI for FPS-like war training, and keep it state-side for as long as possible, until releasing the code to the public, like how our time's corps still have human-level AI mostly corp-side.

[Anonymous No.22703388]

>>22700702
I have a blog I post stuff on occasionally. It's mostly character studies and a few isolated history pieces but I intend to start writing a story set in Italian North Africa at some point; their version of the Suez Crisis.
https://paktderpakte.tumblr.com/

[Anonymous No.22703964]

>>22701374
The premise of this sort of falls apart when you realize that by 2010 they could have just used 1488andme to detect any stray Jews

[Anonymous No.22704183]

>>22703964
The premise of this sort of falls apart when you realize that by 2010 stray Jews would have figured out how to scramble their marker DNA within their junk DNA.

[Anonymous No.22705134]

>>22699964
America adopted germany's fascist economic policy of corporatism pretty much entirely and I doubt a nazi america would appear all that different from it's current form except there would be fewer jews.

[Anonymous No.22705496]

>>22699963
Unironically rolled my eyes at this

[Anonymous No.22705528]

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[Anonymous No.22705538]

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[Anonymous No.22705646]

>>22705134
>America adopted germany's fascist economic policy of corporatism pretty much entirely

Provide some examples

[Anonymous No.22705988]

>>22705646
NASA

[Anonymous No.22706302]

>>22705134
America is the one country most dedicated to free-enterprise in the world. What are you talking about?

[Anonymous No.22706809]

>>22705134
Yes, corporatism in some form is the economic winner of the early 20th century, but contemporary America's legitimating myth is liberal antifascism. Also as anon noted, the American regime is particularly careful to play on a theme of free enterprise and individualism, so while public-private partnerships are common, none of the welfarist, syndicalist, or pro-social aspects of fascism are carried forward. America is a state of raceless hustlers and wageslaves ruled over by Jewish capitalists.

The memory of the Axis casts a shadow over the modern world and various pieces of its ideological and economic apparatus are used or were previously used, but the thing itself was destroyed and the victorious powers are anxious that it never come back. The thing you hate is liberal capitalism, not fascism.

[Anonymous No.22706939]

>>22706302
imagine believing this. jfc

[Anonymous No.22707044]

>>22699952
What is North Korea

[Anonymous No.22707106]

>>22706809
lmao anon you're cute

[Anonymous No.22707343]

>>22706939
Is he wrong?

[Anonymous No.22707366]

>>22707343
you have to be 18 to post here kid

[Anonymous No.22707369]

>>22707106
I appreciate the attempt at condescension but I can't return it. I actually find the tendency of Marxists and conservatives to identify the contemporary American regime with fascism to be very tiresome.

[Anonymous No.22708332]

>>22706939
The rest of the world is worse.

[Anonymous No.22708345]

>>22708332
Anon probably both regards the US as not particularly laissez-faire and also rejects the evaluation of an unregulated economy as positive
That is to say, there are places that are "freer" by a libertarian evaluation than the US, and also, libertarians are retards

[Anonymous No.22708351]

>>22703388
Interesting, good luck anon.

[Anonymous No.22708961]

>>22707369
Then you are clearly ill-informed and should educate yourself

[Anonymous No.22708965]

>>22708961
Not really. I know about all the things that leftists and rightists point to, they're just trivial. See the second section of >>22703353
Your thirst for von Braun's blood doesn't make America fascist, lol. You think about superficialities.

[Anonymous No.22709159]

join the official /lit/ community
https://discord.gg/uDRjs5ku

[Anonymous No.22710677]

.

[Anonymous No.22710730]

>>22705496
He doesnt know about the "lets all pretend to be jews and dress the jewish prisoners in our uniforms quick before the allies arrive" back up plan of nazi high command.

I bet you think George Soros is actually jewish.

[Anonymous No.22710732]

>>22708961
Please educate us then anon.