/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.22668531]

Plato and Aristotle were so unbelievably smart. The jump of knowledge from before their era to when they lived is immeasurable. It's easy to believe they were divinely inspired somehow.

[Anonymous No.22668533]

>he doesn't know about the pre-socratics
>he doesn't know about ancient babylonian wisdom

[Jon Kolner No.22668535]

>>22668533
Heraclitus was okay but he is nowhere near the level of Plato.

[Anonymous No.22668652]

>>22668531
Just like Odysseus, Athena was their aunt.

[Anonymous No.22668700]

>>22668531
If you try hard enough you can make anything seem like divine inspiration.

[Anonymous No.22669953]

>>22668700
some cases more honest than others

[Anonymous No.22670129]

>>22668531
Um...

[Anonymous No.22670188]

>>22670129
Most of his teachings are hearsay/lost/already expressed by Jews
He left no writings of his own and nobody can agree whether Zoroaster preached a monotheistic or dualistic god. Hes nowhere near the level of Plato and Aristotle

[Anonymous No.22670230]

>>22670188
He influenced Plato and Aristotle. Plato and Aristotle both only had the time to 'philosophize' because they were decadent nobles who had slaves do their labor for them. Zoroaster was hard working his whole life compared to either of them.

[Anonymous No.22670241]

>>22670188
>/already expressed by Jews
Other way around

[Anonymous No.22670257]

>>22670230
It's impossible to measure the amount of influence he had on them, but the fact that their ideas eclipse his shouldn't be debatable
>>22670241
you can see it either way but the fact is that the Jewish documents are older and more meticulously preserved than anything Zoroastrian related.

[Anonymous No.22670266]

>>22670188
>already expressed by the jews
Dumb-fuck, the jews stole his teachers and appropriated them as their own. Zoroaster predates Judaic belief.

[Anonymous No.22670276]

>>22670257
>but the fact is that the Jewish documents are older and more meticulously preserved than anything Zoroastrian related.

Oldest jewish text - 11th century BC

Oldest zoroastrian text - 13th century BC

So, you're objectively...What did he mean by this?

[Anonymous No.22670300]

>>22670266
>Dumb-fuck
you aren't worth speaking to
>>22670276
they could be that old, but the manuscripts aren't. just like the hindu mansuscripts probably aren't as old as they claim either
the reason jews might have a better claim is their widespread regional use and their degree of preservation. but this is such ancient history with influence from other lost Mesopotamian religions that its hard to make a definitive claim either way. it all depends whether you're an abrahamic believer and it suits your case that judaism be true, or you're an atheist and vice versa.

[Anonymous No.22670315]

>>22668531
Which do you like more?

[Anonymous No.22670326]

>>22670315
Plato but I haven't read a lot of either one yet

[Anonymous No.22670379]

>>22670326
The Republic is a wonderful chimera of a work, if you haven’t gotten to it yet.

[Anonymous No.22670589]

>>22670300
>the reason jews might have a better claim is their widespread regional use and their degree of preservation
Except they aren't. We have historical archeological evidence proving so. No jewish text predates the 11th century, and that text specifically is proto-judaic, called the Khirbet Qeiyafa Inscription, which many argue isn't even Hebrew.

The oldest religious jewish text are the Dead Sea Scrolls which, on account of their "religious" teachings, are dated to 16th Century BC, but secular scholars date them to be, at the latest, 9th century BC.

So the truly oldest "religious" contextual writings of judaic believes is 9th century, with the oldest extant writings of Hebrew language are 11th century.

[Anonymous No.22670614]

>>22668531
I have once seen a "scientism" type arguing more or less about how we should ignore "2,000 years old primitives" and only read things written recently.

Which shows he had never read Plato. I remember when reading Plato for the first time and wondering how someone could be so smart.

[Anonymous No.22670659]

>>22670276
> Oldest zoroastrian text - 13th century BC
Lol which one my nigga

[Anonymous No.22670662]

>>22670659
The Avesta, which is actually religious texts about Zoroastrianism, not just faintly judaic Hebrew writings like the other one.

[Anonymous No.22670680]

>>22670614
The reason people say that is because metaphysics is fucking useless.

I still agree Plato and Aristotle are worth reading 100%, but this place, and 4chan in general, lend metaphysical thinking a lot more explanatory power than it's earned. At best people read these books to furnish an insecure self-concept. This may or may not be projection.

[Anonymous No.22670706]

>>22670614
> only read things written recently
If you are pursuing a trade, engineering/programming, or something like stocks, this is perfectly reasonable