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/lit/ - Literature

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21610435 No.21610435 [Reply] [Original]

Why is this book mandatory reading for american high schoolers? I believe most people who say this is a bad book are americans who read this at a young age. It doesn't make sense for a teenager to read this book, you're just not going to get it.

>> No.21610461

>>21610435
I read it in highschool and loved it.

>> No.21610476

>>21610461
Damn nigga let me suck ya dicc

>> No.21610479

>>21610435
It's objectively a great books no matter what age you read it.

>> No.21610485

>>21610435
It’s great because as a youngin you either identify with Holden or hate him because you see yourself or younger self reflected in his juvenile attitude

>> No.21610488

>>21610435
Because it was written by a Jew and you're supposed to hail it as a masterpiece or else you're an antisemite who wants to open the wooden doors to Auschwitz again and take the Jews on a Holocoaster

>> No.21610493

>>21610488
Jews are cool. Fuck off

>> No.21610557

>>21610485
I read the book when I was 30 and I still identified with Holden. It's clear Salinger used him as a vehicle to vent some of his own frustrations too.

>> No.21610568

>>21610493
Fuck off, kike

>> No.21610666

>>21610485
What juvenile attitude?

>> No.21610681

>>21610485
>>21610666
I didn't relate at all or hate him. I just saw him as a lost kid.

>> No.21610705

>>21610435
I think its just generally misinterpreted in academia anon. For some reason its hailed as the great American Bildungsroman when really its a social commentary. Pretty standard in America though, where 1984 is accepted as a right wing libertarian novel for reasons unexplained.

>> No.21610768

>>21610681
But why

>> No.21610818

>>21610705
It's probably easier to think of the book as a silly juvenile rant (and to validate that view, which is academia's role) instead of valid social commentary. Ironically giving some kids this book so early at least helps them understand they're not alone.

>> No.21610824

Challenge for those who describe Holden as juvenile ITT: find ONE supporting example from the book. I know it's going to be difficult when you can't just mumble something about how he's "whiny," and I don't expect anyone will succeed.

>> No.21610858

Because boomers identified with it and they write the curriculum.

>> No.21610860

>>21610858
Nobody writes the curriculum

>> No.21610876

>>21610860
Books which are approved for use in high schools are curated at the state level in my state. Teachers can select from pre-determined groupings of books. This is assigned because boomers said it would be.

>> No.21610882

>>21610435
goddam

>> No.21610899

>>21610876
>he thinks the curriculum is decided

>> No.21610902

Frhv

>> No.21610923

>>21610899
I assume you are trying to advance a joke of some sort, but I'll respond in earnest. It's handled at the state-level in my state. There are certain boxes which simply have to be checked in most subject areas.

>> No.21612228

>>21610435
I read it in highschool and loved it.

>> No.21612291

>>21610485
i didn't see myself at all in him
i thought he was an annoying little bitch

>> No.21612299

>>21610435
Every person I've met who dislikes this book is a massive pleb. They either complain because Holden is too whiny and immature, or on 4chan they complain that Salinger was Jewish. Placing too much importance on an author's identity when judging a book is a strong indicator of bad taste. You're no better than the woke women who dismiss white male authors.

>> No.21612320

>>21610435
I read it when I was 17 and remembered really loving it where it was my favourite book. His view on ppl and society I remember made a lot of sense to me (buti don't recall what they were lol)

I'm 33 now. Will it resonate the same?

>> No.21612534

>>21610435
How many people actually read the books they're assigned?

>> No.21612547

>Why is (((this book))) taught in (((public schools?)))

>> No.21613509

>>21610479
/thread

>> No.21613556

He rapes his friend, The Kid.

>> No.21613660

>>21610824
Challenge for you: YOU HAVE TO GO BACK

>> No.21613667

>>21613660
Still no takers

>> No.21613687

>>21610485
Is being depressed or lonely supposed to be common? The book was boring as hell but wasn't that bad.

>> No.21614032

>>21610435
i think some people never actually are put in a position where they are forced to individuate and have original thoughts. only teenagers who are forced into this experience early on will appreciate the book in high school.

>> No.21614071

You're a real prince, Anon kid. Kidding aside, it was a very enjoyable read, but I don't understand the hype.

>> No.21614669

>>21610435
You read it as a teen, and empathise with Holden. You read it as an adult, and sympathise with Holden. The wonder of Salinger as a writer is his ability to capture the spirit of the postwar varsity teen in such a charming & endearingly mocking way that you end up on Holden’s side when you are going through what he’s going through and still on his side when you are old enough to see that his pain and the melodrama is something he will overcome.

Adolescents who read this now have had their minds so poisoned by the political imposition of the society of social media, that they want to pathologically diagnose Holden, instead of simply identify him with the archetype he actually represents, which is the American teenager.

>> No.21614800

>>21614669
Is this a bot post? You don't overcome Holden's view on life without shortening your lifespan by 30 years and becoming a bitch to alcohol, if you're lucky.

>> No.21614903
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21614903

>>21614071
Same. I was expecting something else, it was a really fun read with a nice style, but i don't see how this one got away with stuff like being in top 100 Novels list around.

>> No.21614961

>>21614800
>Is this a bot post?
no

>> No.21614969

>>21610435
It's a great novel that shows how the teen spirit never dies, I thought adults were mature as a kid, but then you realize they are just like us

>> No.21614987

>>21614800
Yes, you literally do, if you actually go ahead and grow up.

>> No.21615002

>>21610435
I read it on my own and loved it

>> No.21615023

>>21610435
Alot of times is Young Americans first experience with a narrator/protag who isn't a chosen one or bland self insert

>> No.21615047

>>21614987
>in a psych ward by 17
>flunked out of three schools already, not even a college dropout
>hates phony bullshit so much suicide would be on the table if it weren't for phoebe
>hates movies, social dances, trite bullshit, tries getting real with people and gets spit on the face for it constantly
>probably molested in the past, shut off the memory
>so sensitive even senseless "fuck you" graffiti becomes a vehicle for his depression
>right before niggers and their violent ways take over NYC
Holden's a lost cause.
I know this is a troll post but there's no fixing people like him. They're too good and we fail them.

>> No.21615062

>>21615047
Holden isn’t a lost cause, that’s just what you choose to have the book reflect back at you. I repeat: grow up

>> No.21615090

>>21615062
Holden doesn't even remind me of myself. I'm too stupid. He reminds me of my sister and she's a total wreck.
I don't think chronic depression is something you can grow out of. I know admitting you're at fault here is too hard for people like you though.

>> No.21615092

>>21615047
It's sounds basic but Holden really just needs to grow up. He's immature at the end of the day

>> No.21615104

>>21615092
People like Holden can't grow up is my point. What are they gonna do? Pretend nothing's wrong? They get a job and then into drugs and die by 40.

>> No.21615113

>>21615090
Pathological diagnoses is half the problem with people now. They think that their brain is in a specific state, and that it’s bad, and that they can’t change it. You can. It takes endless hard work and different things work for different people but it’s possible.

>> No.21615120

>>21615092
>>21615062
>he needs to grow up
>hes immature
Just a crumb of example from the text please

>> No.21615134

>>21615120
I haven’t said he’s immature once. He’s perfectly mature for his age lmao. It doesn’t mean he isn’t experiencing extreme adolescent angst, anxiety and melodrama. Which is, as I say, normal for his age. But also something completely possible & normal to grow out of once you become an adult.

You’ve spent so much time in perma-adolescence on the internet that you automatically think to “grow up” is some kind of dunk on maturity. It isn’t, it’s a normal part of human experience.

>> No.21615137

>>21610824
How about the scene in the hotel where he pretends he got shot and nurses the wound with his hands as if he’s preventing himself from bleeding out. It’s been a bit of time since I’ve read the book, but the weird overly imaginative nature of this scene always struck me as odd and overwhelmingly juvenile

>> No.21615140

>>21615120
Read any dialogue between him and other characters. He's like a little boy compared to his peers

>> No.21615142

>>21615134
I would also expect Hamlet or Romeo to grow up. It’s the same archetype, you just get bogged down in the ironic detail of realism.

>> No.21615147

>>21615134
So what does becoming an adult entail for you?

>> No.21615151

>>21615137
He says it himself a bit after, "I swear those movies ruin you".
However, it's really less of a commentary on juvenile imagination and more on the looming rise of postmodern simulacra.

>> No.21615162 [DELETED] 

People who dismiss Holden as annoying just seem low iq or sheltered to me. Theyve never really been through some shit especially while young. They adopt a philosophy whole cloth and tell you to read meditations or watch Andrew Tate. They think their prescriptions work for every human and when it inevitably runs into some exception they get pissed and blame the person
I don't think I can grow up. There's just something wrong with me

>> No.21615171

>have never read this book
>constantly compared to Holden
>almost 30 and I heard the you're Holden thing again
I just don't get it. Is that an insult

>> No.21615172

>>21615162
There's no adapting good people to a fundamentally rotting society

>> No.21615174
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21615174

>>21615120
>>21615140
>>21615140
>>21615147
>>21615151
>Meets with Carl Luce
>Just tries to get him to talk about sex
Wow Holden is so deep and such a sigma male.
That's totally normal for an adult to act this way. You guys are either trolling or autists yourself who don't realize how stunted Holden's social skills are

>> No.21615182

>>21615174
I don't think anyone's pretending Holden isn't a teenager. But the shit he perceives and talks about is real whether you're 16 or 40.

>> No.21615191

>>21615182
If you are walking around at 40 obsessed with the idea of other people being phonies, you are seriously stunted, and that’s on you, not Holden.

>> No.21615195

>>21615137
>has a sense of humour
>NOOOOOO HES ACTING LIKE A CHILD
He was drunk too. Big screaming deal.
>>21615140
Have you any examples? Because part of the point of the book is he actually ages up very easily in conversation, say, with the nuns. And what "peers?" the asinine Carl Luce? Stradlater? Ackley?
>>21615174
I see literally nothing wrong with the conversation he has with Luce, who is being a childish asshole himself for no reason.

And still not a single quote from Catcher is provided to make the case that Holden is immature or childish.

>> No.21615203

>>21615195
He acts exactly his age. Which is in its essence, immature, because humans don’t reach full maturity until their early 20s.

>> No.21615213

>>21615203
He does not act his age and Salinger expresses that on pretty much the first page when he says
>Sometimes I act a lot older than I am—I really do—but people never notice it. >People never notice anything.
In some situations I will grant you he does act his age, but it's a lot more complicated than that because he's actively understanding most people around him on a very deep level. His observations are not "typical 16 year old adolescent" and, again, NO example from Catcher has been used. People just keep spamming the exact same line.

>> No.21615215

>>21615191
>obsessed
Way to miss the point. Holden was obsessed since he was just processing the idea in his teen brain, but noticing our society seems to be wired towards phoniness is forever.
Imagine what he'd think about those ad campaigns about equality or social media, lol

>> No.21615224

>>21615191
Whether you're obsessed or not, it's often true. Holden feels like he can't connect with people, even people he has affection for, because he's able to see through their actions and come to the conclusion that they're misreading the way the world really is. Say, when he goes to visit Spencer and he reiterates the headmaster's line that "life is a game." Holden says something like
>I know it, boy I know it
but inwardly he thinks it's complete bullshit, and he isn't wrong.

>> No.21615226

>>21615213
Oh my goodness, my brother in Christ, Salinger’s writing is sympathetic and lightly mocking/endeared here to the typical teenage predicament of feeling like you are and act a lot older than your peers, despite the fact that any adult around you perceives you as the level of maturity your age actually reflects. It’s such a common trait of the outcast adolescent.

>> No.21615234

>>21615195
This. Talking bring up sex in conversation is a sign of maturity. Most people don't talk about sex publicly because they are too immature

>> No.21615237

>>21615234
Bait

>> No.21615238

Also has anyone here read Franny and Zooey? Franny articulates a lot of what Holden experiences from a slightly different perspective. Her breakdown might seem "immature" as well because obviously the reason we exist is to "succeed," right, so when she's "whining" about her professors being self-absorbed morons and noone in her entire sphere of academia seemingly grasping or teaching that knowledge should point towards wisdom and validating some spiritual yearning or just something other than one-upping people in discussions and "knowing things," you see the same kind of breakdown Holden experiences.

>> No.21615241 [DELETED] 

some people arbitrarily decide to hate everything they use to be once they pass age of majority and others keep consistency
its like how after 21 people pretend drinking alcohol all the time is normal
people talk to me like im making some huge sacrifice and huge decision by maintaing sobriety
i didnt drink when i was 6 or 14 or wahtever. i didnt come out of the womb drunk. why did YOU start? you're the one who change and is doing something out of the ordinary not me

I don't get how people find holden so intolerable,. he doesnt even act his age. most guys his age are totally retarded. people forget that in the context of the story he is 100% correct about basically everyone he judges and observes. that is no longer immaturity. its immaturity when you're both wrong and act on these things. he just observes and is correct

>> No.21615245

>>21615226
And yet the adults in the book do not "know better" than he does, and Salingers sympathies clearly lie with Holden. I'm sorry the most reddit tier surface level take on the character is all you can understand but you are wrong.

>> No.21615250

>>21615238
Great addition. Franny and Zooey is actually a lot better in expressing this sentiment, because we have actual mature characters helping Franny towards her epiphany in which she realises that all humans are inherently of value and deserve love, whether they will be janitors or great visionaries.

>> No.21615254

>>21615195
>I see literally nothing wrong with the conversation he has with Luce
Lmao you're absolutely a social outcast then. These are the people who's opinion you're reading /lit/

>> No.21615258

>>21615245
Motherfucker, yes Salinger sympathises, but in his understanding he also can see that it’s more of a symptom of his adolescence that Holden’s reactions to it are so strong that it is anything else.

>> No.21615263

>>21615258
*than it is anything else

>> No.21615264

>>21615250
I also like when Zooey real-talks her for this comparison because he's like
>look sis, I've seen people having real mental breakdowns and they didn't pick and choose their location to do it
or something like that, which echoes Holden who just wanders around musing on his brothers death and James Castles suicide and the like while failing to take care of himself.

These are good books guys. They aren't as simple as "le whiny protagonist is a teen and it's overrated because I read it in high school and must be contrarian."

>> No.21615266

>>21615254
I get along pretty well socially. Would you like to actually articulate an opinion or quote something from the book? I reread Catcher recently and would be very happy to discuss it.
>>21615258
I just don't agree with you at all. You can keep emphasizing the same point all you like. Anytime you want to bring an example from the book I'd be happy to discuss it.

>> No.21615268
File: 44 KB, 828x363, 1tdj4iab7mf61.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
21615268

>yes it is the girls fault I cannot breed

>> No.21615272

>>21615258
>are so strong
If this all doesn't get you down even as an adult then you regressed developmentally from your teen years because you were so afraid of dealing with a truth for which your only cope mechanisms are either feigning ignorance or killing your soul and joining the madness, and both should result in personal disgust.

>> No.21615274

>>21615266
Seriously, read Franny & Zooey like >>21615238 says. There you will truly see Salinger, at the end of his life, come to the conclusion of the contradiction he had been working through his entire life. It’s a Christlike conclusion, full of compassion, understanding and love, and truly highlights exactly why Holden is ultimately immature as he wanders around bringing up bile as a response to any and all external stimuli he finds disagreeable. I love & sympathise with Holden, I care about him as a character & want him desperately to come to maturity. The satisfaction with Franny and Zooey is that Franny actually does.

>> No.21615278

>>21615266
>Carl Luce sits down
>Holden asks how's his sex life immediately
>Carl Luce recoils and tell him he doesn't want to talk about it.
>Holden keeps at it until he leaves
>Anon sees this a perfectly normal in adult life and not signs of immaturity
Opinions discarded

>> No.21615284

>>21615274
I am Franny and Zooey anon lol. I don't think Holden is immature except in a few specific instances regarding which he's simply accurately depicted as his age. I think Holden has intense compassion for almost everyone he meets and that, again, is not an immature quality.

>> No.21615291

>>21615272
I can sit and seethe at plenty of things about the way the modern world works, I have done this obsessively at times. But honestly, I would rather fill my time up with love, compassion and gaining wisdom through art than allowing myself to become transfixed by hate for fellow humans who I can see are doing their best with the lot they have, and even if not, who I believe still have an innate capacity for goodness & I have faith that any person has the ability to turn to Eternal Life from Eternal Death.

>> No.21615293

>>21615278
I see this conversation differently. Holden asks him about it in mild jest because Luce was well-known for giving "sex talks" when they were students together. Luce gets petulant almost immediately and is basically unresponsive. If he had just laughed it off and opened up to a conversation he could have. Holden describes Luce pretty thoroughly before, during, and after their meeting and he comes across as a huge asshole.

>> No.21615296

>>21615291
Who does Holden "hate" in the book? For fucks sake it ends with him saying that he misses everyone he described.

>> No.21615297

>>21615278
You're a retard for thinking anonymous people on a basket weaving forum understand social skills

>> No.21615301

>>21615284
But I would also say compassion is not a quality specifically uncommon to or excluded from the adolescent. It’s just that the adolescent is only able to perceive things through his own solipsistic view of the world, meaning that in Holden’s case, outward compassion, except for his sister, which is different, doesn’t ultimately translate to true inward compassion. Often when he outwardly shows compassion, he inwardly passes judgment, which is the immature half of it

>> No.21615305

>>21615291
You can have compassion and love for your fellow man. Holden does. That's exactly why he's so depressed about everything, because *this* is an incredibly rare quality and one that often gets others to stone you instead.
Holden hurts no one but himself. That's his "problem", and why ultimately he finds salvation through family. The only immature quality to his character is in the titular vision, and even that's more of a desperate wish to save others.

>> No.21615306

>>21615296
Hate, distaste, despair. It’s all on the same continuum. He thinks he sees something they all can’t. If he truly did, this is a Christlike quality, and does not require judgment from him in response, but relentless understanding.

>> No.21615308

>>21615293
Imagine sitting down with someone you haven't seen in years and immediately asking about their sex life. Like within a couple sentences. You see nothing wrong with this because you have no interpersonal skills

>> No.21615312

>>21615297
>>21615278
Bla bla bla here's your social skills
>Luce liked to control conversations among his younger peers when they dormed together
>he gave sex talks to them because that was his interest or because it held their attention
>he didn't like when other people threatened to overtake him in attention
>having since graduated he sits down wurh Holden who immediately confronts him with a joke about who he was/is
>whether he has changed or wants to protect a more mature image of himself he reacts with ceaseless petulance and refuses to give the conversation any attention
If you faggots dislike Holden and like Carl Luce it tells me a lot about the type of people who disparage this book

>> No.21615316

>>21615306
Examples motherfucker do you have them?

>> No.21615318

>>21615305

>>21615301
>>21615306

>> No.21615325

>>21615301
No, he inwardly shows compassion for the judgements he makes about people which are often things like simple observations about how they look or their intelligence. He feels bad for a funny looking girl because her date is incredibly boring and he recognizes she probably doesn't have much choice in the matter. He feels bad for the girls he dances with in the hotel lounge because they're so excited to have maybe been in the same room with a celebrity and they're excited to get up early to see some stupid movie, moviestars being the reason they're in New York or whatever.

>> No.21615326

>>21615316
Calling anyone and everyone a “phony” and being so disdainful of modern culture implies that he sees something bad and foreboding in it that all these old phonies can’t. Christ could see things like this, but did not judge.

Holden isn't wrong to feel this way, but it isn’t wholly compassionate to pass judgement on someone else’s authenticity (or, essentially, their value) because they are preoccupied with things you personally perceive to be of lower value.

>> No.21615329

>>21615326
Yes, and he can. He's a very intelligent character who thinks very deeply.

>> No.21615336

>>21615329
Doesn’t make him the arbiter of authenticity by any means. His inflated sense of his own wisdom reeks of immaturity.

>> No.21615339

>>21615326
>>21615329
Also bro you don't need to BE christ to agree with Christ, and Christ considered everything to be phony too. He says so fucking repeatedly and the judgements he passes on people are very sharp and he does so repeatedly.
>It's only okay when christ does it
Christ would have shared a number of Holdens sentiments. Holden, however, can't perform miracles.

>> No.21615347

>>21615336
Anon I'm still waiting for a single fucking example from you from the book to be put under discussion. Find a passage and let's talk.

>> No.21615358

>>21615195
Imagine thinking Luce not Holden was being the asshole here lol
>>21615238
Love Franny, having been around people who think academia is everything I understand her sentiments

>> No.21615360

>>21615339
>Judge not, that you be not judged. Matthew 7:1

Holden is a false prophet.

>> No.21615368

>>21615301
>>21615306
Please keep in mind even Christ lashed out in understanding and love, and he was just as troubled in many ways. There's more to injustice in the world than individual faces and individual judgement. That's part of the reason why The Catcher takes place in New York, I think--the bullshit everyone seems occupied with to such an extent they forget their humanity takes an omnipresent form throughout the conversation, like it was a monster in the shape of the city and the lifestyle itself.
>>21615326
He's just really fucking lonely. This outburst is also a teenage part of his character, but one you can't help but sympathize with.

>> No.21615372

>>21615360
>Holden is a false prophet
Well... I haven't heard this one before. I am still, and permanently it seems, waiting for someone to bring some of what he says or thinks out of the book to discuss. Lucefag did it but I cant even understand how you misread a book/character this badly
>>21615358

>> No.21615379

>>21615372
I’m not clear on what you think I have misread or don’t understand.

>> No.21615384

>>21615379
That's probably because you're a moron.

>> No.21615389

>>21615384
Oh no, you think I’m a phony :(

>> No.21615392

>>21615312
>Bla bla bla
You need to be 18 to post here kiddo

>> No.21615396

>>21615368
I’ve said so many times I sympathise with Holden. I just don’t see him as “mature”. He matures in some ways during the novel, but nothing unrealistic for an adolescent of his age and outcast disposition.

>> No.21615404

>>21615358
Franny is great Zooey is eh

>> No.21615409

>>21615312
yea seriously
>hit bro up to hang out
>he actually comes
>open with a joke about the good old days
>gets pissed off, pretends he's above it, leaves
this book's full of "literally me" moments tho fuck

>> No.21615419

>>21615409
>I got a flit for you I've been saving him :D
>Typical Caulfield (he says this like 6 times) so immature
Then a bunch of tards on lit misread this as Holden being the asshole when Luce is a patronizing dickhead from the start and entirely lives up to how Holden describes him
>>21615389
You're definitely illiterate. And didn't you start the name calling immediately?

>> No.21615421

I'm still waiting on some actual quote's from the book simpletons

>> No.21615428

>>21615404
What's wrong with Zooey? :(

>> No.21615430

>>21615419
I don’t recall calling anybody names, unless you refer to me calling precious Holden a false prophet.

>> No.21615444

>>21615430
Sorry, I thought you were this Luce poster
>>21615254
Or one of the other posters who said I have no social skills or understanding. It was 3 or 4 posts. If none of them were you I apologize, but I still think you misread the book pretty decidedly.

>> No.21615459

>>21615444
Honestly, I enjoy the discussion but I don’t think it’s a case of me misreading a book. It’s a case of two people taking different readings of a book, which is a good thing. It’s been fun anon, I am now going to play with my puppy before I put him to bed.

>> No.21615471

>>21615396
Maybe mature for his age, but that's the audience for the novel anyways (including Salinger himself). But leaving the validity of his mental age aside, the things he feels are pretty true regardless. It's up to every man to find a way to actually face these (and many, including those who brand the book as juvenile, just run away), but the lamentation through teenage eyes is greatly appreciated anyways. Good book.

>> No.21615472

>>21615459
Well don't immediately call people social outcasts for having a different perspective than you and then act like you're so mature you have to retire from the discussion and do something more important.
>no wonder you like Luce

>> No.21615478

>>21615472
Please, I am not the person who spoke about “Luce”. I could never devolve into the act of being a “Luce poster” or whatever you describe. That’s fandom behaviour.

Now that you know this, I can leave and hang out with my puppy in peace.

>> No.21615479

>>21615459
not that anon but this is a desperate attempt to save face 'im taking my ball and going home'

>> No.21615483

>>21615478
NTA but have fun with your puppy man :)

>> No.21615485
File: 42 KB, 471x359, 1652062339849.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
21615485

>>21615421
Theyre not coming.

>> No.21615491

>>21615478
Then why reply to comment chain about Luce asking how you misread the book. If it wasnt you then i didnt say anything to you.

>> No.21616035

>>21615195
>I see literally nothing wrong with the conversation he has with Luce, who is being a childish asshole himself for no reason.
lol

>> No.21616095

>>21615047
>tries getting real with people
He's always playing or being a kid, he doesn't know how to act

Anyways, kid got a rough hand but he probably gets over it

>> No.21616106

>>21615213
How can you misread this so badly lol? Are you under like, 25?
Salinger doesn't express that, Holden says it. It's a sympathetic (and even cute and funny) line. Every teen, specially "outcasts" thinks this.

>> No.21616115

>>21616106
It's a recurring theme in the book. Sometimes he acts/thinks a lot older than he is.

>> No.21616154

>>21616115
I remember him acting pretty much his age throughout

>> No.21616159

>>21616154
You've never met a 16 year old.

>> No.21616217

>>21616159
I have and I also remember being one, lel. He's angsty and alienated (understandable given the circumstances) so he ruminates and engages in self destructive behaviour

>> No.21616226

>>21616217
Yes but I wouldnt say his observations about other people or life in general are immature or at all typical of a 16 year old.

>> No.21616322

>>21610435
He rapes his sister, Phoebe.

>> No.21616367

>>21616226
He's not dull, but calling everyone a phony is pretty typical of a teen.

>> No.21616437
File: 320 KB, 640x444, 1504455665266.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
21616437

Did "Cather in the Rye" start the young adult trope of the main character being a whiney little bitch?

>> No.21616500

>>21616437
No, that was always a thing.

>> No.21616514

>>21615023
this is a good point

>> No.21616859

>>21615444
>none of them were you I apologize
>>21615459
>a case of two people taking different readings of a book, which is a good thing. It’s been fun anon,
>>21615472
>Well don't immediately call people social outcasts for having a different perspective than you and then act like you're so mature you have to retire from the discussion and do something more important
Who talks like this? What the fuck is wrong with these people. You guys sound like bots trying to mimic fedora memes. Kill yourself children

>> No.21616862

>>21615195
Incel troglodyte hands typed this

>> No.21617476

>>21616859
you kill yourself

>> No.21617521

>>21610435
>It doesn't make sense for a teenager to read a book for teenagers

>> No.21617800

>>21610435
I havent read it since I was a teen so I can't really remember what he was like besides me identifying with him at the time. I do remember ppl saying he was immature (wasn't he like 16 in the book?) and needed to grow up

In what way did he need to grow up?

>> No.21618083
File: 501 KB, 1439x745, tempFileForShare_20230128-102048.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
21618083

why read

>> No.21619492

Americans haven't written any good books so they're forced to push shit like Catcher in the Rye and Great Gasby as great American classics. The Jewish mafia pushing him also helps.

>> No.21619499

>>21619492
2/3 of the meme trilogy were written by Americans.

>> No.21619602

>>21619492
19th and 20th century American lit mogs almost all other literature ever written, save for like, James Joyce and a long list of English poets and playwrights.

>> No.21619989

>>21619602
Anglos live in their bubble missing millennia of literature that every other tribe had access to in purer form due to the greek>latin progression and still in their ignorance dare to say their literature is the best, doubly so when most of the books they claim as greats are literally retreads of these old tales. Lol. lmao even

>> No.21620020

>>21618083
Because its fun to do?