Magic Mountain Week 5

[Anonymous No.22112085]

Chapter 4 is done! Now, onto Chapter 5. How far are you in the reading? How are you finding it? Any thoughts, opinions, or predictions?

A recap of the chapter:

>Stupidity and illness discussion with Settembrini.
>Hans goes for a hike.
>Obssesion with Pribislav.
>Dr. Krokowski talks about love.
>Hans' obssesion with Frau Chauchat.
>Settembrini's grandfather.
>Hans is ill


Here are some the passages I recently highlighted:

>[Music] divides [hours] up and gives some content to each, so that there's something to them after all—whereas normally the hours and days and weeks hang so awfully heavy on one's hands.

>[...] (Love) was the most unstable and exposed, fundemtally prone to confusion and perversion [...] each of its constituent elements was a perversion [...] one ought not conclude that the whole was itself a perversion simply because its parts were, one was therefore compelled to enlist the legitimaxy of the whole, if not its whole legitimacy, and apply it to each of the perverse parts.

>We all love people like that, whether we want to or not, because when they annoy us with their carelessness, the annoyance becomes just one more reason for being fond of them. What it is to be annoyed at people and yet have no choice but to love them.

>Humanism has been accused of exaggerating the importance of form; but it cultivated beautiful form purely for the sake of the dignity of man.

[Anonymous No.22112432]

>>22112085
I don't know what it is about Mann's prose that makes me feel like I'm being kept at an arm's length from the world and characters, there's this intellectual veneer that doesn't let me in
like the philosophical tangents feel flat and undeserved, it's almost like Mann himself has just started thinking about time and human nature and we are witnessing him try to reason everything out for the first time (which wouldn't be a bad thing if those concepts were not so, well, basic - I'm thinking of 'Excursus on the Sense of Time' here)
the book is interesting but I'm feeling disconnected and I don't know what to make of that

[Anonymous No.22112436]

>>22112085
I don't know what it is about Mann's prose that makes me feel like I'm being kept at arm's length from the world and characters, there's this intellectual veneer that doesn't let me in
like the philosophical tangents feel flat and undeserved, it's almost like Mann himself has just started thinking about time and human nature and we are witnessing him try to reason everything out for the first time (which wouldn't be a bad thing if those concepts were not so, well, basic - I'm thinking of 'Excursus on the Sense of Time' here)
the book is interesting but I'm feeling disconnected and I don't know what to make of that

[Anonymous No.22112538]

>>22112085
>20 pages left in chapter 4 still
Fortunately, it's really captivating me. If only life didn't get in the way.
It's amusing seeing Settembrini spouting off about whig history and humanism having just read Spengler's caustic critique of all that. It made me wonder exactly how common Settembrini's views were at the time.
Also, I think Mann does a better job at describing a crush than any other writer I've read.

[Anonymous No.22112616]

>>22112436
I think he's trying to illustrate in a layman way some thoughts on the subject. Like he's laying explicit the themes of the novel.

[Anonymous No.22113006]

Just looking at Chapter 5, it appears to be double the length of Chapter 4.

I should have plenty of time to get through it but I don't know about you guys. I reckon Encyclodaedic as a deadline for next week (a few pages less than Ch. 4.) Does that sound reasonable?

[Anonymous No.22113287]

>>22113006
That seems good. I'll try to push further but don't think I can count on it.

[Anonymous No.22113913]

>>22112436
I’m not reading TMM but Dr. Faustus instead right now and I find that characteristic of Mann’s prose to be quite appropriate for DF although I’m not quite sure how well it translates to TMM. I felt the same at the beginning that it’s almost stifling to a real envelopment in the work but you only need to give it about 100 pages to work it’s magic. Those themes will come up again and again in different situations and each one will be a little addition or variation to the classic scheme that all compound on each other until it comes to its apogee not unlike the swelling of the tide or or the denouement of an orchestra. Mann is quite good at being transparent about his themes but still having them work due to the sheer intricacy with which he develops them and which naturally invite the reader to engage with them on the same ruthlessly analytical level as Mann himself.

[Anonymous No.22114314]

>>22113913
>Mann is quite good at being transparent about his themes
I think this is what fucks with me, I love Dostoevsky and I'm used to the themes being deeply embedded in the interplay between intricate psychologies so it feels like cheating when things are stated outright
everyone says I should bear with it and that the book gets better after page 200

[Anonymous No.22114352]

>>22112538
There is a passage about the two principles: Asiatic and European. Having read Spengler, does that agree with what you have read?

Yes, the description of Hans' internal dialogue and the one with Fraulein is quite novel to me. His description of the way people engage in drama: how both parties tease and know what they are doing. It's also refreshing to hear his rationalized infatuation in this imperfect sick girl.

[Anonymous No.22115096]

bump

[Anonymous No.22115210]

>>22112436
that very much is his stock German style typical of the time in my experience, but you will see flashes brilliant but so fleeting you'd think he's been cheating you the rest of the time. Settembrini is a joy, you can dig your teeth in there if you're more political. lots of 'lit crit' to sample from
keep in mind this is very much a bilndungsroman and therefore in critical dialogue with the Germam/European character and lackadaisical turn toward leisure and mysticism before sleeping giants to come would awake.

[Anonymous No.22115231]

I'd add for readers that much of the medical examination and pontification may seem like fluff or tedious but it remains a throughline in the narrative and story so don't just ignore it

[Anonymous No.22115261]

well if any of you get ancy with extra time to read ahead then it would not be a bad idea to spend the 2 hours or so to read Mann's brief but canonized 'A Death in Venice'. A text deserving of study in it's own right that may give you additional context to unluck TMM. It's like a German-gay Lolita yes Mann was closeted

[Anonymous No.22116077]

>>22115261
I had just finished Death in Venice when I discovered your guyses thread on either week 3 or chapter 3 (I forget which). I liked Death in Venice so much that I was excited to read more Thomas Mann immediately and I've been playing catch up for the past week or so. I liked how distilled Death in Venice felt in its ideas so I was tentative about The Magic Mountain, given it's length and all, but so far I've been very pleasantly surprised.
I actually just finished Analysis this morning and the parallels between Aschenbach's fondness for Tadzio and Han's for Pribislav struck me immediately. It seems like both books are going to share the theme of 'love from afar', and I love the way Mann writes about that stuff so I'm glad it seems like we're going to get more of that with Chauchat, it'll be interesting to see this sort of thing with less of a distance between the admired and the admirer. It also seems like both books share the themes of disease and time, at least in the sense that Aschenbach seemed to lament his old age and oldness in general despite being accomplished, and already early on we've seen Joachim lament something similar on his staying for so long while being not so accomplished. The fear or regret of just letting the years slip by without having done much seems like an obvious thing for this book to tackle, but I'm curious to see how these themes develop.
Also I must say that this book feels very comfy, Death in Venice held a sort of tense air for me but TMM feels 'nicer'. I don't think I can properly articulate what I mean by that, perhaps the longer length gives the book more breathing room, or maybe it's just the change in subject matter. Regardless, I find it a very pleasant read.

[Anonymous No.22116289]

>>22114352
>There is a passage about the two principles: Asiatic and European. Having read Spengler, does that agree with what you have read?
No, it's slightly reminiscent of Aristotle but taken in a different direction. I believe Guenon discusses it somewhere but I have no desire to read more of him.

[Anonymous No.22116675]

>>22112085
>>Hans' obssesion with Frau Chauchat.
having read the whole thing, this is one of my favorite parts of the book. It so perfectly captures everything about falling in love as a slightly shy, studious young man.