/sffg/ - Science Fiction and Fantasy General

[Anonymous No.20784958]

No Future Edition

Previous Thread:>>20774885

>Recommended reading charts (Look here before asking for vague recs)
https://mega.nz/folder/kj5hWI6J#0cyw0-ZdvZKOJW3fPI6RfQ/folder/guIyhAzS

>Archive
>>/lit/?task=search2&search_subject=sffg

>Goodreads
https://www.goodreads.com/group/show/1029811-sffg

[Anonymous No.20784976]

99 cents into the quarter pounder realm - plus tax!

[Anonymous No.20785026]

Lovecraft and CAS. That is all…

[Anonymous No.20785054]

>>20784976
>99 cents into the quarter pounder realm - plus tax!
For every person that was curious what Xianxia is and why people read it, this legendary parody-review of often shilled in this general 'I Shall Seal The Heavens' should give you some insight. Most of xianxia looks exactly like presented.

[Anonymous No.20785062]

Any new /sffg/ romance lit?
or Male Human MC x Female Vampire romance lit?

[Anonymous No.20785129]

Why are the top books in basically every categiry in the Goodreads choice awards appear so garbage?
Or they are actually good and I'm just prejudging them?

[Anonymous No.20785138]

>>20785129
they are popular
goodreads is a lit themed social media

[Anonymous No.20785139]

>>20784853
jesus, this is almost bollywood tier but without all the soul and kino
what an awful adaptation

[Anonymous No.20785151]

>>20785054
I get that this is a parody, but is the original as stupid fun as this? I might be interested.

[Anonymous No.20785199]

>>20785151
A Will Eternal by the same author is actually written as comedy like this.
ISSTH is funny but mostly just out of absurdity (the protagonist can't help but piss everyone off everywhere he goes)

[Anonymous No.20785230]

>>20785151
>I get that this is a parody, but is the original as stupid fun as this? I might be interested.
Exactly the same, but written seriously. 'Protagonist is stronger than other people believe' is a constant theme in xianxia. And stealing from the richer cultivators. And robbing them.

[Anonymous No.20785280]

I'm reading Out of Body by Jeffrey Ford. It's about a guy who starts astral traveling while he sleeps after getting gun-butted while witnessing a murder. This guy Ford has the most basic and utilitarian prose I've ever read. It's like he has no style whatsoever. He won World Fantasy Awards (not for this book).

[Anonymous No.20785386]

I want a good fantasy that has elves and dwarves and magic and dragons
Not dnd not tolkein
I'd prefer they were actually elves drwarves and dragons too, not cringe modern author name substitutions

[Anonymous No.20785397]

>>20785386
>not tolkein not dnd
>actual elves, dwarves and dragons
do you think they're real creatures with definitive forms or something?

[Anonymous No.20785440]

>>20785386
>I want a good fantasy that has elves and dwarves and magic and dragons
>Not dnd not tolkein
>I'd prefer they were actually elves drwarves and dragons too, not cringe modern author name substitutions
Age of Fire series, starting with Dragon Champion. Almost two decades old, sounds exactly what you're looking for

[Anonymous No.20785447]

SVPREMACY OV BAKKER FOREVER TRVE

[Jeo No.20785471]

It's like symbography

[Jeo No.20785479]

Like how did we get the idea to.plug certain sounds to certain effects, don't animals have a sound to thing memory too? It's so imefficient for humans, you know like in the South pole the clouds make lettery shapes, maybe it's trying to communicate or something

[Anonymous No.20785488]

>>20785479
>go to south pole
>look at sky
>clouds form letters
> S..U..P..R..E..M..E
I think it's trying to tell us something.

[Anonymous No.20785501]

I've finished most of S tier already, any ideas what to pick next?

[Anonymous No.20785518]

>>20785501
The Aspect Emperor series

[None !SFFG.n1h7M No.20785535]

>>20784958
Instantiation - Greg Egan (2020)

The Discrete Charm of the Turing Machine (2017)
A social science fiction story set in the present day about the causes and effects of economic precarity as told through the everyday life of an average Australian family.
Enjoyable

Zero For Conduct (2013)
A story about chemistry and physics set in the present day. An Afghani girl whose parents were murdered lives with a relative in Iran. She's an industrious genius determined to make the most of her life. It would've been better if weren't essentially all set-up.
Ok

Uncanny Valley (2017)
The protagonist is a sideload, an embodied sentient AI that's a very fuzzy simulacrum of a specific human, hence the title. On top of that the original can choose not to transfer certain memories and traits, which causes selective amnesia in the sideload. Most of the story is the protagonist trying to determine which memories weren't transferred and why, so it reads as a SF mystery. The problems are that it continually undercuts its own findings and never quite finds the right tone that would resonate with the reader.
Meh

Seventh Sight (2014)
A twelve old boy with artificial retinas uses an app to reconfigure his trichromat eyes to allow him to become a heptachromat. The story explores what differences this could bring as it follows him through a couple decades of life. It also has a lot of metaphors.
Ok

The Nearest (2018)
This started as a police investigation and became a psychological horror story. It's the kind of story where I tried to view it as the protagonist did, but I failed. It was just too obvious to me what was going on, and I think that was intended. It made for an interesting case study, though I have a lot of doubts about it, but nothing more than that.
Ok

Shadow Flock (2014)
The protagonist is coerced by a shadowy organization to use her drone expertise to help with a heist of physical cryptowallets.
Meh

[Anonymous No.20785540]

>>20785518
I will do as you have recommended. I shall not be swayed from this decision. I am committed.

[None !SFFG.n1h7M No.20785542]

>>20785535
Bit Players (2014)
This is surely the funniest work I've read from Egan. If you take this seriously, you're doing it wrong. It's clearly intended to be a parody. The title is quite the versatile bit of wordplay. I searched a bit and found the assumed author and the work it's parodying and why. It's about speculative physics, but the speculation is mostly irrelevant because the world doesn't have to conform to them. It also has various other amusing ideas, like a book to VR world converter. If this were a light novel I'd name it: "I was reincarnated in a VR kusoge that has nonsensical physics and the devs expected me to be an NPC, but I only cared about doing experimental isekai physics!" That may seem like an absurd title, but it isn't relative to light novel naming conventions.
Enjoyable

Break My Fall (2014)
The transit between Earth and Mars involves slingshotting from stepping stone to stepping stone. It doesn't always work out well, but difficulties can be overcome. This would be neat to see visually.
Ok

3-adica (2018)
This is a continuation of Bit Players. The new world is stated to be a mash-up of works from Doyle, Dickens, Stoker, Stevenson, and Shelley. Their goal is to use a GPU exploit involving color values and graphical glitches to transition to the world of 3-adica, which is based on the principles of 3-adic numbers. An accurate visual representation of that world be mind-boggling at the very least. I still found this to be rather amusing. Egan wrote an essay about the math involved, but it certainly isn't required to enjoy this, and I'm not going to pretend that I understood it on anything more than the most superficial level.
The essay: https://fromearthtothestars.com/2018/09/05/inside-3-adica/
Enjoyable

The Slipway (2019)
A surprisingly beautiful story about the nature and process of science. A cosmic event being momentous and unknown doesn't inherently make it frightening, let alone disastrous. Sometimes what we think changes everything doesn't have any practical significance at all. Those who focus solely on the technical aspects of this story are missing out on a lot.
Enjoyable

Instantiation (2019)
The third story after 3-adica. It's interesting in how these worlds are composites of various works and the characters are composites that this story itself would read like a composite of Egan's own work. The real world VR hardware is much more similar to Ready Player One than Sword Art Online.
Enjoyable

[Anonymous No.20785552]

read bakker

[Anonymous No.20785555]

A sarcastic excerpt from one of the stories in Instantiation:
"They seem to think I’ve somehow harmed their chances for Elon to take them on a ride out to the wormhole, which the aliens are building in order to invite all the least pleasant people on Reddit and 4chan into their galactic empire.”
Oh that Egan, what a kidder!

[Anonymous No.20785573]

>>20785440
I just finished all of that series + the spinoffs

No magic in it tho, not in a traditional sense anyway

>>20785397
You know what I mean
I don't want some shit thats elves but with some cringe name

[Anonymous No.20785586]

>>20785552
I'm 80% through the judging eye
I don't want this series to end

[Anonymous No.20785591]

>>20785501
Sorry mate but Wheel of Time is better than the fucking Witcher and Harry Potter . Why do you have it so low?

[Anonymous No.20785598]

>>20785591
it's not better than the witcher imo
Both have a few decent books and fall off but wot lasts longer after the fall off and has less interesting about it before the decline.
(And the first book sucks too)

[Anonymous No.20785613]

>>20785518
Nice jaw lad. I thought most of you fags in this general would have mutated physiognomies but you're looking good.
Need to bulk up tho.

[Anonymous No.20785616]

>>20785501
Is Wizards First Rule young adult? I just looked it up and saw they made that series of it that I saw a bit of when I was a kid, but I didn't like it and don't remember it much

[Anonymous No.20785625]

>>20785586
Well your in luck because bakkers already said he's not gonna finish the series so you'll never find out what happens

[Anonymous No.20785628]

>>20785616
its utter garbage, unless you are really into ayn rand I don't think you'll enjoy the on your face atlas shrugged turned into fantasy (and shitload of BDSM sex)

[Anonymous No.20785631]

>>20785616
No, only insofar as all fantasy is young adult. Although it was as a young adult that I enjoyed it, and I don't think I could now.

[Anonymous No.20785634]

>>20785616
It's bog standard epic fantasy so it isn't YA but has the YA plot of teenager going on a journey discovering themselves.
Definitely not YA by the time you get to the evil bondage witches.
TV show is actually better than the books which are absolute dogshit, especially after the first one or two and extra especially after the author lost his mind post 9-11

[Anonymous No.20785640]

>>20785230
I wanna see "constantly overestimated xianxia protagonist" now. People keep thinking he's responsible for inane bullshit that he just lucked into causing at best.

[Anonymous No.20785645]

>>20785625
fuck, really?
I thought he only had problems with finding a publisher and was going to release another trilogy

[Anonymous No.20785651]

>>20785628
>shitload of BDSM sex
That's a little unfair. There's BDSM overtones, there's not much actual sex.
>bog standard epic fantasy
It's marketed that way, somewhat, I mean it has wizards and witches and a dragon. Maybe Goodkind was trying to make it generic. But in practice it's bizarre and unconventional because he's a freak.

[Anonymous No.20785655]

>>20785645
the series ties up, but people are unable to accept that it really ties up and whatever would happen in the later duology would just be grim-grim-dark

[Anonymous No.20785662]

>>20785651
Forgot to quote >>20785634 as well.

[Anonymous No.20785686]

>>20785640
I've seen a couple manga with that premise. Spoilers because not /lit/ Tearmoon Empire is about a Marie Antoinette that after the guillotine goes back to her youth and tries to do things right, except that she never actually learned how to do anything right. Her minimal good intentions were actually all she had to do, not be a little shit, but she isn't aware of it so she keeps worrying and overcorrecting in the wrong direction. And The Story of Lord, Devastated Manor Who Grows by Misunderstanding. An OP healer tries to make his shitty territory work, everyone accidentally use him to make a revolution while he thinks he's becoming a good and friendly nobleman. We later see that his dad was suicidally depressive and his mom was borderline brain dead.
In both cases a solid element is the narrators being brutal with the MCs.

[Anonymous No.20785717]

Is he the Spoony One of fantasy?

[Anonymous No.20785719]

>>20785686
I've seen a comedic WN with a similar thing too, Eminence in Shadows. He's not really overestimated in ability, he is genuinely the strongest guy around, he's just a complete dumbass who doesn't understand what he's actually doing because he made up some shit about fighting a cult as an excuse to rope people into his nonsense except the cult turned out to be real.

[Anonymous No.20785736]

>>20785719
It's not funny. Dude killed himself because he realize he couldn't lift enough to beat a nuke.
Both types of comedy are very popular in Japan. It might be an exageration to the kid gloves they use in every interaction, or a mockery of the fantasies of power they grow up with. Or, you know, something completely different we're not getting outside of the culture.

[Anonymous No.20785743]

>>20785736
I mean I find it pretty funny just because of how much the guy seems to be accidentally in the right despite having no idea what's going on all the time.

[Anonymous No.20785790]

>>20785054
>coughed up a mouthful of ketchup
That's the part that always gets me, because they ALWAYS cough up blood.

[twi No.20785800]

>>20783930
eh, i liked that D arc. i generally like the baleros characters.
oh well, i guess sometimes you just want to get back to the izril stuff.
i can certainly relate, because i'm finally catching on with the K chapters. finally finished the vol4 batch. i wasn't impressed, although towards the end they were alright i guess. hopefully i'll get through it all soon. that or the vol 6 K chapters manage to change my mind.

[Anonymous No.20785803]

>>20785054
kek didn't know that was a goodreads review comment

[Anonymous No.20785819]

>>20784495
It's not so much that I don't like them but I'm not finding them very engaging yet
Niers' class doesn't sound very interesting at the moment to be honest and the whole "let's secretly make bombs, this will surely not come back to bite us in the ass" thing is just tiring to read
I'll go back and read a chapter every now and then though, I wasn't really intending on skipping any parts forever

[Anonymous No.20785826]

He's pretty good, isn't he?

[Anonymous No.20785864]

>>20785826
>earrings
that's a no

[Anonymous No.20785894]

>>20785819
Oh, and the Ksmvr/Horn chapters were really good and I'm quite glad that they addressed the whole thing about his age, competence and "naiveté". I was starting to get worried that he wouldn't grow as a character and always remain the "dumb" almost pure comedy relief member of the group

[Anonymous No.20786014]

>>20785555
>>20785542
ok I might have to read some of these now

[Anonymous No.20786026]

>>20785535
>>20785542
I will never read these. Nothing personnel kid but they are not THE chart.

[Anonymous No.20786064]

>>20786026
The SUPREME Chart.

[Anonymous No.20786065]

>>20785386
Read Markus Heitz

[Anonymous No.20786197]

need something with worldbuilding + adventure + magic + military engagements

read maalzan, bakker, tbc already

[Anonymous No.20786204]

>>20786197
The Red Knight maybe

[Anonymous No.20786214]

>>20786197
you can sink your time to wheel of time or a song of ice and fire

[Anonymous No.20786223]

>>20786214
oh, read those too

>>20786204
series looks interesting gonna give the first one a go

[Anonymous No.20786239]

>>20786197
does "advanced human society falls into pre-industrial era of tech and rebuilds civilization including armies based off roman legionnaires" sound interesting at all to you? it doesn't have magic but it has advanced tech here and there, and even dragons. one of the MCs basically has the equiv of a politics/history PhD and ends up being the head commander since he's the most knowledgable person left alive

[Anonymous No.20786250]

>>20786239
Well, idk what book you should at least say so I can go google it

[Anonymous No.20786261]

>>20786250
https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/662641.There_Will_Be_Dragons
i've posted about it off and on previously, been months though.
the series goes into hyperpedantic detail about army structure and building and basically everything else. if you end up enjoying book 1 and want to keep reading, stop once you finish book 3.

[Anonymous No.20786279]

>>20786014
Egan has various other prior collections as well. This is his most recent one. The earlier ones are generally considered to be better, so if you do like these, you may want to try the others as well.

[Anonymous No.20786287]

>>20785555
kek yeah I remember reading that and feeling it was very out of place. I also felt that the overall collection was QUITE infused with politics, perhaps moreso than normal. The only story that stood out to me in Instantiation had been the 3-part with the layer upon layer of simulations

[Anonymous No.20786365]

>>20785800
If you finished the V4 Flos batch then you are practically there, there is very little bullshit ahead, at most uninteresting fragments. Now there's only one Flos chapter in V5 (Interlude - Flos) (but it's half Flos half Liscor actually), then in V6 you start the real plot in Chandrar that has suprisingly little Flos in it.

>>20785819
Anon, I didn't mean Nier's class. I meant Tulm's [Dragonslayer Strategist] Class. Though now I'm thinking you just read just the first part of that arc and didn't realize it's about the Titan's game, not United Nations.

[Anonymous No.20786387]

>>20785598
witcher is poop

[Anonymous No.20786395]

>>20786365
yeah i'm reading the V5 interlude right now and this female blacksmith is pretty entertaining already.

[Anonymous No.20786406]

>>20786365
Yeah, I understand, but I haven't gotten to the part with this Tulm yet
I believe the first chapter of the batch was about the UN and the following ones are about Niers' game, that's why I was commenting on the whole state of the Baleros storylines so far

[Anonymous No.20786418]

>>20785717
spoony had charm at one point, this fat fuck never had any

[Anonymous No.20786425]

>>20786418
He's more of a Linkara.

[Anonymous No.20786558]

>>20786395
Yeah, Chandrar has the wildest characters, Nawalishifra is just the beginning.

[Anonymous No.20786618]

>>20785826
hes a hack

[Anonymous No.20786631]

>>20786287
Egan has always been political from his debut work. He's literally also a political activist. It's just a matter of how much he includes it and how well. I'd say the main difference really is that overall his works are more concerned with the relative here and now rather than speculative far futures.That and they are far less mystical/supernatural as well. More grounded I suppose.

[Anonymous No.20786704]

Finished Book of the New Sun today. Amazing read but i feel like I barely scratched the surface, as the latter events recontextualizes so much of the earlier parts of the novel.
Tried reading the first chapter again, and having a better grasp of the setting and vocabulary already makes it a whole new beast. Also tried listening to Alzabo Soup for that chapter, w/c laid to light some vital nuances and motivations I would have missed otherwise.

Now I'm at a tri-fork of the road, do I:
>continue the reread w/ the podcast companion
>continue with Urth of the New Sun before the reread
>Finish the rest of Solar Cycle before the reread

How did /sffg/ read the series? How would you recommend going through jt?

[Anonymous No.20786871]

Bought Asimov's Robots and Empire today, can I read that without having read much Asimov or should I save it for when I've read more of his books? I'm kind of confused on the chronological order on his works outside of the Foundation series

[Anonymous No.20787079]

How do so called "webnovels" generally compare to traditional representatives of the genre?

[Anonymous No.20787089]

Recommend a good entertaining sci fi book. I'm not looking for anything specific. I haven't read any sci fi at all so spoil me with the best this genre has to offer

[Anonymous No.20787228]

>>20787079
Seconding this question

[Anonymous No.20787260]

>>20787079
A stark contrast.
>read Sanderson
>nothing happens until the very end
>read Dungeon Crawler Carl
>shit never at any point stops happening

[Anonymous No.20787265]

>>20787228
>>20787079
Webnovels obviously have the main advantage of having more authorial freedom, though that's not necessarily a GOOD thing. Easy feedback of moment-to-moment stuff is also notable, because it means that sometimes elements of the story can change midway through, sometimes for the better. As a whole, I'd say webnovels are, y'know, not really much better or worse than traditional stories, but they tend to suit long-running stories better.

[Anonymous No.20787267]

Braigonbros.......

[Anonymous No.20787270]

>>20787260
DCC has stopped being a webnovel, though it started as one, so only sort of fair. And that's just kind of a writer thing.

[Anonymous No.20787295]

>>20786395
>Nawalishifra
Nawalishifra best Tsun.

[Anonymous No.20787351]

>Lyonesse.
>Gormenghast.
>The Second Apocalypse.
Ah... the holy triumvirate of /sffg/.

[Anonymous No.20787461]

Did anyone else not really know how to read as a kid and teen? I was obviously taught how to read text and know what it means from a young age but when I recall reading stuff like harry potter it's just sort of empty. The main reason I read was because adults and teachers said it was good but you weren't taught how to visualise, imagine and keep track of things. I had to teach myself and train that later when I was in my late teens and realised I couldn't properly read.
I believe this isn't just the minority either and the main reason why the majority of people don't read.

[Anonymous No.20787469]

>>20787461
I don't really visualise when I read and I've always been a big reader

[Anonymous No.20787478]

>>20787351
No wolfe?

[Anonymous No.20787530]

>>20787461
>Did anyone else not really know how to read as a kid and teen?
No. I actually want to visit my elementary school to get my ancient library records and see what I first began reading as a young boy, what my first checked-out book was, and all that.

[Anonymous No.20787544]

Is this where fantasy peaked? It's probably the best malazan book, and easily the best fantasy series. Will I ever enjoy a series as much as I enjoyed malazan? Should I just reread it, or do you lads have recommendations for something as complex and brilliant as this.

[Anonymous No.20787627]

>>20787530
I went to look at my elementary school some years ago and it had been demolished and left as a vacant lot.

[Anonymous No.20787628]

>>20787544
Yes, the Second Apocalypse. It's a million times better.

[Anonymous No.20787634]

>>20787628
Cringe

[Anonymous No.20787650]

>>20787461
I noticed that I definitely read faster as a teenager than now in my 30's

[Anonymous No.20787756]

>character reminisces about their childhood on their deathbed after a lifetime of horror and turmoil

[Anonymous No.20787782]

>>20785151
ISSTH is essentially a series of Meng Hao pissing off one person after another while robbing them blind. He's so brazen that he reverse engineered the magical karma techniques of the ruling Ji clan just to make people owe him money, and peels the floor tiles out of every ancient temple he stumbles upon.

[Anonymous No.20787791]

READ CRADLE!

[Anonymous No.20787859]

Why doesn't Bethesda include any of Kirkbride's writing in their published books? He's not a credited writer on Skyrim or Online, but they still included his books from previous games.

[Anonymous No.20787883]

>>20787859
If you're ever at quakecon, whatever you do, don't mention Kirkbride to Todd Howard. Goes from jolly gamesguy to cold, seething anger in seconds.

[Anonymous No.20787949]

>>20787883
Wow, Howard is insane. Money changed him.

[Anonymous No.20788031]

I sort of imagined the Alethi looked middle-eastern, seemed to fit well.
But they are seemingly supposed to look southeast asian?

[Anonymous No.20788096]

>>20786704
I would always recommend to first read The Urth of the New Sun and do it right after finishing Citadel. I personally read the complete series in one go without any re-reads though I let a few weeks pass between each part. Once I finished Short Sun I went back to New Sun. I have yet to listen to any of the podcasts but I think you can just listen to them whenever you feel like it once you’ve finished TBotNS. They are not necessary but can be quite interesting from what I hear.

[Anonymous No.20788113]

>>20786704
Urth of the new sun. Then come back and go through it all with alzabo soup. Then rest of solar cycle. Repeat

[Anonymous No.20788127]

>>20787544
This was my least favorite part in the entire series. I absolutely hated it and skipped through a lot of it. I very much liked the first four however as well as six and seven.

[Anonymous No.20788134]

>>20787756
Can you tell me which books have this?

[Anonymous No.20788140]

>>20787089
If you haven't read any sci-fi at all, then maybe consider reading Ender's Game or Old Man's War. If you like military sci-fi then The Forever War by Joe Haldeman is currently my fave book of all time.

[Anonymous No.20788150]

>>20788031
Haha what? Southeast Asian? If anything the Shin look like SEA. But never the Alethi. They are white or middle eastern, maybe a mix of both.

[Anonymous No.20788153]

>>20785640
That's also fairly common, there's History's Strongest Sect, where a guy goes around pretending to be an ancient master and recruiting all the protagonists of various other xiaxia stories and claiming all their actions as his own so everyone, including his "students" is convinced he's a secret immortal from a higher realm while in reality he's Jackie Chan tier. Though eventually he collects lots of the cheat items and secret manuals from all his pupils and makes himself ACTUALLY powerful, just in time for everyone to figure out he was faking the entire time before and then it flips into everyone thinking he's weak and getting stomped.

[Anonymous No.20788161]

>>20786204
God I wish there were more books like the first two Traitor Son novels.

[Anonymous No.20788187]

>>20788150
I didn't think it fit very well from their description or character either but that's how a lot of the fanart seems to be, they're drawn really dark with asian eyes so I was wondering if I missed a description of them.

[Anonymous No.20788314]

>>20788161
I'm not actually a big fan of full scale battles/sieges in fantasy but he does a good job of writing them.
3rd book was where I lost interest too but I think it was just because I was reading something else at the time

[Anonymous No.20788495]

Why haven't westerners adapted more of their fantasy into animations.
It's a much better or rather far safer medium for it. Harder to seriously mess up.

[Anonymous No.20788498]

>>20786704
Whatever you think is going to maximize your enjoyment. I tend to think rereading it for yourself would deepen your enjoyment more than listening to the podcast first, but whatever's good.

[Anonymous No.20788524]

>>20788495
Because you're doubly shrinking your audience by putting a niche genre into a niche medium

[Anonymous No.20788537]

>>20788495
I can imagine Codex Alera as an anime but where would the profit for the investors be?

[Anonymous No.20788559]

>>20785640
It's a parody of Xianxia, but "Arrogant young master template A variation 4" is exactly that.

[Anonymous No.20788570]

>>20788495
Animation is difficult, and the West still views animation as something for children.

[Anonymous No.20788683]

>>20787461
Modern education system can do that to you. A proper language education would've taught you to both understand and memorize stories from a very young age.

I did not start reading whole novels until I was 12 but I knew how to read from elementary school

[Anonymous No.20788705]

Not /sffg/. Mods, you know what to do.

[Anonymous No.20788723]

>>20788705
Fuck off you gay little twit.

[Anonymous No.20788734]

>>20788498
I did reread the first chapter slowly and deliberately, and only afterwards did I listen to the corresponding podcast episode to compare thoughts. The process is time consuming but the first chapter was a lot of fun to dig into.

Decided to finish UotNS first, as 2 previous anons suggested (thanks!). Will decide after Urth, on how to proceed - its a balance between the "freshness" and momentum of the Severian centric events and narrative, and a more holistic knowledge of the overarching Solar Cycle.

Another question for /sffg/, how much do Long Sun and Short Sun alter ones appreciation and understanding of New Sun? (I speculate they do, but not as much as BotNS/Urth)

[Anonymous No.20788848]

tell me about the fat man.
why does he wear the train conductor hat?

[Anonymous No.20788948]

>>20788734
Short/Long sun are their own thing. It's almost incidental that they share the same universe as BotNS. They're so far removed from Urth/Nessus/Autarchy that you don't really learn any more about them.

[Anonymous No.20789142]

I read 150 pages of He who fight with monsters bc i had no internet and the only book available in my kindle was that, cringe and horrible but i might read more

[Anonymous No.20789192]

I spend so much time buried in books when I could be multitasking while listening to audiobooks.

[Anonymous No.20789205]

What, in your opinion, makes a good fantasy?

Great characters? Great plot? Great themes and message?

[Anonymous No.20789256]

>>20789205
Whenever someone fellates a work of fiction because of "muh deep themes" it's almost always them being insecure about just liking the thing primarily for the plot/characters/setting because they perceive that as being shallow.

[Anonymous No.20789267]

>>20789256
Themes are important and nice, but yeah the moment to moment is 99% of quality, and that's almost entirely down to characters/plot/setting. Good prose can also be nice, and is required to be truly excellent, but a story can survive almost entirely without it.
I've dropped books with good prose and themes a hundred pages in, and I've read a million word esl shitshow because the MC was entertaining.

[Anonymous No.20789280]

>>20789192
>audiobooks
I seriously hope people don't do this

[Anonymous No.20789318]

>>20789280
The only audiobook I've listened to is American Psycho read by that guy from The Wire, and it was after reading the book twice over the years. Considering listening to some of the lengthier Peter Hamilton books while I work. I do 90% of my reading in bed.

[Anonymous No.20789372]

>>20789280
I often listen to the audiobook concurrently to read the physical book.

[Anonymous No.20789414]

>>20783724
He went to war, killed a bunch of people, and posed beside their dead bodies. That really fucked him up.

[Anonymous No.20789427]

>>20787544
Toll the Hounds is where it peaked for me. Dust of Dreams only works if you treat it as the first part of The Crippled God. For myself, I see no point in reading more fantasy after Malazan. There's only so much time in a day and I want to reread the books.

[Anonymous No.20789440]

>>20787461
I was reading on my own before the third grade in elementary school. One night my mother told me she wasn't going to read to me anymore. She ran away a few years later. I don't know if that's why I was obsessed with reading, but I read The Hobbit and LotR before I was done grade four. I was really fascinated with the Frank Frazetta artwork on old Conan paperbacks. That was the number one thing that excited me about books as a kid. That I could read about the things happening on those covers. I remember bringing in one of the Robert E. Howard books to a reading session in my Catholic school. I'm grateful my teacher encouraged me instead of punishing me for doing that because I think I read some racy scene to a bunch of kids my age that were bringing in some kindergarten level books.

[Anonymous No.20789466]

Apparently Ian esselmounts character in their tabletop was Dassem Ultor, who was Erikson's?

[Anonymous No.20789473]

The ghost of Al Capone, in space

[Anonymous No.20789654]

>>20784958
>Spend 8 hours a day being a college worker mindnumbingly talking and thinking about global issues
>Go home and immediately watch John Carpenter movies, write up Call of Cthulhu TTRPG scenarios, and read genre fiction
I'd rather live in pulpy horror or science fiction than anything else desu...

[Anonymous No.20789660]

>>20785826
I tried borrowing and reading Kraken but returned it in an hour. It was shit.

[Anonymous No.20789756]

>>20787461
I was a reader from a young age. The first books I remember really getting into were the Moomin books when I was around 8 years old. I had Pooh and other books before that but didn’t like them nearly as much

[Anonymous No.20789822]

kickstarter surprise-four-secret-novels-by-brandon-sanderson

>185,341 backers pledged $41,754,153 to help bring this project to life.
>$41,754,153

what in the FUCK

anyway what is the secret series about, from the image on the kickstarter im guessing its about Hoid, i remember ages ago hearing something about him and a dragon being a book idk if this is it

still, 41millions wtf

[Anonymous No.20789831]

Tell me which one of the chart has what I'm looking for
>Epic Fantasy
>Knights
>A king who can fight would be very welcomed
>Chads in armors
>Romance with power level couple (very important)
>Catchy story
>Not overly detailed daily-life actions that don't lead to anything
>A happy ending is preferable. I don't want to be left with the feeling that I read something sad after having such a good time with the characters.
I already own Geralt of Rivia saga, need more of this kind to keep reading after I've finished them.
I don't mind if the book also has psychos, sadists, masochists, etc. I just want a worth-reading story with all or almost all of the mentioned above.
Leave your recs, I'll add everything to my to-read list.

[Anonymous No.20789835]

>>20789280
>>>/wsg/4667740
I thought this was pretty great with narration by Leonard Nimoy, although I do 99% of my reading with physical books

[Anonymous No.20789843]

Anyone know any good dieselpunk books? Think the Leviathan series but for adults. Supernatural elements are acceptable.

[Anonymous No.20789844]

>>20789831
sounds comfy

[Anonymous No.20789848]

>>20789831
Le Morte d'Arthur
>>20789822
Sandersoy had a snowball effect that the more normies bought it, the more it got PR, then the more people bought it, etc. Even then, he is definitely going to be using that money to cover costs, wages of his workers at the press, and to invest in the company for upcoming projects. I doubt he'd pocket much (because then he'd pay more tax).

[Anonymous No.20789890]

>>20789280
I hate this fag like you wouldn't believe

[Anonymous No.20789924]

What's a book or series that would fill you with a sense of dread & fright? I probably have pleb tastes if I had to guess. Like I enjoyed witcher and dune and game of thrones (even though that fatass will never finish the series)

I've never looked into a horror/suspense/thriller book before and I have to imagine there's a lot of gold to be had.

[Anonymous No.20789989]

I've been reading my way through Discworld for the first time (publication order; just finished Jingo and started in on The Last Continent) and I've gotta say I'm enjoying it. Some books are definitely better than others but overall they've been quite enjoyable. I'd say my favorites so far have been Lords and Ladies, Reaper Man, Small Gods and Pyramids and my least favorites have been Soul Music, Maskerade, Eric and Interesting Times.

>>20789924
Depends on what you go in for, really. If "person being stalked by monster" blows your skirt up then I can recommend Cujo wholeheartedly, if you want something more eldritch then try some Lovecraft (The Call of Cthulhu is a good starting place, as is The Shadow Over Innsmouth and The Dunwich Horror) or Pet Sematary and if you want a tried-and-true classic then try Dracula or The Great God Pan by Machen. There's also It if you want to hop right into a cocaine-and-liquor-fueled doorstop but I wouldn't recommend it.

[Anonymous No.20790090]

[Anonymous No.20790103]

>>20790090
Honestly I just want another xiaxia to talk about, they're interesting, but all the currently running ones are shit.
LOTM part two when?

[Anonymous No.20790105]

Started Fallen Dragon by Hamilton. Never been so bored with a book in my life. DNF.

[Anonymous No.20790113]

>>20789831
The Wizard Knight has literally all of this and more.

[Anonymous No.20790132]

>>20790113
picked up

[Anonymous No.20790147]

>>20788498
>>20788570
a lot of people loved atla

[Anonymous No.20790162]

Anybody read Anderson's King of Ys series? I can cop the omnibus cheap, but have only read The Broken Sword. Granted, I adored that novel.

[Anonymous No.20790180]

>>20788734
In my case they made me appreciate BotNS even more because I realized that something like it can’t be written again. Both Long Sun and Short Sun are entirely different from New Sun. The setting, the writing style (which I found very disappointing) and the story all differ from New Sun. But Long Sun and Short Sun are very strongly tied together. In a way you could say that Short Sun is to Long Sun what UotNS is to BotNS.

[Anonymous No.20790185]

>>20790103
Basically all xanxias other than RI are just based on single template allowed by ccp.

[Anonymous No.20790243]

>>20785386
The Broken Sword by Poul Anderson

[Anonymous No.20790253]

>>20787544
No, Midnight Tides is.

[Anonymous No.20790256]

>>20789466
Erikson played every single character in GotM basically.

https://malazan.fandom.com/wiki/Role-playing_Game_Origins_of_the_Malazan_Series

[Anonymous No.20790307]

>>20789466
He basically played every character from the first few novels, simultaneously.

[Anonymous No.20790333]

>>20788127
>Least favourite
>Loved the first 4

You do know this is the 3rd book..r..right anon?

[Anonymous No.20790335]

>>20790307
Imagine being a writer and not simulating every character as an individual part of your mind, instead roleplaying as each of them on purpose. Damn, what a schizo.

[Anonymous No.20790336]

>>20787628
I do have the first book, and I got filtered by page 1. It felt so indecipherable, the names were ridiculous and Its the quickest I've ever given up on a book. That first page just felt like absolute fucking nonsense

[Anonymous No.20790338]

>>20790253
I can't wait to reread this. Midnight tides and reapers gale were fantastic

[Anonymous No.20790432]

low teir wizard bros.....

[Anonymous No.20790446]

>>20790333
Oh, whoops. The books in my shelf are in the wrong order. I meant that I hate book five „Midnight Tides“. Three was amazing.

[Anonymous No.20790477]

Reminder that older women are the best romantic interests in sff

[Anonymous No.20790682]

Which Lovecraft story is the best? I love Dunwich Horror a lot but will branch out.

[Anonymous No.20790777]

>>20789843
spent 2007-2009 trying to write one

real dieselpunk is almost impossible to do right imho

tried multiple times since (always failed after plot just got too strange or too simple, also hard to portray cultures that are only a few generations ago, you get lost in details and mores or it just feels like WWX with more machines)

guess we need to wait until our civilization moves beyond diesel (in a real way, not the current lite green BS) to see what happens to the genre

btw someone has any dieselpunk tips? would love to read other people's attempts

[Anonymous No.20790778]

>>20790682
I recommend The case of Charles Dexter Ward. In my opinion is has a masterful buildup and good resolution. It is my favorite Lovecraft story.

[Anonymous No.20790955]

Hey, guys. I caught up on some reading while I was away. Now my plate is clean, so to speak. Do you have any recommendations for me?
I know most of you are lunk heads only interested in fighting, military, and boats. But please try to recommend something with half decent characters for once. It doesn't have to be high art. Just not kucklehead shit. You know what I mean. And no pirates! No books where the focal point is sailing!

My reading history so far: https://pastebin.com/EHV1f68e

[Anonymous No.20791029]

>>20789280
Audiobooks are great.

[Anonymous No.20791045]

>>20790955
Your list appears to not have any webnovels, so I suspect you haven't branched into that direction yet. I recommend to try Dungeon Crawler Carl, as it is published and relies strongly on characters.

[Anonymous No.20791047]

Hey what do you know. A trip to the ether and hooking up with a psycho tranny GF actually made Zack chapters interesting. Still black though.

[Anonymous No.20791053]

>>20791045
>>20790955
To add to DCC, you might consider A Journey of Black and Red if Vampire stuff isn't off-putting to you (real vampires, not this modern stuff for women)

[Anonymous No.20791059]

>>20791047
She's not trans though, just pretending with her abilities at times. This is run-of-the-mill shapeshifting stuff that's been in fantasy for decades.

Btw, Zac might be one of the few black protagonists in Fantasy that are actually, like, good. What was that phrase that's been thrown a lot? Something like 'Just let Nigga wear armor and be a Knight for once.'

[Anonymous No.20791060]

>>20789989
I completely forget what Eric is even about. It's not necessarily BAD, it's just sort of a book that... Happens. So you're up to, what, Feet of Clay or Hogfather now?

[Anonymous No.20791062]

>>20791047
Zach doesn't become interesting until around the last quarter of book 4.

[Anonymous No.20791067]

>>20791047
I'm only on book 1 and I see WHY people don't like Zach (he's just kind of a lawful good guy trying to be lawful and good while Ryun is reflecting on the monster he was and has the whole weird memory shit) but I don't think he's boring necessarily. Maybe my opinion will shift as the story goes I'm still only on chapter 50-something. Zach probably needs some impetus for a character arc of his own to really be good, though, I guess.

[Anonymous No.20791112]

>>20789848
Nice
>>20790113
Thanks, anon! Seems like I'm going to start with this one.

[Anonymous No.20791124]

>>20791045
>>20791053
>Look up Dungeon Crawler Carl
>It's litRPG/gamelit
No thanks. I don't want anything that is based on game logic. Or otherwise marketed as a game. Dungeon and Dragons, and all that table top shit is hella cringe, yo. They revel in tropes. They worship tropes. They make no effort to disguise their tropes. Rather, they lean into them, bolster them, and market themselves based on tropes. And I just think that's cheap writing. The readers get off to the idea of a "trope done right", rather than just a good story with a good character.

It's true, I haven't gotten into webnovels. Mostly because nobody recommends any. And any time I've glanced at a webnovel, it looks like the most cheesiest shit in the world.

>A Journey of Black and Red
LOL listen to the sample of the audiobook: https://www.audible.com/pd/A-Journey-of-Black-and-Red-Audiobook/B09GL4J49P
The idea of deep south vampires sound cute on paper. But I'm not listening to this retard "southern belle" voice for 14 hours.

[Anonymous No.20791128]

>>20791124
DCC IS LitRPG, but it's pretty much done as a 'game show' sort of deal. The appeal is the characters, mostly, which is what you're looking for.

[Anonymous No.20791138]

How so you even go back to normal audiobook after listening to graphic audio?

[Anonymous No.20791144]

>>20791128
Don't care. Too meta for me. And besides, the audiobook narrator is really hamming it up with a bad Patrick Warburton impression. https://www.audible.com/pd/Dungeon-Crawler-Carl-Audiobook/B08V8B2CGV So that kills it for me.

[Anonymous No.20791145]

>>20791124
>comparing D&D to a self-published fantasy story with litrpg elements
>they all
wew lad i bet you believe in original writing too

[Anonymous No.20791151]

>>20791145
If you have exceptions to the trope-y cringe, then by all means, post them.
I don't want my stories to sounds like a game manual. Sorry if that's too much to expect out of a story.

[Anonymous No.20791155]

>>20791151
>Sorry if that's too much to expect out of a story
You're the only one making these grandiose assumptions and having expectations when you admittedly don't read them. Do you get off to embarrassing yourself in front of everyone?

[Anonymous No.20791173]

>>20791144
Jeff Hays is a great reader and Dungeon Crawler Carl is his favorite book of those he's recorded.

[Anonymous No.20791175]

>>20791155
I'm telling you to change my mind with something. I'm sorry "Dungeon Crawl Carl" is the best you have to offer. But I don't want a book based on game rules. I don't play table top games. I barely play JRPG video games anymore. I *despise* western RPG video games. I hate rogue-likes and dungeon crawlers. And so anything that reminds me of these video game tropes is an automatic dismissal. You're talking to a guy who dropped Malazan, because the narrator was referring to characters by their RPG classes rather than actually using in-universe names.

[Anonymous No.20791189]

>>20791175
Funny enough, most of the litRPGs I find are usually based on MMORPG mechanics instead of JRPG/WRPGs. A good chunk of litRPG appeal is nostalgia for the good/classic-WoW or insert-fav-MMO-here days.

That said, there isn't much that's good and the genre is dominated by comedy and/or power fantasy. So if the humor isn't your thing, the stat-boxes isn't going to redeem the genre for you.

[Anonymous No.20791192]

>>20791124
If not Litrpg, then i'd like you to consider:
- Beware of Chicken
- The Perfect Run

I know you said no Litrpgs, but still you might be interested in The Wandering Inn (it's very much not like any other LitRPG, barely even a part of the genre) because it has the best characters I've seen in any webnovel. Just a typical epic fantasy, but with Levels.

[Anonymous No.20791193]

>>20791173
I imagine he enjoyed himself. Actors love anything where they get to go all out and dive into their character. Unfortunately for us, the listener, his love and effort doesn't translate into a good performance.

>>20791189
Oh right. I hate MMOs too.

[Anonymous No.20791212]

>>20791175
>But I don't want a book based on game rules
It isn't. The rules are explicitly fluff. The only real rule is that the showrunners will pull whatever they think will rope in more viewers, which is usually some form of hyper violence.
That said you sound like a complete pseud so you should just leave.

[Anonymous No.20791258]

>>20791192
>The Perfect Run
How is that not LitRPG? I read the description, and it sounds like Fallout New Vegas or Bioshock. They're blatantly using video game terminology.

>Beware of Chicken
I'll give it a shot. I'm not all too familiar with cultivation stuff yet. The only one I've read thus far is Cradle. So I'm not yet jaded enough to hate the tropes. I might enjoy this.

>The Wandering Inn
Mmmm... a lot of the criticism this gets is about how unbearable the main character is. It's also 43 hours in autdiobook time. And I'm not sure I want to read another Brandon Sanderson length behemoth with a mopey dopey main character. Soft pass.

>>20791193
>>20791173
I want to amend this statement. If the book is meant to be comedic, then I can understand why he went with that style of performance. Like using Patrick Warburton in The Tick. It's a silly character in as satirical universe, so they got a silly sounding guy to play the part. I get that. And if that's the case, then he's doing a pretty good job. I just personally don't like that style of performance.

>>20791212
>The heckin apocalypse will be televised!
>Hyper violence
>A sadistic game show unlike anything in the universe
I can't say what I really think of this, because the moderators here really hate that kind of content. But you know exactly what I'm thinking, don't you?

[Anonymous No.20791280]

>>20790777
I think you would want to go for a simpler plot. Take inspiration from the pulps of the time and build a tight thriller with the main appeal being a protagonist with a strong hook making his way in an interesting setting.

[Anonymous No.20791292]

>tfw when a new book releases and it's been days but still isn't publicly available to pirate and you really want to read it

[Anonymous No.20791296]

>>20791138
Are there any decent non-constant-cringe inducing graphic audios even
I listened to like a five minute sample of some Sandersn*y and I vouched never to approach that kind of thign ever again

[Anonymous No.20791300]

>>20791292
what's the name?

[Anonymous No.20791304]

>>20785717
Didn't he steal from charity recently?

[Anonymous No.20791315]

>>20791258
>a lot of the criticism this gets is about how unbearable the main character is
To be honest, I think most of that criticism comes from the knuckleheads you were trying to fend off
Most TWI characters are really fun and decent in my opinion, although I'm only like halfway through the story, which is extremely long and definitely not for everyone

[Anonymous No.20791323]

why do trannys hate brandon sanderson?

[Anonymous No.20791325]

>>20791296
I'm wondering this too. The only graphic audio I tried was for one of Sanderson's books. After a few chapters, I had to switch back to basic narration. The music swells at the end of scenes were reminiscent of reality shows. And many of the sound effects were too too sharp and grating. They really needed to level all the sounds better. The magic powers that were supposed to be wind based, had this sharp keening sound. Not the whooshing sound you'd expect from wind. It sounded less fantasy and more sci-fi.

[Anonymous No.20791340]

>>20791323
He's a Mormon.

[Anonymous No.20791353]

>>20791323
How could they? His books are so pozzd up already.

[Anonymous No.20791362]

speak of the devil, finally checked out Sanderson and just finished pic related.
bretty gud

[Anonymous No.20791382]

>>20791315
I will keep the book in the back of my mind. If I'm feeling starved enough for content, then I'll probably try it. I don't have a good feeling about it though. I just got done bingeing the Penric books and Sabriel books. All together, 16 books. And they're all short stories. Clean 10-12 hour stories. No fluff, no filler. So now I'm trying to imagine a book that is 4x the length of a normal book. Does it have 4x more content? 4x more plot turns? 4x more character development? I very much doubt that.

[Anonymous No.20791392]

>>20784958
I've got dreams of writing my own epic fantasy/sci-fi stories, but have found that I really haven't engaged with enough of the literature as I should. Most of my experience with the medium has been relegated to movies or TV shows, but I figured if I'm going to write I should read what's written. I picked up Way of Kings yesterday and I got the complete Dune series for Christmas, so I'm going to start working my way through those. I know that's probably newfaggy, but I've got to start somewhere.

[Anonymous No.20791400]

>>20791362
If you stop right there, then you're golden. You can continue thinking Sanderson is pretty good and be satisfied. Delve into this other works however, and you've doomed yourself.

[Anonymous No.20791405]

>>20785062
Tsukihime (technically a mostly literary experience, but I dunno if /lit/ discourages VN recommendations. I don't browse here often)

[Anonymous No.20791441]

>>20791258
The point of DCC is the contrast of how absurdist the game show setting is compared to how genuine Carl himself is. I'm probably not gonna convince you, but Carl is just as annoyed at the game as the reader is meant to be.

[Anonymous No.20791446]

>>20791362
Turns out when Sanderson restricts himself to one room and a handful of characters in a story that has to wrap up, he's actually solid.

[Anonymous No.20791458]

>>20791446
He mentioned recently he's going to put out a collection of non-cosmere short fiction and I have high hopes for that

[Anonymous No.20791461]

>>20791392
Anon, do try reading older fantasy. And I mean 10 years old, at least. I know Sanderson and his style may look appealing when you are inexperienced, but trust me, there's a reason why the policy of dealing with every Sanderson's fanboy is to tell him to 'Read another book.' The older fantasy tends to be better written and usually is more 'thought-out.' Modern stuff tends to be simple and easily digestible. You may, of course, write something like that yourself, but if try older books you will realize how good fantasy can be and how much the modern stuff is lacking.

[Anonymous No.20791482]

>>20791461
I think the sad thing about Sanderson, is that all of his stories are well thought out. All he does is world build, world build, world build. But all that world building accomplishes, is to explain how the 1 dimensional characters can fly around with anime powers. Slap some slave themes on top of that, and people will think his work is deep.

[Anonymous No.20791487]

>>20791461
Thanks anon, I appreciate the advice. Any recommendations on said category of books?

[Anonymous No.20791549]

>>20791487
Robin Hobb books, starting with Assassin's Apprentice. The first The Lies of Locke Lamora book is also good, just don't read the sequels. And of course, G.R.R.Martin's Song of Ice and Fire, just keep in mind Martin was a tv writer and wrote the story in a way a show is written (or at least that's the gist of the stuff I read about ASOIAF, I personally liked it very much).
Other than that, Hugo awarded books up to 2014 should be good guideline.

I recommend against The Wheel of Time, I haven't read it all, but according to opinions I've heard it's one of those that were good because they existed in the right moment, these days it's not considered that good. You can still read it to know how the classic epic fantasies looked, though. Honestly, just look at lists of Epic Fantasy books and read what YOU find appealing. You will have a hard time writing stuff you don't like.

Terry Pratchett's Discworld is a also an incredibly good series, especially if you are looking for well-written satire and stories. Keep in mind the first few books in the series were a bit clunky, but the rest is amazing.

[Anonymous No.20791574]

>>20791482
When I say 'thought-out' I do not mean world-building, at least not on its own. For me, it means that the author crafted a world that contains stories and characters that are magnified by 'magic systems' and world-building, all parts of the craft synergizing correctly to create something more than the sum of its parts. I don't think Sanderson really succeeded in that, the first two books were decent, but the longer it goes the worse it becomes. I dropped Stormlight Archives series at the third book because it seemed Sanderson was running on fumes, not having a decent story to tell anymore. The opinions about the fourth book only reinforced my judgement. Sanderson had done a decent job at creating secrets and mystery, but the reveals robbed the story from most of its value.

[Anonymous No.20791601]

>>20791549
Thanks for the recommendations. I happen to already own the first 3 ASOIAF books from when I worked in a bookstore and they were getting thrown out, so I nabbed them from the trash can.

[Anonymous No.20791644]

>>20790336
If you got page 1 of Prince of Nothing you literally have a room temp iq. Every new term introduced in that prologue is defined right there in the text. Like literally right there.

[Anonymous No.20791649]

>>20791060
>So you're up to, what, Feet of Clay or Hogfather now?
The Last Continent.

[Anonymous No.20791692]

>>20791649
Ah, that one was about Rincewind, yes? Tbh the books about Rincewind were the weakest in the series.

[Anonymous No.20791712]

>>20791067
>I see WHY people don't like Zach
>he's just kind of a lawful good guy trying to be lawful and good
I mean...isn't that enough? But I think really it starts in the early chapters where he's always playing the wet blanket to Ryun's enthusiasm. He gets massive bonuses and is the most powerful person in the world early on because of Ryun's aggressive engagement. YOU'RE WELCOME ZACH. And even as his attitude starts to change is still listens to that Yoko bitch trying to poison him against the team. Also he sides with the government. Walking no fun zone.

[Anonymous No.20791734]

>>20785501
PKD:
Ubik: C2
Deus Irae: B3
Harlan Elison:
A Boy and his Dog: B1
Gene Wolfe:
Book of the Long Sun: S3
John Norman:
Tarnsman of Gor: D1
Move the Last Wish lower, more like B-tier

[Anonymous No.20791742]

>>20791712
Even though Zach is not a saint, looking back basically every choice he's made can be judged as better than Ryun. The history of what had happened on post-framework Earth speaks for itself. If Ryun didn't go off the deep end the iteration would go its own course. Of course, that wouldn't be as interesting, but it would be a decent life, one Zach pursued. Ryun could not be bound by anything resembling social order.

[Anonymous No.20791757]

>>20791692
>Ah, that one was about Rincewind, yes?
Yes.

>Tbh the books about Rincewind were the weakest in the series.
So far that seems to be the case, more's the pity.

I really wish that Pratchett would try to be less on-the-nose for some things; Maskerade has been the worst I've read so far with Soul Music not being far behind and Moving Pictures was in a similar vein although it gets a bit of a pass for doing it first and not directly aping anything specific. It's even more frustrating because when he gets it RIGHT (like Lords and Ladies, which has been hands-down my favorite so far) it's brilliant.

[Anonymous No.20791762]

>>20791742
How was it better? If he'd been able to choose he'd have just gone into a defensive crouch and gotten filtered when Earth ended.

[Anonymous No.20791795]

>>20791757
Wyrd Sisters was just Macbeth

[Anonymous No.20791841]

>>20791292
>tfw when it seems the book didn't actually release and has been pushed back months.

[Anonymous No.20791858]

>>20791841
>tfw months become years

[Anonymous No.20791888]

>>20791712
It's a guy trying to cling to social order in a new world versus a guy going "FUCK YEAH FREEDOM" and ignoring the consequences. Ryun may have a shitty backstory and all but he still is clearly a worse person than Zach just from his actions. Zach doesn't necessarily think too deeply on things (he clearly doesn't even conceive that Ryun could be a 'person' anymore for example) but he's never portayed as bad, just at most as naive. It's also sort of telling how the first thing they both do in the Infinite Realm is functionally similar (saving strangers) but Ryun observes and only gets involved when it resonates with him, whereas Zach just strides in immediately when seeing people in danger.

[Anonymous No.20791914]

>>20791795
Yeah, but the characters weren't constantly turning to the camera and winking and to me that's the difference between books like Wyrd Sisters and Lords and Ladies and books like Maskerade, Moving Pictures and (to a lesser extent) Witches Abroad. Yes, I know what you're riffing on; please stop constantly reminding me of it.

[Anonymous No.20792101]

>>20791914
I think you're around the point when Discworld stops doing such full-on parodies, at least. A lot of the stories are just what they are, and if they're parodic or subversive at all, it's of stories as a whole, not a specific one.

[Anonymous No.20792300]

>>20790432
Is this series good?

[Anonymous No.20792339]

>>20791392
Sanderson's writing gives you an idea of how low the bar is for quality writing in fantasy. What people don't get is that the average reader can't get through anything more complex than YA. If you want to write fine literature, you're going to have an audience of twelve people by the time you're ninety years old.

[Anonymous No.20792342]

>>20791841
>tfw when it seems the book didn't actually release and has been pushed back months.
This happened like 3 times to be last year, incredibly annoying when they have the dates wrong.

Think it was mostly down to Tor's list being shitty but that's not an issue now because they're too fucking lazy to even publish it

[Anonymous No.20792479]

>>20792300
the first few books are decent but when the black company goes south, the quality literally goes with it
or at least, that was my impression

[Anonymous No.20792508]

>>20792300
Yeh it's great and worth reading all the way to the end

[Anonymous No.20792545]

>>20790090
Why is it so damn good?

[Anonymous No.20792641]

>>20787461
I'm mentally "teleport" and "live" whatever I'm reading, so I have no idea.

[Anonymous No.20792713]

>>20792641
What does that even mean.

[Anonymous No.20792835]

Can anyone give me a recommendation?
- Any type of MC (as long as their personality is consistent but not an idiot who acts on emotions or leaves their enemies alive to be a "good person" and be "better" )
- Believable secondary characters (that aren't made up of idiots, Mari Sue, etc)
- A good plot
- A book with mystery and investigations

You can give me recommendations without the last point but it must be mentioned

[Anonymous No.20792870]

>>20792835
The Rook, Steerswoman, Felix Castor (well this is heavily inspired by hellblazer so some people are dumb), Imager, Finder for scifi

[Anonymous No.20792925]

>>20792870
Thanks, but just to be sure can you specify the authors' names?

[Anonymous No.20792930]

>>20792925
o'malley, kirstein, carey, modesitt, palmer

[Anonymous No.20792999]

>>20792835
Any other suggestions?

[Anonymous No.20793023]

>>20789831
More like this aside from the books that have already been recommended to this anon? I'm interested too.

[Anonymous No.20793034]

>>20792835
>Any type of MC (as long as their personality is consistent but not an idiot who acts on emotions or leaves their enemies alive to be a "good person" and be "better" )
This is pretty vague requirement because you either want an edgy genius or a robot according to this. Basically every good protagonist must be irrational or have some normal emotional responses that are not perfectly optimized.
But with that in mind, try Mother of Learning and Worth the Candle.

[Anonymous No.20793060]

>>20793034
STOP FUCKING RECOMMENDING WEBNOVELS LONGER THAN PROUST UNLESS SOMEONE ACTUALLY ASKS FOR THEM FOR FUCKS SAKE

[Anonymous No.20793079]

>>20793060
>STOP FUCKING RECOMMENDING WEBNOVELS LONGER THAN PROUST UNLESS SOMEONE ACTUALLY ASKS FOR THEM FOR FUCKS SAKE
If something is good, the wordcount is a virtue, not a flaw. Go seethe and read your 40k words long novels for pre-schoolers.

[Anonymous No.20793090]

>>20792835
>(as long as their personality is consistent but not an idiot who acts on emotions or leaves their enemies alive to be a "good person" and be "better" )
Carl

[Anonymous No.20793091]

>>20793079
standard bugman response

[Anonymous No.20793165]

>>20793034
I read the first one, it was overall good/decent (but the power system does not make any sense sometimes)

And for the second one... I don't like the concept of an LiTRPG
I want to feel that the world is believable

Thanks anyway for answering me.

To answer your question when I talk about emotion, I mean that I don't want idiots who react instinctively on emotion not to have no emotion

[Anonymous No.20793168]

>>20793079
Worth the Candle is absolute dogshit even within the context of it's terrible subgenre.
There is literally no reason to ever mention it to someone in here asking for recommendations unless they make a specific query about litrpg webnovels.

[Anonymous No.20793172]

>>20793090

The author's name?

[Anonymous No.20793198]

>>20793172
https://www.goodreads.com/series/309211-dungeon-crawler-carl

[Anonymous No.20793252]

>>20793079
t. sees nothing wrong whatsoever with reading a 10,000,000 chapter long super mario fanfiction

[Anonymous No.20793262]

>>20793034
mol is garbage. How can anyone recommend it is beyond me

[Anonymous No.20793292]

>>20793252
>t. sees nothing wrong whatsoever with reading a 10,000,000 chapter long super mario fanfiction
No one sane reads fan fiction. Webnovels on the other hand are original creations.

>>20793262
>Why would anyone recommend the most popular and widely accepted to be great webnovel, baka

[Anonymous No.20793332]

>>20792835
Reverend Insanity.
Fang Yuan is the most calculating and ruthless character ever written.
The side characters, while less driven, are all rational and have understandable motivations they work towards.
The plot is excellent, and continuously adds more and more elements, but always relating to other previously established ones so things never become confusing or overly complicated but also remains fresh and interesting.
There are shitloads of mysteries, but not much investigation, more like uncoverings and reveals in the process of pursuing various goals.

I'll say that it's best read after burning out on other xiaxias, since it's so different and better executed, but it's by far the best in the genre with only Lord of the Mysteries being a competitor if you like steampunk and lovecraft enough.
LotM is another rec, there's a lot more mystery and investigation, but I'd say the characters are weaker.

[Anonymous No.20793340]

>>20793332
>Fang Yuan
Rules in might

[Anonymous No.20793342]

>>20793332
... Reverend Insanity is my favorite story I've already read it 2 times.

Lord of the mystery started out very well but it became lame in my opinion and the mystery/thriller feel became more of a thriller only

[Anonymous No.20793346]

>>20793332
>>20792835
Disregard Reverend Insanity recommendation. It's good for a chineese webnovel, but shit by any other standard. It has idiotic plot, mary sue edgy protagonist who 'outsmarts' everyone else (because other people in the story are retards who can rub their two brain cells together).
You thought webnovels are bad? Reverend Insanity suffers greatly from webnovel filler, even by chinese standards. Every chapter you read will contain a summary of the previous one to artificialy generate more pages. You will literally choke on words, even if you skim.
Don't do this to yourself anon, there are better works out there, works that don't make you sacrifice your dignity.

Lord of the Mysteries I've heard only good opinions on, though.

[Anonymous No.20793366]

>>20792835
>Worth the Candle is a completed serial web novel by seasoned "rational fiction" writer
>rational fiction
DENGAR

[Anonymous No.20793369]

>>20793342
Well you're fucked then, cause RI is poison to ever enjoying another xiaxia. I've found a couple that were interesting for an arc or two, but they all fall to pieces and become unreadable. Unfortunately that included Infinite Bloodcore.
And yeah, the middle of LotM isn't great, the beginning hooks people, and the ending leaves a good impression so it gets overrated. Still better than most though.

What sequence did you get to? It's possible if you push through for a little bit you'll start seeing things ramp up. There's some additional mystery/investigation things that get added near the end that are pretty interesting.

[Anonymous No.20793374]

>>20793292
>most popular and widely accepted to be great webnovel
>mol
Pick one.

I knew mol was shit after reading just few chapters, but I couldn't put my finger on exact reason. Later after reading several litrpg novels (or atleast making an attempt) I have realized what really makes true litrpg so shit and mol ticks all those boxes. mol is 100% litrpg without the stat window with points and "system", mol is total garbage.

[Anonymous No.20793381]

>>20793346
You don't describe RI at all. Everything you describe is exactly what I hate, and RI is one of the only Webnovels that doesn't do that.
As for Fang Yuan, he is the most coherent protagonist I've read
Unlike other webnovels, the secondary characters are intelligent, not retards

[Anonymous No.20793386]

>>20793369
I know that's why I'm looking for printed books and not webnovels.

[Anonymous No.20793391]

>>20793346
Eat some carrot and submit to Fang Yuan.

[Anonymous No.20793407]

I should read dune again
I also really fucking hated dune

[Anonymous No.20793414]

>>20793407
How supreme was it? I remember the supreme fat guy who ruled supreme over kids, but other than that it wasn't that supreme.

[Anonymous No.20793419]

>>20785471
The mule arc kept me reading Asimov.

[Anonymous No.20793433]

>>20793414
paul was a bland bitchy fag that was easy to hate

[Anonymous No.20793465]

>>20793433
I agree, especially in the first book, I read the second book and he was better (he was ruling supreme) but he kept his bitchy attitude even though he was ruling in absolute supremacy.

[Anonymous No.20793467]

>>20785552
I fucking hate Kellhus. Is Cnaiur in the Aspect Emperor series? I would read for Cnaiur.

[Anonymous No.20793469]

>>20793346
Plot is good and mc is the opposite of edgy. It is a webnovel and there is some padding, few chapters also have issues with translation but in general translation is fine. Also the characters are mostly typical chinese stereotypes, and they tend to be similar (unlike western characters). By chinese standard it is at the top because it is original unlike the absolute majority of chinese xanxia, by western standard its hard to compare the two but RI is definetely better than average modern western fantasy.

[Anonymous No.20793481]

>>20793467
Yes.. but not until the third and fourth book.

[Anonymous No.20793486]

>>20793386
read Martial world ann Human Emperor

[Anonymous No.20793513]

>>20789654
you're a special snowflake

[Anonymous No.20793522]

1. Characters
2. World
3. Plot

[Anonymous No.20793545]

>>20793481
Too based for this world.

[Anonymous No.20793568]

>>20793486
Martial World ?.… it this a joke?

The protagonist is not an idiot but it is ALL the secondary characters that are retarded. He always comes across the right characters/elements that will help him at the right time.

And the harem... The HAREM! One of the women becomes his wife only because he is powerful, not his personality (no love, At least not normally, to say it's love is an insult from the author. I say that while I DO NOT LIKE ROMANTIC STORIES) , no unprofessional dialogue between them , it was not a political marriage (no benefits other than a burden), nothing
I would give a lot to delete the time when the read these crap novels to do more productive things or read better things.

Reverend Insanity freed me from reading more of this crap.

[Anonymous No.20793579]

>>20793568
based

[Anonymous No.20793592]

>>20785501
Name Of The Wind should only be in D tier because that nigger will never finish the story.

[Anonymous No.20793609]

>>20793592
What a shame. We need more comedy.

[Anonymous No.20793617]

>>20793568
MW is better than RI (and it's still too bad for me to recommend)
At least in MW other people are active players in the ruthless world
RI is a playground for the protag

[Anonymous No.20793618]

>>20790682
I love most of them, but the ones with a sort of documentary style stick out the most. Like Mountains of Madness, Color Out Of Space, Red Hook

[Anonymous No.20793628]

>TWI 6.52K
not the animals...

[Anonymous No.20793633]

>>20791353
They are and they aren't, like yeah in Stormlight Archive there is a singular background character that is a literal magical tranny. As in were born Female, Identified Male, and going through the process of getting magic made them match their Identity, it actually jives with his whole realmatic theory thing and doesn't seem too odd.

>>20791323
In Stormlight there is a young female character, she has a desire to not grow up, she does certain things like binding her chest to hide her growth from herself. Trannies latched onto this said she's Trans, Sanderson said no, Trannies insisted he change the character, Sanderson said No. Trannies Seethe.

[Anonymous No.20793655]

>>20793617
Playground?

You almost got me. This joke is in poor taste. No need to answer, I won't fall for it again.

[Anonymous No.20793660]

>>20793609
Young Kvothe is 100% a Cuck for Denna, recall at this point he hasn't touched grass or had sex. By Book II he's fucking everything in sight, he outfucks a Succubus. We all know Denna is a distraction he's going to have Devi and Auri as sisterwives.

[Anonymous No.20793691]

>>20793522
lol, setting is not that important. It lives simply to support things that actually matter to a story, like themes, characters and plot.

[Anonymous No.20793706]

>>20784958
Hey, I was told to ask here, I'm looking for a previously existing document with a massive list of potential domains we can give gods in fantasy settings that I heard mentioned on /tg/, does anyone here know what I'm talking about and where I can find it?

[Anonymous No.20793748]

>>20793691
if the world isn't distinguished and appealing it's less likely to be memorable and paint a strong picture in the minds of the reader.

the vibe of a story and its world is very very important, because if it's nonexistent, then the story is soulless.

[Anonymous No.20793792]

>>20793691
Setting is what distinguishes sff from other fiction, except by accident of quality. Characters? No. Plots? No. Themes? Maybe, sort of, sometimes. The difference written in 30-foot-high letters of fire is the setting. Why are you here?

[Anonymous No.20793822]

>>20793568
it definitely isn't RI but it has pretty nice story and comfy worldbuilding, I felt a sense of adventure (in a sort of chinese way) while reading it.

yeah the romance was terrible and female characters shit

[Anonymous No.20793833]

As a gay man, I'm a little tired of people here on /sffg/ suggesting I get into Brandon Sanderson's work.
TL;DR: I am politely asking the /sffg/ community to consider additional alternative suggestions for reading when asked for recommendations besides "go read Sanderson."
Thank you for reading, and happy trails to you all.

[Anonymous No.20793839]

>>20793748
>>20793792
>t. retards
Setting/World-building doesn't mean shit if your story, characters, and overall STYLE sucks.

[Anonymous No.20793855]

>>20793833
Recommending Sanderson hasn't been the meta in some time, anon.

[Anonymous No.20793868]

>>20793839
Go eat normie ass, pigboy and don't come back until you're ready to see the genre for what it really is.

[Anonymous No.20793900]

Every story is the same. The only difference is interesting setting concepts imo.

[Anonymous No.20793934]

>>20793868
It's not my fault you only read shit writers.

[Anonymous No.20793999]

>>20793900
Read Poul Anderson. There's always a different story shape. But I think Vonnegut has lectures on how story arcs are the same throughout cultures and history:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GOGru_4z1Vc

[Anonymous No.20794046]

>>20786197
first law trilogy?

[Anonymous No.20794053]

>>20793900
Truly a great example of narrow-minded mental illness.

[Anonymous No.20794060]

>>20793839
Recs are almost only for barely read works that the poster is pushing hard for others to read as well.

[Anonymous No.20794067]

>>20794053
guys who've read less than 20 different fantasy or scifi series total love to come in here and make sweeping statements about the state of fiction

[Anonymous No.20794072]

>>20793660
Do you not distinguish between simp, friendzoned, cuck, and the many other words?

[Anonymous No.20794075]

>>20793934
If we're a product of our environments, you could be.

[Anonymous No.20794084]

I've been putting off reading Madouc by Vance. I don't Lyonesse to end, bros. It's been a while since a series has such utterly captivated my imagination. Has anybody played the TRPG?

[Anonymous No.20794085]

>>20793706
Sounds like something from a sourcebook like God & Pantheons.

[Anonymous No.20794090]

Bump Limit

[Anonymous No.20794106]

>>20794067
Show me a successful story that's different.

[Anonymous No.20794110]

>>20793833
people recommend you sanderson because you're a faggot and so is everyone who likes him

[Anonymous No.20794116]

Finally found that book that's been on my mind since forever
mom bought it for me decades ago and I didn't bother reading it, and tossed it away, only remember that it had something to do with dragons
turns out it was Dragon Raja by Yeong-Do Lee

[Anonymous No.20794124]

>>20794085
I got the implication that it was something more homemade. Thanks for trying though!

[Anonymous No.20794154]

>>20793839
characters and the world they reside in is much more important than the plot

style (i'm assuming you mean prose) is hard to fuck up. literally don't be ass.

[Anonymous No.20794248]

>>20793855
>>20794110
https://www.reddit.com/r/Fantasy/comments/w9o5hw/as_a_gay_man_im_a_little_tired_of_people_here/

[Anonymous No.20794252]

>>20794248
So, the retards shitting up /sffg/ are reddit users, doesn't surprise me, just wish they stayed in reddit.

[Anonymous No.20794265]

>>20793633
I don't really get how people get 'obviously trans' from 'character who just doesn't want to acknowledge puberty because that means she's growing up'.

[Anonymous No.20794270]

>>20794084
I want to tell you to just bite it, but I keep some Vance, Wolfe and Stephenson in the pocket just in case I need to reconnect with the world pronto at some point. Tons of lesser writers I run the table on as soon as I scent something good in them but some I have to put aside. In 100 years since the first pulp era you'd think you could accumulate a lifetime's supply but somehow you've got to ration them out still.

[Anonymous No.20794271]

Best asian fantasy? The poppy wars is popular but I don't see the point of reading something written in 2 months by a 22 year old.

[Anonymous No.20794272]

>>20794265
Because they're terminally online, with no actual life beyond online

[Anonymous No.20794273]

>>20794252
>the retards shitting up /sffg/ are reddit users
Even worse, they're americans

[Anonymous No.20794285]

>>20794265
>just doesn't want to acknowledge puberty because that means she's growing up'
Being "uncomfortable in your body" during puberty can get you classified as trans, removed from your home and neutered. It's a key trans narrative.

[Anonymous No.20794364]

>>20794271
Journey to the West

[Anonymous No.20794383]

What should I read after "The Shadow Over Innsmouth"?

[Anonymous No.20794395]

>>20794383
anything you want. I recommend you turn away from the /lit/ shit of "first you read this, then this, then this" graphs as early as you can.
As long as it's not a trilogy or something just read what you want.

[Anonymous No.20794413]

>>20794270
>stephenson
Oh nonononononooo

[Anonymous No.20794420]

>>20794383
Rats in the Walls.

[Anonymous No.20794432]

>>20794383
I don't think reading order much applies to Lovecraft outside the Raymond Carter stories.

[Anonymous No.20794434]

>>20785386
try this, not much recommended, the chronicles of the raven and its sequel, the legends of the raven

>The Raven: six men and an elf, sword for hire in the wars that have torn apart Balaia. For years their loyalty has been only to themselves and their code.

But, that time is over. The Wytch Lords have escaped and The Raven find themselves fighting for the Dark College of magic, searching for the location of Dawnthief. It is a spell created to end the world, and it must be cast if any of them are to survive.

[Anonymous No.20794495]

>>20794252
I thought that was known for a hike now.

[Anonymous No.20794506]

>>20794395
I have never used a reading chart or graph and I’ve been reading genre fiction since I was little (so probably going onto 16 years of reading schlock now). I just wanted to know which stories people liked.
>>20794420
Thanks.
>>20794432
I don’t care about order though. Just wanted to know which stories are considered people’s favourites.

[Anonymous No.20794515]

>>20794072
I mean he is actually factually cucked, other men have sex with Denna. He is also a youth and stupid at the point in the story where that phrase is.

[Anonymous No.20794539]

>No Bastion sequel
>No Iron Prince sequel
>A Thousand Li's author is persona non grata
Will Wight wins by default

[Anonymous No.20794590]

Now write Kellhus vs Fang Yuan

[Anonymous No.20794597]

>>20794539
Iron Prince a shit.
Ching chong Tao Wong crucified himself and I'd be surprised if he even finishes A Thousand Li.

[Anonymous No.20794661]

>>20794154
>characters and the world they reside in is much more important than the plot
You're literally describing an RPG.

[Anonymous No.20794698]

>>20794434
This looks good I"ll be adding it to my list.

[Anonymous No.20794702]

>>20794515
So you just use it for whatever you feel like, ok.

[Anonymous No.20794787]

>Mistborn adaption confirmed.
Cast Vin and Kelsier.

[Anonymous No.20794794]

>>20794787
Idris Elba

[Anonymous No.20794989]

New thread
>>20794988

[Anonymous No.20794996]

New thread
>>20794995

[Anonymous No.20795008]

>>20794996
>This thread has been inactive for over an hour
>Seconds of the new thread is made and it’s shitposts.
There’s no point.

[Anonymous No.20795022]

>>20793628
>>TWI 6.52K
The Tirq arc was so boring the first time I read it. It's decent on a re-read, though. And at the end we are getting Fetohep, the best Chandrar ever had to offer

Btw, how did you like 6.51A?

[Anonymous No.20795031]

>>20795008
Yes, anon. Our shitposters ar won 24/7 to shit up /sffg/. It’s been known for months now.

[Anonymous No.20795035]

>>20795031
It’s not that healthy to be terminally online all the time.

[Anonymous No.20795167]

>>20794590
The settings don't mesh well enough for it to work.
And both of their immediate reactions to dangerous intelligent people is "I should kill this guy right now" and then doing it.
If you trapped both of them in some sort of confessional where they could only communicate I don't think they'd have much to talk about.
And if you swapped their positions a Dunyain isn't that much of an oddity in RI world, and Fang Yuan is just slightly above average compared to a normal man without his hundreds of years of experience, and even with them he's on par with a Nonman.

[Anonymous No.20795513]

>>20791644
How about I fuck your little twink arse, then we will see who's got a room temp is nigga