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/lit/ - Literature

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File: 7 KB, 189x266, demiurge.png reality.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
21330193 No.21330193 [Reply] [Original]

>dude the world is a prison lmao. disunite yourself from both eros and agape, cut yourself off from both transcendence and immanence. it's gotta be Eros and Transcendence all the time
>yeah bro the demiurge is a real SOB, you gotta escape from this illusory world altogether yo and just deny earth, community, body, and senses. Union between formless nirvana and samsara/form? lmao what a hylic joke!

Remind me why I should take gnostics seriously again?

>> No.21330202

>>21330193
>Remind me why I should take gnostics seriously again?
Anal

>> No.21330203

Atheism itself is solid proof that god exists. You can't deny this.

>> No.21330204

>>21330193
no idea what this thread is about but i like the lion snake guy, looks cool

>> No.21330214

>>21330203
Only if you're already a gnostic, the existence of something doesn't imply the existence of its antithesis

>> No.21330230

>>21330214
You can be atheist, but you can't be ignorant of god. Even if you talk to someone about god who is an atheist, it's as if he immediately grasps the concept of god. I have never seen an atheist baffling about the concept itself like he can't grasp it in order to proof that god doesn't exist. Like you could with many words that are mere ideas like for example intersectionalism.

>> No.21330249

>>21330204
Gnostics have a wide range of beliefs but the key one to know in this case is that the universe we live in currently was created by The Demiurge, which is analogous to the Abrahamic/Judeo-Christian God. The demiurge in agnosticism is an antagonistic force, more akin to a jailer as opposed to a benevolent creator deity. Again, the gnostics have a very wide range of beliefs so I am only speaking in generalities here. The demiurge is something that must be overcome for us to achieve enlightenment and escape the current torturous plane of existence.

I am not a gnostic or religious in any real way but Gnosticism has some fucking metal beliefs that are cool as fuck.

>> No.21330283

>>21330230
This is the most retarded argument I have ever heard, but fine, I'll indulge you.
People understand what a god or deific entity is because our culture is massively saturated with examples of them, and most of the time they are introduced to the concept very early either through religious traditions or in popular culture. They aren't born with that inherent knowledge. If you had children you would know this but it isn't a matter of debate.

>> No.21330306

>>21330283
Ok, people are taught into the concept early on, but how can there be a concept of something that doesn't exist? That's probably impossible.

>> No.21330367

>>21330306
I can have the concept of a woman that loves me, but she doesn't exist. There's an example.

>> No.21330377

>>21330367
> woman
exists
> Love
Exists (probably, or as a feeling empirically)
See? Your concept is a composite of real things. That's the only reason you could make that concept, your feelings related to it aside.

>> No.21330392

>>21330377
By that logic, an honest liar could exist too. Or a liberating tyrant.
Sorry, doesn't work that way.

>> No.21330394

>>21330283
nta, but Thomas Paine actually talks about the way in which children *do* know this. Sure they aren't born with it in the same way children are not born capable of feeding themselves. But as soon as they develop the ability to ask questions, eventually they ask about the concept of inheritance. Where did I come from? Where did you come from? And Paine argued that it's a simple rational deduction from this series of questions that there must be some thing out there that everything we see of creation comes from. And that's the natural understanding of God.

and forgive my light proselytizing here, but I find it beautiful that one can deduce the existence of a God in this way and commit their life to expressing love and gratitude toward it.

>> No.21330396

The god of our universe is clearly evil and insane, and hates us.
Proof by simple inspection.

>> No.21330409

>>21330392
All composites. They are contradictory, and? Most characters are contradictory. Do they exist any less because of that? No, and sorry, it doesn't work that way. Cheap ad hominem.

>> No.21330442

>>21330193
Atheism itself is solid proof that god exists. You can't deny this.

>> No.21330443
File: 85 KB, 1280x720, Screenshot_142.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
21330443

>>21330193
I am not crazy! I am not crazy. I KNOW the Demiurge trapped us in the material world! I knew the creation of matter was caused by Sophia's fall. One emanation from the Logos. As if I could ever make such a mistake. Never. Never! I just - I just couldn't prove it. He - he covered his tracks, he got those idiots at the Council of Nicaea to lie for him. You think this is something? You think this is bad? This? This chicanery? He's done worse. That garden! Are you telling me that Anthropos just happens to fall like that? No! He orchestrated it! Yaldabaoth! He ejaculated into mud through the firmament to create Adam! And I worshipped him! And I shouldn't have. I took him into my own temples! What was I thinking? He'll never change. He'll never change! Ever since Eden, always the same! Couldn't keep his plagues out of Egypt! But not our Demiurge! Couldn't be precious Samael! God of the blind! And he gets to be a deity!? What a sick joke! I should've stopped him when I had the chance! And you - you have to stop him! You-

>> No.21330456
File: 1.13 MB, 245x200, wtf are these people talking about.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
21330456

>>21330442
>Atheism itself is solid proof that god exists

>> No.21330749

>>21330443
Golden, but perhaps underappreciated here. It's a weird cross between this board and a /tv/ post.

>> No.21330857

>>21330443
pissed myself laughing, choice post mate

>> No.21330897

>>21330456
Can't you read?

>> No.21330930

>>21330306
>that's probably impossible
Numbers don't exist

>> No.21330936

>>21330394
A very pretty concept sure but that's not evidence Paine is correct or proof of the existence of a god

>> No.21330937

>>21330193
You absolutely shouldn't.

>> No.21330942

My inborn edgyness almost led me down the gnosticism path but /lit/ made me introspect and self critique.
I've finally come to the realization that edgelordism shouldn't be the basis for a Weltanschauung.
Guess I've dodged a bullet there.

>> No.21330968

>>21330283
It's a good argument. Get fucked.

>> No.21330970

>>21330936
>that's not evidence Paine is correct
that wasn't up for contention, Paine is correct. it's easy enough for even a child to deduce that things do not make themselves, and that something must have made all the things. it doesn't have to be Sky-Daddy God, it can be literally anything.

>proof of the existence of god
this was never implied. it isn't possible to prove anything exists.

>> No.21330978

>>21330283
>have children
>literally teach them from birth that there are no gods and that the world is "purely material" (relying on the kids' ignorance to not question what "purely material" even means)
>"Yeah bro kids aren't born with inherent belief in God."
>ignore the fact that every human civilization on Earth has spontaneously come up with the idea of deity or deities and continuously propagated that belief through vast periods of time
Let alone the fact that you are IGNORING the fact that you have to explain to the kids what is responsible for reality being the way it is in the first place, which you just replace with an atheist non-explanation to stop them from asking harder questions that you're too afraid to even ask yourself.

>> No.21330999

>>21330193
Lol
OP is gonna pop

>> No.21331140

Gnosticism is an umbrella term for various heretical sects in early Christianity that relied on corruptions of hermetic and neoplatonic doctrine.

>> No.21331603

>>21330978
You don't need to keep them sheltered from it, nice strawman.

The Piraha people in the Amazon are an example of a society that has no concept of deities. Try not to let your head explode as this simple fact destroys your whole worldview.

>which you just replace with an atheist non-explanation
This is also a strawman, you aren't pointing to any actual question they may ask that would need an "atheist non-explanation"

If you can't form a cogent argument then I'm not going to bother replying anymore, unless you can provide me with something aside from your misguided ranting and fallacious shit

>> No.21331859

>>21330193
>muh eros, muh agape
Keg parties aren't a metaphysics, retard.

>> No.21333092

>>21330443
Kek

>> No.21333094

>>21330193
I WANT OFF THE DEMIURGE'S WILD-RIDE.

>> No.21333122
File: 92 KB, 750x1009, demiurge stick .jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
21333122

>>21333094
Gnosticism, Theravadin Buddhism, a type of Advaita Vedanta, a “higher Inner Voice,” the inner Holy Spirit, archetypal psychology, the care of the Soul, contacting the Higher Self etc, are all true enough and altogether important; but in their partiality, in their exclusively world-denying bent, they attempt to deny it by escaping it altogether. It is Phobos: the fear-laden hand of earth-denying, community-denying, body-denying, sensory-denying escape. “Emptiness is not other than Form, Form is not other than Emptiness" - there is a union between Eros and Agape, Ascent to the One (formless nirvana) perfectly and fully embracing the world of the Many (samsara and Form).

>> No.21333130

>>21330193
Because if you don't you're a kike

>> No.21333134

>>21330942
Self-criticism is jewish, just like Mao's handlers in China

>> No.21333282

>>21330193
Gnostics are just people who don't want to admit masturbating 7 times a day might not be good for the soul

>> No.21333298

>>21330193
Any religion that tells you to give up earthly desires or value is exploiting you to take those things.

>> No.21333516

>>21333298
dumb commie

>> No.21333965

>>21333282
Truly

>> No.21335442

>>21330193
>Remind me why I should take gnostics seriously again?
If you don't want to. then don't.

>> No.21335974

>>21330202
What?

>> No.21336366

>special snowflake beliefs 101
I bet none of you niggers actually believe these things, it's just hip to use these words.

>> No.21336391

>>21330193
Gnostics are a bunch of gay pseuds. They are like fanfic writers down to making Mary Magdalen a bloody Mary Sue, they even gave her a "Yaas Kween!" moment in the Gospel of Mary:
><Peter said>, having asked about these
matters, ‘Did the Saviour speak secretly with a woman and [not] openly so that we all might hear? Is she more worthy than us . . .
>. . . the Saviour. Levi said to Peter, ‘Peter, your hot temper is always with you and now you are questioning the woman like adversaries do to her. If the Saviour deemed her worthy, who are you to set her at nought? Certainly, knowing her, he
loved her very well. Rather, let us be ashamed and, having put on the perfect man, let us do what was commanded u —to preach the gospel, not laying down any
rules nor making laws

>> No.21336393

>>21330230
Smurfs are easy to understand, therefor you must believe in Smurfs.

>> No.21336480

>>21336366
>>21336391
tedious culture war goblins