/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.20942219]

When did you guys realize pic. related was typical faulty masonic speculation, and that the author was a hack merely reproducing erroneous theories imagined a century beforehand. The attempted link between modern freemasonry and dante, was based on the falsification of a forged medallion, and literal fantasy from earlier authors.

[Anonymous No.20942241]

>>20942219
>In a study on Dante’s esoterism, René Guénon mentions two bronze medals, one portraying Dante and the other depicting the Veronese painter Pisanello. The reverse side of each medal bears the initials: F.S.K.I.P.F.T.found in the Victoria and Albert Museum

>Guénon interprets the initials as “Fidei Sanctae Kadosch Imperialis Principatus Frater Templarius” and argues that Fidei Sanctae refers to the “Fede Santa” a tertiary order of Templar association whose dignitaries bore the title of “Kadosch”. The latter is the Hebrew word for “consecrated” and is still used for some freemason grades. Guénon believes this was proof that Dante Alighieri was therefore connected to the Templars and this is why he chose Saint Bernard of Clairvaux as his guide in the third book of the Divina Commedia.

>Guénon states that the medals he saw were found in Vienna’s Historische Museum. However, a search of this museum’s current online catalogue does not return any of the two medals. The medal representing Pisanello, does appear in a Catalogue of bronzes and ivories of European origin shown by the Burlington Fine arts club in 1879. That catalogue ascribes the medal to Pisanello (1360-1415). Both Morelli and Gruyer believe that the medal is genuine; however, Milanesi and Lenormant believe that the medal was made by Francesco Corradini, not Pisanello, hence the inscription “Franciscus Korradini Pictor Fecit” (from the Lives of Painters by Giorgio Vasari, Blashfield and Hopkins edition, volume II).

>Luigi Valli, in his study Studi sui fidele d’amore, I, 1933, suggests that the inscription could refer to the seven virtues, Fides, Spes, Karitas, Justitia, Prudentia, Fortitudo, Temperantia. In his view, this could have held some initiatic meaning.

>It is hard to derive a clear cut conclusion from the study of these medals as to whether Dante was a Templar or not.

[Anonymous No.20942243]

>>20942219
I never realized that because im not a hylic like you are OP

next question

[Frater Asemlen !XS8vrClKs2 No.20942246]

Hated the book completely, there’s actual occultism and Christian mysticism in Dante, the Hollander annotations gives a lot of background and links to study, like Hugh of st Victor.

[Anonymous No.20942289]

>>20942246
Oh definitely there is and I am not undervaluing Dantes poems, but the connections made by guenon, vallis and rosetti between dante "Kadosch knights e.g modern freemasonry, " "templarism" etc. is speculative rubbish of little worth, based on an empirical forgery, it serves as a good example of why these extensive commentaries on symbolism which focus on the these sorts of historical hypotheses are mostly the product of an authors imagination.
>>20942243
This writing of guenon is hylic-tier.

[Anonymous No.20942301]

>>20942219
>>20942241
bro, you need to stop reading that blog
also, book was cool because he introduced me to the idea that Dante copied muslim authors which is true

[Anonymous No.20942325]

>>20942289
>why these extensive commentaries on symbolism which focus on the these sorts of historical hypotheses are mostly the product of an authors imagination
This is true. Guénon seems to have been more intuitive than others but is still very hard to tell how real some of his conclusions on symbolism are.

[Anonymous No.20942340]

>>20942301
>nooo stop reading that blog!
They are on point amd correct, I am yet to see an actual error on the blog.

[Anonymous No.20942360]

>>20942301
Also this is not at all a unique conclusion of guenon he is just parroting Palacios and Ceruli, while definitely there is a possibility that dante was influenced by some islamic sources because of parralels, I would not exaggerate or advance that point in any meaningful way, as the resemblences are more or less superficial.

[dago !deClb9SBC. No.20942423]

>>20942219
first two or three chapters are good
rest is a snoozefest

Jennifer Upton's (Charles Upton's wife) commentary is kind dece

[dago !deClb9SBC. No.20942431]

>>20942246
Frater give the a qrd on your beef with Guenon again
im re-reading his stuff right now through a critical lens and would appreciate your insight

[Anonymous No.20942529]

Trying to read Dante as anything other than an extremely intelligent and also extremely devout Catholic is a waste of time.

Frankly, I think Dante should be canonized. Writing the Comedy is saintly behavior.

[Anonymous No.20942545]

>>20942301
>Dante copied muslim authors which is true
He put Saladin in the first ring along with Aristotle, Plato, etc.

[Anonymous No.20942566]

>>20942545
According to Sir Richard Burton, Saladin was a notorious pederast

[Anonymous No.20942570]

>>20942566
So why is Saladin not punished? Are you implying Dante was a pederast too?

[Anonymous No.20942572]

Interesting. So it’s like CotC?

[Anonymous No.20942575]

>>20942572
Eh Call of the Crocodile is more Goosebumps tier. It has some good ideas in there with the Dante parallels.

[Anonymous No.20942578]

>>20942572
It’s fucking weird how that book has gained such mass appeal now. I can remember when it was just the banner ads and the occasional thread about it.

[Frater Asemlen !XS8vrClKs2 No.20943021]

>>20942431
Tldr, the sources on Hinduism and Buddhism available to them were subpar, their study and understanding of western occultism was very low, they didn’t actually practice ceremonial magic, which I count a major negative for any occultist to the point their opinion should basically be thrown out, and their understanding of Sufism/Islam is fixated on too small a group, Arabi is not the god of Sufism, and neither is shankara an all-essential figure to Hinduism.

[Anonymous No.20943085]

>>20942578
Probably discord fags needing to belong to something. Or maybe Gardiner has just upped his spam.

[Anonymous No.20943109]

>>20942219
>Though we have not been attempting an account of Art's historical development from the religious idea, but simply an outline of their mutual affinities, yet that historic career must be touched upon in dealing with the circumstance that it was almost solely plastic art, and that of Painting in particular, which could present the religious dogmas—originally themselves symbolical—in an ideally figurative form. Poetry, on the contrary, was constrained by their very symbolism to adhere to the form laid down by canon as a matter of realistic truth and implicit credence. As these dogmas themselves were figurative concepts, so the greatest poetic genius—whose only instruments are mental figures—could remodel or explain nothing without falling into heterodoxy, like all the philosopher-poets of the earliest centuries of the Church, who succumbed to the charge of heresy. Perhaps the poetic power bestowed on Dante was the greatest e'er within the reach of mortal; yet in his stupendous poem it is only where he can hold the visionary world aloof from dogma, that his true creative force is shewn, whereas he always handles the dogmatic concepts according to the Church's principle of literal credence; and thus these latter never leave that lowering artificiality to which we have already alluded, confronting us with horror, nay, absurdity, from the mouth of so great a poet.

[Anonymous No.20943115]

>>20943085
It’s Goodreads and Redditors. Call of the Crocodile is being heavily promoted on Goodreads and being added to peoples want to read” lists by the thousands. Look up any horror book and you’ll see Gardner’s books as the top suggestions.

[dago (fed) !deClb9SBC. No.20943124]

>>20943021
Word, thanks
I read his novel he wrote when he was like 18 and I think his obsession with Advaita is because he had a “mystical events” related to ‘returning to the source’
Basically his awakening came when some ‘force’ whispered in his ear some Sphinx-tier riddle and then spent his youth trying to solve it until he realized Advaita Vedanta was what he was looking for all along.

Anyways, i intend to get through all your shiva books you recommended over the next year before diving into Shingon
(Gotta spend a year doing hatha yoga first. Ya boy is way too inflexible to meditate properly)

[Anonymous No.20943128]

>>20943115
Holy shit.

[Anonymous No.20943129]

>>20943115
Wow wtf

[Anonymous No.20943134]

>>20943115
This is absolutely ridiculous yet incredible. How does Gardner keep defying the odds and keep becoming a bigger meme? This almost seems supernatural it’s so retarded.

[Anonymous No.20943144]

>>20943134
Maybe it's the power of one of the spirts from his novels.

[Anonymous No.20943192]

>>20943124
>I read his novel
Guenon wrote a novel?
>>20943115
>>20943134
It's only a matter of time until pic related happens.

[Anonymous No.20943205]

>>20943144
I wouldn’t be surprised. Call of the Crocodile is the only Gardner book I’ve read. The concept of depersonalization is constantly hammered in during the plot. Over and over ad nauseam. To the point where I felt like I started to feel the effect. Legit felt like reading cursed literature. Like the whole point might’ve been to make the reader feel detached from reality.

[dago !deClb9SBC. No.20943505]

>>20943192
https://brunohapel.blogspot.com/2018/10/rene-guenon-la-frontiere-de-lautre-monde.html

[Anonymous No.20943605]

>>20942301
>>20942340
What's ’that blog’? Don't be elusive to signal status it's lame, name it.

[Anonymous No.20943696]

>>20943605
im guessing it's https://vedavyasamandala.com/

[Anonymous No.20943704]

>>20943696
Thanks anon.