/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.21638808]

Is antinatalism just the problem of evil brought down to human agency in the absence of God?

[Anonymous No.21638811]

>>21638808
it's just gay

[Anonymous No.21638813]

>>21638808
>picrel
lmao, this fucking psycho

[Anonymous No.21638834]

"Is mommy willing to prevent evil, but not able?
Then she is not omnipotent.
Is she able, but not willing?
Then she is malevolent.
Is she both able and willing?
Then from whence comes evil?"

[Anonymous No.21638894]

Anyone who reads the Last Messiah and still decides to have children is the paramount of all evil. Now watch the cope from breeder filth roll in.

[Anonymous No.21638910]

>>21638808
There is no problem of evil, Hegel already proved that history is theodicy.

[Anonymous No.21638912]

>>21638808
Antinatalism is a group evolutionary strategy to extirpate the weak and botched from the gene pool through self-deselection.

[Anonymous No.21638943]

>>21638912
Kinda like modern monasticism?

[Anonymous No.21638975]

Anti-natalism only targets whites. They do not go to Africa and Asia to spread their creed where it would actually matter.

[Anonymous No.21639072]

Good grief, is Gary still around? Is he any better now? Has he grown up or matured? He was insufferable and obnoxious in like 2012.

[Anonymous No.21639097]

>>21638943
Monks could procreate with nuns or prostitutes, anti-natalists virtually castrate or kill themselves.

[Anonymous No.21640160]

>>21638975
Benatar is literally a teacher in Africa.

[Anonymous No.21640194]

>>21638808
>>21639072
yes he is still doing the same shit a decade later. i drunk called him back in the day after his dox got leaked on a certain site lol, that man does not deserve such trolling tho and i just said hi and hung up

[Anonymous No.21640202]

>>21638834
This kill the religiousfags.

[Anonymous No.21641048]

>>21638808
I'm certainly an anti life pessimist but I coudn't care less if niggers and white trash wants to keep shitting out mongrels into this toilet world.

[Anonymous No.21642325]

>>21638912
>survival of the fittest

It's really just survival of stupidest and more delusional

[Anonymous No.21642482]

>>21638975
>Asia
South Korea's fertility rate is 0.84

[Anonymous No.21642498]

>>21638910
Give me the QRD

[Anonymous No.21642611]

>>21642325
Literal slave morality. They flourish, while you die impotent and cope with "but they're stupid" and claim a moral victory in the face of your evolutionary loss.

[Anonymous No.21642621]

>>21642498
Evil and suffering are neccessary steps in the production of the purposeful outcomes of history to realise the absolute spirit. God breaks eggs to make omelettes.

[Anonymous No.21642634]

>>21642611
Having a child is like taking a shit in a toilet. Not such a grand "evolutionary victory"

[Anonymous No.21642657]

>>21642611
>teleology

pseuds getting their hand on evolutionary theory was a mistake

[Anonymous No.21642728]

>>21642657
That unfortunately happened pretty early on. Most popular depictions of evolution are a joke.

[Anonymous No.21642755]

>>21638808
Is antinatalism the new /lit/-obsession after the meme trilogy?

[Anonymous No.21642769]

>>21638808
To me antinatalism is just the peak of pessimism. I’ve been there and experienced where the thoughts come from. But the moment you start getting back into, you know, actually living and trying. It’s like who cares. Yeah we’re all suffering to some extent but I’m ballin and I like sex. If I knock her up then so be it. Ignoring life and your base desires completely is just even more miserable. I don’t regret raw doggin them hoes on god.

[Anonymous No.21642776]

>>21642769
Based.

[Anonymous No.21642783]

>>21642482
The birthrate is going down everywhere because as a country gets more developed there is less need to shit out 20 children to help out at the farm or with the family trade, at the same time a more developed society means a smaller rate of child deaths which means that you don't need to birth as many kids to keep yours alive.

[Anonymous No.21642813]

>>21638808

https://youtu.be/PGQNhxAshE0?t=54

inmendham classic right here

[Anonymous No.21642814]

>>21642769
I overcame it too but realised I'm still terrified of becoming a slave for life by knocking up some girl. Maybe that was the real concern all along. Now I'm just celibate for selfish reasons.

[Anonymous No.21642818]

>>21638834
>Is God able to create a world where he is able but not willing to prevent evil and still not be malevolent
By assuming morality is above God you affirm the consequent that God cannot be all powerful

[Anonymous No.21642840]

>>21642818
True, the only way the creator of our world can be omnipotent is if everything that happens is according to his will and that is what makes it good. Real believers should accept sin and child rape and shit as God's will and thereby good.

Only the Aghori are consistent.

[Anonymous No.21642848]

>>21642769
>>21642814
You "overcame" it or applied a Zapffian mechanism to take your mind off of it?

[Anonymous No.21642855]

>>21642769
No harm intended but I don't think you ever understood the issue if you say things like 'im ballin and like sex'

[Anonymous No.21642877]

Antinatalism is cope for people who wouldn't ever reproduce in the first place.

[Anonymous No.21642879]

>>21638808
I hope that's not him, I always thought of him as Jewy looking

[Anonymous No.21642896]

>>21641048
This. Not my or my non-existent progeny’s problem.

[Anonymous No.21642901]

>>21642848
I dwelled on it to the point where I got tired of being outraged at the inevitable. I think we just have a limited emotional capacity of being upset at the same thing without it ever changing. It's like wild animal suffering. Terrible, but at some point you can't just cry over it every day and you can't fix it either so you just kind of move on.

I guess that could technically full under the isolation or distraction copes from the Zapffean list? Although Zapffe is more concerned with people trying to get away from their own consciousness rather than other people's suffering I think.

[Anonymous No.21642905]

>>21642896
Yeah but even childless people have genetic interests. Think of the other Whites.

[Anonymous No.21642936]

>>21642901
He outlines fairly early on in TLM that the awareness of our terrible fates is what really puts the sting in consciousness,

[Anonymous No.21642941]

>>21642936
>live awesome life
>kill yourself painlessly at 80
what is stopping you from doing this

[Anonymous No.21642947]

>>21642905
What about them? We seem to collectively want to commit genetic suicide. Who am I to question the zeitgeist and why would I even want to try?

[Anonymous No.21642948]

>>21642941
I mean, nothing keeping you from having the will to live till 80, plenty keeping you from actually doing it. One of which is possible diminishment of that will.

[Anonymous No.21642951]

>>21642877

i am more of a child-free person than antinatalist even though i agree with a lot of antinatalists say

i think being childless makes life easier. you don't have a bunch of mouths to feed, clothe and shelter when you don't have kids. you can become rich easier

[Anonymous No.21642954]

>>21642941
Fate. The notion that you’ll live a healthy awesome life until the age of 80 is not actually within your control.

[Anonymous No.21642956]

>>21642634
>>21642657
Again pure slave morality, your impotent defeat in life is turned into a moral "victory". Wimper off into the abyss.

[Anonymous No.21642957]

>>21642951

child-free person than an anti-natalist even though i agree with a lot of what antinatalists say*

[Anonymous No.21642992]

>>21638808
wow other people watch draftscience??

honestly I think he's definitely a genius IQ wise, but he's obviously got some kind of serious mental health issue.

he's very interesting to listen to though, and I wish he had been able to have a better life.

[Anonymous No.21642997]

>>21642954
>>21642948
Sure it is, just have the Nembutal ready to go just in case

[Anonymous No.21643009]

>>21642848
Never read him.
>>21642855
part of it is being lighthearted and joking about it all. There’s not much we can do but I know I felt a lot worse trying to deny my will than just accepting and submersing myself in it. I wasn’t reducing the suffering in the world because in the end I was just increasing my own by a large amount.

[Anonymous No.21643017]

>>21642877
There isn't such a high bar in order to reproduce in the first place.
Although there should be a criteria

[Anonymous No.21643036]

>>21642997
It’s not the suicide part that the issue my dude.

[Anonymous No.21643038]

>>21642936
Seems right. The paradox of actively being an antinatalist is that it likely increases the suffering in the world though. Personally choosing to be childfree is one thing that you can just kinda set and forget, but beyond that your active adherence to and association with the ideology habitually places suffering at the forefront of your consciousness while it's extremely unlikely that you deter even a single person from breeding who has his mind set on it. From a utilitarian perspective it is better to simply not dwell on bad things that you have no possibility of fixing.

[Anonymous No.21643186]

>>21643036
Nothing's guaranteed, but most people get old. A long good life is pretty likely if you act right.

[Anonymous No.21643275]

>>21643186
Ask me how I know you’re under 40.

[Anonymous No.21643288]

>>21638808
based love draft science

[Anonymous No.21643290]

>>21643275
He's on 4chan.

[Anonymous No.21643380]

>>21638808
I think this is the first time someone made sense of antinatalism for me. It's just further moral degradation in the void left by Providence.
Thank you for this realization.

[Anonymous No.21643391]

>>21643380
You're welcome.

I don't think the attempts at theodicy are looking very good for the secularists though desu.

[Anonymous No.21643447]

>>21638834
"Is mommy willing to provide tendies, but not able?
Then she is not omnipotent.
Is she able, but not willing?
Then she is malevolent.
Is she both able and willing?
Then from whence comes evil?"
ftfy

[Anonymous No.21643457]

>>21640160
Let's be real, The only people who will listen to his message are whites, he's just hastening the complete negrification of that country

[Anonymous No.21643564]

>>21638811
This
/thread

[Anonymous No.21644622]

I can't think of anything more putrid, vile and disgusting than breeding.
Am I weird because of that?

[Anonymous No.21644630]

>>21642611
The only winning move is not to play.

[Anonymous No.21644710]

>>21642813
Based schizo

[Anonymous No.21644740]

>>21638808
> give humans agency
> they commit mass suicide

idk what to say, its concerning

[Anonymous No.21645450]

>>21644622
Nope, if you are not animal-minded than breeding is repugnant. Parenting is monstrous since parents basically bully their children into worshipping them and narcissistic because they spread their shitting little genes, and unresolved trauma and pathologies.

It's demonic

[Anonymous No.21645470]

>>21638808
Antinatalism is an attention seeking neurosis. Noone with nihilistic views would actually go out of their way to prove that living is bad and don't actually kill themselves. It's just not how people work. Antinatalism is hypocritical. You can't express your desire to stop all suffering when your first motivation is yo syop your own suffering and die.

[Anonymous No.21646357]

>>21645450
Parenting within the boundaries of Providence is literally the only way you can truly take responsibility for your actions. Since atheistic thought cannot resolve itself to Providence, parenting is left devoid of its moral aspect as literal reification of your moral makeup.

[Anonymous No.21646576]

>>21638894
I felt bad that you didn't get all of those (yous) you were expecting, so here's a consolation (you) so you don't go home empty handed.

[Anonymous No.21646823]

antinatalism is when people don’t have any love in them.

Ill breed infinite multiverses of my people and no one can stop me.
The only god is my love.

[Anonymous No.21647884]

21646823
meds take'em all

[Anonymous No.21647991]

>>21644740
Makes me wonder.

It seems all one needs to end up either a suicide or an antinatalist is the capacity for conscious rumination. That would point to conscious reflection being dysgenic. Sometimes I think about this in terms of contraception. After all, what does contraception entail but at least some foresight. By that logic, less caution = greater reproductive success. Maybe that's Fermi's answer right there. Maybe intelligence has its own in-built self destruct mechanism. Maybe AI will "top out" as well.

Metzinger has a paper on AI crunching the numbers and ending up anti-life, but for purely utilitarian reasons.