/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.21565072]

>Reading should be done without subvocalizing
>The reader should somehow be able to remember what they read

[Anonymous No.21565088]

>the reader should somehow remember all the characters names even the most minor and not blur them all together and get frustrated

[Anonymous No.21565095]

>>21565072
>>21565088
yes, problem?

[Sage No.21565184]

>the reader should pick up on the avant garde elements after first read through or many books

[Anonymous No.21565208]

>Just how little German style concerns itself with sound and with the ear is demonstrated in the fact that even our good musicians write badly. The German does not read aloud, not for the ear, but merely with his eyes. In the process he has put his ears away in a drawer. In antiquity a man read, when he read - and that happened rarely enough - to himself aloud and in a loud voice. People were amazed if someone read quietly, and they secretly asked themselves why. With a loud voice - that is to say, with all the swellings, inflections, changes in tone, and shifts in tempo which the ancient public world enjoyed. At that time the principles of writing style were the same as those for the speaking style, and these principles depended in part on the astonishing development and the sophisticated needs of the ear and larynx and in part on the strength, endurance, and power of the ancient lungs. A syntactic period is, as the ancients understood it, above all a physiological totality, insofar as it is held together by a single breath. Such periods, as they manifest themselves in Demosthenes and Cicero, swelling up twice and sinking down twice, all within the single breath - that's what ancient men enjoyed.10 From their own schooling they knew how to value the virtue in such periods - how rare and difficult it was to deliver them. We really have no right to the great syntactical period, we moderns, we short-winded people in every sense! These ancient people were, in fact, themselves collectively dilettantes in public speaking - and as a result connoisseurs and thus critics. Hence, they drove their speakers to the utmost limits. In a similar way in the last century, once all Italian men and women understood how to sing, among them virtuoso singing (and with that the art of melody as well) reached its high point. But in Germany (right up until very recent times, when a sort of platform eloquence started flapping its young wings timidly and crudely enough) there was really only one form of public speaking which came close to being artistic: what came from the pulpit. In Germany only the preacher understood what a syllable or what a word weighs, how a sentence strikes, leaps, falls, runs, and ends; only he had a conscience in his ears, often enough a bad conscience. For there is no shortage of reasons why it's precisely the German who rarely, and almost always too late, achieves a proficiency in speaking. It is appropriate therefore that the masterwork of German prose is the masterwork of its greatest preacher: up to this point, the Bible has been the best German book. In comparison with Luther's Bible, almost everything else is mere "literature" - something that did not grow in Germany and hence also did not grow and does not grow into German hearts, as the Bible has.

[Anonymous No.21565210]

>he read the story
>didn't have brothers karamazov told orally in a group of people

[Anonymous No.21565256]

>>21565072
>unable to synthesize abstract thought without inserting the medium of sound
brainlet

[Anonymous No.21565274]

>>21565072
>He require simulated auditory autoprocessing

[Anonymous No.21565356]

>>21565256
>>21565274
Oh yeah? Wel...YOU'RE MEAN

[Anonymous No.21565392]

>>21565356

[Anonymous No.21565464]

>>21565072
I immediately forget every paragraph I read when it's non-fiction. With fiction, no problem, it all stays in. Also sub-vocalization makes me forget fiction as well.

[Anonymous No.21565482]

>>21565208
goethe, wagner

[Anonymous No.21565492]

>>21565088
General Hammond!

[Anonymous No.21565498]

I have a retarded question: how fast should I move my eyes across the page? I'm never sure if I'm actually capturing every word or not

[Anonymous No.21565619]

>>21565088
Fucking Russian writers

[Anonymous No.21565807]

>>21565498
Your eyes are blind for the small moments in which they move. So moving them less across lines of words can help you see more of them. Less is more.
Also, a cool trick (which only works if you don't sub vocalize) is to look on between the words instead of the actual words

[Anonymous No.21566521]

>>21565072
>>Reading should be done without subvocalizing
This is silly for fiction. If you don't subvocalize or 'play the scene in your head' it ruins the experience.

[Anonymous No.21566594]

> Reading should be done without sub-vocalizing

Midwit meme. Sub-vocalizing is good, we learn to speak first, it aids in comprehension and understanding. Speed readers are psueds. If you're able to get the gist of a material by just scanning over it, it's too simple to be valuable, and you'll probably make some basic comprehension mistake anyway.

[Anonymous No.21567202]

>>21565498
>I'm never sure if I'm actually capturing every word or not
When you turn the page, stop and reflect on whether you retained what you read just 30 seconds ago. If the answer is no, then slow down.

[Anonymous No.21567983]

>>21566594
based and true

[Anonymous No.21568814]

>>21565072
I visualize every setting and character. I subvocalize dialogue only.

[Anonymous No.21568834]

>>21565274
Reading quality novels without subvocalizing nor taking the time to appreciate their richness is peak bugman behaviour.

Do you even read?

[Anonymous No.21570380]

>>21568814

[Anonymous No.21570468]

>>21565072
reading should be done by reading out loud.
period

[Anonymous No.21570639]

>>21565619
Russian middle names are patronymics, the name of their father with a suffix added to indicate the person's gender. Full names are used in order to convey a formal way of addressing someone. Just the first name indicates they are familiar with the person. Diminutive names are to show extreme closeness and familiarity and only family, very close friends, and spouses use them. Ez pz

[Anonymous No.21570719]

>>21570639
I don't think it's very bad when reading Dostoevsky works but Tolstoy refers to characters by different names all the fucking time. For some reason Kitty's (or Katerina, or Katyenka that one time) parents are called the prince and princess although they're married. Karenin is sometimes called Alexey Alexandrovitch. Vronsky is also sometimes called Alexey, and I don't remember his second name. Konstantin Levin is Sergey's brother, but Sergey's last name is not Levin.

[Anonymous No.21570734]

it's amazing that some guy has been making these subvocalizing threads on /lit/ for about a decade. why does he do it? you'd think eventually over all those years he might eventually... get a life? guess not.

[Anonymous No.21570751]

When I try to read without subvocalising my automatic reaction is to hold my breath for some reason

[Anonymous No.21570782]

>>21570719
haven't read the book but
>Konstantin Levin is Sergey's brother, but Sergey's last name is not Levin.
can't be brothers they don't have the same patronymic

also you're such a baby
>boo hoo sometimes the characters are referred to by their first, sometimes by their last names and sometimes by the diminutive form AAAAH IM GOING insane

[Anonymous No.21570912]

guys, just so you know, every time you read a word you make microscopic movements with your vocal cords, you are not just sub vocalising but silently vocalising.

[Anonymous No.21571082]

>>21565072
Subvocalization is far more pleasurable than speed reading, as my brain is superior to any television in existence.

[Anonymous No.21571763]

>>21570734
>There is only one person on /lit/ with x interest

[Anonymous No.21572136]

Kubrick never subvocalized.

[Anonymous No.21572169]

Sometimes when I’m reading something I start to think about something else and realize that nothing I read for the past 3 pages has been absorbed, like when someone comes and asks you a question while you’re watching a film in the living room.

[Anonymous No.21572198]

>>21565088
>read book
>can recognize character perfectly every time I see their name
>can never recall their name
>can't spell their name
>can't pronounce their name

[Anonymous No.21572215]

>>21572169
I hate it when that happens.

[Anonymous No.21572255]

People in this thread complain about reading trouble and I can't even think.

[Anonymous No.21572290]

>>21568834
>Just don't take any time to appreciate the depth of the writing bro
>The more books you read the more gooder your intelligence
>It's just science

[Anonymous No.21572303]

>>21566594
This desu

[Anonymous No.21572327]

>>21571763
dude, no one is interested in this lame forced topic. you are just an autistic crank.

[I V R I • N E M O !!GgBWHLRiayD No.21572360]

>>21565072
>Reading should be done without subvocalizing

?

Anyone who is conscious mentally vocalizes, and it is also what happens when on reads: the subtler, and more needless, that one is, the quieter, and more direct/immediate, is the voice of one's consciousness, void of any superfluous enactment.

Equilibriated consciousness is ever seated on the middle summit: as in action in general, so in voice in particular.

Needing less and less, be calmer still, and subtler yet.


>The reader should somehow be able to remember what they read

You should be able to remember what is important enough to not forget; otherwise, why would you even read?

[Anonymous No.21572430]

>>21565492
the last place i expected to see this, shel kek nem ron!

[Anonymous No.21572644]

>>21572327
And you are a schizo. Why the fuck have you been coming here for 10 years?
>>21570734
>.. get a life? guess not.
No self awareness.

[Anonymous No.21572683]

>>21572644
next time to you go to fill up the catalog with another useless subvocalizing thread you will be conscious of the fact that you will never have sex. sad, but that's the life you chose, one shitty thread at a time.

[Anonymous No.21572702]

>>21572683
I've had sex, I just didn't bother calling your Mom back when I was done. Now take your meds and keep bumping my thread like a good little bitch

[Anonymous No.21572714]

>>21572702
ten years down the drain, but someone bumped your valueless thread.

[Anonymous No.21572722]

>follow each line down the pages of my book with a bookmark like I did in grade school
>don't care how juvenile and retarded it looks, I read faster and internalize it better

[Anonymous No.21572788]

>>21572714
Did you really spend ten years here? Seriously? Please tell me you didn't waste ten years here. How do you live with yourself?

[Anonymous No.21573046]

>>21566594
By subvocalization we mean laboriously treading over the text serially rather than direct and immediate hearing and visualization.