/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.21650508]

I’D LIKE TO BE UNDER THE SEA IN AN OCTOPUS’ GARDEN IN THE SHADE

[Anonymous No.21650528]

>>21650508
>>>/mu/

[Anonymous No.21650534]

>>21650508
lmao

[Anonymous No.21650703]

>Nigga commits suicide for watching absolute kino
https://www.vagant.no/fra-peer-gynt-versjonen/

[Anonymous No.21651723]

Portrait of Otto Weininger by Isidore Kaufmann (1903).

[Anonymous No.21651748]

>>21650508
worst thread on /lit/ rn

[Anonymous No.21651806]

>>21650703

[Anonymous No.21651835]

>>21651723

[Anonymous No.21651908]

>>21651806
"Has it been observed what kind of name Ibsen has chosen for his hero? Peer Gynt – it has so little gravity. The name is like a rubber ball that keeps bouncing off the ground." - Weininger

[Anonymous No.21651932]

>>21650508
best thread on /lit/ rn

[Anonymous No.21651934]

>>21651806
Which translation is this?

[Anonymous No.21651937]

>>21651908
The person who hated himself the most had to be Nietzsche. His hatred of Wagner and of
asceticism, and his wish to switch allegiance to Bizet and Gottfried Keller, was merely a
hatred of the Wagnerian, the ascetic and totally non-idyllic person that he was himself.
Self-hate is certainly morally superior to self-love. Thus the insincerity is bad, with which
Nietzsche pretended to have achieved the transition (the “recovery” from Wagner, from his
“illness”) – this is not the only pose which Nietzsche affected in front of himself and
everyone else.46 Pascal, who certainly hated himself terribly, ranks high above Nietzsche in
this – moreover, he is never as superficial as Nietzsche can sometimes be. While Pascal
was able openly to declare as a fundamental principle, “le moi est haïsable”,47 (Pensées I, 9,
24), Nietzsche even denied this, his own hatred of himself, and – he hated himself so –
slandered it and disparaged it – of course only as a characteristic of Pascal. There is only
one passage where Zarathustra is sincere about this: in the glorious song, which is
absolutely to be understood as an ethical symbol, “Before Sunrise” (in Part III): “O, heaven
above me, pure.... What I want with all my will is to fly, to fly up into you! And whom did I
hate more than drifting clouds and all that stains you? And I hated even my own hatred
because it stained you. I loathe the drifting clouds, those stealthy great cats which prey on
what you and I have in common – the uncaring, unbounded Yes and Amen

[Anonymous No.21651968]

>>21651937
A man who has written Peer Gynt can only be a self-hater. At first, Ibsen himself51
certainly thought of the poem as a tragedy of vanity (in the most general sense, cf.,
Solomon), and only gradually did it become clear to him that all vanity in front of others,
all primary respect for others, has as a condition the giving up of one's own self and one's
own self-worth.
However, the long digression from which I have now returned to Peer Gynt, and to
whose justification in principle my opening observations about the elevated moral inner life
of great men also contributed, was necessary to help us to understand one of the author's
creations which I have not yet mentioned. Although it, in the whole of the much-interpreted
Peer Gynt, has given us the most to puzzle over, none of the interpretations has even
satisfied the interpreters themselves. “The great Boyg”, the most puzzling and at the same
time most original figure in the work52, now becomes as clear as its peculiar nature will
allow it to be. The “great Boyg” plays the most important role in the second and fifth
Acts53; it is well worth observing, that both times it is conquered through Solveig. It is the
power that again and again leaves a person unfaithful to himself, and shows him to be vain.
Indeed, whenever he has mercilessly stirred himself up and chastised himself it still lets
him become aware of the vanity, not displaced, not disabled, but unchanged in the furthest
corners of his inner self, in the same place and with the same assets:
Here and back – it's ever so wide!
Outside and inside – ever so broad!
There he is! There! Around where I'm pointing!
When I get outside, still I'm surrounded! [II: 7]

51 The most un-solemn person there has even been.

[Anonymous No.21651973]

>>21651968
As a child I heard a school teacher tell the class that I found myself in, the following
story about the method by which one kills bears in Russia: a block of wood is suspended
between two tree trunks; in order to pass between them the bear has to shove the beam
aside. Now the beam swings back and hits him ever harder in the head, which so enrages
the bear that he repeats the same thing until a powerful shove smashes his skull. Ibsen
could also have used this story as a parable for what he wanted to express. The “great
Boyg” is the whole force of the empirical ego, with which it raises itself again and again
against the intelligible ego, although it still supposes that it has fully and definitively
vanquished it; and at the same time it is the voice with which it advises the others, after
constantly repeated relapses, to give up the hopeless, senseless struggle. Hence the selfconfident irony with which the Boyg meets Peer Gynt's boisterous assault, tells him to walk
around him, urges him to put up with him, to move on and let him be, instead of wanting to
take the invincible fortress by storm. The Boyg is the redemption-negating principle in
general; in him Ibsen tried to grasp the great negater in himself. One may call him comfort,
or indolence, the tie between the soul and the body (he conquers without striking a blow,
and gradually); in any case he is that which Ibsen wanted to break in himself, as he
established this Peer Gynt, his Peer Gynt. He himself, however, felt that we will not be
finished with him before death.

[Anonymous No.21651979]

>>21651723
Looks like shit

[Anonymous No.21652044]

>>21651979
Which?

[Anonymous No.21652171]

>>21651723
not even close to accurate

[Anonymous No.21652182]

>>21650703
I don't understand this article. What was the reaction of Weininger?

[Anonymous No.21652200]

>>21652171
He wasn't impressed with the way the play was staged, or with Christiania and Norway in general.

"Ibsen is nowhere so little understood as in his homeland, a land where people think of Knut Hamsun, whose *Pan* is perhaps the most beautiful novel ever written, as a common scribbler, far inferior to the talented Garborg; where they always say “Ibsen and Björnson”; and where, in Christiania to be precise, *Peer Gynt* is performed in a field in a circus atmosphere – a performance that with the best of wills can only be called idiotic. In such a land, Ibsen must indeed have suffered frightfully."

[Anonymous No.21652202]

>>21652182
He wasn't impressed with the way the play was staged, or with Christiania and Norway in general.

"Ibsen is nowhere so little understood as in his homeland, a land where people think of Knut Hamsun, whose *Pan* is perhaps the most beautiful novel ever written, as a common scribbler, far inferior to the talented Garborg; where they always say “Ibsen and Björnson”; and where, in Christiania to be precise, *Peer Gynt* is performed in a field in a circus atmosphere – a performance that with the best of wills can only be called idiotic. In such a land, Ibsen must indeed have suffered frightfully."

[Anonymous No.21652221]

>>21652202
"Übrigens ist Ibsen wohl nirgends so wenig verstanden worden, als in seiner Heimat. Dort, wo man K n u t H a m s u n , dessen »Pan« vielleicht der schönste Roman ist, der je geschrieben wurde, für einen gewöhnlichen Skribenten hält und tief unter den talentierten G a r b o r g stellt, wo man stets nur »Ibsen und Björnson« sagt, wo, wie speziell in Christiania, der »Peer Gynt« vor einem Zirkus-Publikum in einer Weise dargestellt wird, die man beim besten Willen nicht anders als trottelhaft nennen kann, dort muß Ibsen allerdings furchtbar unter seiner Umgebung gelitten haben. Übrigens hat er es ja in sei-nem Epilog selbst zu verstehen gegeben, wie wenig er ver- standen worden ist."

[Anonymous No.21652225]

>men are more religious than women
Was he out of his mind??

[Anonymous No.21652234]

>>21652202
"Übrigens ist Ibsen wohl nirgends so wenig verstanden worden, als in seiner Heimat. Dort, wo man K n u t H a m s u n , dessen »Pan« vielleicht der schönste Roman ist, der je geschrieben wurde, für einen gewöhnlichen Skribenten hält und tief unter den talentierten G a r b o r g stellt, wo man stets nur »Ibsen und Björnson« sagt, wo, wie speziell in Christiania, der »Peer Gynt« vor einem Zirkus-Publikum in einer Weise dargestellt wird, die man beim besten Willen nicht anders als trottelhaft nennen kann, dort muß Ibsen allerdings furchtbar unter seiner Umgebung gelitten haben."

[Anonymous No.21652239]

>>21652225
Kierkegaard, a thinker with whom Weininger has a lot in common, said that women can only experience religiousness, or have some sense of what it is, through the man.

[Anonymous No.21652483]

>>21652239
Women seem object orientated with their spirituality they talk about stars and magic rocks.
Men think about ideas "like what is God?"

[Anonymous No.21652489]

>>21650508
kek

[Anonymous No.21652497]

>>21652225
You have to understand what religious means in his vocabulary. In the conventional sense, he is wrong, but in the strictly defined sense, he is correct. A decent but not perfect idea of Weininger's distinction is the Roman distinction between religio and superstitio. The former would be masculine and the latter feminine. Weininger's idea of religio also centers more firmly around self-thought ("egoism") and the spiritualization of the intellect.

[Anonymous No.21652573]

>>21652225
Same as in Conrad's Nostromo: "God is for men, religion for women."

God = True Religion.

I remember reading something Coleridge wrote when in Germany about the atheism of Hamburg's men as VS their women. Seems a common fact of human life—how dreary! The everlasting hopes of men for eternity are upheld, moulded and codified by women. Doesn't give one much hope.

[Anonymous No.21653330]

>>21650508
i dont get it

[Anonymouṡ No.21653440]

>>21650508

I GOT A GAL NAMED DAISY, SHE ALMOST DRIVE ME CRAZY
GOT A GAL NAMED DAISY, SHE ALMOST DRIVE ME CRAZY
SHE KNOWS HOW TO LOVE ME, YES INDEED
BOY YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT SHE DO TO ME
TUTTI FRUTTI, OH ROOTIE
TUTTI FRUTTI, OH ROOTIE, OOH
TUTTI FRUTTI, OH ROOTIE
TUTTI FRUTTI, OH ROOTIE
TUTTI FRUTTI, OH ROOTIE
A WOP BOP A LOO BOP A LOP BAM BOOM

[Anonymous No.21654847]

>>21652225
For Weininger, the founders of the world historical religions have been the greatest most masculine geniuses of all time, with Jesus being the best. Weininger sees their work as the most important and worthwhile, the only real masculine pursuit

[Anonymous No.21654882]

>>21650508
Seeing Weininger namedropped in Zeno’s Conscience had me accidentally drop my monocle into my tea

[Anonymous No.21655233]

>>21654847
he was right

[Anonymous No.21656934]

>>21650528
Fuck off.

[Anonymous No.21658072]

Did Weininger rebirth as Camille Paglia?

[Anonymous No.21659164]

>>21654882
This sounds so funny for some reason. What's a monocle though?

[Anonymous No.21659207]

>>21658072
Kill all women

[Anonymous No.21659221]

>>21659207
Ok man fucker

[Anonymous No.21659466]

>>21658072
Kevin Solway is probably the man most responsible for keeping Weininger's ideas alive today.

[Anonymous No.21659629]

>>21658072
The way I see it Weininger is against Jung and Freud not advancing them or working on their conclusions of establishing value in 'culture'. It's kind of hard to pin point but they seem to be addressing wide audiences, and they take the social sensationalist narratives of history as real. You could maybe accuse Weininger of being just as dramatic but I actually think his similarities to Jung and Freud are the worst parts of his work, and even there he's more restrained. Everything special about Weininger is his connecting epilepsy to criminality, he says all world historical criminals suffered from epilepsy. This is so much more important, personal and real than 'archetypes' or Freud's reduction of the mind. Weininger breaks every thing up into a binary but he doesn't have the arrogance to call it 'order and chaos', he's more aware, more self-cannibalizing, because that's real morality in contrast to a type of self love focused on fixing community. Weininger is trying to find a redemptive reason for everything as it exists not trying to fix it himself, or 'wake people up'. Weininger is the prophet of self hatred but he's not a pessimist, he's just trying to be as honest as possible, and not trying to help people or 'heal culture'. To me he's only addressing one specific type of individual in his work, one specific type of mind, not a 'world community of people'. For Weininger only one soul really exists, and all other souls are formed from vanity. Weininger's binary is walking and stumbling, speaking and stuttering, standing and sleeping, flailing and quickening. Don't you see how much more personal this is? Weininger does a lot of art and literature criticism but everything in his work is focused on little speckled kernels of truth and everything else is absolute blindness that we can't really make judgements on without superhuman levels of work, interest, and authority that is really beyond human ability. To Weininger, the mother is the voice of a type of false self hatred that Peterson advocates 'try harder, do more, be better'- the father is the voice of a type of real self love that Dostoyevsky and Wagner advocates 'stop trying, stop fattening yourself up for your butchers (Sarcotheus, Typhurgus, Aplestus, Philocreus, Miastor), stop appetizing yourself externally, feed on internal death and never die. Obviously this is misrepresenting his work in a bunch of different ways when he's stumbling and addressing a community, but at the kernel of his work it would not be a misrepresentation if everyone in the community was this specific individual that he's really addressing.

[Anonymous No.21659681]

>>21659629
Jung and Freud, Paglia and Peterson believe the naïve and self satisfying theory that we are here to eat food and survive no matter the cost, to 'make things' and establish ultimate value by 'fighting against the chaos of nature'. Weininger knows the truth, you're existence hinges on a bargain with the beings that have their origin in the hidden black flame near the pure moon that represents the white purity that exists beyond. You're not here to eat and survive, you are the food. Weininger asks, what makes Sarcotheus sick when he eats you?

[Anonymous No.21659744]

>>21659681
>Weininger knows the truth, you're existence hinges on a bargain with the beings that have their origin in the hidden black flame near the pure moon that represents the white purity that exists beyond. You're not here to eat and survive, you are the food.
>Weininger asks, what makes Sarcotheus sick when he eats you?
Ironically it is the most incredible "interpretation" of the world I have ever read.

[Anonymous No.21659789]

>>21650508
>“My soul is a hidden orchestra; I know not what instruments, what fiddlestrings and harps, drums and tamboura I sound and clash inside myself. All I hear is the symphony.”

[Anonymous No.21660622]

>>21659789
That has nothing to do with Weininger but that guy does look like him
>Souls, individuals, are not the ultimately real; they, too, are still the expression of vanity, the attachment of worth to the person. Only the Good, which contains all individual elements within it, is of the highest reality.
>I have imagination for myself, not myself for imagination. I have the same with truth. The need for originality
(or some sort of original song)
>is thus weakness

[Anonymous No.21661201]

>>21659681
>>21659744
Based. Pls continue

[Anonymous No.21661358]

>>21659789
21st century Weininger??

[Anonymous No.21661406]

>>21650508
Is that he, indeed, I spy? Otto Weinger the jew who committed suicide because he couldn't logic and mathematize his way out of being an incel?

[Anonymous No.21661814]

>>21661406
No, he didn’t have the OCD mother voice in his head like that. According to his best friend he was being hunted by demonic hounds and shot himself in the heart before they could eat it. He didn’t die an easy death, he was fully conscious, even his last act embodied the selflessness of his work. If hell attained his prized heart…

[Anonymous No.21662208]

>>21652225
Spirituality is a Masculine and Aryan trait in his view. See germany and India. Both spiritually brilliant, particularly germany of the 19th century. The Jewish and feminine traits are earthly and superstitious.

The current zeitgeist has nu-atheism which ignores previous philosophy and ideas and ‘starts fresh’ and loosely and poorly attempts to label non science as superstition.

But traditionally there are philosophical and metaphysical pursuits and they seem dominated by men and very associated in particular with indo-European groups.

Contrary the Talmudic religion is a very earthly and process based one. Christianity and Buddhism and hindu are very spiritual and rational and do not focus on earthly rewards.

You’ll also find that Weineger believes women are the sexually dominated gender and that men are mentally more free from its obsession.

The man’s sexual sensation is limited to the penis and once released it expires for a period where women generally have sexual sensation in multiple places and don’t have a refractory period.

[Anonymous No.21662219]

>>21662208
>Spirituality is a Masculine and Aryan trait
Science is a Masculine and European trait. I am not some steppenigger. Btw both Islam and Judaism are inundated in mysticisme. See sufism and kaballah.

[Anonymous No.21662223]

>>21662208
>The man’s sexual sensation is limited to the penis and once released it expires for a period where women generally have sexual sensation in multiple places and don’t have a refractory period.
Detumescence vs. contrectation drive.

[Anonymous No.21662329]

>>21662219
Weineger didn’t state it was discreet but that there was a continuum and you would find ‘masculine’ females and feminine males (homosexuals and trans and libertines). He also seemed to want to say that ideally society would be Christian and masculine and we should strive for that opposed to what he saw as a Jewish and feminine era (imagine if he could see us now).

[Anonymous No.21662347]

>>21662329
Imagine if he was brought back to life now and given pen and paper and maybe a twitter account for a week. Mein gott

[Anonymous No.21662351]

>>21653440
Got a lot of laughs

[Anonymous No.21662386]

>>21650534
lol even

[Anonymous No.21662391]

>>21650703
bruh

[Anonymous No.21662544]

>>21662347

He’s be banned in seconds in a proverbial book burning and an intelligent perosns ideas would be wasted to oblivion

[Anonymous No.21662549]

>>21653440
Explain the joke. I laiten to Elvis and I don’t get this

[Anonymous No.21663333]

>>21652497
Good post