/cathlit/ - Catholic Literature General

[Anonymous No.22509503]

https://www.vatican.va/latin/latin_index.html - Vatican site

https://www.catholicnewsagency.com/ - Catholic News Site

https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/4chanlit/images/d/d7/19-06-36-14727334993410.jpg/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/1000?cb=20181124135713 - Catholic Literature Chart

[Anonymous No.22509516]

>>22509503
I want a really nice Bible as a heirloom. Shoul I get this one? It seems to be the only true leather cath bible I could find, but I never read the ESV-CE. Not sure how good it is.

[Anonymous No.22509523]

>>22509503
bump

[Anonymous No.22509538]

>>22509516
You should own several different Bible for comparison's sake. That one is edited by Cambridge so it's probably trustworthy academically speaking.

[Anonymous No.22509574]

>>22509503
What are some good religious poets or poetry anthologies. I know bloom made an anthology of American religious poetry, looks good, i hope i can get it soon

[Anonymous No.22509607]

I humbly submit that you change the general name in future iterations to /catholit/. In nomine patri et filii et spiritu sancti.

[Anonymous No.22509636]

>>22509538
>You should own several different Bible for comparison's sake.
Speaking of that, should a Catholic read protestant versions? I got a really nice deal on a Cambridge pocket KJV. I really like it because I can take it anywhere, it's the bible I read the most but it's not really Catholic. Is there a problem with that?

[Anonymous No.22509725]

I'm embarrassed to say that Chesterton is my favorite author.

[Anonymous No.22509733]

>>22509725
Why?

[Anonymous No.22509739]

>>22509516
It's a revision of the RSV like the NRSV and RSV2CE, but not as good as the RSV2CE. Leather wise though, Cambridge makes nice bibles. It's too bad there aren't any premium options in the RSV2CE.

[Anonymous No.22509742]

>>22509733
He's obnoxiously glib at times, and midwits love him.

[Anonymous No.22509747]

>>22509636
You won't get all the mass readings in a Protestant bible, but it's OK to study with it. You will all the books if you had a KJV with Apocrypha. There just aren't any pocket editions. The smallest is the Cambridge Cameo. Really handy, but not pocket sized.

[Anonymous No.22509760]

>was catholic
>started studying Plato
>realized belief is mere opinion, and communion with transcendent being can only be achieved with true knowledge
>God is Rationality Itself, and Rationality must be known, not merely believed in
>ergo, one cannot have faith in transcendent matters
>ergo, Christian faith is erroneous
>Also, there is no a priori evidence of the divinity of Christ
what do bros? I'd really like to go back to being Catholic for sentimental reasons, but I can't get out of this bind.

[Anonymous No.22509764]

>>22509503
>Catholic
>Literature

[Anonymous No.22509773]

>>22509764
yes

[Anonymous No.22509793]

>>22509764
How many Gene Wolfe and Tolkien threads have I see on this board... just in the last year? Enough. And they're Catholic.
How about among classics. Dante, Cervantes, arguably Shakespeare, Flannery O'Conner, Chesterton.
Philosophers. Descartes, Aquinas, Pascal, Augustine, Duns Scotus. Saints galore.
Are you trying to live in some fake reality where you delete Catholics out of history?

[Anonymous No.22509806]

>>22509793
>Gene Wolfe and Tolkien
Their works isn't about Catholicism though. Religion is a private thing, keep your religion out of my goddamn books.

[Anonymous No.22509812]

>>22509806
everything is about catholicism

[Anonymous No.22509816]

>>22509806
>anon only picks out two of the authors listed to comment on because he only reads genre fiction

[Anonymous No.22509822]

>>22509806
They are more than you think.
I do what God wants. It's not your world. It's his. And you're the one that walked into this thread in the first place. You're just inviting it at this point.

[Anonymous No.22510218]

>>22509503
Is CS Lewis considered part of cathlit? What about Kierkegaard? My view is yes.

[Anonymous No.22510221]

>>22509793
>Are you trying to live in some fake reality where you delete Catholics out of history?
Yes

[Anonymous No.22511144]

>>22509574
>good religious poets
Gerard Manley Hopkins, S.J. is pretty much the only one I can stand.

[Anonymous No.22511149]

>>22509742
>He's obnoxiously glib at times
I think Chesterton just has a much wider range of quality than people realize. His Father Brown is supposedly pure kino but some of his lesser works, like his biography of St. Thomas Aquinas, are not great.

[Anonymous No.22511154]

>>22509760
>what do bros
Aristotle's Metaphysics shows that Platonic Forms are destroyed.
>ergo, one cannot have faith in transcendent matters
Faith is just partial knowledge of what you can't fully know.

[Anonymous No.22511159]

>>22510218
Kierkergaard was on the index, but so was Montaigne.
>>22509503
Some good resources for y'all:
>CLUNY media
20th century works reeprinted by a press ran by a Dominican. See François Mauriac for kino.
>St. Augustine Press
Good resource to find some great Catholic literature.
>New Polity
The absolute best Catholic political commentary and just absolutely great essays - anything by Marc Barnes is gold.

[Anonymous No.22511171]

>>22509503
here's a list of Church Fathers (and their respective works):

https://www.earlychristianwritings.com/churchfathers.html

[Anonymous No.22511312]

>>22511154
>Aristotle's Metaphysics shows that Platonic Forms are destroyed.
Nonsense. This ends in materialism or pantheism, both of which are absurd

[Anonymous No.22511321]

>>22509760
Faith is only the beginning. Not the totality. You will have plenty evidence of Christ if you were baptized in fire. Pray for it earnestly. You can't will it, you can't force it, only Christ himself will give it.
>The wind blows wherever it pleases. You hear its sound, but you cannot tell where it comes from or where it is going. So it is with everyone born of the Spirit.-John 3:8

[Anonymous No.22512667]

bumpu

[Anonymous No.22512740]

>>22509503
finding the church fathers very great.
why don't people read them more?

[Anonymous No.22512803]

>>22509760
>be raised catholic
>become a kind of agnostic atheist growing up
>be in complete despair and darkness at 17/18 yo
>give my soul to God
>couple years later meditate about love
>the morning star rises in my heart
2 Peter 1:19
Pray with all your heart/mind/soul for just one moment and you will see how God can change you but beware,it wont be easy.

[Anonymous No.22512808]

>>22510218
>>22511159
Kierkegaard was a Lutheran and papist rapists are simply trying to appropriate him

[Anonymous No.22512870]

>>22512803
I've never been an atheist because I'm not retarded, but the dilemma I putlined in my list is seemingly unsolvable.
>>22511321
>Faith is only the beginning. Not the totality.
What do you mean by this?
>plenty of evidence of Christ
Empirical evidence, sure. But what is needed for true KNOWLEDGE of Christ's divinity is an a priori proof.

[Anonymous No.22512873]

>>22512870
*post not list

[Anonymous No.22512891]

>>22509760
>a priori evidence
look into natural theology.
Aquinas might be right up your alley aswell. for the most famous part of his work, are you familiar with the Quinque viae proofs?

[Anonymous No.22512894]

>>22512891
Yes. There are no a priori proofs for the divinity of Christ.

[Anonymous No.22512901]

>>22512870
also the Orthodox talk of noesis and theoria.
probably what you're looking for.
they talk some about it in the Philokalia, but i'm sure there are more directed works which i don't know yet.

[Anonymous No.22512913]

>>22512894
repeating that doesn't make it true.
argue against it, if you're so keen on that.
this close to being convinced you're falseflagging.

[Anonymous No.22512942]

>>22512913
>argue against it, if you're so keen on that.
What do you mean argue against it? How can I argue against what I am claiming doesn't exist? How do you demonstrate a priori proof for events in time?

[Anonymous No.22512951]

>>22512942
by proving the Trinity.
your "proof of Christ" is being too reductionist in its scope.

[Anonymous No.22513275]

>>22512951
The Trinity can exist without an Incarnation

[Anonymous No.22513329]

>>22509760
>there is no a priori evidence of the divinity of Christ
Are you talking textually because Philippians is pretty explicit about Jesus being God and that's older than the Gospels.

[Anonymous No.22513364]

Is Walker Percy good aside from the Moviegoer? Also is Flannery O'Connor good or is she a meme?

[Anonymous No.22513366]

>>22509760
>a priori evidence
God damn you’re a midwit

[Anonymous No.22513421]

>>22513366
I'm a platonist

[Anonymous No.22513732]

>Every mountain on earth is covered and flowing with the blood of sacrifices to pagan idols
>Jesus emerges from Golgotha (the place of the skull) and shouts down satan and his idols
>The entire earth quakes as the idols fall
>Satan's own demons torment him for losing to Jesus
>Jesus brings his conquering light to erect monasteries atop the destroyed temples of the idols
I didn't know the Syriac tradition could get so metal. This is very underrated.

[Anonymous No.22513947]

>>22511171
Thank you!

[Anonymous No.22514179]

I'm seriously stating to think I might be more Egoist than Catholic.

[Anonymous No.22514795]

>>22509503
Blacks are the perfect catholics because they're already illiterate. The pope doesn't even have to burn all the bibles. Truly a match made in hell

[Anonymous No.22515211]

>>22514795
You sound like you don't read much yourself. You've bought into all the memes. There were vernacular translations of the bible before Wycliffe. There was even a complete German bible nearly a hundred years before Luther. No one was persecuted for having a bible. The only thing condemned was when it was unauthorized and translated by heretics. Starting with Cathars.
While in the East, work in translations happened in medieval times. Syriac, Ethiopian, Armenian, Arabic, etc.. all in the earliest centuries of the Church. St. Cyril and Methodius translated for the Slavs in the 800s, and even invented a script and alphabet (which is still passed down as Cyrillic).

[Anonymous No.22515951]

>>22514179
We used to have the military orders for Catholics with a strong will to power. Maybe we should revive them. Quite frankly, it's abundantly clear to me that the post-Vat 2 "peace at all costs" regime has failed and it's time to get back to our roots of just war theory and such.

Pic related, the Knights of Malta should turn themselves back into the Hospitallers.

[Anonymous No.22515967]

>>22515951
I chalk it up to boomers, some well meaning. Younger Catholics will shift things a bit.

[Anonymous No.22516000]

Does Kerouac count as a Catholic? Beat came from Beatific Vision, according to him.

[Anonymous No.22516088]

>>22515967
Oh, yeah, it's 100% the Boomers. The current state of the Church is so strange because every young Catholic who has stuck around is smarter, better read, better catechized, and seems to have a deeper faith than a ton of the Boomers who are currently archbishops and cardinals. With a handful of exceptions, the upper ranks of the hierarchy are full of old homos who I wouldn't favor in a debate with your average Zoomer from Catholic Twitter. Even the more left-wing Catholics, whom I profoundly disagree with, are more trustworthy in their faith than the average old Boomer cardinal.

You're used to respecting your elders in Catholicism, but today the situation is reversed: I respect younger Catholics far more than I respect older ones, because they're more knowledgable and because they've faced some of the bleakest times to be Catholic in centuries and have stuck it out.

Hopefully, as you say, this means good things for the future, as younger people become priests, monks, nuns, and eventually bishops. But right now it's a very odd time.

[Anonymous No.22516117]

>>22515951
I'm in the process of becoming a Knight of Malta and I don't see the point of anywhere it could go "fight" or anything; that said the recent branding has seemingly tried to take "Military" out the full title ("Sovereign Military Order of Malta" now being retconned into "Sovereign Order of Malta") and I think that's dumb too.

Also Pope Francis really, REALLY overstepped his bounds when he basically assumed direct control of it and appointed his own leadership. It's like that Voltaire quote about the Holy Roman Empire; the Sovereign Military Order of Malta is now neither Sovereign, nor Military, nor based in Malta.

[Anonymous No.22516240]

>>22516088
I'm not a fan of the left wing types either. I doubt you mean that. They basically want Episcopalianism. And they're too friendly with historical-critical views of scripture and introduce those folky songs in Mass. Also they all like Thomas Merton, who was very flawed and barely Catholic imo.

[Anonymous No.22516246]

>>22516240
If by Left Wing, you mean Dorothy Day, I'm all ears.*

[Anonymous No.22516625]

>>22513275
Heresy.
>>22513366
Agreed
>>22513421
No, you're a faggot.

[Anonymous No.22517301]

Bros, how do I start over?

[Anonymous No.22517817]

>>22517301
Start from the beginning.

[Anonymous No.22517885]

I'm a practicing catholic, but I just can't stop masturbating. I masturbate every single day, sometimes more than twice a day. Help me, please brothers!

[Anonymous No.22517893]

>>22509806
Hahaha...ohohohohohonononono hahaha....

[Anonymous No.22517949]

>>22509503
The catholic lit chart does not include the catechism which I find silly.

[Anonymous No.22518230]

>>22515211
Thank you for this anon. Can you tell me how the Galileo and Bruno fiascos were misrepresented by modern propaganda?

[Anonymous No.22518236]

>>22517885
It's really embarrassing, made worse that all you need to do is... not do it. No saint or church father even wrote about it, sins against chastity were assumed to be fornication.
Myself, I tie it to loneliness. At times when I was very busy with social activities, such as travelling in a group or at the recent WYD, I can go over a week.
Using the internet, 4chan specially, doesn't help, certainly. Even if the porn boards are avoided entirely, there's erotism all over.

[Anonymous No.22518253]

>>22518230
Yes, the Church never said that Galileo's ideas were outright wrong, they just wanted him to admit that they were just theories and at the time they were right, there was no way to prove Galileo's arguments. But Galileo was stubborn and continued to portray his ideas as the truth (which in the end they were, but then again, at the time there was no way to prove them for sure).

[Anonymous No.22518259]

>>22518230
Aa for Giordano Bruno, he was a really insufferable person. He made enemies everywhere he went. The reason he was burned was less because of his ideas, but more because he was just a really arrogant and awful person.

[Anonymous No.22518326]

>>22518230
Galileo got math wrong and was treated well despite his protestations. Bruno was a demonologist and deserved what he got.

[Anonymous No.22518341]

>>22518253

Don't forget other people were allowed to publish ideas similar to Bruno's before and after he did, just without the insufferable faggotry.

Are these three topics covered succinctly in a book somewhere to aid my proselytization and redpilling against dishonest Satanic memes?

[Anonymous No.22518390]

does anyone have any catholic figures that they know of who can be considered the patron saint of late bloomers? I need a figure I can aspire to be when it comes to starting my life over at 28.

[Anonymous No.22518393]

>>22518390
read Augustine's Confessions.

[Anonymous No.22518395]

how about a catholic video, https://youtu.be/3y4Zicbq0Ao?si=OnqV2Bzy-kD3AltX

[Anonymous No.22518446]

>>22518390
The archangel Raphael, who watched over those continuing on their Journey
St. Nicholas, of children (of all ages) and sailors (those adrift in their life)
St. Dymphna, of melancholy, and its similar concept perverted by modern institutions like (((psychoanalysis))), depression
St. Jude, of lost causes, and unofficially but pertinently, those who repent on their deathbeds

[Anonymous No.22518466]

What are the most important "role model" saints in general?
Any good books about this?

[Anonymous No.22518497]

>>22518466
Jesus Christ should be your only role model, not other mortal men.

[Anonymous No.22518556]

Is my nigga Eckhart considered a heretic?

[Anonymous No.22518568]

>>22518556
No, he was never condemned. But some specific statements he made were condemned by the Pope in "In Agro Dominico", see here for example (or google for the full text):
https://medium.com/catholicism-for-the-modern-world/the-heresies-of-meister-eckhart-655ea39a9c6f

[Anonymous No.22518572]

>>22518259
>he was just a really arrogant and awful person.
He’s literally me

[Anonymous No.22518575]

>>22518446
Is there any place I can find a list of this shit?

[Anonymous No.22518590]

Bergoglio is a heretic, he remained silent while the Church in Germany did all sorts of heresies. Look at Germany, that is the future of the Church under Bergoglio.

[Anonymous No.22518610]

>>22518575
>shit
GTFO!

[Anonymous No.22518619]

>>22518575
Some here may be able to direct you to useful books and articles, but my knowledge of the saints is from orally transmitted knowledge and scattered readings of individual sites through the years.

[Anonymous No.22518632]

>>22518590
That wouldn't mean he's a heretic per se, which is why it's so difficult to indict his ambiguous doings.

But if he were proven to be consistently directly complicit and approving, then if a heretic is someone who willfully subverts the magisterium, and the person at the head of the hierarchy does acts that fit such sin, then what are members of the body supposed to conclude?

I'm convinced he's a heretic, but it still has to be proven through proper judicial channels.

[Anonymous No.22518646]

>>22518590
To understand the situation in Germany it is important to remember that Germany has a mandatory religion tax (9% of your income tax). If you are listed as a Catholic you must pay the tax.
The Church is struggling financially and causing a schism in Germany would be a big blow.

[Anonymous No.22518652]

>>22518646
People would rather leave the Church than pay a tax? They should burn in hell then!

[Anonymous No.22518658]

>>22518652
People wouldn't leave the church, they like the church (as it exists in Germany today). instead the German Catholic Church would separate and become independent. Obviously not the first time this happens.

[Anonymous No.22518780]

>>22518497
It's not an either/or. Are you Catholic? What do you think Baptismal names represent? And Christ appointed leaders of his Church partly for this purpose too.
>Be imitators of me, as I am of Christ.-1 Cor 11:1

[Anonymous No.22519729]

>>22518466
I'm a huge fan of St. Therese de Lisieux

[Anonymous No.22519999]

>>22509636
>Speaking of that, should a Catholic read protestant versions?

No.

Catechism of Saint Pius X:

> 29 Q. May any translation of the Bible, in the vernacular, be read?
> A. We can read those translations of the Bible in the vernacular which have been acknowledged as faithful by the Catholic Church and which have explanations also approved by the Church.

> 30 Q. Why may we only read translations of the Bible approved by the Church?
> A. We may only read translations of the Bible approved by the Church because she alone is the lawful guardian of the Bible.

> 31 Q. Through which means can we know the true meaning of the Holy Scripture?
> A. We can only know the true meaning of Holy Scripture through the Church's interpretation, because she alone is secure against error in that interpretation.

> 32 Q. What should a Christian do who has been given a Bible by a Protestant or by an agent of the Protestants?
> A. A Christian to whom a Bible has been offered by a Protestant or an agent of the Protestants should reject it with disgust, because it is forbidden by the Church. If it was accepted by inadvertence, it must be burnt as soon as possible or handed in to the Parish Priest.

> 33 Q. Why does the Church forbid Protestant Bibles?
> A. The Church forbids Protestant Bibles because, either they have been altered and contain errors, or not having her approbation and footnotes explaining the obscure meanings, they may be harmful to the Faith. It is for that same reason that the Church even forbids translations of the Holy Scriptures already approved by her which have been reprinted without the footnotes approved by her.

Read the Latin Vulgate. If you don't know Latin, read the Douay-Rheims.

[Anonymous No.22520002]

>>22510218
>Is CS Lewis considered part of cathlit?

No, he was a Protestant.

[Anonymous No.22520062]

>>22518575
It is a sin to call the patronages of the Saints "shit". That being said, here you go:
https://catholicsaints.info/

[Anonymous No.22520063]

>>22509760
Check out Augustine. He showed how the insights of the Platonists point to God. Augustine in His Own Words is a great summary with lots of excerpts, best intro.

Then consider Bonneventure and Dionysus

[Anonymous No.22520271]

Bros, the Diamond Brothers are on a roll

[Anonymous No.22520744]

>>22509503
Who /calvinist/ here?

[Anonymous No.22520770]

>>22520744
No such thing. Like all Protestants, even Calvinists have split in dozens of directions.

[Anonymous No.22521099]

>>22517885
A friend of mine basically said that at that point you have an addiction and it's probably venial. It's likely you first started regularly masturbating at such a young age (10-12 if you're like me) that you're note culpable. I personally would recommend cutting porn out and really seeking to love and understand a key dynamic of heterosexual pedophilia that these porn actresses suffer from that I will now tell you. Most children who were molested or have sex with an adult when they are pre-pubescent actually come to try to convince themselves that they liked it and this corruption of the will is the fettish of pedophilia - power has some to do with it - but for example for me, you get frozen (again, when you're young and it's hetero-sexual then your memory is much fuzzier) in this type of posture of wanting to slavishly give yourself over to abuse in a sexual way. In some ways, it's so beautiful because you see what the human compassion of a child is very like from your own giving eyes (it is not an overstatement I could conceivably sell myself into slavery for a similar woman with similar specific features), and yet the sadness that your will is in some ways so profoundly wrong and mixed with self-doubts and sadness in those doubts because the sex abusers are typically so close - mine gave me a wedding gift and I'd hug her easily if I saw her randomly and not feel bad about it. It's incredibly odd but the issue is that you want to give yourself to sex, like porn stars do, and not God. I hope this helps with why these porn stars are so oddly broken.

[Anonymous No.22521119]

>>22517885
Read Graham Greene and embrace your Catholic guilt

[Anonymous No.22521225]

My girlfriend supports abortion. I told her that abortion is the same as taking a life and therefore, due to our Christian upbringing, it's wrong and we should be against it. But then she said that in 2 Kings 2:23-24 God sent two bears to kill 42 children, so it would be hypocritical for Christians to be against abortion. How would you reply to that? I kept quiet because I couldn't find a satisfying answer...

[Anonymous No.22521525]

>>22521225
she's a dumb bitch that has no right to be speaking on scripture. read 1 Timothy 2:12
>But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.
and again, 1 Corinthians 14:34-35
>Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience as also saith the law. And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church.

[Anonymous No.22521533]

>>22521225
I'm pretty sure those children weren't aborted but killed.

[Anonymous No.22521655]

>>22521533
So abortion is not murder is what you're saying. We can agree on that

[Anonymous No.22522635]

>>22521655
Can't commit murder because he takes life away at the perfect time.

[Anonymous No.22522720]

>>22511171
What are good ones to read?

[Anonymous No.22522934]

>>22516117
>I'm in the process of becoming a Knight of Malta
I'm genuinely jealous. I hope the best for you, anon.

[Anonymous No.22523013]

>>22517885
I too am dealing with the same addiction. The little advice I can give you would be: It's always a good idea to have company, it's much harder to fight the urges when you're alone. Also that your addiction can be impacted by your emotional state and your stress level, it is very common to have relapses when you are feeling bad. Finally that this kind of things take time, compare the time where you became addicted to the moment you decided to start quitting, at least in my case my addiction started when I was 12 years old and until recently two years ago (when I was 25 years old) I decided to make an effort to quit. Don't get discouraged, keep fighting, praying to Christ and regularly attend the sacraments. The journey of recovery is not linear and there are usually many bumps, but it is possible to overcome.
And always trust that Christ will heal you.

[Anonymous No.22523090]

>>22521225
>2 Kings 2:23-24 God sent two bears to kill 42 children
42 Youths would be more accurate. His life was likely in danger had things gone on.

[Anonymous No.22523111]

>>22521225
https://www.catholic.com/qa/whats-up-with-elisha-and-the-bears
https://www.catholic.com/audio/cal/your-bible-questions-23 Minute 23:51 and 29:10

[Anonymous No.22523112]

>>22523090
i.e "But God saved his prophet from a large mob of violent young men" is a bad argument in favor of abortion.

[Anonymous No.22523114]

>>22515951
>>22516117
>I don't see the point of anywhere it could go "fight"
The only real options would be
>help Ukraine
>assassinate Kim Jong Un?
>help African, South American, and South Asian rebel movements usurp fascist governments
Which would be.... interesting.
>>22517885
heretical leftwing take incoming
God made humans to experience the full range of sexuality, including for some people asexuality. The Bible essentially condemns cheating, rape, and anal sex on the grounds that in ancient times it was a hotbed for disease. Your sin lies not in feeling arousal that God created you to have, but in treating women as objects to be used for your own personal gratification.

[Anonymous No.22523133]

>>22523114
>heretical
You are right about this part. Wrong about the rest

[Anonymous No.22523137]

Daily reminder that the Trinity was made up in the 4th century and makes absolutely no sense, no matter how much Love Augustine throws at it or how much Light Dante said it could emit.

Daily reminder the Catholics started a huge war andb brutally executed Jan Hus for suggesting laypers receive wine as well as bread, adopted his position in the following centuries and officially apologized in only very recent years.

Daily Reminder Catholicism is ripping into two halves, one Vatican II Big Tent (smile and nod your head) the other Tridentine Reactionary (scowl and nod your head).

Daily reminder the Catholic official teaching is that if an adult masturbates they have go tell a priest before taking Communion or they risk hellfie for the double sin of defiling self and Eucharist,and that thinking this religion through in any sense literally leads to a distorted psyche with massively pent up rage and suffocated individuality.

To all of you clean cut neo-traditional good boys dressed in khakis, have fun, don't forget to call your mother, and if you sneak a peak at Margaret's plump trad catholic booty in the communion line you'd best make it a blessing lest your sin create natural disaster in the 3rd world as Augustine said.

[Anonymous No.22523142]

How catholic are the Father Brown stories? Ive been reading them recently and enjoying them.

[Anonymous No.22523153]

Catholic science fiction books that you recommend?
And while we're at it, what Catholic fiction books would you recommend? Books similar to Lord of the Rings or Narnia. Thanks in advance.

[Anonymous No.22523178]

>>22523137
DAMN that's crazy haha

[Anonymous No.22523243]

>>22523137
Yet Christians were baptized in the name for the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit since the 1st century AD

Alas poor John Hus. He taught other things as well though. Overall, it got out of hand. The church is made up of sinners. That's just life.

Mmmkay

Even Prots do a form of confession before the holy Eucharist.

lol

--A prot

[Anonymous No.22523245]

>>22523137
>Daily reminder that the Trinity was made up in the 4th century and makes absolutely no sense, no matter how much Love Augustine throws at it or how much Light Dante said it could emit.
Sir, this is a Wendy's. It's just a book recommendation thread.
That said, the idea of a Trinity existed far before the Church spelled it out. And it wasn't even spelled out in the 4th century, but the 2nd century with Tertullian. While in the Old Testament, there was the Theophany of the Angel of the Lord. God the Father never spoke to anyone directly. It was the Angel of the Lord or sometimes Spirit who inspired the prophets, and they spoke in the first person as God. For he is God, just in different expressions. Not some seperate being from God, but who spoke in the first person as God, who showed up in person to the tent of Abraham, who appeared as the Burning Bush and told Moses "I AM THAT I AM". Angel just means Messenger. From this he became known as the Memra in the Targums. The Word of God. The mouthpiece of God. And the Word became flesh as Jesus.
>Amen, amen, I say to you, before Abraham was, I am.-John 8:58

[Anonymous No.22523259]

>>22523153
I would recommend Anderson's High Crusade.

The author isn't actually Catholic but the narrator is. An enjoyable, relatively short read it was.

[Anonymous No.22523265]

>>22523259
Thanks

[Anonymous No.22523287]

>>22523243
You can fuck off too, you are no better than the Catholics. You swapped an overly-wrought dogmatism for a fides indistinguishale from subego.

All of you could simply detach the blocks from your heads and give up the act, and allow yourselves to think as you actually do, but you are trapped in social relations that restrict your free thought and speech, and you cannot let go of the Noble Lie that Jesus is the Supreme Good Boy and God is Nice.

Have you ever left the house? Have you seen what kind of death and destruction commitment to religious truth causes?

I know we are in a desperate postmodern time where it all looks bleak and we are willing to hide out in pretty bomb shelters with mosaics of Bible scenes.

But get a grip you guys, it is way too late to re-track the world onto Medieval imperialism and Catholicized Thought Monarchism.

We are done. It's over. Now it crawls in a corner and slowly dies, with fierce cries and snarls and desperate gasps.

It is finished. The End of the Age Never came. He was never with us, not for a second. Or will we wait another 2,000 years?

Use your brain. Would you practice Christianity if you were the last Christian professing? Would you die for a church or one, or alter your beliefs?

Social pressure is all that is happening here you guys. Your intellects are caught in the press, but the press is not an intellectual problem.

Homoousia. What the actual fuck are you thinking?

[Anonymous No.22523310]

>>22523287
Sir, this is a Burger King.

Commitment to anything seems to result in death and destruction, because others are inevitably committed to something else. Is commitment evil? No, we just live in a fallen world.

Get over yourself, defeatist.

[Anonymous No.22523317]

>>22523142
>Father Brown
Aren't those Chesterton?

[Anonymous No.22523319]

>>22523310

You found a fruit within reach of your mind, congratulations. You may have it, I would not rob one so deprived, even if it were just.

[Anonymous No.22523329]

>>22523287
>The End of the Age Never came
Of course it did. It was the end of the Jewish age. Not end of everyone. And the Wailing Wall is still a Wailing Wall, as a testament to that end. But Satan has been rearing his head again. Ever since Jews lost everything, they became an apocalyptic cult hellbent on revenge on the Church and unmaking history.
Other than that, you should stop projecting on everyone else. It's immature. I respect that you have your own issues, but don't hurl that on everyone else.

[Anonymous No.22523353]

>>22523329

Man I would make such a fool of you in speech. You wouldn't even open your mouth, you would skeptically stare off into space and toss what cheap barbs you may between my lost trains of thought, then rush home and Google various things to check if what I have told you is indeed true.

Go read the story of the Tapestry and the Vision of Cornelius the Roman soldier in the book of Acts. First read Moses at Sinai in Exodus. Ask yourself if the God who began the covenant by a fiery theophany to Moses is the same God who ended it by decorative bedsheet to Peter and some random Roman soldier on top of a tiny house on the city of Joppa SEVERAL YEARS AFTER the resurrection.

Jesus was a normative Jew, James refused pork, Paul wanted to give out hot dogs to the gentiles to entice them into his new personality coat.

Hint: Paul is the one who decided it was a New Covenant, not Jesus.

Don't give me lip about my attitude. I have to suffer you fools every hour of my life.

[Anonymous No.22523384]

>>22523317
Yes

[Anonymous No.22523428]

>>22523142
The author was a Catholic, converted from Anglicanism, so I'd say pretty catholic

[Anonymous No.22524535]

>>22523353
NTA but you’re a blubbering moron. The New Covenant was not created by Paul. For starters, the Old Testament flat-out says that there will be a New Covenant, and the OT predates Paul by over seven centuries.

And Jesus Himself refers to Himself and His blood as the New Covenant at the last supper. Paul didn’t make that up, it’s in the gospels.

Good Lord, for someone who’s so Biblically and historically illiterate, you sure do love blowing wind up your ass. At least do a 20 second Google search before saying something so laughably wrong. https://www.openbible.info/topics/new_covenant

[Anonymous No.22524568]

>>22524535
Oh fuck off, the Pauline formula of "This is my body.... of the new and eternal covenenat" is the ONLY time Paul overlaps the Gospels in specific phrasing. The same Paul that offers a 5th list of appearances of the resurected Jesus that differs from all four Gospels! The same Paul who hacks his way with the writer of Acts into a new Covenenat

Jesus did not describe or preach or talk about in any sort of sense Paul and the hot dog eaters had. Hence the tension between Paul and James. Jesus kept the mitzvot, called the deity Abba, in Aramaic. Paul worships Theos, a foreign god.

It is one of the most obvious late redactions you dingus! It's a hackjob book, the New Testament! Glue and red ink everywhere! See Mark's ending? Now ya don't! See Mark in Luke? God has copy editors?

Use your brain! I am still up, go ahead.

[Anonymous No.22524983]

Can anyone explain why this schizo "Pauline Christianity" theory appeared?
It never made any sense to me.

[Anonymous No.22524991]

Can anyone explain why this schizo theory of a difference between "Original Christianity" and "Pauline Christianity" appeared?
It never made any sense to me.

[Anonymous No.22525060]

>>22523153
Anything by Gene Wolfe and also I believe T.H. White might have been Catholic. Also, Canticle for Liebowitz is very very Catholic.

[Anonymous No.22525065]

>>22524568
I tell you this for the glory of God and the edification of you in whatever sense as I think it's a saying worth hearing. How women sounded to me as an atheist heretics sound to me as a Catholic.

[Anonymous No.22525069]

Once more with joy, oh my home, I may meet;
Once more, ye fair flow’ry meadows, I greet ye;
My pilgrim staff hence forth may rest,
Since Heavn’s sweet peace is within my breast.

The sinner’s plaint on high was heard,
Accepted by a gracious Lord,
The tears I laid before His shrine,
Are turn’d to hope and joy divine,
Oh Lord, eternal praise be Thine!

The blessed source of Thy mercy o’erflowing,
On souls repentant, who seek Thee, bestowing;
Of Hell and Death I have no fear,
My gracious Lord is ever near.

Hallelujah! Hallelujah!
Eternally, eternally!


Heil! Heil!
The Lord hath marvels wrought!
Redemption He to all hath brought!
One night in blest propitious hour,
He left a sign of His dread pow’r;
The barren staff of priestly rule
He made to bloom with Summer’s green;
Now man’s curse doth the Lord annul,
His pitying love shall make us clean!
Declare it loud through ev’ry land,
None who condemn at last shall stand!
High doth he throne ‘bove sin and death,
Reigning in mercy, not in wrath!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=COhLnFwGaT0

[Anonymous No.22525169]

>>22512803
>the morning star rises in my heart
The morning star in the Bible is literally the devil

[Anonymous No.22525208]

>>22521099
>it’s probably venial
How? St. Aquinas said that masturbation is a worse sexual sin than rape.

[Anonymous No.22525232]

>>22514795
African blacks are the perfect Catholics because they unironically fear God have literally zero tolerance for honky ass transgender kids/open borders/female priest bullshit.

[Anonymous No.22525495]

time to piss of papists.jpeg

"He spoke as God, with authority , "i will give unto thee".For as the father gave you the revelation, so i give you the keys. By "keys" understand that whicdh binds or looses transgressions, namely, penance or absolution; for those who, like peter have been deemed worthy of the grace of the episcopate, have the authority to absolve or to bind. **even though the words "i will give unto thee" were said to peter alone, yet they were given to all the apostles"**

bl. theophylacts commentary on the gospel of st matthew , chapter 16:19

[Anonymous No.22525600]

>>22520744
I'm a Catholic who agrees with St. Augustine more than most other Catholics do, so I suppose that makes me a Calvinist.
>"It was in order to teach us that the act of believing is owing to the Divine gift, not to human merit, that our Saviour declared, ‘No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him; and except it were given unto him of my Father.’ It is wonderful, that two persons hear; one despises, the other ascends. Let him who despises, impute it to himself; let him who ascends, not arrogate it to himself."
>“Christian men in their prayers mutually recommend each other to the Divine regard. That person, for whom no one intercedes, while he intercedes for all, is the true and only Mediator. The apostle Paul, though a principal member under the Head, yet because he was a member of the body of Christ, and knew the great and true High Priest of the Church had entered, not typically, into the recesses within the veil, the holy of holies, but truly and really into the interior recesses of heaven, into a sanctuary not emblematical, but eternal, —Paul, I say, recommends himself to the prayers of believers. Neither does he make himself a mediator between God and the people, but exhorts all the members of the body of Christ mutually to pray for one another; since the members have a mutual solicitude for each other; and if one member suffers, the rest sympathize with it. And so should the mutual prayers of all the members, who are still engaged in the labours of the present state, ascend on each other’s behalf to the Head, who is gone before them into heaven, and who is the propitiation for our sins. For if Paul were a mediator, the other apostles would likewise sustain the same character; and so there would be many mediators; and Paul’s argument could not be supported, when he says, ‘For there is one God, and one Mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus; in whom we also are one, if we keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace.’”

[Anonymous No.22525644]

>>22525065
Hey, altar boy, dummy head,

I don't have a wacky sexual complex in my heas due to believing all human sexual lonings other than penis in vagina between married persons forbidden the use of evil condoms and required by Jesus to inseminate.

I have occasional experiences of same sex attraction and I enjoy wearing bright colors. I am tempermentally masculine and my slight stature makes me an ironic and adorable Napoleon, and it's okay.

And sometimes my erections are weaker than I would like. Also okay. Not freaking out.

Mine is a Healthy. Clean. Psyche.

You aren't going to snag me with your viscious sexual self hatred so obviously manifesting as insecurity you presume others share.

I like myself, my body and its longings, which originate outside my will and which I curtail excesses of strictly througu the operations of reason.

All this to say, I can watch porn and use condoms without a guilt complex, and I do not consicer masturbation "a gravely disordered moral act." For an adult to think or say so is truly ridiculous.

Grow up. For confident men, women bite less and draw no blood with their jabs.

[Anonymous No.22525911]

>>22525644
ok

[Anonymous No.22525917]

>>22525644
>Mine is a Healthy. Clean. Psyche.
I doubt this quite highly.
Seeing as you needed to insert yourself in this Catholic Literature thread and ended up talking about your sexual experiences when no one asked.

[Anonymous No.22525992]

>>22514179
What if true egoism is being Christian
It's literally the best course of action for yourself, and you're eschewing everything that deviates from that goal in going after it.
On the surface stirner is just arguing weakness from giving into bodily desire with disregard for everything else.

[Anonymous No.22526003]

Also
>this is the Bible thread coming back
Comfy.

[Anonymous No.22526008]

>>22517885
Go look at how sin affects you.
How it sets you far from God; try to understand His sadness at it, and keep it in mind when you're feeling urges.

As for the urges themselves, resist them and avoid anything that could access it.
Grab your Bible once it starts to lure you.
Another helpful thing is looking in a mirror; remind yourself of all the evil and wrong in that sin, in how you don't want to do it, and focus yourself out of that lustful 'haze'.

[Anonymous No.22526013]

>>22526008
And also, how it makes you less than human, less than what God made you to be.
See how terrible it is for you to go away from God.

[Anonymous No.22526021]

>>22525644
Reaching levels of reddit spacing that shouldn't even be possible.

[Anonymous No.22526038]

>>22522934
It's not a jealousy thing; anyone can join the orders. The hardest thing is getting a hold of members/community, which varies a lot based on where you are and how active the members are (and the fact that most of them are old and don't have much of a digital presence). After that you literally just help volunteer stuff and they opt to let you start the process of joining.

[Anonymous No.22526039]

>>22525232
I wonder if Sarah will still be there for the next vote (or even if he will still be an option). he seems like a true Christian.

on the topic of Africa, it is quite curious that people attack Christianity as colonialist while it was in Africa nearly from the start. Already had its biggest national conversions around the fifth century, and its first contact in like 50 AD.

[Anonymous No.22526048]

>>22526021
don't feed the troll, anony.

[Anonymous No.22526093]

>>22526021
If I don't put spaces in your zoomer brain will tl;dr me.

>>22526048
I don't think you know what a troll is. I am not posting deliberately outrageous remarks to instigate an outragefrom you.

I am an ex member of your wacky religion that enjoys the great freedom and light weight of being outside the wacky religion, and I extend my hand to you to tell you that outside the wacky church it is a beautiful day.

[Anonymous No.22526097]

>>22526039
Sarah is retired last I heard.

[Anonymous No.22526105]

>>22524991
Generate division and build a wedge to attack Christianity with.
Paul is a very oft attacked man, because a lot of his writings is exegesis and explanations/exhortations.
In attacking him, they try to undermine theology and Christianity as a whole(often attackign both with the same nonsensical "argument").

[Anonymous No.22526107]

>Mere Christianity - C. S. Lewis
>Introduction to Christianity - Pope Benedict XVI
>The Confessions of St. Augustine
>St. Thomas Aquinas - G.K. Chesterton
>Orthodoxy - G.K. Chesterton
>The Everlasting Man - G.K. Chesterton
>A Shorter Summa The Essential Philosophical Passages of Saint Thomas Aquinas Summa Theologica - Peter J. Kreeft
>Catechism of the Summa Theologi - Thomas Aquinas
>Catholic Catechism of Saint Piu - Pope St. Pius X
>Early Christian Writings The Apostolic Fathers - Andrew Louth
>History of the Christian Church (Complete Eight Volumes In One) - Philip Schaff
>Ignatius Catholic Study Bible New Testament RSV 2nd Edition
>The Faith of Our Fathers - James Cardinal Gibbons
>The Spirit of Catholicism - Karl Adam Robert A. Krieg
>The Complete Ante-Nicene & Nicene and Post-Nicene Church Fathers Collection
>United States Catholic Conference - Catechism of the Catholic Church-Libreria Editrice Vaticana (2000)

https://www.traditionalcatholic.co/free-catholicbooks/
https://www.traditionalcatholic.co/free-catholic-books-ii/
http://www.freecatholicebooks.com/
http://www.saintsbooks.net/BooksList.html
https://catholicebooks.wordpress.com/subject/

[Anonymous No.22526110]

>>22526097
yeah, think so.
had to send the letter in after hitting 75, as is custom.
Quite promptly sent into retirement too.

[Anonymous No.22526116]

>>22526107
Do you have the "/Christian/ reading guide" chart?
It's pretty great. Along with the "theology of the first seven ecumenical councils" one; i think there's both in the /lit/ wiki.

[Anonymous No.22526136]

>>22521225
42 youths;
Paraphrasing, a group of almost adults (around 20s and close) threatening a prophet bwfore he goes into their city.
Think of an antifa protest if you want a contemporary comparison. The same kind of "almost violent mockery and attacks" from anyone against them. The same violent tension a step away from snapping.

Elisha was close to being lynched by a mob mocking him.
Some even argue they were telling him to go away/die when they said he should follow Elijah in "going on up".

[Anonymous No.22526154]

Anyone here read Raymond Brown’s 101 Questions and Answers?

[Anonymous No.22526171]

>>22509503

Anglo-Catholic reading list, "How to save Western civilization."

[Anonymous No.22526242]

>>22511159
Glad to see someone posting Mauriac! One of my all-time favorite authors, and some I rarely see discussed here. Viper’s Tangle is absolute kino, and with as much as people here love Dostoevsky, I think Mauriac is a great recommendation

[Anonymous No.22526272]

>>22526154
Raymond Brown is an embarassment to God, who designed intellect to illuminate a room, and who now watches in shocked horror as Raymond Brown's lighrey brain squeezes itself into channels, tubes, mechanisms and tracks, contorting and conniving into a great circuit of little pistons and footnotes through the seems of which oozes a dulled, yellow oil that smells of Balsam and drips on the floor where children go slipping and falling with their ill treaded church loafers.

Strange Raymond. Poor kids.

(Benedict read Raymond Brown in detail and with great interest. The old Inquisitor knew the importance of keeping an Academic Top Man at work on defending the New Testament from the heresy of common sense.This shows you how desperate even a traditionalist bastion like Benedict's faith really is. He looked up Raymond Brown footnotes in the middle of the night.)

[Anonymous No.22526441]

Scholasticism is a product of Plato being lost in the medieval west whereas Aristotle wasn't. Is there a reason Platonism tends to be in vogue during the more excessive periods of Church history (late antiquity, Renaissance resurgence) whereas Scholasticism seems to be more in vogue during more austere periods (Middle Ages, 20th-century apologetics)?

I associate Platonism/Neoplatonism with a sense of anti-Scholastic Greco-Roman decadence even if the actual doctrine of Platonism is ascetic and proto-authoritarian.

[Anonymous No.22526458]

>>22526441
You are fairly off there, Aristotle is the one who entered discourse late, via Arabic ca. 1200.

Homer enters around this time as well (Dante never read Homer!) while the Aeneid persisted through the early middle ages. Perhaps that is your mixup?

The first centuries AD are astonishingly complec and you have ypu have to be a fairly strong scholar to really comprehend big epochs like that. You would just have to spend decades reading in Greek/Hebrew/Latin.

I don't have anything like that but my sense is Neoplatonism was ascendent in the first centuries of Christianity, and then became displaced by rationalism.

The Scholastics (and I only really know a tad of Duns Scotus) seem to make large advances in rationality beyond the categories of antiquity due to the additional metaphysical settings of Christian theology. In my imagination scholastics are northern mystical scholar monks who chased God through copybooks in the dead of night and captured real glimpses of him nobody had ever seen.
And the scholastics accidentally birthed modern philosophy via Descartes.

[Anonymous No.22526506]

Thoughts on Ratzinger/Benedict?

He's clearly brilliant, and his arc is so fascinating to me. He started off as a huge admirer of the nouvelle theologie, but post-Vatican 2 he grows increasingly more trad, culminating of course in issuing Summorum Pontificum during his papacy. One seems to see a visible regret for what became of the Church after Vatican 2.

I've read some of the Jesus of Nazareth series; they're brilliant. Need to finish, and I want to read Introduction to Christianity soon enough.

[Anonymous No.22526519]

>>22526506
Not regret of Vatican 2 itself, but it's abuses in the following years. He pointed the way and left many gifts on how to navigate it.

[Anonymous No.22526521]

>>22526506
A theologian is all. We will never know the real Ratzinger, just the General Theologian Ratzinger Subtype he decided to become for whatever reason.

He tows the party line reliably and takes doctrine very seriously. That is, he is a Catholic.

If you read him you will indeed find Catholic thoughts operating over Catholic ideas. That they unfold in the mind of a man called Ratzinger is totally irrelevant.

Anyways it's not hard to see his actual personality. He is a Germanic temperment fond of order and organization. He is an elitist aesthete with primitive tastes, preferring Mozart's empty and endlessly valid ornamental phrases to either Bach's intellectual intricacy or Beethoven's emotional ressonance. That about sums it up for me.

[Anonymous No.22526531]

>>22526171
>Anglo-Catholic reading list, "How to save Western civilization."
You should add St. Gregory's Prayerbook.

[Anonymous No.22526545]

>>22526521
Bach wasn't a Catholic. Why should he prefer him? Mozart was also Bavarian (more or less) like Benedict. You gotta stick with your homies.

[Anonymous No.22526552]

>>22526545
I find your suggestion that one should choose musical compositions according to religious sympathies with the composer aggressively stupid.

It is like you are trying to offend all human sensibility on purpose.

[Anonymous No.22526557]

>>22526552
It's just a joke. Is this autism?
Actually, now that I ask that, that's probably why Bavarians and Austrians are preferable in the first place.

[Anonymous No.22526565]

>>22526557
It is impossible to differentiate a mild sarcasm from a common stupidity on this forum and you well know this. I mistrust your claim that you were being funny because the general tone of this thread is a stupid parade.

[Anonymous No.22526579]

>>22525208
Addiction weakens culpability significantly especially if you started young. For example, if you started heroin (or p*rn) at 12 then you shooting up or not being able to stop shooting up at 25 is not surprising. God is asking you to trust Him to heal you.

[Anonymous No.22526580]

>>22525644
>Hey, altar boy, dummy head,
I forgive you and didn't read the rest of your post.

[Anonymous No.22526596]

>>22526579
In my 1955 OED, which easily defines all sorts of gorey concepts and sexual greek terms, defines masturbation as "To defile oneself." A rather short entry.

Censorship is a hangover we are just barely getting over. And you are going to tell an adult that touching their pee pee is a no no because the Deity doesn't like it, because he intended pee pee for vagina only and gets very upset when people use his stuff the "wrong" way, to the point that he is known to bar entry to Heaven for some very egregious self pee pee touchers, even while his bishops down below busy themselves hiding kiddy pee pee touchers in Roman collars from prying "secular liberal anti-Catholic" media.

How are the RCIA numbers this year? 4 or 5 people in the city signed up for this shit? Shocking.

[Anonymous No.22526598]

>>22526565
Bad day? I'm not here to add to it.
>mistrust your claim
I used homies and Pope Benedict in the same sentence. Not sure why you'd think otherwise.

[Anonymous No.22526610]

>>22526596
Afaik, there's at least 40 people in RCIA at my parish alone.

[Anonymous No.22526632]

>>22526610
Good Lutheran boys marrying Good Catholic girls does not count, nor do 20 year old cradle Catholics getting their belated confirmations as part of a nascent adult identity quest.

I love how young people pretty reliably choose to follow their nice parents (if they have them) as a first step in life. It is genuinely sweet.

Ah. I have to be honest anyways you depress me with this number 40. That 40 people in any city anywhere desire to be Catholic in 2023 defears me utterly.

I abandon this thread, defeated. Have your Bible roleplay religion. Have it all. Crawl in your box. Deep. Where it is very quiet and safe. And go to sleep. Goodnight. Life's a dream anyways, nothing is very important in the world that continuously decays.

[Anonymous No.22526636]

>>22526632
>I abandon this thread, defeated.
What did you want in the first place?

[Anonymous No.22526640]

>>22526632
Great, don't let the door hit you on the way out.

[Anonymous No.22526678]

>>22526636
To plant seeds in the brains of Catholics so they have an idea of where to look when their faith comes crashing down over their head as it surely will, when life hits.

When you find yourself in that position and realize that your faith does nothing at all to help you battle the black hole gnawing at your toes, I want you to have a sense of the error. It is not the case that God is unreal and life is meaningless.But the men who pretend to represent him are just that- pretenders.

My hope is someone will remember something I have said under such circumstances, and not have to face an artificial choice between the nihilism of total anti-faith and all out Dogmatic practice.

God is real and his church is outdoors. He speaks in poems, music, love, togetherness, wine, food, warmth, health.

Fat chance, I know.

[Anonymous No.22526699]

>>22526678
I'm only where I'm at because I already did hit rock bottom. I used to steal from nuns. Not listen to them. Among other things. It's Christ who set me straight from the outside. Hopefully he'll do the same for you too.

[Anonymous No.22526864]

>>22526521
I love Bach but you got filtered

[Anonymous No.22526875]

>>22526699
I am not talking about sex drugs and rock and roll, I am talking about your loved ones you will watch die one by one if cancer does knock you dead at 55 like it did my Dad.

Have you grieved as a Catholic yet? That's the test. If you can grieve Catholic you are a true believer. I tried to grieve Catholic. Just too many dark feelings in the corners, I couldn't breathe.

[Anonymous No.22526877]

>>22509503
proof?

[Anonymous No.22526974]

>>22526877
That the pope is Catholic?
Still working on it.

[Anonymous No.22526989]

>>22526596
>1955 OED
Not an authority on morals nor normative.
>easily defines... gorey concepts and sexual greek terms
I'm not sure that about a probably 10-25 person project, at least, over many years is easy but sure.
>Censorship is a hangover we are just barely getting over.
It's peculiar to me that you don't correctly use the word "censorship" nor even dictionaries, as if somehow a group of men agreeing with us 60 years ago is some conspiracy against your mis-used neurons, and yet your standards for morals and strictures of human behavior is some prattling on, and pseudo-relative-puritanism to be sure, that a pedarast was a Bishop or a priest or even maybe the odd Pope is somehow revelatory proof that mortal isn't anything but mortal sin. Your post is unimpressive, categorically insane, and embarrassing. Also, if any of it were true, it'd be preferable that you were merely self-punishing your neruons over engaging in intellectual debate but that's not the case. Either admit you prefer intellectual and moral debates to depravity and admit that depravity is depraved or stop wasting intellectual curiosity on defending ill-conceived idols like the ability to secretly view women as sexual objects in private (as the penis is not without thoughts but your defense is).

[Anonymous No.22526994]

>>22526678
>To plant seeds in the brains of Catholics so they have an idea of where to look when their faith comes crashing down over their head as it surely will, when life hits.
This is the most pathetic self-indulgence of any manner or form.that I have ever seen. Your prose admit a mediocre intelligence and a high degree of self-confused malice with likely a menagerie of heresies, long overwritten navel-gazing, and general faux-revelations to coddle your divorce from the Church.

[Anonymous No.22527002]

>>22526989
>>22526989
I certainly did not say the 1955 OED or CT Onions are moral authorities. Who could possibly even think this?

I compared the defintion for masturbation (a well known dirty-word sure to be looked up by kids) with, say paraphilia (a word adults will look up). It defines paraphilia unhesitatingly with multiple entries, quote and etymology.

Masturbation literally just says "to defile oneself." That entry was not written by a lexicographer, it was written by an editor.

Ie, censorship. You trackin? Good. You're an ace, kid. Nothing gets by you.

[Anonymous No.22527010]

>>22526994
I will try harder as a person? I'm not sure what reaction you were desiring with this very angry post.

[Anonymous No.22527022]

>>22527002
>censorship
Are you howling and licking your "wounds" that a 70 year old dictionary correctly defined, agreeing with Plato and nearly every major moral theologian before the last 70 years, masturbation? And then saying that this "censorship", which is so vast and conspiratorial that you easily post about it now, is somehow 1) detrimental, 2) exists, 3) is wrong? You implied 1 incorrectly, 2 by just contradiction because this grave conspiracy you easily "saw through," and 3 you ommitted by saying a bad man did a bad so now you can do whatever you want. Personally, I have zero doubt you were raised and syrrounded by bigotted Catholics, based on your pists, and I'm deeply sorry to get that impression.

[Anonymous No.22527032]

>>22527022
Why are you arguing with yourself about the definition of masturbation in --MY-- 1955 OED?

I cited it from memory as an example of censorship in the past, an example of the time when parents were deeply afraid of what might happen if their children knew words like "orgasm" and "masturbation."

That'a all. It is an appropriate and accurate example of the phenomenon (terror of sex) which I referred to in abstract and desires a concrete example of.

No more with you, stop it. I ignore you henceforrh unless you discover an interesting thought to share.

[Anonymous No.22527145]

>open thread
>schizo boomer ranting about jerking off
>close thread

[Anonymous No.22527343]

>>22527032
>henceforrh
It's clear you're young and also warring against admittedly overly Puritanical people but I would recommend rebelling via physical distance and education. Catholic moral teachings are not overly stringent or impossible and any good Confession will confirm this. I will also sex, don't overestimate that sexual sins are far less serious than spiritual sins but just easier for many people to condemn.

[Anonymous No.22527351]

>>22526506
Brilliant theologian, a great pope.
there's even theories he was pushed into the pope emeritus position.

The most interesting part is seeing the immense amounts of critique from the more libertine heretics, who were angry at actions like denouncing transexuals and other statements against homosexual marriage.
directly blaming the pedophilia scandals on homosexual cliques that infiltrated the church too.

[Anonymous No.22527375]

>>22527343
>>22527343
I am 34 and converted to Catholicism at 28. I was not raised a Catholic at all

I have not had spell check or autocorrect installed on my phone for several years. I got tired of constantly correcting corrections.

I tap every letter and this can get sloppy when typing fast.

Be a tiny itsy bit humble, friend.

[Anonymous No.22527423]

>>22526458
I'm honestly thinking less of the doctrine itself and more just the different milieus in which they seemed to flourish. I associate Platonism and Neoplatonism with the late Roman Empire and the Renaissance when Augustine and the Medicis were massive drunks or horndogs, whereas I associate Scholasticism/Aristotle with ascetic English monks in habits.

I know that's a really huge oversimplification of history but they are the archetypes that exist in my mind and I want to know why that is.

[Anonymous No.22527434]

>>22527375
>phoneposting
Repent

[Anonymous No.22527435]

>>22527423
This may be correct for all I know, my hisory is nowhere near good enough to say. Certainly Aristotle is the writer whose translations were rediscovered in the beginning of the high middle ages, not Plato.

[Anonymous No.22527480]

>>22527375
I meant the word choice was odd - I mistype everything too and phone post too - just be warned it's a far greater sin to cause others to sin than to sin yourself. You're in my imperfect prayers.

[Anonymous No.22527490]

>>22509503
Where spaniards the only good catholic poets? They're the only ones i've read.

[Anonymous No.22527496]

>>22527480
Lol, hey... want to know what I think of your warning?

Suck my nuts

Want to know what I think of your prayer?Shove it up the ass of your lord and savior. You don't love him. Or else you wouldn't pray in the direction of an image of his corpse and direct your prayers to the Butcher God that watched the nails stab his only boy as he cried, "Papa"

You are a sicko. I don't care that you are also a dumbass. People are born dumbasses or smart, it means nothing.

Do you want to avoid being misled? Then stop misleading yourself.

[Anonymous No.22527547]

>>22518390

AUGUSTINE

[Anonymous No.22527561]

>>22523137

Your individual ego should be suffocated. That's the point. Replace your will with the Will of God. Catering to yourself as an individual is SIN. Pride.

[Anonymous No.22527591]

>>22509636
Protestant Bibles take books out. Specifically Tobit, Judith, 1 and 2 Maccabees, Wisdom of Solomon, Sirach, and Baruch. So you can enjoy the KJV for its literary value, it is de facto an incomplete Bible, as are all protestant versions.

[Anonymous No.22527632]

>>22527561
>>22527561
>"Your individual ego should be suffocated"

This is an internalized echo of parental rage at the bruised child ego. It's coming from the region of the mind that fears humiliation and seeks approval. All of us have this region, it comes from social childhoods.

How do you know when you are doing the Will of God or not? Does the reasoning and gnosis come from your mind? And does this mind act on its own and with its own logic? Then it is you who set the bar.

You may choose to set the bar in, say, the precise manner of the Catechism, or somewhat higher or lower. But you set the bar. Perhaps Augustine and Aquinas made the bar. But you set it.

Which is to say you are a man with free will acting in the world according to his reason and habit like everyone else.

It would be mighty, mighty arrogant to suppose one's own moral principles necessarily represented the Will of God merely because one is convinced they are currently faithful/practising/trying/"close to the Lord"

[Anonymous No.22527669]

>>22527490
Dante was italian and the divine comedy is a must-read,if you dont want to commit to the whole trilogy than at least just the inferno.

[Anonymous No.22527674]

>>22527591
personally i have a protestant bible but also got the the complete apocrypha which also include the ethiopian enoch and stuff in another book.
the apocrypha was worth it just for judith desu,what an amazing story.

[Anonymous No.22527733]

>>22527632

Nice try Satan. I aim for perfection. I subordinate my ego to God and God works through me.

All your sophistry means nothing. Either God is real or He isn't. If God is real then your sophistry means nothing. If God isn't real then your sophistry means nothing. You're playing deceptive word games to try and cause people to doubt themselves. SORRY not happening today.

In the past I would have entertained a.conversation or debate with you. But now I am wiser. I'm past being pulled into the pit of circular discussions that ignore the fundamental issue. You either devote fully to God or you don't. Nothing else needs to be said.

[Anonymous No.22527745]

>>22524568

[Anonymous No.22527841]

>>22527669
Yeah i guess i didn't think of him as a poet because i read him it in prose translation but you're right

[Anonymous No.22527875]

>>22527733
This has the intelligence of the average Christian Facebook post. Congratulations, you just shot a hole through your own brain.

>>22527745
Use your words honey

[Anonymous No.22527893]

>>22527875
>This has the intelligence of the average Christian Facebook post. Congratulations, you just shot a hole through your own brain.
You're trying to convert convinced Catholics on a Mongolian knitting forum. And it isn't even a theology thread. That's probably sillier than facebook.

[Anonymous No.22527995]

>>22527893
>convinced Catholic
This isn't a thing. It is not possible to be convinced of this Monstrosity Religion in the way one can be convinced of ordinary propositions. To practice or profess it requires an extremely elaborate psychological structure rooted in sense of sexual selfhood and reaching up through the mind and into such diverse regions as political ideology and aesthetic preference. It is highly particular to the individual.

This is why there's a type of Christianity that suits any given type of mind. The more rationality and knowledge the public has, the more splintering must occur for Christianity. This is happening in spades within the Catholic church as well, where one finds a bewildering range of opinions about everything. But the Catholic church is One True Church, so she cannot break. Hence she quickly becomes mute as heterodoxies within her rage and bloom and overgrow.

It is over anon. We are two thousand years into this mighty experiment, and have only marched deeper and deeper into the wilderness of Modernity.

Soon begins the Blood Carnival, the horrible final stand, and it will be the end of Christianity and also humanity. They will not live alongside the faggots, the trannies, the she-hes... they will not join rank with the Abomination... they will die before they see a child raised in a commons, or the embryos in a line.

How will these strange and myriad Christians behave when calamity arrives?

Oh they have lots of guns.
Oh they are unafraid of death
Oh they are Holy Warriors and it's lookin' like Revelations out there.
See the clouds?


It is finished.

[Anonymous No.22528002]

>>22527995
>This is why there's a type of Christianity that suits any given type of mind.
There is no other type. And whatever is good about other communities already exists in the Catholic church. You otoh have a very limited view of it.
>>22527995
>, and have only marched deeper and deeper into the wilderness of Modernity.
It's already dead, killed by the Frankenstein monster it released. But even the Church has a place in postmodernism and beyond.

[Anonymous No.22528031]

>>22528002
How did I know you were going to get hung up on the idea of a multiplicity of Christianities? The multiplicities run right through your parishes you idiot, this is the cause of variance in belief. The variances your pastor fully knows are there but is powerless to clarify. The variances you yourself observe, but conceive of as imperfections awaiting a new coalescence of the faith (what Vatican II desperately tried and fantastically failed to be).

Anon, that would be motion in the exact opposite direction of the momentum of 2,000 years of history .

There is no fucking way the Church can undo what has been unleashed. She must wither into factions and mute irrelevance. There is no way out.

The ship is going down and your feet are wet. Bend down. Will you baptize your kiddos here and leave them this very mess? The water will only he higher, your body aged more years.

Is this the institution you will give your mind and soul to?

[Anonymous No.22528056]

>>22527547
My two instincts for his (>>22518390)'s posts were Augustine and Ignatius of Loyola but I don't know if they'd just make him feel worse, because he's talking about being a late-bloomer and Augustine and Ignatius were already young accomplished chads in the worldly sense before their spiritual renewal.

[Anonymous No.22528087]

>>22528031
There is a command towards humility on the mysteries of God. The Fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge. Even Aquinas would tell everyone this. Not everything has a definitive answer, and this idea of an all encompassing psychological structure down to even politics and aesthetics is just dumb. Even as you rebel, you're just as stubborn as a trad.
>The crucified Son of God is the historic event upon which every attempt of the mind to construct an adequate explanation of the meaning of existence upon merely human argumentation comes to grief. The true keypoint, which challenges every philosophy, is Jesus Christ’s death on the cross. It is here that every attempt to reduce the Father’s saving plan to purely human logic is doomed to failure.”-JPII, Fides Et Ratio

[Anonymous No.22528099]

>>22528087
What do you call a Catholic that's been cornered in a theology debate?

A mystic

[Anonymous No.22528142]

Could have been a good thread, but of course a schizo with a phobia of christian things found it

[Anonymous No.22528162]

>>22528099
That position is all I've ever had and all I've wanted for you or anyone else. A revelation of God. I could never give you this myself and no amount of arguments will bring you any closer to it. I wish it was that simple.

[Anonymous No.22528178]

>>22528162
I have had mystical experiences in my life. Most people have. All over the world. Buddha was exploring the cosmos under a tree 500 years before baby Jesus wept.

The sensation of oneness with God is known in all societies. The descriptions of encounters as transcendent, life changing, inexpressible in language etc. are exactly the same as you find among Christian faithful.

In other words please explain how you know the religious awe you have experienced is related to the character Jesus from Mark's Gospel and not a distinct spiritual outgrowth of intensive human emotions like belonging, love, forgiveness, acceptance peppered with a Catholic vocabulary.

[Anonymous No.22528193]

>>22528178
I'm not talking about oneness. If you feel one with God, you're especially deluded.
As I quoted already, "The fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge."-Proverbs 1:7

>And the seraphim cried unto another, and said, Holy, holy, holy, is the LORD of hosts: the whole earth is full of his glory. And the posts of the door moved at the voice of him that cried, and the house was filled with smoke.
>Then said I, Woe is me! for I am undone; because I am a man of unclean lips, and I dwell in the midst of a people of unclean lips: for mine eyes have seen the King, the LORD of hosts.-Isaiah 6:3-5

[Anonymous No.22528215]

>>22528193
I am shocked. A Catholic just quoted the Psalmist to me which implores worship to YHWH, the deity Christianity quietly abandoned for its exciting Monster Deity, which is a Frankenstein of Decaying Crucified Jesus, Neutered YHWH and a birdlike beam of light that flies up lady's vaginas and impregnates them with God-Sperm.

And I am told calmly by straight faced men this can all be explained satisfactorily. Presumably many footnotes will be involved.

[Anonymous No.22528230]

Do you keep your Bible on your shelf or at your side at all times?

[Anonymous No.22528266]

>I just wanted to talk about videogames... I just wanted to talk about tabletop games... I just wanted to talk about Catholic literature...

Why do asinine schizo's insert themselves into everything and ruin the discourse no matter where you are online anymore, my brother anons?

[Anonymous No.22528282]

>>22528266
These people have very fragile egos.

[Anonymous No.22528289]

>>22528266
He might be a Jew deliberately trying to derail the thread.

[Anonymous No.22528331]

>>22528282
>>22528289
I have more self confidence at the moment than at any other time in my life. Abandoning Christianity led to an intellectual renaissance and my mind is explosively creative right now. My psyche has been released from my childhood guilt complex.

>>22528289
Classic Christianity. Very much like John's Gospel where Jews are called devils over and over.

Devil... heretic... Jew... rebel... these are all ways of naming whoever will not submit to Catholocity.>>22528282

[Anonymous No.22528351]

>>22528331
Weak bait.

[Anonymous No.22528356]

>>22528331
Good for you?

No one here has any reason to care?
You come here, you start a conflict, you yhen complain about being labeled an antagonist by some anons.

Yet another pseudo-Intellectual who knows some basic philosophy and big words graces the presence of 4ch. Yay.

If you're miserable, go find someone else to share it with

[Anonymous No.22528378]

>>22528356
I don't care if you like me, at all. I know I am wicked smart, I don't need or desire validation from a lesser mind.

You cannot touch me, I am sorry. You have nothing more to say and now proceed to sourpuss. Shoo, this is my thread now.

[Anonymous No.22528404]

>>22528378
This is a Catholic thread, ergo, it belongs firstly to Our Lord and then, secondarily, to Our Lady.

[Anonymous No.22528412]

>>22528356
>>22528404
Could you stop replying? He's obviously baiting you.

[Anonymous No.22528424]

>>22528412
In medieval times this is the part where you guys would burn me at the stake.

[Anonymous No.22528434]

Is the Douay-Rheims as poetic as the King James?

[Anonymous No.22528560]

>>22528434
not quite but it's a better translation
KJV copied Douay-Rheims and then made it more poetic in places at the cost of accuracy (intentional protestant mistranslation)

[Anonymous No.22528617]

>>22528560
Please execute me sir I have been a very bad boy and am deeply ashamed.